Author Topic: Super Smash Bros. Brawl (Read 451921 times)

KDR_11k · « **Reply #300 on:** May 19, 2006, 11:49:27 PM »

At least make a 360 version, you fool.

Who says they aren't going to? I don't recall them talking much about the XB and PC ports of the previous MGS games, either.

Renny · « **Reply #301 on:** May 21, 2006, 09:30:07 PM »

If they're building the game/engine from the ground up for PS3, as they did for Snake Eater, I can't see them porting Guns of the Patriots to the 360 either. Unless the PlayStation truly falls on its ass. (To Phil, Ken, Kaz, et al: please fail. Thank you.)

Spak-Spang · « **Reply #302 on:** May 22, 2006, 10:39:53 AM »

New Question to spark discussion for Smash Brothers Brawl:

In Melee every character got a new special move to accompany the old moves. Most characters didn't lose any moves or had moves changed. This led to the current system of special moves being maxed out.

So the questions are:

1)Do you want to keep characters movesets the same, and just balance the gameplay more, of course new characters would have completely new move sets?

2)Add new moves to characters that need adjustments, even it means taking other moves away. It is better to balance characters and keep them fresh for a new game?

3)Come up with a new system for special moves so that all the old moves can be kept and new moves can be added?

Personally, I want to keep the simple move set. It was limited, but made the game accessable. Most characters move sets are close to perfect, but could always be refined...and some characters need complete overhauls.

Bowser needs an overhaul. His moves just don't bring the fear and power that a character of his size and evil needs. I would rather drop his 3rd jump and just make him even harder to Smash Hit any true distance. Then back him up with some insane power to match his bulk.

Yoshi needs to lose that annoying Egg Roll attack for something better.
Mario could lose the Cape for a new move slot.
Gannondorf needs a completely new play style.
Young Link needs to have completely seperate move set from Adult Link.

I am sure there is others I could bring up.

Arbok · « **Reply #303 on:** May 22, 2006, 10:52:10 AM »

Quote
Originally posted by: Spak-Spang
In Melee every character got a new special move to accompany the old moves. Most characters didn't lose any moves or had moves changed. This led to the current system of special moves being maxed out.

Some characters did, though, like Kirby got a fairly awful new running charge move in Melee where he gets engulfed in fire, which was done to balance him out because his old one was too good... problem was that Kirby was nerfed way too hard and was made arguably the weakest character in Melee.

Anyway, they have the "finishers" (or what ever they will ba called) to play around with for each character, so that gives them a lot of room to add new things and elements to each regardless.

Quote
Originally posted by: Spak-Spang
1)Do you want to keep characters movesets the same, and just balance the gameplay more, of course new characters would have completely new move sets?

I'd rather the "B" moves for the non-clones stay the same. Some of them need improvments, like Kirby's hammer, but I think this should be done with balancing out things like damage, range or other added effects instead of removing them.

As for the clones, they need different movesets. However, I loved Ganondorf, and thought the idea of a "heavy" Captain Falcon was great and he was the most diverse in terms of play in regards to the clones. I would like to see someone like that again, although not with Ganondorf. I think someone like "Deathborn" from F-Zero GX would fit that role, although hopefully they would still spice it up a little more in terms of his moves to make him stand out more against Captain Falcon.

Honestly, though, I wouldn't mind if they just axed Dr. Mario, Young Link and Pichu as is. Falco, with his huge jumping, was different enough to I think merit a redesign as was Roy with that giant explosion he released with holding B, but the others I wouldn't lose sleep over if they got the axe.

Spak-Spang · « **Reply #304 on:** May 22, 2006, 11:16:53 AM »

Arbok: Thanks for your input.

I personally liked Young Link as a character in the game, but felt his execution wasn't good. I am an proponent of Young Link turning into Wind Waker Link, and giving him different items for specials to help him feel different.

Young Link bombs should be the Bomb-Chus, and walk across the ground.

Young Link should have an attack evasion move link Marth and Roy have (Like in Wind Waker.)

Young Link should have a boomerang that parallizes the character for like a half second (Like in the original Zelda.)

Instead of a bow and arrow, he should have his trust slingshot.

Do that and Young Link is finally, a contender and different from Link.

AnyoneEB · « **Reply #305 on:** May 22, 2006, 03:36:06 PM »

I would expect some new game play mechanics like there were in SSB:M. You already mentioned meteor smashes (I think everyone got them, not just Kirby). On the other hand, if you want to still use the GCN controller, I am not sure how you would fit in any new moves. The only thing I can think of is there are currently two jump buttons (X and Y). Remember we are talking about the game where left+A describes at least 5 unique moves (weak, strong, meteor smash, charge-up smash, simple smash) depending on exactly how you time it. It seems pretty maxed out on controls. Whatever, I am sure there will be a few changes.

I agree that the clones should get their own moves. In order to fix balance, some moves may have to be removed, but it would be nice if, like SSB-->SSBM, you could just pick up the game and use any character from the old game and be okay at it.

zakkiel · « **Reply #306 on:** May 23, 2006, 06:28:17 AM »

No moves new moves. I think Mario's cape move is fine, otherwise Spak-spang's list is decent. I would add DK's forward B. I can't think of another move equally useless. It's slow, does no real damage, never traps them long enough for you to add another attack unless they're at such high damage that the punch would obliterate them anyway, and can't even really spike them when they're in the air at over 100%.

EasyCure · « **Reply #307 on:** May 23, 2006, 07:59:38 AM »

mario's cape should stay, i love that move. practice enough to get the timing right and watch peoples reaction when you fling a bob-omb back at them....aah i love smash :-D

maybe they can replace marios up+b (the uppercut) and incorperate the cape in some way that makes him do some kind of flying move. even if they change the uppercut slightly so that it becomes a type of grab where mario flies up and back down to power bomb the crap out of an opponent....then again thats too similar to kirby's grab move. i duno, it'd be cool to see mario fly with the cape though, with the cape or the Leaf power up from SMB3.

Spak-Spang · « **Reply #308 on:** May 23, 2006, 08:13:26 AM »

EasyCure: How about change his uppercut, into his trademark Spin Jump with the Cape?

I would make it do less damage, but combo better, and even deflect projectiles still.

Air Grab moves would be great, but I think that is something for Donkey Kong. He needs to be reworked so that he is a monster thrower.

If we replaced forward B with a special dash and throw move, that could be used in the air in any direction. Could be very cool.

I think Princess Peach also needs something more. Perhaps overhaul her so that she reflects more Super Princess Peach with emtion based special moves. Her special moves in the Melee were very weak as if they didn't have much to go off of.

EasyCure · « **Reply #309 on:** May 23, 2006, 08:28:14 AM »

yeah i agree about peach. there wasnt too much to go on when they designed her character really. the floating and turnip picking were the only real "moves" she ever had in the only action game she starred before Melee was developed. sure it was cute to see her smash attack use rackets and golf clubs, but this time around she has her own game and more moves under her belt, so she can be a contendor in Brawl.

Smash_Brother · « **Reply #310 on:** May 23, 2006, 08:30:49 AM »

I just want the characters BALANCED, and I don't care if SSBB comes out in 2008 for balance reasons alone.

Bowser (my favorite character) can be used to strike terror if you know how to use him properly but he BADLY needs to be revamped. All of Kirby's moves should have their power multiplied by 1.75.

Remember the metal block item and how it allowed your character to shrug off weak attacks? I think the heavyweights need to have that ability. When Bowser is about to perform his smash attack, a quick tap in the leg from Pichu shouldn't make him stop and cringe.

EasyCure · « **Reply #311 on:** May 23, 2006, 08:37:57 AM »

i don't know what made me think of this but what if they made a mario kart item...as in an actual kart that would zip across screen and plow anything in its way? that'd be fun lol.

ooh crazy idea for a level...remember how the final destination level the platform seemed to be getting sucked into a worm hole of some sort and you end up in a realistic world? what if there was a level simmilar to that where its a basic floating platform, but the scenery change, alot like the pokemone level, and allows diff. levels of interactivity. what i picture is something that will change it to difff nintendo themese. like one second you're on a basic platform, and in another you're on the old NES excite bike track and the lil racers could hit you (with minor damage). the change would be quick so it doesnt get stale and stays unpredictable. like you go from excite bike to one of bowsers keeps in SMB1 with lava pits, fire balls shooting up vertically/horizontally and those cool fire 'chains', then suddently everything warps so that you're fighting in another old school NES world.

it could be a virtual console level!!

(i just realized how absurd that idea is)

Bill Aurion · « **Reply #312 on:** May 23, 2006, 08:56:11 AM »

I don't believe it's been posted yet, but according to the official Japanese site not every character will return...(Bye bye, clones, hopefully...)

NWR_pap64 · « **Reply #313 on:** May 23, 2006, 08:59:48 AM »

I think the characters that were the least popular in Melee are the ones that will get the axe...

I think those might be Mr. Game and Watch, Mewtwo, The Ice climbers, a great deal of the clones and maybe Jigglypuff...

Seriously, who in here used Mr. Game and Watch as a serioys character?

Characters like DK, Yoshi, Bowser, Peach, Zelda, Cpt. Falcon and Ness are likely to stay since not only are they staple characters they are characters that people like and use a lot.

I don't know about the FE characters...

mantidor · « **Reply #314 on:** May 23, 2006, 09:01:53 AM »

"and maybe Jigglypuff..."

Noo

he rocks!

Besides whats the point of Snake being there if he cant get beaten up by someone with a flower above the head?

NWR_pap64 · « **Reply #315 on:** May 23, 2006, 09:05:14 AM »

Quote
Originally posted by: mantidor
"and maybe Jigglypuff..."

Noo he rocks!

I agree that Jigglypuff is a silent killer as if played right he/she becomes a killer character. I just wonder if he/she has enough support to appear again on Brawl.

If he/she does appear again in Brawl he/she will seriously become a never ending running joke of SSB.

Spak-Spang · « **Reply #316 on:** May 23, 2006, 09:05:19 AM »

Bill: I think that has been posted.

Easycure: I dunno about a Mario Kart item...but I would love a Mario Kart level...I think that is more interesting than the F-Zero level. (Although I admit it would be very similar.)

What would be cool about the level is that characters that weren't in the game actually playing would be the characters in the Karts...and yes that means having fun and designing Karts for non Mario characters. Also Items fired during in the Mario Kart race could effect the fighting. Lightning coud shrink everyone, a blue shell could smash hit the person in first place. Lots of potential.

I do like your changing Nintendo classics level design. It could be designed to look like a Television, and when you pause to zoom out you see a Nintendo Wii in a living room. Then the television changes to represent different games. Heck, it could even read the virtual console library (and trophies earned) to select which games.

Smash Brother: I completely agree. I think Bowser when you finally land a hit that can KO him should fly without much jump ability to get back...but he should be like trying to take down Metal Mario or something. Bowser needs to be completely feared as a weapon of Smash destruction.

Caterkiller · « **Reply #317 on:** May 23, 2006, 09:08:26 AM »

As big of a Pokemon fan that I am, I wouldn't mind Pichu gone, or Dr Mario. If there are going to be clones make them as different as Mario and Luigi please. I would love the other clones to stay but to have their own styles of play, not just tweaked versions of someone else.

Mr. Game and Watch is pretty popular in my smash community. I would be very angry if he was gone. Same with Mewtwo, and there is always someone around to surprise us with Jigglypuff.

NWR_pap64 · « **Reply #318 on:** May 23, 2006, 09:10:09 AM »

Now that you guys mentioned the Mario Kart level...

I REALLY hope that they cut down on the crazy, fast moving levels for Brawl.

I mean, those levels were nice and all, but most of the time they were annoying and I spent the entire match trying to avoid being killed by the level rather than fighting my opponent.

Just in case I am talking about levels like Big Blue, Poke Floats, Icicle mountain and Rainbow Cruise. From the looks of the Brawl tariler they will have constantly changing stages, but I hope they don't go hogwild with them on Brawl.

Smash_Brother · « **Reply #319 on:** May 23, 2006, 09:11:16 AM »

I'd have no problem with them throwing out half of the characters from SSBM.

IMHO, the secret character lineup sucked ass. Mr. Game and Watch can die in a fire, MewTwo was woefully underpowered, Marth and Roy never even appeared in a game which an English speaker could play and understand, Pichu is a weaker, sh*ttier version of Pikachu, and DOCTOR Mario?! Bleh...

Toss 'em all out, I say.

Smash_Brother · « **Reply #320 on:** May 23, 2006, 09:14:39 AM »

Quote
Originally posted by: Spak-Spang Smash Brother: I completely agree. I think Bowser when you finally land a hit that can KO him should fly without much jump ability to get back...but he should be like trying to take down Metal Mario or something. Bowser needs to be completely feared as a weapon of Smash destruction.

Yeah, Bowser, DK and other heavyweights should all be able to shrug off weak attacks and grabs by small characters.

If you're going to sacrifice speed, you need to get something in return. In SSBM, speed was KING. The top tier is populated by Marth, Shiek and Fox, FFS!

Something has to change if heavyweights are to have a chance of being worthwhile.

Arbok · « **Reply #321 on:** May 23, 2006, 09:16:37 AM »

Quote
Originally posted by: Spak-Spang
I think Princess Peach also needs something more. Perhaps overhaul her so that she reflects more Super Princess Peach with emtion based special moves. Her special moves in the Melee were very weak as if they didn't have much to go off of.

Peach rocked in SSB:M, and was easily one of the more top tier characters in the game simply for her trunip move and her recovery ability, while her mid-air smashs and running A attack were excellent. If they wanted to add "Super Princess Peach" emotion type stuff, that would likely fit in well with her new "finisher" move (wish there was a name for this).

Quote
Originally posted by: Smash_Brother
Bowser (my favorite character) can be used to strike terror if you know how to use him properly but he BADLY needs to be revamped. All of Kirby's moves should have their power multiplied by 1.75.

Fully agree, you never see Bowser or Kirby in the torunaments, and they need some upping in the power department badly. Kirby used to be too powerful back in the 64 version, but they greatly reduced his defense, decreased his attack power, and changed around some of his good regular attacks.

Quote
Originally posted by: pap64
I think the characters that were the least popular in Melee are the ones that will get the axe...

I think those might be Mr. Game and Watch, Mewtwo, The Ice climbers, a great deal of the clones and maybe Jigglypuff...

Game and Watch might get the axe simply for his design, but people do like him, the Ice Climbers and Jigglypuff, so I wouldn't jump to such conclusions as you do see them used in torunaments rarely. Removing Mewtwo is a horrible idea, though. He was a lower tier character, which is why no one played him. That's a pretty poor reason to just remove him altogether instead of trying to balance him to be a real contender.

Quote
Originally posted by: Smash_Brother
I'd have no problem with them throwing out half of the characters from SSBM.

IMHO, the secret character lineup sucked ass. Mr. Game and Watch can die in a fire, MewTwo was woefully underpowered, Marth and Roy never even appeared in a game which an English speaker could play and understand...

I do... You will evoke a LOT of outcry if Marth was removed, as he is the most used character in tournaments by far considering he was the top tier character in the game. Removing characters instead of balancing them, because they are underpowered, is a pretty poor idea too.

Spak-Spang · « **Reply #322 on:** May 23, 2006, 09:18:03 AM »

Smash:

I do agree Doctor Mario, Pichu, Mr. Game and Watch, and Roy were annoying characters.

Marth was cool even though I didn't know the character because he was someone completely new. Mewtwo had so much potential. I loved his jumps, his teleports, he just didn't have the power to back it up. I say keep him in and add some stuff.

How about a telekinesis special move where he can pickup objects when his range and throw them or bring them too him from far away. It would be a nifty power with some crazy strategy to it.

Smash_Brother · « **Reply #323 on:** May 23, 2006, 09:20:02 AM »

Quote
Originally posted by: Arbok
I do... You will evoke a LOT of outcry if Marth was removed, as he is the most used character in tournaments by far considering he was the top tier character in the game. Removing characters instead of balancing them, because they are underpowered, is a pretty poor idea too.

My primary gripe with him is that it is literally IMPOSSIBLE for me to KNOW him as a character without learning Japanese or finding a hacked translated FE rom.

I'd have no problem if they included Ike or the hero from the new FE game on the Wii because I can play the game and learn about him. I didn't play Earthbound until I unlocked Ness in SSB.

Smash_Brother · « **Reply #324 on:** May 23, 2006, 09:21:51 AM »

Quote
Originally posted by: Spak-Spang Marth was cool even though I didn't know the character because he was someone completely new. Mewtwo had so much potential. I loved his jumps, his teleports, he just didn't have the power to back it up. I say keep him in and add some stuff.

Roy was generally always called "C-stickin' Roy" because a player could sit there and use the C-stick during a 4 player battle and sometimes get enough kills to win.

I don't mind Mewtwo, just that they need to power him up substantially. Again, replace Marth with Ike and nerf him a bit and he'd be fine.

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Author Topic: Super Smash Bros. Brawl (Read 451921 times)