Topic: 3DS TV anyone?

[sweetfeathery]

I think you know where I'm going with this topic by the name. The Vita is getting a television box so that psp, vita, and ps1 classics can now be played through your television, so is it time to start asking the question if Nintendo will do the same with their handheld?
I would think that the smartest way to accomplish this would be to sell it as a Wii U peripheral for 50+ dollars that would allow you to use your wii u gamepad controller to interact with the 3ds bottom screen while the television acts as your top screen. I would also think that if Nintendo were to launch a device like this it would be the perfect time to put Nintendo DS games on the Virtual Console.
Another thought that just popped up as I'm writing this would be the device acting as a media manager for anyone who already has a 3ds. The device could store games that you buy through the VC and would allow you to swap them out from you sd card whenever you plug in your sd card to the box.
Anyone think this is a viable/technically possible idea?

[Oblivion]

I would love it. I know this idea is considered stupid around these parts, but I would love a 3DS TV with an easy way to transfer my saves.

[BlackNMild2k1]

Why not just build this feature into the Wii U.

We all know the Wii U could use some value adding, and the last thing Nintendo needs is one more piece of hardware it will have a hard time selling.

[ejamer]

I'd strongly consider this... but it would need to support physical 3DS games and I'd much rather it not be tied to the Wii U console.


Part of the appeal of Vita TV is having a cheap streaming/gaming platform for a second TV. If 3DS TV were tied to my Wii U console then it would be much less useful for me.
Of course, if you don't have it tied to the Wii U then controls become difficult - maybe unworkable.  I'm concerned that pricing would be an issue too.


Vita TV seems to be a better concept because of the single screen approach and the ability to push better graphics. It still makes some compromises, but not as much as a theoretical 3DS TV unit would.

[azeke]

3DS games would look horrible on big TVs.

[BranDonk Kong]

Nintendo could easily do 3DS emulation on the Wii U, no need for another device.

[sweetfeathery]

The idea I had for this would be a piece of hardware that Nintendo would sell that has to connect to your Wii U, not a standalone console.. think back to the Super Gameboy and the GameBoy Player for the GameCube. Both of those devices required the use of their home console counter-part.

[BranDonk Kong]

Keep in mind you'd also need a 3D TV for this (3DS TV), and 3D TV adoption has been pretty low.

[Mop it up]

I don't think I'd want a 3DS TV if it were something like the Vita TV, but I do want something that's akin to the Super Game Boy and Game Boy Player: an accessory for the Wii U that plays 3/DS game cards. With the GamePad, the controller is already set up to play such games. The 2DS also shows that Nintendo doesn't care very much about 3D anymore, so I think it actually makes it more likely for this to happen since Nintendo wouldn't care if people have a 3D TV or not.

[ejamer]

3DS games would look horrible on big TVs.

This is a good point. Some games might still be fun... but most would probably be eyesores.

Nintendo could easily do 3DS emulation on the Wii U, no need for another device.

But with the system-based account system and no option to use retail games, that would severely limit the value.  Vita TV is cool because it adds more options and fits into the Sony ecosystem, allowing you to play games you already own or to move games from Vita TV to other devices later using Sony account system.


(Of course, maybe that's not a big deal if aren't paying for extra hardware. Then a "3DS TV" just becomes a higher-priced Virtual Console option for Wii U, right?  Still not interested personally, but can see how some would be and it would only expand the market for 3DS games and increase the number of games available for Wii U... so win-win for Nintendo there even if only a small number of people are interested in playing "portable" games on the big screen.)

Keep in mind you'd also need a 3D TV for this (3DS TV), and 3D TV adoption has been pretty low.

Would dropping 3D support be a turn off for most people?




Nah... I can't see this happening. It just doesn't make sense with the account setup, lower graphical quality, and dual screen requirement.  Too many issues, not enough value added.

[Wah]

It would be a nice add-on for the wiiU!

[nickmitch]

Maybe this would be nice to use on the gamepad, but that doesn't make it different from just owning a 3DS.

[Adrock]

The 2DS also shows that Nintendo doesn't care very much about 3D anymore

Disagree. 2DS is marketed specifically to children who Nintendo previously warned against using 3D. Additionally, it's being launched alongside the original and XL models, not replacing them. 3D was always meant to be supplementary rather than a major component of the handheld or even its reason for being. To say Nintendo doesn't care about it is a stretch. If they didn't care about 3D, they would stop making games that use it.

As for 3DS TV, it's an intriguing idea though I'm not sure how well it would work. Games that require constant glancing between screens wouldn't work quite as well between the GamePad and a TV. 3DS is very different from the GamePad and TV combo because the screens are always tethered to each other.

[Mop it up]

To say Nintendo doesn't care about it is a stretch. If they didn't care about 3D, they would stop making games that use it.

I didn't say they don't care though; the key there is "very much." Enough that they don't mind having models out there that don't have the feature, which a device for the Wii U wouldn't for most people. Such a device wouldn't be replacing the 3DS either, it would have a specific market purpose as the 2DS does in appealing to people who want to play at home on a TV.

[Adrock]

I still don't think it's accurate to say Nintendo doesn't care about 3D very much or otherwise. They're admittedly going after a specific demographic with 2DS. Nintendo took out 3D, but more importantly, they got the price down to $130. For households with multiple children, this makes buying one for each of them less of a financial burden. That's where the real value of 2DS is.

I'm not sure there's a large enough market for a 3DS TV which, based on this thread, would require another console to function whereas Vita TV runs independently and costs, at most, $150. I'm not sure the ability to play 3DS games on a TV is enticing enough to justify the additional cost of a Wii U for those who don't already have one. Currently, I think there's a good chance that most Wii U owners already own a 3DS as well. For what Sony is trying to accomplish with Vita TV, it makes sense. As imagined in this thread, a 3DS TV doesn't.

Of course, if Nintendo were to actually go after Vita TV with a 3DS TV that functioned as an independent unit (1DS?), complete with its own controller with touchscreen, they could potentially dominate the micro-console market. That would probably require Nintendo to merge the Wii U and 3DS Virtual Console, but such a device holds much more value than one that needs a Wii U. Then again, that might not be great idea. Nintendo shouldn't be giving people even less reason to buy Wii U. And I'm still not convinced that playing 3DS games on a TV would be intuitive enough to be worth it.

[Mop it up]

I s'pose saying they don't care very much isn't the best wording, but you seem to understand what I'm trying to say so no biggie.

For some perspective, what are your thoughts on the Game Boy Player and Super Game Boy? Do you think those weren't worthwhile to exist either? As for price, those were both $50 at launch, and I imagine a 3/DS Player for Wii U would also be around $50-60, so it would be relatively inexpensive.

I'm also not sure what isn't intuitive about 3/DS games on Wii U. The only thing missing would be the lack of 3D for 3DS software if people didn't have a 3D TV. I know I'm a minority, but a 3/DS Player for Wii U would not only be a huge selling point for the Wii U, it would also make me more inclined to buy 3DS games since I could play them much more comfortably.

[Adrock]

Regarding Super Gameboy and the Gameboy Player, it's hard to say with absolute certainty considering I didn't own either until around 2007. I tried them, but they were collector's items more than anything. I wanted the Gameboy Player mostly because I found the Horii retro controller first. At that point, I already had an original Gameboy Advance, an SP, and moved on to a DS Lite. I wasn't really playing Gameboy Advance games anymore.

I suppose both are far more worthwhile than a hypothetical 3DS TV due to the nature of the Gameboy line. They were strictly portable console games for the most part. A 3DS TV is only problematic due to my opinion of the DS/3DS platforms which changed the way handheld games were made and played. Glancing between screens inches from your face is far different than changing the orientation of your head to look at a TV several feet away and a controller in your hands. That can greatly affect your performance in a game designed with the DS/3DS in mind. The transition isn't the same though not all DS/3DS games would suffer this inconvenience, only the ones that use the second screen heavily rather than for cursory info. That said, I think there's inherently more value in the Super Gameboy and Gameboy Player since you're always only looking at one screen, just like you would on any Gameboy.

[Mop it up]

Glancing between screens inches from your face is far different than changing the orientation of your head to look at a TV several feet away and a controller in your hands.

True, I hadn't thought about that. Though, I can think of only a couple games that used both screens for viewing, and 3DS games tend to focus on the top screen since it's the 3D one, so overall it wouldn't be much of an issue. Certainly not enough to deter me, and probably anyone else who would want such a device.

Besides, there were some games that didn't work very well on the Game Boy Player, like WarioWare: Twisted and the Game Boy Camera. Not as many games as there are DS ones that used both screens, true, but still, a few exceptions don't outweigh the benefits.

[Ian Sane]

I loved the Game Boy Player.  I modded my Gamecube to allow for Japanese games so I could import the Player months before it came out in North America - that's how much I wanted it.  I have no need for handheld gaming but Nintendo handhelds have games I want to play.  Not only would I much rather play them on a TV but I find my neck gets sore playing handhelds (you either have to look down on them or keep your head up but raise your arms; either way they're an ergonomic nightmare).

I wanted this for the DS.  I didn't give a damn how it worked.  Hell I would have been fine with the top screen on the TV and the touchscreen staying limited to the handheld, I just wanted a way to play these games on a TV.  Of course a really clever design would let you pick if you wanted one or both screens on the TV and how you wanted them arranged and let you use the Wii pointer as a mouse cursor to simulate the touchscreen.

So I would quickly snap up a 3DS TV and it would be a major selling point for the Wii U for me.  Realistically they could put the touchscreen on the tablet.  Having to stare at two screens far apart is already part of the Wii U experience.  No 3D?  Doesn't matter now because Nintendo already has introduced a model without that feature so it isn't essential.  Some games would probably not work well with it but games like Kirby Tilt 'n Tumble or Boktai already were unusable on the Game Boy Player and the Super Game Boy didn't even support link cable but that didn't ruin the experience for the games that it did work well with.  So some games don't work well?  So what?  Let the buyer make the decision.

It really annoys me when people write off the idea as pointless and then have this attitude that it absolutely should not exist.  How does this affect anyone not interested in it?  It isn't even like this is a game dev team that could be working on something else.  Nintendo's hardware team releases new product infrequently outside of the launch of new systems and spends a lot of time on R&D that never results in a consumer product.  They release something like this and you lose NOTHING while people that want it gain something.

[Kytim89]

If Nintendo were to make their own version of the Vita TV using the DS and 3DS software with the Wii U then it would also be a good time for them to allow a unified system account between the 3DS and Wii U, and to allow Wii and DS emulation on the 3DS and Wii U. Otherwise it would seem that Nintendo wants you to buy everything twice and that would defeat the purpose of having a machine that you would want to encourage all of the people who own 3DS systems to hurry and add to their collection.

[shingi_70]

a 3DS TV kind of fails harder than the Vita TV for mutiple points.


-It would be directly competing with Nintendo's own home system since it would use the excast game gimmick.
-3DS games look horrible blown up.
-No account system as of yet kills the thing.

[Adrock]

Of course a really clever design would let you pick if you wanted one or both screens on the TV and how you wanted them arranged and let you use the Wii pointer as a mouse cursor to simulate the touchscreen.

Now I really don't see that one working. It's one thing to get this to work between the GamePad and a TV (and on the Gamepad, you're also either stretching the screen or centering the display which would make the touch controls difficult to reach), but reworking all the games to work with the Wii Remote is something I especially don't see Nintendo bothering with. Pointer controls are also far less accurate than using a stylus directly on a touch screen.

Having to stare at two screens far apart is already part of the Wii U experience.

Except Wii U games are designed that way. Many games are designed to move the GamePad independently around the TV. The screens on DS/3DS are less than an inch apart all the time. They're really not the same thing.

So some games don't work well?  So what?  Let the buyer make the decision.

"So what?" This would be a pretty big gamble for Nintendo with no immediate benefit. 3DS is already performing well and 2DS is a much safer and smarter approach to expanding that audience. What's the market for a 3DS TV? With so many 3DS units already sold, it's probably a lot smaller than you think.

It really annoys me when people write off the idea as pointless and then have this attitude that it absolutely should not exist.  How does this affect anyone not interested in it?

That's pretty much what you do with motion controls.

I wouldn't call it pointless, but I'm not entirely sure how well it would work due to the way the original hardware was designed. This is probably a lot more complicated than Super Gameboy or Gameboy Player. Considering how many variables are involved, I think Nintendo has more important things to address.

[Mop it up]

It wouldn't expand the userbase, but I do think it could help increase game sales. I think I had three GBA games when I bought a Game Boy Player, and had no intentions of buying any more, but after I got that thing, I started paying attention to the GBA again. With 3DS, I'd be more inclined to buy games sooner and new instead of used, as I often think "I'll wait until this 3DS game gets cheap since it's such a pain to play those and not worth that much to me."

I don't think a 3/DS Player is really any risk, it would be such a cheap device to make. It wouldn't need to have any of the expensive components of the 3DS, such as the screens and the cameras and all of that, it would mostly just have a cartridge slot, and maybe a CPU depending on whether or not the Wii U is a kind that could match the 3DS CPU's clock speed. Then again, I believe the 3DS has two CPUs so either way the device would probably need at least one. Still, the CPUs are one of the cheapest components of a 3DS.

I think it could be priced at $50 and still have a profit margin on it, so even if it sells similar to the low numbers of the Super Game Boy and Game Boy Player, it would be of no loss. That said, I do agree that the timing isn't right yet, there are other matters to attend to first, but in one or two years it could be a nifty device.

[Ian Sane]

You shouldn't have to rework any games to work with my Wii pointer idea.  There are NES emulators that use a mouse cursor to simulate the zapper and this works without requiring any modification to the roms whatsoever.  A DS/3DS game would logically just keep track of when a point on the screen is touched and when that touch is released.  So you put a cursor on the screen and when you press A it interprets as touching the screen in that spot and when you release A that's you taking the stylus off the screen.  From a technological point of view it's no different than mapping the 'A' button to 'B'.  Now for how well this would work?  Don't know.  It might be too awkward.  I'm sure DS emulators use a mouse to simulate the touchscreen.  Any posters with loose morals have any experience with that and can tell us how well it works?

As for motion controls I crap on them when they are the ONLY option in a new game in a series that used to use conventional controls and now uses them for effectively nothing more than mapping a former on/off button press to a shake.  So I actually do lose something because now a series that my patronage helped make a success in the first place has wonky controls to appease a customerbase that only started buying Nintendo products in 2006.  Do you ever hear me rant about the controls in Punch-Out or SSB Brawl or Xenoblade?  No, because those games support normal controls providing options for all so that anyone can play the game however best suits them.

You are not required to buy a 3DS TV.  It is very likely that if such a product existed no 3DS games would REQUIRE it since no Game Boy or GBA games required the Super Game Boy or Game Boy Player.  The 3DS, as is, would continue to exist and you could continue to play games on it as you already were without having to concern yourself in the least with other people playing their 3DS games on the TV.  It's an OPTION.  How do options hurt anyone?  I welcome options and only bitch when I am denied options for arbitrary reasons.

Now I will agree that this probably doesn't have a lot of mainstream market potential and to really get it to work well involves a certain involvement from the player that the hardcore will easily work with but a casual gamer will find confusing and the lowest common denominator ensures that we can't have nice things.

I wonder if Nintendo could make this a device that requires a 3DS, as it pretty much just outputs the game to a TV.  It would not eat into 3DS sales at all then and would solve the problem of hardware level accounts.  Now if it was technologically feasible, I would have made it so that the Wii U just supports this out-of-the-box.  The Wii U just recognizes that your 3DS is on and let's you stream the game to the TV and tablet.  Since it requires both systems Nintendo loses no sales and it may help encourage the owner of one of those systems to also pick up the other to enjoy the combined functionality of the two.  But unless they can do that with a firmware update that's just a "could have been".

[pokepal148]

You shouldn't have to rework any games to work with my Wii pointer idea.  There are NES emulators that use a mouse cursor to simulate the zapper and this works without requiring any modification to the roms whatsoever.  A DS/3DS game would logically just keep track of when a point on the screen is touched and when that touch is released.  So you put a cursor on the screen and when you press A it interprets as touching the screen in that spot and when you release A that's you taking the stylus off the screen.  From a technological point of view it's no different than mapping the 'A' button to 'B'.  Now for how well this would work?  Don't know.  It might be too awkward.  I'm sure DS emulators use a mouse to simulate the touchscreen.  Any posters with loose morals have any experience with that and can tell us how well it works?

It really isn't that simple, to accomplish that goal the emulator itself has to trick the rom into thinking you have a zapper. and even then you really think it would work well?

As for motion controls I crap on them when they are the ONLY option in a new game in a series that used to use conventional controls and now uses them for effectively nothing more than mapping a former on/off button press to a shake.  So I actually do lose something because now a series that my patronage helped make a success in the first place has wonky controls to appease a customerbase that only started buying Nintendo products in 2006.

Clearly you are oh so open minded. I once asked you if you felt the same about mario 64 not letting you use the d-pad... care to enlighten me on that

Do you ever hear me rant about the controls in Punch-Out or SSB Brawl or Xenoblade?  No, because those games support normal controls providing options for all so that anyone can play the game however best suits them.

and i'm sure you found something else to complain about...

You are not required to buy a 3DS TV.  It is very likely that if such a product existed no 3DS games would REQUIRE it since no Game Boy or GBA games required the Super Game Boy or Game Boy Player.

  That's not entirely true... the only way to play DK 94 in color for a very long time was on a Super Game Boy.

The 3DS, as is, would continue to exist and you could continue to play games on it as you already were without having to concern yourself in the least with other people playing their 3DS games on the TV.  It's an OPTION.  How do options hurt anyone?  I welcome options and only bitch when I am denied options for arbitrary reasons.

I think the reasons not to do this are more then arbitrary...

Now I will agree that this probably doesn't have a lot of mainstream market potential and to really get it to work well involves a certain involvement from the player that the hardcore will easily work with but a casual gamer will find confusing and the lowest common denominator ensures that we can't have nice things.

yes... it couldn't possibly be that the gba player flopped in some major way or anything of the sort(seriously i'm kinda curious on how well that thing sold), no... its all because of those dirty smelly casuals...

I wonder if Nintendo could make this a device that requires a 3DS, as it pretty much just outputs the game to a TV.  It would not eat into 3DS sales at all then and would solve the problem of hardware level accounts.  Now if it was technologically feasible, I would have made it so that the Wii U just supports this out-of-the-box.  The Wii U just recognizes that your 3DS is on and let's you stream the game to the TV and tablet.  Since it requires both systems Nintendo loses no sales and it may help encourage the owner of one of those systems to also pick up the other to enjoy the combined functionality of the two.  But unless they can do that with a firmware update that's just a "could have been".

it's possible but would take alot of effort that I would rather see put into other things.