Author Topic: LOZ: 2005 (Read 720856 times)

Kenology · « **Reply #2300 on:** June 07, 2006, 03:15:25 PM »

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Originally posted by: Requiem
I don't think it killed the game, however, if they simply made the damaged recieved from enemies greater, then I think it would have been better.

^ I support that post.

I think in recent Zeldas, enemies don't take as much damage as they should. Also, if you notice, fairies fill up your *entire* life energy, instead of just the first 6 hearts like in ALttP.

The Zelda series is pretty much tailor made for me -- I swear Shiggy had me in mind when he conjured it up. I love the more cerebral games, y'know, games that make you think... have puzzles to solve. WW really let me down in that area. I never got stuck once. Not to mention that, some puzzles had the potential to be quite challenging, but then they give you a hint that practically spells it out for you. I HATE THAT!

I hope TP punishes me like the Zelda sadist I am. Atleast give us a hard mode like Fire Emblem... with a nice bonus for beating it. I think that'd be a sweet compromise.

couchmonkey · « **Reply #2301 on:** June 08, 2006, 07:18:27 AM »

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Originally posted by: IceCold
I think I've agreed with you about this earlier, but you're right. Some games (or even portions of games) I'm horrible at, and I just can't seem to understand what to do, while my friends breeze past those parts.

Ha ha, I've probably said it a few times. Going back to me thinking WW Ganon was hard for a second...after hardly dying at all the entire game, he forced me to use all my potions and fairies before I even got past the puppet part of the fight. Then he raped me in the sword fight. However, I know there are some tricks to that second part that make it easier. Even with lots of practice, I still have trouble with the caterpillar puppet, he's just too random and quick for me.

On the other hand, I never had a big problem with Ocarina's Ganon. The first phase took a little practice, but now I have no problems, and the pig phase is easy if you know how to avoid his attacks. I thought Bongo Bongo was cool, but he frustrated me at times. Hard to aim!

Edit: Kenology - yeah Wind Waker's hint system was a little blunt. I found the puzzles hard enough without help though. I can't remember, is it possible to skip the hints?

Kenology · « **Reply #2302 on:** June 08, 2006, 09:56:14 AM »

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Originally posted by: couchmonkey
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Kenology - yeah Wind Waker's hint system was a little blunt. I found the puzzles hard enough without help though. I can't remember, is it possible to skip the hints?

IIRC, some you could skip, and some you couldn't. When the crystal glows, you don't have to listen to what it has to say, but then again, you never know when it's gonna give you some general information, a subtle hint, or give you the solution to a puzzle so... *shrugs*

I want OoT: Master Quest caliber puzzles x10 w/ no hints whatsoever...

Requiem · « **Reply #2303 on:** June 08, 2006, 10:48:48 AM »

Oh god...

Master Quest -- And I thought the Water Temple was hard before *sheesh*

Bongo Bongo was rip off of the Shadow Temple boss, who was undoutably a great boss. I remember dying just so I could face him again.

NinGurl69 *huggles · « **Reply #2304 on:** June 08, 2006, 11:30:41 AM »

UM

Bongo Bongo IS the Shadow Temple Boss (Ocarina).

IceCold · « **Reply #2305 on:** June 08, 2006, 01:30:15 PM »

Yeah - I think you mean the Wind Waker boss, right Requiem? I can't remember who it was or where you fight it, but I do remember that there was a Wind Waker boss just like Bongo Bong which had hearts coming out of its nose..

NinGurl69 *huggles · « **Reply #2306 on:** June 08, 2006, 03:08:07 PM »

That was Gohdan, master of Voltron and the Universe.

Hostile Creation · « **Reply #2307 on:** June 08, 2006, 05:12:51 PM »

F-Zero GX was a pretty challenging game, to me, though I beat everything in it. But it made me curse more than any other game this generation.
Mainly I'm just bad at fighting games, having to memorize all those button sequences, and dual analogue shooters (which I'm not bad at, just not as good as the guys that play them often).

A challenge is nice, but it is by no means necessary for me to enjoy a game.

Most of the puzzles in Wind Waker, I figured out relatively easily. The puzzle solving wasn't the best I've seen in Zelda, but it was pretty good, and it made up for it in other areas. One puzzle had me stumped for days, though, and that was the following the sword trick right before the final boss. I thought it was awesome when I figured it out, but it took me a long damn time.

Gohdan was cool. I remember fighting him for the first time (I was at a friend's house, had brought it over to show him), and he shoots that mega blasts of fifty blazing energy balls, and I was like HOLY DAMN.
I actually died on him, once. Not the first time, but once I got stuck in the electricity and he kept knocking me back in with super ball beam, until I died. I think that was a second playthrough.

(By the way, I've fought the Wind Waker final boss more than fifteen times, probably more than any final boss other than Starfox 64, and definitely more than the two for boring old OoT final boss).

Kenology · « **Reply #2308 on:** June 08, 2006, 05:30:00 PM »

LOL @ Professional 666's Daisy avatars!

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Originally posted by: Professional 666
That was Gohdan, master of Voltron and the Universe.

But yeah, that was Gohdan. I remember Gohdan because he had the worst battle theme ever in a Zelda game. It's just terrible.

You can so tell Wind Waker wasn't blessed by Koji Kondo directly (aside from a few pieces).

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Originally posted by: Hostile Creation
(By the way, I've fought the Wind Waker final boss more than fifteen times, probably more than any final boss other than Starfox 64, and definitely more than the two for boring old OoT final boss).

You know, Eiji Aonuma was actually in charge of that final battle sequence. He said that he purposely made it easy because he wanted the player to be on an 'emotional high' and totally destroy Ganon. I think he succeeded, because OoT had the best final battle sequence in all the Zeldas in my opinion. He even had a request for Kondo for Ganon's final battle theme. You know that usually, Miyamoto let's the sound team do whatever the hell they want and doesn't request anything, but Aonuma asked for an epic, yet emotional piece. Of course, Kondo succeeded with "Last Battle" (it really comes alive with the live trumpet on the Re-arranged Album).

I know this is gettin' tired but, another criticism for WW... this time, about the story. How the hell does this puny little cocksucker get to wield the Master Sword to fight Ganondorf!? I know him and Zelda dipped on him, but c'mon! The very same Master Sword that Hero of Time Link had to be sealed away for seven years in order to wield and face Ganondorf! That's bullsh!t! They better do Ganondorf some serious justice in Twilight Princess, because I was disappointed that they let him lose to a couple kids in Wind Waker. Hero of Time link needed to become an adult, acquire the Master Sword, *AND* awaken the six sages just to be able to *CONTAIN* Ganondorf in the Sacred Realm. But those two little bastards just beat him like he wasn't sh!t! I didn't like that at all.

Dasmos · « **Reply #2309 on:** June 08, 2006, 05:50:27 PM »

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Originally posted by: Hostile Creation
F-Zero GX was a pretty challenging game, to me, though I beat everything in it. But it made me curse more than any other game this generation.
Mainly I'm just bad at fighting games, having to memorize all those button sequences, and dual analogue shooters (which I'm not bad at, just not as good as the guys that play them often).

A challenge is nice, but it is by no means necessary for me to enjoy a game.

I agree F-Zero was a bitch especially the Story mode, but so was Viewtiful Joe. Getting all the characters and defeating all the modes was a horrendous pain in the ass, but I love hard games.

I wouldn't mind if TP wasn'y any harder than WW, games like that don't need to be hard. It's more about the adventure and the exploration than anything else. If it was too hard, I'm quite sure it would get in of preserving this.

NinGurl69 *huggles · « **Reply #2310 on:** June 08, 2006, 05:55:40 PM »

More like a rightfully GOOD battle theme for the entire series since it was old-school and retro like Gohdan in his Tron-like digital GLORY.

Gohma-Crab ATTACK ITS WEAK POINT FOR MASSIVE DAMAGE! in the Dragoon Roost Temple had the worst theme. Slow. Boring. Simple. Weak. Much like the boss itself!

Kenology · « **Reply #2311 on:** June 08, 2006, 06:07:46 PM »

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Originally posted by: Professional 666
More like a rightfully GOOD battle theme for the entire series since it was old-school and retro like Gohdan in his Tron-like digital GLORY.

Gohma-Crab ATTACK ITS WEAK POINT FOR MASSIVE DAMAGE! in the Dragoon Roost Temple had the worst theme. Slow. Boring. Simple. Weak. Much like the boss itself!

I did like the music style they used for Gohdan. You're "old-school" and "retro" adjective were right on. It sounded almost like they were trying to emulate the NES's sound chip with that theme. But the composition was horrendous. I could'a wrote a better battle theme than that!

Ironically, Gohdan's intro theme, "Gohdan appears", was great (while it lasted).

The Dragon Roost Temple theme was just "Dodongo's Cavern" from Ocarina of Time with some added sound effects and a simple beat.

Hostile Creation · « **Reply #2312 on:** June 08, 2006, 06:24:40 PM »

Kenology, it's obvious, really. Wind Waker Link is just much more bad-ass than Ocarina of Time Link.
Plus Ganon got old and fat in the interval.

IceCold · « **Reply #2313 on:** June 08, 2006, 07:00:46 PM »

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One puzzle had me stumped for days, though, and that was the following the sword trick right before the final boss

Where you have to use Phantom Ganon's sword to break throught the wall? Heh, I remember trying all my items and then just messing around with the sword, and I was amazed when it actually worked..

Or are you talking about following the hilt of his sword underground?

Requiem · « **Reply #2314 on:** June 08, 2006, 10:49:28 PM »

Yeah... I'm a dumb-ass -- I meant Gohdan, excuse me.

Does anybody else think that Link might die in TP?

Kenology · « **Reply #2315 on:** June 09, 2006, 03:37:53 AM »

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Originally posted by: Hostile Creation
Kenology, it's obvious, really. Wind Waker Link is just much more bad-ass than Ocarina of Time Link.
Plus Ganon got old and fat in the interval.

No way, Oot Link was much better!

Hero of Time >>>>>> Hero of Winds

Though that little punk could throw down, just chalk it up to an improved battle system.

couchmonkey · « **Reply #2316 on:** June 13, 2006, 09:38:50 AM »

Wind Waker Link could wield the Master Sword because it wasn't at full power when he found it. Then he personally powered it up, so he got to wield it at full power too.

Or because, you know, it's a game, and it doesn't need logic.

Bill Aurion · « **Reply #2317 on:** June 14, 2006, 06:34:26 AM »

"Does anybody else think that Link might die in TP?"

"No way, Oot Link was much better!"

There is absolutely no contest when it comes to most badass Link...This title obviously belongs to Oracle Link...I mean, come on, he faced down 16 dungeons, 2 final bosses, Twinrova, AND Ganon...That is pure awesome...

In terms of OoT VS WW Link, WW Link had much more going against him in his game...OoT Link had always been alone, but WW Link's world was turned upside down in an instant when his sister was snatched away from him...Then he had to leave all of his friends to find her...It definitely takes a stronger mind to deal with what WW Link did...

Kenology · « **Reply #2318 on:** June 14, 2006, 09:00:16 AM »

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Originally posted by: couchmonkey
Wind Waker Link could wield the Master Sword because it wasn't at full power when he found it. Then he personally powered it up, so he got to wield it at full power too.

Or because, you know, it's a game, and it doesn't need logic.

LOL!

It's funny how you tried to rationalize it yourself *first* and then say it doesn't need logic. That's very true though. But for consistency's sake, it's not to believeable.

Athrun Zala · « **Reply #2319 on:** June 14, 2006, 09:15:25 AM »

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Originally posted by: Kenology
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Originally posted by: couchmonkey
Wind Waker Link could wield the Master Sword because it wasn't at full power when he found it. Then he personally powered it up, so he got to wield it at full power too.

Or because, you know, it's a game, and it doesn't need logic.

LOL!

It's funny how you tried to rationalize it yourself *first* and then say it doesn't need logic. That's very true though. But for consistency's sake, it's not to believeable.

I don't know, but maybe, *maybe*, the idea was to enfasize(sp?) soul and will power (and courage...) over the rest

couchmonkey · « **Reply #2320 on:** June 14, 2006, 09:51:16 AM »

My idea was to emphasize that logic and consistency have no place in Zelda (or most of Nintendo's games).

Granted, Aonuma has started bringing some more consistency into the series, but I think it will be a long time before we can expect the Zelda plot to be cohesive across all generations.

Ugh, if Link dies in Twighlight Princess, it better not be in vain. It's a game, not a movie! When I win, I want to win!

Kenology · « **Reply #2321 on:** June 14, 2006, 10:36:10 AM »

What's this about Link dying in Twilight Princess now?

couchmonkey · « **Reply #2322 on:** June 14, 2006, 10:47:58 AM »

It was just a suggestion someone made earlier. Nothing official has been said about this (and why would they, spoild the ending of the game, it would) but some people already suggested this since the game has been said to be set between The Ocarina of Time and The Wind Waker, and Wind Waker's plot says that Ganon returned sometime after The Hero of Time left, and nobody could stop him. That could be interpreted to mean that this Link is doomed.

Requiem · « **Reply #2323 on:** June 14, 2006, 12:20:23 PM »

I dont think I was the first to mention it, but Couchmonkey I think your refering to me.

Anyway, apart from the reason you gave, Aunoma did say that this would be the most melancholy of all Zeldas. He continued saying that in this game, you will feel many emotions from happiness to despair.

Plus, almost all great epics end with the hero dying (Gladiator for example).

wandering · « **Reply #2324 on:** June 14, 2006, 10:40:01 PM »

...yeah, but they're idea of melancholy is probably ending the game with Link walking down the road as slow, sad music plays. Like the end credit sequence for the Hulk.

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Author Topic: LOZ: 2005 (Read 720856 times)