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Episode 213: To Upgrade, or Not to Upgrade?

by Michael Cole, James Jones, Greg Leahy, and Jonathan Metts - October 3, 2010, 2:10 pm PDT
Total comments: 29

When it comes to 3DS news analysis, we just can't help ourselves.

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Jon is taking a month-long hiatus from RFN while he moves to a new city, and we're very pleased to have Michael "TYP" Cole fill his seat this week. Mike is riding the Ufouria joy train but may be derailed by crappy touch-screen controls for Dark Void Zero. James finally returns to reviews with a withering overview of Pirates! for Wii, but he's somewhat happier with ESPN3 support in the New (New) Xbox Experience. Greg reflects Treasure-envy by "importing" Silhouette Mirage, a game famously ruined during its English localization. Jonny catches up with Sin & Punishment 2 and shares some final thoughts on Spidey's latest DS adventure.

While we usually leave news analysis to the Newscast, this week's 3DS event was so big that we figured you could handle two podcasts covering it. We share our thoughts on the price, release date, game announcements, hardware features, etc. That discussion segues beautifully into Listener Mail, where we answer your questions about Nintendo's possible arrogance with 3DS pricing, whether to upgrade now to DSi or wait for 3DS, and a quick word on Animal Crossing and Memory Card 59.

The votes are in, and our next RetroActive game is Yoshi's Story (N64)! Dredge your memories or play along with us, and if you don't have the game, it's easy enough to download from Virtual Console for 1000 Wii points. Then hit up the official thread to post your comments on the game -- we'll pick the best to read on RFN!

This podcast was edited by Greg Leahy.

Music for this episode of Radio Free Nintendo is used with permission from Jason Ricci & New Blood. You can purchase their newest album, Done with the Devil, directly from the record label, Amazon (CD) (MP3), or iTunes, or call your local record store and ask for it!

Additional music for this episode of Radio Free Nintendo is copyrighted to Nintendo, and is included under fair use protection.

Talkback

Kytim89October 03, 2010

There is a pretty good chance that the virtual handheld will not only include Nintendo systems, but ones fromother companie too. For example, the SEGA Gamegear will most likely be available along with the Neo Geo Pocket Color and perhaps the Atari Lynx. The appeal of these consoles will be the ability to play the games without the need of a bunch of batteries and that they will be backilit thanks to the 3DS.

As for movies being preinstalled, Nintendo will most likely bundle the 3DS system with a particular movie based on color. For example, a blue 3DS will have Avatar preinstalled and the black 3DS will have Resident Evil Afterlife preinstalled.

TJ SpykeOctober 03, 2010

Why do you think Atari will create a emulator for Lynx games? They didn't bother trying to get 2600, 5200, 7800, or Jaguar games on Wii's Virtual Console and they had far more popular games than Lynx. I would love more games, but I don't think Lynx will be available. Hell, right now not even Game Boy Advance will be supported (although Iwata did say that they were just starting with Game Boy and Game Boy Color).

As for pre-installed movies, so far Nintendo has not given any indication they would do that. Maybe they might change their mind, but they the current 3DS package will not include any movies.

Kytim89October 03, 2010

Quote from: TJ

Why do you think Atari will create a emulator for Lynx games? They didn't bother trying to get 2600, 5200, 7800, or Jaguar games on Wii's Virtual Console and they had far more popular games than Lynx. I would love more games, but I don't think Lynx will be available. Hell, right now not even Game Boy Advance will be supported (although Iwata did say that they were just starting with Game Boy and Game Boy Color).

As for pre-installed movies, so far Nintendo has not given any indication they would do that. Maybe they might change their mind, but they the current 3DS package will not include any movies.


What ever 3D movie store they have in the works will probably have them available. I would not rule out the 3D Final Destination movie being on there as well.

NOTE: The Live Radio Trivia is not this coming Friday, it is the following.  My apologies for the confusion.

I started to post that maybe Atari hasn't come to Virtual Console due to all the corporate weirdness and financial problems since the name was bought by Infogrames, but then I remembered that Atari games are all over Microsoft's Xbox 360 Game Room, and that several Atari arcade games are now playable (legitimately) via browser. So I really don't know.

Kytim89October 03, 2010

Quote from: Jonnyboy117

I started to post that maybe Atari hasn't come to Virtual Console due to all the corporate weirdness and financial problems since the name was bought by Infogrames, but then I remembered that Atari games are all over Microsoft's Xbox 360 Game Room, and that several Atari arcade games are now playable (legitimately) via browser. So I really don't know.


I was talking about the Lynx and I just though it would be a good thing if all the handhelds that stood in Nintendo's way and got cut down would have a second chance at life. You could bet your last dollar that the Gamegear will find its way onto the service for sure and I was a little dissapointed that you guys did not touch on other non-Nintendo consoles being on the service. Overall, the virtual handheld serive will be a reflection of the virtual console. I just hope that the virtual handheld helps spur interest in the virtual console once again because it is abysmal in regards to good games being released here lately.

I always found it strange that all the Atari systems and Colleco Vision never made it over to the virtual console.

greybrickNathan Mustafa, Staff AlumnusOctober 03, 2010

I would laugh myself to death if Nintendo included PSP games on the portable VC and included more games than what is currently available to PSP go owners.

Of course I know this would never happen, but perhaps some day in the distant future a Nintendo handheld will play Sony games.

PS: All of the PS3 talk on RFN in past episodes is part of what has inspired me to get a PS3 tomorrow- so excited!

Kytim89October 03, 2010

Quote from: greybrick

I would laugh myself to death if Nintendo included PSP games on the portable VC and included more games than what is currently available to PSP go owners.

Of course I know this would never happen, but perhaps some day in the distant future a Nintendo handheld will play Sony games.

PS: All of the PS3 talk on RFN in past episodes is part of what has inspired me to get a PS3 tomorrow- so excited!


I do not see PSP games coming to the virtual handheld, but I do see(and encourage) Nintendo basically capturing all the third party PSP games that never made it to the DS for the 3DS as ports. It would be nice to have all the Monster Hunter games along with Birth by Sleep, Peace Walker, War of the Lions and every single exclusive RPG that ever made it to the PSP for the 3DS. The PSP is beaten into the ground at this point, but they are still going. If this were to happen, Nintendo could close the book on the PSP for good. Sony would have to leave the handheld market or reveal the PSP 2 because of this embarrassing defeat.

greybrickNathan Mustafa, Staff AlumnusOctober 03, 2010

Quote:

The PSP is beaten into the ground at this point, but they are still going. If this were to happen, Nintendo could close the book on the PSP for good. Sony would have to leave the handheld market or reveal the PSP 2 because of this embarrassing defeat.

I like my PSP, and I think that plenty of Japanese gamers would want to contradict your thoughts on its, "embarrassing defeat."

KDR_11kOctober 04, 2010

Really, anything above 200€ is way too damn much for the 3DS, even going above 150€ is already expensive.

ejamerOctober 04, 2010

If the Portable Virtual Console includes Neo Geo Pocket Color games, then I'll be compelled to buy a system.  Otherwise I can wait for a price drop.

Kytim89October 04, 2010

Quote from: ejamer

If the Portable Virtual Console includes Neo Geo Pocket Color games, then I'll be compelled to buy a system.  Otherwise I can wait for a price drop.


I feel the same way about the GBA.

For anyone wondering, especially since my DSiWare zealotry gets referred to a lot on this show, I did a fist pump when I read that DSiWare games would be transferable.

Also, anyone who says DSiWare is weak can go eat something phallic. There's a lot of crap on it, but I've got about 20 awesome games that say any comers of full of crap. I've got about 15 terrible games that laugh in my face, though. Luckily, some of those are review copies.

Quote from: NWR_Neal

Also, anyone who says DSiWare is weak can go eat something phallic.

Something phallic or an actual phallus? I need to know these things.

Quote from: Halbred

Quote from: NWR_Neal

Also, anyone who says DSiWare is weak can go eat something phallic.

Something phallic or an actual phallus? I need to know these things.

Read betweenadickthe lines.

greybrickNathan Mustafa, Staff AlumnusOctober 04, 2010

Quote from: NWR_Neal

go eat something phallic. There's a lot of crap on it

Ew.

Kytim89October 04, 2010

I thought this forum was supposed to be family friendly?  ;D

As for the price of the 3DS in America, I never hear anybody talking about the trade in value for the DS systems that will be offered by Gamestop and various other buisnesses that will help reduce the overall cost of the 3DS.

Assuming that Gamestop offers a trade with DS towards the 3DS then this is what I expect the values to be for each DS system:

DS Phat: $30
DS Lite: $50
DSi: $70
DSi XL: $90

Regardless, selling the old systems in might help in getting the 3DS for a cheaper price.

NWR_KarlKarl Castaneda, Contributing EditorOctober 04, 2010

Fun Fact: Go Eat Something Phallic was the name of my band in high school.

TJ SpykeOctober 04, 2010

Quote from: Kytim89

I thought this forum was supposed to be family friendly?  ;D

As for the price of the 3DS in America, I never hear anybody talking about the trade in value for the DS systems that will be offered by Gamestop and various other buisnesses that will help reduce the overall cost of the 3DS.

Assuming that Gamestop offers a trade with DS towards the 3DS then this is what I expect the values to be for each DS system:

DS Phat: $30
DS Lite: $50
DSi: $70
DSi XL: $90

Regardless, selling the old systems in might help in getting the 3DS for a cheaper price.

Maybe you would get those prices after factoring in the bonus trade in value they offer to upgrade to new systems. No way you would normally get $70 for a DSi or $90 for DSi XL, even the prices for DS and DS Lite might be too high. I don't think they will offer anything special for the original DS at all.

Kytim89October 04, 2010

Quote from: TJ

Quote from: Kytim89

I thought this forum was supposed to be family friendly?  ;D

As for the price of the 3DS in America, I never hear anybody talking about the trade in value for the DS systems that will be offered by Gamestop and various other buisnesses that will help reduce the overall cost of the 3DS.

Assuming that Gamestop offers a trade with DS towards the 3DS then this is what I expect the values to be for each DS system:

DS Phat: $30
DS Lite: $50
DSi: $70
DSi XL: $90

Regardless, selling the old systems in might help in getting the 3DS for a cheaper price.

Maybe you would get those prices after factoring in the bonus trade in value they offer to upgrade to new systems. No way you would normally get $70 for a DSi or $90 for DSi XL, even the prices for DS and DS Lite might be too high. I don't think they will offer anything special for the original DS at all.


They might offer something for the original DS, but it will be very meager. I am hoping that I can get atleast $50 for my DSi. If so and the 3DS is $250, I can then get it for $200. If the 3DS is $200, I will get the 3DS for $150. Tax would be included, too.

The only problem to this is how will we be able to transfer DSiware to the 3DS? If both systems are needed in the same place then you would not be able to trade the DSi in before purchasing the 3DS. If Club Nintendo has anything to do with the transfer, all you have to do is cancel your account for the DSi and then reactivate it for the 3DS and all the games are there for downloading.

ejamerOctober 05, 2010

Quote from: Kytim89

I feel the same way about the GBA.

I'd rather use my GBA Micro - but that's probably a minority opinion.


Considering how hard it is to find good, authentic GBA games, there is some real value to having GBA on a portable virtual console.  I'm just concerned that many of my personal favorite games (mostly niche titles) won't be sold that way.

Quote from: ejamer

many of my personal favorite games (mostly niche titles) won't be sold that way.

They wont.

PaleMike Gamin, Contributing EditorOctober 07, 2010

Regarding Animal Crossing for Cube...

Didn't the packaged card come with some in-game NES games?  I swear I remember it did....

But, that said, I think it only worked for the first town you created... so even getting that card used and wanting to start a fresh town would cause you to lose them.

I probably put more time into playing Zelda on my copy of Animal Crossing (courtesy of Action Replay) than the actual game. Was that NES title ever unlockable through Nintendo-approved means?

ControlerFleXOctober 08, 2010

Quote from: KDR_11k

Really, anything above 200€ is way too damn much for the 3DS, even going above 150€ is already expensive.

Well that sounds a bit silly...

All the specs might not show it but Nintendo will be ahead of the pack with the 3DS and things like that always come with a price. The announced price converted to any currency sounds crazy.......... if you haven't seen this thing for your own eyes.

25,000Yen is about the price you pay for a luxury item like this in Japan. Think about what ever FAD luxury product in your respective country now and the 3DS will be about that much.

Want it in March? Pay UP! Or wait in agonizing pain for the Christmas bundle to save a few buX.

KDR_11kOctober 08, 2010

People are guessing 250$, therefore I expect 250€. What pack is the system ahead of? The Apple pack? It's ahead in battery life only there (and of course controls).

I'm unable to see stereoscopic 3D except for the most extreme cases anyway but even if I could see it I wouldn't pay more than a couple of Euros extra for it. In the end it's still just a gimmick, not an improvement to the core functionality of the system.

ControlerFleXOctober 09, 2010

Quote from: KDR_11k

People are guessing 250$, therefore I expect 250€. What pack is the system ahead of? The Apple pack? It's ahead in battery life only there (and of course controls).

I'm unable to see stereoscopic 3D except for the most extreme cases anyway but even if I could see it I wouldn't pay more than a couple of Euros extra for it. In the end it's still just a gimmick, not an improvement to the core functionality of the system.

I think 250 as well , but that doesn't seem like too much to me, it's up there but not over board. As far as ahead of the pack goes, I'm thinking of the hand held gaming  market. The PSP Go alienates the previous PSP enthusiast and until the iPhone has buttons or slides open to reveal two touch screens, it wont be a serious gaming experience.

I do feel bad for your inability to see stereoscopic and might not have any luck with parallax either. but hopefully the rest of the systems features will be able to win you over in the long run.

KDR_11kOctober 10, 2010

I like the games the system offers but I do not see any justification for the price of the system itself. The DS was over 100€ cheaper than that.

The competitor the 3DS must beat is not the PSP. It is not the iPhone either. It is the DS. How much more does the 3DS offer to me, the customer, that would warrant a 100€ price increase? This question gets much, MUCH worse once you ask it from the perspective of the blue ocean crowd the DS brought in. How much would glasses-free 3D improve games that are not 3D in the first place?

Sony had a similar problem trying to migrate their Buzz and Singstar audiences to the PS3, there is no real benefit from going to the bigger hardware as the games were never hardware-constrained anyway.

ControlerFleXOctober 10, 2010

Quote from: KDR_11k

.........The competitor the 3DS must beat is not the PSP. It is not the iPhone either. It is the DS. How much more does the 3DS offer to me, the customer, that would warrant a 100€ price increase?

....................How much would glasses-free 3D improve games that are not 3D in the first place?...........

Yeah the current Family of DS does make it a hard sell and truthfully I'm not really excited for the N64 remakes, 3D in old games doesn't change/add game play.

But I think Nintendo is trying to express that this item is less of a Toy and more a Gadget. This way grown folk will adopt it first for them selves and once the first drop happens in the third quarter, then the ,ore savvy consumers like yourself will have saved some dollars and will have an even better lineup to pick from.

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