Topic: Nintendo 3DS Discussion

[TJ Spyke]

After all the crap and lies Mark Rein has spewed about Nintendo and their systems, I wonder if Nintendo even wants to work with them. I wish developers would stop relying on Unreal Engine for all of their games, there are other engines out there.

[Kytim89]

Why can't Epic's developers create a modified version of their engine to accomodate the 3DS hardware? Perhaps they are too lazy or the system may not be able to handle the engine.

It is probably the simple matter that Nintendo doesn't care so they make zero effort to accomodate Epic and Epic doesn't feel like jumping through extra hoops that Sony and Microsoft don't make them jump through.
 
The lack of the Unreal engine on the Wii is a big reason why the third party support sucks.  I highly doubt it would impossible to have something running on it but is Nintendo actively seeking out a relationship with Epic?  Are they showing any interest or are willing to work with them at all?  I doubt it judging by Nintendo's track record with third parties.
 
I'm sure if Nintendo approached Epic with the intention of getting that engine on the 3DS and were willing to provide assistance in getting it working it would happen.

What better reason to attract hardcore gamers then to have one of the most hardcore developers make games for your console. Perhaps I am too ambitious, but I want bigger and badder games for my handhelds and what better way then to have Epic develope for the 3DS.

[Adrock]

It is probably the simple matter that Nintendo doesn't care so they make zero effort to accomodate Epic and Epic doesn't feel like jumping through extra hoops that Sony and Microsoft don't make them jump through.

I think Nintendo cares and so does Epic if only because they both could be making so much money if the other relented. It just seems like a really drawn out game of chicken. Who is going to buckle first? I don't think Mark Rein has anything against Nintendo, but he makes no money off of the. That's the bottom line when it comes to his anti-Nintendo rhetoric. He doesn't wipe his ass with $100 bills by allocating company resources to reconstruct engines for specific platforms. The Unreal engine is a one size fits all and developers love it. For that reason, he probably feels companies like Nintendo should bend to his whims. So much support hinges on it. On the other end of the spectrum, Nintendo would have to rethink their entire strategy to accomodate Epic and by extension 3rd parties. Nintendo is a very profit focused company. 3DS is probably marked up close to $100. They like making money off of hardware even though they make more on software. To employ hardware capable of running the Unreal engine with as little optimization necessary would require Nintendo to bump up the specs and sell near or close to breaking even.

I really like this quote from Iwata from a recent Iwata asks: In Nintendo's past history, (Hiroshi) Yamauchi-san has said, "The hardware is just a box you buy only because you want to play Mario games." Those were his exact words. I think that should apply to the way Nintendo develops hardware except take out "Mario" and just consider it games in general. If more powerful hardware is what Nintendo needs in order to bring in more and better games from 3rd parties, that's what they should do. It's just a box to play games on. Nintendo stands to make more money from stronger 3rd party support than they would on marking up hardware.

[Ian Sane]

  After all the crap and lies Mark Rein has spewed about Nintendo and their systems, I wonder if Nintendo even wants to work with them. I wish developers would stop relying on Unreal Engine for all of their games, there are other engines out there.

A lot of popular games these days are made in the Unreal engine.  I'd say Nintendo owes it to their customers to try to make those available on Nintendo systems.  If they can bury the hatchet with Square, they should be able to work with pretty much anyone.  Hell, Nintendo has worked with Sega, who spouted more crap about Nintendo than anyone else.

[Kytim89]

It appears that Mark Rein is interested in bringing Gears of War to the PS3 since the franchise is owned by Epic. However, this might mean that a handheld version would go to the NGP since it has to analog sticks, but technically the 3DS has two analog sticks if you count the touch screen.
 
http://www.1up.com/news/gears-of-war-ps3-epic-love
 
Here is a video of Final Fantasy 4 being played on the 3DS:
 
http://gamevideos.1up.com/video/id/33020
 
Phantam Hourglass being played on the 3DS:
 
http://gamevideos.1up.com/video/id/33021
 
Dragon Quest 9:
 
http://gamevideos.1up.com/video/id/33003
 
Super Mario 64 DS:
 
http://gamevideos.1up.com/video/id/33003
 
One thing about the 3DS is that I see its launch line up as some what inferior, but I have missed out on a **** ton of DS games, so I might take advantage of the 3DS BC and play these games while more suitable ones come out for the 3DS like Revelations and Kid Icarus.
 

[Guitar Smasher]

  After all the crap and lies Mark Rein has spewed about Nintendo and their systems, I wonder if Nintendo even wants to work with them. I wish developers would stop relying on Unreal Engine for all of their games, there are other engines out there.

A lot of popular games these days are made in the Unreal engine.  I'd say Nintendo owes it to their customers to try to make those available on Nintendo systems.  If they can bury the hatchet with Square, they should be able to work with pretty much anyone.  Hell, Nintendo has worked with Sega, who spouted more crap about Nintendo than anyone else.

First of all, Sega was in direct competition with Nintendo.  Beyond the marketing trash-talk, there's a mutual respect involved (it doesn't hurt that they're both Japanese, as I'm sure you'll agree).

Secondly, even if the Unreal engine was on Wii, do you think we'd be seeing any real appreciation?  Sure there might be more ports, just because of the huge userbase, but the devs are still going to put their "best efforts" on the other consoles, simply because of the better specs.

And the devs know that given the choice between three consoles, most multiple-console owners will buy the PS360 version just for the better graphics (and online but that's another argument).  Forget the motion controls, the majority of devs aren't interested in making meaningful motion control experiences.  And why would they be when the whole 'industry' judges games primarily on the quality of graphics (is it any coincidence that the standard game review lists 'graphics' as the first scoring category?).

So if Nintendo was to overcome this, they'd have to produce a console that would exceed the capabilities of the competition.  But that would mean significantly increasing the cost of the console, eliminating a huge portion of their customers.  It's a trade-off that I'm sure they evaluate constantly.  As much as you want them to make the "everything console", they'll never be able to capture 100% of the market.

[MaryJane]

I think it's fair to say that the 3DS is the most powerful system Nintendo has created to date, and if that isn't good enough for Epic, tough ****.

[KDR_11k]

Epic just claimed that there's no middle ground between 50 million dollar AAA games and indie titles made in a garage. They're just close minded.

[BlackNMild2k1]

Extremely early builds of MegaMan Legends 3DS for anyone that's interested
http://blog.daletto.net/dash3/archives/2585488.html

Mega Man Legends 3, Resident Evil Mercenaries Go Playable Later This Month!
Capcom holding 3DS demo event in Akihabara.
http://www.andriasang.com/e/blog/2011/03/04/capcom_3ds_demo_event/

Was there some talk recently about Mega Man Legends 3 not being an actual game yet? Well you can put that idea to rest now! The game is going to be on playable demo at an event later this month!

Capcom announced today plans for an event tilted "3DS x Capcom Premium Demo Event." This will be held at the Belle Salle event space in Akihabara on the 29th.

The event will have Super Street IV 3D Edition, Resident Evil The Mercenaries 3D and Mega Man Legends 3 Project available for play. SFIV is already out, but the latter two have never gone playable on Japanese soil before (Mercenaries was playable for press outside of Japan).

To sample Mega Man Legends 3 and The Mercenaries 3D before others, head to Akihabara on the 29th between 15:00 and 20:00. Admission is free.

[UncleBob]

What's everyone think about the talk regarding the 3DS Battery Life so far?  I ask because I've been involved with a product design that I think will be *AWESOME* if the company I've worked with manages to get everything lined up.  Unfortunately, it appears we're going to miss the US 3DS launch, but I'm still excited for the item.

[Tanookisuit]

Yeah, UncleBob, it sounds like this will be the first time since the original Gameboy that I'll be buying some sort of external battery pack.  I'm assuming that's what you're working on?

[Caliban]

What's everyone think about the talk regarding the 3DS Battery Life so far?  I ask because I've been involved with a product design that I think will be *AWESOME* if the company I've worked with manages to get everything lined up.  Unfortunately, it appears we're going to miss the US 3DS launch, but I'm still excited for the item.

Aha, so your little secret is about to be unfolded.

In regards to battery life, the only place I've read about it was on kotaku. Mr. Bashcraft said that it lasts 3 to 8 hours, just like Nintendo has stated. Personally I think up to 15 hours would have been optimal, but that's just me.

[BlackNMild2k1]

I don't know if this was mentioned elsewhere, but it looks like Master Quest is included in the OoT 3Dmake
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kjq2L9ebos0&t=047

I have the collection on a GC disc, but I never played it. This might make a 3Dmake worth a purchase for me.

[NeoStar9X]

Epic just claimed that there's no middle ground between 50 million dollar AAA games and indie titles made in a garage. They're just close minded.

I'm going to go out and say that Epic's attitude, which is in part shared by many western developers is why Nintendo might never have a strong relationship with them the way they have with their Japanese counterparts. Instead of Nintendo crawling to them (the way Sony and Microsoft have done to a degree) and doing what they can to get their support, which can be a negative to Nintendo itself (looks at how much money Sony and Microsoft lost on their hardware doing that) Nintendo I think in a manner of speaking just does a "screw you too" and continues to do their own thing. They as a company are better for it I think even though we as customers might not be at times.


I think the N64/PS1 era when many developers pulled support (for various reasons) in favor of Sony taught Nintendo a valuable lesson. They can not and should not totally depend on 3rd party developers or have business models that put them in the red. Had Nintendo not had a good deal of their own IPs during the N64 and Cube era and had enough goodwill with buyers to introduce more they'd be gone I think. So they think about themselves first and foremost and what benefits them. As well as they should. They don't have the money to produce hardware so powerful and expensive that they need to sell at a loss just to get people to buy and so 3rd parties will make games for. It isn't going to happy. Neither would Sony or Microsoft if their gaming divisions were actual true independent entities.


I would much rather prefer Nintendo work with companies that actually are willing to work with the technology they provide. If they feel Nintendo could do better then I think they should work with them to design a system that will actually be profitable piece of hardware and not put Nintendo itself out of business. So instead of being concerned that Epic refuses to work on a Nintendo system I think more interest and support should be given to High Voltage who has a version of their Conduit engine running on the 3DS. People should be more interested in Capcom and Tecmo who has successfully developed Street Fighter and Dead or Alive games for the 3DS that are exactly like their console counterparts. Even Konami that is going to provide a true Metal Gear Solid game (remake it may be). Forget the likes of Epic I say.

[Stogi]

First of all, this isn't about Epic but their Unreal Engine that powers many many games.

Second of all, Nintendo does have the money (I think they are the second largest company in Japan).

Third of all, I agree.

[Razorkid]

Speaking of battery life, I'm fine with the estimated time the 3DS was stated to last on one charge.  I feel like it's time people face reality and realize that any modern electronic handheld device from your iPhone/flavor of the month Android to the 3DS and even upcoming NGP will sport battery lives that are inferior to past generation hardware by virtue that they just do so much more!


Besides, if I'm playing any handheld/draining my phone battery doing something for 3+ hours straight, you better believe I'll be in the vicinity of a wall outlet to plug the sucker in.  I don't see the problem.

[alegoicoe]

good to see nintendo formally announcing  a mario game.

[Stratos]

People should never accept poor battery life as a norm. As technology changes so do batteries. They must improve with the tech. I expect batteries to have longer lives as time goes on and if they can't it is time to find a new replacement for batteries as we know it.

[oohhboy]

Actually we are coming to the end of lithium batteries. There is one or two more extensions to it with nano tubes, but chemically we are reaching the end without using some really volatile and nasty stuff you can't give a common user in a portable manner.

The next "battery" are going to be super capacitors and hybrids, but I wouldn't expect it for another 5-10 years when they surpass Lithium Ions in power density. They have many advantages over a normal battery including shape, extremely fast recharge, efficiency and number of cycles.

Even then no matter how powerful the battery, you can always find an application that will out strip it not to mention you have to deal with all the heat produced.

[Razorkid]

That's my exact reasoning behind why I'm not upset over battery life. Portable tech as a whole is really bumping the ceiling on reasonable battery life and new consumer level battery tech is a much more slower beast to develop. Hell, before the smartphone age, I remember charging my phone once every few days. Now it gets charged AT LEAST once a day, and on average twice depending upon usage.

I'm not trying to be an apologist for companies (Nintendo included) putting out devices with less than stellar battery life. But I'm also being realistic in my expectations. The psp was the last handheld device to have moving parts and because everything is such a generational leap in power going forward, I expect everyone will have similar "new gen" battery lives until battery tech can be upgraded again.

[KDR_11k]

Speaking of battery life, I'm fine with the estimated time the 3DS was stated to last on one charge.  I feel like it's time people face reality and realize that any modern electronic handheld device from your iPhone/flavor of the month Android to the 3DS and even upcoming NGP will sport battery lives that are inferior to past generation hardware by virtue that they just do so much more!

New hardware also reduces power consumption so you can maintain a high battery life despite getting better hardware by staying behind the curve, something Nintendo is most likely doing.

If the 3DS has a battery life that's on par with the iPod Touch it's an abject failure.

On the other hand the DSi supposedly gets 2-4 hours of battery life when running at full brightness but by going down a few steps you can get up to 14 hours or so out of it.

[Razorkid]

Yup. Knowledge of how to stretch any portable device's battery life to the limit is very crucial nowadays.  Fortunately a lot of devices have the options that allow you to tweek battery usage beyond the highest draining settings.


And I agree, the iPod Touch/iPhone battery lives are deplorable.

[TJ Spyke]

And I agree, the iPod Touch/iPhone battery lives are deplorable.

Only when playing games. I mainly use my iPod Touch for music and podcasts and I only have to recharge it after about 20 hours (I don't know the max time though since I always have it hooked up to my computer when I am at home).

[NWR_insanolord]

I can get about 6 hours of game time from my iPhone 4, and that's with Wi-Fi and 3G both on. That's not bad in my book, especially given the kinds of games I tend to play on the thing.

[SixthAngel]

I can get about 6 hours of game time from my iPhone 4, and that's with Wi-Fi and 3G both on. That's not bad in my book, especially given the kinds of games I tend to play on the thing.

I'm pretty sure that when they say "wi-fi on" when talking about the 3DS they are actually talking about playing a game that is using it.  The regular DS only turns wifi on when you are using it so I assume this is the same.  You may have both of them "on" in the settings but are you actually playing an online game?  Also I think the phone will only connect one way (probably wifi because its faster) and won't actually use both connections even if they are both on.

I see no problem with the battery life since it doesn't really seem much different from my current ds.  I've heard the max brightness is ridiculous on the 3ds and cutting it brings hours of gameplay.  I have never played my dslite on max brightness.  Wi-fi is another huge battery drain that I would barely use on the 3ds and certainly woudn't use for 5 hours outside of my house since I would have to be sitting at a wifi spot for that long.