Author Topic: Pokemon Diamond/Pearl (Read 80633 times)

Dasmos · « **Reply #75 on:** May 25, 2007, 06:19:01 AM »

Why did they even include the Snowpoint area, it's possibly the most annoying thing ever.

Ceric · « **Reply #76 on:** May 28, 2007, 08:43:42 AM »

VGCats Comic
I do have to mostly agree with this.

I mean I want to know how I'm through 2 badges and still most of the time I run into a Zubat, Geodude, or Bidoof. Not to mention that large majority of the pokemon I do run into are not new. In fact a lot of them are from the original. They added what 236 since then...

Also the first Gym is... wait for it... Rock! They could have messed the order around some at the least. I know its a "winning" formula and all but I'm tired of the mix. Why not have me go through an area with say... fire pokemon or electric at the beginning. Just mix it up some... blah...

Shecky · « **Reply #77 on:** May 28, 2007, 02:40:49 PM »

Well, seeing as this is my first entry to the series, I don't see the problem. However, the first panel is just flat out wrong... a girl picking pearls over diamonds?

! (Incidently, my emperical evidence actually maps to my generalism... and shows that every female gamer that I know who owns this generation pokemon has picked diamond....)

Had I know about the 10 pokeballs, I wouldn't have been annoyed at buying 10 before I got the freebees. I also could have avoided being annoyed had I found out money is somewhat abundant, since I'm now sitting on 360000 worth.

The GTS *works*. I've gotten every request filled. I'm sure the good requests go quickly, and thus the only ones left are the insane offers. I've run into a few reasonable ones and when I left to catch the requested pokemon, someone else had filled it.

Oh, I do have a question... I was trying to figure out the move "Hidden Power" and it seems to be based on IV's ... what are those? and how does it affect that move. The web is most unclear on the matter.

Ceric · « **Reply #78 on:** May 28, 2007, 02:55:27 PM »

Yeah. If you are just starting in the series then everything I'm complaining about doesn't apply. Though if you longtime you should understand. Now for Hidden Power...

Heres an article all about it.

that Baby guy · « **Reply #79 on:** May 28, 2007, 03:09:54 PM »

IV's are something the people that actually care to win every single battle use to their advantage. Essentially, even though they may be of the same species, virtually every Pokemon you catch is unique in a small sense. IV's are the means to allow this. Basically, every single stat (HP, Attack, Defense, etc.) has a random value from 0-31 assigned to it upon capture. For every value above "0" by the time you reach level 100, a Pokemon's total stats will be raised by twice the value of that number. For example, if your Pikachu had a special attack IV of 15, by the time that Pikachu reaches level 100, it's special attack will be 30 points higher than the lowest possible special attack for Pikachus, and 32 points lower than the highest obtainable special attack stat, barring the effects of Natures and EVs. I think they are called individual values.

The Nature your Pokemon has (Lonely, Mild, etc.) Can add 10% to one stat, while subtract 10% from another. This can be very useful apparently, but let me state that there aren't Natures to raise or lower the HP stat, unlike IVs and Evs.

EVs are actually effort values. Essentially, this is the thing Pokerus doubles the amount you receive, and is probably the reason why you may have noticed irregular stat boosts upon a few level-ups. Different Pokemon you battle give hidden points, and upon accumulation of enough of these points in one stat, you gain a one-point in the respective stat. There is a limit of 510 of these points on a Pokemon, and the points can actually be removed through new berries. To use these stats to the maximum effectiveness, you would have to train for some time against specific pokemon. Also, there are new items created to make this training easier.

Now, most players choose to ignore much of these factors, as paying attention to them causes immense attention to the game, beyond realistic acceptibilities. However, as time passes, online play will become more and more competitive between certain groups by virtue of taking advantage of these stat rules. I assure you that I have not ever taken part in any of this kind of stuff, and it is not the reason why I dominate you in a Pokebattle, though at some point in time, perhaps a year or so from now, it may be.

nintendo_star · « **Reply #80 on:** May 28, 2007, 04:43:54 PM »

Quote
Originally posted by: thatguy
IV's are something the people that actually care to win every single battle use to their advantage. Essentially, even though they may be of the same species, virtually every Pokemon you catch is unique in a small sense. IV's are the means to allow this. Basically, every single stat (HP, Attack, Defense, etc.) has a random value from 0-31 assigned to it upon capture. For every value above "0" by the time you reach level 100, a Pokemon's total stats will be raised by twice the value of that number. For example, if your Pikachu had a special attack IV of 15, by the time that Pikachu reaches level 100, it's special attack will be 30 points higher than the lowest possible special attack for Pikachus, and 32 points lower than the highest obtainable special attack stat, barring the effects of Natures and EVs. I think they are called individual values.

The Nature your Pokemon has (Lonely, Mild, etc.) Can add 10% to one stat, while subtract 10% from another. This can be very useful apparently, but let me state that there aren't Natures to raise or lower the HP stat, unlike IVs and Evs.

EVs are actually effort values. Essentially, this is the thing Pokerus doubles the amount you receive, and is probably the reason why you may have noticed irregular stat boosts upon a few level-ups. Different Pokemon you battle give hidden points, and upon accumulation of enough of these points in one stat, you gain a one-point in the respective stat. There is a limit of 510 of these points on a Pokemon, and the points can actually be removed through new berries. To use these stats to the maximum effectiveness, you would have to train for some time against specific pokemon. Also, there are new items created to make this training easier.

Now, most players choose to ignore much of these factors, as paying attention to them causes immense attention to the game, beyond realistic acceptibilities. However, as time passes, online play will become more and more competitive between certain groups by virtue of taking advantage of these stat rules. I assure you that I have not ever taken part in any of this kind of stuff, and it is not the reason why I dominate you in a Pokebattle, though at some point in time, perhaps a year or so from now, it may be.

This is very confusing. Please explain this in a way that I will understand.

that Baby guy · « **Reply #81 on:** May 28, 2007, 05:12:03 PM »

I don't explain things in more detail than I currently know. If it is absolutely necessary, I can find a link that may provide more information, but I really don't want to for someone who's sole purpose at the moment is seemingly to antagonize me.

Caliban · « **Reply #82 on:** May 28, 2007, 05:55:55 PM »

Basically, thatguy knows enough about Pokemon that when you have a battle against him your team gets beat to a pulp, my pokemans are evidence of such agonizing (not really) defeat.

that Baby guy · « **Reply #83 on:** May 28, 2007, 06:05:04 PM »

You know it!

WuTangTurtle · « **Reply #84 on:** May 28, 2007, 10:47:50 PM »

I think your explanation was fine the only thing missing was maybe a detailed example to walk a noob through.

Here goes:

Every Pokemon has a base stat. If you battle only Golbats you'll gain an extra point in Speed, so lets say u fight 4 Golbats and your pokemon levels up, that would mean your pokemon would gain a +1 in speed. Most pokemon give you EV's (effort values) in whatever their strongest trait is.

As for the Nature of your pokemon, like thatguy said, it will increase one stat while dropping another.

I wouldn't worry much about this stuff until you beat the elite four, especially since this stuff works in the background of the game, there isn't a way to check how many EV's each of your pokemon have, and since you need to advance in the story of the game your bound to fight Pokemon that you don't want to gain EV's from.

Hope that helps.....

Mashiro · « **Reply #85 on:** May 28, 2007, 11:02:13 PM »

Only now are my friend (shast) and I re-working our teams and working out the EV points and Nature to make our teams the best they can be.

It's extremely tedious and boring but once it is done, it is pretty rewarding. =)

As Wutang said and I recommend, clear the game first and then think about back-tracking to rebuild / rebreed your team.

Ceric · « **Reply #86 on:** May 29, 2007, 03:28:45 AM »

Here is a site with articles on all of that including EV, IV, and DV

Shecky · « **Reply #87 on:** May 29, 2007, 01:24:29 PM »

Quote
Originally posted by: thatguy
I don't explain things in more detail than I currently know. If it is absolutely necessary, I can find a link that may provide more information, but I really don't want to for someone who's sole purpose at the moment is seemingly to antagonize me.

I'm sorry you think that way, it's nothing like that. I'm just slowly learning things from the game and on my own as I go here, and strategy against the CPU is nothing like against a computer. So it's good to be able to challenge human opponents and try to formulate strategies... hence why I don't mind getting beat over and over.

(when I first read that post I didn't relize who it was directed at. I was confused b/c you did answer my question

.... I see now)

First... thanks to everyone for the pointers and all the info.

Now I'm pissed at Pokemon.... Let me tell you why....

I thought this would be one of those games that would be reasonably free of the invest your time in order to get what you want just so you can have a little fun against friends or strangers. Turning out to be the same as the others, maybe on the same tier as Guild Wars. Guild Wars pissed me off in that it was supposed to be the game free of any grinding. Just get it and you can pop right on and battle PVP. Great I say! So I pick it up and go straight to PVP only to find out that I have about a half a dozen cookie cutter presets to use. No problem there is a customize button.... but wait! it's empty under this. Why? Well you need to play the single player to fill it in Shecky! Invest tons of hours playing so you can get all those different skills so that you can customize your character.

So a buddy of mine told me that I'd eventually run across a "move relearner" for pokemon, so that I could experiment all the while on movesets. He also mentioned not to try and level every pokemon you get, but to rather get to like a handful and stick with those. Cool so far. Well, the move relearner wants something for the effort, of which I have seen one of thus far. Plus it turns out that these IV's and EV's make enough of a swing (63 points/stat) that it does make a difference against someone who cares to go that route. At least the second part is true, as most normal battle modes you can agree to exclude the legendaries and whatnot. So you can play with pokemon that wouldn't normally be able to stand up to those.

I guess my question is this.... are these types of games so insecure with their balance that they can't give the user the option to say:
1) Pick a pokemon/character
2) Distribute some bonus stats (or EV's as you have it) to customize
3) Pick moves/skills from all available to that type
4) Have fun with it

And don't even bring up single player... if you do your missing the point.

END RANT

that Baby guy · « **Reply #88 on:** May 29, 2007, 01:34:23 PM »

Woah, calm down Shecky. I wouldn't type out all of what I did for you if you annoyed me. I was referring to nintendo_star, a.k.a. ARO, a.k.a. Union Pentagon.

You don't annoy me, or else I wouldn't play the game against you. This guy has been harassing me since he first had an identity crisis and started inventing things and various persona around the forums.

Quote
Originally posted by: nintendo_star

This is very confusing. Please explain this in a way that I will understand.

And you bring up one of the reasons I like the Stadium series. It lets you forget about all that stuff, while letting you get balanced movesets for the several Pokemon instantaneously. None of this grinding stuff and the like. Anyways, like I said, I don't do that stuff, I don't have the time to. I find what I like, and put the moves I like on it. Past that, in a year or so, I may get bored and decide to, but it isn't on schedule for a long time.

Mashiro · « **Reply #89 on:** May 29, 2007, 01:39:28 PM »

Quote
Originally posted by: Shecky
I guess my question is this.... are these types of games so insecure with their balance that they can't give the user the option to say:
1) Pick a pokemon/character
2) Distribute some bonus stats (or EV's as you have it) to customize
3) Pick moves/skills from all available to that type
4) Have fun with it

I think the game does givee you the ability to just have fun with it and you can really choose to play as you like. Playing just among friends casually doesn't need massive time put into the game, nor do you have to bend over backwards worrying about EVs and IVs.

I like the fact that the game has added (albeit somewhat random) layers to it. It makes people who want to play competitively gain more play time out of it (the game) by having to really get down to the nitty gritty of making your Pokemon the best it can be. Sure it's somewhat long and boring working up specific EV's but I feel like it's worth it to gain a slight edge over the competition.

I like the added depth but it's not for everyone I guess.

Shecky · « **Reply #90 on:** May 29, 2007, 01:48:29 PM »

Quote
Originally posted by: thatguy
Woah, calm down Shecky. I wouldn't type out all of what I did for you if you annoyed me. I was referring to nintendo_star, a.k.a. ARO, a.k.a. Union Pentagon.

You don't annoy me, or else I wouldn't play the game against you. This guy has been harassing me since he first had an identity crisis and started inventing things and various persona around the forums.

Quote
Originally posted by: nintendo_star

This is very confusing. Please explain this in a way that I will understand.

And you bring up one of the reasons I like the Stadium series. It lets you forget about all that stuff, while letting you get balanced movesets for the several Pokemon instantaneously. None of this grinding stuff and the like. Anyways, like I said, I don't do that stuff, I don't have the time to. I find what I like, and put the moves I like on it. Past that, in a year or so, I may get bored and decide to, but it isn't on schedule for a long time.

Yeah, sorry about that... I figured that out after I posted. The whole MMO, grinding, and games like WOW and GuildWars obviously strike a nerve with me, and I was reading all this EV and IV stuff my rant was building up

If that's true about stadium, then I might have to get the Wii version comming out... NWR, please point that out in your review (if that's the case)

that Baby guy · « **Reply #91 on:** May 29, 2007, 01:51:06 PM »

Alright. I agree with that, though. It's almost the same, but remember several people are happy playing without that stuff.

Shecky · « **Reply #92 on:** May 29, 2007, 02:03:11 PM »

Quote
Originally posted by: Mashiro
Quote
Originally posted by: Shecky
I guess my question is this.... are these types of games so insecure with their balance that they can't give the user the option to say:
1) Pick a pokemon/character
2) Distribute some bonus stats (or EV's as you have it) to customize
3) Pick moves/skills from all available to that type
4) Have fun with it

I think the game does givee you the ability to just have fun with it and you can really choose to play as you like. Playing just among friends casually doesn't need massive time put into the game, nor do you have to bend over backwards worrying about EVs and IVs.

I like the fact that the game has added (albeit somewhat random) layers to it. It makes people who want to play competitively gain more play time out of it (the game) by having to really get down to the nitty gritty of making your Pokemon the best it can be. Sure it's somewhat long and boring working up specific EV's but I feel like it's worth it to gain a slight edge over the competition.

I like the added depth but it's not for everyone I guess.

True, I agree with that. I just think that I'm not the only person who would really enjoy the type of model I outline. Now if you play pokemon without paying attention to EV's then on one hand it does give each person's characater a "personality" that develops as they defeat enemies in single player. Also, if you can only play against friends, then chances are you play against people who share your mentality or at least know who does and doesn't.

So I'm not going to swear off pokemon, but some games could benefit from the "don't make me grind for it" mentality.

And that still doesn't excuse this move relearner fee... is there a beach filled with these scales?

that Baby guy · « **Reply #93 on:** May 29, 2007, 02:13:36 PM »

I think you get them in the underground thing. I haven't really tried to get any yet.

Mashiro · « **Reply #94 on:** May 29, 2007, 02:29:04 PM »

True, the move relearner fee is annoying. As is having to dig up evolution stones. I wish I had the GBA games just to transfer stones over =/.

I think an awesome addition would have been to make EVs not a complicated grind but maybe something along the lines of touch screen mini games to strengthen your PKMN . . . because I do agree grinding is boring.

but I also think making things too easy makes it boring . . .

it's tough finding a happy balance ^^;

that Baby guy · « **Reply #95 on:** May 29, 2007, 02:32:30 PM »

I do have to say it was a step in the right direction to have the auto-level battle modes. Definitely.

Shecky · « **Reply #96 on:** May 29, 2007, 02:41:14 PM »

Quote
Originally posted by: Mashiro
True, the move relearner fee is annoying. As is having to dig up evolution stones. I wish I had the GBA games just to transfer stones over =/.

Curious... how were stones obtained in the GBA games? I figured I'd be able to buy them eventually in this version (what else am I supposed to do with all this cash? or is 340K not that much??)

Mashiro · « **Reply #97 on:** May 29, 2007, 02:43:36 PM »

Yeah I agree, I really wish there was a random battle lobby though . . .

Mashiro · « **Reply #98 on:** May 29, 2007, 02:44:55 PM »

In this game you dig them up in the underground . . . no longer can you buy the stones from the store like in the GBA, GBC and GB games.

On a side note: working up EVs ain't that bad if you get the battle tower items that increase a specific EV gain by 4.

Ceric · « **Reply #99 on:** May 29, 2007, 03:27:59 PM »

Shecky it sounds like what you really want is the Colosseum type games.

News:

Author Topic: Pokemon Diamond/Pearl (Read 80633 times)