Author Topic: Twilight Princess Spoiler Discussion Thread (for those who have the game tomorrow) (Read 150460 times)

mantidor · « **Reply #475 on:** January 28, 2007, 06:28:04 AM »

"I don't see how having characters speak to someone who never replies makes the game more immersive. If he's well written then we will identify with him regardless of whether or not he has dialogue."

No, it would be like a movie, and we would take a more passive role, and it would suck, theres enough wannabe-movie games already.

Link being left handed is tradition, if they keep him left handed (and I really hope they do) it would be for no other reason than tradition, because it has no impact in gameplay, but Link not talking is not a tradition, thats not the reason behind it, is the way the dev team let you make the experience more interactive, and the impact on gameplay would be significant, and in bad way.

And besides, he does have the ocasional written dialogue, but only if we can chose it. Take one simple example, Zelda after telling you her dream in Ocarina asks if you believe her or not, the answer doesn't matter at all, you have to eventually believe her because the game has to continue, so it seems the whole question was unnecessary but it wasn't, it lets you decide whether you want Link to be someone who trusts people or not, all Zelda games are filled all around with those insignificant details but their accumulated effect is what makes the game so good.

Adrock · « **Reply #476 on:** January 28, 2007, 07:35:13 AM »

If we're supposed to be in Link's shoes, then the player's choices should have more effect on the game. Using Mantidor's example, what if you chose not to believe Zelda? Then, you weren't asked again and forced to believe her. Instead something else happens? Your choice affects the direction of the game. I remember in the beginning of Chrono Trigger when you first meet Marle. You slam into her, but what you choose to do next affects the game. That choice didn't significantly alter the game; it was just cool that your choices mattered in some way.

I think they should've kept Zelda as it used to be and not try to force feed a story that isn't really that great to begin with. I've established that I hate bulk text. If Nintendo doesn't want voice acting in Zelda, then stick with text, just give us less of it. Zelda fans are pretty divided on the issue of making the games more cinemtic with deeper plots and voice acting. Honestly, I don't care. I'd rather they just pick a side (cinematic or not cinematic) because long cinemas without voice acting is annoying. That's right in the center, taking the worst parts of either side. Give me Zelda with short cinemas and text boxes. There's always the prospect of a new franchise.

Artimus · « **Reply #477 on:** January 28, 2007, 08:05:06 AM »

Quote
Originally posted by: Adrock
If we're supposed to be in Link's shoes, then the player's choices should have more effect on the game. Using Mantidor's example, what if you chose not to believe Zelda? Then, you weren't asked again and forced to believe her. Instead something else happens? Your choice affects the direction of the game. I remember in the beginning of Chrono Trigger when you first meet Marle. You slam into her, but what you choose to do next affects the game. That choice didn't significantly alter the game; it was just cool that your choices mattered in some way.

I have no problem with this either. This also makes far more sense than the current model.

Quote
I think they should've kept Zelda as it used to be and not try to force feed a story that isn't really that great to begin with. I've established that I hate bulk text. If Nintendo doesn't want voice acting in Zelda, then stick with text, just give us less of it. Zelda fans are pretty divided on the issue of making the games more cinemtic with deeper plots and voice acting. Honestly, I don't care. I'd rather they just pick a side (cinematic or not cinematic) because long cinemas without voice acting is annoying. That's right in the center, taking the worst parts of either side. Give me Zelda with short cinemas and text boxes. There's always the prospect of a new franchise.

Problem is that there are now four 3D Zeldas, 6 2D Zeldas, 1 sidescroller and an upcoming 2.5D Zelda. They cover ever part of the gameplay to story spectrum from all gameplay (Zelda 1) to gameplay with some story (Ocarina) to great gameplay with more of a story (TP). There's not really a lot about Zelda to improve on or fix. TP basically perfects Ocarina and fixes its flaws. 2D Zelda have never been as good as LttP and LA. As amazing as the games are there comes a time when a sequel cannot possibly advance the model any further. At that point you have to either abandon the series or reinvent it. We can see this with Mario. Mario 64 essentially did all you need to with 3D Mario and then SMS was just treading water. So with Galaxy they've tried to redesign the series so it feels just the same but is exciting and new. The time has come for that to be done with Zelda. Obviously the answer is NOT making it full of story like a Square game. Obviously the answer has nothing to do with voice acting (it's just so painful, like you said, when they're using cinematics with lips moving and no voice). What's the answer? I don't know. But maybe integrating the player into a story more is the answer. Perhaps Zelda could redefine how we view 'story' in games by making us control it (but not in the GTA open-ended sense). Or maybe the solution is just to replace the dungeon model. Who knows.

I just hope they really challenge themselves with the first full-fledged Wii Zelda and really find a way to reinvigorate the series. I didn't feel TP was stale at all (criticisms its "just more Zelda" truly baffle me). But I'm afraid the formula is now perfected and I want to see some new ideas and the series break ground again.

IceCold · « **Reply #478 on:** January 28, 2007, 08:17:43 AM »

That's exactly what they're trying to do with Phantom Hourglass - I'm all for full stylus controls, because it will be fresh and exciting. I have a feeling that we'll all be shocked when we get first details of the next Zelda.

Smoke39 · « **Reply #479 on:** January 28, 2007, 12:14:49 PM »

Quote
Originally posted by: matt oz
If you don't want Link to talk, then turn off the voice acting when they make him talk.

You really think they'd give us the option?

mantidor · « **Reply #480 on:** January 28, 2007, 02:42:38 PM »

I have no doubts that Zelda will continue to break the mold, it always has, the only reason TP exists and really didn't break any mold is thanks to the bitching about the WW, if not for that it would be a completly different game.

The Traveller · « **Reply #481 on:** January 28, 2007, 03:03:25 PM »

Hmm..I am kinda worried that Nintendo wont make another console cel shaded Zelda. I like the TP look but I dont want that to be the only style they go with from now on. A land based cel shaded Zelda could be amazing.

Kairon · « **Reply #482 on:** January 28, 2007, 03:05:23 PM »

In my heart of hearts... I haven't given up on sailing.

~Carmine "Cai" M. Red
Kairon@aol.com

Adrock · « **Reply #483 on:** January 28, 2007, 03:57:06 PM »

Sailing as a gameplay mechanic wasn't necessarily bad; the implementation of sailing in Wind Waker was. I think sailing in Phantom Hourglass could be really fun.

I wouldn't mind another console cel-shaded Zelda. Cel-shading was never the problem. Regardless of the graphical style, it's the gameplay that will continue to define Zelda so I hope it reinvents itself more than it has the past few games.

I still like my idea that the choices the player makes actually changes the direction of the game. If Nintendo really means for the player to be Link, what better way than making the player's decisions actually matter.

Zelda: Do you believe my story?
Link: No.
*Zelda looks down in shame*

BlackNMild2k1 · « **Reply #484 on:** January 31, 2007, 05:38:11 AM »

Another question: In regards to bug collecting. Once you leave the Sacred Grove is it possible to go back and collect the second bug if you missed it the first time?

I going back and collecting all those rupees I had to leave behind since my rupee bag was always full and I now have something to actually spend rupees on Castle bridge and Goron Store in Hyrule and Bug collecting is an easy way to make money and I figure there is a heart peice reward at the end if you complete the task. That is why I wanted to know.

mantidor · « **Reply #485 on:** January 31, 2007, 06:00:02 AM »

There are no "one time only" things in TP as far as I know, something I hated in the WW and the figurine collection.

And if you really want to know the bug reward

its just the big wallet ¬_¬"OH LOOK MORE RUPEES!"

BlackNMild2k1 · « **Reply #486 on:** January 31, 2007, 06:07:03 AM »

Quote
Originally posted by: mantidor
There are no "one time only" things in TP as far as I know, something I hated in the WW and the figurine collection.

And if you really want to know the bug reward

its just the big wallet ¬_¬"OH LOOK MORE RUPEES!"

well, I tried going back, but the entrance was blocked.
I guess I could always try again later.

Smoke39 · « **Reply #487 on:** January 31, 2007, 09:37:30 AM »

Quote
Originally posted by: mantidor
its just the big wallet ¬_¬"OH LOOK MORE RUPEES!"

Giant. You get the big one the first time you give her a bug (or maybe just the first time you talk to her).

Ceric · « **Reply #488 on:** January 31, 2007, 10:13:49 AM »

Quote
Originally posted by: Kairon
In my heart of hearts... I haven't given up on sailing.

~Carmine "Cai" M. Red
Kairon@aol.com

Mental Note: Kill all Heart of Hearts that thinks like Kairon's.

MaryJane · « **Reply #489 on:** January 31, 2007, 01:57:48 PM »

I can finally post in here now that tonight, I beat Zelda! I didn't want anything spoiled, although I had a few things spoiled along the way, I'm curious though as to the spoiler tags, when the title says spoiler discussion thread? Like should I spoiler tag that I think the "true" Midna was hotter than Zelda?

Anyway I finished with 17 hearts and 4 heart pieces, kind of pissed, but the finally battle against Gannon was IMO the best boss battle ever! The game took me 56+ hours to complete, and I managed to get all 24 bugs, and all the heart pieces I got without using a Players Guide of any type! I got stuck a good number of times and fell asleep for 15 minutes once too, but hey I came home from a party and it was going on 5a.m so I have an excuse, it certainly wasn't the games fault.

Ahh... When does the next one come out?

Edit: I wouldn't mind seeing sailing come back to Zelda, as long as it wasn't the main form of the game. I like riding Epona, there were a good number of times I chose to ride Epona to get from one place to the next rather than portaling. (BTW Hyrule is really really big!) But sailing could be good too, like just to get to a one or two islands off the mainland, that have specials stores or even a dungeon or a second cave of ordeals. Something along those lines, but not full out Wind Waker style, although I did enjoy that game a lot.

Kairon · « **Reply #490 on:** January 31, 2007, 02:08:35 PM »

About Midna's sexiness...

She is IMMEASURABLY sexier WITH hips and those giant eyes you can just fall into, that aggressive, exotic chinese-like highly-feminine-pitched language, that supple curvy form and that slight smirk and OH what a derriere!

...

Fifth Element tall, skinny, Eva-Green look-a-like Midna doesn't cut it.

~Carmine "Cai" M. Red
Kairon@aol.com

MarioAllStar · « **Reply #491 on:** January 31, 2007, 02:16:00 PM »

Quote
Originally posted by: MaryJane
I like riding Epona, there were a good number of times I chose to ride Epona to get from one place to the next rather than portaling. (BTW Hyrule is really really big!)

I did this a few times too. I hope next time Nintendo gives a horse to Link that the player doesn't have to press the "A" button every four seconds. It makes horse riding into chore and I end up pressing the A button rapidly because I am too lazy to time my button presses. Either Epona needs to stay faster for longer periods of time, or Nintendo should ditch the carrot/spur system.

MaryJane · « **Reply #492 on:** January 31, 2007, 02:17:43 PM »

I was actually talking about the taller one, her "true" form. The dwarf, or imp form wasn't her true form which is why she didn't want to be seen when she was in that form, I guess she was invisible when you were a wolf...

The "true" Midna actually had some boobs, and hip curve, and talk about derrier, plus how the dress she was wearing MMMMMMM mmm, leggage up the ying yang! lol

BlackNMild2k1 · « **Reply #493 on:** January 31, 2007, 06:19:58 PM »

Quote
Originally posted by: MaryJane
I can finally post in here now that tonight, I beat Zelda! I didn't want anything spoiled, although I had a few things spoiled along the way, I'm curious though as to the spoiler tags, when the title says spoiler discussion thread? Like should I spoiler tag that I think the "true" Midna was hotter than Zelda?

Just cause Spoilers are being discussed doesn't mean you need to spoil it for others that may just have a question and want to ask those that have already beaten the game. I come in here not to read whats under the spoilers, but to ask a question about where I am at in the game to let me know if I am onto something and should keep trying, or should I just move on. Nothing more & Nothing less.

P.S. I still can't get back into the Sacred Garden area to get that second bug. (I assume that is where the other half of the pair is at) Should I just move on to the desert and come back later, or should I just forget about it all together since there are no ins & outs?

MaryJane · « **Reply #494 on:** February 01, 2007, 01:33:11 AM »

Ooops, my bad. I can be inconsiderate in certain mind frames.

UltimatePartyBear · « **Reply #495 on:** February 01, 2007, 03:02:42 AM »

Quote
Originally posted by: BlackNMild2k1
P.S. I still can't get back into the Sacred Garden area to get that second bug. (I assume that is where the other half of the pair is at) Should I just move on to the desert and come back later, or should I just forget about it all together since there are no ins & outs?

If you don't want to risk spoilage, there's the gameplay strategy forum. Anyway, regarding your question: Just move on. You will have another opportunity later.

BlackNMild2k1 · « **Reply #496 on:** February 01, 2007, 04:46:36 AM »

Nobody really post in the gameplay strategy forum (there's a game play strategy forum?) often enough to get a response in a timely manner. But thanks for the answer, thats all I need to know, and it wasn't a spoler at all as it game me no details about anything. Now I can move on without worry that I missed something.

Ceric · « **Reply #497 on:** February 01, 2007, 05:29:25 AM »

The last form of Midna needs some more meat on her bones.

MaryJane · « **Reply #498 on:** February 01, 2007, 06:26:16 AM »

If she can keep the same structure, of curves Vs. flesh, then I agree, but most girls can't pull that off... although this is a video game we're talking about, lets petition Nintendo for the next game! Although I guess the changes would have to apply to Zelda, or Illia, or Saria, or Midna, or Impa, or Naboroo, or Princess Ruto, or Tetra, or Aryll it's Link's sister so SHHHHHH! or Medli or Link's next not Zelda, but shows sign of mutual attraction chick.

Are we all agreed? Man Law!

Chris1 · « **Reply #499 on:** February 03, 2007, 05:37:30 PM »

Just finished this game, and clocked in at about 58 hours, and WOW, this is one if not THE best game I’ve ever played! I seriously loved every minute of it! Thank you Nintendo! Do any of you sometimes never wanna beat the game because you don’t want to see it end? I felt that way, and to me that’s a sign of a classic! I must say that having a pointer on screen was probably one of the best things in my opinion, it added the responsive and accurate weapon aim at a moments notice, something that hasn’t been done since the 2-d games, where if you see a rupee or enemy you “fairy it” (as I call it) and shoot with your boomerang, that didn’t require z targeting or manual aiming while in 1st person mode, letting you accurately aim the bow, clawshot, boomerang ect in a split second at anything you wanted to, something not possible without the Wiimote, so that’s my opinion on a positive for that version! I have a bunch of questions, but won’t ask until I catch up on the 25 pages on this thread, maybe I’ll see it answered there.

News:

Author Topic: Twilight Princess Spoiler Discussion Thread (for those who have the game tomorrow) (Read 150460 times)