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Author Topic: What's with all the negative editorials about the Wii?  (Read 18011 times)

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Offline Ceric

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RE: What's with all the negative editorials about the Wii?
« Reply #50 on: April 21, 2007, 11:18:38 AM »
I have to agree with Deguello.  Their is one thing in this world that will almost instantly trigger me into a rage.  Thats Disrespect.  I respect you till you prove me wrong.  Its one thing for a true blog or a forum poster to link a Review with no heads up.  Notice I said link or even quote a little.  Its another for a "Mainstream" site to take from another site without giving a heads up to the people responsible.  Especially if there is an area for people to comment about it and the original author may never know what people are saying about him and then one day someone who does confronts him.

I know from the policy about how their is research to find the core source when something is posted here on NWR.  I have to hope that they notify the source when its another site like NWR at the least, aka not something coming straight from the companies website where it is assumed and wanted to be linked.

Also their is no cause to link people then when they come to visit disrespect them.

In Short:
IF GoNintendo wants to be treated like a blog they should be treated like a blog. (No access to Press Releases, mainly.)
IF GoNintendo wants to be treated like an aggregator(think Google News) then they should not have exclusives, press releases, and unique articles. (Though things like press release would naturally aggregate in.)
IF GoNintendo wants to  be a Mainstream site like they are then they need to act it a little more and play nice with the other sites.

Personally I had no beef with GoNintendo till I heard they be disrespecting Deguello.  Also heres another food for thought.  GoNintendo and NWR fill a very similar niche.  So every perk that GoNintendo gets is one that more than likely would have gone to a site like NWR instead.
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Offline NWR_pap64

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RE:What's with all the negative editorials about the Wii?
« Reply #51 on: April 21, 2007, 11:22:47 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by: Deguello
"As for the linking, he's using a short excerpt and linking the source, The courts have upheld that to be fair use. "

Yes it may be LEGAL, but dong it with my reviews without even telling NWR or at least ME is just in bad taste.  The fact I had to find out about it thirdhand just irks me a little more.  Then I find out he's been doing it since 2005?  Well, you can possibly see why I'm a little more miffed than usual.

So I decided to enter their chatroom a few months ago and see what's up, maybe see if I can at least  tell him my concerns.  I was shouted out by their fans the very moment I brought up my concerns, saying I was a faker, and then that they "Didn't know what NWR was," and then  referred to it as "some small unknown fan site." The mod in the room did not reply.  All I asked was that they at least give me a HEADS UP that they were going to snarf my review and that they could stand to be a little more picky about news.  Apparently, even though they eat at my table and even dare to pick off of my plate, they are too good to show me manners and professional courtesy.

This is how their community and staff responded to me, a 6-year veteran in this games press thing.  I may not be the most professional guy on the block, but I at least expected a response and maybe thought I could be treated with a little bit of respect.  Just a little.  I don't ask a lot.  You guys here defending GoNintendo and their community, please note that you are treating them a whole lot better than they treated me.

P.S.:  And no I certainly am not jealous of their press goodies, as I get a few myself.  I might be a little more angry at Nintendo PR for deeming them worthy of the stuff.  But I can't help but feel a little irritated when they get the stuff and still profess to "not be journalists."


First of all, I appreciate the fact that you have expressed your concern in the most sincere way possible. I personally don't like it when people disguise their issues and concerns in angst, sarcasm, anger and forced humor, so the fact that you can clean as to why you have a beef with Go Nintendo earns some points in my book.

As for the issue, being a reviewer as well I understand your concern. Its your work and you have the right to defend it.

But I think you handled this very, very, VERY poorly. First of all, this was a serious issues that should have been discussed DIRECTLY with the creators and owner of the site. Chat rooms are infamous for hosting A LOT of wild and "unique" members, so if you went there with a harsh attitude then of course you were going to get all the crap thrown at you.

That type of behavior ISN'T exclusive to Go Nintendo. All websites have their loyal fanbase. The minute you criticize them you are defacing a holy grail. I'm sure that if an outsider came to NWR and started to criticize it the staff and members would come out and do the same thing. No website has a clean and pure community. Some are worse than others, yes, but the reality is that no online community is perfect.

Finally, it honestly looks as if you want us to share your anger towards the site. Its unfortunate what happened between you and the website, but you can't ask us to try to see it with the same eyes as you.

Forgive my bluntness, but it looks as if that experience was so bad that you stopped trying to solve the issue and decided to just hate the site and throw mud at them when the opportunity arises (be honest, were you the Deguello that flamed RMC in his Bust a movie review?).

Did you at least made the effort to talk directly to the creators and staff? One last thing, did you went in there seriously, or did you have a childish attitude about it?
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Offline Smash_Brother

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RE: What's with all the negative editorials about the Wii?
« Reply #52 on: April 21, 2007, 11:33:00 AM »
GoNintendo is like a geyser of information.

It doesn't matter how accurate the information is. All I need to do is toss it into the geyser to get the whole world to see it. That could come in rather handy...
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Offline Kairon

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RE:What's with all the negative editorials about the Wii?
« Reply #53 on: April 21, 2007, 11:39:10 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by: pap64

That type of behavior ISN'T exclusive to Go Nintendo. All websites have their loyal fanbase. The minute you criticize them you are defacing a holy grail. I'm sure that if an outsider came to NWR and started to criticize it the staff and members would come out and do the same thing.


Yeah! No one gets to criticize the NWR review write-ups except for us!!!

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Offline Deguello

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RE:What's with all the negative editorials about the Wii?
« Reply #54 on: April 21, 2007, 04:59:32 PM »
I didn't want to send an email because e-mails give them time to destroy evidence or formulate a defensive, guilt-shifting response.  I thought about a post on their message board too but a similar situation would occur.

I said the mod in the chat didn't respond to ME.  She (I say she because it was a "Bethany") continued to have discourse with other members, even while I was getting trashed.  And apparently this "Bethany" is an important person, as she runs the site for a while on certain days.  I thought that was a high enough person to air concerns too, especially since I did not have the time to make this a big issue.  If that was the sort of behavior I got from a senior staffer, I can only imagine how the president would carry himself.  And his he doesn't actually link my NAME in my reviews, he feels fit to encapsulate my review as representative of NWR in general, so I returned the favor.

Pap, I believe you think I went in there with a vial of piss and vinegar, but I assure you I was calm at the utmost.  At the very least Ms. Mod could have invited me to a private chat.  But instead she left the messenger to be shot by their cultists.  And this is the sort of attitude I received.  So yes I did cease attempts to bridge relations right there.  It's hard to build a bridge when the other side is busy burning it.

And yeah I sometimes comment there when I see something about them that particularly irks me.  Such as Mr. Cassidy's incessant habit of professing his fandom of every game he posts a preview of or sceenshots for.  Or his pretense of knowing everything about a game series while reviewing the latest ieration, and getting facts so wrong it seems lie he doesn't know what he's talkng about.  You may not realize it, but he is seriously insulting the intelligence of his readers and somewhat treating them like children.  And yes I do have the tinge of anger and insult when I comment, but since it apparently hasn't caught his eye, he still continues to ignore me as he grabs my work without telling me.

He benefits from me having bigger fish to fry than argue over the internet about him snarfing my reviews.  But it still feels wrong and disrespectful to at least not tell me.

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Offline Smash_Brother

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RE: What's with all the negative editorials about the Wii?
« Reply #55 on: April 21, 2007, 05:12:44 PM »
It's hard to argue with Deguello on the subject.

From that perspective, I'd hate the place too.

FYI, any Nintendo-related news I generate would go right to NWR and only to NWR. I've just been a patron too long to not feel that way about it.
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Offline Kairon

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RE:What's with all the negative editorials about the Wii?
« Reply #56 on: April 21, 2007, 05:20:43 PM »
Now with more information, I find I am in Deguello's camp.

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Offline NWR_pap64

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RE:What's with all the negative editorials about the Wii?
« Reply #57 on: April 21, 2007, 05:31:59 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by: Deguello
Pap, I believe you think I went in there with a vial of piss and vinegar, but I assure you I was calm at the utmost.  At the very least Ms. Mod could have invited me to a private chat.  But instead she left the messenger to be shot by their cultists.  And this is the sort of attitude I received.  So yes I did cease attempts to bridge relations right there.  It's hard to build a bridge when the other side is busy burning it.


I never said that you were mad or went there on a crazy binge. I wasn't there to witness it so I can't say which side is right.

I do believe your story since you have been honest and sincere about it. But to be honest, I am at a point where I have two different stories of the same thing. I have talked to RMC about it and he paints it another way.

Its like in a cartoon or sitcom where one side tells their story and in their version they are the saints and the other party are the demons, while in the other party's version they are the saints and the others are the demons.

Since I wasn't there to see it all I can't say which story has more valid. Not that I don't believe you or anything, but I decided to stay neutral on this because the stories differ greatly from each other.

If it makes you feel any better, I've been defending the site, yes, but its not like I am 100% loyal to them. I don't like some of their users, I don't go to their forums, listen to their podcast or participate in their contests.

I do post the news they put up, but I do it because I am ONLY interested in the story themselves. I now post the link of the original source when I talk about an announcement, and only submitted news like 3 times.

My loyalty lies first and foremost on cap and SB's website, because I've done stuff there for the past 5 years and that's where our friendship started. NWR is second because all of my Wii friends come from NWR.

Everything else I just check the news and reviews and don't bother with their stuff.

Once again, I appreciate that you were sincere and didn't rely on angst or sarcasm to tell your side of the story. I understand the issues better now.

EDIT: Actually, the more I think about it and read your story, the more valid it becomes. In other words, your anger towards the site is valid rather than some angst filled quarrel.

Like Karion said, with the information posted now things are clearer as to why some of the users have a personal beef with the site.

I mean, this isn't like dissing IGN for editorials or NWR because of their reviews. Its something deeper than that, and thanks to the info posted it becomes clear.
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Offline Kairon

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RE: What's with all the negative editorials about the Wii?
« Reply #58 on: April 21, 2007, 05:37:38 PM »
Hold it!

What's RMC's verison of it, and why can't he notify the websites when he's linking to their articles? It's not like the website can tell him "no," since he's legally in the right, and it is, after all, just common courtesy that doesn't take but 20 seconds...

~Carmine "Cai" M. Red
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A glooming peace this morning with it brings;
The sun, for sorrow, will not show his head:
Go hence, to have more talk of these sad things;
Some shall be pardon'd, and some punished:
For never was a story of more woe
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Offline NWR_pap64

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RE:What's with all the negative editorials about the Wii?
« Reply #59 on: April 21, 2007, 05:40:55 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by: Kairon
Hold it!

What's RMC's verison of it, and why can't he notify the websites when he's linking to their articles? It's not like the website can tell him "no," since he's legally in the right, and it is, after all, just common courtesy that doesn't take but 20 seconds...

~Carmine "Cai" M. Red
Kairon@aol.com


Well, I investigated this case by asking him his side of the story. This is what he told me.

"As far as linking reviews, I always
provide a link to the original source.  This is an extremely common
occurrence among all news sites, and there is nothing wrong with it.

The real problem is that Deguello had an issue with it and never
contacted me.  I feel horrible about this.  If anyone ever has a
problem with anything that I do, I want to hear about it.  I wish he
had contacted me."

He sounds honest. But so does Deguello. This is why I am neutral. Since there's nothing that proves this its hard to tell which version is right.

...Damn, we should turn this into a Phoenix Wright case!
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Offline Kairon

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RE: What's with all the negative editorials about the Wii?
« Reply #60 on: April 21, 2007, 06:06:09 PM »
Hmm...

Well, just because they failed to communicate before doesn't mean they can't try again right? Maybe all it takes to resolve this case is a second chance and some real dialogue? And hopefully, this time we can reach RawMeatCowboy himself instead of merely getting caught up in a beauracracy of fanbois.

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A glooming peace this morning with it brings;
The sun, for sorrow, will not show his head:
Go hence, to have more talk of these sad things;
Some shall be pardon'd, and some punished:
For never was a story of more woe
Than this of Sega and her Mashiro.

Offline NWR_pap64

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RE:What's with all the negative editorials about the Wii?
« Reply #61 on: April 21, 2007, 06:09:31 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by: Kairon
Hmm...

Well, just because they failed to communicate before doesn't mean they can't try again right? Maybe all it takes to resolve this case is a second chance and some real dialogue? And hopefully, this time we can reach RawMeatCowboy himself instead of merely getting caught up in a beauracracy of fanbois.

~Carmine "Cai" M. Red
Kairon@aol.com


I agree.

The key here is that the issue is solved so that we can come to a conclusion
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Offline Kairon

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RE: What's with all the negative editorials about the Wii?
« Reply #62 on: April 21, 2007, 06:22:05 PM »
Turnabout Fansite!

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A glooming peace this morning with it brings;
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Offline Karl Castaneda #2

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RE: What's with all the negative editorials about the Wii?
« Reply #63 on: April 21, 2007, 06:30:42 PM »
GoNintendo killed my parents and got my sister pregnant with a biracial baby.
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Offline NWR_pap64

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RE:What's with all the negative editorials about the Wii?
« Reply #64 on: April 21, 2007, 06:33:47 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by: ViewtifulGamer
GoNintendo killed my parents and got my sister pregnant with a biracial baby.


VITAL TESTIMONY!

VITAL TESTIMONY!
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Offline Kairon

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RE: What's with all the negative editorials about the Wii?
« Reply #65 on: April 21, 2007, 06:43:52 PM »
(wha... wha... whaaaaaAAAAATTTT?!?!?!?!)

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A glooming peace this morning with it brings;
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Go hence, to have more talk of these sad things;
Some shall be pardon'd, and some punished:
For never was a story of more woe
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Offline Adrock

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RE:What's with all the negative editorials about the Wii?
« Reply #66 on: April 21, 2007, 06:47:35 PM »
1. GoNintendo is good for having all kinds of Nintendo news clumped together in one place. I don't pay attention to their other crap. Codename Revolution is kind of the same thing, but without all the fluff and its Wii only.

2. While I don't have anything personal against the guy who runs GoNintendo, I can't stand anything written by him. He's one of those people who gets a tingle in his pants when "Nintendo" is even uttered within hearing distance.

3. The people who normally comment are even worse and I honestly hope they trip and fall on something. I add my two cents very rarely on the site and the reason is that fanboys are set and ready to ravage your penis or vagina if you say anything moderately anti-Nintendo.

4. People are disrespectful all over the internet, that includes NWR. I've noticed some pretty vile comments to new forum members since finally upgrading my lurker status to posting member last year. There's definitely a "Get a clue, noob" vibe around here as if you must earn your stripes or something. That's no different than most anywhere else online though. So while I generally agree with Deguello, I kind of feel like it's expected.

On a related note, I did save this sweet ass fan art of Samus in a battle ravaged space suit. Quite possibly the best fan art of anything I've ever seen anywhere.  
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Offline Kairon

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RE: What's with all the negative editorials about the Wii?
« Reply #67 on: April 21, 2007, 07:04:13 PM »
Dude, everyone I've been talking to this past couple of days is Gaga over that fanart.

~Carmine "Cai" M. Red
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A glooming peace this morning with it brings;
The sun, for sorrow, will not show his head:
Go hence, to have more talk of these sad things;
Some shall be pardon'd, and some punished:
For never was a story of more woe
Than this of Sega and her Mashiro.

Offline IceCold

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RE: What's with all the negative editorials about the Wii?
« Reply #68 on: April 21, 2007, 07:45:57 PM »
Link please!
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Offline Shift Key

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RE:What's with all the negative editorials about the Wii?
« Reply #69 on: April 21, 2007, 07:56:42 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by: Adrock
1. GoNintendo is good for having all kinds of Nintendo news clumped together in one place. I don't pay attention to their other crap. Codename Revolution is kind of the same thing, but without all the fluff and its Wii only.


Ok, there's one real issue with this aside from displaying other people's hard work - revenue. If you don't have to visit the source of the site then they don't get visitors. GoNintendo is giving you the news directly from someone else's mouth - generally without the need to visit the source. And GoNintendo get hits in turn, which generates more money for them, while the source gets nothing.

I rather the slashdot type of aggregation where a blurb is displayed and any media (images, youtube vids, details) are then linked to. This makes it fair for both the original source and GoNintendo, as they both fulfill a role in the process of getting information to you.

Quote
3. The people who normally comment are even worse and I honestly hope they trip and fall on something. I add my two cents very rarely on the site and the reason is that fanboys are set and ready to ravage your penis or vagina if you say anything moderately anti-Nintendo.


Comments posted anywhere on the Internet are ripe for mockery or debate. Suck it up and fight words with more words.

Quote
4. People are disrespectful all over the internet, that includes NWR. I've noticed some pretty vile comments to new forum members since finally upgrading my lurker status to posting member last year. There's definitely a "Get a clue, noob" vibe around here as if you must earn your stripes or something. That's no different than most anywhere else online though. So while I generally agree with Deguello, I kind of feel like it's expected.


I have no problem with newbies or people who stop lurking and decide to start posting. I do have problems with people who post stupid things without doing a bit of research of engaging their brain slightly - like this gem - so I do believe that respect in a community like NWR or another forum is earned, not given. Posting style goes a long way to building a good rapport with others.

I'll certainly keep an eye on this.
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Offline ShyGuy

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RE: What's with all the negative editorials about the Wii?
« Reply #70 on: April 21, 2007, 07:56:58 PM »
So, all you GoNintendo haters, do you also hold in contempt the other blog-wait-not-a-blog-news-maybe-except-they're-not-a-real-journalist-sites? Are Joystiq, Kotaku, and Destructoid also guilty of the crimes of: linking without permission, not being real hard hitting news bureaus, and creating biracial babies?
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Offline Strell

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RE: What's with all the negative editorials about the Wii?
« Reply #71 on: April 21, 2007, 08:21:51 PM »
Kotaku and Joystiq suck.

No need to worry about them.
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Offline Infernal Monkey

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RE:What's with all the negative editorials about the Wii?
« Reply #72 on: April 21, 2007, 08:33:01 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by: Deguello

EDIT: Oh yeah he likes to snarf reviews from a lot of other sites too, which I find a little annoying.  I mean their readers got to comment on my review of Zoey 101 before you guys did.  I mean I guess it does generate traffic to here, but it would have been nice if he asked first.  He may end up snarfing something that a person with a little more money than usual and a little less patience will sue him into oblivion for.


That's the worst part. 90% of the GoNintendo fanbase aren't going to bother checking out the source, they'll just read what parts RMC has quoted (sometimes he'll nearly quote the whole damn thing). He even includes the final score. YouTube/video reviews are EVEN WORSE because he links them directly into the bloody page so you can view them there. He won't even credit people that made/uploaded the YouTube videos, instead he'll thank whichever mindless GoNintendo fanboy sent it to him.
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Offline Shift Key

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RE:What's with all the negative editorials about the Wii?
« Reply #73 on: April 21, 2007, 08:44:35 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by: ShyGuy
So, all you GoNintendo haters, do you also hold in contempt the other blog-wait-not-a-blog-news-maybe-except-they're-not-a-real-journalist-sites? Are Joystiq, Kotaku, and Destructoid also guilty of the crimes of: linking without permission, not being real hard hitting news bureaus, and creating biracial babies?


I don't check these sites often, sometimes Kotaku. And if I'm really craving lowest-denominator Nintendo news then I'll check GoNintendo. Byte-sized news only goes so far.

Kotaku do a similar thing, but at least they will summarize the article in their own words and discuss it briefly (giving me an idea of whether I want to read the article itself). I don't see anything insightful from GoNintendo posts.
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Offline Adrock

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RE:What's with all the negative editorials about the Wii?
« Reply #74 on: April 22, 2007, 11:25:07 AM »
Quote
Shiftkey wrote:
Ok, there's one real issue with this aside from displaying other people's hard work - revenue. If you don't have to visit the source of the site then they don't get visitors. GoNintendo is giving you the news directly from someone else's mouth - generally without the need to visit the source. And GoNintendo get hits in turn, which generates more money for them, while the source gets nothing.

Well, maybe you should tell that to GoNintendo.

I simply stated that it's nice to have one place that clumps all the Nintendo news in one place, even if most of it is fluff, because I don't scour the internet for Nintendo news. If it makes you feel better, I actually visit the original source for interviews and news stories that pique my interests linked on GoNintendo. It's actually easier to do so. I give them credit for providing a site that gives me access to those stories that I might never have found otherwise.

Quote
Comments posted anywhere on the Internet are ripe for mockery or debate. Suck it up and fight words with more words.

Suck it up? I'm not going to waste my times arguing with a bunch of ignorant kids over videogames. Are you kidding me? I have better things to do.
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