Topic: VC, GC games and the classic controller (and why Nintendo is stupid)

[Caliban]

Meh, I'm still getting 2 Classic controllers, I've got 2 GC controllers, so I'm all set for 4 way multiplayer.

[Spak-Spang]

Quote
Originally posted by: Pale
I guess I'm just one of the strange ones that was hoping I wouldn't NEED my WaveBirds for Wii.  I think the Classic Controller would have worked great for Cube games.

Regardless, I just saved some money on Launch day.  I'll probably only pick up two Classic controllers now (instead of 4) for sake of 2 player VC games that require more than 2 buttons and don't use an analog stick.  (I still hate the Cube d-pad)

I was the same way.  I don't have any more Gamecube controllers that work great anymore.  I need to buy 2-3 more.  But I love the design of the Virtual Controller much better than the Gamecube controller.

My guess would be that the limitation is within the actual software and hardware and less that Nintendo made a conscientious decision not to allow this to happen.

The reality could simply be that they didn't have an easy fix or a fix at all to trick the software into thinking it was using the Gamecube controllers...and that could be because HOW the Wii controllers send information to the console.

Its a disappointment to be sure, but perhaps it is one that was unavoidable, or one that can be fixed with firmware later.

[Mario]

Would it be possible to play a 4 player N64 game using 2 Classic Controllers and 2 GC controllers?

[UncleBob]

Quote
Originally posted by: MarioAllStar
I doubt that (m)any Wii games or original Virtual Console content will be designed for any GameCube-compatible controllers (Bongos, GBA-link, etc.).

We already know that Bongo Blast was moved to the Wii, so that's at least one game that will use the Bongos (at least, I have high hopes they don't plan on making me purchase even more Bongos)...  I assume that since the GBA Pokémon games are compatible with the DS games, you'll probably be able to link them to the Wii to transfer Pokémon to the upcoming Pokémon Wii game.  But that's just a guess.

[Shecky]

 This whole thing pisses me off in the fact that it should be relatively straight cut from what we know...

1) Two modes of operation.... Wii software and GCN software.  What's Wii software, everything that's not pressed to a GCN disc.

2) Controlling anything GCN is done through the GCN ports.

3) Controlling anything else is done with or through the Wii remote.

   As a result of this VC games would be playable with anything attached to the Wii remote or even the remote itself.  I'm also sure that your going to be able to use any past Nintendo controler with Wii software.  Why?  You can make an adapter to plug any controler into the Wii remote that's why.  Nintendo could easily come up with a button mapper channel to allow customizations and profiles for VC games.  If they don't you could easily do the mappings via other means.  I bet you'll even see playstation controller adapters for the wii remote from third parties.  So could you use the GCN controller for VC games?  Yes.  Wii titles?  Yes.  Just not through the GCN ports, but rather the Wii remote.

[mantidor]

Quote
Originally posted by: segagamer12

The VC 'Classic' controller will work perfectly for NES, SNES, TG16, Genesis and N64 games so what is the big deal?

I mean seriously stop and think about it you dont really think that people who dont have GC controllers now wont be able to get them any where Wii controllers are sold?

No, it doesnt fit perfectly for the N64 games, thats my big deal, the rest is of course covered.

Its not just that though, the focus of the classic controller is to be a last gen controller (GC) more than a last last gen controller (N64) that covered pretty much the rest of consoles, and so far the only reason for this is two types of games: independent games being released in the VC that will use this classic controller, which so far are completly unexistant, and new wii games that are going to have traditional options (smash bros, fire emblem), then again, you can use the GC controllers for wii games anyway, we know we can do it in Smash, it can also happen for Fire Emblem or whatever other new traditional game comes. So unless this indie scene is going to explode and be huge, something I highly doubt, that second stick of the classic controller will be unused most of the time, or used to ackwardly replace C buttons in N64 games, which makes completly pointless to focus on a GC like pad when a N64-pad is the obviously better choice.

At least thank godness for third parties, I can't wait for their peripherals, if they make an N64 VC pad, there would be little to no reason to get a Nintendo classic controller.

[GoldenPhoenix]

Quote
Originally posted by: mantidor

Quote
Originally posted by: segagamer12

The VC 'Classic' controller will work perfectly for NES, SNES, TG16, Genesis and N64 games so what is the big deal?

I mean seriously stop and think about it you dont really think that people who dont have GC controllers now wont be able to get them any where Wii controllers are sold?

No, it doesnt fit perfectly for the N64 games, thats my big deal, the rest is of course covered.

Its not just that though, the focus of the classic controller is to be a last gen controller (GC) more than a last last gen controller (N64) that covered pretty much the rest of consoles, and so far the only reason for this is two types of games: independent games being released in the VC that will use this classic controller, which so far are completly unexistant, and new wii games that are going to have traditional options (smash bros, fire emblem), then again, you can use the GC controllers for wii games anyway, we know we can do it in Smash, it can also happen for Fire Emblem or whatever other new traditional game comes. So unless this indie scene is going to explode and be huge, something I highly doubt, that second stick of the classic controller will be unused most of the time, or used to ackwardly replace C buttons in N64 games, which makes completly pointless to focus on a GC like pad when a N64-pad is the obviously better choice.

At least thank godness for third parties, I can't wait for their peripherals, if they make an N64 VC pad, there would be little to no reason to get a Nintendo classic controller.

I think you are completely missing the point, the extra analog stick is an option for developers creating new games to utilize, whether they do or don't is another matter but it does not hurt to design it that way in case! Maybe I misread but I believe a couple games will be utilizing the classic controller (forgot which games, but it was hinted at that Smash Brothers Brawl would). You guys need to get off the mindset that the classic controller is for VC games because that is not its sole purpose, it is an alternative to Wii developers as well!  With that said I would like an N64 controller shell, but I think the classic controller will be utilized for some Wii games as well so both would be good to get.

[mantidor]

And thats why I mentioned that the GC controller can be used for this new wii games, making the classic controller unnecessary. New developers are free to use the second analog of the GC controller, and personally for me the GC controller is superior to this ripoff of the ps pad. It howevers harms N64 compatibility by replacing C buttons for a stick.

[GoldenPhoenix]

delete

[GoldenPhoenix]

Quote
Originally posted by: mantidor
And thats why I mentioned that the GC controller can be used for this new wii games, making the classic controller unnecessary. New developers are free to use the second analog of the GC controller, and personally for me the GC controller is superior to this ripoff of the ps pad. It howevers harms N64 compatibility by replacing C buttons for a stick.

The GC controller would not have the functionality of the Wiimote because of its motion sensing capabilities. If a developer were to make a game for Wii they would most likely want to utilize the accelometers even if they use the classic controller shell. I don't see how that is hard to understand, the Wiimote even with the classic controller shell on still has extra functionality that could not be done with a GC controller (and to avoid looking like a lazy port they would probaly implement the motion control functions similar to the PS3). BTW I have a feeling that SSB Brawl will not use the GC controller but will instead use the shell.

[Mario]

Quote
No, it doesnt fit perfectly for the N64 games, thats my big deal, the rest is of course covered.

You can not say that without hands-on experience. Full stop. Move along.

Also remember, you don't have to buy a Classic Controller. Use your GC controller. It worked perfectly fine with OoT on GameCube.

BTW Ians posts here are completely ridiculous, I fully understand what Deg sees now, this horse crap has to stop.

[GoldenPhoenix]

Quote
Originally posted by: Mario

Quote
No, it doesnt fit perfectly for the N64 games, thats my big deal, the rest is of course covered.

You can not say that without hands-on experience. Full stop. Move along.

Also remember, you don't have to buy a Classic Controller. Use your GC controller. It worked perfectly fine with OoT on GameCube.

BTW Ians posts here are completely ridiculous, I fully understand what Deg sees now, this horse crap has to stop.

Can you guys direct to the news article where it was said that GC controllers would work with VC games?

[Mario]

From the link in the original post

Quote
Can you specify which controllers it will be possible to use for each of the VC games types (NES, SNES, PC Engine, N64)?

Nintendo: All virtual console games can be played using the Classic Controller or Nintendo GameCube pads.

[nitsu niflheim]

This is not an important issue.  Why are ya'll bitching about something so stupid as this.  First off there will be a small percentage of people who after buying a Wii will go back and buy up old GCN games, there will be some.  The main reason for the BC was that people who already own a GCN wouldn't have to keep their GCN hooked up.  I have no problem keeping only my Wavebird out to play my old GCN games.

Why would ya'll want to play your GCN games on a new style controller anyways?, because we all know that you will all (those bitching that is, most likely) will find something wrong with that if you had been forced to play GCN games with either the Wii controller or the classic controller.

How hard is it to keep your GCN controller out?

[Spak-Spang]

Actually the Virtual Console Controller will work with the N64 controls....not perfect, but well enough.

The N64 Controller has 9 Buttons, but only 8 are accessable at any given time.  If you hold it with the center prong you lose the L button, and if you hold it at its ends you lose the Z button.

The Virtual Console has 8 Buttons available to use.  I actually think that the 4 shoulder buttons will make games using all the face buttons easier...Because you have your thumb easily played to access 4 buttons, and then the shoulder buttons will be easily researched with your fingers...less accidental button presses.

[UncleBob]

Quote
Originally posted by: Spak-Spang
The N64 Controller has 9 Buttons, but only 8 are accessable at any given time.  If you hold it with the center prong you lose the L button, and if you hold it at its ends you lose the Z button.

I always held the N64 controller wrong.  I held it in such a way that I can hit all the buttons.  In fact, I always thought it was uncomfortable to hold it with the center prong....

[Spak-Spang]

Quote
Originally posted by: UncleBob

Quote
Originally posted by: Spak-Spang
The N64 Controller has 9 Buttons, but only 8 are accessable at any given time.  If you hold it with the center prong you lose the L button, and if you hold it at its ends you lose the Z button.

I always held the N64 controller wrong.  I held it in such a way that I can hit all the buttons.  In fact, I always thought it was uncomfortable to hold it with the center prong....

Ok...so you are admitting you are a freak?  J/K

But still no more than 8 buttons were ever used at the same time.  

[Shecky]

Nobody even read my post!

"Can you guys direct to the news article where it was said that GC controllers would work with VC games?"

Yes it's the same one that says you play VC games with the classic controller.

[mantidor]

Quote
Originally posted by: Mario

Quote
No, it doesnt fit perfectly for the N64 games, thats my big deal, the rest is of course covered.

You can not say that without hands-on experience. Full stop. Move along.

Also remember, you don't have to buy a Classic Controller. Use your GC controller. It worked perfectly fine with OoT on GameCube.

BTW Ians posts here are completely ridiculous, I fully understand what Deg sees now, this horse crap has to stop.

But there is hands-on experience, I played OoT in the GC, I hated it, the C-stick is not a good replacement for buttons and I think people who think it is are insane, it couldn't be more ackward. It did not work perfectly fine for OoT.

Which is the reason for my dissapointment, and you can be sure theres no way Im going to buy the classic controller, but is such a wasted opportunity that this controller doesn't use a N64 pad.

[Smash_Brother]

The Playstaton version of Castlevania will be available for purchase on the 360 arcade.

Sony doesn't hold the rights to any 3rd party games which appeared on their consoles (which was most of them).

Something tells me the classic controller looks like a PS1 controller because the Wii will continue to add additional consoles to its list of downloadable support. Once the infrastructure is in place, all it takes is for Nintendo to create the additional emulators and place them up for download and then people can start downloading the roms, no matter how large they might be.

Considering that a 200GB USB hard disk will run you $80, downloading PS1, PS2, Saturn, Dreamcast, Xbox, etc. games might very well be possible at some point in the future.

Plus, I fully expect Nintendo to sell a Wii-compatible HD alongside the Wii at some point in the future, especially if they do release these emulators and roms.

[Dirk Temporo]

Quote
Originally posted by: mantidor
So I want to know why the hell Nintendo didn't just use a N64 controller as the classic controller when its obvious it works for every single console in the VC perfectly. Whats the point in two analogs sticks and clickable shoulder pads if GC games are out of the question?

Because the N64 controller sucked ass and developers making NEW games for the VC might want to use a second analog stick?

[Talon]

What is interesting is how the vitrual console controller seems to have taken a step back from Nintendo's Gamecube controller mantra.  If I remember correctly the reasons behind the Gamecube controller design was because they wanted to simplify the controller to a point where every button feels unique so people could intuitavely find them without looking at the controller.  I believe they acheived that relatively well, im still forever looking down at my ps2 pad.

I believe they did not go with an N64 controller setup because of the steep learning curve non-gamers would face trying to use it.  Think about the first time you ever saw or picked up an N64 controller.  Hence the reason for the current design.  It is by far the industry standard and will be the most flexible to use for cross-platform support (if indeed developers wanted to put dual shock games on the Wii).

Besides the majority of people who want to play gamecube games on their Wii's will already have a gamecube.

[GoldenPhoenix]

And once again I'll say that the classic controller can be used not only for VC games but for new Wii games as well. I would not be surprised to see some upcoming games use just the classic controller or maybe use it as an alternative control method while utilizing the motion control features!

[Smash_Brother]

I know that the Metal Slug Anthology will use 6 different control methods, including a GC controller.

My guess is that the whole thing is more in the hands of developers than we realize.

[GoldenPhoenix]

Quote
Originally posted by: Smash_Brother
I know that the Metal Slug Anthology will use 6 different control methods, including a GC controller.

My guess is that the whole thing is more in the hands of developers than we realize.

Interesting, I wonder if they may also use the Classic Controller too for some of the Wiimotes functions?