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Episode 217: Pargon Lindy Tier Aretak Pargon

by James Jones, Greg Leahy, Jon Lindemann, and Jonathan Metts - October 31, 2010, 10:15 am PDT
Total comments: 41

He's back!

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Finally! Jon Lindemann returns to our coven for an action-and-laughs-packed episode full of Radios and Freedoms and Nintendos. Jon doesn't so much talk about specific games but rather delivers a treatise on the state of gaming for middle-aged men who have to throw all their games in boxes and drive for two days to a new city and take a long time to get all of those games back out of the boxes. Riveting stuff. Jonny blasts yo' expectations with the cool-but-disappointing Bit.Trip Fate, the verbose Alan Wake, and just a tad of Rock Band 3. James struggles to remain coherent when describing Sengoku Basara: Samurai Heroes, while Greg makes a belated return to Wario Land (Shake It!) before wrapping up Castlevania: Lords of Shadow just in time for Halloween.

Then we took a break.

Then we made Jon read all five letters in Listener Mail! Your questions lead us into the state of gaming retail, Zelda: Skyward Sword's release date, the pertinence of gaming magazines, regional disparities with game releases in today's modern age, and DS games to import from Japan. There's also a special announcement about an upcoming event, and we need your help! Be sure to listen all the way through to get the 'tails. And don't forget to vote on the next RetroActive selection -- voting ends this Wednesday!

This podcast was edited by Greg Leahy.

Music for this episode of Radio Free Nintendo is used with permission from Jason Ricci & New Blood. You can purchase their newest album, Done with the Devil, directly from the record label, Amazon (CD) (MP3), or iTunes, or call your local record store and ask for it!

Additional music for this episode of Radio Free Nintendo is copyrighted to Nintendo, and is included under fair use protection.

Talkback

FZeroBoyoOctober 31, 2010

I've yet to listen to it, but nice ode to Eternal Darkness with the title. I believe it is "Power Lindemann Creature Summon Power". In other words, summon Jon Lindemann.  ;D

LittleIrvesOctober 31, 2010

FZeroBoyo, you beat me to it.  The Darkness Comes!  And welcome back, J-O-N.

happyastoriaOctober 31, 2010

Funny, on the Joystiq podcast the host complained about the narration on Other M, but praised Alan Wake's highly detailed of scenes you just watched narration.

I look down at my computer and see the Windows 7 sticker on the lower left-hand side. I begin to type the letter F for funny. I continue to finish the word and follow it with a comma. I begin to start my second sentence, but realized I wrote "Joystiq" instead of "360 Fancast." I was too lazy to correct my mistake.....

Actually,  My narration is pretty good! I gave you a bit of information that was not known by simply looking at the screen. I thought the narration for Alan Wake was going to be like that.

CëricOctober 31, 2010

Quote from: happyastoria

Funny, on the Joystiq podcast the host complained about the narration on Other M, but praised Alan Wake's highly detailed of scenes you just watched narration.

The difference is that the narration in Alan Wake sets the mood and the tone of the game perfectly, and the narration ties into the concept that it's essentially Wake the writer telling his story.  When you find pages of Wake's story in the game world, sometimes it foreshadows things to come, while at other times it tells what happens with other characters off-screen at the time.  The narration in Other M is just asinine and adds nothing to the game, not to mention it is read in extreme monotone and isn't particularly interesting.

I'm glad you guys appreciate the episode title!

Kytim89October 31, 2010

Quote from: Jonnyboy117

I'm glad you guys appreciate the episode title!


What does it mean?

CëricOctober 31, 2010

Quote from: Kytim89

Quote from: Jonnyboy117

I'm glad you guys appreciate the episode title!


What does it mean?

"Go play Eternal Darkness on GameCube."

In the parlance of the Eternal Darkness magick system, it translates to "summon a super-powerful Lindy-aligned creature". Originally, I thought about using the Mantarok alignment and replacing "Aretak" with Lindy, but then I decided it would be funnier if Lindy had his own alignment. Although, a purple Lindy is an amusing image.


What do you all think of the big announcement at the end of the episode? What are your initial thoughts on what should be included in such an event?

Kytim89October 31, 2010

Quote from: Jonnyboy117

In the parlance of the Eternal Darkness magick system, it translates to "summon a super-powerful Lindy-aligned creature". Originally, I thought about using the Mantarok alignment and replacing "Aretak" with Lindy, but then I decided it would be funnier if Lindy had his own alignment. Although, a purple Lindy is an amusing image.


What do you all think of the big announcement at the end of the episode? What are your initial thoughts on what should be included in such an event?


How about a therapy session where I come to terms with the fact that Rare N64 games will never be on virtual console.

happyastoriaOctober 31, 2010

Quote from: Jonnyboy117

What do you all think of the big announcement at the end of the episode? What are your initial thoughts on what should be included in such an event?

I hate it! I work on Saturday. Can it be done on a Sunday?

greybrickNathan Mustafa, Staff AlumnusOctober 31, 2010

Greg wins this episode with the Return of the Jedi reference.

I remember having to restart the process of climbing the Colossi quite frequently in SOTC.

Good job, y'all. I know James, Karlie & Aaron had technical challenges recording Radio Trivia Live for future posterity, but hopefully you can figure out a reliable means in the next month+

CëricNovember 01, 2010

I've been playing a little Bit.Trip FATE and I kind of agree with Jonny.  Although I do like the music in the game, the gameplay is kind of boring (mainly because it seems to take 5 seconds of continuous fire to kill anything).  It's not very clear playing the game what does what and what the rules are.  I'm only on the second stage so it could get a lot better, but so far the game just seems to be missing a certain "snap" to the gameplay.  It just feels very loose.

LolmonadeNovember 01, 2010

Twin stick shooters play much better with a pointer for aiming, much more precise. I have a much harder time hitting stuff when I aim with the right stick.

Western publishers usually release games in Europe in the same week as in America (game releases are usually on Thursdays or Fridays in Euroe while they're on Tuesdays in America so it's rarely the same day).

KisakiProjectNovember 01, 2010

In regards to your live charity marathon I have a  few suggestions.

Try and get guests like Billy or Chris Kohler?

Retrospectives are always fun and can go on forever.  Maybe talk about gba launch memories since 3DS comes out soon.  Cube launch memories etc?

You should all definitely play a game you've never played before and discuss it.

People calling in and maybe doing live questions could be cool.

Quote from: KisakiProject

In regards to your live charity marathon I have a  few suggestions.

Try and get guests like Billy or Chris Kohler?

Retrospectives are always fun and can go on forever.  Maybe talk about gba launch memories since 3DS comes out soon.  Cube launch memories etc?

You should all definitely play a game you've never played before and discuss it.

People calling in and maybe doing live questions could be cool.

Thanks for the input. I'm thinking that if we can do live call-ins, we will not only answer questions but also ask them. I want to do some one-on-one trivia and put our listeners on the spot. You've got 15 seconds to answer this question... go! It doesn't get more live than that.

greybrickNathan Mustafa, Staff AlumnusNovember 01, 2010

I want a live musical performance by James.

Killer_Man_JaroTom Malina, Associate Editor (Europe)November 01, 2010

My only request for the live RFN is that it takes place at a time that would also accommodate the listeners in the UK. By which I mean, early enough that I won't have to stay up through the night to hear it. That's all.

In the meantime, thanks for another enjoyable episode. Good to hear Lindy's voice again, and the Listener Mail questions were superb.
The relevance of gaming magazines is really quite a tricky one. I subscribe to the Official Nintendo Magazine over here, and on more than one occasion, I've questioned why I still do. Partly because of the magazine itself; it has clean design and interesting features, but understandably, it has a broad demographic in its readership, so the writing style tends to be quite chatty and informal, which isn't generally my cup of tea. But as you discussed, if you are looking for news, in the age of the world wide web, magazines do not cut it, unless they have some world exclusive information, which is sometimes the case (in fact, in the latest issue of ONM, there was a set of 3DS previews with a lot of info I hadn't seen elsewhere, as well as the Sonic Colours review that Greg briefly mentioned).
I suppose the presentation does play a large role in the appeal of magazines over websites. It is nice to flick through pages and perhaps something will catch your eye - IIRC, this was how I came to learn of niche games like Chibi-Robo and Soul Bubbles. ONM also likes to show big screenshots with annotations all over them to explain stuff like interface quirks, another thing you don't often see in internet coverage.

Ah, what would I do without this show?

This is one of my favorite episode titles, by the way. I keep saying it in a low, evil, Lords of Thunder voice.

GoldenPhoenix¸November 02, 2010

For some reason i can hear Patrick Stewart or Ian McKellen saying it.

alegoicoeNovember 02, 2010

great discussion about the magazine trends, i recently wrote to an game informer editor called Phil Collar cause his reviews on nintendo games are very bad and very one sided, he gave metroid other m a 6, and the reasons are abismal, i could agree if the games have some flaws but giving a game a 6 because you dont like it , thats just stupid, and then you have another guitar hero and they gave it an 8, magazines have gotten too political for my taste but this crossed the line.

CëricNovember 02, 2010

Quote from: alegoicoe

great discussion about the magazine trends, i recently wrote to an game informer editor called Phil Collar cause his reviews on nintendo games are very bad and very one sided, he gave metroid other m a 6, and the reasons are abismal, i could agree if the games have some flaws but giving a game a 6 because you dont like it , thats just stupid, and then you have another guitar hero and they gave it an 8, magazines have gotten too political for my taste but this crossed the line.


A review ultimately boils down to whether a reviewer enjoyed it or not, and whether they would recommend the game to other people.  It's impossible to review games purely on their technical merits, and without the personal bias there's nothing worth reading in a reading IMO.  You might as well just read a preview or press release.  That said, you probably want someone who enjoys music games reviewing a Guitar Hero game, someone who enjoys FPS games reviewing Call of Duty, etc.

alegoicoeNovember 02, 2010

^yes i know but if you dont like a game that does not mean others are not going to enjoy it specially a metroid title, i know other m was not metroids best, but its a damn good game, and to give it a low score just because you dont like its un professional.

CëricNovember 02, 2010

Quote from: alegoicoe

^yes i know but if you dont like a game that does not mean others are not going to enjoy it specially a metroid title, i know other m was not metroids best, but its a damn good game, and to give it a low score just because you dont like its un professional.


It's your review, your opinion.  I would think it's unprofessional to write a review for some phantom audience that you don't actually agree with.  It's your name on the review, not theirs.  I'd rather see writers take a stand and have an opinion (even if I don't agree with it, like I don't agree with the Castlevania: Lords of Shadow reviews) than read "Well, if you're a fan of X, Y, and Z, you might like this" reviews.

greybrickNathan Mustafa, Staff AlumnusNovember 02, 2010

Quote from: alegoicoe

^yes i know but if you dont like a game that does not mean others are not going to enjoy it specially a metroid title, i know other m was not metroids best, but its a damn good game, and to give it a low score just because you dont like its un professional.

I think to give a game a high score when you don't like it is unprofessional. Why would you waste time stepping into the mindset of every possible user and assign the highest of those scores? Of course, you can't pan a game intended for toddlers because you didn't enjoy it, so there has to be some degree of flexibility in your mindset.

alegoicoeNovember 02, 2010

Quote from: broodwars

Quote from: alegoicoe

^yes i know but if you dont like a game that does not mean others are not going to enjoy it specially a metroid title, i know other m was not metroids best, but its a damn good game, and to give it a low score just because you dont like its un professional.


It's your review, your opinion.  I would think it's unprofessional to write a review for some phantom audience that you don't actually agree with.  It's your name on the review, not theirs.  I'd rather see writers take a stand and have an opinion (even if I don't agree with it, like I don't agree with the Castlevania: Lords of Shadow reviews) than read "Well, if you're a fan of X, Y, and Z, you might like this" reviews.

You got me, am a fanboy, but i got a question, would you agree that Other M is a 6 quality game?

CëricNovember 02, 2010

Quote from: alegoicoe

Quote from: broodwars


It's your review, your opinion.  I would think it's unprofessional to write a review for some phantom audience that you don't actually agree with.  It's your name on the review, not theirs.  I'd rather see writers take a stand and have an opinion (even if I don't agree with it, like I don't agree with the Castlevania: Lords of Shadow reviews) than read "Well, if you're a fan of X, Y, and Z, you might like this" reviews.

You got me, am a fanboy, but i got a question, would you agree that Other M is a 6 quality game?


In my personal opinion, it's a 7.5 or so.  However, given how weak the storytelling is; how rigidly linear the game's structure is; the insistence upon Wiimote-only controls that can (IMO) be painful during extended play; and the damage that game does to Samus' character, I can totally understand why someone would go lower.  Despite its problems, I fairly enjoyed Other M, but that doesn't make my opinion any more "right" than anyone else's.

alegoicoeNovember 02, 2010

Quote from: broodwars

Quote from: alegoicoe

Quote from: broodwars


It's your review, your opinion.  I would think it's unprofessional to write a review for some phantom audience that you don't actually agree with.  It's your name on the review, not theirs.  I'd rather see writers take a stand and have an opinion (even if I don't agree with it, like I don't agree with the Castlevania: Lords of Shadow reviews) than read "Well, if you're a fan of X, Y, and Z, you might like this" reviews.

You got me, am a fanboy, but i got a question, would you agree that Other M is a 6 quality game?


In my personal opinion, it's a 7.5 or so.  However, given how weak the storytelling is; how rigidly linear the game's structure is; the insistence upon Wiimote-only controls that can (IMO) be painful during extended play; and the damage that game does to Samus' character, I can totally understand why someone would go lower.  Despite its problems, I fairly enjoyed Other M, but that doesn't make my opinion any more "right" than anyone else's.

Its true that the story is weak, but gameplay wise the game is a blast once you get a hang of the controls, and the game has some pretty good graphics, i would give it a solid 8.5.

NWR_KarlKarl Castaneda, Contributing EditorNovember 02, 2010

Quote from: alegoicoe

^yes i know but if you dont like a game that does not mean others are not going to enjoy it specially a metroid title, i know other m was not metroids best, but its a damn good game, and to give it a low score just because you dont like its un professional.

Actually, to do anything but that would be unprofessional. A review is an opinion, so how can you attempt to evaluate something if you don't use your own personal rubric? Game Informer's done this in the past (with Paper Mario 2), factoring in how they perceived the general public would receive it, and it's blown up in their face.

If you only read reviews to see your own thoughts reaffirmed, what's the point in reading any at all?

Reviews are opinion pieces. Period.

If you don't like a game, review it as such. I know someone hated on the idea of the recommendations ("if you like that game, you'll like this), and I see where you're coming from, but I feel like that's good way to be like "yea, I loved/hated this game, but you might like it if you enjoyed this game."

alegoicoeNovember 02, 2010

Quote from: NWR_Karl

Quote from: alegoicoe

^yes i know but if you dont like a game that does not mean others are not going to enjoy it specially a metroid title, i know other m was not metroids best, but its a damn good game, and to give it a low score just because you dont like its un professional.

Actually, to do anything but that would be unprofessional. A review is an opinion, so how can you attempt to evaluate something if you don't use your own personal rubric? Game Informer's done this in the past (with Paper Mario 2), factoring in how they perceived the general public would receive it, and it's blown up in their face.

If you only read reviews to see your own thoughts reaffirmed, what's the point in reading any at all?

i actually only read reviews on game informer just to see the crap they talk about nintendo games cause i find it amusing, other than that i get the magazine for free so its ok. the games that i play which i have been playing for nearly twenty years i dont need to see reviews about, new games i do read them, and from various site not only one to gather some info about it.

I've generally believed that reviews ultimately serve a primary and, optionally, a secondary purpose: to critique the "quality" of the game (its merits and demerits), and then to offer a (possibly nuanced) play/don't play recommendation.

A review can criticize a game and still wind up recommending it to at least some gamers, if the game does have some merit (above 5 on the NWR scale). That's perfectly fine. What ISN'T fine is for reviews to merely provide a recommendation without critiquing the game, or even worse, fail to critique the game and slap on a score. It's fine to say "If you liked X and Y, check out game Z", as long as it's preceded with discussion of the game that would allow those unfamiliar with X and Y to come to their own conclusions about the game and (ideally) whether or not their tastes are aligned with the reviewer's.

I personally don't care whether a reviewer explicitly says "I liked/disliked this game." The important part is WHY. If you can properly explain the reasons for your personal evaluation of the game, then you've got something to chew on, and readers can decide for themselves whether they agree or even care about specific criticisms. With Zach's review of Other M, he did a good job of explaining why he was disappointed with the game. I decided that I probably wouldn't be as bothered by those things, and that turned out to be true. My eventual disagreement doesn't mean Zach's review is bad or that he's wrong... we just disagree! Very respectfully, at that.

ShyguyNovember 02, 2010

Did Halbred ever post his "raw, uncut" review on Metroid Other M? I'm curious what his unprofessional thoughts are on the game.

I've got a suggestion for the live show: If you guys get exhausted and can't go on anymore, but the money's still coming, stick Zach and Nathan on there and let them do the polo podcast they've been threatening. Problem solved.

A more serious suggestion: take listener mail type questions, but then have the listener asking the question  stay on live via Skype and take part in the ensuing discussion.

Spak_SpangNovember 03, 2010

I agree that they should give their opinions on games. I don't want the kind of crap certain Game Informer editors admitted that they based their reviews on what they thought their readers would think rather then what they honestly thought about the game (I am specifically talking about the infamous Paper Mario: The Thousand-Year Door review). If you base your score on what you think your readers would give, then you are a bad reviewer. I read a review to see what that person feels about the game, not what they assume I will feel.

As for bad scores being unprofessional, what? If they think the game is bad, then give it a low score. This isn't kids sports where everybody gets a trophy and nobody gets criticized.

Quote from: Mop

Did Halbred ever post his "raw, uncut" review on Metroid Other M? I'm curious what his unprofessional thoughts are on the game.

Totally forgot about this. I'll have to try and dig it up! I may have accidentally deleted it, though. Which would probably be for the best.

For the live podcast, may I suggest a live trivia show a la "Wait, Wait Don't Tell Me?"

TofuFuryNovember 03, 2010

Quote from: Halbred

For the live podcast, may I suggest a live trivia show a la "Wait, Wait Don't Tell Me?"


Since Lindy likes making rhymes, he can put together the Limericks.  Get a guest from Nintendo to answer questions about being a plumber, and a lucky NWR forum member can get Greg's voice on there voicemail box.

SundoulosNovember 04, 2010

Quote from: insanolord

I've got a suggestion for the live show: If you guys get exhausted and can't go on anymore, but the money's still coming, stick Zach and Nathan on there and let them do the polo podcast they've been threatening. Problem solved.

Or...you could start the show out with it and make people donate in order to make them stop.  :D

greybrickNathan Mustafa, Staff AlumnusNovember 04, 2010

Quote from: Sundoulos

Quote from: insanolord

I've got a suggestion for the live show: If you guys get exhausted and can't go on anymore, but the money's still coming, stick Zach and Nathan on there and let them do the polo podcast they've been threatening. Problem solved.

Or...you could start the show out with it and make people donate in order to make them stop.  :D

Well then we wouldn't make any money, WOULD WE?  :@

LolmonadeNovember 05, 2010

"It's not fun" is a pretty serious flaw.

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