3DSWiiU

Investors Heavily Criticize Nintendo's Performance

by Pedro Hernandez - August 11, 2011, 6:02 pm PDT
Total comments: 58 Source: (Bloomberg), http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-08-10/mario-pre...

They believe Nintendo should open themselves to mobile phone gaming.

Investors criticize Nintendo's recent performances with the Wii, 3DS and upcoming Wii U.

One belief they have is that Nintendo should start supporting mobile phone gaming for devices such as the iPhone and iPad due to how successful these ventures have been for other companies. “Smartphones are the new battlefield for the gaming industry,” said Ohki, a fund manager at Tokyo-based Stats Investment Management Co. “Nintendo should try to either buy its way into this platform or develop something totally new.” 

This is in part due to the poor sales of the 3DS, which prompted Nintendo to lower its price months after it debuted across the globe. Experts believe that Nintendo needs to create games that show off the 3D capabilities of the system better, inspiring consumers to invest on it. “The selection of 3-D titles available is pretty poor,” said 19-year old Chihaya Kaizaki, who also stated that the 3DS lacked the games he wanted to play.

Finally, investors are also wary of the upcoming Wii U. The system, first revealed at this year's E3, has failed to inspire their interest, making experts wonder if it will ever live up to the legacy the Wii gained ever since its November 2006 launch.

Talkback

DanielMDaniel Mousseau, Staff AlumnusAugust 12, 2011

Nintendo will never do that. Nintendo has learned and by the time Wii U comes out they will make sure its flawless. I bought the 3DS the first hour it was out and never have I regretted my decision to buy it.


And I'm not the only one. All true Nintendo fans know that they won't let us down. I can't wait until Wii U, and I'm going to pre-order it as soon as the stores let me :) 


And I know a company needs the investors, but screw them. They don't about anything else other than their money and not the real reason Nintendo does what it does. Nintendo does it for their fans, the true fans. And since this is a Nintendo fan/information site, I'm pretty sure most, if not all of you are true fans.


Thank you Nintendo, keep doing what you do best!

broodwarsAugust 12, 2011

As much of a fan as I am in handheld systems as dedicated units and as much as I'd prefer Nintendo to keep that format viable, I don't think Nintendo really has a choice but to start supporting mobile phone games in addition to their more traditional ventures.  The industry and the economy have changed a great deal since the original DS launch, and I'm not sure the investors are going to let Iwata and Co. stay the course if the 3DS doesn't pull a miraculous recovery this Fall after the fantastic bungling they've done so far.  The market for mobile phone games is growing too potentially lucrative for the investors to allow Nintendo to keep ignoring it, much as I'd prefer they would.

As for the Wii U, that system right now is a hard sell with the information we have right now.  At the moment, all Nintendo has accomplished is establishing that the console will be a little better than the PS3 and 360 were 5 years ago, with a controller that IMO screams gimmickry and a software library the audience will likely already own on the other consoles.  Until Nintendo demonstrates its capabilities with must-buy software, it'll be hard for Nintendo to sell this device outside of what's left of their core fanbase on Wii.  With all that uncertainty, it's easy to see how the investors are starting to lose their patience and their faith in the company.

I wonder if Nintendo can turn this around with a good showing at the Tokyo Games Show.  Both the 3DS and Wii U need must-buy software, and a big showing in front of Nintendo's native audience would probably do a lot to calm the investors.

SilverQuilavaAugust 12, 2011

It would be just about the stupidest thing Nintendo ever did if they considered that.

UncleBobRichard Cook, Guest ContributorAugust 12, 2011

Better Headline: "Nintendo needs new investors".

Seriously.  I wonder how many of these are the same guys who thought the PS3 was going to have 44% of the market...

DasmosAugust 12, 2011

I have yet to play a mobile phone game that I would happily pay more that $2 for. Everything available on these iPhones and Adroid phones are stopgap games, they offer me a little distraction while I wait for the bus. I'm glad Nintendo hasn't resigned itself to making games like this, I want to play something more substantial. I haven't really played my 3DS outside of my house yet, but I've taken my DS all across the country.

EnnerAugust 12, 2011

I think it's still too early for Nintendo to start making games for smart phones or make their own smart phone. Smart phones may have taken a large chunk of the portable gaming market from Nintendo, but the future may prove to have enough room for games on smart phones and dedicated handheld gaming systems.


As for the Wii U, it's early for that system as well and there is time remedy concerns.


As an aside, why does "gimmick" have to be bad word?  :(

broodwarsAugust 12, 2011

Quote from: SilverQuilava

It would be just about the stupidest thing Nintendo ever did if they considered that.

Why?  It's no worse than creating a piece of DSiWare, only they could use some of those smaller mobile games to fund their bigger projects and simultaneously establish a presence with a larger market.  The one "downside" is that it would mean that Nintendo would actually have to justify their $40 3DS game prices with software worthy of it.  So long as Nintendo establishes a dictinction between "pick up and play" mobile games and more substantive 3DS dedicated handheld games, they could be viable in both ventures without sacrificing their traditional handheld games model.

As it stands, Nintendo is ignoring mobile phone gaming and allowing Apple to make them look like fools.  I think it's a significantly lesser Evil for Nintendo to step onto the mobile phone game scene and establish a benchmark of quality Nintendo smaller projects.  If successful, it would do a lot more to keep Apple from driving down the market than ignoring it and hoping that it goes away, Nintendo's strategy with the 3DS that has clearly failed so far.

ShayminAugust 12, 2011

Quote from: UncleBob

Better Headline: "Nintendo needs new investors".

Seriously.  I wonder how many of these are the same guys who thought the PS3 was going to have 44% of the market...

Nintendo attracted a very "special" class of investors off the success of the Wii and DS. A class who have no idea what "vertical integration" means and why Nintendo builds their business around the concept. (Hint: It's better to control the hardware and collect licensing fees than to be the one getting 70 cents on the dollar for your work.)

Once a company goes public, the morons come flying out of the woodwork.

broodwarsAugust 12, 2011

Quote from: Shaymin

(Hint: It's better to control the hardware and collect licensing fees than to be the one getting 70 cents on the dollar for your work.)

Sure, if people are actually buying the hardware and its accompanying software.  But the whole reason Nintendo is in this mess with the 3DS is that people aren't.  The price cut and the games coming in the Fall could change that, that's true.  But if the 3DS is still not in significantly better shape by the end of the year, Nintendo could probably stand to look at alternative business models in addition to their handhelds.  Investors are notoriously skittish and not always the brightest, but whether Iwata and Co. like it or not they have to answer to them.  I just don't see how Nintendo truly hopes to combat Apple like this, so maybe a better approach is to try to direct that market from within.

DanielMDaniel Mousseau, Staff AlumnusAugust 12, 2011

Yah I don't find gimmicky bad at all. Both Sony and Microsoft said the same thing for Wii and its motion controls, and then look what they do. Sony creates a complete rip off of the Wii remote and Nunchuk, and then there Kinect.

broodwarsAugust 12, 2011

Quote from: DanielM

Yah I don't find gimmicky bad at all. Both Sony and Microsoft said the same thing for Wii and its motion controls, and then look what they do. Sony creates a complete rip off of the Wii remote and Nunchuk, and then there Kinect.

In all fairness to Microsoft, the Kinect is vastly different technology than the Wii Remote with much grander possibilities (which Microsoft is doing absolutely nothing right now to take advantage of), and it really shouldn't be lumped in with the Move so easily.

nickmitchAugust 12, 2011

Investors are the reason the 3DS is doing shit in the first place. Had Nintendo not wanted to get it in before the end of the last fiscal year, it would just now be coming out* with all the games we have now* (Pilot Wings, Zelda 3D, etc). The early drought wouldn't have been an issue.* The eShop would've been up day 1.* The system would've had so much of a sales slump that Nintendo would've slashed the price so damn much.*


*probably.

TJ SpykeAugust 12, 2011

"Finally, investors are also wary of the upcoming Wii U. The system, first revealed at this year's E3, has failed to inspire interest, making experts wonder if it will ever live up to the legacy the Wii gained ever since its November 2006 launch."

Um, what? I can't speak for Japan, but at least here the Wii U has been getting a ton of interest from analysts to fans to third party publishers. Already the system has more promising third party games than the Wii did at the same point prior to release.

brood, the Kinect can do some things the Wii Remote can't. However, it's also far worse for most game types.

BboyAugust 12, 2011

I hope Nintendo doesn't listen to their investors... Can someone think of a time where they didn't?

StrawHousePigAugust 12, 2011

Diluting a brand as strong as Nintendo is very shortsighted and would completely undermine their ability to engage the audience on their own terms and in ways the audience hadn't thought of before, which is one of the things that has made them so endearing.

It's hard to argue with the success of smartphones and tablets (ie, the iPad) in the current global economy. You have to remember that's all these talking heads are looking at. They can't see the forest for the trees, as it were.

Although I do still love the idea someone here had about putting out a Nintendo WFC or friends app that would let you manage and communicate with your Ninfriendos™.

Killer_Man_JaroTom Malina, Associate Editor (Europe)August 12, 2011

I think the 3DS price drop indicates that Nintendo is actually willing to piss off their investors in the short-term if the actions they take will be beneficial in the long run. That's great, because the business moves they have made recently to try and keep investors happy were detrimental. I mean, obviously they need to maintain good relations, but investors have zero perspective and severe short-termism. The last thing Nintendo should do is take advice from them.

I live in fear of the day when Nintendo shifts away from dedicated systems. The games I own on my iPod Touch are simple fun, but that's just it. They're simple out of necessity - the more complex, intricate or faster-paced experiences I can find on my usual console or handheld have no place on these smart devices.

NinSageAugust 12, 2011

In other news, investors don't know how to run companies ... that's why they just invest in them.

Good lord ... what's next?

2009: "Kids like sillybands. You should make your next console out of sillybands!"
2010: "People like Lady Gaga.  You should ditch Mario and make her your mascot!"
2011: "Angry Birds and Fruit Ninja are the only two mobile games successful enough to ever mention. You should randomly throw cheap games at the market until 0.00001% of them are break out hits!!!"

NWR_pap64Pedro Hernandez, Contributing WriterAugust 12, 2011

I have to agree with a lot of you. I feel that these investors are trying to bully Nintendo into a position where it is beneficial for them rather than the company. In other words, follow the trends that work.


I find that to be somewhat ironic. The reason many gamers and consumers are tired of casual gaming as a whole is because companies put too much effort into creating these "family friendly" games that mainly exist to follow a trend in the market.


But then the market itself got over-saturated, consumers lost interest and they went to look for something else.


In 2006, that trend was the Wii and its motion control heavy games.


In 2009-10 it is all about the iPhone gaming and its hits.


By 2013 or 14 there will be another trend companies will be desperate to follow. I certainly doubt that all of this mobile gaming mania will last for that long.


Just watch. The market will once again be filled with Angry Bird like games and half assed efforts created to provide the audience with something they think they will eat up, and it will all slow down, giving analysts the opportunity to say "Is the iPhone/iPad bubble about to burst?".

KDR_11kAugust 12, 2011

Do the math. Big Nintendo hitters sell for 50$ and sell 20 million units or more. On the App Store they would have to cost 5$ or so and even that would be a high price for that market. They're never going to sell 200 million units on the app store.

Luigi DudeAugust 12, 2011

The only investor who has any real power is Yamauchi since he's the largest shareholder by far.  Yamauchi is the guy that said Nintendo would close before ever developing for another platform.

So yeah, I wouldn't worry about what some of the investors are saying since the most important investor is still on Nintendo's side.

TJ SpykeAugust 12, 2011

These investor meetings are jokes anyway, anybody who owns even just 1 share of stock in the company can attend them. So often you get people who don't know what they are talking about.

SixthAngelAugust 12, 2011

If Nintendo wanted to they could just do a buyback, they have a shitload of money.
These are just trend following investors that after jumping in after the Wii/DS catapulted want Nintendo to follow them to the next trend.

The mere idea of it is stupid.
The biggest Iphone games don't make near the money Nintendo's biggest games do.  It frankly doesn't look like any will in the forseeable future.  Even if the worst possible predictions happen Mario will destroy iOS games this winter.  The mobile phone game market is VASTLY overrated.  Apps are typically packaged together with games making it even more confusing.  I think mobile games will have some effect on Nintendo.  Particularly games like Brain Age, Language Coach, Crosswords, and Recipes will have difficulties because they are easily and cheaply replicated on the phone.  The end of handheld gaming seems just like ridiculous Apple hype, which gets hyped more than any company I have ever seen.

Hardware is one of Nintendo's biggest strengths and anyone who watched the success of the DS and Wii would realize that.  Not to mention royalties they get from other companies for making the hardware.

Let's be honest, most investors know little to nothing about a lot of things they invest in.  They follow trends and many jump around.

Chozo GhostAugust 12, 2011

They need to give the price cut time to take effect. I'm sure there will be a dramatic increase in 3DS sales this month and next month compared to what it has been in previous months. These investors are impatient and unrealistic. There was a problem and Nintendo addressed, but now they just need to give it time to kick in.

CericAugust 12, 2011

Having personally dealt with enough investors over the years.  I don't know why Nintendo doesn't just take them out of the equation.  They have the money to do it and still be able to weather a few bad generations.

ShayminAugust 12, 2011

SalesBot will hopefully confirm this shortly, but one of the top 10 best selling games of last month in the US was New Super Mario Bros. A 5 year old game brought in ~$2.5 million in revenue to the company.

Try doing *that* on a cell phone. (Spoilers: You can't)

LittleIrvesAugust 12, 2011

I agree with what the vast majority of you here are saying...  please no don't do it (but they're not going to do it, anyway).

The same investors in 1986 might have said, This NES thing needs a VHS player. It even looks like it could play them...  you're missing the next evolution in home entertainment!

In 1996: Use CDs not cartridges! (Well, they might have been right about that one....)

In 2006: The Wii doesn't have a DVD player!? Craziness!

Okay, maybe the analogy isn't quite right, but the general idea is that a lot of people think they know what Nintendo should do based on short-term trends. But the Big N has been a force in the market for nearly 30 years and that's no accident. Sure the market is changing, but it's changed before. Let's not get all carried away and follow the leader after being one for decades.

Chozo GhostAugust 12, 2011

The investors should be criticizing Nintendo for abandoning the Wii and not giving it the software support that it could and should have.

ShyGuyAugust 12, 2011

Nintendo should open themselves to porting games to my microwave, it has better controls than the iPhone.

NinSageAugust 12, 2011

Quote from: ShyGuy

Nintendo should open themselves to porting games to my microwave, it has better controls than the iPhone.

Oh my god, best line ever.

That might show up in a sig of mine down the road.... you'll get credit of course. ^_^

CericAugust 12, 2011

Quote from: NinSage

Quote from: ShyGuy

Nintendo should open themselves to porting games to my microwave, it has better controls than the iPhone.

Oh my god, best line ever.

That might show up in a sig of mine down the road.... you'll get credit of course. ^_^

And its totally True too.

couchmonkeyAugust 12, 2011

The request to put games on mobile phones is idiotic but investors have a right to be angry with Nintendo: 3DS is performing horribly.  It's not just because of phones, either, since regular DS and PSP were regularly outselling 3DS prior to the recent price drop.

At the same time, Nintendo seems to have squandered the potential of the Wii (went from best-selling system ever to having trouble keeping up with PS3 and Xbox 360) and so far Wii U appears to reject the philosophy that made Wii popular.

Personally, I owned Nintendo stock until earlier this year; thank God I dumped it just before 3DS launched.

Chozo GhostAugust 12, 2011

Quote from: couchmonkey

The request to put games on mobile phones is idiotic but investors have a right to be angry with Nintendo

They have a right to be angry. The problem is they are being angry for the wrong reasons. They are angry because Nintendo doesn't support gaming on mobile phones, but what they should be angry with is NOA's decision not to bring Wii games like Xenoblade over to North America and the severe drought that the Wii is suffering from which should not be happening and which Nintendo themselves even promised would not happen. That's what the investors should be pissed off about.

nickmitchAugust 12, 2011

The problem here is that the investors are trying to run the company the way things are done by the more infamous US CEOs. They just want the stock price to go up. Short term sales do that. They don't really care about the long term growth of the company. They just want Nintendo to give in to popular things because they are popular. What they forget is that since Nintendo basically resurrected this industry, they've pretty much been deciding what's popular.

NinSageAugust 12, 2011

Quote from: couchmonkey

3DS is performing horribly.

As expected? No. Horribly? Also no.

Quote from: couchmonkey

The request to put games on mobile phones is idiotic but investors have a right to be angry with Nintendo

um, were all the printing money jokes between 2004 and now complete BS? I mean, that did happen right? No one just dreamed it, right?

Assuming it did happen, seems like the investors would be pretty pleased with past results and should probably stfu in the meantime =P
... just my take on the situation.

CericAugust 12, 2011

Stocks are nothing more then paid opinion polls.  Clear and simple.

Mop it upAugust 12, 2011

Nintendo have had a bad year, and a lot of it is unfortunately due to their own bad decisions. All I can hope for is that they learned from their mistakes. And we all know how it can sometimes take a while before they learn, or they can even learn the wrong lesson from something. If I were an investor I'd be weary of Nintendo too, because there is no guarantee they've learned from the 3DS and will successfully launch the Wii U. I'm hopeful, but I wouldn't bet on it.

Chozo GhostAugust 13, 2011

Quote from: Mop

Nintendo have had a bad year, and a lot of it is unfortunately due to their own bad decisions.

All their success went to their head and they became arrogant and that's why they priced the 3DS so grossly in excess of what it cost them to manufacture it. Arrogance was why Sony dropped from number 1 to number 3 in a very short period of time. Nintendo needs to be very careful because the same thing could happen to them. Fortunately, I think this 3DS thing might have taught them a lesson before it is too late. I hope they learn from that lesson....

AdrockAugust 13, 2011

If investors told Apple to license OSX or iOS to other companies, Steve Jobs would personally backhand each and every one of them. The reason: it devalues the company's bottomline. The same principle applies here. If Nintendo puts their games on tablets and smartphones, they pretty much shoot themselves in the foot because their entire business model revolves around selling compelling software to sell their hardware. You simply cannot get Nintendo games anywhere but Nintendo console/handhelds (or you're not supposed to... damn, pirates).

Ignoring the fact that 3DS and smartphone games are 2 entirely different experiences, the thing I don't understand is that investors are claiming that iOS and Android games are moving in on Nintendo's territory so the investors' brilliant solution is for Nintendo to support those platforms and be in direct competition with themselves. Investors want Nintendo to give a cut of their profits to Apple, Google etc. to help destroy their own platform. What the f...?

SixthAngelAugust 13, 2011

Quote from: couchmonkey

The request to put games on mobile phones is idiotic but investors have a right to be angry with Nintendo.

But they got angry and said things after the price drop.  Nintendo just did something about the problem and what they did seems to be the entire reason they suddenly care about the problem.  These investors are 100% reactionary.

That is why Nintendo shouldn't and won't listen to them.

NinSageAugust 13, 2011

Quote from: Chozo

All their success went to their head and they became arrogant and that's why they priced the 3DS so grossly in excess of what it cost them to manufacture it.

I disagree. The joy-gasmic reaction from E3 2010 determined the price of the 3DS.  Remember, at the time, people were half-jokingly encouraging each other to temper their excitement for fear that it would jack up the retail price.  Turns out they shouldn't have been joking at all. =P

Also, if memory serves correctly, the PSP Go debuted at $250 and that was essentially just a (worse) iteration.  So $250 for a brand new  platform with never-seen-before technology? Doesn't seem all that bad in relation to the competition.  Heck, throw mobile phones into the equation... some of their prices dwarf $250.

Now, for me, $250 was still too much.  So I agree it was a high price.  But it wasn't arrogance that determined it... it was market research.

Mop it upAugust 13, 2011

Quote from: NinSage

But it wasn't arrogance that determined it... it was market research.

Although I agree it isn't arrogance, I wouldn't call it research. Nintendo didn't ask anyone what they would pay for a 3DS. Since Nintendo are known for affordably pricing their systems, I think people expected it to be $200 at the absolute maximum. If they had known the price, they'd have likely been more skeptical and mentioned that it was overpriced. Though the E3 crowd doesn't represent the average consumer anyway, so they aren't a good group on whcih to base certain decisions.

TJ SpykeAugust 13, 2011

Actually, they did ask people at E3 what they would pay for the 3DS, which was part of what caused them to raise the price to $250. Yes that's not a large group statistically speaking, they do tend to represent hardcore gamers (though hardcore gamers were not the majority of DS owners).

Mop it upAugust 13, 2011

They did? I don't recall that. Got a link?

TJ SpykeAugust 13, 2011

Hmm, I have been checking and it doesn't look like they asked what price, but the excitement for the 3DS at E3 did lead to the pricing.

shainentinpockAugust 14, 2011

I really hope they don't go on and develop ios games. I really don't find games on my phone to be fun. They all seem to play like angry birds. It's a fun diversion but it's not a game. Hopefully after the Nintendo 3ds price, Nintendo will be back in the game. The software lineup for the 3ds this holiday season looks great. I wish they waited to launch the Nintendo 3ds until they had the software.

Chozo GhostAugust 14, 2011

Quote from: NinSage

I disagree. The joy-gasmic reaction from E3 2010 determined the price of the 3DS.  Remember, at the time, people were half-jokingly encouraging each other to temper their excitement for fear that it would jack up the retail price.  Turns out they shouldn't have been joking at all. =P

I don't see where you are disagreeing with me. The reaction at E3 2010 fed into the arrogance or whatever you want to call it. Maybe over-confidence would be a nicer word for it? But I don't think it can be denied that the enormous success of the DS (and Wii) was also a factor in the pricing.

Mop it upAugust 14, 2011

Quote from: Chozo

But I don't think it can be denied that the enormous success of the DS (and Wii) was also a factor in the pricing.

If that's the case, then they ignored one of the reasons the Wii and DS are successful, which is affordability. Plus, some people probably just bought a DSi for $150-190, and didn't want to spend even more money on another handheld. What I think happened is that Nintendo knew they were going to have low profits this year due to the lack of compelling Wii and DS software for a majority of it, so they wanted to get as much profit as they could from the 3DS which caused them to release it before it was ready at a high price.

Chozo GhostAugust 14, 2011

Quote from: Mop

If that's the case, then they ignored one of the reasons the Wii and DS are successful, which is affordability.

Precisely. That is exactly the mistake Sony made also when they priced the PS3 at $600. Sony mistakenly and arrogantly believed that because of how popular the PS2 was consumers would buy the PS3 at any price. Well, they learned the hard way that that wasn't the case, and they went from 1st place to 3rd as a result. It was only after the PS3 dropped to a more affordable $299 that sales started to pick up.

Nintendo's mistake with the 3DS was similar but not as fatal and more easily reversible than the PS3's problem was, because in the PS3's case even at $600 it was selling at a loss, but the 3DS was selling at a huge profit so Nintendo could afford to cut the price with no problem. The 3DS was also fortunate that the Vita was a long way off so its blunder wasn't so bad because there was no competition to deal with.

ThePermAugust 14, 2011

people are fickle idiots. Nintendo will make 3ds a success in the same way they made Wii and Ds a success. The 3ds could always have some firmware changes that make it adapt to the market. Cell Phone games sales are an example of a fad. How many shitty games can you purchase before you're tired of it? Just because their selling now doesnt mean they'll be selling in the future. This is like what happened during the Atari game industry collapse...exactly what happened. People will eat their words when a crapton of Resident Evil looking games end up on 3ds, whether Nintendo has to money hat them or not.

I don't believe smartphone gaming is a fad. However, it certainly doesn't make sense for Nintendo to jump into that market, creatively or economically.

CericAugust 15, 2011

Quote from: NWR_insanolord

I don't believe smartphone gaming is a fad. However, it certainly doesn't make sense for Nintendo to jump into that market, creatively or economically.

I agree with this.  I put smartphone gaming in the same space as Minesweeper and Solitare.  Which that space is hard to break into in a lasting way like Solitare.

Ian SaneAugust 15, 2011

If Nintendo went into smartphone gaming it would kill the 3DS.  That's their competition.  Their investors might as well be asking them to make Xbox 360 games.  They can make smartphone games or they can make 3DS games but they can't make both.

I think handheld gaming is dying.  The DS owes a huge chunk of its success to casual gamers.  Those casual gamers are gone and no 3D gimmick is going to win them back.  They already own or want to own a smartphone.  If they can play games on their phone, they don't need to buy a Nintendo handheld.  You can argue that smartphone games suck.  Doesn't matter.  When did quality matter to casuals?  They just view videogames as a mindless distraction.  They can get that kind of game on their phone.

The market for a dedicated handheld videogame system are hardcore gamers.  It's the guys who just need to continue playing videogames when they're on the bus or on vacation.  They want a fuller experience than what a phone will provide for them.  The 3DS has done a shitty job of attracting this audience because it just plain has dick all selection for games.

I think the future is for handhelds and consoles to be one.  I don't mean we all play on these tiny screens because I sure don't want that.  I think though that we'll have one format and one can choose if they want to buy a handheld model or a home model.  Ideally you should be able to hook up your handheld to a TV as well.  You buy a game and it works on either model.  Graphics are plateauing on consoles and eventually handheld technology will catch up to them.  Then is to time to switch to one format.  Core gamers will enjoy having the flexibility to play games in whatever way best suits their lifestyle.  It isn't like you buy seperate songs or movies for home or portable purposes.  You can listen to MP3s on an MP3 player or though speakers in your house.  You can watch a DVD on your home theatre setup or on a portable DVD player on a plane.  There is no reason to have seperate formats for the same thing unless there is some technological limitation that demands it.  We used to have records for home and 8-tracks in your car.  Once we switched to cassettes and CDs, 8-tracks died because there was no point in having a seperate format when the normal format worked in both environments.

Next gen should be the unified format.  Though their interest in gimmicks like 3D and tablet controllers can fuck that all up.  The gimmicks realistically are just an excuse to justify the seperate formats.  They impress casuals but that audience is lost to smartphones for GOOD so it's time Nintendo stopped artificially creating justifications for seperate hardware and merge them.  Hell, we already have the dual screen and touchscreen on both systems now!  If the 3DS successor is as powerful as the Wii U, why would it have to be a different format?

Chozo GhostAugust 15, 2011

Quote from: Ian

We used to have records for home and 8-tracks in your car.  Once we switched to cassettes and CDs, 8-tracks died because there was no point in having a seperate format when the normal format worked in both environments.

8-tracks were not only for cars. The format died because it sucked not because it only worked in cars. My grandma had an 8 track player in her living room so I know for a fact it wasn't just a car thing, and I don't know why you're thinking it was.

HypotheliciouslyAugust 15, 2011

Children will always be the main target for handheld gaming. No parent wants to give their young child an expensive phone. They may let them play with their iphones and ipads, but they will never EVER buy them those products unless they expect it to be lost or broken in a week.

That's were Nintendo's niche has always lied. Children. KIDDY. Whether they are playing at home or on the go, they will always, always need games. Tough, durable games.

The reason why the DS was so popular was because it broaden it's appeal from children and teens to everyone. The GB:SP was the first step in making gaming cool or 'hip' for the masses, and the DS just built on that design. The 3DS is trying to continue that design and capitalize on the 3D fad. Who knows if it'll work. As a successor to the DS, it'll be just fine. But an outstanding success? We'll see.

Ian SaneAugust 15, 2011

I'm pretty sure the reason 8 track was even invented was so that you could listen to music besides the radio in your car.  You could not possibly have a record player in a car.  The use in the car was the whole reason they took off, though they did offer home players.

If you think about it, why do we have seperate console and handheld videogame systems.  Why wasn't the Game Boy just a handheld NES?  Well NES carts are too big for starters but, ignoring that, shrinking the hardware into a handheld at the time would not have been cost feasible and would have devoured batteries.  That's why the Game Boy had to be scaled down and thus needed it's own format.  The Game Boy even had the same exact button layout as the NES.  It was entirely technological limitations that established the seperation between consoles and handhelds.  Otherwise the TurboExpress would have taken off and Sega would have bypassed the Game Gear entirely in favour of the Nomad.

Keep in mind that eventually downloads are going to be the future so we're not even going to be limited by the size of the media.  Both handhelds and consoles can connect to the internet.  In terms of specs the 3DS is actually SUPERIOR to the Wii!  So what keeps these things seperate?  Well the 3D of the 3DS cannot be replicated on a console without the purchase of a very expensive TV.  The dual screens and touchscreen are not available YET but will be when the Wii U comes out.  The Wii has motion control which, in the "waggle the remote" method, is not feasible on a handheld.  Kinect would also not be possible on a handheld.  But are any of these mandatory features?  3D sure isn't.  You can turn it off on the 3DS so there is no reason games could not just offer it as a feature that you can only see with a portable model or a 3DTV.  Kinect is an optional peripheral that could just be something that only works on in a home setting (it would still connect to your portable model for when you hook it up to the TV).  Despite Nintendo's attempts, the remote is no standard and the Wii U proves it.  Like Kinect it can work fine as an optional peripheral that can still work with the portable model when it is used in a home environment.

AdrockAugust 15, 2011

I really don't think smartphones gaming is treading on Nintendo's ground. Many people playing games on smartphones didn't buy Nintendo handhelds to begin with. They went from nothing to Android/iPhone, not DS to Android/iPhone. No one is buying smartphones for the purpose of playing games. They're playing games because now they have a device they need and use for other things that just so happens to be able play games. I'm not convinced that the number of people who did own DS and shunned 3DS for smartphone games is terrible high. There will always be a market for dedicated portable game machines. They don't play the same types of games.

Chozo GhostAugust 15, 2011

Quote from: The

The GB:SP was the first step in making gaming cool or 'hip' for the masses, and the DS just built on that design.

Actually, its been that way since the original spinach Gameboy. Tetris was the first big mainstream portable game. It was the killer app (along with Mario Land and Kirby and others) which put the Gameboy far ahead of every other competitor and made it mainstream. Adults owned and played original Gameboys just as they do with the DS today. Of course the gaming market had grown much larger since the late 80s, so there are more adults and people in general playing DSes and so on than Gameboys 20 years ago, but the adult to kid ratio of the original Spinach Gameboy probably isn't much different than the adult to kid ratio of the DS.

I remember reading an article somewhere once about how Gunpei Yokoi was inspired to create the Gameboy after watching an adult playing with a calculator on a train. He saw the potential and he was right. It wasn't just something for kids. Tetris was the Brain Age or Nintendogs of its day.

Quote from: Ian

Otherwise the TurboExpress would have taken off and Sega would have bypassed the Game Gear entirely in favour of the Nomad.

Actually, the Game Gear itself was just a portable Master System. So it was a similar concept to the Nomad in that respect. The only difference between the Game Gear and the Master System other than the fact one was portable is that the carts were physically different, but with third party adapters it was easily possible to run master system carts on the game gear and vice versa.

ThePermAugust 16, 2011

Quote from: NWR_insanolord

I don't believe smartphone gaming is a fad. However, it certainly doesn't make sense for Nintendo to jump into that market, creatively or economically.

im not saying they'll go away, im saying that their spike in sales will. What will happen is there will come to be franchises in smartphone gaming that dominate the market and become popular and choke out competition. Also, certain games will peak, they'll release sequels, and these sequels will be basically the same thing with little difference, there will be diminishing returns. Sound Familiar?

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