Topic: Nintendo Teabagged Once Again....

[Stratos]

All the Wii really needs to have graphical parity with its competition is HD

From what I've seen, that is very untrue. Those systems have much more processing power which results in far better graphics at any definition.

I think Chozo Ghost was talking more about ease of portability between PS360 and Wii.

Also, remember the Little Kings Story developer thought that the game didn't need IR controls and felt they would be 'tacked on'. Also Monster Hunter 3 and No More Heroes 2 have Classic Controller usage (Monster Hunter 3 requires a CC to play, well in Japan it did).

[Ian Sane]

All the Wii really needs to have graphical parity with its competition is HD, which only matters if you have an HD tv to play it with.

I don't have an HDTV but PS3 games just CRUSH Wii games in graphics quality on my standard definition TV.  It's not even close.
 
I agree that eventually we will hit a wall with graphics.  In fact I think we're here now.  When I look at the best looking PS360 games I can't imagine anything really being much better.  I still could last gen, just a little bit.  But now I really can't and the new TVs are supported so where do we go?  I argue we go nowhere and just let one generation go on for a long time.
 
But with the Wii I can obviously see the need to go forward because, well, there are those other consoles out there with better looking games.  Sony and MS could probably just release motion control for their consoles but Nintendo NEEDS a new console before they can reach a point where no upgrade appears necessary.  If I can point to something that already exists and say "look, that's better" then there is still room to go.
 
If you make a next gen game with conventional controls the justification for its existence would be improved graphics and more enemies on screen and that kind of stuff that improves because of hardware.  No one bought a Wii to have slightly better looking Gamecube games.  The motion control is the ONLY justification of the Wii even existing.  It is otherwise a completely half-assed sorry excuse for a hardware upgrade.  So if you're making a Wii game I can see why you would feel the need to force in some sort of motion control so that your game doesn't look like a rip-off.  And then your game plays like piss because you're in over your head.
 
Though I think if they just tried to make good games and not pay attention to that sort of stuff it would work out fine.  Crappy motion games come from deliberate attempts to make use of motion control.  If you just try to make a great game and use whatever controls work best then you'll do fine.

[Mop it up]

I think Chozo Ghost was talking more about ease of portability between PS360 and Wii.

If that is the case, it is also untrue; I'm pretty certain that the development architecture of the Wii is far different than that of the XBox 360 and PS3.

[BlackNMild2k1]

This just makes me sad.....

Street Fighter IV for iPhone Revealed

February 15, 2010 - Street Fighter IV… on the iPhone? Capcom is going for it this March, bringing the acclaimed fighter to Apple's handhelds. But this is no quickie, banged-out port. Capcom has taken months to come up with suitable controls for a platform with no physical buttons, employing a virtual pad and move buttons to recreate the arcade stick right on the touchscreen. After all, without great controls, what's the point?

Capcom is not accepting any loss of the console game's beloved art direction in the iPhone edition. It has taken assets straight from the current-gen code, so the new art style that won universal accolades is faithfully recreated on the iPhone's smaller, but crisp screen. In our shots of Ken and Ryu battling it out, you can see the fidelity to the console version at play. These are the same models, just slightly scaled down – but with minimal loss of detail or color.

Capcom's virtual stick should make it easy to pull off big punches, fireballs, and Ultras.

And it isn't just art direction that Capcom is bringing to the iPhone's Street Fighter IV. Capcom promises that fan-favorite fighters beyond Ryu and Ken (the first two Capcom is willing to confirm) will round out a large roster. While names are not yet spoken, Capcom has confirmed that the iPhone cast features both classic brawlers and new characters created for Street Fighter IV. So, there is an excellent chance your personal favorite will end up in the mix. Each fighter has their complete move set, including the Ultras. The animations for the over-the-top Ultras have not been cut either. Expect to see those screen-popping bursts of punches and kicks explode on the iPhone.

Now, hardcore gamers coming into Street Fighter VI with lofty expectations are understandably concerned about whether or not Capcom's virtual pad will offer the same, precise controls needed to truly master the game. That's fair because to competitive players, Street Fighter is a contest of exactness and finesse. To alleviate worries, Capcom offers a number of control configurations so players can find their favorite position, button transparency, and set-up. Street Fighter IV also includes a Dojo Mode for training, giving you ample opportunity to get used to the controls before heading into a tournament or into a multiplayer match.

Ryu and Ken are the first two fighters Capcom has confirmed.

Multiplayer? Street Fighter IV allows two players to trade blows over Bluetooth, just like the arcade or console edition. So, spending a little time in Dojo Mode isn't such a bad idea, especially if you want to answer your iPhone and tell whoever is calling that you just hammered your friend flat into the ground.

Check out IGN's full gallery of screens, seen here for the very first time anywhere. And be sure to keep checking back as we learn more about Street Fighter IV's expansive roster, additional modes, and potential price in the weeks leading up to its App Store release.

I think Nintendo should just hold a press conference and make a very formal and public apology to just about everyone. Obviously they shot someones dog or kicked someones cat, slapped everyones mama and keyed everyones car. So lets just get the apology out of the way and then we can all be friends again.

[Ian Sane]

With Nintendo it is probably just attitude above all else.  We've looked at it from every angle and it just doesn't make much sense.  I think Nintendo just acts indifferent to third parties.  Their attitude is "we're making this hardware and if you want to support it too, okay, but we don't care one way or another.  We're designing this for us and us alone."  Meanwhile other companies, even when they design something that's really lousy for gaming like the iPhone, are designing their hardware with third party support in mind.  Their business model involves other companies making products for it and getting a cut from that.  They have an attitude that's inviting.

Nintendo is the attractive, smart, funny, talented person who has no friends because they make no effort to be friendly.

[Kairon]

Nintendo is the attractive, smart, funny, talented person who has no friends because they make no effort to be friendly.

People who need people are the luckiest people in the world.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9-8gn6vGu_w

[NWR_insanolord]

Nintendo is the attractive, smart, funny, talented person who has no friends because they make no effort to be friendly.

People who are as rich and successful as Nintendo is don't generally have to make any effort; they usually have tons of people banging down their door trying to get a piece of their success.

[GearBoxClock]

There seems to be an anti-Wii snobbery in the industry. This is probably due to the highly visible shovelware on Wii and the bias against attracting new people to video games.

[Chozo Ghost]

For all we know Capcom might be at work on SFIV for the Wii and/or DS as we speak. We might hear something about it at E3. who knows?

[Stogi]

Tatsunoku vs. Capcom is WAY better anyways.

[BlackNMild2k1]

I'm not gonna hold my breath, or even reserve space for the thought.
I also don't think anyone even remotely expects it, but it would be a pleasant surprise.

[Stratos]

If it comes it better still have the Star Wars characters.

[Arbok]

If it comes it better still have the Star Wars characters.

That was Soul Calibur, not Street Fighter

[Stratos]

LOL, you're right. What a brain fart.

[Chozo Ghost]

Hey, if the Wii port of SFIV adds Star Wars characters, I certainly won't complain.

[D_Average]

I'm calling it. Next is an RE5 iPhone port.

[BlackNMild2k1]

One day the analyst will be right about the Wii..... I'm not so sure that day is today though.
Wii Cycle to 'Fade Meaningfully' in 2010, Aggressive Price Cuts Needed

"We acknowledge that a traditional hardware cycle would now be nearing completion, leaving further market growth dependent on continued and aggressive hardware price cuts, software price cuts, hardware extensions and an economic lift.  We remain optimistic for near term PS3 and 360 market growth opportunities, vis-Ă -vis an emerging secondary casual market cycle, as accessory innovations potentially target an established Nintendo casual market.  We expect continued market weakness through ’10 for Nintendo related products, as the Wii cycle fades meaningfully and the DS platform faces considerable competition from Apple related mobile gaming devices. We recognize new hardware from Nintendo is on the horizon," Hickey began.

Continued Market Weakness.......
::looks back at December sales records set by Nintendo Wii & DS and then looks at January sales dominance by Nintendo::

He continued, "We think console manufactures need to dramatically cut price points in calendar ’10, to continue hardware sales momentum from the holiday.  However, we expect Microsoft will not cut the price of their hardware in front of the introduction of Natal motion technology this holiday, as they are likely hesitant to offer a price induced inflection point for their installed base growth, favoring a hardware innovation as a more sound medium term sales catalyst.  Importantly, Nintendo built the majority of their casual mass market oriented installed base from a $250 price point. We believe Nintendo needs to cut the price of their console from $200 to $150 immediately, as they should establish as meaningful of an installed base as possible before the Natal and Arc are introduced.  We believe they also need to generate strong hardware sales momentum into their competitors release or face the draconian consumer perception of the Wii having a dramatically reduced entertainment value proposition over a faded technology innovation; Rock Band anyone?"

Establish as meanigful of an installed base as possible......
::Looks back into the sales thread once again and sees the Wii total units sold vs either the PS3 or 360::

Interestingly, Hickey also sees new casual market opportunities as a portion of current Nintendo customers will look to upgrade to more powerful or new experiences. The upcoming Project Natal and Sony motion controller could be just what they're seeking. "We believe a new casual game market will emerge in calendar 2010, which could be very beneficial for Microsoft, Sony, Apple and 3^rd party software developers like Electronic Arts, Activision, THQ, Ubisoft, and Take-Two.  The casual hardware extensions from both Sony and Microsoft will likely drive both additional hardware and software sales, for casual and non-gaming mass market opportunities," Hickey said. "We expect a potential up-migration from a portion of Nintendo’s Wii market, as many new gaming console households choose to upscale their game entertainment experience, enjoy a broader array of multi-media options and experience 'the new' casual gaming opportunities.  We expect 3rd party publishers could benefit significantly over the emerging casual cycle, as their prior experience at the casual market was often tortuous from Nintendo’s software domination."

Well I guess anything is possible, but if they couldn't figure out what to do with motion controls in casual games when graphics weren't important, I can't imagine what they are gonna do with motion controls now.

Besides, if the casual market is casual, wouldn't owning one system that fits their needs be enough, and if they aren't enjoying the 3rd party software now, what makes them think the same games from the same 3rd parties on a different platform will be any better? Hoping to get to the new suckers first until they realize that this game sucks just as much as the one they released on the Wii?

[D_Average]

Most people who own a Wii are not going to upgrade for better graphics.  It's really going to take somthing special to convince this demographic they need a new gaming console. Special as in a console that spits out rainbows and talking unicorns into your living room. From what I've seen, Natal and Arc are more of the same. 

[Peachylala]

Natal needs extra CPU processing in order to work, I wonder if an RRoD console can even handle that. (and isn't it just a glorified Eye Toy?)

Arc... color me intrigued, but I'm very skeptical on how we are suppose to control it. With that cone thing and a PS3 controller? No thank you. I don't want to play games and be uncomfortable at the same time. =/

We expect 3rd partypublishers could benefit significantly over the emerging casual cycle,as their prior experience at the casual market was often tortuous fromNintendo’s software domination.

I would point out the obvious, but seriously, sometimes I wonder if we have more common sense then the media i think we do.

[D_Average]

In other news, the CEO of THQ not only stated de Blob is going multi platform, but just to add a bit of spice, he also stated he'd rather play it on a "traditional controller.". A strange thing for a CEO to state. Perhaps he was taking a shot at Wii owners for the poor sales on Deadly Creatures.

Link
http://i.joystiq.com/2010/02/17/thq-ceo-saints-row-and-red-faction-at-e3-de-blob-going-multipl/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%253A+weblogsinc%252Fjoystiq+%2528Joystiq%2529&utm_content=Google+Reader

[Ian Sane]

Most people who own a Wii are not going to upgrade for better graphics.  It's really going to take somthing special to convince this demographic they need a new gaming console.

I figure it'll just take a game they want to play enough that they'll buy a console for it.  They bought a console for Wii Sports and they'll need something that hooks them in enough to buy another console.
 
But then isn't that the risk with targetting a casual market?  All of these people who bought a Wii for Wii Sports and then have Wii Fit, Wii Play, maybe Mario Kart Wii may be short-term customers.  If they aren't interested enough to be regularly buying games on the console they own then they may be content with just sticking to that one console for good.  Stop making games for the Wii?  What do they care if they're content to play the three games they own whenever company is over?
 
Wii Sports was a very special game in that people saw someone swinging the controller and having the guy on the screen do the same thing, and that was so impressive that people HAD to have it.  That now has to be done AGAIN.  Sony and MS have to do it and Nintendo will have to do it with their next console.  It's a near impossible act to follow.

[Peachylala]

I call deBlob 2 suffering Viewtiful Joe Destruction now.

[ejamer]

In other news, the CEO of THQ not only stated de Blob is going multi platform, but just to add a bit of spice, he also stated he'd rather play it on a "traditional controller.". A strange thing for a CEO to state. Perhaps he was taking a shot at Wii owners for the poor sales on Deadly Creatures.

Perhaps Wii owners were taking a shot at Deadly Creatures clearly being pushed out into market without the right level of polish or marketing to support it.
 
(Ok, not really.  The game wouldn't have sold big numbers either way.)

[Chozo Ghost]

But then isn't that the risk with targetting a casual market?  All of these people who bought a Wii for Wii Sports and then have Wii Fit, Wii Play, maybe Mario Kart Wii may be short-term customers.  If they aren't interested enough to be regularly buying games on the console they own then they may be content with just sticking to that one console for good.  Stop making games for the Wii?  What do they care if they're content to play the three games they own whenever company is over?
 
Wii Sports was a very special game in that people saw someone swinging the controller and having the guy on the screen do the same thing, and that was so impressive that people HAD to have it.  That now has to be done AGAIN.  Sony and MS have to do it and Nintendo will have to do it with their next console.  It's a near impossible act to follow.

I agree with this, in fact I've made the same argument myself before.

It turns out to be both a good thing and a bad thing for Nintendo. Its bad because it will make it tougher for Nintendo to repeat the same level of success with the Wii's successor, but its a good thing because it also makes it just as hard (if not even more hard) for the competition. So its both a good thing and a bad thing, but I would say a good thing overall because Nintendo grabbed the casual market first, which means they've gained ground that won't be lost to the competition very easily, and it also means they have built up brand recognition. Everyone knows the Wii name now, so when Nintendo creates a Wii 2, or Super Wii, or Wii Advance, or whatever everyone will know this is the rightful heir to the Wii throne and will probably be more likely to grab that than an imposter system that lacks that Wii name, and those popular Wii franchises that everyone recognizes.

See, I think there are two branches of Casual gamers. There are Casual gamers who are also Casual purchasers and will only buy 1 or a small number of games for their console. That's okay for Nintendo because they profit on the hardware so they don't have to make money back in software sales, but it would really suck for Sony or MS. But then there are also Casual Gamers who are heavy purchasers. They love casual games, and can't get enough of them so they buy them by the ton. This is the segment of casual players that is worth fighting over.

[Ian Sane]

It turns out to be both a good thing and a bad thing for Nintendo. Its bad because it will make it tougher for Nintendo to repeat the same level of success with the Wii's successor, but its a good thing because it also makes it just as hard (if not even more hard) for the competition. So its both a good thing and a bad thing, but I would say a good thing overall because Nintendo grabbed the casual market first, which means they've gained ground that won't be lost to the competition very easily, and it also means they have built up brand recognition.

I see your point and if the casual gamers who are regular purchasers are a large chunk of the Wii userbase then being there first is a good thing.  I just question how many casuals fit this bill.  In my personal experience every casual gamer I know (all of these people are co-workers) would be casual purchasers.  For them the Wii was a fad that they played the **** out of for about a year or so and have ignored it since.  They don't even have Wii Sports Resort which seems like something that would be right up their alley.  The continued success of the Wii suggests it isn't a fad, but remember that the Wii was hard to come by for a long time.  The people I know who have one didn't get it at launch, it took them often a least a year to land one.  Then they played the **** out of it and then got bored.  During the shortages there was always a big chunk of the casual market that had not yet had a chance to own a Wii, so they would not have had their fill of it yet.  Now that the console is readily available the buzz that it had for over two years is gone.  The Wii was something everyone I met talked about.  Not so anymore (those that talk about it with me are people that would normally play videogames).  So is that momentum still there?  I know this is just personal experience and might not be widespread.
 
Meanwhile I argue that Nintendo has pretty much handed the core gamer market to Sony and MS on a silver platter.  The core gamer who only owns a Wii, is content with it being his sole console, and isn't a diehard Nintendo fanboy is rare.  You own a Wii and something else.  That's how it works.  PS360 is your main console and the Wii is your Nintendo machine.  The core market is the one where you KNOW they're going to continue buying games next gen and that's the market Nintendo does not have locked up.
 
Have you noticed in your daily life a decent amount of casual gamers who are not also casual purchasers?