Topic: Miyamoto interview on IGN

[Ian Sane]

Click here.

This was mentioned in the Thurdayaton thread but after reading it I felt it deserves it's own topic.

Reading it I see a few things popping out at me that really concern me.

Miyamoto says that 2006 is the year of the Revolution and the way he's saying everything it gives me the feeling that the Rev won't be shown proper until next year which is complete unacceptable.  Now he also says that Spaceworld is a possibility so we're not screwed for sure and I think it's possible that Nintendo could change their mind about when to show it at virtually any time.  They probably think right now that waiting is a good idea.  They wouldn't have bombed on their conference otherwise.  I think however they'll see how damaging the Rev no-show is and will show something in the next few months.

This interview really gives the impression that the Rev is underpowered.  They ask about the power TWICE and he dodges it both times with all sorts of BS about creativity and how raw power doesn't matter and stuff like that.  That sounds like an excuse.  It sounds like an attempt to justify a stupid decision on Nintendo's part.  If the Rev isn't underpowered then surely he would say "don't worry.  It will be comparable to the other consoles."  But he doesn't and Nintendo only dodges stuff like that when they know you won't like what the real answer is.  I have a feeling Nintendo is back on the drawing board freaking out over how superior the specs of the other consoles are in comparison.  I think they grossly underestimated what everyone else was doing.

Third parties don't have dev kits yet and there's no planned timetable for when they will.  In other words Revolution third party support is going to SUCK and Nintendo is making very little effort to fix that.  Third parties needed dev kits yesterday if they plan on releasing anything for launch.  They need dev kits NOW.  Not a few months from now, not next year but RIGHT NOW.  Being similar to the Cube won't accomplish much because the Cube had sh!tty third party support.  The third parties that I want to see on the Cube don't have much experience with Cube dev kits.

Reading this interview suggests to me that Nintendo wasn't prepared for what Sony was going to show.  They're WAY behind and it shows and they have to bust their ass to salvage this mess.  I don't think they expected Sony to show any game related footage or announce any titles or to just show that much.  I don't think they thought the PS3 would be as powerful as it is.  They have to get those third parties in the loop and they have to beef up the Rev's power and they have to do that very soon.  They're going to have to bust their ass just to deliver the bare minimum let alone to go above and beyond expectations.

[Artimus]

Or it means they don't want to compete with Sony and Microsoft because they're looking for a different type of product.

[Nigel]

Quote
Originally posted by: Ian Sane
I have a feeling Nintendo is back on the drawing board freaking out over how superior the specs of the other consoles are in comparison.  I think they grossly underestimated what everyone else was doing.

it's scary just how true this can be.

[HereticPB]

Smart really as the other companies tipped their hands and shown their cards and controllers. Nintendo actually doing the copying this time?

[mantidor]

Im predicting right now there will be a "Rev is d00m3d" editorial at IGN next week, or maybe even this week.

I dont know what to think about the specs anyway, Im sure games will look really great, and thats enough for me. I dont see such a big difference in the overall impressions from the general audience about the next gen console's graphics, because it would hard to compare them and say which ones look better, this time it will all depend on the art direction and the effort of the devs and not just the raw horsepower of the machines.

[TMW]

Quote
Originally posted by: HereticPB
Smart really as the other companies tipped their hands and shown their cards and controllers. Nintendo actually doing the copying this time?

Um...there is nothing to steal.  

You have a Dreamcast clone and a Sony Sextoy.  

[Arbok]

Quote
Originally posted by: HereticPB
Smart really as the other companies tipped their hands and shown their cards and controllers. Nintendo actually doing the copying this time?

Copying isn't the word, as I doubt they will steal any of Xbox360's or PS3's ideas.

EDIT: Or what TMW said, damn my slow typing...

[Ian Sane]

"Or it means they don't want to compete with Sony and Microsoft because they're looking for a different type of product."

We've heard that before.  They used that excuse with the Cube and it didn't improve things.  Does the Rev play games?  Yes.  Therefore it competes with Sony and MS.

[jasonditz]

Since IBM and ATI designed the chips for both the Rev and the Xbox 360, if the later is considerably more powerful and launching sooner Nintendo would probably be very pissed. They're both heading in different directions, and I'm sure Nintendo is making cost an issue more than MS (who seem more than willing to subsidize their systems to the tune of several hundred dollars per unit), but we can reasonably expect them to both be in the same league.

[jasonditz]

Quote
Originally posted by: Ian Sane
"Or it means they don't want to compete with Sony and Microsoft because they're looking for a different type of product."

We've heard that before.  They used that excuse with the Cube and it didn't improve things.  Does the Rev play games?  Yes.  Therefore it competes with Sony and MS.

And despite all the doom and gloom about the specs the Cube was not underpowered for the generation. Far from it.

[Sir_Stabbalot]

No offence, Ian, but you really should be a bit more optimistic. Thinking so negatively can't be good for your health.

[BlackNMild2k1]

Quote
Originally posted by: Nigel

Quote
Originally posted by: Ian Sane
I have a feeling Nintendo is back on the drawing board freaking out over how superior the specs of the other consoles are in comparison.  I think they grossly underestimated what everyone else was doing.

it's scary just how true this can be.

Quote
From the interview
Shigeru Miyamoto: You know, I didn't get a chance to see the Sony and Microsoft presentations for myself, but from what I've heard from people it sounds like they are going to be using cutting-edge technology, as are we. However, the way that they are planning on implementing that technology is obviously very different from the route that we're going to be taking. On the business side of things I see where we're going and I see where they're going and I'm not worried at all. I don't think it's going to influence us at all. We're good to go.

Shigeru Miyamoto: You know, in regard to the power of the Nintendo Revolution versus, say, the Xbox 360, we're looking at making a small, quiet, affordable console. If you look at trying to incorporate all that, of course we might not have the (raw)horsepower that some other companies have, but if you look at the numbers that they're throwing out, are those numbers going to be used in-game? I mean, those are just numbers that somebody just crunched up on a calculator. We could throw out a bunch of numbers, too, but what we're going to do is wait until our chips are done and we're going to find out how everything in the game is running, what its peak performance is, and those are the numbers that we're going to release because those are the numbers that really count.

Not so sure if they are going back to the drawingboard, or if they just didn't want to show more of the same (even though some pre rendered target videos would have been nice).  As usual Nintendo wants to show actual games running on actual hardware, Not target videos ala PS3.
 

[Unsung Zero]

Well, by not revealing much, as far as the technological aspects of the Revolution go, Nintendo does have the upper hand. They have their special controller, and now they can match the specs of the other systems if they so choose (think along the lines of how quickly new technology becomes available in the computer world.)

[Arbok]

Quote
Originally posted by: Unsung Zero
They have their special controller, and now they can match the specs of the other systems if they so choose (think along the lines of how quickly new technology becomes available in the computer world.)

Sony has that advantage as well, Microsoft is the only one losing out there as they are putting their system out the door so quickly.

[stevey]

1 nintendo said the chip aren't done so 2-3 X power go in a year to 20-30 X power. 2 The # from sony is what it will be not what it is now so it only 10% of what there said and it might not be able to do it. 3 mario 128 how much longer must I wait and last Ian drink some wine and go to happy land please.

[trip1eX]

Quote
Originally posted by: Artimus
Or it means they don't want to compete with Sony and Microsoft because they're looking for a different type of product.

Exactly.  That's what they are doing.  They are competing by differentiating.  Their console will be low cost, quiet, smaller, have a new controller and give you access to the backlog of Nintendo games. They want you to be able to get experiences that are different from the other consoles.    

[Spak-Spang]

I think Miyamoto pretty much blantantly admitted the Revolution will be less powerful than Xbox360 and PS3.  However, he did state that it won't be as big of a power difference as everyone assumes.  

It also appears that Nintendo is actually trying to take technology a different direction.  So I think Miyamoto was trying to say in Raw horsepower they may have us beat, but in technological advancements that matter to gaming, we are coming up with something special.

Last very important fact is Nintendo is still looking at a reasonable price mark.  If you look at the price quoted for the PS3...it will come out at $400.00!!!  I am willing to bet that the Xbox 360 will be similarly priced.  That is insanely expensive for a video game system.  I am basically going to have to have $500.00 saved up to entire the next generation market of gaming.  I can't afford that.  And I don't think many can.  I think the Xbox 360 will have a slower launch than Microsoft is hoping for...same with Playstation 3.

However, Nintendo could come in with a reasonably priced system that offers unique differences to the Xbox and Playstation.  If that happens people may board on the cheaper, less powerful system.  Plus with the option to download your favorite games, I can see that selling point making Nintendo Revolution the MUST HAVE second system in your house.  Because it will play Everything else.

 

[pudu]

Quote
Originally posted by: Ian Sane
"Or it means they don't want to compete with Sony and Microsoft because they're looking for a different type of product."

We've heard that before.  They used that excuse with the Cube and it didn't improve things.  Does the Rev play games?  Yes.  Therefore it competes with Sony and MS.

Yea Nintendo is definately sticking to that crazy notion that they are so "different" that they don't even need to compete...whatever that means.  Ok so you can put off the next "real" GB for a "third tier" system aka the DS and say it doesn't compete with the PSP.  But in truth, as everyone knows, it is PSPs competition regardless.  Nintendo can say what they want as far as what they believe to be true but nothing overpowers the fact that the general public, stores, and the press all WILL make comparisons between the Revolution and the other consoles just as they did with DS vs PSP (funny that Nintendo is now basically living with this fact and comparing sales figures with PSP even though by their definition it isn't even it's competition).  

Shigeru Miyamoto: Let me pose a question to you. When we launched the Nintendo DS, we didn't really say too much about its power. Do you think we've suffered?

IGNcube: No. Definitely not.

I beg to differ.  There is no way to say that if the DS had more under the hood and did more multimedia things it wouldn't have done better (or posibbly worse).  I think that with portables graphics are less important in general then with consoles.  Now considering the difference in graphics between the PS2 and Xbox I am hoping that the Rev turns out to be no less powerful in comparison to the PS3 (by this I mean I hope it's not more of a gap then there was between PS2 and Xbox).  At this difference in graphics I could deal with it and be happy for all the features and games but if it's similar to the average pc graphics of today then I'm going to be a little upset.  No one can deny they don't enjoy good graphics.  Graphics CAN immerse you in a game and open a whole new world of possiblities!  More polys mean more to interact with, larger environments to explore, more details to include, more characters on screen, more emotional connection, etc etc.  Let's just hope Nintendo has both superior control AND graphics!  You hear me Nintendo?

What do you guys think superiour graphics and physics can add other then eye candy???

Edit: spelling (sorry if there is more...)

[ThePerm]

what the hell? Seriously..he sounds like he doesnt know what he's doing anymore......
he has other people doign his projects for him and he isn't even examining the competition.
They are a business. They have to realise this. They are worried about being copied? so what?
Being first is more important to everyone else than being copied.

Seriosuly I watched both microsoft and sony's conferences and they were 1000 times better than
nintendo's

[LuWoo75]

After having some time to think things over I have to say I'll backtrack on some previous post.  First of all all the games coming from the ps3 are all fmv, sony and my post is a train wreck are playing the # game every # they throw out are theoretical sony dosent have one game running on it's system yet.  Ninetendo isnt going to throw #'s out just fot spits and giggles at least this is what i'm getting from that interview.  I have a gut feeling Nrev isn't as weak as we think from that interview it may not me as strong as ps3 but i think it somewhere on the 360 level.  I dont think that there going back to the drawing board b/c they are making the system smaller, if they are doing that it wouldnt make sense to try to add more proccessors as that would add to the heat and space and would need water cooling ala 360 to disapate the heat.  

I do agree that Nintendo didnt count on sony showing this much of there stuff right now.  I feel sony felt like they had to in order to keep my post is a train wreck from dominating this year's E3.  Think about it for a minute if Sony didnt do what they are doing they woulda took E3.  Sony did exactly what it had to do come out with the highest specs or at least an illusion of even if they had to fudge the #'s no one is going to second guess it cause there is no software running on it to back it up.

Nintendo wasn't ready for this and there arn't going to fudge #'s just to play the same game.  I even bet Nintendo wasnt' even going to show or even have a final design on the rev until sony started showing theirs.    

[Ian Sane]

"So I think Miyamoto was trying to say in Raw horsepower they may have us beat, but in technological advancements that matter to gaming, we are coming up with something special."

The problem with this logic is that it only works for exclusives.  Companies like EA, Ubisoft and Activision aren't going to take the time to make use out of what the Rev provides.  They're going to take the version of Madden, Splinter Cell, and Tony Hawk that the other consoles get and shoehorn it into the Rev, even if they have to remove stuff to do it.  So you get the same situation as the Cube where the exclusives are amazing but everything else is a half-assed port.  By providing comparable hardware Nintendo doesn't get stuck with the sh!ttiest version of every multiplatform game.  And the problem is that Nintendo isn't in a position where they can rely on third party exclusives.  They have the weakest third party support.  For now they have to rely on multiplatform games to fill in the gaps.  In order to increase the amount of exclusives they get they have to increase their market share and they can't do that if they always get the worst version of Madden because they didn't match specs.

The PS2 gets the best versions of most multiplatform titles because it's the market leader.  The Xbox gets the best versions of a lot of multiplatform titles because it's the most powerful console.  The Cube rarely gets the best version of multiplatform titles because it is neither.  If the Rev is underpowered it's in the same position that the Cube is in.

[LuWoo75]

Yeah 3rd party support is one that has always bothered me.  That game the Darkness looks to be a decent game it's on the 360 and ps3 and if the specs are way inferrior nrev maynot even get a port.  It's still too early to say either way but i dont know if i can put this on on Nintendo.  I dont think anyone knew sony was going to show their system and it's my post is a train wreck who pushed everyone into a new generation of consoles b4 anyone was ready.  

I was pleased to hear Kid Icarus is going to make an appearance on the nrev though.

[jasonditz]

Incremental differences in multiplatform titles don't sell consoles, and even if they did there's nothing for Nintendo to do about it.

Nintendo is not going to magically get more third party exclusives either. The depth of the 1st, 2nd party library and the small market share make it the worst possible target for most games right now.

They've got three cards to play this generation.

1) Price. The Revolution will almost certainly be the cheapest of the three consoles
2) 1st and 2nd Party Exclusives: Nintendo always has the deepest library of quality 1st party and 2nd party titles. Microsoft proved last generation that money can't buy that kind of support. Not even a whole LOT of money.
3) History: Nintendo has been around the longest and despite its current position is still synonymous with gaming to many.

All signs point to them realizing this and playing them

[Ian Sane]

"Incremental differences in multiplatform titles don't sell consoles, and even if they did there's nothing for Nintendo to do about it."

They don't sell consoles but they help not sell consoles.  Negatives add up.  If the Rev has the worst versions of Madden and Tony Hawk that's a negative and it's something that someone considers when they buy a console.  One of the Cube's biggest problems is that it had a whole buttload of little negative things.  On their own they weren't that big of deal but combined they made on big fat reason to NOT buy a Cube.  Having the worst version of Madden didn't put the Cube in last place.  No it was that combined with no DVD playback, no online games, a restrictive controller, no demo discs, small memory cards, component cables that have to be ordered online, weak third party support & not enough mature games.

If the Rev is underpowered it already has two negative points in that it's the weakest hardware and if has the worst versions of multiplatform titles.  Two negative points that Nintendo can see coming a mile away and can stop right now.  There's always going to be some negatives that the console maker has no control over.  But they should always try to nail the ones they do have control over so those combined with the uncontrollable ones don't mess everything up.  The Rev is going to have weak third party support.  Nintendo can't fix that problem overnight.  Combined with those other two that they can fix overnight already we've got a big fat reason not to buy a Rev and we don't even know all the details yet.  They'll never EVER overcome the uncontrollable negatives without first addressing all the ones that they do have direct control over.  How can anyone have faith in a console maker that has had two "loser consoles" in a row that doesn't fix problems starring them right in the face a year before launch?

I don't know about you but I got pretty sick last gen of Nintendo creating their own problems and then not solving them.  Nintendo has never been more unpopular than they are right now.  All it takes is ONE EXCUSE for people not to care and they won't.  Well here's one excuse and it's a big one.

[Kairon]

I can't wait for you to stop caring Ian Sane.

I've never been a Nintendo fan for their marketshare, nor for their graphics.  I stay interested In Nintendo because they do some of the best innovation and gameplay I've gotten my hands on.

You seem to want Nintendo to be everything Sony and MS are, AND more. Well, I'd just like to tell you, it can't be done. You simply CAN'T one-up Sony or Microsoft at their own game. It's all Nintendo can do to just keep up.

Therefore, Nintendo will ALWAYS have those negatives. Nintendo's only hope to survive is to create positives via quality games and innovative gameplay that can balance those negatives out. This is what Nintendo seems to be pursuing.

Look Ian Sane, you're asking for Nintendo to BE Sony and Microsoft. They simply can't. They don't have the resources, the know-how, nor do they have the pervading market presence or any brand at all outside the videogaming field. What you're asking for is impossible, and it is all Nintendo can do to simply keep up.

Look at it this way: Nintendo is NOT a hardware maker. They are a software maker who maintain a presence in the hardware market to make their software innovations possible. If you want a cutting edge powerhouse system, fine, get a PS3 or XBO360. Sony and Microsoft can give you what they want, but Nintendo, a company whose NES was ALREADY inferior technology against its competitors, they're not the company you're looking for.

Carmine M. Red
Kairon@aol.com