3DS

Ocarina of Time Had Mario 64-Esque Paintings Early in Development

by Neal Ronaghan and Matt Walker - June 15, 2011, 11:53 pm PDT
Total comments: 8 Source: http://www.nintendo.co.jp/3ds/interview/aqej/vol5/...

Also, Miyamoto sees the series and game like it was Twin Peaks.

Here are some translated notes from the latest Iwata Asks on The Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time 3D:

- Back when they first started making it they didn't know how big a game they would be able to make with the memory constraints. Miyamoto reveals that while they were validating it, he had a worst case scenario in his mind that it would be structured like Mario 64 - only Link would be adventuring in Ganon's castle and it would have separate areas the way Mario 64 uses the paintings. In that case Link wouldn't be able to leave the castle.

- The Forest Temple battle with the Ganon Doppelganger riding a horse out of the painting was a carry over idea from that period of development.

- Iwata mentions that Zelda must have been an exception for Miyamoto - he usually makes his game by first focusing on the game function/elements and then expanding on that, but for Zelda it seems like story was more important. Miyamoto says that is incorrect, he relates it to Twin Peaks - in that show it was less about the story for him and more about what kind of characters would show up. He created Zelda with that mind set of deciding first what kind of characters he wanted to show up in the game.

- Iwata asks Miyamoto about the story and he mentions that he would love it if people would stop focusing on the story, because having to pay attention to all of those details ends up wasting a lot of time. He'd much rather focus on the game itself. He likens this to Yoshi - people as if he is a boy or a girl? Well he's probably a boy, he says. Then he shouldn't be able to produce eggs. But if he's a girl his voice should be more girlie, etc, etc.

- He then relates the concept to Popeye - how these same characters in old cartoons would play different roles every time, and that is kinda how the Mario characters have become. He then mentions that it would be great if people could accept him doing that with the Zelda characters.

- He explains that pre-rendered cut scenes don't line up with his design style at all, and if they have to put some in his games he makes sure that they're done so that they can be easily changed on the fly. So he prefers doing them in real time.

- For the scene in Lon Lon ranch where Ingo chooses to be a sore loser and lock the doors so Link can't get out - originally he wanted to have Ingo burn the ranch down in reaction to that. But then someone brought up "well, what do we do when people go back to the ranch after that?" and that's when Miyamoto chose to give up on that idea.

- At the end, talking about the 25th anniversary Miyamoto reveals that Nintendo of America proposed doing a collectors pack exactly like they did with Mario 25, but Miyamoto and Iwata both shot that down saying that wasnt very Nintendo-like. (Doing it two years in a row)

Talkback

EnnerJune 16, 2011

Quote:

Nintendo of America proposed doing a collectors pack exactly like they did with Mario 25, but Miyamoto and Iwata both shot that down saying that wasnt very Nintendo-like. (Doing it two years in a row)

Aww. Something like that should be Nintendo-like. This is a special time; a time to reflect on Nintendo history.

UltimatePartyBearJune 16, 2011

Quote:

- He then relates the concept to Popeye - how these same characters in old cartoons would play different roles every time, and that is kinda how the Mario characters have become. He then mentions that it would be great if people could accept him doing that with the Zelda characters.

I can get behind that.  The continuity used to matter more to me, but even back then it was too snarled for me to reconcile the first two games with the rest of the series.  The series has doubled in size since that time, and there's plenty of room in it for mini-series of interconnected games (like WW and PH) without worrying about the overall timeline(s).  It's just not worth the energy to get worked up over it anymore.  I mean, I'd prefer continuity, but I can see how it could be stifling to creativity, and that would be far, far worse for the series.

You have my support, Mr. Miyamoto.

KeyBillyJune 16, 2011

I think story helps us relate to the characters and makes every action in the game world feel more compelling.  In SMG 2, for example, the absence of story made me less interested in defeating Bowser.  It was just another boss battle.  I agree that artistic license is needed with characters, but that should only help the story, not hurt it.  I love Miyamoto, but I feel like sometimes he is standing over the shoulders of people that want to excel in some areas of games that I care about, making sure they are blocked at every step.

AdrockJune 16, 2011

It would greatly benefit Miyamoto if he said there was no continuity and that each game stands alone, besides the obvious sequels like Majora's Mask, similar to Final Fantasy. That way the characters can just play the roles they play for each game.

If Nintendo were to do that, they could focus on telling a story without adhering to a continuity. Story IS important as it draws players into the world, incites emotions, makes them care about what they're doing. Miyamoto/Nintendo shouldn't discount the effect it can have but the problem seems to stem from trying to fit it all into a neat anthology. I can do without the continuity, the canon. It's hard for me to invest into a long adventure if I'm doing it "just because' so in that sense, I prefer a strong narrative along with compelling gameplay.

Ian SaneJune 16, 2011

A big part of the appeal for Zelda is exploring the world.  That means the locales and characters all have to be interesting and those are storyline elements.  Some attention has to be paid to the story in order for the world to feel like a world and not just be some videogame level.

If they had gone with the Mario 64 painting idea in OoT, not only would that have changed the game but it would have had a major effect on videogames PERIOD.  OoT was incredibly influencial because it pretty much did whatever it felt like.  It really pulled away the limitations of videogame design with its sheer scope and ambition.  The paintings idea would not have allowed that.  It worked for Mario because Mario is a level based game.  Zelda had to be one big world and had to show devs how to make one big world in a 3D game.

mr_lakituJune 16, 2011

Quote:

- For the scene in Lon Lon ranch where Ingo chooses to be a sore loser and lock the doors so Link can't get out - originally he wanted to have Ingo burn the ranch down in reaction to that. But then someone brought up "well, what do we do when people go back to the ranch after that?" and that's when Miyamoto chose to give up on that idea.

That made me Lol Lol Ranch ;D

UltimatePartyBearJune 16, 2011

I guess I read it differently, but I thought he was only talking about the overall Zelda series story, not claiming that he didn't want to have a good story within each individual game.

Could the translator possibly clear that up for us, please?  Or is it too vague in the original Japanese?

Mop it upJune 19, 2011

That's how I interpreted it as well. Each game has good story within that title, but things are made into a mess when trying to connect them. So don't connect them.

Quote:

He likens this to Yoshi - people as if he is a boy or a girl? Well he's probably a boy, he says. Then he shouldn't be able to produce eggs. But if he's a girl his voice should be more girlie, etc, etc.

Just say that Yoshi is asexual or a hermaphrodite and be done with it.

Quote:

- At the end, talking about the 25th anniversary Miyamoto reveals that Nintendo of America proposed doing a collectors pack exactly like they did with Mario 25, but Miyamoto and Iwata both shot that down saying that wasnt very Nintendo-like. (Doing it two years in a row)

What a crock. They already did this two years in a row, since in 2009 they released the Metroid Prime Trilogy along with the other New Play Control! series of games.

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