Topic: The OFFICIAL Big N rumor thread *bring your own salt*

[Ian Sane]

Okay I figure that there is no way ALL of these ideas are on the controller.  Probably each idea has been considered at some point and the resulting product will merely feature some of them.

And that makes sense since Nintendo did so well with the Wii remote there would be a certain expectation for them to do something innovative with the controller again.  So in R&D that throw every idea they can think of at the wall to see what sticks.  The rumour-mongers pick up on the different ideas and run with it.

[Ceric]

Though Nintendo is known to throw all things at the wall during R&D.

[Chozo Ghost]

Who is there in the room where Nintendo "throws ideas at the wall to see what sticks" and is leaking all these rumors? It would be worth finding out, because whoever it is is probably a Sony agent who is there to see what Nintendo is brainstorming so they can start ripping it off.

[Ceric]

I think all these rumor leaks are more evidence of Nintendo reaching out to 3rd parties then anything they've said.

[Adrock]

Now there are rumors of a rear trackpad? Cheesus... I'm still not terribly convinced of the point of the rear trackpad on NGP consider it has a touchscreen. I know, I know... so you can have touch controls without interfering with action on the screen so on and so forth. That said, seems redundant on a home console's controller which supposedly has a 6 inch touchscreen. Also, even if Nintendo was planning a reach touchpad, they'd likely remove it because Sony announced it first.

PSP used disc and gamers didn't buy the games. Why didn't they buy the games? I can only guess that it was because the UMD's ate up all the battery life, which lead for the need to bypass the UMD drive, which led to ripping games off the UMD which led to games as torrents which then meant free games to all who had a memstick.

What the? Really? You can do the same thing on DS. PSP is just easier to pirate than DS. There will always be a subset of gamers who pirate games. People pirate games because getting something for free is, in fact, cheaper than paying for it. I know, crazy, right? I can't believe that either. Nice try, though.

But you are also forgetting the other thing I mentioned about carts, Nintendo controls them. You have to go to Nintendo for their proprietary carts and Nintendo can price them as they see fit. They control the manufacture and will probably still request high minimum orders & queued up lead times for manufacturing.

No, I didn't. And no, they probably wouldn't. (see quote below)

No one has complained about Nintendo's handling of DS/3DS cards, not in terms of price, lead times or any other ridiculous old-school Nintendo conditions/restrictions. If it was a problem, we would have heard about it ages ago.

[Ceric]

Adrock: On the PSP back touch area.  Using your free fingers to press soft buttons so you don't have to clutter the screen with them would probably be the best way to use it.  Its actually in a way an elegant solution to avoid making a DS and give the extra buttons.

[Adrock]

Adrock: On the PSP back touch area.  Using your free fingers to press soft buttons so you don't have to clutter the screen with them would probably be the best way to use it.  Its actually in a way an elegant solution to avoid making a DS and give the extra buttons.

I know, I know... so you can have touch controls without interfering with action on the screen so on and so forth.

Come on, man.....

I understand what it's meant for, but it still seems extraneous to me. There are so many buttons on NGP. The read trackpad is a solution; 2 screens is still a better one. I prefer 2 smaller screens over 1 large screen. Having an entire touchscreen devoted to secondary functions just feels better than using screen real estate on a single screen to display that info or having a trackpad where you can't see what those functions are unless they're on the screen anyway and if that's the case, why not just the  touchscreen. I don't know if I'm explaining that well. Still, Nintendo seems to be discouraging the touchscreen as an action screen on 3DS which I get since 3D is meant to be the main selling point, but some of the most innovative games on DS used the touchscreen exclusively or almost exclusively. It's just awkward for games to switch screens on 3DS or to hold it sideways like a book for games like Hotel Dusk. Oh well.

[broodwars]

Personally, I like the idea of having a rear touchpad simply so I can use the features of the touchscreen without having to use a stylus or smear my fingerprints all over my nice screen.  I can't say I care much for the proposed ideas like "pinching" objects using fingers on the touchscreen and the touchpad.  I can do without 2 screens, though.  If there's one thing I thought the DS proved over time, it's that the 2nd screen is largely superfluous.  90% of the time, the 2nd screen was just used to show status screens or maps anyway, and I rarely had problems with just pausing the game to access those.  And there weren't enough games that used both screens well to really prove the functionality worthwhile to me.

[BlackNMild2k1]

My main point with carts working on DS is that there is no viable retail alternative. Games don't sell on PSP unless its called Monster Hunter. If you want to sell portable games for more than $0.99 on an iPhone, your only choice is the DS which uses carts. There is no other physical alternatives regardless of how much money 3rd parties throw at PSP and its disc format. You can't continue to ignore that fact.

[Stogi]

You guys should just make a bet. Neither of you are going to agree.

While I see Nintendo itching to go back to carts, I do not think financially, they will allow themselves to. 3rd Parties or not, it's about Nintendo's bottom line.

[BlackNMild2k1]

supererogatory superannuation
It is my understanding that the new GTA will be unveiled at E3 in some capacity.

He didn't mention Cafe, but it was rumored that Nintendo and R* had talked, and that R* was one of the first to have a Dev kit. Then it was separately rumored that R* was working on GTAV for Cafe.

Super Annutation has been pretty reliable in the past and has no reason to lie now, so I'm just gonna put 2+2 together and hope that means that fanboys will be happy come E3.

[Stogi]

Woooo! Another ChinaTown Wars!

[Adrock]

You can't continue to ignore that fact.

All points duly noted.

Ignoring what? I've acknowledged all of your points. Your point of there being no viable alternatives is NOT the reason why cards work. Cards work because it's a good format for gaming and no one has complained. No one, about anything regarding cards. Even if 3rd parties didn't consider PSP a viable alternative and everyone only begrudgingly supported DS, someone somewhere still would have said, "Cards are bullshit" then explained why. If 3rd parties were so vehemently against the price or Nintendo's policies regarding cards as you've mentioned before, they would have voiced a dissenting opinion. Furthermore, no one has ever said UMDs are a better format for any reason, including price. DS dominated because Nintendo, for once, had the foresight to predict where the market was headed and flat-out made a better system.

And PSP is a viable retail alternative. It only looks like a failure next to DS but then again, almost every piece of gaming hardware looks bad next to DS's sales figures. Despite the rampant piracy, 3rd parties still support PSP with some decent exclusives. PSP has better 3rd party support than the Wii and that's just plain pathetic. 3rd parties certainly thought there was money to be made otherwise they would have stopped supporting it years ago. Again, that's the bottomline. It's not about storage formats. To 3rd parties, the Wii got that right and everything else wrong. The system as a whole has to provide an ecosystem for profitability. That's the incentive. "3rd parties will support hardware they deem worth supporting." 3rd parties supported PSP. Sony released good hardware, Nintendo released better hardware. Both were deemed profitable and were supported accordingly.

You guys should just make a bet. Neither of you are going to agree.

Bet on what? This all started because I called out the 25GB disc rumor and said moving to cards seems like something Nintendo would want to do considering they don't like optical media. It was an observation until BlackNMild2k1 made it into a debate which is fine by me. This is a message board, people talk about things. As far as I'm concerned, it's not malicious. If it bothers you, I don't really know what to tell you. I signed up for this site years ago so I could talk about things with people who are interested in the same things I'm interested in.

[BlackNMild2k1]

The thing is we both agree that carts would be a great thing for Nintendo to use on another console, we just disagree on why it isn't happening.

it's just that PSP isn't a viable alternative to DS for software sales because software DOES NOT SELL on PSP outside of a few franchises such as Monster Hunter.

3rd parties aren't gonna complain about the only system actually making them money, that they then turn around and use to release console-like PSP games that they hope will finally start selling (60million PSP units out in the wild), but never seem to. PSP is great hardware with shitty software sales. People buy it for gaming, but not games they intend on buying. People buy it for movies, but not movies they are buying on UMD's, people buy it for media playback in general, but not media they are buying from PSN or Qriosity or whatever their music service is.

PSP doesn't have the ecosystem that DS has and that is why carts on the handheld work without complaint. Money is being made and everyone is content, but that doesn't mean they wouldn't jump on an optical with the proper ecosystem should one actually exist. Doesn't mean they would abandon Nintendo's money printer, but they may put favor towards something alternative format if their was one. Good thing is that NGP is using carts too, so that will be one more manufacturer moving towards making the flash format cheaper sooner, and no better company to do that than Sony.

So even though carts are not a viable medium at the moment, doesn't meant that it won't be maybe in the next next gen(Wii3) or the one after that(Wii4). Problem is that it will never be as cheap as the disc alternative and therefore 3rd parties will probably always prefer it to a cart format of same storage size.

[Kytim89]

I see the Wii 2 as the second coming of the SNES and I hope that Nintendo collaborates with third party developers on a scale not seen since the days of the SNES. Perhaps it is wishful thinking, but I hope that SquareEnix reintroduces all of their RPG glory of that console era onto the Wii 2 and Nintendo themeselves reinvigorate their franchises in tune with what they did back in the early 1990s.

[BlackNMild2k1]

Honestly that would be very cool and I don't see Nintendo limiting it to the touch area but extend it all the surfaces you normal handle.

I don't believe it because that would mean Nintendo is throwing every trick at this controller...tricks that no other company has been working on or really developed a consumer product.  The expense is just too high for a consumer.

However, IF I am wrong...then I believe this would mostly be used to feel buttons on a screen and that is all.  You can no simulate real feelings and textures with a touchscreen.  And if you could and Nintendo had the technology first...they shouldn't be making a game system, but a freaking tablet with the device because it would revolutionize every industry. 

Here is a very interesting video from a Toshiba showing off Haptic technology that should be ready for market. (video is from May 2010)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jXITjLurof0

Key things of interest:
-Feel texture as if touching actual object
-Does not need to be limited to the screen
It can be wrapped around the entire controller to provide a sensation to all of your hand, not just the screen.

That sounds like something that could not only get everyone taking, but get everyone to want to try out the Wii2 for themselves because you have to Feel it to believe it.

[Dasmos]

supererogatory superannuation
It is my understanding that the new GTA will be unveiled at E3 in some capacity.

He didn't mention Cafe, but it was rumored that Nintendo and R* had talked, and that R* was one of the first to have a Dev kit. Then it was separately rumored that R* was working on GTAV for Cafe.

Super Annutation has been pretty reliable in the past and has no reason to lie now, so I'm just gonna put 2+2 together and hope that means that fanboys will be happy come E3.

Guh, **** GTA. Give me another Red Dead game.

[Chozo Ghost]

I see the Wii 2 as the second coming of the SNES and I hope that Nintendo collaborates with third party developers on a scale not seen since the days of the SNES. Perhaps it is wishful thinking, but I hope that SquareEnix reintroduces all of their RPG glory of that console era onto the Wii 2 and Nintendo themeselves reinvigorate their franchises in tune with what they did back in the early 1990s.

I could swear you said this same exact thing about 20,000 times before. Do you ever get tired of repeating yourself?

[Adrock]

3rd parties aren't gonna complain about the only system actually making them money

Well, that's just silliness. 3rd parties can criticize something and still support it. They have and will continue to do so. Nintendo is still criticized for Friend Codes which started on DS. Sony was criticized for putting only one analog nub.  3rd parties still published games on DS and PSP, as opposed to neither. And seriously, 3rd parties are making money on PSP games. That's why they still release PSP games. They wouldn't continue doing that if they expected to lose money. They just make more money on DS.

[BlackNMild2k1]

DS success funds PSP failures. That's the way it's been for a long time.
Just like WIi shovelware has been funding AAA budget HD games.

Everyone was complaining about friend codes, not just 3rd parties. Besides Nintendo's online is almost not functional because of them, so there is plenty reason to complain about it.
Dual analog on PSP was complained about because it was preventing them from doing straight PS2 to PSP ports and now they had to actually put effort into reworking controls for PSP games.

The difference between those 2 things and the use of carts on the DS is that either of those things could change with an update. You can't just change the format without releasing an entirely new platform (see PSPgo, failed because they took away retail games from it trying to get away from battery draining and failed as a format UMD's). PSP has proved that spinning disc don't work on a portable and that in order to have a portable product that won't die on you after 2hrs, is to use a flash based format for size and energy requirements. The use of carts is necessary on handhelds therefore is not something you can effectively complain about. Cost of carts is the cost of doing business. Your only other viable option is DD, which means that you either hope PSPgo starts succeeding or you sell games for $2.99 on iPhone and Android.

On PSP games support:
The only place where PSP games are selling is Japan. PSP is, for the most part, DEAD in the U.S. & Europe. So I don't know why PSP continues to get more games than Wii or DS, I can only guess that Sony is offering some sort of incentive, but even if they aren't really losing money, they surely aren't making any either

[Chozo Ghost]

I understand if parents don't want their kids playing with strangers online, but that's something parents need to take care of themselves. Friend codes did the work for parents who were too lazy to keep an eye on things themselves, but while that was helpful to them it was harmful and annoying to everyone else. When you play a game online it should be possible to play with random people that you don't know, because your friends may not have the games you want to play, and even if they do it isn't likely they would always be online when you want them to be so being able to play with random strangers is an essential feature.

That said, the parental controls should be there and I have no problem with that. But they should only be an option and shouldn't be mandatory.

[BlackNMild2k1]

$350+ Wii2 production (by Hon Hai) to start in Oct. coming in 2012
http://fudzilla.com/notebooks/item/22633-wii2-to-be-built-by-hon-hai

We have been hearing this rumor for about two weeks now, but we had difficultly verifying it until now. The Taiwan Economic News has confirmed that Hon Hai Precision Industry Co reportedly has an exclusive contract to build the Wii2 for Nintendo.

Our sources are also saying that Hon Hai will be able to start delivering the first units to Nintendo in October, but it is unclear what the run rate will be once the building is on the way. Whispers suggest that Nintendo will start ramping up production for an expected launch in North America slated for next year. Despite some suggesting a holiday launch for Nintendo yet this year, we just don’t hear it that way.

With the news from Taiwan comes word that the MSRP of the Wii2 will be an estimated $350 to $450. This number is a bit shocking for Nintendo, but actually not unexpected given the hardware that the Wii2 will be using. While others continue to report that the Wii2 will not be HD, the information we have still indicates that the console will use a modified GPU from the ATI R700 family and it will support 1080 HD.

Wii2 production (by Hon Hai) to start in Oct. & a $350 - $450 price point with a 2012 release

This is the 2nd time we've heard the rumor about system being produced starting in October. This is also the second time we've heard a price point of $350+.

At that price this system better blow the screen off my 720p TV forcing me to go buy a 1080p set to replace it because 720p just couldn't handle it.

[Chozo Ghost]

$450 is steep. I think I would have to wait on it if its priced that high. But on the bright side, at least it isn't $600 like the PS3 was when it launched. The PS3 is now $299, so I'm sure the Wii 2 will go down eventually as well.

[Ceric]

$350+ Wii2 production (by Hon Hai) to start in Oct. coming in 2012
http://fudzilla.com/notebooks/item/22633-wii2-to-be-built-by-hon-hai

We have been hearing this rumor for about two weeks now, but we had difficultly verifying it until now. The Taiwan Economic News has confirmed that Hon Hai Precision Industry Co reportedly has an exclusive contract to build the Wii2 for Nintendo.


Our sources are also saying that Hon Hai will be able to start delivering the first units to Nintendo in October, but it is unclear what the run rate will be once the building is on the way. Whispers suggest that Nintendo will start ramping up production for an expected launch in North America slated for next year. Despite some suggesting a holiday launch for Nintendo yet this year, we just don’t hear it that way.

With the news from Taiwan comes word that the MSRP of the Wii2 will be an estimated $350 to $450. This number is a bit shocking for Nintendo, but actually not unexpected given the hardware that the Wii2 will be using. While others continue to report that the Wii2 will not be HD, the information we have still indicates that the console will use a modified GPU from the ATI R700 family and it will support 1080 HD.

Wii2 production (by Hon Hai) to start in Oct. & a $350 - $450 price point with a 2012 release

This is the 2nd time we've heard the rumor about system being produced starting in October. This is also the second time we've heard a price point of $350+.

At that price this system better blow the screen off my 720p TV forcing me to go buy a 1080p set to replace it because 720p just couldn't handle it.

Agree.  $350-$450 is still a price point I expect a Haus of a system.  I won't take just better than a PS3.

[Stogi]

Uh thanks for quoting that for us, Ceric. I hadn't seen it the first time. EDIT: ah, you edited it

BnM, 720p and 1080p aren't much different from each other. You'd be hard press to tell them apart if shown side by side. It does look better, but I wouldn't go out and buy a new TV for it.

What I really hope Nintendo deals with is 'teh jaggies'. Even the highest end games like Crysis 2 still have jaggies, which is disappointing. I also hope they automatically upscale Wii games. Unless something amazing stands out during launch, I could have fun simply replaying all my favorite games in 1080p glory.