Topic: The Legend of Korra [Season 4 airs in Jan/Feb for Australia]

[Stogi]

UHHHH NO ONE is talking about that last episode, "Korra Alone"?!

**** it. I'm not gonna say anything either.

[BlackNMild2k1]

I have the 1st 2 eps, U just haven't watched them yet. So I have nothing to say about any of it.

[ObbyDent]

IT WAS FUCKING AMAZING HNNG


Better?

[Spak-Spang]

I liked the episode, but the first 2 episodes were world building and catching people up.  I really like the villain so far, I like the idea of the world seeming to work without an Avatar...the world is creating its own balance.  Hopefully, the 3rd episode moves us forward more and really helps us see the vision of this season.

[azeke]

2nd episode was meh.

They only have 10-12 episodes and they waste an entire episode showing Korra just roaming around pointlessly. She barely even interacts with anyone.

If they wanted to do second "Zuko alone" -- that didn't work. "Zuko alone" actually told some new stuff. This one only teased that we might get some new stuff in the next episode. Maybe.

The only good part were cutesy spirits.

[Spak-Spang]

The episode was filler...and it was pretty clever in some ways.  It told us, that Korra can now move.  She is still able to bend all elements...however she seems to be quite a bit weaker at them.  It told us, she can't use the Avatar State.  It kinda gave us hints how team Avatar drifted apart and why/how Bolin started working with the "big bad."  There was a lot of information given to us this episode, but you are right very little progression in story.  I think they could have told parts of this story in episode one and saved the reveal of the villain for episode 2.  Also, why not show us an air nation defense win instead of a loss?  At least that way, episode 2 could have had more progress. 

[ObbyDent]

The episode is not filler if it does what you explain above. Filler does nothing for the plot of the show, of the character development of the... characters. Just because there was no progress in the plot, does not mean that it is filler.


Especially when we have no idea how the story is going to go and how important the episode is for the season.

[Stogi]

Explaining why something happened and showing how something is happening is the exact opposite of filler.

This episode was phenomenal. Every scene had a point, detailing Korra's struggle and pursuit to become whole again. It was wonderfully crafted from beginning to end. There wasn't one wasted scene. In fact, it might be the best episode I've seen since the first Avatar episodes (the Raava episodes).

This is why I love Avatar. They provided us with the emotional state of the character and this is incredibly important when it comes to story telling. Whenever we see Korra from now on, we will realize just how hard it is for her and empathize with her frustration and fear of becoming obsolete. And so when she eventually becomes whole again, it will mean that much more to us.

So filler this was not. This episode, in contrast to the first, was not exposition and I really enjoyed it for that.

[ObbyDent]

Explaining why something happened and showing how something is happening is the exact opposite of filler.

Exactly. This "filler lol" bullshit that goes on in this fandom pisses me off the no end. So many people bitched about "filler" in the original show when the only episode that qualified was "The Great Divide".

[Spak-Spang]

To be fair the original show did have episodes that were less important.  However, the first series was a much longer season, and the emphasis was on exploration and the journey into adulthood.  So, the longer seasons and detours were more acceptable and I would say important for the story.

That said, you are kidding yourself, if you think the same basic Avatar story couldn't have been told in 3 seasons with 13 episodes each.  It wouldn't be the same, and sure it would be lacking some elements, but it could still be highly emotional deep and explore the entire world of Avatar...I mean look Korra has done a wonderful job of doing it.  With far less episodes, I believe Korra has already surpassed the original series in storytelling. 

[ObbyDent]

I must be kidding myself, because I firmly believe that it would not be the same.

[Spak-Spang]

Sorry, the your kidding yourself is/was harsh.

I guess all I am really saying is 13 episodes is a lot of time to tell a story Its over 4 hours of content.  But since they are broken down into mini-segments or mini-stories to a bigger story...you don't have to worry so much about transitions and pacing like a movie does.  So, it allows you to take several shortcuts in storytelling and tell a bigger story quicker and easier.  Korra has proven that the scope of the series does not have to be limited by the episode count. 

Am I saying that episodes of the original series were bad, or needed to be cut?  No not really.  The creators did a great keeping the momentum of the story going even with long seasons, which can sometimes bog down a story.  However, the story could have been told tighter, and could still be just as powerful and meaningful. 

Would I have wanted the original series to be fewer episodes?  Probably not.  But I also wouldn't want Korra to be 24 episodes long a season.  Perhaps 16...but not more than that. 

[broodwars]

With far less episodes, I believe Korra has already surpassed the original series in storytelling.

Eh...I don't know about that, man. There was a lot of love triangle filler and "idiot plot" in the second season (not to mention the complete lack of consequence for Korra losing her bending at the end of Season 1, only to get it back 5 seconds later) that makes it hard for me to say Korra surpasses TLA in terms of storytelling. Sure, aspects of Season 1 were excellent, and Season 3 as a whole was very good, but in terms of storytelling I find Korra a great deal more inconsistent than TLA.

As for this season...eh, I'm reserving my judgement on it till we see more episodes. I'm really not fond of how transparently evil Kuvira is already seeming to be, so much that it wouldn't surprise me if she was behind the bandit raids on the various Earth Kingdom states to force them to join her. I realize it's odd to say that given how overwhelmingly evil Fire Lord Ozai was in the original series, but Ozai also had 3 seasons of build-up behind him. Kuvira just reminds me of Unalok from the 2nd season, a rather pathetic villain who just appeared out of nowhere; was increasingly boring to watch; and was only a threat because everyone around them was an idiot.

[Spak-Spang]

Well, to be fair, they had NO idea that they would be renewed the first season.  You have to complete the season.  And actually, I thought season 2 did a pretty good job of telling the love story pretty quickly and getting over it.  You have to remember that is a part of growing up...and actually most of the love triangle stuff was really first season.  Second season dropped it quickly. 

People may not have liked the direction the second season went...but I think that season was the start of showing the world as a bigger place, that has begun adjusting without an Avatar and raised the questions whether or nor the world needs an Avatar.  Showed us a new world and history for the Avatar.  And basically showing that right and wrong isn't as easy to determine anymore...and each season past has continued that trend.

[ObbyDent]

The situation with Season 2 was the same with Season 1: they did not know that they were getting a third and fourth season when they made it. As bad as people like to say Book 2 is, I can still slightly forgive it for some of its faults.


Spak, the love triangle stuff wasn't actually dropped until Season 3. Even until the last few episodes of season 2, you had Mako going back to Asami, lying to Korra about their fight, and breaking Asami's heart (again).

[Spak-Spang]

Maybe I just don't remember all of season 2.  But, I never found that element of the story distracting...but I guess at the same time it wasn't memorable either.  So good point.

[ObbyDent]

Oh, I completely agree with you. At the time I was frustrated with the love triangle stuff, but now that we are getting more of the entire story under our belts, I don't find it distracting from the main plot at all. In fact, on rewatch, I actually find some of it fairly engaging.

[BlackNMild2k1]

finally watched the 1st 3 eps.

Is this getting another season, or is this the last one?
and Toph calling Korra out on her self pity was great.
PTSD ain't no joke though, and Korra got it bad. But atleast she now has a goal. An definitive obstacle to overcome, but after that, there truly are not other excuses other than how Toph already explained it.

[ObbyDent]

This is the last season.

[Stogi]

The last episode was pawful as a whole but had Toph, so it was still enjoyable when she was on screen. It was such a throw away episode, with things turning out the way we easily predicted but still lacking any sort of energy. Why was it so easy for Kuvira to dismiss the King? Wouldn't someone be upset and try to stop her? This was a perfect opportunity to show how ruthless she could be, but instead everyone seemed to know it was going to happen beforehand because no one was shocked. All of those conversations, Bolin and Mako, Kuvira and the leader of Metal City, could have gone down in a battle/coup de tat scenario. It would have created drama and intrigue, but we're given the Hotel scenes, which were awful.

And last but not least, that bit about Kuvira taking the President's suite was the worst bit of foreshadowing I have ever seen.

It's crazy how 'Korra Alone' was a perfect episode of storytelling and this one was a mess.

And why are the Earth Kingdom rulers always getting overthrown? This is the third time in a generation. That's pathetic.

[Spak-Spang]

Kuvira was not the problem of this episode.  The reason it was so easy to dethrone the king is he is a brat.  This is exactly how dictators often come to power.  They overthrow the corrupt establishment and bring balance and order.  She first brought the balance and the order in such a powerful way nobody dared stand up to her, and she brought enough stability to the masses that they gladly cheered her coming to power instead of another royalty that would probably tax the people to live out of luxury.  What happened there was very realistic. 

As for no retaliation her surprise announcement caught the Republic and the other nations by surprise...they had no time to respond...but I believe we will get to that soon next episode. 

If Kuvira should how cruel she could be on TV and to the general masses she could have lost her public support...she still wants to be seen as a leader for the people.

What is frustrating to me is the Toph stuff was excellent but has no resolution.  Hopefully this is not all we get of her.  Because her being the wise but hard teacher is always fun.  I wish she could have just pulled the poison out of Korra and moved on.  There is still much story to be told.

[Stogi]

I didn't say 'cruel', I said 'ruthless' and that's exactly what she is and that's exactly why it should have been shown to the masses given the timing of her coup and her very ruthless speech. It was not realistic at all. Sure the King is a brat, but he is still the King. Loyalty should have come into play, and not in a heated argument. Someone should have yelled "What the hell are you doing?" Instead, we debate the philosophical ramifications of Kuvira's actions afterwards rather than diving into the actual consequences.

Yes, she is loved. And yes, it should be easy for her to take over considering how much support she has, but no one speaking out against what is a crime is simply weird and made the episode lack any real significance. If the Republic and other nations were surprised, no one showed it.

This episode was a mess.

[Spak-Spang]

ruthless and cruel are often viewed as the same.  Even if I messed up the adjective, my point still stands.  And yes it is fairly realistic.  He is a king by title only.  The last queen had basically enslaved her people for her own wealth, and when overthrown the boy king went into hiding in another country, while the entire kingdom fell into anarchy.  One single person fought to regain order for the people.  Kuriva.  Yes, she did so ruthlessly.  Yes, she forced loyalty...but with that loyalty the leaders lost power...the people gained security and food.  The people would rally to her.  The king...not so much.  He is out of touch...nobody wants him. 

As for the episode being good...I already stated I thought it did not advance the plot far enough and therefore isn't my favorite.  I just think the problems with the episode lay elsewhere.

[Stogi]

Ok, maybe we're looking at this wrong. Let's take this for what it is, a story. And in a story, actions have consequences. So even if this is "realistic", this story would have benefited with a reaction that was not as muted and tempered as the one they portrayed. It would have been better if there was a fight for power, however small it may have been, for two reasons. One, it would have provided the perfect setting for the conversations that followed, such as Bolin and Mako splitting on what is right and two, it would have riled the 'Earth Empire' towards Kuvira; seeing her fight against loyalists to an outdated system and an unworthy ruler as well as a foreign government partaking in a sovereign nation's politics. It would have added emotion, energy, and empathy towards Kuvira that is very much needed. Because as of now, Kuvira is completely one-sided. We have seen her pray on her own people, so it would have been significant if she fought for them in front of the eyes of the world.

It would have also put more urgency into Korra's recovery and the Metal's City response. Plot lines would have the necessary weight to move forward quickly. And lastly, from an entertainment aspect, it would have been interesting!


Again, this is a story. And that is why to me the best moment of the episode was Toph getting to the heart of Korra's issue. You see a plot device that is moving to slowly (e.g. you wish Toph would have just healed her already), while I see a story progressing naturally.

[Spak-Spang]

I understand your concern.  And I think there were reactions.  Scene in the debate between the two brothers. 

But there were 2 stories going on this episode...and I guess I am waiting for the next episode to the see the weight of what happens with Kuvira...but I think it will come.  But bureaucracy often times acts too slowly...and allows very bad things to happen.  (Hilter being a great example of that.)

I understand the story progression and story arc happening with Korra...and I understand that PTSD or whatever Korra is going through is quite serious.  But they are giving her too much of an easy out with it just being poison...it is going to be an easy fix once she "gets over herself" which I think will allow for a super quick, nope I am back recovery.  I think discovering the root of her problem, but Toph getting the metal out...and the PTSD still remaining would be a better story arc.  Korra can begin healing and reconnecting to the Avatar State, but she still must deal with the emotional scars.  This girl has been through hell in what could be seen as a relatively small amount of time.  Not only that recover has been slow.  Yet, this is the first time we have seen her really dealing with those scars and it may all just be poison still in her body. 

I know I am being too harsh on it...or it sounds like I am critical of the show, which I love.  But honestly, this part of the Korra story could have been put in episode 2, and they could have had a single Kuriva episode for the 3rd episode providing better pacing and impact for both.