Author Topic: RetroActive #19 Poll - GameCube 10th Anniversary Edition (Read 43611 times)

Jonnyboy117 · « **on:** July 25, 2011, 09:49:08 PM »

The winning game will be played and discussed by the RFN crew on an upcoming podcast (or two). We'll also open a discussion thread for NWR forum users to post their thoughts on the game; excerpts from this thread will be read on the show, as well.

Note: All of the above games should be available for $10 USD or less (used). We strongly encourage fans to find a copy of the game and play along with us!

NWR_insanolord · « **Reply #1 on:** July 25, 2011, 09:56:02 PM »

I chose Rogue Leader, because it's the only one I currently own and I've been looking for an excuse to go back and play it again. It was a launch game, but it ended up being one of the best-looking and best-playing titles the system ever saw.

broodwars · « **Reply #2 on:** July 25, 2011, 09:56:43 PM »

I know there's a real anti-RPG sentiment with Retroactive lately, but Baten Kaitos Origins is a really cool game, and one that could have some interesting conversation (especially given Jonny's history with card games.

). Plus, it's a game by Monotlith, the makers of Xenoblade, so that would make it a really timely game to discuss given all the Operation Rainfall controversy. It's also a game that very few people played, but if you're an RPG fan who owns Nintendo consoles you really should play it.

NWR_Karl · « **Reply #3 on:** July 25, 2011, 09:58:36 PM »

A vote for Killer7 is a vote for a better America.

alegoicoe · « **Reply #4 on:** July 25, 2011, 10:06:44 PM »

Out of all of the games, the only one i havent played is Baten Kaitos, am really interested in that game and how it stacks up against the few RPGs the gamecube library has.

Jet Pilot · « **Reply #5 on:** July 25, 2011, 10:09:18 PM »

I vote for Killer 7 because that game is so weird that it will inevitably result in an interesting discussion.

Schadenfreude · « **Reply #6 on:** July 25, 2011, 10:22:09 PM »

The second Baten Kaitos? Ah crap, I wish I could retract my vote.

Pajamas · « **Reply #7 on:** July 25, 2011, 10:24:54 PM »

I'd say go for Rogue Squadron II. Easy to pick up and play, and it was a launch title. It'll give me a reason to finally get around to playing it.

broodwars · « **Reply #8 on:** July 25, 2011, 10:25:51 PM »

Quote from: Schadenfreude on July 25, 2011, 10:22:09 PM

The second Baten Kaitos? Ah crap, I wish I could retract my vote.

You can. There's a button on the poll for it, but you really shouldn't if you haven't played the game. IMO, it makes the original Baten Kaitos look like an amateur hour production (especially on the localization).

NESticales · « **Reply #9 on:** July 25, 2011, 10:56:23 PM »

Killer 7! I've always wanted to play this game and I think this would be great to hear all your opinions and experiences.

NWR_Neal · « **Reply #10 on:** July 25, 2011, 10:58:38 PM »

I'm predicting before I vote: Rogue Leader will win. Putting Star Wars in this vote makes it generally no contest, especially since it is way more fondly remembered than the other four, slightly divisive games. I predict talk about this game will not get much more than "Wow, this game is still awesome. It looks better than most Wii games."

I'd love to hear talk about Baten Kaitos: Origins, Wario World, or Killer 7. It won't happen, though. Star Wars wins.

broodwars · « **Reply #11 on:** July 25, 2011, 11:11:08 PM »

Quote from: NWR_Neal on July 25, 2011, 10:58:38 PM

I'm predicting before I vote: Rogue Leader will win. Putting Star Wars in this vote makes it generally no contest, especially since it is way more fondly remembered than the other four, slightly divisive games. I predict talk about this game will not get much more than "Wow, this game is still awesome. It looks better than most Wii games."

I don't know. The Star Wars factor is big, but I think Killer 7's going to win. It has had the endorsement of several NWR staffers in the past on RFN, and I think that'll pull it through. Then everyone will have a chance to talk about how terrible a game it is, how much an "acid trip" it is, how little the story makes sense, etc.

frostybro24 · « **Reply #12 on:** July 25, 2011, 11:16:32 PM »

not crazy about trying killer 7 or replaying warioworld, but id love a good rpg to sink my teeth into while i wait for tales of the abyss and paper mario. baten kaitos all the way!

Shaymin · « **Reply #13 on:** July 25, 2011, 11:39:10 PM »

I voted BK:O since I'm hoping it'll lead to a crossover between RFN and 8-4 Play.

TJ Spyke · « **Reply #14 on:** July 25, 2011, 11:53:42 PM »

I liked Rogue Squadron II, but I feel it has been discussed many times before. I went with Wario World, partially to give me an excuse to finally play it.

NWR_insanolord · « **Reply #15 on:** July 25, 2011, 11:54:30 PM »

Did we change it so you can see the results of the voting now or can I just see that because I'm staff?

TJ Spyke · « **Reply #16 on:** July 25, 2011, 11:55:01 PM »

The results do now show up (at least to me).

UncleBob · « **Reply #17 on:** July 25, 2011, 11:58:18 PM »

Quote from: NWR_insanolord on July 25, 2011, 11:54:30 PM

Did we change it so you can see the results of the voting now or can I just see that because I'm staff?

Because you're staff. Shh.

NWR_insanolord · « **Reply #18 on:** July 26, 2011, 12:02:25 AM »

Neal's right (and I'm not just saying that because he gave me that big, juicy promotion). Star Wars will most likely win, and there isn't anything really interesting to say about it. I don't agree with his decision to cowardly give in to the public's will and refuse to fight for what he believes in.

I have removed my vote from Rogue Leader, and I encourage everyone else to do so as well. This feature isn't supposed to be about patting a universally praised game on the back. It's supposed to be about looking deeper into something that hadn't gotten that treatment before.

I don't know what I'll vote for, but I'm open to arguments. I just want a good discussion, and I don't think we'd get that from Rogue Leader.

NWR_Neal · « **Reply #19 on:** July 26, 2011, 12:21:20 AM »

Quote from: NWR_insanolord on July 26, 2011, 12:02:25 AM

I don't agree with his decision to cowardly give in to the public's will and refuse to fight for what he believes in.

I don't know what you're talking about. I voted for Wario World.

Ceric · « **Reply #20 on:** July 26, 2011, 12:34:04 AM »

I voted Baten Kaitos Origin. I don't have that game and its the one most interested in. Now I do want Battalion Wars to come up in Retroactive because I think their can be some serious fun discussion with it. Though it did break my Cube like F-Zero would and Prime 2.

NWR_insanolord · « **Reply #21 on:** July 26, 2011, 12:56:26 AM »

Quote from: NWR_Neal on July 26, 2011, 12:21:20 AM

Quote from: NWR_insanolord on July 26, 2011, 12:02:25 AM
I don't agree with his decision to cowardly give in to the public's will and refuse to fight for what he believes in.

I don't know what you're talking about. I voted for Wario World.

I figured you didn't vote for it yourself, but you needed to make more of an effort to convince everyone else to do so as well. Either that, or rig the poll so whatever one you want will win (which is still an option).

Jonnyboy117 · « **Reply #22 on:** July 26, 2011, 01:03:53 AM »

To clarify the nominees: Rogue Leader was my idea. I haven't played it since launch era, and I have a feeling that it may be more flawed than most of us remember. It also has the potential to draw in James since he loves flight games so much. However, I am also interested in playing all the other choices (even Killer 7... sort of). Note that I do not vote in these and am not advocating for any particular game, just explaining why a Star Wars game made the list.

TalesOfFan · « **Reply #23 on:** July 26, 2011, 01:26:23 AM »

I've had Killer 7 sitting in my backlog for sometime now. I really need a good excuse to pull it out, and I'd love to play it along with Shadows of the Damned to compare the two.

TheYoungerPlumber · « **Reply #24 on:** July 26, 2011, 02:12:32 AM »

*sniff* No Billy Hatcher? I guess there just wasn't support amongst the RFN staff for this overlooked platformer.... I think any of these (barring Wario World--sorry Greg) would make for interesting discussion.

Killer_Man_Jaro · « **Reply #25 on:** July 26, 2011, 02:37:03 AM »

Good to see that you picked some of the more obscure Gamecube titles. Before I go on, I'd like to issue a public health warning: if you voted for Killer 7 having not played it before, remove the vote, then wash your hands thoroughly. I played it briefly on a friend's PS2, and it is total dreck. Those who voted for it having already played it, we may have already lost you. You have been warned, forums. (Now I'm worried Karl will edit this post out of spite.)

I'll vote for Star Wars: Rogue Leader because I never had a chance to try it - does it still live up to everyone's fond memories? I think Battalion Wars would also be an interesting discussion, but based on the comments so far, it has no resonance with people.

And for the record, TYP, if Billy Hatcher were on the poll, that would get my vote. It is a curious title with a bizarro twist on platforming that everyone owes to themselves to play.

TJ Spyke · « **Reply #26 on:** July 26, 2011, 02:41:52 AM »

I played the demo of Billy Hatcher and the Giant Egg that was included on the Nintendo GameCube Preview Disc and I didn't like the controls. It's what caused me to not buy the game.

Plugabugz · « **Reply #27 on:** July 26, 2011, 05:52:02 AM »

I can't wait for the Games that are Probably Better in the Past Retroactive Edition, and we can fill it up with such gems as

Spyro Wii
Crash Bandicoot on GCN

and so on...

Crimm · « **Reply #28 on:** July 26, 2011, 09:04:47 AM »

I'm a big proponent for Baten Kaitos: Origins. It had the extreme misfortune of coming out after the Wii launched. I'm not sure the game holds the same value if you haven't played its predecessor, but it is fantastic. The decision to limit the cast to three characters, something that RPGs haven't done in a while, does allow them to focus on just those characters without any waste like providing us the backstory of Ghibari.

Who cares!? He fights giant skyfish with an oar and is sporting a Vanilla Ice haircut.

Lithium · « **Reply #29 on:** July 26, 2011, 10:20:51 AM »

Quote from: Jet Pilot on July 25, 2011, 10:09:18 PM

I vote for Killer 7 because that game is so weird that it will inevitably result in an interesting discussion.

same here, It's a really polarizing game. Personally I love it but even if they hate it that retroactive will still be very entertaining to listen to.

adadad · « **Reply #30 on:** July 26, 2011, 10:28:38 AM »

I don't have a Gamecube so unfortunately I won't be able to actively participate in this like I did with Perfect Dark (probably a relief for some considering my essays in that Retroactive thread). I would've loved to play Baten Kaitos Origins back when it came out, but unfortunately it never made it to Europe. That was a real shame, since I thought the first game was enjoyable, if a bit marred by the horrendous voice acting.

I never completed Killer 7, always wanted to though, I thought it was a really good game so I might vote for it anyway. Story is batshit insane, but that's part of the charm. I was disappointed with No More Heroes and think this is far superior gameplay-wise. Despite the crude controls I actually think it plays well and the levels are well-designed. Plus the music - who can forget Rave On?! The concept of running through a completely empty room with that music going was a fantastic way to get pumped for the boss battles.

noname2200 · « **Reply #31 on:** July 26, 2011, 02:24:58 PM »

Rogue Leader's the only game on the list that I played, and while it's a good flight game I can't think it'd be as fun to discuss as Killer 7. As a fan of good gameplay and lucid stories I already know I won't get past the first hour, but I'm curious enough to hear others' thoughts that I'll vote for it.

Yoshidious · « **Reply #32 on:** July 26, 2011, 02:48:09 PM »

Quote from: NWR_Neal on July 25, 2011, 10:58:38 PM

Rogue Leader will win. I predict talk about this game will not get much more than "Wow, this game is still awesome. It looks better than most Wii games."

I find your lack of faith in our ability to generate a good discussion disturbing...

NJha01 · « **Reply #33 on:** July 26, 2011, 03:29:17 PM »

I choose batallion wars just for Karl....

NWR_Neal · « **Reply #34 on:** July 26, 2011, 03:38:07 PM »

Prove me wrong, Leahy! Prove me wrong! (srsly, do it.)

NWR_Karl · « **Reply #35 on:** July 26, 2011, 04:19:34 PM »

Quote from: NJha01 on July 26, 2011, 03:29:17 PM

I choose batallion wars just for Karl....

Wrong Battalion Wars, I'm afraid. I didn't (not) review the GameCube iteration.

Yoshidious · « **Reply #36 on:** July 26, 2011, 04:21:59 PM »

Quote from: NWR_Neal on July 26, 2011, 03:38:07 PM

Prove me wrong, Leahy! Prove me wrong! (srsly, do it.)

I already have--clearly, I'll be far too busy spouting random quotes from the movies to be trotting out tired old lines about how much better Rogue Leader looks than most Wii games.

NWR_insanolord · « **Reply #37 on:** July 26, 2011, 04:53:41 PM »

I take back what I said: if Greg will spend the entire discussion spouting random Star Wars quotes and references, this will be the best RetroActive ever.

NWR_Neal · « **Reply #38 on:** July 26, 2011, 05:33:32 PM »

You know, I might just change my vote to Rogue Leader to hear Greg spout Star Wars quotes incessantly...

Crimm · « **Reply #39 on:** July 26, 2011, 06:35:53 PM »

Quote from: NWR_insanolord on July 26, 2011, 04:53:41 PM

I take back what I said: if Greg will spend the entire discussion spouting random Star Wars quotes and references, this will be the best RetroActive ever.

I will ruin this by quoting Anakin circa Episode I the entire time.

Try me.

broodwars · « **Reply #40 on:** July 26, 2011, 06:38:22 PM »

While I wouldn't like Rogue Leader to win because I don't think there's much interesting discussion to be had there beyond just throwing Star Wars quotes around, I can at least understand why people would pick that game. It's a good game. But for all you guys voting Killer 7, I just see that discussion going like the Ninja Spirit one did: people voted for the game, and then no one talked about it or played it because the game was just not worth playing. You already know the game is terrible, so do you really need 1-2 hours of people repeatedly stating that?

Crimm · « **Reply #41 on:** July 26, 2011, 06:40:53 PM »

I don't think Killer7 is TERRIBLE, but Goichi Suda really needed someone to come in and make his gameplay for him. And now he has that.

Lithium · « **Reply #42 on:** July 26, 2011, 06:41:07 PM »

Quote from: broodwars on July 26, 2011, 06:38:22 PM

While I wouldn't like Rogue Leader to win because I don't think there's much interesting discussion to be had there beyond just throwing Star Wars quotes around, I can at least understand why people would pick that game. It's a good game. But for all you guys voting Killer 7, I just see that discussion going like the Ninja Spirit one did: people voted for the game, and then no one talked about it or played it because the game was just not worth playing. You already know the game is terrible, so do you really need 1-2 hours of people repeatedly stating that?

I actually think Killer 7 is a great game

Crimm · « **Reply #43 on:** July 26, 2011, 06:41:44 PM »

Quote from: Lithium on July 26, 2011, 06:41:07 PM

Quote from: broodwars on July 26, 2011, 06:38:22 PM
While I wouldn't like Rogue Leader to win because I don't think there's much interesting discussion to be had there beyond just throwing Star Wars quotes around, I can at least understand why people would pick that game. It's a good game. But for all you guys voting Killer 7, I just see that discussion going like the Ninja Spirit one did: people voted for the game, and then no one talked about it or played it because the game was just not worth playing. You already know the game is terrible, so do you really need 1-2 hours of people repeatedly stating that?

I actually think Killer 7 is a great game

It takes all kinds...

Traveller · « **Reply #44 on:** July 26, 2011, 08:02:44 PM »

Quote from: TheYoungerPlumber on July 26, 2011, 02:12:32 AM

*sniff* No Billy Hatcher? I guess there just wasn't support amongst the RFN staff for this overlooked platformer.... I think any of these (barring Wario World--sorry Greg) would make for interesting discussion.

Billy Hatcher was quite good, although in places the frame rate was a little bad. It was built on the Sonic Adventure engine.

gojira · « **Reply #45 on:** July 26, 2011, 08:09:00 PM »

I've rented both Battalion Wars games and didn't find either all that interesting. Star Wars was a fun game, but I have no real desire to play it again. I am kinda interested in Wario. I love the character and I love Treasure, but I rented the game back in the day and wasn't too impressed.

I think Killer 7 is a great game. And I think there's a lot to talk about. But I'm going to vote for Baten Kaitos: Origins. I loved the first game and always meant to get around to buying and playing Origins.

Jonnyboy117 · « **Reply #46 on:** July 26, 2011, 09:06:41 PM »

When I first started thinking about this RetroActive, one of the main reasons for doing it was Billy Hatcher and TYP's frequent recommendations for it. Then it got overlooked, even in the poll. Sorry! We will at least include it as a nominee one of these days.

Halbred · « **Reply #47 on:** July 26, 2011, 10:01:40 PM »

If Baten Kaitos wins, I will give up on all of you, and suggest an Inevitable RetroActive Rule: if an RPG is present on a RetroActive poll, it will undoubtedly win, no matter its calibur.

Star Wars, goddamnit. It looks better than most Wii games. Also, it's STAR WARS.

Shaymin · « **Reply #48 on:** July 26, 2011, 10:15:14 PM »

There's always a bigger fish...

Sundoulos · « **Reply #49 on:** July 26, 2011, 11:36:12 PM »

Rogue Leader gets my vote as well. I miss Factor 5!

I've always loved any type of space combat simulation...it's a game type that hasn't been discussed in a Retroactive and, for the most part, is largely absent (or at least under-represented) in modern gaming.

broodwars · « **Reply #50 on:** July 27, 2011, 12:08:53 AM »

Killer 7, I knew it would be you. I smelled your foul stench when I was brought onboard.

Sundoulos · « **Reply #51 on:** July 27, 2011, 12:23:13 AM »

Quote from: Jonnyboy117 on July 26, 2011, 09:06:41 PM

When I first started thinking about this RetroActive, one of the main reasons for doing it was Billy Hatcher and TYP's frequent recommendations for it. Then it got overlooked, even in the poll. Sorry! We will at least include it as a nominee one of these days.

"Commander, tear this ship apart until you've found that game, and bring me the other nominees! I want them alive!"

Okay...so that was a stretch.

King of Twitch · « **Reply #52 on:** July 27, 2011, 12:59:11 AM »

All you people that love role-playing so much why don't you call an escort service and leave video games to genres that are actually fun?

When it comes down to a game where you "fight" enemies and grind up your "stats" through card "battles" versus a game where you fly through space and take down space stations the size of moons, how could you not VOTE STAR WARS

broodwars · « **Reply #53 on:** July 27, 2011, 01:14:03 AM »

Quote from: Zap on July 27, 2011, 12:59:11 AM

All you people that love role-playing so much why don't you call an escort service and leave video games to genres that are actually fun?

Oh, you mean like genres where you spend hours on end continuously flying around in circles shooting at the asses of other planes until either you succeed, Darth Bob manages to fly into you, or you fall asleep from boredom?

(and for the record, that was facetious)

FZeroBoyo · « **Reply #54 on:** July 27, 2011, 08:48:31 AM »

As noted before, Star Wars pretty much gives Rogue Leader a boost, but who knows? We may have another upset on our hands...

Also if it's not Killer7, Karl's going to hate all of us. (I think.)

Ceric · « **Reply #55 on:** July 27, 2011, 09:17:39 AM »

Quote from: Zap on July 27, 2011, 12:59:11 AM

All you people that love role-playing so much why don't you call an escort service and leave video games to genres that are actually fun?

When it comes down to a game where you "fight" enemies and grind up your "stats" through card "battles" versus a game where you fly through space and take down space stations the size of moons, how could you not VOTE STAR WARS

Star wars... Psshhhh.... Battalion Wars is an action game... Yours is just a flight sim. BW has funny little men shooting at each other.

Quote from: Halbred on July 26, 2011, 10:01:40 PM

If Baten Kaitos wins, I will give up on all of you, and suggest an Inevitable RetroActive Rule: if an RPG is present on a RetroActive poll, it will undoubtedly win, no matter its calibur.

Star Wars, goddamnit. It looks better than most Wii games. Also, it's STAR WARS.

I think that is good evidence that at least the people who do retroactive would by an RPG on the Wii.

So I went back to my Madden thread to get some stats to interact with Neal with and I realized I should do something similar for these games on the retroactive poll. Here is an easy set of links to all the content on the site that has been tagged for these games (Notice RFN isn't in any of the Killer 7 taggings which I can't believe.)

Battalion Wars (Lasse Pallesen 7.5)
Killer 7 (Karl Casteneda 9)
Baten Kaitos Origins (Michael "TYP" Cole 8 | Zosha Arushan 8)
Star Wars Rogue Squadron II: Rogue Leader (Jonathan Metts 9 | David Trammell 9)
Wario World (Michael "TYP" Cole 6)

happyastoria · « **Reply #56 on:** July 27, 2011, 02:15:24 PM »

Killer 7, baby!

Crimm · « **Reply #57 on:** July 27, 2011, 05:12:57 PM »

Let's be clear, any review of Killer 7 that gives it a 9 is wrong. Reviews are opinion, but that's just not accurate.

And I like the game, but you have to acknowledge the gameplay is not the kind of material that earns a 9.

Ceric · « **Reply #58 on:** July 27, 2011, 05:49:56 PM »

Quote from: Crimm on July 27, 2011, 05:12:57 PM

Let's be clear, any review of Killer 7 that gives it a 9 is wrong. Reviews are opinion, but that's just not accurate.

And I like the game, but you have to acknowledge the gameplay is not the kind of material that earns a 9.

I remember making a similar argument at one point and being told that reviews can't be compared between the reviewers own portfolio and that the number is ethereal nothingness and the text only matters.

NWR_Karl · « **Reply #59 on:** July 27, 2011, 05:55:13 PM »

I gave Killer 7 a 9/10 because I had an awesome time with it, specifically for the reasons outlined in the review.

Speaking of, I actually posted that review six years ago today.

Ceric · « **Reply #60 on:** July 27, 2011, 06:32:53 PM »

Quote from: NWR_Karl on July 27, 2011, 05:55:13 PM

I gave Killer 7 a 9/10 because I had an awesome time with it, specifically for the reasons outlined in the review.

Speaking of, I actually posted that review six years ago today.

7 would have been an awesome coincidence.

broodwars · « **Reply #61 on:** July 27, 2011, 06:45:11 PM »

Quote from: Ceric on July 27, 2011, 06:32:53 PM

Quote from: NWR_Karl on July 27, 2011, 05:55:13 PM
I gave Killer 7 a 9/10 because I had an awesome time with it, specifically for the reasons outlined in the review.

Speaking of, I actually posted that review six years ago today.
7 would have been an awesome coincidence.

No more than his review being published on the twenty-seventh day of the seventh month of the year 2005 (which contains the numbers 2 and 5, which combine together to make the number seven).

Perhaps that date has special significance as the junction point for all space and time. Or maybe it's just an amazing coincidence.

NWR_Neal · « **Reply #62 on:** July 27, 2011, 08:20:29 PM »

Quote from: Crimm on July 27, 2011, 05:12:57 PM

Let's be clear, any review of Killer 7 that gives it a 9 is wrong. Reviews are opinion, but that's just not accurate.

And I like the game, but you have to acknowledge the gameplay is not the kind of material that earns a 9.

That's the James we all know and love! Telling people they're totally wrong when their opinions don't match his! Wait for the SNES 20th Anniversary when he says that Super Metroid isn't one of the system's best games, and that it is a matter of fact that some Japanese RPG that 30 people played is far superior!

Though, to be honest, I could give two shits about Killer 7. It's wacky and stuff, but the story never gripped me and the gameplay was pitiful. I totally defend Karl's review despite not agreeing with it, because he soundly makes the case for Killer 7 being a 9/10 for him.

NWR_insanolord · « **Reply #63 on:** July 27, 2011, 10:06:55 PM »

James and I should team up. He can troll Super Metroid while I troll Super Mario World and Link to the Past. We can alienate everyone who reads the site.

marty · « **Reply #64 on:** July 28, 2011, 09:01:37 AM »

I apparently bought Killer7 on Dec 7, 2005 and paid $32.42 for it.

Ceric · « **Reply #65 on:** July 28, 2011, 09:48:12 AM »

Quote from: NWR_insanolord on July 27, 2011, 10:06:55 PM

James and I should team up. He can troll Super Metroid while I troll Super Mario World and Link to the Past. We can alienate everyone who reads the site.

Wait, You're not already doing that?

Yoshidious · « **Reply #66 on:** July 28, 2011, 03:23:33 PM »

Quote from: NWR_Neal on July 26, 2011, 05:33:32 PM

You know, I might just change my vote to Rogue Leader to hear Greg spout Star Wars quotes incessantly...

To a dark place, this line of thought will carry us...

Quote from: broodwars on July 27, 2011, 06:45:11 PM

Perhaps that date has special significance as the junction point for all space and time. Or maybe it's just an amazing coincidence.

Be careful of mixing in Back to the Future quotes with Star Wars quotes. Before long, you'll end up with Darth Sidious saying "You're fulfilling your density, Anakin."

broodwars · « **Reply #67 on:** July 28, 2011, 03:26:16 PM »

Quote from: Yoshidious on July 28, 2011, 03:23:33 PM

Be careful of mixing in Back to the Future quotes with Star Wars quotes. Before long, you'll end up with Darth Sidious saying "You're fulfilling your density, Anakin."

Hah! I was wondering if someone would catch that reference.

And then you go and miss a chance to drop a "My name is Darth Vader! I'm an extraterrestrial from the planet Vulcan!" reference in response.

:

Traveller · « **Reply #68 on:** July 28, 2011, 07:19:29 PM »

Noo Killer 7

Granted I have only played a small amount of it, but its such a clunky game..

AV · « **Reply #69 on:** July 28, 2011, 10:51:56 PM »

I rented Killer 7 and liked it, and bought it for $10 at Best Buy and never touched it and sold it back . It was too odd to keep going, so i'm curious what happens after the first hour in.

Fatty The Hutt · « **Reply #70 on:** July 29, 2011, 12:29:29 PM »

I voted Killer 7.
It'll be fun to hear Jonny (and James) bitch about it. But it'll be even better if Karl is on the 'cast. If Killer 7 wins, Karl must be brought in!!

Also, I own the game but have barely played it. So, there's that too.

Ceric · « **Reply #71 on:** July 29, 2011, 01:10:41 PM »

Quote from: Fatty_The_Hutt on July 29, 2011, 12:29:29 PM

I voted Killer 7.
It'll be fun to hear Jonny (and James) bitch about it. But it'll be even better if Karl is on the 'cast. If Killer 7 wins, Karl must be brought in!!

Also, I own the game but have barely played it. So, there's that too.

You know I'll bet you could just go to past episodes and get all the Karl Soundbytes you need to have it almost like he was there for that game.

leahsdad · « **Reply #72 on:** July 30, 2011, 04:00:51 AM »

I voted Killer 7.

The irony (and allure) of this Gamecube Retroactive is that I never owned a Gamecube. I sort of gave up on Nintendo after the N64, and I owned a Dreamcast and, later, a PS2. So I definitely have some catching up to do.

Robknoxious1 · « **Reply #73 on:** July 30, 2011, 10:54:49 AM »

I voted for Wario World before reading any of the comments. Looks like I may be the only one =P

I've never played it but have been wanting to pick up a used copy recently.

TJ Spyke · « **Reply #74 on:** July 30, 2011, 03:47:21 PM »

No, I also voted for it.

Schadenfreude · « **Reply #75 on:** July 30, 2011, 05:57:36 PM »

Quote from: broodwars on July 25, 2011, 10:25:51 PM

Quote from: Schadenfreude on July 25, 2011, 10:22:09 PM
The second Baten Kaitos? Ah crap, I wish I could retract my vote.

You can. There's a button on the poll for it, but you really shouldn't if you haven't played the game. IMO, it makes the original Baten Kaitos look like an amateur hour production (especially on the localization).

I own the first one and haven't played it while I don't own the second one. I retract my vote for Star Wars!

holtman · « **Reply #76 on:** July 31, 2011, 06:05:14 PM »

Well it look like I'm the only one who voted for Battalion wars

Da Jarvis · « **Reply #77 on:** August 01, 2011, 09:49:06 PM »

I voted for killer7 and here is why: I have been playing a lot of Catherine and No More Heroes, so a game this wierd is in my taste right now. Plus, it might be interesting to hear the staff talk about such a wierd game. IDK, it's a personal preference really xD

Jonnyboy117 · « **Reply #78 on:** August 02, 2011, 08:49:51 PM »

Reminder: voting closes Thursday afternoon! If you've been waffling, it's time to decide. Thanks to everyone for making this a new record for fan participation in RetroActive!

motang · « **Reply #79 on:** August 02, 2011, 08:52:46 PM »

I vote for Battalion Wars, even though the driving mechanics in that game was broken!

TJ Spyke · « **Reply #80 on:** August 02, 2011, 08:53:12 PM »

What was the previous record?

ShyGuy · « **Reply #81 on:** August 03, 2011, 02:35:15 AM »

I stand with Karl and the 7 Killers!

NWR_insanolord · « **Reply #82 on:** August 03, 2011, 03:09:38 AM »

I have thrown my support behind Killer 7, because I probably wouldn't take part in this regardless of what wins, and Killer 7 seems to me to be easily the most entertaining of the five to listen to other people talk about playing without playing myself. Also, Crimm is against it, so I didn't really have another option.

5kytar · « **Reply #83 on:** August 03, 2011, 10:25:16 AM »

I like Wario... I'd actually like to replay this game. I think it was funny how it was made by treasure. No wonder the bosses were so creative.

ShyGuy · « **Reply #84 on:** August 04, 2011, 12:22:02 AM »

If Killer7 Wins, does Karl get to do a guest segment?

Ceric · « **Reply #85 on:** August 04, 2011, 08:13:20 AM »

Quote from: ShyGuy on August 04, 2011, 12:22:02 AM

If Killer7 Wins, does Karl get to do a guest segment?

I still think it be funnier just to edit in his opinions from other RFN's and Newscasts.

Sundoulos · « **Reply #86 on:** August 04, 2011, 08:39:40 AM »

Vote Rogue Leader; it should win!

Search your feelings--you know it to be true!

NWR_Neal · « **Reply #87 on:** August 04, 2011, 12:31:46 PM »

Polls are closing soon. Will your vote matter? Find out by voting!

gbuell · « **Reply #88 on:** August 04, 2011, 01:45:26 PM »

KILLER 7. PLEASE.

Nintendad · « **Reply #89 on:** August 04, 2011, 04:32:33 PM »

I voted for Baten Kaitos Origins. It's a good rpg. However, I liked the first one better because of the battle system. It's probably the only rpg I've ever played in which I purposely looked for battles because the battle system was so much fun. Hated the changes they made to it for Origins.

noname2200 · « **Reply #90 on:** August 04, 2011, 05:39:38 PM »

Quote from: NWR_Neal on August 04, 2011, 12:31:46 PM

Polls are closing soon. Will your vote matter? Find out by voting!

That line only works on me in November!

ShyGuy · « **Reply #91 on:** August 04, 2011, 07:50:27 PM »

This hype is killing me. Can we get a hint?

NWR_Neal · « **Reply #92 on:** August 04, 2011, 08:20:55 PM »

Quote from: ShyGuy on August 04, 2011, 07:50:27 PM

This hype is killing me. Can we get a hint?

No.

Shaymin · « **Reply #93 on:** August 04, 2011, 08:40:27 PM »

Spoilers: James employed admin abuse to shift every Killer 7 vote to BK:O

Ceric · « **Reply #94 on:** August 04, 2011, 08:43:04 PM »

Noooo... It should be a Shift to Battalion Wars.

TheYoungerPlumber · « **Reply #95 on:** August 04, 2011, 10:52:06 PM »

What I vote for never seems to win. Oh well.

Jonnyboy117 · « **Reply #96 on:** August 05, 2011, 12:54:11 AM »

This is why we can't have nice things.

TJ Spyke · « **Reply #97 on:** August 05, 2011, 12:58:14 AM »

Bah, I never picked up Killer 7 because it got mediocre reviews and in on-rails. I am sure the discussion will be good, but I have no interest in the game and won't pick it up unless I see it for like $3 or $4.

TheYoungerPlumber · « **Reply #98 on:** August 05, 2011, 12:59:36 AM »

Yeah, there's been plenty of discussion of Killer 7 already on RFN, albeit mostly by Karl. I know far less about the other games in this poll, save for BK:O which I own and have played.

Why the RFN crew decided to include Killer 7 in this poll, I do not know. That said, I will be curious to hear about the game's bizarre anecdotes.

Sundoulos · « **Reply #99 on:** August 05, 2011, 01:04:33 AM »

This is an argument against ochlocracy if I've ever seen one.

NWR_insanolord · « **Reply #100 on:** August 05, 2011, 01:13:51 AM »

Quote from: Jonnyboy117 on August 05, 2011, 12:54:11 AM

This is why we can't have nice things.

Really, you had to know Killer 7 would win when you put it in there. This is all on you.

In fact, I'm pretty sure this was a conspiracy to give them an excuse to get rid of the voting entirely and just pick the games themselves. Which I wholeheartedly endorse.

TJ Spyke · « **Reply #101 on:** August 05, 2011, 01:15:32 AM »

I am sure the RFN crew felt that way after RPG's won like 3 RetroActive's in a row (in fact, I remember at that point they said they were just gonna pick the next one themselves rather than have a poll).

broodwars · « **Reply #102 on:** August 05, 2011, 01:19:12 AM »

Well, I'd better see 38 individual posters following on the RetroActive thread for this game. You voted for the shitty game, and now you should have to suffer the consequences of your choice and actually play it.

Ugh...I totally predicted this. There is nothing worth talking about with this game, and now I suppose I'll be skipping half of RFN for the next few weeks. I already know it's a terrible game with little if any redeeming value, made by one of the most incompetent game designers to walk the earth. I don't need 3 hours of radio to remind me of it.

NWR_insanolord · « **Reply #103 on:** August 05, 2011, 01:20:50 AM »

Quote from: broodwars on August 05, 2011, 01:19:12 AM

Well, I'd better see 38 individual posters following on the RetroActive thread for this game.

You won't, because I just voted for it to spite Crimm and have no intention of playing along.

ShyGuy · « **Reply #104 on:** August 05, 2011, 01:27:04 AM »

Yay! This is revenge for Magic the Gathering and Bill Belichick!

broodwars · « **Reply #105 on:** August 05, 2011, 01:29:11 AM »

I just hope that Baten Kaitos Origins doesn't get completely screwed-over in the 2nd chance poll by being thrown in with 3-4 extremely well-known titles that will just bury it. It's an outstanding game that, unlike Killer 7, actually deserves a 2nd look by Nintendo fans since it has been so overlooked over the years.

Killer_Man_Jaro · « **Reply #106 on:** August 05, 2011, 01:44:26 AM »

Quote from: broodwars on August 05, 2011, 01:19:12 AM

Ugh...I totally predicted this. There is nothing worth talking about with this game, and now I suppose I'll be skipping half of RFN for the next few weeks. I already know it's a terrible game with little if any redeeming value, made by one of the most incompetent game designers to walk the earth. I don't need 3 hours of radio to remind me of it.

Sorry guys, but I completely agree. It made no sense that Killer7 featured in the poll at all when people's distaste for it had come up on the podcast multiple times. Honestly, the joke's on all of you who voted for it, especially those playing it for the first time because you're paying hard-earned money to track down a copy. It truly is an awful game. Now I know RetroActive works well when there are qualities and flaws to discuss, but a line needs to be drawn somewhere to maintain some modicum of enjoyment out of playing the game. Killer7 has no such qualities.

NWR_Karl · « **Reply #107 on:** August 05, 2011, 06:39:09 AM »

OH HO HO.

adadad · « **Reply #108 on:** August 05, 2011, 08:03:08 AM »

I'm surprised to see such a negative reaction to Killer 7 winning. But while I'm sure some of those votes were registered for shits and giggles, there have also been people in this thread who have said that Killer 7 is a GOOD game, myself included. It may not be to everyone's tastes, but I hope that this Retroactive will encourage people to go back, give this game another chance, and maybe they'll be able to appreciate it for what it does well. Primarily for me, looking back, what sold it on me was primarily its unique art-house aesthetic and atmosphere.

I'm relieved that Origins hasn't won it, there have been enough RPGs discussed in previous Retroactives. They're too long, and we saw what occurred in the Mother 3 thread - lots of spoilerific discussion around the story, and the discussion on RFN ended up feeling incomplete for not addressing it, although it's understandable why it was left out.

gbuell · « **Reply #109 on:** August 05, 2011, 08:16:52 AM »

I'm so happy right now. Killer 7 is a wonderful game and people who hate it should be sent to the gulag.

Ceric · « **Reply #110 on:** August 05, 2011, 08:33:02 AM »

I'm hoping Battalion Wars gets a more favorable poll next time.

NWR_Karl · « **Reply #111 on:** August 05, 2011, 09:08:37 AM »

Quote from: TheYoungerPlumber on August 05, 2011, 12:59:36 AM

Yeah, there's been plenty of discussion of Killer 7 already on RFN, albeit mostly by Karl. I know far less about the other games in this poll, save for BK:O which I own and have played.

Why the RFN crew decided to include Killer 7 in this poll, I do not know. That said, I will be curious to hear about the game's bizarre anecdotes.

This is actually untrue. Killer 7 came out a full year before RFN began - every time it's been brought up on the show, it's always been in passing (or as a slight on me). There's never really been a comprehensive discussion on it.

Clearly they included it for the right reasons. They put it on the ballot, and the people have spoken. Decision justified.

gbuell · « **Reply #112 on:** August 05, 2011, 10:00:30 AM »

Karl, are you joining the discussion?

marty · « **Reply #113 on:** August 05, 2011, 10:42:23 AM »

hahah, I'm glad k7 won. It's barely functional and completely terrible.

Lithium · « **Reply #114 on:** August 05, 2011, 10:44:11 AM »

Quote from: adadad on August 05, 2011, 08:03:08 AM

I'm surprised to see such a negative reaction to Killer 7 winning. But while I'm sure some of those votes were registered for shits and giggles, there have also been people in this thread who have said that Killer 7 is a GOOD game, myself included. It may not be to everyone's tastes, but I hope that this Retroactive will encourage people to go back, give this game another chance, and maybe they'll be able to appreciate it for what it does well. Primarily for me, looking back, what sold it on me was primarily its unique art-house aesthetic and atmosphere.

I'm relieved that Origins hasn't won it, there have been enough RPGs discussed in previous Retroactives. They're too long, and we saw what occurred in the Mother 3 thread - lots of spoilerific discussion around the story, and the discussion on RFN ended up feeling incomplete for not addressing it, although it's understandable why it was left out.

Couldn't have said it better myself

Quote from: gbuell on August 05, 2011, 10:00:30 AM

Karl, are you joining the discussion?

I really hope he does, if only for the sake of balance haha

Ceric · « **Reply #115 on:** August 05, 2011, 10:48:47 AM »

I bought this game for my brother off of the hype when it came out. I need to see if I can borrow his copy. Always meant to.

KDR_11k · « **Reply #116 on:** August 05, 2011, 11:59:31 AM »

Ah, the only one of those I own and played won (though I got it on the PS2). I have Battalion Wars still sealed (was dirt cheap but haven't had the desire to actually play it) and rented Wario World long enough to beat it (2 days).

gbuell · « **Reply #117 on:** August 05, 2011, 12:15:30 PM »

I think Battalion Wars is pretty good, I really enjoyed it. I never played BWii, was that any good?

Ceric · « **Reply #118 on:** August 05, 2011, 12:29:51 PM »

Quote from: gbuell on August 05, 2011, 12:15:30 PM

I think Battalion Wars is pretty good, I really enjoyed it. I never played BWii, was that any good?

From Memory it was and I seem to remember though that sometimes I prefer the control. Definitely worth picking up if you find it. Especially if you liked BW and can get it for $20.

noname2200 · « **Reply #119 on:** August 05, 2011, 12:52:35 PM »

Quote from: gbuell on August 05, 2011, 12:15:30 PM

I think Battalion Wars is pretty good, I really enjoyed it. I never played BWii, was that any good?

I thought it was a great B-tier title (and that's not meant condescendingly). I can't compare it to the original, but I thought it was a steal at $20.

Ceric · « **Reply #120 on:** August 05, 2011, 12:58:57 PM »

Their really isn't any game quiet like the Battalion War series. It borrows from a lot but the presentation and how it is put together is very fresh in its own way. Its like a movie you watch and your really enjoy it but, you recognize you don't want it to spawn off a genre.

Fatty The Hutt · « **Reply #121 on:** August 05, 2011, 01:34:16 PM »

Wow, since the K7 win this thread has become full o' grapes.

Sour ones that is.

Karl really should be invited for the K7 discussion. Its the only fair and balanced thing to do.

NWR_Karl · « **Reply #122 on:** August 05, 2011, 01:45:29 PM »

I'll be there. Jonny's holding me to my word.

Fatty The Hutt · « **Reply #123 on:** August 05, 2011, 02:33:57 PM »

Quote from: NWR_Karl on August 05, 2011, 01:45:29 PM

I'll be there. Jonny's holding me to my word.

Woot.

Shaymin · « **Reply #124 on:** August 05, 2011, 07:06:41 PM »

Quote

I've said it before and I'll say it again: Democracy simply doesn't work.

- Kent Brockman

ShyGuy · « **Reply #125 on:** August 05, 2011, 08:48:33 PM »

Serious question. Why do you guys add games to the poll you don't want to play?

Mop it up · « **Reply #126 on:** August 05, 2011, 09:25:32 PM »

Of these five, I own and have played Battalion Wars and Wario World. Both are fun but pretty short, oddly enough. Especially Wario World, I can see people who paid $50 for that being extremely disappointed in it due to its brevity. I enjoyed it, but I found it for a lot less than that.

I bought Star Wars Rogue Leader at launch since I wanted something to play, but never got around to it and ended up selling it a couple years back. I guess that was kind of a waste, but oh well...

I'm not really into RPGs that much which is why I never checked out Baten Kaitos, but usually if I like an RPG is it because it deviates from the norm. This one does look different but also complicated, but if it's cheap unlike I thought, I might check it out.

I ended up voting for Killer 7 since neither Battalion Wars nor Wario World seemed to have support. I've always been curious about it but never bothered to pick it up before.

Jonnyboy117 · « **Reply #127 on:** August 06, 2011, 11:51:43 AM »

There is a story to be told here, that I think will clear things up. From our email thread, Greg wrote:

Quote

Given the GCN theme and our conversation about some of the best RetroActives being the ones with games that were flawed but interesting, I can't help but think of Killer 7. I've never played it, but it seems very much like the kind of game that provokes a diversity of strong opinions on it (I suspect that I might hate it, but that would be part of the fun of talking about it, I suppose).

I replied:

Quote

I almost put Killer 7 on the list, despite my strong negative reaction every time I've played it. If we have consensus, I am willing to include it.

Jon chimed in:

Quote

I own Killer 7, but (surprise surprise) have never played it. Karl's love affair with it instantly sent up a red flag for me. Bwahahaha. I've also never heard a good word about it aside from Karl, so maybe it is a good candidate.

James didn't argue:

Quote

I've played it and enjoyed it well enough, but it's not a good game without the weirdness.

I think that was the last time it came up in the discussion before I posted the poll. As other games were dropped for various reasons, Killer 7 stayed on the list because no one protested, and we all seemed mildly curious (or for James, mildly positive). I didn't really think it would win in the face of strong contenders like Rogue Leader and Baten Kaitos Origins, but I usually try to have wild cards (three of them in this lineup) that could find supporters and come up with an unlikely win. It has happened before, and it happened this time. You'll hear me groan on the next RFN (facetiously), and probably even when I play it (earnestly), but clearly I was not adamantly opposed to giving this game another shot, and neither were any of the other three guys. As I told Karl recently, I want to push past the things I don't like about it to discover and appreciate what there is to like, and I may need help from the game's fans to do so.

alegoicoe · « **Reply #128 on:** August 06, 2011, 03:42:20 PM »

its cool that killer 7 won, but i was looking forward to baten kaitos, well its ok anyways i havent played killer 7 so this might be a good time to play it before the podcast.

NWR_insanolord · « **Reply #129 on:** August 06, 2011, 03:56:12 PM »

The way I see it, with the strong feelings on both sides of this game, this is either going to be the best RetroActive ever or a complete and total trainwreck. Or possibly both. Either way, I'm looking forward to it!

Da Jarvis · « **Reply #130 on:** August 07, 2011, 03:54:08 AM »

I see a lot of people complaining about killer7, but I wonder how many of them have actually played the game and are not just basing there opition on reviews or what other people have said about it. I usually don't give an opinion about a game till I play it and even if it get's good or bad reviews, I usually go off people I know have similar tastes as I do. I really don't know, but if anyone has actually played this game, do you really find it that bad? I would like to know, simply because I have not played it before and from what I have seen, it looks wired enough to get attention of some sort. I mean, I never though I would like Legend of Dragoon and I love that game to death. I am just curious if this game actually deserves the hate I am seeing. I mainly voted for it because I am curious what everyone else is going to say about it and I would love to play it to see what I think, but I won't even be close to my Wii till about a month from now at the very least and after that, I have school till Decemeber plus work. Basically, I don't think I will have time to play any Console games till then, which is a shame considering a lot is coming out in the fall. Thank god for my DS and iPhone

NWR, if you are reading this, a DS Themed Retro Active would be awesome for next round during Fall Semester ^_^

broodwars · « **Reply #131 on:** August 07, 2011, 03:58:57 AM »

Quote from: Da Jarvis on August 07, 2011, 03:54:08 AM

I see a lot of people complaining about killer7, but I wonder how many of them have actually played the game and are not just basing there opition on reviews or what other people have said about it.

I owned the game back on the GameCube and played through the entire game twice, just to make sure there wasn't some hidden enjoyment I somehow missed. So yeah, my opinion that it's one of the worst games I have played in at least the last couple of console generations is my own.

Da Jarvis · « **Reply #132 on:** August 07, 2011, 04:14:52 AM »

Quote from: broodwars on August 07, 2011, 03:58:57 AM

I owned the game back on the GameCube and played through the entire game twice, just to make sure there wasn't some hidden enjoyment I somehow missed. So yeah, my opinion that it's one of the worst games I have played in at least the last couple of console generations is my own.

Like I have said, I have never played the game before, so all I can go off is what I hear of the game. I was just curious of how many people who are hating on the game have actually played it is all. It sounds like you have a pretty passionate hate for the game though from what I have read xD

broodwars · « **Reply #133 on:** August 07, 2011, 04:32:17 AM »

Quote from: Da Jarvis on August 07, 2011, 04:14:52 AM

It sounds like you have a pretty passionate hate for the game though from what I have read xD

Well yeah. The game is both utterly pretentious and mechanically abysmal, as if it were made by a game designer who had absolutely no idea what he was doing. Oh wait, it was.

From the very moment the game begins it practically dares you to stop playing it with incomprehensible dialogue and an even more incomprehensible story that delights in going absolutely nowhere as slowly as possible; puzzles whose solutions are not only extremely obvious and simplistic but are actually displayed on your map; shooting and movement mechanics that are very restrictive and frustrating; and characters who are largely extremely unmemorable. The game's one saving grace (besides the last level, which is by far the most comprehensible in the game) is the one thing that Suda 51 ever gets right, and that's the game's wacky style. Anything and everything is fair and logical in the world of Suda 51, so long as it looks "cool". Sometimes that really works, and a lot of the time it really doesn't.

Killer 7 is just a mess, the very definition of style over substance. And if that's what you're after, there are far better games in that vein (even Suda 51 games) than this.

Da Jarvis · « **Reply #134 on:** August 07, 2011, 04:38:26 AM »

Quote from: broodwars on August 07, 2011, 04:32:17 AM

Well yeah. The game is both gloriously pretentious and yet mechanically shitty, as if it were made by a game designer who had absolutely no idea what he was doing... Killer 7 is just a mess, the very definition of style over substance. And if that's what you're after, there are far better games in that vein (even Suda 51 games) than this.

Intesting. So is the game popular because it is bad (like why people still play Wand of Gamalon or ET for the Atari) or because of how wacky it is? I mean, I thougth No More Heroes was pretty wacky, but I never remember not enjoying NMHs, then again, that is the only game I have played by Mr. 51 and that game got pretty solid reviews.

broodwars · « **Reply #135 on:** August 07, 2011, 04:49:09 AM »

Quote from: Da Jarvis on August 07, 2011, 04:38:26 AM

Intesting. So is the game popular because it is bad (like why people still play Wand of Gamalon or ET for the Atari) or because of how wacky it is? I mean, I thougth No More Heroes was pretty wacky, but I never remember not enjoying NMHs, then again, that is the only game I have played by Mr. 51 and that game got pretty solid reviews.

Suda 51 may be a terrible game designer, but I'll gladly give him props that there is an appeal to the madness and energy that he imbues in his projects. You just never know what you're going to get from the guy. One moment, a character could be reeling off a 5 minute speech philosophizing about geopolitical issues, the next someone could drop a random pop culture reference, and the moment after that a character may literally spend 5-10 interactive minutes driving down an empty stretch of highway for no real reason. His work is just completely random, but usually based on a solid premise that he can't stop himself from screwing-up.

The problem is that there's usually no one above him keeping him in check and not letting his auteur tendencies outweigh a Game's Prime Directive that the experience needs to be fun. Killer 7 may have completely failed on the writing angle as well, but most of Suda 51's games fail due to just extremely bad mechanical and level design decisions. The closest I've seen Suda 51 to producing a quality game was Shadows of the Damned (which was a decent game, if somewhat average), and renowned game designer Shinji Mikami had to keep him on a tight leash just to produce that.

oohhboy · « **Reply #136 on:** August 07, 2011, 04:57:06 AM »

Killer 7 is the game equivalent of one of those mad art house films that only make sense to the director. Your comprehension is not required and may not even be desired.

In the end, I can't call it a bad game, but I can't say it's a good game either. It just is.

Unfortunately I haven't played any other of Suda 51's works, so I can't not make comparisons as to how sane he is other than it's not "Batshit".

Ceric · « **Reply #137 on:** August 07, 2011, 08:28:27 AM »

So what your saying is that Suda 51 is like George Lucas with the Star Wars Prequels? Without a budget and someone to keep him in check he goes way further then needed and can't strike the correct balance?

oohhboy · « **Reply #138 on:** August 07, 2011, 09:04:40 AM »

Hell no, George Lucas is just plain incompetent and greedy to boot. That man had a good idea, but he is poisonous to his own work. So no, Suda 51 is most definitely Not George Lucas.

Suda's problem with Killer 7 is that he doesn't quite know what he wants to make. It's a toss up between interactive novel, a straight up film, light gun game, or a manifesto to the bourgeois of Capitalism. It's undoubtedly unique, which makes it neither good or bad.

If measured against what is considered traditionally a "Game", then in that sense it could be considered a failure. But I don't think this was what he was trying to make and I guess by that measure it is a success of sorts that nobody in their right mind would try to follow.

broodwars · « **Reply #139 on:** August 07, 2011, 11:48:52 AM »

Quote from: Ceric on August 07, 2011, 08:28:27 AM

So what your saying is that Suda 51 is like George Lucas with the Star Wars Prequels? Without a budget and someone to keep him in check he goes way further then needed and can't strike the correct balance?

I think a more apt comparison is that Suda 51's the video game industry's equivalent of Ed Wood.

gbuell · « **Reply #140 on:** August 07, 2011, 12:59:43 PM »

Ed Wood? No. I'd liken him much more to David Lynch - at least, Killer 7 definitely gives off a strong Lynch vibe. Lynch is another very divisive figure, but personally I like what little I've seen of his, for similar reasons that I liked Killer 7.

Da Jarvis · « **Reply #141 on:** August 07, 2011, 01:27:25 PM »

So what everyone is saying is killer7 is like Neon Genesis Evangelion in the sence that only the creator knows what it means and that he is so far up his own ass, that it doesn't make sence to anyone else but him? At least that is what I am understand...

oohhboy · « **Reply #142 on:** August 07, 2011, 01:51:29 PM »

That is partly true depending on which version of NGE your talking about. Rebuild from what has been released so far makes sense within it's own universe (and is awesome). The same cannot be said for the original, although most of the batshit insanity was confined to the last quater of the series and that "Movie". The original series shat itself partly due to running out of money, but that didn't excuse the BS at the end. ome rumour has it he was insane or that the ending was some elaborate troll. The movie sure felt like that.

Da Jarvis · « **Reply #143 on:** August 07, 2011, 02:01:32 PM »

Quote from: oohhboy on August 07, 2011, 01:51:29 PM

That is partly true depending on which version of NGE your talking about. Rebuild from what has been released so far makes sense within it's own universe (and is awesome). The same cannot be said for the original... ome rumour has it he was insane or that the ending was some elaborate troll. The movie sure felt like that.

LOL! When I watched NGE for the first time, I came in with people telling me it was the best anime ever (Mostly those anyoying elitest that hate anything after the 90's), and I ended up coming out dissapointed, mostly due to how anyoying Shinji was personally. I have heard pretty solid things about the newer version of it, but I am waiting for it to be done till I try it. I never even saw the movie, but I know THAT SCENE in the hosptial was pretty much the last straw xD

Ceric · « **Reply #144 on:** August 07, 2011, 10:33:02 PM »

The best part of Evengelion is the Parodies of it. They are better.

Lithium · « **Reply #145 on:** August 07, 2011, 11:46:07 PM »

Quote from: Ceric on August 07, 2011, 10:33:02 PM

The best part of Evengelion is the Parodies of it. They are better.

my favourite is when Gintama did a parody of it for their "last episode"

^^^
would be better with subtitles since the Gintama characters say random **** haha

Soren · « **Reply #146 on:** August 08, 2011, 11:12:56 AM »

I voted for Killer 7 because I remember being really pumped up for it when it was first announced, along with most of the Capcom 5. The collection of bad reviews afterwards turned me off completely for the time being. But now with this poll it gives me the chance to finally give it a fair chance. I have no idea what to expect from it, but I'll play through it...

gbuell · « **Reply #147 on:** August 08, 2011, 07:45:40 PM »

I don't remember it getting a lot of bad reviews, and it has a 74 on Metacritic, which isn't TERRIBLE. I think a lot of people are overplaying the negative reaction it got when it came out.

Lithium · « **Reply #148 on:** August 09, 2011, 01:38:12 AM »

Quote from: gbuell on August 08, 2011, 07:45:40 PM

I don't remember it getting a lot of bad reviews, and it has a 74 on Metacritic, which isn't TERRIBLE. I think a lot of people are overplaying the negative reaction it got when it came out.

In the games world review scores are more inflated than the U.S dollar

heyoooooo

but seriously though while I agree with you to most people think anything under an 80% is considered bad, I mean remember the shitstorm that happened when Gamespot gave twilight princess an 8.8?

gbuell · « **Reply #149 on:** August 09, 2011, 06:06:13 PM »

Yeah, I remember that, and that shitstorm was ridiculously stupid. And I love Twilight Princess.

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