Topic: my crazy idea for starfox

[Armak88]

I wouldn't mind on foot missions if they were done right, but I just want a kickass starfox game again, and I think the best way to get that is to go back to flying. Maybe another game could be all on foot fox, but I would rather see one thing done right than two or more things poorly implemented. And if I have to make the choice between fox in an awring and fox on foot, I'll take fox in the air every time.

[Smoke39]

Star Fox 64's multiplayer was quite good, it wasn't intense or desperate and therefor not to formula, but it was quite fun.

Flying in circles through a big, empty level and spraying your opponent with a burst of laser fire every once in a while when you come accross them isn't very fun.  Especially when things mainly came down to who had found the laser upgrade.

and as for playing western games like this... name some and i would be happy to.

I don't know; I don't pay much attention to the genre.  But if there's a lack of such games, it isn't Star Fox's responsibility to fill the niche, just as it wasn't Metroid's responsibility to provide Nintendo with an FPS (e.g., Metroid fan backlash to Hunters).

[EasyCure]

... wait there were "on foot" in Star Fox 64's multiplayer. http://youtube.com/watch?v=3tMKXVzyl_4

Star Fox 64's multiplayer was quite good, it wasn't intense or desperate and therefor not to formula, but it was quite fun.

Keep the on foot missions!  Fox is still in character and a badass on foot!

thats exactly what i was going to say. You cant say that on-foot missions arent a part of starfox because obviously the designers of the BEST Star Fox game wanted to add some on foot stuff, or else they would of left it out completely.

also, Armak88 i have played Sin & Punishment, not only back on the 64 but i have it on the VC now as well and the difference between that and star fox is all in the movement. Sure its also on rails and you're blasting sh*t outta the sky left and right but you're not around the way you do in an Arwing. your movement is mainly left and right with some jumping thrown in. Theres no way you can avoid a giant laser by hugging the top corners of the screen in S&P. Point is, if movement was that restricted, yes i agree that IR pointing for aiming would work, but i still dont think it'd work for star fox.

[q]i just want to see the series continue and stay starfox.  defend the on foot missions all you want.  but thats not starfox.  i also want to see the series evolve so to speak cause it is really an untaped goldmine.  there aren't many games in this genera any more.[/q]

Let me get this straight, you want the series to continue and stay "star fox" or, true to its roots, but you also want the series evolve. But arent the on-foot missions of assault an evolution of the series? Look at the on-foot battles from the SF64 multiplayer and they suck because of how limited the multiplayer was. Now if you imagine that but put it in the games single player mode you'd have somethign similar to what Namco did in Assault. I call that an evolution of the series. You'd be stifling the series if you pigeon held it to JUST on rails or JUST Arwing missions.

The fact is Star Fox is a group of mercenaries for hire, so if somewhere in the story someone wants them hired for a mission that can be done on foot, let them do it. They wouldnt pass up that paycheck. If your argument is that the on-foot missions dont feel like a starfox game then it might just be that you're close minded. I know when I played thru Assault those missions felt right; you're speeding around, shooting a ton of sh*t and ducking moving out of harms way. Maybe if they made an on-foot mission that was also on-railes you'd like it more. You already mentioned S&P so im assuming you already think the two are similar.

Next Star Fox games needs to be done in house and i have faith they'll take all of the series best elements and make a game that can top SF64.

[Smoke39]

In a sense, aren't the landmaster missions sort of a proof of concept for on-foot missions?  That is, they show that Star Fox can work on the ground.

[walkingdead2]

the fact of the matter is the game is called starfox... not foot fox and that's the way it should be.

second don't call me closed minded cause i didn't like the foot missions in assault.  that game was just aw full and as much of a fanboy as i am i cant just give Nintendo a pass on every thing they do. (or outsource)

its ridiculous to call me close minded cause i didn't like something in one game.  were not talking about the social ramifications of Raoul Castro taking power in Cuba, and how that's going to affect Florida's economics, as well as trade with Venezuela.

i just didn't like starfox assault.  and if the foot missions were so good on sf64 why didn't they put them in the real game? probably cause it didn't feel like starfox.

[Smoke39]

the fact of the matter is the game is called starfox... not foot fox and that's the way it should be.

Well, on that note, it isn't called Land Fox or Aqua Fox, either.

[DAaaMan64]

second don't call me closed minded cause i didn't like the foot missions in assault.  that game was just aw full and as much of a fanboy as i am i cant just give Nintendo a pass on every thing they do. (or outsource)

Your in the wrong forum if you think we give Nintendo any free passes here.

[walkingdead2]

am i just the only one who wants to see this game return to its roots... and be proud again.  i guess i am cause every one else wants foot missions or the inability to have any freedom in the game.

[Smoke39]

Ditching the rails =/= returning to its roots.

[Armak88]

Ditching the rails =/= returning to its roots.

QFT

Being able to fly anywhere would be so strange for a starfox game. Part of the fun in the 64 game was finding new paths in each level. I know it's been said already but having the game on rails allows the developer to place obstacles and changes in your path that have to be overcome. It's like running through a gauntlet. I don't understand how you could be a fan of starfox and hate the idea of on rails gameplay.

[walkingdead2]

Ditching the rails =/= returning to its roots.

no but driving tanks and running around fighting dinosaurs is far far far from its roots.

[DAaaMan64]

Ditching the rails =/= returning to its roots.

no but driving tanks and running around fighting dinosaurs is far far far from its roots.

I don't know what roots your talking about, but the landmaster was in the 64 version and that was when the series was prime.

[walkingdead2]

i must admit that the 64 version is the only one i haven't played.  but i have played every other one... well not 2 that was only in japan though.

[Shift Key]

i must admit that the 64 version is the only one i haven't played.  but i have played every other one... well not 2 that was only in japan though.

You wouldn't be so bitter if you'd have played it.

[NWR_insanolord]

You're a fan of Star Fox but you haven't played the best game in the series? You really should pick it up on the VC. And the SNES Star Fox 2 was never released anywhere, even in Japan, but it was close to completion when it got canceled and a ROM of it is out there on the net.

[EasyCure]

On-foot Fox.. LOL

if anything, that statement alone shows how you're being closed minded. And honestly, in my original post i meant to say something like "you're either closed minded or..." but i guess i was in such a hurry i only left it at "you're closed minded" which sounds like an insult, which i didnt mean so sorry if i got you all worked up.

I just dont see how after 4 real installments of the game (i dont count Adventures because it was TOO much of a departure, and i wont defend it because it isnt a real Star Fox game, it was a game called Dinasaur Planet and reworked to use Starfox characters.. if you didnt know). 2 of which feature the landmaster tank (not sure about Command so maybe 3) people still complain about it or the on foot missions. Like Smoke39 stated, the landmaster alone is proof that the game works on the ground as well. Those levels were awesome, albeit a little slower paced.

And if you've never played Starfox 64 than you better get on it, NOW. It is everything a sequel should be and completely blows the original out of the water. Its been long enough now that it has the nostalgia factor working for it too but it just didnt have the difficulty of the original... i think thats the only factor that really keeps it from making fans forget about the original. The graphics in the original were great for its time because of the SuperFX chip but starfox64 is one of the few games (in my opinion anyway) on the N64 that dont look ugly ten years later. Plus Starfox64 introduced the rumble pak which really put you in the game. Today i barely ever feel the rumble in games, i think we take it for granted, but back then.. awesome!

Also to clarify, im not against the All-range levels, they were fun too but they clearly fall short of the great on-rail levels. I'm also not saying that on-rails is the way to go. What I'm saying is that if Starfox wants to return to glory it should do everything its already done (Railed/Non-railed levels, Varied vehicles to pilot, on foot missions, different paths to reaching the End Boss, different paths within levels, sense of team thru good story/script, replayability, a challenge, smooth controls) and take it to the next level.. you know, what they SHOULD be doing with the series. Assault was a good evolution of the series gameplay but it fell short to the magic of N64 game. The on-foot missions are fun but they also got repetitive because they were abundant. The Flying missions didnt feel right.. something about the enemy patterns and the pacing just put me off about it.. it just fell short. It felt like a Star Fox game, it just didnt feel like a GREAT starfox game. To be cliche, it was the "mario sunshine" of the star fox series. i want a star fox "galaxy" caliber game and honestly, i dont think a 3rd party could do that the next time around.

[walkingdead2]

You're a fan of Star Fox but you haven't played the best game in the series? You really should pick it up on the VC. And the SNES Star Fox 2 was never released anywhere, even in Japan, but it was close to completion when it got canceled and a ROM of it is out there on the net.

how can i play starfox 64 on the snes.

and i thought starfox 2 was released... ohhh well i was wrong.

[UltimatePartyBear]

There have only been two Star Fox games: one on the SNES and one on the N64.  I don't know what this "Assault" thing you guys are talking about is, but for some reason the thought of it makes me want to kill things.

[Nick DiMola]

There have only been two Star Fox games: one on the SNES and one on the N64.  I don't know what this "Assault" thing you guys are talking about is, but for some reason the thought of it makes me want to kill things.

No props for Star Fox 2 ... I mean Command?

[DAaaMan64]

There have only been two Star Fox games: one on the SNES and one on the N64.  I don't know what this "Assault" thing you guys are talking about is, but for some reason the thought of it makes me want to kill things.

No props for Star Fox 2 ... I mean Command?

Command wasn't bad, but I had missed the on rails stuff a lot and all-range mode annoyed me for all the reasons it already did. Having to turn around too much.

[UltimatePartyBear]

There have only been two Star Fox games: one on the SNES and one on the N64.  I don't know what this "Assault" thing you guys are talking about is, but for some reason the thought of it makes me want to kill things.

No props for Star Fox 2 ... I mean Command?

Once upon a time, reading about Star Fox 2 in Nintendo Power made me excited in all the right ways.  Then it got canceled, and then Star Fox 64 came out and solidified the series concept.  Before that, with only one game called Star Fox, they were completely free to change things up in the sequel, and it would have been awesome.  They didn't do that, though.  They started experimenting after the series was defined, and it worked against them.  Star Fox Adventures is about as much a Star Fox game as Link's Crossbow Training is a Zelda game, for example.  That's not to say that any spin-off game like that has to be bad.  It's just that every Star Fox spin-off game has been very, very bad.

So I didn't even give Command a chance.  It was the same concept I once drooled over in Nintendo Power, sure, but the Star Fox series was already dead.

[DAaaMan64]

It's just that every Star Fox spin-off game has been very, very bad.

I don't really think so, nothing has been great but nothing has been terrible.  All the games played well and were solid entertainment but they weren't anything real striking.  I though Dinosaur Planet was okay, but not great. Had it not been so damned frustrating and if the controls had felt more fluid I would have probably liked it quite a lot.  Sounds like it just shouldn't have been developed by Rare. 

That is my honest opinion of Star Fox Adventures and yes that game wasn't too bad.  For example our own review gave the game an 8, and IGN gave it a 9.  It averaged an 8.1 on game rankings and Assault averaged a 7.1(We gave it two 7s).  Far from "very very bad"

[walkingdead2]

On-foot Fox.. LOL

if anything, that statement alone shows how you're being closed minded.

im really tired of this open minded closed minded argument.  my opinion is a closed minded one and there for not valid to you.  why cant i have my opinion.  if i don't like something im not going to say i do just to do it.  in fact your close minded because you cant accept the open world branching storyline idea i had that keeps fox in a space ship... there you go i turned the table on you.

why don't we just discuss this topic rather than calling each other names.

[UltimatePartyBear]

That is my honest opinion of Star Fox Adventures and yes that game wasn't too bad.  For example our own review gave the game an 8, and IGN gave it a 9.  It averaged an 8.1 on game rankings and Assault averaged a 7.1(We gave it two 7s).  Far from "very very bad"

Clearly I disagree with those scores.  I find myself liking Dinosaur Planet less and less as time goes by.  I can't think of it without blaming it for being a textbook example of how not to apply a license to a game, for introducing ridiculous and terrible concepts to the Star Fox series, and for encouraging the idea of Fox running around outside his Arwing, which led directly to the game I consider the worst purchase I ever made, even though I spent less than $15 on it.

Now, before we go in a circle again, I know some people liked the on-foot crap.  You're welcome to your opinion.  The simple fact of the matter is that those are not even remotely a part of what I think a good Star Fox game should be, and there is no way to make them good enough because being Fox McCloud is not the appeal of the game.  The appeal of the game is flying an Arwing fighter against impossible odds and winning.  Fox is a cool character, sure, but only because he's the ace pilot of a highly destructive machine of war.  If you take that part of his character away, he's just another funny animal, no cooler than Crash or Bubsy.

(I'll grant an exception for the Landmaster because the MacBeth stage in Star Fox 64 is a beautiful symphony of destruction.)

[DAaaMan64]

That is my honest opinion of Star Fox Adventures and yes that game wasn't too bad.  For example our own review gave the game an 8, and IGN gave it a 9.  It averaged an 8.1 on game rankings and Assault averaged a 7.1(We gave it two 7s).  Far from "very very bad"

Clearly I disagree with those scores.  I find myself liking Dinosaur Planet less and less as time goes by.  I can't think of it without blaming it for being a textbook example of how not to apply a license to a game, for introducing ridiculous and terrible concepts to the Star Fox series, and for encouraging the idea of Fox running around outside his Arwing, which led directly to the game I consider the worst purchase I ever made, even though I spent less than $15 on it.

Now, before we go in a circle again, I know some people liked the on-foot crap.  You're welcome to your opinion.  The simple fact of the matter is that those are not even remotely a part of what I think a good Star Fox game should be, and there is no way to make them good enough because being Fox McCloud is not the appeal of the game.  The appeal of the game is flying an Arwing fighter against impossible odds and winning.  Fox is a cool character, sure, but only because he's the ace pilot of a highly destructive machine of war.  If you take that part of his character away, he's just another funny animal, no cooler than Crash or Bubsy.

(I'll grant an exception for the Landmaster because the MacBeth stage in Star Fox 64 is a beautiful symphony of destruction.)

I guess we agree to disagree, because I though the on-foot stuff from Assault felt smooth, fun, and I thought I was playing real StarFox when I was doing the on-foot stuff.