There is still an IBM and an AMD comment I'm still trying to figure out that happened before this floodgate of rumors started pouring out.

Nice work compiling all these sources. This seems to be a very comprehensive list. The only other tidbits I've seen are:
* A source told Kotaku that the console will be "more powerful than the current generation systems"
* Edge heard on the grapevine that Ubisoft, Electronic Arts and Activision have had development kits for several months

I would be very surprised if it's backwardly compatible with the GameCube, it requires a special disk-drive to accept both sizes of disks and Nintendo usually take out compatibility from 2 generations back.


DS took out original Game Boy (B&W) support
DSi and 3DS took out GBA support


Which is annoying because you have to have at least a GBA to play your old GB/GBC games, I'd much rather stick them in my DSlite, the connector IS the same. (it fits but doesn't play)


Saying this however, if the Wii2 doesn't support GC games they'll have to think of a way to stop people putting the disks in and screwing up the drive.


Also if it is compatible, I could see them charging us for a USB "GameCube connection kit" to plug your controllers in, no way are they going to cram 4 GC ports onto the system again.


They could also call it the "Smash Bros Brawl connection kit", cos that's the only thing I've used GC pads for in the past 5 years!

The Complete Rumor Compilation starting from Oct. 2010 -> Yesterday
http://www.nintendoworldreport.com/forums/index.php?topic=16688.msg667116#msg667116

any pie in the sky rumors, dismiss.
like more powerful then the ps3, i see nintendo using 360
like components cause its refined now and cheeper, but  unless
nintendo plans a bulky psp2 like device for palm of hand 3d games,
count out an expensive 6in touch screen.
Nintendo goes minimum, so 360 level i see if they can sell it for a profit.
remember, all the proto types nintendo had for the wii controller, so some
of these controler ideas will never be mass produced. and yea, i see GCN
support being dropped, please nintendo, use HD disks.

It's really not much different than any other slot loader, it just has a rolling bar on the "bottom" to load the disc in so it can take both sizes, unlike the PS3 that has gears and wheels on the sides that can only accept full size discs. It certainly wouldn't add to the costs.

Doesn't it also have a little funnel like shape to position the GCN discs to the middle.

I'd love to see a rundown of previous console rumors being compared to what the console actually turned out to be.  I'm not sure how hard it would be to find all those old rumors for the Wii or GameCube before they were unveiled but it'd be interesting to see and would really help put all these rumors in the proper context.

I don't think there's enough of sample to state "usually" with Nintendo.
NES - No BC (Duh)
SNES - No BC
N64 - No BC
GCN - No BC
Wii - GCN-only (1 Generation)
VB - No BC
GB - No BC (again, duh)
GBC - GB-only (1 Generation)
GBA/SP - GB & GBC BC (2 Generations)
GBm - No BC
DS/DSlite - GBA only (1 Generation)
DSi/DSiXL - errr... DS only (0.5 Generations?)
3DS - DS & DSi (1.5 generations?)

Three systems with no BC due to lack of things to be compatible with (NES, VB, GB)
Four systems with no BC.
Four systems (counting the 3DS) with only BC one generation back.
One system that went two generations back.

So, there's as much precedence for there to be no BC as there is for there to be BC only one generation back.  However, I agree with the later part of your post about not including GameCube ports.  It would be interesting if there was a device that allowed you to connect your old GCN controllers (you know, assuming that you won't just be able to use the new 'everything but the kitchen sink' controller that this new system is supposed to have).

Would it plug in via USB, or could it be a wireless attachment?  Because that'd be pretty cool.  Another advantage of having a separate attachment, they could easily program the *next* next system to support it as well, using one attachment several generations down the line.

Didn't Nintendo file a patent at some point with a screen-controller mock-up very similar to the rumors circulating now? Could that be the source of the rumor, true or not?

GameCube BC may be required for Wii BC due to the shared accessories.

Aside from dance mats, are there any Wii games that require the GCN ports?

I'm not sure. I'll try to follow up on that.

Then again, act Activision how much Nintendo cares about BC in the DSi.

Going by how rumors with the DS and Wii ended up these are most likely true. The touchscreen device sounds clunky and expensive though. No idea how you'd use motion controls with that. On the upside that means Chou Soujuu Mecha MG could work on that console.


As for shared accessories, the DSi had no support for DS accessories that used the GBA cart slot.

I've been thinking about the 6" figure, and my first thought is that it is a diagonal. That means we don't know the height/width ratio. It could be quite narrow.

Interesting fact: diagonal corner-to-corner the Wii Remote is 6".

Guitar Hero DS?

Also I mean High resolution single touch screens have been around for a long time.  My Dell Axim 51v screen had just been caught up to this generation of iPhones so... single touch tech wise it probably be a lot cheaper then everyone be thinking for the screen. Mic Cheap.  Camera's Cheap.  I'll bet the motion bits cost more then the last two things and there not that expensive anymore.  Nintendo can think the Phone industry for really driving down the cost of a lot of these little components.  Though I do think Nintendo couldn't initially make there customary profit margin and make a normal 20%-10% or so but, seriously as long as you're making money on the accessories what they gateway into matters much more.

It wouldn't mess up the drive. It could just do what the current Wii drive does whenever an object that isn't a disc is inserted and eject it right away.

A new device wouldn't have to use a slot loader anyway.

Go back to flip-top like the GameCube? I like that design better anyway, it's more durable.

No reason it couldn't, but that does mean you couldn't put it on a middle self in an entertainment center.

Could be a tray, similar to the Panasonic Q.

A tray is still better than a slot-loader, to me.

Nintendo won't go out of their way to add GC support. There are Three reasons why I say this:

1) Its not like the GC was a hugely popular console, and we're now 2 generations later so people care even less than they did then.

2) Nintendo wouldn't even make the simple effort required to add DVD playback to the Wii. Even though its simple to do, it adds to the cost.

3) And perhaps most importantly, Nintendo makes zero money off Gamecube games and accessories at this point. If they aren't making money on it, why would they want to support it? They actually have an economic incentive NOT to support GC BC because they can make more money that way by selling GC games via downloads on the virtual console.

So for those three reasons I believe they won't add it. Even though it is simple to do, there just isn't the incentive there for them to do it. Not many consumers care about it, and there's no money in it, so why would they? They want you to rebuy those games.

The most baffling rumor to me is easily the 6" touchscreen. I'm trying to wrap my head around a controller that uses motion, sticks and buttons, and has a screen. Nothing feasible comes to mind. Who wants to swing around an NGP?

The most intriguing clue to what it may look like may seem like the most insignificant: the sensor bar. Why would the controller need a sensor bar? Well it probably needs to sense something, but what? Could it be a Wii like remote? Probably, but how are you going to hold the remote and the controller at the same time?

That's why I'm guessing that Head Tracking is making it's way into reality -- if these rumors are true. It's really the only logical answer given the data.

Keep in mind, the literal French text says it replaces the sensor bar. There's a lot of ways to interpret that, and many sites took it to mean that the controller could be used as the sensor bar for Wii games. As I read it, admittedly with limited understanding of the language, it was saying that pointing could be done entirely within the controller instead of having a device broadcast out.

"It replaces the sensor bar."

I guess that's not as intriguing. That could mean that part of the control is something like Kinect or Move.

The main problem I have with the 6" screen on the controller is the cost. Everyone is going to buy multiple controllers for their system, so wouldn't they all have this 6" screen? Seems like it would skyrocket the price, I can imagine it costing 90-100 for one controller

Nintendo might not actually care about the high controller price too much. In fact, I wouldn't be surprised if they were prepping a new "Wii Play"-like game for the system where people can feel better about swallowing a high controller price as long as a free game is included.

Its a model that worked on the Wii, although I'm not sure that would fly if it reached a total price of $100.

As a company, they're very cost conscious. I doubt we're going to get $100 controllers.

I was thinking they could sell the screen separately from the controller, just like how they do with the nunchuck thing. Many games (probably most) would not require or even use the screen, so it doesn't necessarily need to be fused into the controller. This way the controller can be $50 or less, but then you can buy the screen later on for an additional $50. So it would still be $100 total, but you wouldn't have to pay it all at once. The screen could be offered in as a bundle deal with games, kinda like what was done with Wii Play and the Balance Board and Wii Wheel and so on.

Would a $100 controller fly with consumers? It would if it could be paid for in installments. This strategy has already been proved to be extremely successful with the Wii. The 'mote only costs $50, but then you have to add a $20 'chuck and a $20 classic controller and a $10 wheel, and a $20 zapper and it all adds up. You might not pay it all at once, but on the Wii you very much do spend $100 easily on your control setup but people can swallow this because its done in installments and not all at once.

If it's not bundled in and part of the main control solution, then it won't be heavily supported by the software making it about as useful as the Balance board, M+, Motion Camera & the uDraw tablet, which would be only for the few handful of games that actually use those things.

Either bundle it in from the start, or don't bother.


If your gonna innovate with a screen in the controller/tablet streaming or whatever, it needs to be part of the base SKU otherwise it just becomes another optional and often ignored peripheral.

I agree with BnM.  If you want support it needs to be the standard.

I think he's saying you bundle it with the hardware, but sell it separately for additional controllers. That way everybody has one, but not necessarily more than one, so you couldn't assume there were multiple individual screens for local multiplayer.

I also, while typing this post, figured out what the bundled game to show off the screen in the controller will be: Pac Man Vs. 2. Hell yes.

I don't know which Wii you're talking about, but I've fixed at least a dozen that were damaged from non-discs being inserted in them. I think you meant to say "whenever a disc that isn't a Wii or GameCube game..." because it doesn't like to eject plastic toy music discs, bobby pins, checkers, toothpicks, etc, etc.

Anyway, if Project Cafe is backwards compatible with the Wii, then there's really no reason to not make it backwards compatible with the GameCube. Then again, there's no reason to make it BC with either console, since there's already 80 bazillion Wiis out there, and they all play GameCube games. My guess is that it will be backwards compatible, via software emulation and having some common hardware too, but it will only use Wii Remotes for playing Wii games, the Wii sensor bar will work with it (or there will be one built into the new console), and GameCube games will be played using the classic controller.

Well if it's a small object then it's likely to get stuck in there, but it will attempt to eject it.

The Wii's optical drive sucks anyway. Everyone I know has had their drive fail at least once. Most were covered under warranty, but some have happened only recently and were thus repaired out of pocket. It's not a hard job, but those drives do cost about $50, so it's no small price.

None of these rumors make any sense. The HD one; ok sure. The release on 2012; probably. But a controller with a screen, all the necessary buttons for today's games, a camera, sensor bar, that can stream full games and has better motion detecting than the Move. It's too much. Way too much.

If we're looking at a $100 controller then the odds of the console's MSRP being $299 are even less likely. That would mean the console itself could be worth no more than $200, and if that's the case how powerful could it be? The only way you would pay $299 and get a console that was worth $299 is if the $100 controller were omitted from the SKU. Somehow I don't think that would go over well with consumers. Its bad enough not to get a game bundled with the system, but to not have a controller either would be even worse. Consumers don't want to be SKUed with a controllerless SKU.

So if the controller is truly worth $100 then the console MSRP may be as high as $399. But my guess is the whole screen on the controller thing is probably just a bunch of crap, unless its something really simple and inexpensive.

Would have to be.

I mean if you think about it there is a basic laundry list that must happen:
1. HD (You can't buy an SD TV really anymore.)
2. Better Motion Controls then the Competition aka Move in this case
3. Someting beyond motion tech because of Kinect (if Kinect hadn't came out a full iteration would be less a no-no but, it shifted the game and made it a capital time to strike at there market because its sort of the same move Nintendo did with the Wiimote.  Someone name a non-casualish game that really can use Kinect well as its main control scheme.)
4. More storage (games and system)

Once you start going through the checklist it makes more sense.

Also a controllerless SKU would be shooting yourself in the foot. I also still hold Nintendo will not make there customery profits on the controller this time.  Profit just not as much initially because the need to strike while the iron is hot.

Nintendo's certainly not going to take a loss, but they'll settle for a lot less than the huge margins they're making on the 3DS.

Maybe the new system will allow 3d on any television without glasses. I mean, Nintendo HAS been blowing our minds lately with all the new things in recent years like the 3ds. It kinda seems routine now doesn't it? Which is increasingly awesome. We'll probably be having dinner with a real Mario in our homes within 10 years.

In a recent interview Reggie said something about not having 3D as the main draw like 3DS. I don't remember exactly but every site took it as no 3D at all.

If anyone can look through any patents Nintendo has filed over the last few years that can provide some clues about what might be put in the console. For example, does anyone know if there have been any patent filings regarding a touch screen controller? What other patents have Nintendo filed recently that may provide some clues on what they're up to? Of course, you have to accept that not every single patent that Nintendo files for is actually going to end up used in a finalized product, but it can give some ideas anyway.

The Touchscreen controller patent may actually already be covered by patents for the DS.  Considers how they did them.

Over the last few years I've learned not to take what Nintendo execs say at face value, especially when they're being vague. It's usually best to just wait them out until they're ready to actually say something (or as in the case of the 3DS, someone forces their hand).

Patents:

Wii Light: Ambient and Game controlled lighting system
HDD Game Storage: Copying Retail Games directly to a HDD and then accessed through a special filing system with boxart & rating info

Horseback Riding Controller accessory: .... just look at the pic 
Football Controller: Squishy football controller accessory, like the steering wheel, bowling ball, tennis racket, etc etc

Vitality Sensor Game:
Balance Board Motorcycle Game:



Reggie says 3D will not be Wii2 selling point:

Note that Reggie isn't saying that the Wii 2 *won't* support 3D. He's just saying that isn't going to be the selling point of it. Which makes sense, because at this point its not an amazing new innovation anymore. Other consoles have already been doing it.

No to sound like a dick, but is that a *Note* to yourself?
because no one even mentioned Wii2 not supporting 3D

In fact Iwata pretty much already confirmed that 3D will be doable in the next system (as it is already possible in Wii and GC)
http://www.andriasang.com/e/blog/2010/06/17/iwata_on_3d_wii/

Okay, here's my thoughts on this:

Some of these details are so off-the-wall and impractical that I'd easily assume they were just another  part of the regular flow of misinformation constantly being spread across the Internet-- except there seem to be way too many consistencies from too many independent sources for it not to have some legitimacy. Having a controller that has motion controls, dual analog sticks, and a 6-inch touch screen can't possibly be part of the same hardware. I'm thinking it's one of two possibilities: Either Nintendo has purposely concocted multiple false leaks to throw the press off, or at some of these features are in fact for a separate peripheral, and not part if the standard controller. My guess is that the touch-screen is something separate, and the rest will all be part of what will essentially be the standard controller. After, piecing all the reports together (excluding the touch screen), and using some common sense, I've concocted my own concept design:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v292/bman87301/cafe-1.jpg

Basically, it's an update of the Wii remote design, but more ergonomically shaped, and with an added 3DS-style analog circle slider as well as additional face buttons and a shoulder button (when it's on its side), which more or less removes the need for a separate Classic Controller. The B trigger is now analog-pressure sensitive. The Nunchuk is essentially the same only now with a phone-styled coiling cord, and an analog Z button (to go along with the analog B on the remote).

P.S. In case you can't tell, the button on the very top, above the D-pad and Circle slider on the remote is the POWER button.

Nintendo isn't savvy enough to successfully intentionally spread misinformation. Also, if they're trying to win over third parties, telling different things to different companies, some of which are lies, is not a good way to do that.

Again, I was saying any false leaks would have been aimed at the press, the not developers. The developers would obviously be shown the legitimate working hardware. Of course doing that means potential leaks, and Nintendo knows it  so they purposely have some of their own employees give false info to leak out simultaneously, thus making any legitimate leaks indistinguishable. Companies have been known to do this.

Hasn't Nintendo intentionally fed false rumors about upcoming products before? Seems like they did do that with the Wii before it was unveiled, but I can't put my finger on the specifics.

Because it didn't happen...

There were a number of false rumors about the Wii-- I think the most infamous and widely believed one was that it would use 3D projection, but that rumor was never supported by Nintendo. Nintendo did confirm DVD-playback, VGA support, and SSB at launch, none of which actually happened-- but those were all things that truly were initially planned, just ditched at the end-- not intentional false reports meant to mislead. As far as I know, Nintendo has never intentionally done that.

Yeah, all those talks about "online plans" for the Gamecube. ;)

Once again, the key term here is "intentionally false". Abandoned plans obviously don't qualify.

Since this thread may still be alive, I'll post one last updated Rumor Consolidation

Uhh bro...I think he was joking. Actually, I know he was. Still, he has a point.

I think we were all very surprised that Nintendo, the company that wanted to make online games before it was even possible, completely messed it up. What was especially troubling is that they had a nice template in Xbox Live to base it off of and make it their own, but still, they messed it up. If you were willing to put forth the effort, it worked and in some cases, worked well. But besides HD, people see online connectivity as the Wii's greatest fault.

With the 3DS, Nintendo's online and wireless connectivity looks promising. There is only one system friend code to share. They allow you to see what friends are online and what they are playing. The general gist of what I'm hearing is that it's not as robust as Live but it's nice, and upgradeable through FW.

So with the Wii 2, I'd except something even more satisfying. I, for one, am in agreement with BnM and others that they should tie the system to My Nintendo, and offer a cloud-based system that saved game data, allowed easy registering of games, and kept track of what VC and Wiiware games you have purchased. But Sony just started to offer something like that so I don't see Nintendo pulling it off from the get go.

New Rumor "confirmations" from IGN
-The N Stream (Wii2) details from IGN: Price, size, manufacture dates, manufacturer, features and a possible name.

or even better

Nintendo's Wii Stream

LOL how childish hehehehe

Just an FYI - I'm planning an update to this tonight or tomorrow.

Did you get Ribbed on RFN about this?

Nope. I was congratulated for a job well done.

*Crimm goes back and quickly Ninja-Edits before release*

Don't cross the Wii Streams!

http://www.29-95.com/files/images/GB.jpg

http://www.liveforfilms.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/12/Ghostbusters-art-500x400.jpg
Source - http://www.liveforfilms.com/2010/12/31/cool-art-ghostbusters-made-the-stay-puft-marshmallow-man-cry/

Was looking for a picture with the beams going in and Label the Stay Puff Marshmellow Man as the Stream but, I saw this picture and thought it was too cute not to share.

Just imagine how awesome it would be if the new controllers linked up with the console with streams of colored light just like in Ghostbusters.

I've updated this article.

You know, NWR has a three man sleeper cell stationed in Japan. Are they skilled enough to infiltrate NCL, take out the Nintendo Ninjas and escape with the vital Cafe information? Is the minimal loss of life worth a Pulitzer?

All I'm saying is if a Chinese operative can smuggle out a 3DS from the factory, then SuperFamicomplicated should be able to conduct a little corporate espionage.

If they can find it.

In order to get into Nintendo's secret installation you must first get past their guard dog, Reggie. :reggie:

Real Reggie is at NoA. NCL has Reggiebots developed at Tohoku University. Replace eyes with lasers and teeth with a pneumatic beartrap and you pretty much get the idea.

Does he stil have his Sea Monster that he used to soften Europe for the Wii?

I've tried before. Nintendo HQ in Kyoto is surrounded by Piranha Plants.

First jump to lure it out.  Then run while its resetting.

Ceric has a point there, man. Go for it.

New Rumor: -Project Cafe  E3 Publishers List?

New Rumor: -Project Cafe: 8GB onboard Flash, 25GB disc & 1080p