WiiU

North America

Mario Kart 8 Review

by Neal Ronaghan - May 15, 2014, 12:01 am PDT
Total comments: 299

7.5

Mario’s latest kart-racing game is beautiful and fun, but too often it becomes bland.

Video review below!

If there’s one word that can quickly sum up Nintendo’s latest entry in the Mario Kart series, it’s beautiful. From top to bottom, this is a gorgeous game, likely the best-looking one Nintendo has ever made. Even the soundtrack is superb, with amazing songs that call to mind past Mario games in new musical styles. Behind that beauty, unfortunately, is a degree of vapidness. Mario Kart 8 is just like any other Mario Kart game you’ve played in recent years, adding little to the franchise other than polish and some middling additions and tweaks.

Playing through Mario Kart 8 feels mechanical. Like every recent Mario Kart game, there are eight cups containing 32 tracks, half of which are remade courses from past games. There’s another take on Rainbow Road, on Bowser’s Castle, on Mario Circuit, etc. All the retro tracks are lovingly remixed, twisting what you remember about past tracks and turning them into something that feels new and unique, taking advantage of air, sea, and zero-gravity. Two standouts for me were Toad’s Turnpike and Rainbow Road, both from Mario Kart 64 originally. They are reminiscent of the 18-year-old tracks, but they feel different and are extremely fun to race, with Toad’s Turnpike letting you race on the walls and Rainbow Road featuring ample amounts of jumps.

Woefully, the single-player, which is structured like recent Mario Kart games, is brief and boring, focused on making you replay cups at different difficulty levels to unlock every character. While sometimes the courses seem more focused on being a graphical spectacle, the way some courses evolve and change, such as Thwomp Ruins, is awesome. Most courses have multiple forks at different points that are faster or slower depending on your items. The only saving grace of the single-player is that you don’t necessarily need to do it all by yourself; all the content can be unlocked by playing Grand Prix mode with up to four players.


While single-player is just more of the same, the clear focus and highlight of Mario Kart 8 is multiplayer, whether it’s split-screen or online (or both!). Four-player split-screen only loses a little bit of graphical fidelity and remains a total blast. Once again the series bests any other multiplayer racing game I’ve ever played. Online runs smoothly as well, and while I would love to be able to talk with my friends during the races, it is still fun playing against other people while getting to smack talk in the lobby.

Outside of the shiny HD graphics, the big new addition for Mario Kart 8 is Mario Kart TV. Technically, it is very impressive. As far as I can tell, the game records your recent races, allowing you to customize your very own highlight reel using a few different options with little to no load times. You can even post that highlight reel to Miiverse or YouTube (YouTube functionality was not up at the time of the review).

Rewatching the highlight reels is fun, especially in multiplayer, because you can see what other racers did and instantly slow down or speed up the gameplay for dramatic effect. It’s novel but ultimately pointless. When realizing how smoothly Mario Kart TV runs, it makes me sad those resources weren’t used to do something that actually integrates into the gameplay or single-player. Instead, Mario Kart TV is a cherry on top of a week-old cupcake.

The biggest bummer of all is Battle mode. Instead of featuring arenas, you can choose between eight modified regular courses. The foundation is sound, as it becomes more of a jousting match as you circle around the course attacking other players, but the lack of an on-screen map makes finding other players difficult on the large circuitous tracks.

Mario Kart 8 is an enjoyable game that hits the basic bullet points required for the series. The new tracks are fun and the retro courses are reinvented and radical. Playing in multiplayer is still great fun, but the poor single-player experience sadly damns this game. Outside of Mario Kart TV, it adds very little that hasn’t been done before, and Mario Kart TV is nothing more than a superfluous addition.

I like playing Mario Kart 8. I think it’s a satisfactory entry in the series, but nothing more. The final package ends up feeling like someone who covers themselves in makeup to hide the fact that they are 10 years older than they are pretending to be.

Summary

Pros
  • Amazing music
  • Fun online and local multiplayer
  • Great track design
  • Lovely HD graphics
Cons
  • Mario Kart TV is lame
  • Miserable Battle mode
  • Stale single-player mode

Talkback

gamewizard65May 15, 2014

Majority of other reviews I've watched praised MK TV. Its all about the racing, baby! While it is a shame that those who enjoyed previous iterations of battle mode in an arena setting, will not be happy battling while race on the tracks selected, in the end, its a very minor part of the game.


What the hell does one expect from a single player mode! Pathetic review, pathetic site, plus this coupled with mainly negative RFN podcasts, Nintendo fans should steer clear of this negative sore fest!

broodwarsMay 15, 2014

Quote from: gamewizard65

What the hell does one expect from a single player mode!

Sonic All-Stars Racing Transformed and even Diddy Kong Racing shows what one can expect from a single-player racing campaign, and they were awesome for it. Split/Second's campaign was repetitive, but at least it managed some variety with different events, a progression system, & tracks that would loop in on one another to play with expectations. That Mario Kart's SP continues to be completely half-assed and boring shouldn't be acceptable anymore.  The bar's been set, and by Sega of all companies. Nintendo can at least pretend to show up.

TAYREL713May 15, 2014

An unexpected score but Neal and I rarely agree so I guess not an expected score, lol. I never was big into Battle Mode so thats a wash but "bland" that is a telling bit of phrasing. I guess I know what I'm in for when it comes to Mario Kart and I'm okay with it.

Disco StuMay 15, 2014

Quote from: broodwars

Sonic All-Stars Racing Transformed and even Diddy Kong Racing shows what one can expect from a single-player racing campaign, and they were awesome for it.

I always feel so alone in my opinion of Sonic All-Stars.  I thought it was a janky, confusing, un-fun mess of a game.  With boring visual design to boot.  I think the ultimate problem with it though was that Sega's stable of characters definitely leaves something to be desired...Sonic and his shitty friends indeed.

Just added video review to article.

latterdayrastaMay 15, 2014

Neal and Daan's review scores were determined before they ever played the game.  Based on comments from Connectivity, it's clear that Neal and Daan are tired of the core gameplay of Mario Kart.  I respect that that is their honest opinion of the game and the series, but maybe take that into account when reviews are assigned.  This is a Nintendo enthusiast site, so I assume that there is someone on staff who is still excited about Mario Kart.  Let that person review the game.  Personally, I still really love the core Mario Kart gameplay elements, and I'm okay that it has become a bit iterative.  I spent hours playing MKWii and MK7, and I can't wait to spend hours playing MK8!


I love the content you guys make, but if you find yourself thinking "this is more of the same," realize that this game series doesn't match your personal tastes anymore and find someone who can look at the game from a less jaded perspective.

jwristonMay 15, 2014

A Nintendo-based site gives by far the worst reviews for a Nintendo-published game? You are entitled to your opinions but I'm pretty disappointed by this. I hope these scores don't keep anyone away from what many are calling the best entry in the series. I'm looking forward to playing this with all of my Wii U loving friends.

azekeMay 15, 2014

Nothing like fanboys outraging over a score being too low before even playing the game themselves.

I actually went into playing the final version of Mario Kart 8 being super excited for it. I might have had reservations over the past year or so, but in the past month, I've gotten more and more excited for it. My logic? Well, it's Mario Kart. I'll have fun with it because it's Mario Kart. I embraced it like that, hoping to recapture the love and affection I had for MKWii and MK:DD.

Then I played the final game, and it really made every reservation and worry come to light (as I wrote about in the review). I played a lot of Mario Kart 8, and while I totally had fun with it (and I'm sure most of you critiquing this review will have even more fun with it), it just felt hollow to me. I started playing this game wanting to love it unabashedly like everyone else. It didn't happen that way. I didn't even totally realize I was skewing negative until I put the pen to paper.

Sorry you guys disagree with my score and my text.

SorenMay 15, 2014

You gave the game a score without talking about the online multiplayer at all. What's the difference here between this and Mario Golf?

SorenMay 15, 2014

Never mind that last sentence. I clearly can't read.

MastaPoMay 15, 2014

How come "Choose from over 50 different baby racers" isn't on the Pros list?

latterdayrastaMay 15, 2014

Quote from: NWR_Neal

I actually went into playing the final version of Mario Kart 8 being super excited for it. I might have had reservations over the past year or so, but in the past month, I've gotten more and more excited for it. My logic? Well, it's Mario Kart. I'll have fun with it because it's Mario Kart. I embraced it like that, hoping to recapture the love and affection I had for MKWii and MK:DD.

Then I played the final game, and it really made every reservation and worry come to light (as I wrote about in the review). I played a lot of Mario Kart 8, and while I totally had fun with it (and I'm sure most of you critiquing this review will have even more fun with it), it just felt hollow to me. I started playing this game wanting to love it unabashedly like everyone else. It didn't happen that way. I didn't even totally realize I was skewing negative until I put the pen to paper.

Sorry you guys disagree with my score and my text.

Fair enough.  All I expect is that the reviewer approach the game with an open mind, and it sounds like you did.  I admit that my comment was aimed a bit more at Daan, since I am usually irked when a reviewer begins an "unbiased" review by stating how bored he or she has been by previous entries in the series.  Then again, it is impossible to be truly unbiased about anything.


I don't hate the review, Neal, and I have never been the guy to rage about a review of a game I haven't played.  I just wanted to submit my two cents about pre-review expectations.

SteleMay 15, 2014

Thank you so much for mentioning GP Coop.  Most reviews have neglected this one way or the other.  It was one of the best things about the earlier MK games, and was sorely missing from the Wii version.  So glad they brought it back.

Ian SaneMay 15, 2014

Quote from: latterdayrasta

I love the content you guys make, but if you find yourself thinking "this is more of the same," realize that this game series doesn't match your personal tastes anymore and find someone who can look at the game from a less jaded perspective.

I would argue that "this is more of the same" is exactly what longtime Nintendo fans that frequent and Nintendo fan site would want to know.  You can assume that most of NWR's readers have played damn near every Mario Kart game so their experience would be similar to that of the reviewers'.  You're essentially saying that they should review it from the perspective of a newcomer but that's not the staff or the audience.

Mario Kart 8 sounds like it's Mario Kart, no more no less.  If you're sick of it, then you'll probably not be interested.  If you're not, you'll probably like it.

pokepal148May 15, 2014

Don't worry if you don't like this game you can enjoy all the other excellent games coming out on the system like.... lemme think a mimute........ just give me a second.......

....I'm gonna go play xenoblade.....

Every single person who owns a Wii U has played at least one previous Mario Kart game. Everyone has different opinions if this series coming into the newest game, and those are going to color (not pre-determine) your reaction to what the new one brings or doesn't bring. That is inevitable when you're dealing with such a long-running franchise.

Evan_BMay 15, 2014

Obviously you shouldn't have to apologize for your score, Neal. I'm just surprised at the venom I'm picking up from your review. Battle mode in Mario Kart has never been good, in my opinion, but I don't understand what more you could possibly want from Gamepad integration aside from gyro steering and mini-map display. Mario Kart is still meant to be played in groups, and the single-Gamepad pairing to the console means any additional functionality would be unfair to pro or Wii remote players.

While this seems like an excuse, it's more of a sad truth. Nintendo still had to create a Mario Kart experience that worked for every pro and con of the Wii U. I don't understand how a game can "best any other multiplayer racing game ever played" and still be the example of mediocrity, but hopefully you stand by your score.

I would have been interested to hear how ATVs handle and what community matchmaking is like, but if you don't think those features are interesting or noteworthy enough to warrant discussion, I'll leave it at that.

twofiftyoneMay 15, 2014

Diddy Kong Racing was practically a single player Kart Racer with Mult-iplayer added on (probably why they made a DS port)

Leo13May 15, 2014

I'm told that you can unlock things while playing 2-player. This is a big deal It was my favorite thing in Double Dash and it's why I gave away my copy of Mario Kart Wii. We always play with at least 2 players.

PhilPhillip Stortzum, May 15, 2014

Quote from: Leo13

I'm told that you can unlock things while playing 2-player. This is a big deal It was my favorite thing in Double Dash and it's why I gave away my copy of Mario Kart Wii. We always play with at least 2 players.

Yeah, that inclusion makes me very happy! :)

Quote from: Evan_B

Obviously you shouldn't have to apologize for your score, Neal. I'm just surprised at the venom I'm picking up from your review. Battle mode in Mario Kart has never been good, in my opinion, but I don't understand what more you could possibly want from Gamepad integration aside from gyro steering and mini-map display. Mario Kart is still meant to be played in groups, and the single-Gamepad pairing to the console means any additional functionality would be unfair to pro or Wii remote players.

For one, I don't even think I really mentioned the GamePad that much in my review. Still, one super easy thing to do was figure out how to make one player play off of the GamePad and another use the TV (e.g. like how Call of Duty: Black Ops II handled multiplayer). That's a simple, basic way to make the GamePad integrate with the game.

Outside of that? Well, I don't make games, but Nintendo did make Nintendo Land, which has incredible uses of the GamePad. If they created some kind of unique multiplayer Mario Kart experience using the GamePad, that would have been new, unique, and potentially incredible. Instead, they made a bad Battle mode and added the ability to upload videos to YouTube. Yay?

Quote:

While this seems like an excuse, it's more of a sad truth. Nintendo still had to create a Mario Kart experience that worked for every pro and con of the Wii U. I don't understand how a game can "best any other multiplayer racing game ever played" and still be the example of mediocrity, but hopefully you stand by your score.

7.5 isn't mediocrity. By my rough personal estimate, I term 7.5 to represent "the average game I would play" if that helps you at all.

Mario Kart, as a series, is the best multiplayer racing experience ever for me. Not saying it's the best multiplayer game period or the best game ever. That fact also doesn't wash away the boring single-player, the mostly uninteresting additions/tweaks, and the fact that it's the same as it ever was.

Quote:

I would have been interested to hear how ATVs handle and what community matchmaking is like, but if you don't think those features are interesting or noteworthy enough to warrant discussion, I'll leave it at that.

ATVs handle slightly different than karts. Personally, I never used them that much because I quickly preferred using bikes and stuck with what I liked.

Matchmaking is similar to MK7 but a little bit more beefed up.

Tyto_AlbaMay 15, 2014

Don't understand why you are trying to talk everybody out of getting this game. Maybe you should be writing for gamespot.

latterdayrastaMay 15, 2014

Quote from: Ian

I would argue that "this is more of the same" is exactly what longtime Nintendo fans that frequent and Nintendo fan site would want to know.  You can assume that most of NWR's readers have played damn near every Mario Kart game so their experience would be similar to that of the reviewers'.  You're essentially saying that they should review it from the perspective of a newcomer but that's not the staff or the audience.

Mario Kart 8 sounds like it's Mario Kart, no more no less.  If you're sick of it, then you'll probably not be interested.  If you're not, you'll probably like it.

I was not at all trying to say that games should be reviewed from the perspective of a newcomer.  Just the opposite.  All reviewers have their own tastes for certain games and genres.  I'm arguing that those tastes should be taken into account when the review is assigned.  I don't want to read a review of a football game by someone who is tired of football games.  Their opinion is going to be "this is like other football games I've played, and thus it is boring because it resembles those games."  How is that useful to me as a reader?

latterdayrastaMay 15, 2014

Quote from: Jonnyboy117

Every single person who owns a Wii U has played at least one previous Mario Kart game. Everyone has different opinions if this series coming into the newest game, and those are going to color (not pre-determine) your reaction to what the new one brings or doesn't bring. That is inevitable when you're dealing with such a long-running franchise.

Exactly!  Shouldn't the overall opinion of the reviewer be taken into account when the review is assigned?  Neal has stated that he was not tired of Mario Kart games when he approached this review, and I trust that he is being honest.  I wouldn't want to read a review by someone who dislikes or is tired of the game's genre or series.  Perfect example: as a Metroid fan I would get no benefit from reading a review of a Metroid game written by James Jones.

Evan_BMay 15, 2014

Thanks for the clarification, Neal. However, I still don't think Mario Kart is the sort of franchise that needs assymetrical multiplayer, but I understand your grading system. However, I think the rest of the industry would use an 8.8-9.5 for the same reasons.

SorenMay 15, 2014

Quote from: Evan_B

However, I think the rest of the industry would use an 8.8-9.5 for the same reasons.

They have. NWR's review scores are the lowest of 42 critic reviews currently on Metacritic.

KhushrenadaMay 15, 2014

Here's a quick question to all the people criticising the score for this Mario Kart game.

What order would you rank the Mario Kart games that have come out before it?

And be honest. If you haven't actually played a certain Mario Kart game, then don't list it or slot it in based on what you've heard about. This should be a list of your actual impressions from actually playing the games.

PhilPhillip Stortzum, May 15, 2014

Quote from: Tyto_Alba

Don't understand why you are trying to talk everybody out of getting this game. Maybe you should be writing for gamespot.

I think Neal is just explaining himself, which he doesn't even have to do.
If one person's opinion matters so much to you, then that's your problem.

PhilPhillip Stortzum, May 15, 2014

Also, who cares about a number? Seriously! Read the body, and when the game comes out for you to play it, see if you agree with the review BODY or not. Don't let some arbitrary number antagonize you.

lukas85May 15, 2014

wow this is fucked up, is the worst review on the net, taking points off metacricit and is totally wrong, you fucked up neal, you really did, you are the new gamespot.

Disco StuMay 15, 2014

I hope this game gets really robust DLC.  New sets of tracks would be so great.

ResettisCousinMay 15, 2014

I just watched the Youtube review. I have RARELY seen a video on Youtube with so many thumbs down. More than 20% of the viewers have rated the video, and it's currently at 85% down vote. And the analogy at the end about a woman in makeup was nothing short of embarrassing.

syn4aptikDave Mellert, Associate EditorMay 15, 2014

I see no point in either defending or attacking the score. It's the man's opinion. Nobody is going to score special Nintendo points for defending the game, and there are no real stakes. I mean, even if Nintendo were to never again make another MK game because of Neal's score, they'll be happy to sell you the ones they already made in perpetuity.

Quote from: lukas85

wow this is fucked up, is the worst review on the net, taking points off metacricit and is totally wrong, you fucked up neal, you really did, you are the new gamespot.

I don't want to speak for Neal, but I'm pretty sure "taking points off Metacritic" is something our reviewers don't consider at all when writing a review, not even a little bit.

LudicrousDa3veMay 15, 2014

Wow. I was a little surprised to find a 7.5 score anywhere, but it's still just a dude's opinion. Is this really a reason for a backlash; just because a reviewer didn't think the game was "all that"?


Besides all of that, I personally look at MK as a competitive game- which means the metagame is king, and we won't figure that out for a while. Until then, it's pretty, it's fun, and it's the only Mario Kart out there on a console*.
*current machine, with online play

CaterkillerMatthew Osborne, Contributing WriterMay 15, 2014

The review sounds fair to me. I played Mario Kart Wii about 1 or two days before I loaned it to a buddy and he lost it. The graphics put me off so much along with the thought of rampant blue shells I just didn't care since Double Dash disappointed me so much.


I'm really looking forward to this simply because of the graphics and aesthetics of the tracks themselves. I know exactly what I'm getting and after avoiding the home console Mario Kart for so long I think I will really enjoy this. Battle Mode is somewhat disappointing as well but I rarely ever play it so it's no biggie for me. I still expect DLC with classic style arenas though.


And yeah single player needs to get good. Mario Kart DS was pretty cool with all those random challenges. And like Broodwars said, something like Diddy Kong Racing's single player would be so nice for Mario Kart. Just something more.


I'm getting it and I'm sure I'll love online though.

AdrockMay 15, 2014

People are complaining about a 7.5? Calm your tits.

Ian SaneMay 15, 2014

So NWR gives the lowest review scores for this game.  So?  Why does that matter?  What, you were all planning on buying and enjoying this game and almost every other reviewer is saying "go for it!" but one site is not quite as enthusiastic and that screws it all up for you?  The reason a site like Metacritic even gets any views is because it's hard to go by just one review and having an average of all the reviews makes it easier to determine what games are worth your time.  The general opinion of most reviewers is that this is a game worth getting.  That should be all you need to help make your decision to buy it.

The only reason to really be upset is if any opinion contrary to your own, even if it is just one outlier, is a threat to your ego.  Either that or, like every notable Wii U release thus far, Mario Kart 8 has been put into the position as the "saviour" of the Wii U and any suggestion that it will not be is discouraging.  Mario Kart 8 is the game it is and no review will make it a better or worse game than it actually is.  Some negative reviews from major sites could hurt its sales but those big sites all seem to like it and NWR is not a big enough wheel that it will impact sales.

You want a reviewer to give his own opinion or you won't get an honest review.  There is no value in someone making assumptions on what a certain audience will like.  All he can accurately determine is if he likes it.

Luigi DudeMay 15, 2014

From reading many of the different reviews on the internet it goes like this.


The high reviews in the 9-10 range come down to people who play Mario Kart mostly for multiplayer racing and don't care that much for the single player or Battle modes.  So if you're someone who plays Mario Kart for the racing multiplayer, you'll probably really love the game and feel it deserves that score.

The lower reviews like the two here on NWR, come down to people who want a better single player and are really disappointed by what they did with Battle mode.  So if you're someone who cares more for the single player modes and really liked the older Battle modes, then you'll probably feel closer to the way they did.


So for people who are interested in the game, these are the things to think about.  The racing multiplayer aspect of the game is considered great, but the other parts of the game can be considered lacking.  Depending on how important these other parts are to you, it'll have a bigger effect on your enjoyment then others.

AdrockMay 15, 2014

I get the analogy at the end, but it isn't one I would use. I suppose a more apt analogy is hanging a painting over a cracked or damaged yet still structurally sound wall. The wall is solid, it will hold, but you're not addressing the problem; you're just making it look better.

All in all, the review is pretty fair. Points were docked for lacking originality. It comes down to what you're looking for. If you're expecting a Mario Kart game to be revolutionary and super-innovative, you're barking up the wrong tree. Neal mentioned something about Mario Kart 8 being Mario Kart 7 except on Wii U. If that's the case, sold. That's really what I want because I merely tolerate handheld games. The changes to battle mode are a bummer, but I rarely play it anyway. Ultimately, it seems like the game gets the racing part right and that's fine by me. Still, very few games are worth full price to me these days and Mario Kart 8 is no exception.

rlse9May 15, 2014

Wow, people sure get excited when the review of a game they haven't even played yet is "wrong"...

I'm guessing the review is fairly accurate based on what Nintendo seems to do with their games for the most part now, make the graphics prettier, add in a couple new features, and not really make any drastic changes.  I'm sure I'll have a blast with the game regardless.  I skipped Mario Kart 7 so I'm ready for a new Mario Kart game but I can see how especially people who play all of the console and handheld games could get a little burnt out on the series since it doesn't change that much from game to game.

The one thing about the review that does seem a little off to me is that everything within the review about Mario Kart TV was positive, other than that it was resources that could have been used elsewhere, but then under cons it lists "Mario Kart TV is lame."

Luigi DudeMay 15, 2014

Quote from: Adrock

I get the analogy at the end, but it isn't one I would use. I suppose a more apt analogy is hanging a painting over a cracked or damaged yet still structurally sound wall. The wall is solid, it will hold, but you're not addressing the problem; you're just making it look better.

Well for those that care mostly about the multiplayer racing, I wouldn't exactly say Nintendo hasn't addressed the problems with the series.  A lot of reviews have mentioned things like items and the different karts being better balanced then previous Mario Karts as well as overall track designs being stronger as well.  For people who play it primarily for the multiplayer races, just these things alone would be enough to consider an improvement to the structure of Mario Kart since they're making what's most important to many even better.


Like with Pokemon, not everyone feels the series needs to revolutionize itself to fix the problems.  To many, just providing better balance to it's core gameplay between installments is enough to justify a purchase because they're making what they already like even better.  Your analogy works perfectly for people like Neal and Daan, who wish Mario Kart 8 did more to revolutionize the franchise, but as we see with many other reviews, not everyone feels a lack of originality is a problem with this series since what they care most about in the multiplayer racing is even better then ever.

ResettisCousinMay 15, 2014

And the video has been removed. Or as Neal would say, it has been colored over like the gray hair of a 30 year old woman.

Doctor_PancakesMay 15, 2014

This is by far the most unprofessional review of any type of media I have ever had the displeasure to read/watch. Not only does the reviewer drone on about how he hates how much a Mario Kart game feels like a Mario Kart game he goes out of his way to insult women and with that ruined all respectability this site has gained over the years since it was Planet Gamecube in the days of old. Never have I been so disgusted by an opinion... is this what modern journalism has come to? Comparing a fantastic game to to some poor woman this shallow journalist dated once in College? I'm done here. It was a great site while you hired respectable staff but this level of insult is only expected of foul mouthed teenage rage gamers that set up channels on Youtube.

My favorite part of Mario Kart was the battle mode. I like the racing but I also liked the battle modes the games that have a battle mode tend to be the ones I like the ones that don't are the ones I don't like as much. I think it is perfectly fair for a man to write a review based solely on his own opinion. That is not journalism, reviews are NOT journalism they are opinions, that is how it is supposed to be. A review is not supposed to be a free ad for the game it is supposed to be an honest impression of the game. I don't care for the game because it was never going to be the game that sold me on a Wii U, it was just another game to sell to the existing audience which were already hyped. I find it stupid that anyone would attack a reviewer who has PLAYED the game when they have not done so just yet.

Also if you base your decision to buy a game or not based on a review site then your dumb, reviews are just other peoples opinions period, get over it.

KhushrenadaMay 15, 2014

From the song "Show Me" by ABC:

"9 out of 10 in every case
She might look pretty but there's make-up on her face"


The Lexicon of Love is a great album and one of the 80's top works. With the way things are hilariously going in this thread, I can't help but think of that lyric.

KhushrenadaMay 15, 2014

Quote from: Doctor_Pancakes

This is by far the most unprofessional review of any type of media I have ever had the displeasure to read/watch.

Looks like it's somebody's first day reading/watching.

There are lots of terrible reviews on the internet, there's no way this is anywhere near the worst. Go read some of mine, you probably won't be criticizing this one anymore.

What I find ironic is that all of the sites that gave this game a high score love Mario Kart TV, but Neal remains unimpressed because it's a novelty that doesn't add to the game's GAMEPLAY.  Marinate on that.

This game has three major areas: Single-player, Battle Mode, Online Multiplayer.  From what Neal is saying, single-player is vanilla and about as much of a retread as you can get. Battle Mode is disappointing and comes across as pretty lazy.  Mario Kart TV is a side feature that's a novelty, and he wishes that it would have been axed instead for a revamp of one of the aforementioned areas that haven't seen any considerable change, or have in fact become worse from previous installments, in his estimation.

All that said, a 7.5 seems like a pretty legit score to me. To me a 7.5 is a good game with some serious flaws, that may not be everybody's cup of tea. Neal has outlined what he considers those flaws to be. Makes sense to me.

ShayminMay 16, 2014

How apropos that a Mario Kart review thread spawns so many drive-bys.

The concerns about Battle Mode don't bug me because for me, the next good Mario Kart battle mode will be the first. So I might go higher when my game arrives because Battle Mode means more to Neal. Thing is, I don't know and won't until the first week of June.

If you're worried about this affecting the Metacritic... door's over there, don't let it hit ya where the good Lord split ya.

Lucariofan99May 16, 2014

Mario kart DS battle was amazing shaymin :@

BlackNMild2k1May 16, 2014

To me is just sounds like another case of Nintendo focusing on all the wrong things for the right reasons.

Where they needed to do something new and different, they didn't need to do it at the expense of the things we already loved and expected to be improved upon. This is the story of Iwata and his Wii U.

TheBigKMay 16, 2014

Good review, Neal. Informative and raw. I like it. I can completely understand where your scoring comes from and your review substantiates it completely. I'm surprised and disappointed by the changes to the battle mode. The days of Block Fort and Big Donut chaos are over... Mario Kart TV seems like a neat little addition, albeit completely unnecessary. I don't see myself using it ever, but I guess it's cool for those who will. It really seems like Mario Kart Wii or 7 with a new coat of HD paint. I never expected the 1P campaign to change from previous instalments, but I'm always hoping they'll switch it up a little bit. Sadly, this is not the case. I wish they'd make a mission mode just like Mario Kart DS. For what it is, I don't think it's worth the $65 CAD ($75 w/ tax) price tag so I'll probably hold off for a little while.


I do have a question, though. What are the controls like? I know you can use GamePad, Pro Controller, and Wii Remote, but can you use the Classic Controller? If I do get this at some point, I refuse to shell out another $50 just to play it with a traditional controller. Did they improve button mapping since Wii? I found Wii's Classic Controller controls to be rather awkward, especially with tricks being mapped to the D-pad and items only usable with the L button.

BlackNMild2k1May 16, 2014

NO BLOCK FORT!? .....NINTENDO!!!!!!

:moonface:


contemplates cancelling MK8 pre-order....
remembers free game for buying.... reconsiders.

pokepal148May 16, 2014

For me it's basically 'I can pick up this and get pikmin 3 for free so I can play that if I want to.

WindyMay 16, 2014

I think its just getting to be the same old same old with these Mariokarts. I just sold my MK7 and imbactually going to skip on this one. I never played 7. I thought I would play a lot with the online play but it just didn't feel right. 8 has had so much hype I feel like I've already played the game. Its also not enough for me to buy a Wii-U. Now if Dragon Quest X gets ported the Wii--U will be mine! Haha

Evan_BMay 16, 2014

Yeesh, this escalated. Quickly, poorly, whatever.

Ultimately, my mind just continues to flit back to Neal's closing remark, which is really what seems to be what ticks most people off about this review (aside from the ridiculous fanboyism). It's a really harsh note to end on and makes Neal's "It's a good game with flaws" message seem more like a sting from an embittered, nostalgic fan.

PhilPhillip Stortzum, May 16, 2014

This topic has turned into one of the many things I freaking deplore about this industry. smfh

SorenMay 16, 2014

Quote from: TheBigK

I do have a question, though. What are the controls like? I know you can use GamePad, Pro Controller, and Wii Remote, but can you use the Classic Controller?

Gaf confirms Classic Controller Pro.


Why was the video review wiped off the face of the earth YouTube?

ResettisCousinMay 16, 2014

The review uses the word 'recent' repeatedly. "Recent Mario Kart" I, for one, don't own a 3DS. Mario Kart Wii came out in 2008 -- SIX years ago. I don't consider that recent in video game terms. The review says that many of the tracks are new and unique and extremely fun, yet says the campaign - the structure within which you play these extremely fun tracks - is boring with the ONLY saving grace being essentially co-op. Wouldn't playing fun, new-feeling and unique tracks be the 'saving grace'? The review barely mentions what effect zero gravity has on the gameplay in terms of shortcuts or 'spin boosting'. And there is no discussion about the new power-ups, time trials, nor a a description of the kart parts to unlock. These are some of the reasons, aside from the tacky closing, that the review falls short. Of course some of the long time fans and staff might say this is a complaint about the numerical score, but it's anything but. The fact is this review does NOT meet the standard of detail and usefulness this site should have for the biggest game we've seen and will see in many months on WiiU.

RachtMay 16, 2014

I feel that the score is very fitting - brilliant, actually. Kudos to Neal and Daan for calling out the game for what it does with this iteration. Am I excited to purchase and play it, though? GOOD HEAVENS, YES.

As I've mentioned to both Lindy and Neal on the Twitters and what-have-yous, I feel that in order for Mario Kart to truly evolve, it needs to take on some sort of merit-based/exp gains type of system embedded into its GP single-player mode. I want to feel as if I'm truly progressing - getting better with EXP that I can apply to certain racing stats in my driver and/or kart. Keep in the customisation options for creating a unique kart (that stuff is great!), and then expand on it. We have a Wii U GamePad in our hands, correct? Let us draw and create logos/art/etc. on our karts for true customisation (anyone who dares draw a penis and/or similar whatnots get banned from online play.)

As for the tracks themselves... Seriously, and hear me out on this, please. MAKE THEM BIGGER. And do away with the four tracks in one cup method. By that, I mean go the route of Gran Tourismo or other similar GP racing games (I'll explain!) Mario Circuit, right? Ok. So, Mario Circuit has a specific leg of the track you'll race in in the beginning stages of the game - call it Amateur difficulty to start. So track circuit will be titled Mario Circuit 1 (throwback to the SMK days.) On MC1, you'll notice as you race this particular leg of the track, that certain track paths are blocked off by rails - these paths leads to harder turns, more difficult terrain, etc. that you'll later come back to in say Mario Circuit 2 or 3...or even 4. On the track map, you'll only see the path you're able to drive on, though, based on the circuit number you're racing.

I feel that this method, in creating larger, more expansive tracks, would open up the series to having WAY more options to race on - without having to resort to half of the game being retro tracks all of the time. And instead of cups, you have difficulty levels that have a much larger list of tracks to race on - garnering points and statistics as you race your way up the leader board. At the end of a specific difficulty level, you'll win that difficulty level's cup (sure, have it mushroom shaped for the first one.) :P:

As for battle mode? Why can't we have both? I much prefer the VS. racing mode over balloon battle (Mario Kart is about racing, after all), but I'd love to have an extensive balloon battle mode with lots of arenas themed from each of the specific courses. And, of course, Block Fort. :P: Gotta have Block Fort. And for the love of all that is holy and pure, BRING BACK THE 360 SPIN MOVE from the N64 game! Gah. That element was brilliant in multiplayer battles.

But anyhow. Long post is long. That's my two pennies worth. Good job, Neal and Daan.

We're making a revised version of the video review. In the past, one of the criticisms we got about our video reviews was that the narration was basically just the written review in voice form. We wanted to try something a little different this time with Neal using a basic outline for the narration instead of an exact script. I think as a companion to the written review it worked fine, but a ton of people on YouTube didn't read the written review and I feel were unfairly condemning Neal's opinion of the game. The updated video review is going to use Neal's written text almost to the exact word with him adding a few extra thoughts on the new gravity mechanics. It should be ready Friday morning. Hope that explains things.

Reviews on NWR are not meant to go over every last detail. That's why there are previews, news, etc. It sometimes varies from writer to writer, but I can sum up why I didn't mention things like time trials, zero-g and the like in detail: they weren't that big of a deal to me. If you think that is a failure of the review, then I suggest you read previews and watch Nintendo Directs instead of reading reviews because that seems to be what you would prefer.

"Recent" is a variable term. To me, I used it to separate the Mario Kart games that follow the specific 32 track formila from the older ones. I apologize if that was confusing. I will be mindful of that in the future and try to use a different term.

I would like to reiterate that I did enjoy the game but it burned fast for me. A major part of Mario Kart to me is replaying it. I don't think I will replay this one a lot. So even though I praised the beauty and course design, the structure of the game (specifically the single player) didn't grab me.

SundoulosMay 16, 2014

More often than not, most of the single player events in Mario Kart games since 64 (with the possible exception o f MK DS) haven't captured my interest for all that long.  I even got bored with MK 7 after a few weeks, and I eventually sold it. 

I enjoy MK Wii more than most did mostly because it is a game that my wife and my children all want to play together; it's one of their favorite things to do.  It's also probably the reason why the Wii U version will be a long-standing hit with us as well.  I imagine that if I primarily played it by myself, I would get bored with it pretty quickly. 

Updated video review is taking longer than I thought. Aiming for this afternoon, but no promises. Thanks!

AdrockMay 16, 2014

Quote from: Penguin_Of_Thyme

Updated video review is taking longer than I thought. Aiming for this afternoon, but no promises. Thanks!

This is bullshit. I rate your post a 7.5. Points deducted for lack of timeliness and innovation.

Maybe it is because I don't have kids but even the multiplayer didn't grab my friends and me. We gravitated towards playing other local multi games instead. Make of that what you will.

SorenMay 16, 2014

It would have been great to read more about the online portion of the game instead of just the one sentence we got.

UncleBobRichard Cook, Guest ContributorMay 16, 2014

Since you didn't like it, can you overnight it to me and have it here by tomorrow?  I'd love to surprise the gang at my StreetPass group. ;)

OblivionMay 16, 2014

Holy shit, the salt in this thread is through the roof. Why is a bad thing that NWR gave the game a 7.5?

Qbert FarnsworthMay 16, 2014

Flawed as it is, and like it or not, aggregate score sites like Metacritic have become a part of the perception of video games. It always irks me when sites will post a low score outlier as it reeks of drawing attention to itself (see GameSpot's review of Donkey Kong Country Tropical Freeze). There's just a little too much "Hey look at me! I'm docking a lot of points on a game everyone else likes. I'm an independent thinker."

Both this review and GS's DKCTF review dock in inordinate amount of points for the game not feeling new enough. In the age of annual Call of Duty or Assassin's Creed releases, it seems like nitpicking to dock a game that comes out once per platform for merely fitting its genre. It's a racing game, and your Diddy Kong "appease the hub world elephant kart adventure games" are the exception. The fact that Mario Kart lives on while Diddy Kart has not shows that the Grand Prix cup formula is what kart genre fans want. To dock points for fitting a limited genre would be like holding it against Madden games for not having the guts to add more platforming elements.

Beyond that, your criticisms are in line with every other review of the game - most of which docked 1 out of 10 points for them.

Quote from: Soren

It would have been great to read more about the online portion of the game instead of just the one sentence we got.

You can race online. It runs smoothly. You can play against strangers or with friends. You can only use voice chat (through GamePad only) during lobbies in friend matches. There are also tournaments, which are sort of like mini Grand Prixs you can make, but it's all based on people showing up at a predetermined time, which I'm a little wary of being that useful. If I go online, it'll likely be to play with friends locally and/or online for the hell of it.

pokepal148May 16, 2014

are people really getting upset about that make-up analogy? Yeesh,

And there are far worse reviews out there, for example.

pokepal148May 16, 2014

Omg I forgot to put the image

http://i.imgur.com/jvjkSHX.jpg

Qbert, our two reviews of this game were posted at the same time as dozens of others. We have no way of knowing or predicting the Metacritic average. To suggest that our site's scores are intentional outliers is ignorant of the actual review process, which is independent, personal, and honest.

CaterkillerMatthew Osborne, Contributing WriterMay 16, 2014

Was it IGN's Mario Kart Double Dash review that gave it like a 7.9 or something? I remember that causing the internet to slip it's ship.

Qbert FarnsworthMay 16, 2014

Quote from: Jonnyboy117

Qbert, our two reviews of this game were posted at the same time as dozens of others. We have no way of knowing or predicting the Metacritic average. To suggest that our site's scores are intentional outliers is ignorant of the actual review process, which is independent, personal, and honest.

That's fine. As a Nintendo site, you surely know the ballpark of what a game is going to receive based on their track record. Most reviews of a 3D Mario game will be 90-95 out of 100. A 2D, side-scrolling Mario game will be 80-90. Zelda will be 90-100. Mario Kart will be 85-90. Smash will be 90-95. Barring some huge glaring flaws which will be noted when video game websites get hands-on previews, we know the scores will be in these areas.

What I'm saying is that worst case scenario, you knew Mario Kart would be no lower than an 85 average (some scores would be higher, some lower). If they game was underwhelming to you, you could have gone with the 80 out of 100 (or 8/10 on your scale), but that gets lost in the shuffle with the other less-than-impressed scores. Nobody who doesn't currently read the site comes to read the review with an 80. But a 75, that's a full 10 points lower than the worst-case scenario Metacritic score. That shouts "Hey look, we review Nintendo, but refuse to be seen as Nintendo fanboys." That gets more attention than an 80, more attention gets more page views, more page views equals more ad revenue.

I also believe it's foolish to dock Nintendo for merely meeting the bar which they themselves raised. They more or less invented the genre. Super Mario Kart and Mario Kart 64 are two spectacular kart racing games. Others Mario Karts have reached those levels, others have failed. It's no different than New Super Mario Bros games. By all accounts, Sega would kill for Sonic games that good. Sony would kill for Little Big Planet to be that good. If they created games that good with Sonic or Sack Boy, they would be lauded. But because it's Mario,  because it's up against Super Mario 3 and Super Mario World, the reviews are just ho-hum. That's what this review feels like. If Sonic, Little Big Planet Racing, or Mod Nation made a kart racer this good (by almost all other accounts), the reviews would be "Mario Kart has met its match." Instead, you dock points for a Mario Kart game being a Mario Kart game.

We don't factor Metacritic into our reviews. We don't base our reviews at all on what other reviewers do or have been perceived to do. Our reviews are the opinions of the reviewer with as little outside influence as is possible.

If you don't like what we write, might I suggest reading a different site?

Qbert FarnsworthMay 16, 2014

Quote from: NWR_insanolord

We don't factor Metacritic into our reviews. We don't base our reviews at all on what other reviewers do or have been perceived to do. Our reviews are the opinions of the reviewer with as little outside influence as is possible.

If you don't like what we write, might I suggest reading a different site?

Talk about some thin skin. I wasn't aware that discourse was discouraged.

You gave your opinions on the game. I gave my opinions on your opinions including the impression that it seemed a little click-bate-ish. I find it unlikely that you are unaware of what competing game sites might say of the game. You have a website with "Nintendo" in the title. Surely you are aware of how well previous Nintendo titles were received by video game journalists.

No non-Wii U owner is looking to a website with Nintendo in its name in order to make an objective decision on whether or not to purchase a Wii U and Mario Kart 8. Surely you know that by offering what is perceived as a low-ball 7.5 score, all you are doing is trying to catch the eye of Nintendo fans to come to your Nintendo fan site (or so it seems). I generally like the work NWR does, so the perception of a click-bate score bothers me more than the score itself which is ultimately irrelevant since I was buying this game anyway (because what else am I going to play).

OblivionMay 16, 2014

So, Qbert, what you are saying that since NWR is a Nintendo fansite, Mario Kart 8 and other staple series cannot have low scores? I'm curious, what exactly is "click-bait" about the review? You can't see a score without clicking on the review already and nothing about the blurb makes it seem like click-bait.


To me, it sounds like you're a Nintendo fanboy who is a little peeved that a Nintendo fansite didn't share your opinion. I think a fansite is good for being more critical than the popular press; they seem to know Nintendo and get sick of the shit Nintendo does far more than the IGN reviewer that plays one Nintendo game a year.

OblivionMay 16, 2014

Quote from: Oblivion

So, Qbert, what you are saying that since NWR is a Nintendo fansite, Mario Kart 8 and other staple series cannot have low scores? I'm curious, what exactly is "click-bait" about the review? You can't see a score without clicking on the review already and nothing about the blurb makes it seem like click-bait.

To me, it sounds like you're a Nintendo fanboy who is a little peeved that a Nintendo fansite didn't share your opinion. I think a fansite is good for being more critical than the popular press; they seem to know Nintendo and get sick of the shit Nintendo does far more than the IGN reviewer that plays one Nintendo game a year.

Evan_BMay 16, 2014

Aren't reviews supposed to cover every aspect, even if it's the reviewer's opinion on these aspects? One could argue that your 'second opinion' article could be used for this, but the other review covers the same ground- I would prefer it if a second opinion was an alternate viewpoint or at least tried to cover different content, but two reviews of similar content and the exact same score released so closely together could be another reason for the backlash.

Anyway, I'm not trying to feed the fire or anything, merely offering some thoughts

Quote from: Qbert

Quote from: NWR_insanolord

We don't factor Metacritic into our reviews. We don't base our reviews at all on what other reviewers do or have been perceived to do. Our reviews are the opinions of the reviewer with as little outside influence as is possible.

If you don't like what we write, might I suggest reading a different site?

Talk about some thin skin. I wasn't aware that discourse was discouraged.

You gave your opinions on the game. I gave my opinions on your opinions including the impression that it seemed a little click-bate-ish. I find it unlikely that you are unaware of what competing game sites might say of the game. You have a website with "Nintendo" in the title. Surely you are aware of how well previous Nintendo titles were received by video game journalists.

No non-Wii U owner is looking to a website with Nintendo in its name in order to make an objective decision on whether or not to purchase a Wii U and Mario Kart 8. Surely you know that by offering what is perceived as a low-ball 7.5 score, all you are doing is trying to catch the eye of Nintendo fans to come to your Nintendo fan site (or so it seems). I generally like the work NWR does, so the perception of a click-bate score bothers me more than the score itself which is ultimately irrelevant since I was buying this game anyway (because what else am I going to play).

Did you not read the post you quoted? None of those things are relevant in our review process. Even if Neal or Daan had seen other reviews before writing theirs, they wouldn't factor into it. This isn't a big picture thing here, we review games as they are, and try to leave Metacritic bullshit outside of it, as any reviewer worth his salt should do.

Evan_BMay 16, 2014

Sorry, that post was directed towards Neal's comment earlier. Didn't realize it would be stormed by a few other posts.

If anything, this pair of reviews summarizes exactly what any non-Nintendo gamer has faced in the past generation of consoles- any online-multiplayer game having a lackluster single-player campaign because that's just how developers direct their time in regards to multiplayer titles. You can always brig up Sonic Transformed as an example of a goodsingle player campaign but truthfully there's a ton wrong with that game otherwise so it would still end up with the same mediocre score as MK8. That point aside, Nintendo fans are starting to get irked with what they perceive as Nintendo "getting away with" releasing a game that is not as innovative as previous titles. I'm not going to comment on that but I will say this- it's not something that has creeped up on the industry. Any developer knows that they need to cut back on content to release a game as soon as possible to maintain an aggressive  presence in the market, but Nintendo is known for saving their est ideas for subsequent releases and that they're banking hardcore on MK8 boosting some sales for them. The only difference this time is that there's nothing innovative "enough" to warrant MK8's existence- rather than being a quintessential experience it's more of the same. This is a viewpoint I understand, but I can look past because I love Mario Kart and I think that it's a franchise that delivers satisfyingly.

And that's all I'll say about that. Some may say "more of the same" but I think that's bull because it's clearly not, at a fundamental level.

Qbert FarnsworthMay 16, 2014

NWR insanolord, don't you think you're being disingenuous regarding Metacritic. Even if you don't check it out, your review gets used on it, and no part of me believes that you didn't think your score would be lower than the average, hence why I called it click bate.
If the Metacritic process is bullshit (it is), why allow your score to be included? Why not change the reviewing system to something like Kotaku's "Should I play this? Yes or No?" You did a review and a second opinion piece on it. Why not do a Siskel and Ebert "Thumbs Up or Thumbs Down" system with two reviewers? If you give a game a 7.5, they can convert that into a 75 on their system rather easily. If you give them only two thumbs up, two thumbs down, or one up, one down to work with, they can't convert that to their system because then a 0, 50, or 100 does not come close to accurately reflecting a review. If you don't give yourself a chance to be seen as an outlier, then you don't create the opportunity for clowns like me to perceive your outlier score as click bate.

That's just my two cents. (I generally enjoy your site).

Sorry, I should have been more through in my previous post. Not only do we not know how other people will review the game, we also don't care. It may be interesting to read other opinions afterward, but our reviewers take care to not be influenced by other reviewers or what we might speculate they will think. Don't you want an honest take on the game?

Here's the good news -- you don't want us to write click-bait nor intentionally pull down Metacritic, and I'm telling you that we don't do either of those things. It's a shame if you don't believe that.

Qbert FarnsworthMay 16, 2014

Quote from: Oblivion

So, Qbert, what you are saying that since NWR is a Nintendo fansite, Mario Kart 8 and other staple series cannot have low scores? I'm curious, what exactly is "click-bait" about the review? You can't see a score without clicking on the review already and nothing about the blurb makes it seem like click-bait.


To me, it sounds like you're a Nintendo fanboy who is a little peeved that a Nintendo fansite didn't share your opinion. I think a fansite is good for being more critical than the popular press; they seem to know Nintendo and get sick of the **** Nintendo does far more than the IGN reviewer that plays one Nintendo game a year.

I didn't say they can't have low scores. In my other posts, I said that one could estimate the range of scores for this game without reading a review. It becomes click bate because aggregate sites like Metacritic use the NWR score.

If you estimate that Mario Kart will score at least an 85, then you can guess that a 75 would be much lower than the average and it stands out more than say an 80. In truth, the Metacritic score is 88. The NWR review docked it for the same offenses as other reviews, but then docked it extra for not innovating enough. The Mario Kart bar was raised so high. It seems pretty hard to expect another Mario Kart game to raise that bar higher, and it seems asinine to dock points for failing to do so. If the controls were bad, framerates were choppy, if the game was laggy, if the game was unbalanced to the point of being unplayable go ahead and dock points. That doesn't seem to be the case. It seems to be a case of a good series producing another good game, but the new game merely maintained the previous level of quality rather than being transcendent.

Ian SaneMay 16, 2014

Quote from: Qbert

It's a racing game, and your Diddy Kong "appease the hub world elephant kart adventure games" are the exception. The fact that Mario Kart lives on while Diddy Kart has not shows that the Grand Prix cup formula is what kart genre fans want.

I think DKR's formula didn't survive mostly because Rare was sold by Nintendo before they got a chance to make a sequel.  Donkey Kong Racing was one of the titles they had announced when they were sold.  The Mario Kart series, however, obviously could continue on so it did.  I don't think the market had any real input on the direction of Kart racers.  Nintendo briefly offered two options and then shitcanned one of them.  The market never truly had any choice of what direction they preferred.

What I liked about DKR wasn't specifically the hub world but just that the approach to the game was obviously to try out new concepts in the kart racing genre.  They wanted to see where the concept could go.  Mario Kart games did that as well early on when it was effectively creating the entire kart genre, but don't do it as much anymore.  That's what a want.  I want Nintendo to see where they can take kart racing and they obviously don't really want to do that.  Mario Kart 8 exists entirely so that there is Mario Kart product on the Wii U.  Some people don't care as long as they get new tracks and the game is fun.  But if you do care then a 7.5 makes a lot of sense.

It's only clickbait if the reviewer scores a game as such specifically to produce that kind of result, and I think I know Neal and Daan well enough to know that's not the kind of thing they'd do. It's a lower score than most others because they had more of a problem with the content of the game than most other reviewers, which will happen with literally every game. Sometimes it's us, sometimes it's a different site, but there's usually always someone who scores a game outside the norm.

We don't have any kind of malicious intent here, we just express our opinions and try to explain them as best we can. This isn't the first time people have come into TalkBack and complained about a review score, and I'd wager it won't be the last. That's the way this business goes.

KhushrenadaMay 16, 2014

Why is any reviewer supposed to be estimating what the metacritic score is going to be in the first place?

What you're saying is this: A person gets a game, plays it, and feels so-so about it. It has some strong points and some weak points. The reviewer than decides on his score for the game based on his experience. But now he has to try and figure out what all other reviews for it will be like. So, even though he felt so-so on it, he should assume his opinion is wrong and that everyone else playing the game is going to like it a lot and rate the game very higher than he feels about it? How does that work?

I've watched a movie with my friends that I thought was terrible and when I started complaining about it, I found out they all liked it. They'd agree with some of my points but it worked for them they said. It boggles my mind how they could like it despite very clear reasons and examples of stupidity. Now, if we were to write reviews of the movie, my score would be much lower than theirs. However, according to you, I should recognize that other people will rate it higher and I need to adjust my score to be a bit higher otherwise I'm being disingenious and not following the crowd for the sake of trying to display "independent" thought. And heaven help me if I bring down the Metacritic score! Moreover, if I had seen the movie on my own and not with my friends, I'd have assumed that everyone felt like me and would be ranking the movie the same way. How am I supposed to figure out they liked it? Knowing they liked it, however, doesn't change how I felt about the movie or what I think are legitamate complaints against it and I feel like there are other people who would feel the same as me so I'm going to write a review and score it based on my own experience with it. If people disagree with it, so be it, but it's just my honest assessment of it.

The problem with most people complaining in this thread is that they seem to have seen the score and automatically assumed it was done on purpose to incite more web traffic. Despite not frequenting this site or looking back at the reviewers past history of positive reviews, they are somehow able to read their thoughts and know this was exactly what they were thinking and that they actually did like the game and are trying to con everyone.

Moreover, if you actually want to base your opinions on Metacritic and for it to be useful, then you should be encouraging people to score games on how they actually feel on playing it regardless of other people's impressions and reviews. Then by having a large amount of honest reviews, you'll have a more accurate score. Wanting people to adjust how they score games based on how others might score it and that it could affect the Metacritic average only ensures that the Metacritic numbers become useless as they don't reflect the truth of any reviewer.

Moreover, if upon playing the game, you want to disagree with the review by citing actual examples and real impressions of the game from having played it, then go ahead. There's nothing wrong with that kind of discussion. It's what people always liked about Siskel and Ebert when they disagreed with each other and argued about a movie citing points about it. But all the people complaining because the score isn't the same as other people's score is just pointless since that is not a legitimate complaint nor do they have the same expertise as the reviewer from not having played the game to be able to accurately judge and critique it or the review.

lolmonadeMay 16, 2014

The score is a 7.5....not a 5 or below.  I could see why there might be some blowback if the game was actually rated poorly, but it's not, it's rated as a good game with some issues that hold it back from being considered great by the reviewer.

Shoot....NWR isn't even the only sub-80 score on metacrtic anymore.

Doesn't it make possible sense that review for a Nintendo site and most likely have played every single Mariokart game might be a bit more fatigued at the iterative nature of the franchise since Double Dash?

Finally, lol at all the internet crusaders coming to the resuce of Mariokart's metacritic score.  I assure you, you're the only ones that care about the game's metacritic rating, and are making such a fuss over something that has literally no significance.

lolmonadeMay 16, 2014

Quote from: Khushrenada

I've watched a movie with my friends that I thought was terrible and when I started complaining about it, I found out they all liked it. They'd agree with some of my points but it worked for them they said. It boggles my mind how they could like it despite very clear reasons and examples of stupidity. Now, if we were to write reviews of the movie, my score would be much lower than theirs. However, according to you, I should recognize that other people will rate it higher and I need to adjust my score to be a bit higher otherwise I'm being disingenious and not following the crowd for the sake of trying to display "independent" thought. And heaven help me if I bring down the Metacritic score! Moreover, if I had seen the movie on my own and not with my friends, I'd have assumed that everyone felt like me and would be ranking the movie the same way. How am I supposed to figure out they liked it? Knowing they liked it, however, doesn't change how I felt about the movie or what I think are legitamate complaints against it and I feel like there are other people who would feel the same as me so I'm going to write a review and score it based on my own experience with it. If people disagree with it, so be it, but it's just my honest assessment of it.


What movie are you referring to?  I'm asking both because I'm genuinely curiuos AND it'll spawn more interesting discussion than the bickering over a review score.

Qbert FarnsworthMay 16, 2014

Khushrenada, your movie analogy is apples to oranges. You disagreeing with your friends has no potential conflict of interest because you are not getting advertising revenue based on page views. Also, Mario Kart must maintain certain elements to be a Kart racing game with Mario characters. There are certain aspects of Mario Kart that you know it's going to be rated on: graphics, game play balance, controls, online options, etc. There needs to be racing, there needs to be weapons (per the brand's formula). We have a frame of reference. The reviewers docked it points for not being something it's not. They wanted to see it do something like a story mode like Diddy Kong Racing. That's not Mario Kart, so it seems unfair to penalize it for asking Mario Kart to not be Mario Kart. Had Smash Bros Brawl not included Subspace Emissary, would it have lost points?

Movies on the other hand can stand on their own. For example, Gravity was well-reviewed and I thought it was terrible. I thought it was terrible because the characters were cardboard cliches (Clooney is one mission away from retirement, Bulluck has to learn to let go of the past, etc.), the science was bad, and overall, it was a little too corny for my taste. I didn't think Gravity was bad because there weren't enough lightsaber fights which worked well in other space movies.

pokepal148May 16, 2014

Quote from: Qbert

I didn't say they can't have low scores. In my other posts, I said that one could estimate the range of scores for this game without reading a review.

one could also just play the game, write a review, and be like "what do you know, I guess I didn't enjoy this game as much as everyone else did, oh well.

Quote:

It becomes click bate because aggregate sites like Metacritic use the NWR score.

If you estimate that Mario Kart will score at least an 85, then you can guess that a 75 would be much lower than the average and it stands out more than say an 80.  In truth, the Metacritic score is 88.

so what, you think this is some intentional attempt to bring down the metacritic score and attract clicks? If that were the case why not give it a 6.5, or go all the way and give it a 1.

And for the record from what we know of the roster that alone is enough to take off a full point for.

Quote:

The NWR review docked it for the same offenses as other reviews, but then docked it extra for not innovating enough. The Mario Kart bar was raised so high. It seems pretty hard to expect another Mario Kart game to raise that bar higher, and it seems asinine to dock points for failing to do so.

Name a mario kart game with a good single player mode.

Mario Kart DS brought us the last major revamp to the Mario Kart formula. Since then there seems to be a cycle of features being lost such as:
Wii: +12 racers -no free for all battle mode, -less robust (and now defunct) mission mode,

7: +coins return +glider(sonic did flying karts better) and underwater(number of people who CARE= 0)
-no single player V.S. mode (grr...) -no mission mode -back to 8 racers

8: +that antigrav thing +single player VS. mode +some stupid replay thing +2p gp(that's probably local only)
-no items held behind you (WHY!!!!!) -actual battle arenas -oh mission mode... where are you, (honey look I'm sorry you maybe maybe feel I don't appreciate you but I can make it up to- honey no don't do this to me.

Quote:

If the controls were bad, framerates were choppy, if the game was laggy, if the game was unbalanced to the point of being unplayable go ahead and dock points. That doesn't seem to be the case. It seems to be a case of a good series producing another good game, but the new game merely maintained the previous level of quality rather than being transcendent.

Which raises the question of why you would get this one
Except the series has failed to address any of the concerns raised with it's single player and seems to remove just as many features as it adds with each entry. people have the same complaint about Zelda but those games at least try to feel like fresh, new experiences. Mario Kart doesn't even make any effort to hide how iterative it is,


Had Smash Bros Brawl not included Subspace Emissary, would it have lost points?

If a game's not that fun when you're playing by yourself that's exactly the kind of thing I want to see in a review. How much of a barrier to enjoyment that is will depend on the play style of the individual, and will thus affect the scores from different reviewers to different degrees. I really don't see what's so hard to understand about that. It's a difference of opinion, not some vast conspiracy.

Qbert FarnsworthMay 16, 2014

pokepal, I didn't say the low score was to bring down Metacritic. I said, here's the expected window of scores. NWR is an outlier. Outliers are often done as clickbate. I saw the review, disagreed with the methods used to dock points down to what I consider clickbate level. My issue is more the integrity of the review than the score. If the game played like crap, or if it played at a level just much lower than what we've come to expect, then fine. Take away points as needed. Instead, points were taken away for not including things that didn't need to be included and for Mario Kart TV (a bell and/or whistle at most) not being anything special.

LinksFury777May 16, 2014

This is like IGN's MK Double Dash 7.9 review all over again.


Obviously, none of us plebeians have played the game yet, but the gaming press has.  So, you have make sure you read the text of the review, not just the score.  My problem with the review is that outside of Battle Mode, Neal pretty much criticizes Mario Kart for being.......Mario Kart.  And that's it.  Zero-gravity is very briefly mentioned and then not talked about at all which, from the Mario Kart Nintendo Direct, is supposed to add more to the game since you get boosts when you ram another racer while in zero-gravity mode.  Neal doesn't even mention this at all.  The problem with the review isn't the score, it's the lack of detail as to why an installment in a very highly regarded series like Mario Kart is given such a mediocre score.  He had to know that a 7.5 score on the most impressive looking Wii U game thus far was going to be controversial.  Just saying it's more of the same isn't enough.

UncleBobRichard Cook, Guest ContributorMay 16, 2014

There's a world of difference between disagreeing with someone's opinion and calling someone's opinion wrong.  Some people don't seem to understand that.

KhushrenadaMay 16, 2014

Quote from: lolmonade

Quote from: Khushrenada

I've watched a movie with my friends that I thought was terrible and when I started complaining about it, I found out they all liked it. They'd agree with some of my points but it worked for them they said. It boggles my mind how they could like it despite very clear reasons and examples of stupidity. Now, if we were to write reviews of the movie, my score would be much lower than theirs. However, according to you, I should recognize that other people will rate it higher and I need to adjust my score to be a bit higher otherwise I'm being disingenious and not following the crowd for the sake of trying to display "independent" thought. And heaven help me if I bring down the Metacritic score! Moreover, if I had seen the movie on my own and not with my friends, I'd have assumed that everyone felt like me and would be ranking the movie the same way. How am I supposed to figure out they liked it? Knowing they liked it, however, doesn't change how I felt about the movie or what I think are legitamate complaints against it and I feel like there are other people who would feel the same as me so I'm going to write a review and score it based on my own experience with it. If people disagree with it, so be it, but it's just my honest assessment of it.


What movie are you referring to?  I'm asking both because I'm genuinely curiuos AND it'll spawn more interesting discussion than the bickering over a review score.

Transformers. The first one. I've never watched any of the others after it.

Those Transformers movies were really popular and made a lot of money. You're just saying you don't like it as clickbait.

KhushrenadaMay 16, 2014

You're just saying that since I covered my house in advertising banners and billboards and give my people my home address to come over and complain if they don't like my low-scoring reviews.

pokepal148May 16, 2014

Quote from: Qbert

pokepal, I didn't say the low score was to bring down Metacritic. I said, here's the expected window of scores. NWR is an outlier. Outliers are often done as clickbate.

Or it could be a person who legitimately didn't enjoy the game. Considering how you have failed to prove your 'clickbate' (it's spelled clickbait btw) theory and almost everyone seems to agree with the whole 'didn't enjoy the game sentiment' I feel you are at the losing end of that debate

Quote:

I saw the review, disagreed with the methods used to dock points down to what I consider clickbate level

so in your opinion it's clickbait, well I'm pretty sure opinion /= fact.

Quote:

My issue is more the integrity of the review than the score. If the game played like crap, or if it played at a level just much lower than what we've come to expect, then fine. Take away points as needed.

so you say that your issue is not with the score but with the "integrity of the review"(what the hell does that even mean) and are now trying to tell us what is apparently ok or not ok to take points off for.

Quote:

Instead, points were taken away for not including things that didn't need to be included.

you mean as in features, content, those things? You know that add value to a game?

Quote:

and for Mario Kart TV (a bell and/or whistle at most) not being anything special.

MKTV has been heavily hyped by Nintendo, it better be good.

OblivionMay 17, 2014

Quote from: Qbert

Outliers are often done as clickbate

:Q :Q :Q :Q :Q :Q :Q :Q :Q


So, no one can never not dislike a game? You've never seen a work of entertainment that someone, anyone, didn't like? Why should they up their score .5 just to make it more in line with the average of other websites?

Updated video review: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a_TIxmicilg&feature=youtu.be


As Jared said, we tried something different with the original video review (more stream of conscious following an outline) and as those who saw it can attest, it didn't really work. The new video review is a slightly modified version of the written review.


In general, we'll be experimenting with video reviews (and other video content, like Curt's weekly news show) over the coming months. In retrospect, maybe this review wasn't the best one to mess around with. But honestly, despite allegations otherwise, I didn't think this review would be as much of an outlier as it was.


As I've said before in this thread and other places, I'm sorry if you are upset by the review. It wasn't done maliciously. It wasn't done to be different.


I wrote and scored the review this way because Mario Kart 8 felt formulaic to me in a way no other Mario Kart has felt like before, even with the zero-g stuff, MKTV, online, etc. I enjoyed it, and likely, if all you want is more Mario Kart, you'll enjoy it even more than I did.


The single-player is a major component to me, and I even played some of Sonic & All-Stars Racing Transformed and Crash Team Racing this week to reaffirm how I felt. Those single-player modes are engaging to me. MK8's isn't. Multiplayer is fun and all, but to me, that's not the entire game.


Also, for real, new battle mode is rough. I tried so hard to try to get into it, but like 1 out of every 10 matches was fun.

Every write a giant post because you're super angry but then you don't post it because it'll just be bad for everybody involved?


I just did that. Then deleted it.


I'll say this:


Expecting a review to read and be scored to a certain level before playing the game (No, listen, you didn't play the game), seeing a score and text that doesn't fulfill your personal expectations, then getting angry at the reviewer for not writing to those expectations, is revolving. This is exactly why I hate the review process.


Buy the game, play the game, enjoy the game. Neal and Daan's reviews DON'T. MATTER. They are OPINIONS. If you are letting THEIR opinions influence YOUR emotional state, THAT IS ON YOU. NOBODY is responsible for YOUR reaction to ANYTHING except for YOURSELF.


JESUS.

ResettisCousinMay 17, 2014

So Zach, why should this site have reviews if they don't matter, and why should the reviews have a talkback feature if the comments shouldn't reply directly to the review? I mean, I know you're still working through your anger at the n-Space guy, but looking past that…?

Look. This is exactly why I don't like the review process. People question your OPINION.


This has nothing to do with n-Space (that was specific to them--I won't go into the inside baseball with that).


This has to do with any review, not just on our website. If reviewer X from site Y gives Halo 4 a review and scores it anything below an 8, people will go apeshit. That particular reviewer just didn't like the game as much as other people. That's it. No conspiracy.


People have unfair expectations. Bottom line. It's not my job to meet your expectations which I don't know ahead of time, and even if I did, I don't really care. So I get angry when people get angry when their personal expectations are not being met. It's so useless.


In a perfect world, game reviews would not exist. If people can't have a civil discussion, then they don't get to HAVE a discussion.

Zach is absolutely right. Talkback still serves a purpose, and I think we all welcome constructive criticism, fact-checking, and especially further discussion from those readers who have played the game. This is an unusual situation in which Nintendo facilitated reviews being published well before the game'a release. People who don't like the outcome here have come armed with the phantom sword of other people's opinions to fight in a proxy war of words. We can only defend our editorial integrity, and most of you can only assume that you won't agree with every word of Neal and Daan's reviews once you play it yourselves. Rather than ask questions of those who do have the game, you arrive with attacks predicated upon your own ignorance. Get bent.

Maybe we should tell Nintendo to make sure not to give us any kind of advance copies in the future to prevent this from happening again.

PhilPhillip Stortzum, May 17, 2014

I find reviews like these helpful because when I finally get to play the game, I can watch for the things mentioned and see if they bother me as much as the reviewer. These are things that I might not have otherwise thought about, so it's awesome to read about them and think about them while playing.

tl;dr: This is a sorry excuse for a review. J/K hehe

pokepal148May 17, 2014

Quote from: NWR_insanolord

Maybe we should tell Nintendo to make sure not to give us any kind of advance copies in the future to prevent this from happening again.

Are you even on an embargo like are there things like unrevealed characters who you can't talk about?

latterdayrastaMay 17, 2014

Quote from: Jonnyboy117

Zach is absolutely right. Talkback still serves a purpose, and I think we all welcome constructive criticism, fact-checking, and especially further discussion from those readers who have played the game. This is an unusual situation in which Nintendo facilitated reviews being published well before the game'a release. People who don't like the outcome here have come armed with the phantom sword of other people's opinions to fight in a proxy war of words. We can only defend our editorial integrity, and most of you can only assume that you won't agree with every word of Neal and Daan's reviews once you play it yourselves. Rather than ask questions of those who do have the game, you arrive with attacks predicated upon your own ignorance. Get bent.

I'm honestly shocked by the thin skin demonstrated by the staff of this site. Outside of a few mean spirited comments, most of what has been said has started as constructive criticism of the review. Instead of engaging in an intelligent discussion of the review process and acknowledging some flaws in this review, the staffers have spoke with a single voice in protecting their friend from the "bullies" attacking Neal. I hoped for a more mature response.


Most people who commented here did not come to burn Neal in effigy. I have respect for Neal, but I have issues with the approach of this review. I couldn't care less if he gave the game a 2 or a 20. I wanted to discuss the optimal way that games should be evaluated. It's not too late to take this discussion in a more constructive direction.


In contrast to his defenders on staff, Neal has taken the criticism very humbly. He has responded by answering a few questions and has resisted the urge to fire back. Kudos to you, Neal. I already had respect for you, and that has only increased.

I wasn't trying to defend Neal from constructive criticism. We welcome that. I was more going after people insisting he had some ulterior motive for the score he posted and misspelled accusations of clickbait.

KhushrenadaMay 17, 2014

None of you know anything about Kart racing otherwise we'd all be talking about M&M's Kart Racing and how it has set the bar which no game has been able to surpass yet.

Unfortunately, Gamezone and IGN decided to clikbate up the whole metacritic score with a 20 and 25 ranking respectively. Didn't they take into account what other critics were going to score it at and adjust their scores accordingly? DewritosPope gave it a 10 out of 10 and said: "Truly one of the best games i've ever played in my life, definitely the citizen kane moment in video game history, i really wish we would have gotten a sequel." However, despite this positive response, Gamezone and IGN clearly conspired to give this game a negative review to score more advertising green and hurt the sales of another Wii game thereby making sure the Wii would fail.

IGN's review mentions "There's no four-player mode, and no battle mode." I'm sick of reviewers criticising a game for what they think it should offer and deducting it points for not being something it's not. They wanted to see it do something like Cranky's Flight School in Donkey Kong Barrel Blast. That's not M&M's Kart Racing so it seems unfair to penalize it for asking M&M's Kart Racing to not be M&M's Kart Racing.

Even worse, the reviewer then tells you "to become a Reese's Pieces fan instead." Not only does the reviewer drone on about how he hates how much an M&M's Kart Racing game feels like an M&M's Kart Racing game he goes out of his way to insult the fine people at the Mars Chocolate company and the wonderful products they put out and with that ruined all respectability that site had gained over the years. Never have I been so disgusted by an opinion... is this what modern journalism has come to? Comparing a fantastic game to some old candy this shallow journalist experimented with once in College because everyone was doing it with Reese's back then? The analogy is nothing short of embarrassing.

You'd think I was done burying this reviewer but I'm not stopping at 6 feet. I'm taking this son-of-a-gun straight to hell. He had the gall to say that the game "offers about as much fun as a half-eaten bag of Peanut style." How could you not enjoy half a bag of peanut M&M'S?!? That reviewer should realize that this product doesn't match his personal tastes anymore and find someone who can look at it from a less jaded perspective. And why no mention of regular, pretzel or almond M&M'S? Would the game be as fun as those? The review is seriously lacking in details and leaves out all kinds of important factors like that.

That is by far the most unprofessional review of any type of media I have ever had the displeasure to read/watch. And because of it, now we are all stuck having to play the lousy Mario Kart series because there's nothing else in the Kart genre to play. And I know it's lousy because NWR gave it a 75%. Even though Metacritic calls that a POSITIVE score and lists Mario Kart 8 as having a 100% positive reviews, I can read between the lines and realize that the series is clearly not liked very much.

KhushrenadaMay 17, 2014

Quote from: latterdayrasta

Quote from: Jonnyboy117

Zach is absolutely right. Talkback still serves a purpose, and I think we all welcome constructive criticism, fact-checking, and especially further discussion from those readers who have played the game. This is an unusual situation in which Nintendo facilitated reviews being published well before the game'a release. People who don't like the outcome here have come armed with the phantom sword of other people's opinions to fight in a proxy war of words. We can only defend our editorial integrity, and most of you can only assume that you won't agree with every word of Neal and Daan's reviews once you play it yourselves. Rather than ask questions of those who do have the game, you arrive with attacks predicated upon your own ignorance. Get bent.

I'm honestly shocked by the thin skin demonstrated by the staff of this site. Outside of a few mean spirited comments, most of what has been said has started as constructive criticism of the review. Instead of engaging in an intelligent discussion of the review process and acknowledging some flaws in this review, the staffers have spoke with a single voice in protecting their friend from the "bullies" attacking Neal. I hoped for a more mature response.

There may be some people that are trying to leave constructive criticism but there were also a few people that came on here just to judge and be flippant about the review and reviewer. Then it just makes all criticism seem as complaining for the sake of complaining and seem like a witch hunt for someone having the gall to have a different opinion. I also question how many people actually come here for reviews all the time and are making a complaint because the review didn't do enough to explain different game elements. I notice that most of the regulars here have very few complaints about the review but it is a lot of the sudden new population who are asking or criticising things about it.

It's funny. This hullaballo about the review has made me realize that I hardly use reviews for my gaming purchases anymore. When it comes to established series, I know ahead of time whether I'll buy it or not. In fact, I'll skip reviews to avoid spoilers. Generally, it's only if a game is an unknown or new IP that I'll check them out a bit more. However, I still do check out various reviews from this site and I've never had a problem understanding the reviewers viewpoint and I can't recall any instance where I didn't think the person reviewing the game was being unfair to it. The latest review I checked out somewhere else was IGN's Kirby: Triple Deluxe review. I wonder if after reading that people would still think this Mario Kart 8 review was being unfair.

KhushrenadaMay 17, 2014

Quote from: Khushrenada

I can't recall any instance where I didn't think the person reviewing the game was being unfair to it.

Ha ha ha. Whoops. That should just be fair not unfair. Gotta love Talkback errors.

Quote from: Khushrenada

Quote from: Khushrenada

I can't recall any instance where I didn't think the person reviewing the game was being unfair to it.

Ha ha ha. Whoops. That should just be fair not unfair. Gotta love Talkback errors.

Freudian slip.

UncleBobRichard Cook, Guest ContributorMay 17, 2014

Yeah, I don't think it's "constructive" to accuse the staff on the site of lying and creating clickbait articles.

KhushrenadaMay 17, 2014

Quote from: NWR_insanolord

Quote from: Khushrenada

Quote from: Khushrenada

I can't recall any instance where I didn't think the person reviewing the game was being unfair to it.

Ha ha ha. Whoops. That should just be fair not unfair. Gotta love Talkback errors.

Freudian slip.

No, just an error in speech that occurred due to the interference of an unconscious train of thought guided by the ego and the rules of correct behaviour. I don't know what you'd call that.

Quote from: UncleBob

Yeah, I don't think it's "constructive" to accuse the staff on the site of lying and creating clickbait articles.

Unless what you're trying to "construct" is hostility and your own inevitable downfall.

SundoulosMay 17, 2014

Clearly this thread demonstrates why game reviewers are among history's greatest monsters.

Seriously, though, I've never really understood why people get emotionally invested in a review to the point where they feel it necessary to attack the integrity of the reviewer.  Given that a good bit of the criticism of the review has gone in this direction, I don't blame the staff for defending Daan and Neal.  I love games as much as the next person, but among the myriad of things that I could choose to get upset about in this world, game reviews are pretty much at the bottom of the list. 

For the record, I think I'm probably going to really enjoy this game in spite of its shortcomings.  I'm not in love with their decisions about the Battle Mode.  I haven't enjoyed the battles in any of the games since the N64 days;  I don't think that it's been well-executed since that time, sadly.  If this is the direction that they are going with it, at this point I probably wouldn't miss it if they eschewed the mode all together.  What does appeal to me about MK8 is the design of the race tracks; the themes are largely the same, but the tracks just seem very creative this time around.  I thought the track design in MK Wii was okay, and I'm probably in the minority in thinking that the tracks in Double Dash were just boring, but something about the design of the MK8 tracks appeals to me.  Maybe I'll feel differently when I experience the game, but I'm still pretty hyped about it right now.

ResettisCousinMay 17, 2014

Qbert's suggestion of "click bait" has drawn a lot of feedback from the NWR establishment. I'm sure the ad revenue from additional metacritic clicks is minimal at best- although I'm also sure having the lowest score on metacritic does generate additional traffic. I believe Neal that that wasn't his goal, and I appreciate that he's been mostly even in his replies to the feedback. Also, the redone video review is an improvement. But is the idea that the site might use a big game to provoke interest and maybe "stick it" to a Nintendo perceived as dangerously conservative so outrageous, given that last month the site published "Three Reasons Why I'm Not Excited For MK8" and "MK8's Use of the Gamepad is Disappointing?"

OblivionMay 17, 2014

Oh no, they released two articles that gave their opinion again. In an editorial. Which, by definition, is an opinion piece.

UncleBobRichard Cook, Guest ContributorMay 17, 2014

Not to mention... Mario Kart 8's use of the Gamepad is disappointing.

I mean, seriously.

Widespread criticism of the GamePad functionality took place several weeks before the game's release date. It was a smart marketing plan by Nintendo, because the topic seemed stale by the time reviews were being written.

ResettisCousinMay 17, 2014

The point was either of those headlines could be taken as clickbait, especially coming from a big Nintendo fansite. I don't have a problem with the articles (or the headlines).

SorenMay 17, 2014

Quote from: latterdayrasta

Most people who commented here did not come to burn Neal in effigy. I have respect for Neal, but I have issues with the approach of this review. I couldn't care less if he gave the game a 2 or a 20. I wanted to discuss the optimal way that games should be evaluated. It's not too late to take this discussion in a more constructive direction.

This is fair. There were a lot of problems with Neal and Daan's reviews and they had nothing to do with the opinions of the reviewers themselves (which I respect). If the staff wants to focus on the Metacritic "click bate" trolls a double down on their defense of that then great. But it just bogs down any actual discussion of the review process.

Evan_BMay 17, 2014

As someone who has been a fan of Sonic the Hedgehog and seen his rapid fall from grace over the last eight or so years and also someone who has been hyped for games that have been reviewed poorly, I don't put much faith in reviews. They are opinions, it just sucks that they've become so recognized as that which sets the bar in the industry that people even get emotionally invested in a score before playing the game.

Then again, I think far too many criticisms of video games are unwarranted. Unless it's Super Mario 3D Land we're talking about, here. That game is trash.

lolmonadeMay 17, 2014

Quote from: Khushrenada

Quote from: lolmonade

Quote from: Khushrenada

I've watched a movie with my friends that I thought was terrible and when I started complaining about it, I found out they all liked it. They'd agree with some of my points but it worked for them they said. It boggles my mind how they could like it despite very clear reasons and examples of stupidity. Now, if we were to write reviews of the movie, my score would be much lower than theirs. However, according to you, I should recognize that other people will rate it higher and I need to adjust my score to be a bit higher otherwise I'm being disingenious and not following the crowd for the sake of trying to display "independent" thought. And heaven help me if I bring down the Metacritic score! Moreover, if I had seen the movie on my own and not with my friends, I'd have assumed that everyone felt like me and would be ranking the movie the same way. How am I supposed to figure out they liked it? Knowing they liked it, however, doesn't change how I felt about the movie or what I think are legitamate complaints against it and I feel like there are other people who would feel the same as me so I'm going to write a review and score it based on my own experience with it. If people disagree with it, so be it, but it's just my honest assessment of it.


What movie are you referring to?  I'm asking both because I'm genuinely curiuos AND it'll spawn more interesting discussion than the bickering over a review score.

Transformers. The first one. I've never watched any of the others after it.

I can see why someone wouldn't like the first one.  I saw Transformers 1 and enjoyed it for what it was, butI definitely wouldn't defend it against criticism.  Definitely don't see why anyone would bother watching the follow-ups, unless you didn't get enough explosions & robots fighting in the first one.

UncleBobRichard Cook, Guest ContributorMay 17, 2014

Stopped by GameStop - played the demo.  Second time I've got to play MK8 Demo...

...It's Mario Kart.  More of the same.  That's not bad, by any means... but still.  Just more Mario Kart.  I have 4 great Mario Kart games with me in my car right now (and one not-so-great one).  Mario Kart 8 is "hey, this system needs a Mario Kart title!", not "Well, I have this really great idea for a game..."

Granted this could change when I purchase the full release (which I will, of course) - but from what I played, more Mario Kart is just more Mario Kart.

Quote from: UncleBob

I have 4 great Mario Kart games with me in my car right now (and one not-so-great one).

Mario Kart is my co-pilot?

KhushrenadaMay 17, 2014

What would Mario Kart do?

deepsouthMay 17, 2014

The only thing that bothers me about this review is the timing of it. Nintendo has thier backs against the wall, and desperatly needs  Mario Kart 8 to ship a ton of consoles. This review is telling people that not only is MK8 not that good of a game, but that it's not worth buying a console over too. Whether you said that or not is beside the point, your low score implies it. And people will take this review seriously Simply becouse it appears to be a Nintendo friendly site! So a website that uses Nintendo's name to help promote themselves, kicks Nintendo when thier on the ground. And as far as the click-bait theory, well I don't know this website good enough to make an assumption about that. But what I will say is that i've never visited this website before, and didn't even know it existed until I saw the ridiculous 7.5 rating it gave to MK8. So whether this review was intentionally made for click-bait or not, like i said, it wouldn't be right for me to comment on. But it did draw me in.

RachtMay 17, 2014

Quote from: deepsouth

blah blah something something...This review is telling people that not only is MK8 not that good of a game, but that it's not worth buying a console over too. ...blah blah something something blah blah

Seriously, you need to stop looking at game review scores as if they're being graded on an academic scale. A 7.5 is above average. 5? That's average. See? One to 10. Not, One to seven is crap, seven to 8.5 is ok, and 8.5 and above is exceptional. None of that nonsense. Get over yourself.

Game is good. Game will be bought. By myself and LOTS of others. It will even sell consoles. Ta da! Happy, fun times. Enjoy your game.

broodwarsMay 17, 2014

Quote from: deepsouth

The only thing that bothers me about this review is the timing of it. Nintendo has thier backs against the wall, and desperatly needs  Mario Kart 8 to ship a ton of consoles. This review is telling people that not only is MK8 not that good of a game, but that it's not worth buying a console over too. Whether you said that or not is beside the point, your low score implies it. And people will take this review seriously Simply becouse it appears to be a Nintendo friendly site! So a website that uses Nintendo's name to help promote themselves, kicks Nintendo when thier on the ground. And as far as the click-bait theory, well I don't know this website good enough to make an assumption about that. But what I will say is that i've never visited this website before, and didn't even know it existed until I saw the ridiculous 7.5 rating it gave to MK8. So whether this review was intentionally made for click-bait or not, like i said, it wouldn't be right for me to comment on. But it did draw me in.

You do realize that every site on the internet has been reviewing Mario Kart 8 because the review embargo lifted, right? There's no "timing" to these reviews. Nintendo lifted their restrictions on reviews, and the reviews went up. End of story. If you want to be concerned about "timing", be concerned that Nintendo chose to release an apparently incredibly formulaic and underwhelming Mario Kart game when they have "thier back against the wall" and "desperatly needs  Mario Kart 8 to ship a ton of consoles" (nice spelling, by the way. It seems to be a common trait in the people complaining about these reviews).

deepsouthMay 17, 2014

Racht, where do you get the idea that a five is an average score? Name me one game that was given a five out of ten and considered average. A 7.5 is a horrible score, and it WILL impact sales. Believe it or not. I hate when people think that these type of reviews dont have consequences or impacts on a games sales. These reviews are more than just an opinion. And get over myself? what does that even mean?

And broodwars, I meant timeing as in the position that nintendo is currently in with thier Wii U, and that a bad review of such an anticipated game is, well, bad timing! And underwhelming is your opinion, as I believe it to be the best Mario Kart yet.

UncleBobRichard Cook, Guest ContributorMay 17, 2014

Quote from: broodwars

If you want to be concerned about "timing", be concerned that Nintendo chose to release an apparently incredibly formulaic and underwhelming Mario Kart game when they have "thier back against the wall" and "desperatly needs  Mario Kart 8 to ship a ton of consoles".

Snark aside, this.  So much this.  Don't blame NWR because the game isn't the best thing ever.  They didn't make it.

You're right - Nintendo really needs to move some consoles.  And they're going to do that with fun and exciting games that everyone *has* to have.  Everyone had to have Mario Kart Wii because no one played Double Dash and for a lot of people, it sucked with the two-rider mechanic.  Mario Kart Wii was the first basic Mario Kart game on a console since Mario Kart 64.  Mario Kart 8 is a re-hash of Mario Kart Wii and it simply isn't going to move a buttload of systems.  It's like New Super Mario Bros. Wii sold a lot of systems because it was the first 2D Mario Platformer on a console in *years*.  Lots of people wanted a new Mario game... Mario Kart Wii U will go the same path as New Super Mario Bros. Wii U... a fun game that folks enjoy, but not something the vast majority of folks are going to rush out and buy a console for.

Nintendo really, really needs a new, fresh game that gets people excited.  And at this point, they could use one or two *more* of those.  Mario Kart Wii part 2 isn't that game.  It'll be a fun game, but it's not going to be a system seller.

I have more faith in the new Smash Bros., as so many people have been craving a new Smash Bros. game since Melee and so many people disliked Brawl.

KhushrenadaMay 17, 2014

Quote from: deepsouth

Racht, where do you get the idea that a five is an average score? Name me one game that was given a five out of ten and considered average.

Hometown Story, Weapon Shop de Omasse, and Mario Party:Island Tour are examples of that.

broodwarsMay 17, 2014

Quote from: deepsouth

And broodwars, I meant timeing as in the position that nintendo is currently in with thier Wii U, and that a bad review of such an anticipated game is, well, bad timing! And underwhelming is your opinion, as I believe it to be the best Mario Kart yet.

How can you possibly believe it to be "the best Mario Kart yet" when you haven't played it? Everyone's opinion is different. We all have our tastes and personal biases.

And I love the insinuation, by the way, that reviewers apparently owe Nintendo high reviews for their latest cash-grab because Nintendo royally fucked-up with the Wii U in every possible way.

UncleBobRichard Cook, Guest ContributorMay 17, 2014

Many of the folks who seem to be criticizing this review seem really off to me.

They're saying that the review should factor in the (potential) MetaCritic score.  The review should factor in that Nintendo needs to sell systems.  They should factor in all kinds of things - none of which reflect on the gameplay itself.

Dear any site that reviews games anywhere on the internet: Please don't do this.  Review the game for what it is*.  Be honest about it.  That's all I ask.

*One caveat is to factor in the price.  A $10 eShop platformer might be the same quality as a $40 3DS retail title - but the lower retail price gets it a bit of a bump for me - it's about value. :D

KhushrenadaMay 17, 2014

Quote from: deepsouth

as I believe it to be the best Mario Kart yet.

Which 3 tracks would you say are your favorite and why? How do you feel about the Battle Mode courses?

Quote from: deepsouth

The only thing that bothers me about this review is the timing of it. Nintendo has thier backs against the wall, and desperatly needs  Mario Kart 8 to ship a ton of consoles.

Kind of been a problem for awhile. Pikmin 3 hasn't done it, Wonderful 101 hasn't done it, Super Mario 3D World hasn't done it, Donkey Kong Country: Tropical Freeze hasn't done it. Maybe Mario Kart 8 will do it but if Super Mario 3D World couldn't with all the positive reviews it got, I wouldn't expect Mario Kart 8 to do it no matter how many great reviews it got.

Quote:

This review is telling people that not only is MK8 not that good of a game, but that it's not worth buying a console over too. Whether you said that or not is beside the point, your low score implies it. And people will take this review seriously

That's amazing considering how many people say they weren't even aware of this site before. If I saw a bunch of reviews that were positive from a lot of regular sites I visited and then saw one that was negative from a site I never heard of, I know I'd suddenly put a lot more weight to what this unknown site was saying than the ones I trusted before.

And I guess when this site gave Donkey Kong Country: Tropical Freeze a 9.5 out of 10, Super Mario 3D World a 10 out of 10, Wonderful 101 a 9 out of 10 and Pikmin 3 a 9.5 out of 10, nobody took it seriously and that's why the games didn't sell more and save the Wii U. But this 7.5 score everyone will take seriously and immediately cancel pre-orders and sell off their Wii U's and buy PS4's instead. Right.

Guess what? The 3DS is selling quite well but nobody came here complaining when Yoshi's New Island got a 6 out of 10. Why is that? Because it didn't matter since the 3DS is selling well? How does that make any difference? A game is good or bad regardless of how well a system is selling. Just like a movie is good or bad regardless of how many tickets it sells. There can be bad movies that make a lot of money and good movies that don't. It's not the reviewers job to sell tickets. It's the movie studio's job. A reviewer just assesses the job that's been done.

Quote:

Simply becouse it appears to be a Nintendo friendly site! So a website that uses Nintendo's name to help promote themselves, kicks Nintendo when thier on the ground.

Since it is a site that follows Nintendo products and only reviews games released on Nintendo systems, I guess a better name would be Xbox News Station. Yes, the name Nintendo is used because that's the site's focus. If they are using Nintendo to promote themselves, I would think you should have heard of this site long before they posted this review.

For your info, this site used to be called PlanetGameCube because it covered Gamecube games. With the Wii release, it was renamed Nintendo World Report to keep from changing its name for every Nintendo console release and that's the way it has stuck. So, yes, just as it "appears", it is a Nintendo Friendly site. However, that doesn't mean that it is automatically going to praise every Nintendo game that gets released. Or perhaps you think Game & Wario should have been automatically given a 10 out of 10 by the reviewers here since this site has Nintendo in the name and by not doing so is kicking Nintendo when they're down. Or is it possible that not every Nintendo game is perfect?

Quote:

And as far as the click-bait theory, well I don't know this website good enough to make an assumption about that. But what I will say is that i've never visited this website before, and didn't even know it existed until I saw the ridiculous 7.5 rating it gave to MK8. So whether this review was intentionally made for click-bait or not, like i said, it wouldn't be right for me to comment on. But it did draw me in.

You won't comment about it being click-bait but you will still talk about it to the effect that you see it as being that way.

deepsouthMay 17, 2014

Broodwars, first off, I have played MK8, and your right, everbody has different opinions. Mine is that its the best one in the series. Second, I don't agree that Nintendo "royally fucked up the Wii U in every possible way". And third I wasn't insinuating anything. Look, you can defend this site all you want, that is your right. You may have been on this site for a long time and the reviewers may even be good friends of yours. I understand, no problem. I'm sure they're good people. But I just think it's a little strange that a website that appears to be Nintendo friendly, (Nintendoworldreport) would give the most anticipated game on the Wii U so far, the lowest score out of nearly fifty reviewers on metacritic.The irony is just a little to thick for me to ignore, thats all.

And Unclebob, to say that double dash sucked is your opinion. But to say that nobody played it is just inaccurate  since it sold seven million copies. I believe it actually was one of the best selling MK's considering the low sales of the gamecube.

UncleBobRichard Cook, Guest ContributorMay 17, 2014

Did I say Double Dash sucked?

Because I own six copies of it, along with Seven GameCubes and six Broadband Adapters.  How many copies do you own?

Bwahaha, I haven't seen so many cringeworthy review complaints since the equally stupid and embarrassing Pangya fiasco from back in my day:


http://www.nintendoworldreport.com/review/13300/super-swing-golf-wii


Neal's a good man, and I firmly believe he reviewed this game to share his honest thoughts and experiences. Not to watch a bunch of you lose your collective (and I do mean collective, you hivemind buffoons) shits.


That doesn't mean that *I* haven't been reading for that very reason, however. Bwahahaha.

No, please continue. Hahahaha.

deepsouthMay 18, 2014

NWR Karl, I don't believe anyone is losing thier collectives shits here, lol. I havent seen anyone blow up, just people posting thier opinion, thats all. And Im sure Neal is a good guy, he just had a bad review. It happens to Most good reviewers on the internet. Jose Otero is someone I have a lot of respect for, but man did he write a shit review of kirby triple deluxe, and I let him know it too. Hivemind buffoons huh? Why becouse people disagree with this painfully inaccurate review? So is anyone with a different view than that of the reviewer a "hivemind baffoon"? Surely you expect a little backlash when you give such a game a low score.

deepsouthMay 18, 2014

Unclebob, yes you did say it sucked. And I only own one copy of double dash. But I own four copies of hogans ally on the NES, but it doesn't mean I like it. We collectors collect, doesn't matter if we like the game.

UncleBobRichard Cook, Guest ContributorMay 18, 2014

Quote from: deepsouth

Unclebob, yes you did say it sucked. And I only own one copy of double dash.

Quote pls.

Quote from: NWR_Karl

Bwahaha, I haven't seen so many cringeworthy review complaints since the equally stupid and embarrassing Pangya fiasco from back in my day

The fallout from the 10/10 Mario golf (or was it Tennis?  Pretty sure it was Golf) was worse.  I think Seanbaby did a saterical write up on it and the staffer who wrote that piece abandoned the site shortly after.

I will defend the site and the review because people here appear to generally be more down to earth than other Nintendo fan site, which is what I like about it these people don't just sing Nintendo's endless praises like some sites. These fans, these idiots who come here to shit all over a perfectly fair review are the very reason I chose this site in the first place,  because some people think that Nintendo can do no wrong and that their games deserve good review scores period. Damn the guy writes his opinion and suddenly people have to make it sound like his one review will single-handedly destroy Nintendo.

deepsouthMay 18, 2014

Khushrenada, your going out of your way to defend this site, and this review, and it isn't neccesary. I'm glad NWR gave all those other amazing Nintendo games the scores they deserved. They should have done the same to this amazing game. About Yoshis new Island getting a 6, well I wasn't here to argue that review, and it wasn't on the same scale as this one. A six is low, should have been a 7.5. And your sarcasm about the other games not selling consoles is inaccurate. All those games you mentioned did move consoles, just not as many as Nintendo would have wished for. You would be suprised at the amount of people who decide not to purchase a game becouse of a metacritic score. Any negative review on any game impacts the sales of said video game, even if it's by a miniscule amount.

deepsouthMay 18, 2014

Unclebob, my apologies. You said to a lot of people it sucked.

Quote from: UncleBob

Quote from: deepsouth

Unclebob, yes you did say it sucked. And I only own one copy of double dash.

Quote pls.

Quote from: NWR_Karl

Bwahaha, I haven't seen so many cringeworthy review complaints since the equally stupid and embarrassing Pangya fiasco from back in my day

The fallout from the 10/10 Mario golf (or was it Tennis?  Pretty sure it was Golf) was worse.  I think Seanbaby did a saterical write up on it and the staffer who wrote that piece abandoned the site shortly after.

I don't remember the Talkback being that bad for Mario Tennis, but it's been ages, obviously. Both were Stan Ferguson, though, who continues to be a lovable curmudgeon over on Box Office Poison at Crosstawk. /plug

It was SomethingAwful who did the write-up on Mario Tennis, though - it was in their Worst Video Game Articles of 200X for that year. Stan absolutely adored that article, though - he's a big Something Awful fan and was just honored to be mentioned haha. As far as Pangya goes, though, he was already in the process of leaving NWR. It was just his last review.

Oh, also, to the other guy who replied, if you're here to talk review bits and ask for more information or constructively criticize actual details, then no, that doesn't make you a buffoon, and I'm not referring to you. But if your comment challenges the legitimacy and credibility of an opinion (which in and of itself is crazy) regarding an experience you've not yet HAD and therefore can't compare until you've gotten the game, then yeah, sure, here's your Buffoon Card. Especially if you're using other reviews  to support your stance.


EDIT: Oh, and I just read your comment about how Metacritic scores affect game sales. Good lord, please reevaluate your thought process. It's not NWR's responsibility to help sell Nintendo's games, and it shouldn't be yours, either.

UncleBobRichard Cook, Guest ContributorMay 18, 2014

Quote from: deepsouth

Unclebob, my apologies. You said to a lot of people it sucked.

You're learning, youngling.  Read what is written instead of what you think is written.

I've played DD with a lot of folks in my time (having multiple GameCubes and wanting to play multi-player to justify them will do that to you)... trust me when I say - the learning curve behind Double Dash is a tough one for lots of folks to get used to.  They'd rather play 4-player '64 than 8/16 player Double Dash.

Quote from: deepsouth

Racht, where do you get the idea that a five is an average score? Name me one game that was given a five out of ten and considered average. A 7.5 is a horrible score, and it WILL impact sales. Believe it or not. I hate when people think that these type of reviews dont have consequences or impacts on a games sales. These reviews are more than just an opinion. And get over myself? what does that even mean?

And broodwars, I meant timeing as in the position that nintendo is currently in with thier Wii U, and that a bad review of such an anticipated game is, well, bad timing! And underwhelming is your opinion, as I believe it to be the best Mario Kart yet.

If you are going by college grades then yes a 75 is above average it would equate to a C+, not good not bad. On a scale of 1 to 5 a 7.5 is a 3.5 which is generally considered good but not bad, the review made it clear the game is just more Mario Kart, then explained what is good about the game, mostly the graphics and the new gravity mode, then mentioned the disappointing single player mode.



I haven't seen a single video nor have I played the demo so I can't say if the game is good or not, I haven't even played it. I find it stupid that someone who hasn't even played the game can just assume it will be the best game ever. Also nobody ever decides to buy a game or not buy a game based on Metacritic, seriously that is a really lame accusation.


Getting back to the actual review, I will say that being someone who, seriously read my posts, has been on the fence about the Wii U has been waiting for more games to make the machine worth investing in. This game was not on my radar, other than as a potential buy down the road if or when I do eventually get the system. This review has not changed my mind in the slightest despite how much I respect the site. I also find it hard to believe anyone is going to read IGN and say yes they gave it a 9 out of ten good now I can buy the game in confidence, oops wait Nintendo World Report gave it a 7.5 sorry Nintendo I have to cancel my Pre-order? That sounds like the mind of a child who is no where near mature enough to handle that people have different opinions.

Quote from: UncleBob

Quote from: deepsouth

Unclebob, my apologies. You said to a lot of people it sucked.

You're learning, youngling.  Read what is written instead of what you think is written.

I've played DD with a lot of folks in my time (having multiple GameCubes and wanting to play multi-player to justify them will do that to you)... trust me when I say - the learning curve behind Double Dash is a tough one for lots of folks to get used to.  They'd rather play 4-player '64 than 8/16 player Double Dash.

I can see that, my friends all had Game Cubes, we used to have Mario Party and Melee allnighters, but when someone mentioned Mario Kart we would just dig out the old N64 as nobody wanted to play Double Dash, we tried it a few times and most people preferred the N64 one. In fact that is why THIS Mario Kart is not on my radar, because DD, to me, sucked, so I skipped 7 and have no interest in 8, yet. No review is going to change my mind, ever, I will decide if or when I get around to playing the game, as someone with intelligence should do. But don't take my word for it, I have been painted as a Nintendo hater by some.

deepsouthMay 18, 2014

NWR Karl, Maybe you should reevaluate your responces, cause I never said it was NWR's responsibility to sale nintendo games. I just said it's a bad review, and a game review can be a deciding factor for some people purchasing a new game. You know, I'll never understand why so many people will defend a bad review just out of forum loyalty. A bad review is a bad review, and your doing the site a disservice by letting it slide.

Quote from: deepsouth

NWR Karl, Maybe you should reevaluate your responces, cause I never said it was NWR's responsibility to sale nintendo games. I just said it's a bad review, and a game review can be a deciding factor for some people purchasing a new game. You know, I'll never understand why so many people will defend a bad review just out of forum loyalty. A bad review is a bad review, and your doing the site a disservice by letting it slide.

Why is it a bad review? Start by answering that question.

deepsouthMay 18, 2014

Unclebob, I apologised becouse I was incorrect, and I admit my mistakes. There is no need to get snotty about it. And "youngling"? lol. I'm sure i'm much older than you.

broodwarsMay 18, 2014

Personally, I find the view of someone who's grown tired of the series rather invaluable to me, as that's the position I'm coming from. So if someone writes a review, says they've grown tired of the series but turns out to love it, they have my attention and I'm more inclined to look into the game.

Quote from: deepsouth

NWR Karl, Maybe you should reevaluate your responces, cause I never said it was NWR's responsibility to sale nintendo games. I just said it's a bad review, and a game review can be a deciding factor for some people purchasing a new game. You know, I'll never understand why so many people will defend a bad review just out of forum loyalty. A bad review is a bad review, and your doing the site a disservice by letting it slide.

Well, it's not a bad review, but that's kind of beside the point.

You're more than welcome to discuss a review's points and seek clarification or explanation in regards to details. You're more than welcome to ask for a reviewer to back up his points with more information. All of this, provided it's done in a constructive way, is welcomed and encouraged.

But the minute you bring up Metacritic, I'm sorry, but the amount of credence I give your argument plummets. At that point, I'm not even defending Neal. I'm defending reasonable discourse. You've set about a crusade, a Holy War, against your bad judgement and cognitive dissonance. Young men will go to war and their young wives will mourn their loss as they raise young children alone. I hope you're satisfied with the horror you've wrought.

deepsouthMay 18, 2014

broodwars, I agree. However someone who has grown tired of a series can't really give a fair and accurate review of a game from that series. Honestly I have grown tired of commenting about this review. I think I've made my point.

Quote from: deepsouth

However someone who has grown tired of a series can't really give a fair and accurate review of a game from that series.

I'm basically tired of the series because of Mario Kart 8, though. I've really enjoyed nearly every other Mario Kart game. This was the one that made me truly grow tired of it. So, I think I gave it a fair and accurate review. Sorry if you disagree.

UncleBobRichard Cook, Guest ContributorMay 18, 2014

Quote from: deepsouth

Unclebob, I apologised becouse I was incorrect, and I admit my mistakes. There is no need to get snotty about it. And "youngling"? lol. I'm sure i'm much older than you.

First, I do deserve to get snotty about it.  You put words in my mouth and even stuck by it when I first said something.  It wasn't until I hand-held you into going back and re-reading what I actually said that you admitted you were wrong.

Second - I could be wrong (it doesn't happen often though) - but I'd guess that you're younger than me.  Heck, I'd guess that I own video game hardware older than you.

broodwarsMay 18, 2014

Quote from: deepsouth

broodwars, I agree. However someone who has grown tired of a series can't really give a fair and accurate review of a game from that series. Honestly I have grown tired of commenting about this review. I think I've made my point.

On the contrary, I think someone who's done nothing but gush about a series in the past would have a much more difficult time putting forth a "fair and accurate" review of a game in that same series. Likewise, I'm far less inclined to believe the review wouldn't unintentionally gloss over major flaws in the game. I may disagree with how eager the internet has been in general to gush over this game because it's Mario Kart & because it's pretty (despite how lazy just about every review admits the SP continues to be and how awful the MP apparently now is), I have no reason to believe either of these reviewers are overlooking the good or the bad in the game.

On a side note, I think it was a mistake to pull the original video review simply because the commenters on Youtube were too stupid to go read the written reviews for more information.  It comes off like you were intimidated by Youtube and rushed to change your product to appease them, though I know that wasn't your intent. I find video reviews that merely read the written review utterly boring.  Ideally, the video should complement the words, which rarely happens in that style of video review.

deepsouthMay 18, 2014

NWR Karl, lol. I think you have put too much infosys on metacritic. Even more so than I. I've mentioned it, yes, but it's not the motive behind my rant. Maybe I haven't been able to fully articulate my thoughts about this review, other than to say it's bad. But I assure you it's not becouse the 7.5 dropped metacritics score.

NWR Neal, well thats really suprising. How can you like the Mario Kart series but not this one? It just blows my mind, thats all. I'm sorry I can't agree with you about giving it a fair and accurate review, but I will agree to disagree. Sorry for the inconvience, my rant is over.

deepsouthMay 18, 2014

Uncle bob, no your wrong. You don't deserve to get snotty about it. You accept someones apology and you move on. You are not older than me by your maturity from the looks of it. And I'm sure I own ten consoles older than you, not that it matters though.

deepsouthMay 18, 2014

emphasis' lol

Uncle Bob is older than I am and I am in my 30's so take that kid.

Quote from: deepsouth

NWR Karl, lol. I think you have put too much infosys on metacritic. Even more so than I. I've mentioned it, yes, but it's not the motive behind my rant. Maybe I haven't been able to fully articulate my thoughts about this review, other than to say it's bad. But I assure you it's not becouse the 7.5 dropped metacritics score.

NWR Neal, well thats really suprising. How can you like the Mario Kart series but not this one? It just blows my mind, thats all. I'm sorry I can't agree with you about giving it a fair and accurate review, but I will agree to disagree. Sorry for the inconvience, my rant is over.

You said it was a bad review, I asked why it was a bad review and your still dodging that by going in circles about who you respect and don't respect as a reviewer.

UncleBobRichard Cook, Guest ContributorMay 18, 2014

Quote from: deepsouth

NWR Neal, well thats really suprising. How can you like the Mario Kart series but not this one?

Going back to that whole "reading what was written" thing... Neal *never* said he didn't like the game.

Quote from: UncleBob

Quote from: deepsouth

NWR Neal, well thats really suprising. How can you like the Mario Kart series but not this one?

Going back to that whole "reading what was written" thing... Neal *never* said he didn't like the game.

This is true. I think I said, in my fair & accurate review, something almost exactly contradictory to what you're assuming. Here it is: "I like playing Mario Kart 8. I think it’s a satisfactory entry in the series, but nothing more."

deepsouthMay 18, 2014

LMAO. What a bunch of cry babies. Attack of the loyal forumers. You guys don't care what I say, your just defending Neal. He's the one taking critisism, and he's the only one who's being mature and respectful. And Marval, geez man. Your a dope.

Quote from: deepsouth

LMAO. What a bunch of cry babies. Attack of the loyal forumers. You guys don't care what I say, your just defending Neal. He's the one taking critisism, and he's the only one who's being mature and respectful. And Marval, geez man. Your a dope.

because I asked you WHY you say it is a bad review, answer that and I will leave you alone.

also check my post history, or check the forum posts in general, nobody here is defending the forums or the site. Most people just want reasonable discussions, if you feel a certain way you should be able to articulate why you feel that way, I have done so, most of us have too, you just keep going all over the place and now are resorting to personal attacks.


I will clarify my position for you, then as a reasonable adult engaging in an intelligent discussion you follow up by doing the same, and we won't have any problems.


The reason I choose to read this site is because many of the writers are like me, long time life long Nintendo fans who can see that currently Nintendo is in a slump and many people are getting tired of the same old-same old, the Nintendo we grew up on was not like the Nintendo out there now. They still make great games nobody denies that, but that does not mean their games are as good as ever, or that every game they make is magically great too.

I don't like just Nintendo games so the few games that Nintendo does make that still interest me personally usually have to be pretty damn good. I can be lenient if say Sony makes a less than perfect game because they more than make up for it with other services and features and get full on third party support, value added reasons to buy their machine. With Nintendo I hold them to a higher standard, understandably so because they frigging created the standards all games are measured by, they are the standard that other companies are trying to live up to. Inevietably that means when they do something less than perfect, being a company known for being anal perfectionists, means that is going to get some attention.


I haven't played this Mario kart game but I have played enough to know that for me, having already been burned out, in order to get interested this would have to be one hell of a Mario Kart game, according to the reviews it is just another Mario Kart game so I know what to expect from it, nothing mind blowingly awesome that makes me think this is the Mario Kart to get me back into Mario Kart. I won't base my entire judgement on a single review alone, or any review at all this is the only one I read because as I stated I mostly read this site.


AS for why I read this site, to be clear, other fan sites are infested with what I call cheerleaders, people who just assume everything Nintendo does is magic and anyone who says otherwise is a hater. As someone who is not a hater I tend to take offense to being treated like shit because I might come out with a dissenting opinion, also ask around I am one of the least popular guys here so I don't think I can be accused of defending the forums either, but I can respect where they are coming from, a similar perspective as myself. Not like some other sites who just stay in a bubble where Nintendo never makes any mistakes ever. I dislike those sites, and the fans who flock to them, because it just gets boring hearing endless praises.

This is the talk back forum, which means it is reply only, so if someone, as I did, says something hastily they can not edit their post, as they often would otherwise, so I had to leave my comment there for you to see when I would have just hit edit and said something else instead.


I can tell you I am not defending Neal's review, or the reviewer himself, all I am saying is it is his fucking opinion, he has played the fucking game, YOU have not so YOU can not say it is a good game or not, and nobody is going to not buy the game based on the review of a fringe site that nobody is reading about a game on a console nobody is buying. Obviously I am over exaggerating the nobody but you can get the point, this is a friggin niche site covering a niche product that is by all accounts failing to meet expectations.

Just a few things to clear up.

In terms of some conspiracy to pull down the Metacritic score, that's an impossibility. Note that we posted this review literally as soon as the embargo lifted, just like every site out there. We didn't wait a week, look at the Metacritic score, and tailor our score accordingly to generate outrage. We do care about traffic, but our aim is to generate that traffic by getting the review up right away, not skewing the score for the sake of being contrarian.

In terms of Neal being "tired" of Mario Kart, I think that's being blown out of proportion. I would say "overly familiar" with the series would be more accurate. And you know what cures somebody of familiarity? A surprise. Something that has a fresh feel. Neal has stated quite clearly in this review that Mario Kart 8 has very little of that for series veterans, and I think that's fair.  We're all old school Nintendo gamers here at NWR and it takes a lot to impress us, so if we say something's good, it's good. In other words, Nintendo can't give us the same old same old and expect us to give it a pass and an unreserved thumbs up.

In terms of this review affecting sales of the game, understand that our review is but a ripple in the pool. We have a niche audience and limited reach, but our audience really is like our staff: long-term Nintendo fans, extremely knowledgeable, very well-versed in its games and the history of its franchises.  For the most part I think they already have a firm grip on what games they're going to buy, but they know that we appreciate Nintendo games the way they do and they like to hear what we think about them and appreciate the opportunity to voice their agreement/disagreement.  Couple this with the fact that whatever score we give, high or low, will be evened out by opposingly high/low scores in the Metacritic rollup and I think a real impact on sales is virtually nonexistent. Heck, we aren't even big enough to get mentioned in articles like these:

http://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/2014-05-15-critical-consensus-mario-kart-8-is-a-triumph-of-familiarity
http://www.joystiq.com/2014/05/15/metareview-mario-kart-8/

If we were truly going for clickbait by posting a lower score than than the majority of other sites, then our grand strategy is failing miserably. Or should I cackle malevolently because it brought, what, three new users to our site?  If you plan on sticking around and contributing to our little community, please do and judge us in the long term instead of the short term. However, if you came here for the sole purpose of crapping on us, I have some words for you.

For people to come to NWR for the first time in order to question our integrity as a site and the integrity of our reviewers (Neal especially) is laughable, because you have no context for your statements.  You haven't been around and observed how things are done here to have any basis for criticism beyond a knee-jerk reaction to a score that, in your subjective opinion, should be higher than somebody else's subjective opinion.  It's not that our reviewers are beyond reproach - we've made mistakes in the past and will make them in the future - it's that over time (and I mean real time, 15 years as we were founded in 1999) I think the track record shows that we always give games a fair shot, and post our legitimate opinions, rather than what Nintendo, our readers, or our advertisers want to hear.  We're one of the longest-running independent voices in the Nintendo community and have done nothing but invest our own time and money into giving the company free publicity (nobody gets paid here at NWR, we are all volunteers) for over a decade. I think we've earned the benefit of the doubt.

what he said, plus don't let me speak for the site, staff or others here, I am pretty new myself. I just stir easy.

UncleBobRichard Cook, Guest ContributorMay 18, 2014

-unrelated- I deleted the Facebook comments - they are not relevant to the discussion going on here.

Thanks, that was my fault.

deepsouthMay 18, 2014

@NWR LINDY

I didn't come here to question the integrity of the website or any reviewer for that matter. Nor did I come here to stir up trouble. I'm not trying to disrespect the site, and I'm sure you have Many knowledgable people here.  I came on here becouse I was looking up Mario Kart 8 reviews, and was happy to see it was getting great reviews across the boards. Except here. This was the lowest score and I was curious as to why. As a die hard Nintendo fan I had the right to know why one of my favorite games got such a low score. So I read Neals review and it seemed like he was a little tired of the series. So I commented on that. I am a die hard Nintendo fan, and I'm usually defending Nintendo alone in a mass of Xbots and Sonyans. I will Defend Nintendo no matter what site I'm on. Yes, even against Nintendo fans themselves. I know that makes me a fanboy, but so be it. I will stand by my opinion that a 7.5 rating is far to low of a score, however i'm not gonna continue to shove it down anyones throat. I do understand now why Neal scored it low, even though I disagree. You know, if this site is full of old school die hard Nintendo fans, technically I should fit right in.

broodwarsMay 18, 2014

Quote from: deepsouth

@NWR LINDY

I didn't come here to question the integrity of the website or any reviewer for that matter. Nor did I come here to stir up trouble. I'm not trying to disrespect the site, and I'm sure you have Many knowledgable people here.  I came on here becouse I was looking up Mario Kart 8 reviews, and was happy to see it was getting great reviews across the boards. Except here. This was the lowest score and I was curious as to why. As a die hard Nintendo fan I had the right to know why one of my favorite games got such a low score. So I read Neals review and it seemed like he was a little tired of the series. So I commented on that. I am a die hard Nintendo fan, and I'm usually defending Nintendo alone in a mass of Xbots and Sonyans. I will Defend Nintendo no matter what site I'm on. Yes, even against Nintendo fans themselves. I know that makes me a fanboy, but so be it. I will stand by my opinion that a 7.5 rating is far to low of a score, however i'm not gonna continue to shove it down anyones throat. I do understand now why Neal scored it low, even though I disagree. You know, if this site is full of old school die hard Nintendo fans, technically I should fit right in.

OK, I'm fascinated to know how your at best 3 track demo experience with Mario Kart 8 not only tells you that 7.5 is too low a score, but that it's one of your "favorite" games before it's even released.  You should probably leave and cut your losses now if you feel it's up to this site to agree with your preconception of what Nintendo games should be scored simply because it's a Nintendo-centric site: you're making even other Nintendo fanboys look reasonable by comparison.  When you have me looking back with nostalgia on the days of Ninhuggles (aka "Pro") and TJSpyke, you're doing something wrong.

deepsouthMay 18, 2014

Are you kidding me? I've played every mario kart game including this one briefly. The track design is second to none. The anti-gravity adds alot of depth to the races, and changes your usual strategy. The horn can save you from the blue shell which you can get in first place by the way. The graphics are just stunning, easily the best looking nintendo game ever. I personally like the roster, online tournaments, MK tv (to be fair I'm unsure about that). But need I continue? Becouse I can. The game is amazing, easily the best mario kart in the series.

deepsouthMay 18, 2014

What I'm looking forward to as usual, is getting three stars in every cup. Then I will set up massive tournaments. I will send invites to this site, you are all welcome to race with me :) Gonna be great.

deepsouthMay 18, 2014

Broodwars, I think your taking my liking the game more personal than I'm taking the 7.5 score. lol
And by the way, I don't give games passes just becouse they are nintendo games. Your preconception of me is off track.

UncleBobRichard Cook, Guest ContributorMay 18, 2014

I have to admit, I lied about the number of copies of Mario Kart: Double Dash I own... I was going off memory and I forgot...

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v180/TheUncleBob/2014-05-17%2023.17.27_zpsrlbh0elc.jpg

I knew I had six cases plus the EU version (which I didn't count since I can't really play)... but I forgot that one of my cases is a dual-disc case with a disc-only copy I picked up cheap.  The other five copies are all versions with the bonus disc. :D

This picture doesn't include my digital versions, of course... but still fun.

If only I could talk my wife into that two-unit Mario Kart GP set-up I saw for $24k.. ;)

pokepal148May 18, 2014

Oh yeah, well I played every game in the series and I think the mario kart series is fine, therefore Neal's opinion of the series is wrong WRONG
WRONG!!!!!

deepsouthMay 18, 2014

What's your opinion of the game?

pokepal148May 18, 2014

let me put it this way, between my undying hatred of mk7 and the questionable decisions made with 8 I am basically picking it up so I can get into that CN deal.

RachtMay 18, 2014

Quote from: pokepal148

let me put it this way, between my undying hatred of mk7 and the questionable decisions made with 8 I am basically picking it up so I can get into that CN deal.

I'll see you on the track then, Poképal. I've got a banana peel with your name on it. >:D

deepsouthMay 18, 2014

So.... 1 out of 10, Whats your rankng pokepal?

deepsouthMay 18, 2014

Well, I give it a 9.5 outta 10. Thats right. Deduct half a point for lack of proper battle mode.

deepsouthMay 18, 2014

Whats your score pokepal?

ymeegodMay 18, 2014

"I don't give games passes just becouse they are nintendo games. Your preconception of me is off track."

Yet a few post back you state NWR should have given MK8 a pass because they are an Nintendo fansite using Nintendo's name to promote their site and Nintendo really needs the sales.  Talk about your double standards.

"The game is amazing, easily the best mario kart in the series."  Maybe but that doesn't mean standards don't go up over the years as well.  Excluding battle mode and not having features that other games have (party chat, off-screen play for mp) means the game is still lacking in areas.

---------------------------------------

For all those bitching about the score, try reading the damn review first instead of focusing on the final score.  Neal made valid fooking points and it's an solid review. 

broodwarsMay 18, 2014

Quote from: deepsouth

Broodwars, I think your taking my liking the game more personal than I'm taking the 7.5 score. lol

I have particular disdain for the hive mind mentality of fanboys, and you're fortunate the terms of service here forbid me from going any further than that.

deepsouthMay 18, 2014

I'm fortunate? lol. ohhhh, noo. lol. Just because you don't know quality when you see it. And don't hold back broodwars. Let it out man. I'm a grown man, I can take anything YOU can throw at me, trust me.. But talk about about hive mentality broodwars.  A few negative criticisms about captain neal and his review and every single member of this site wants to take a shot at me. Honestly I'm tired of defending myself against you goons. So every single one of you share Neals exact same opinion of the game? I find that hard to believe. Anyway, I'm tired of you, you wouldn't know a good game if it slapped you in the face..

Ymeegod, 'sigh'....

I said it was bad timing, and that I thought it was ironic that a site with Nintendo in it's name would have given MK 8 the lowest score on metacritic.  I never said Nintendo games get a pass just because they are Nintendo games. I don't have double standards, you are wrong. I was really tough on a Link Between Worlds. I though it was over rated. But what are you opinions of the game? How come everyone here is just in agreement with Neal that this is the worst MK game in the series? Whats happening here is the definition of Herd mentality. You guys can't think for yourself and your scared to question the leader for fear of banishment.

Funny thing is, when I was about an hour into playing Mario Kart 8 for review, I was singing it's praises much like deepsouth is right now. It was when I played it more that the cracks began to show and I wound up a little more lukewarm.


Also, most people I'm seeing aren't necessarily agreeing with my review in a herd mentality. They're just defending my right to have a unique opinion. If people turn out to love MK8 here, that's awesome. I won't banish anybody. That's not how we do things here.

deepsouthMay 18, 2014

Neal, you obviously have a right to any opinion but they are rushing to your aid. It is a herd mentality. But anyways, what are the cracks that show up after an hour of gameplay? Did you rate MK 7 just as low as this one? Did the same cracks show after an hour of gameplay in that one?

AdrockMay 18, 2014

Quote from: NWR_Neal

Also, most people I'm seeing aren't necessarily agreeing with my review in a herd mentality. They're just defending my right to have a unique opinion.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4GVjkg_7bK0

Quote from: deepsouth

Neal, you obviously have a right to any opinion but they are rushing to your aid. It is a herd mentality. But anyways, what are the cracks that show up after an hour of gameplay? Did you rate MK 7 just as low as this one? Did the same cracks show after an hour of gameplay in that one?

I literally wrote a review about how I feel about MK8.

buttleMay 18, 2014

Yea, this is a bad review.  Mario Kart 8 is a multiplayer racing game, and the he barely comments on that.  He said it was "great fun" and that's about it.  The tracks, he had only positive things to say, but he complained about the formula.  Which there really aren't that many formulaic aspects?  Either way, he didn't explain why it was a bad thing.


And as for the weak 1 player stuff, and the uninspired battle mode.  That is every Mario Kart.  People still complain about IGN's 7.9 on Double Dash, and that game had the same great racing, and same weak other stuff.  But people rememeber it as a bad review beccause that racing was so damn good.


So for me, I would have prefered an in depth review of the racing and just a quick note to say all that stuff is weak like it's always been.


And do we know that they won't add some extra 1 player stuff like they did on the Wii?  The review didn't say.

deepsouthMay 18, 2014

Neal,Yea you did, and I've read your review, but you didn't mention anything about cracks showing up after an hour of gameplay like you just mentioned. I was curious as to what cracks show up. And how is it different from MK7?

Anyways, look, I'm not trying to be a troll. I was just trying to get the reasoning behind your review, which I still haven't got unfortunately. Out of fear of becoming a troll, I will leave this site as quickly as I came, however dissatisfied I am. No hard feelings here.

ymeegodMay 18, 2014

"A few negative criticisms about captain neal and his review and every single member of this site wants to take a shot at me."

Which would say something about you since we normally don't play nice with each other.  NWR has every right to their opinion of a game and you saying it's a poor review just because you disagree with the score? 

If you're an adult then maybe you should put on your big boy pants and start acting like it.

deepsouthMay 18, 2014

Ymeegod, Heres a suggestion. Learn to think for yourself. You don't get far in life by being a follower. Neal can defend himself quite fine.

deepsouthMay 18, 2014

You gave Super Monkey ball 2 a higher score than MK 8? Pushmo got a higher score??? 'siggghhnhh
Ok, i'm done, had to get that out ,lol.

ymeegodMay 18, 2014

"You don't get far in life by being a follower"

LOL how many people on this forum would consider me a follower?  You come hear one day and think you know me?  I never defended Neal nor do I ever care who he is and I can't say if I agree or disagree with a review of a game I never even played nor does Neal review stop me for getting excited about MK8 or canceling my preorder. 

His review does exactly what it's meant to and I know exactly what to expect when I play MK8 for the first time. 

don't go stick around for a few days to at least learn we are far from a hive mentality here. Hell most every other thread degrades into a pissing match quite quickly so stick around your more fun than some of the other regulars.

broodwarsMay 18, 2014

Have you guys noticed that all the people who came here to gripe about the reviews are seemingly incapable of writing a coherent sentence? It's quite a coincidence. I guess Neal and Co. pissed off the denizens of GameFAQs.

There are few sites on the internet where I feel that the people on it are being honest with me, that they aren't just following a mandate from the video game developers in one form or another. NWR is one of those sites. I may disagree with their reviews at times and I may feel they're too forgiving of certain flaws within Nintendo or a piece of software, but I never have reason to believe that the people are insincere. So when some barely-literate fanboys comes in here and starts questioning the integrity of the site in the most tedious; pathetic way possible, I have a problem with that.

Quote from: deepsouth

Ymeegod, Heres a suggestion. Learn to think for yourself. You don't get far in life by being a follower.

The irony of this post astounds me.

UncleBobRichard Cook, Guest ContributorMay 18, 2014

Quote from: broodwars

I guess Neal and Co. pissed off the denizens of GameFAQs.

Well...

TheBigKMay 18, 2014

The people shitting all over this review are goddamn retarded. First of all, reviews are subjective. As in someone's opinion. In the end, does someone else's opinion really bother you on a personal level that much? If it does, may I suggest you close the tab and go back to /v/ where I'm sure you'd have a better time finding like-minded individuals to shit on everything game-related with? Secondly, you people care far too much about numbers. Neal explained his scoring very comprehensively, and if you can't deal with that then you can politely disagree without throwing a hissy fit. I mean, really? Getting this worked up over a video game? C'mon. Lastly, at the risk of contradicting my last point slightly, since when is 7.5 a bad score? The scale is from 1 to 10, not 5 to 10. You people are behaving like Neal said the game was absolute shit, like 1 or 2. 1 is garbage, 5 average, and 10 is perfect. 7.5 is halfway between average and perfect, so pretty damn good. And people clamouring for a 10 need to get a reality check. 10 implies a game is perfect and infallible, and no such game exists. I personally don't believe that a 10 should ever be given because perfection is a goal to strive for and is not actually attainable. Nothing in this world is perfect and improvements can always be made.


Just my two cents on the whole review controversy.

UncleBobRichard Cook, Guest ContributorMay 18, 2014

Quote from: deepsouth

This was the lowest score and I was curious as to why.

EGM also scored MK8 a 7.5.

UncleBobRichard Cook, Guest ContributorMay 18, 2014

Quote from: TheBigK

10 implies a game is perfect and infallible, and no such game exists.

Let me introduce you to the perfect game.

OblivionMay 18, 2014

Quote from: UncleBob

Quote from: broodwars

I guess Neal and Co. pissed off the denizens of GameFAQs.

Well...

Hilariously, this doesn't surprise me. These people definitely remind me of those who use GameFAQs.

buttle's observations about the weight of topics in Neal's review are valid fodder for debate. It's not possible to address every possible topic in a review, and the author has to make subjective (authorial?) choices about where to spend words and focus critical attention. If you think his choices make the review more or less valid/useful/quality writing, we should have that conversation. If you all want to have a more substantive discussion of this review and our editorial process, that's fertile ground and could be a lot more civil than what's going on here.

By the way, you can lay off slinging mud at other communities, and consider that a moderator's threat. GameFAQs draws a much broader user base and is less self-selected than our own forum users. They don't and cannot exercise the kind of moderation nor editorial involvement in the community that we aim for at NWR. I expect all you veterans to show patience and acceptance of anyone coming here from another website. Treat them respectfully, let the moderators do our job, and encourage them to stay involved here so that they may contribute and learn more about what we do. Be a good citizen of our group, or at least don't be a bad citizen.

KhushrenadaMay 18, 2014

Quote from: deepsouth

Khushrenada, your going out of your way to defend this site, and this review, and it isn't neccesary.

Not really. I frequent this site a lot and it doesn't take much time to counter a lot of these arguments since most of them aren't really good points.

Quote:

I'm glad NWR gave all those other amazing Nintendo games the scores they deserved. They should have done the same to this amazing game.

Again, should have is a subjective thing. I'm known on this site for disliking Super Mario Galaxy. If I'd worked for this site and had reviewed the game, I'd have given it a low score. And then I'd have probably gotten all these comments that people are giving Neal. But it's honestly how I feel about the game. As it is, I didn't review it and the people who have reviewed the game all gave it high scores. I know I'm in the minority about feeling that way about the game but I do and a second play through of it recently didn't change my opinion of it. I really like Mario games but for some reason, that particular game just didn't click with me.

Unfortunately, just like a painting, a song, a movie or TV show, people can see and hear the same thing and all have different viewpoints on it. In this case, Neal's viewpoint is different than others. You can disagree with it and if you want to bring up actual points from the game as to why it is the best Mario Kart yet, by all means, you are welcome to do so. But telling a person to change their opinion because everyone else thinks differently or it will hurt sales of a product is completely wrong.

Quote:

About Yoshis new Island getting a 6, well I wasn't here to argue that review, and it wasn't on the same scale as this one. A six is low, should have been a 7.5.



They actually did two reviews on this site. One gave it a 6 and the other gave it a 7.5 (the magical number). So you see, you can relate with a review on this site. I guess the question is, if you'd give Yoshi's New Island a 7.5, what does that ranking mean to you? 

Quote:

And your sarcasm about the other games not selling consoles is inaccurate. All those games you mentioned did move consoles, just not as many as Nintendo would have wished for.

It wasn't really sarcasm. Nintendo has no doubt been hoping that any game they release for it will help kick start Wii U sales on to a better trajectory. But they haven't and even if Mario Kart 8 did get 100% reviews from the 9-10 range, I don't think it is going to do it either. If Nintendo's strategy is to hope that every game they release gets reviewed like that and it is their only plan to get the Wii U selling more units than expect Wii U sales to always be low because depending on 100% reviews for every game is not going to happen.

Quote:

You would be suprised at the amount of people who decide not to purchase a game becouse of a metacritic score. Any negative review on any game impacts the sales of said video game, even if it's by a miniscule amount.

Than you know what? Those are the people you should be attacking and criticising. If people can't think for themselves and only buy things based on a number they see from a site, that's sad. As much as people keep accusing one another of a hive mentality in this argument, those are the individuals that are truly exhibiting it. 12 Years a Slave just won Best Picture. I disagree with that because I've seen the movie and I've also seen other movies released last year that I felt were better. But since it won Best Picture, am I going to change my mind on it? No, because I can think for myself and make decisions based on my likes and dislikes.

I already own a Wii U. A good or bad review of Mario Kart 8 isn't going to affect me or my purchase. I will buy it at some point because I do like Mario Kart games. I admit that I was disappointed in Mario Kart 7 so I do have some reservations about this game. But even if got 100% reviews in the 9-10 range, I'm not going to buy it Day 1. It's just like how I haven't bought Super Mario 3D World yet despite high ranking reviews but will at some point. Games can be bought and played at anytime. The idea that every review for a game should be positive so that Metacritic has a high score to encourage other people to then buy this game and console on the day or week of its release seems like a ridiculous statement. Do you really think there are millions of people that were just waiting to see if Mario Kart 8 would get an average of 9.2 and then they were going to drop down $300 and some dollars because that's what it took? I think people handle money differently. Moreover, if there are people that were waiting for Mario Kart 8 to come out and then buy the system, I doubt they will suddenly change their mind because of one review stating it is more of the same. Most likely, that's what such a person wants anyways. They're most likely still going to purchase it because it's what they've been waiting for and what they want. I highly doubt there are millions of people on the fence as to whether they will buy the Wii U in a couple weeks depending on how the Mario Kart 8 review number comes in at.

Again, this idea that reviewers should alter scores to support Nintendo and keep Metacritic scores high for more sales is flat out WRONG! Sony Pictures had a scandal years back where they made up a fictional movie reviewer to give terrible movies a good rating and quote they could put on movie posters and ads to try and counter the negative reviews they knew the film would get. Is that something that should be applauded? Is it a good idea to have reviews that lie to the public? If not, why is suddenly acceptable to have reviewers rate things higher than they feel just because other people may like it more or a company needs more sales? How is that justifiable?

A reviewer just gives their opinion and reasons for it. Some may agree and some may disagree but that's the point of it. It's just someone giving their thoughts and impressions on something. It allows you to hear another perspective from you own and maybe realize or appreciate things you didn't notice on your own. Just like how I didn't realize the Mona Lisa had no eyebrows until reading someone else's review on it. Making it their responsibility to increase or decrease sales is not the job of a reviewer. It may have an affect on sales but then that's the risk of having anything reviewed. That's why some movies aren't released to critics to be reviewed ahead of time. Studios recognize they're bad and want to keep critics from reviewing it negatively. Likewise, good movies can still get a negative review from some people. It happens.

Finally, you and others coming to this site are reacting to something for which we've yet to see the full context of. It's interesting how Karl posted the link to an old Wii review that got a lot of hate thrown at the reviewer for the game Pangya Golf. I'd honestly forgotten that game even existed. How many people are playing or talking about it today? Does anyone even care about it or still think it was the 9 or 10 that they claimed way back when? For all we know, a year from now, people might be complaining about how Mario Kart 8 was so disappointing. Or they might not. We'll find out over time as more people play it and assess it and compare it to other releases. But to come and say that this review and score is wrong right now is pointless because viewpoints change and it becomes easier to assess things with the passage of time than in the present. Honestly, I'd love to see how people coming in here and complaining about the review feel about the game in a year. I doubt we'll see any of you since you'll have moved on to the next crisis but it would be interesting, I think.

lolmonadeMay 18, 2014

Quote from: broodwars

Quote from: deepsouth

Broodwars, I think your taking my liking the game more personal than I'm taking the 7.5 score. lol

I have particular disdain for the hive mind mentality of fanboys, and you're fortunate the terms of service here forbid me from going any further than that.

Coming from the resident Sony fanboy  :D .



pokepal148May 18, 2014

Quote from: lolmonade

Quote from: broodwars

Quote from: deepsouth

Broodwars, I think your taking my liking the game more personal than I'm taking the 7.5 score. lol

I have particular disdain for the hive mind mentality of fanboys, and you're fortunate the terms of service here forbid me from going any further than that.

Coming from the resident Sony fanboy  :D .

Come to think of it we need a good Microsoft fanboy/troll to compliment broodwars, where can we get one of those?

If you think Khushrenada goes out of his way to defend this site you've clearly never read anything he's posted outside this thread. Hell, the reason you can't edit posts in TalkBack anymore is due to a component of an open rebellion against this site he largely organized.

pokepal148May 18, 2014

Quote from: NWR_insanolord

If you think Khushrenada goes out of his way to defend this site you've clearly never read anything he's posted outside this thread. Hell, the reason you can't edit posts in TalkBack anymore is due to a MAJOR OVERREACTION TO A component of an open rebellion against this site he largely organized.

fixed

Quote from: pokepal148

Quote from: NWR_insanolord

If you think Khushrenada goes out of his way to defend this site you've clearly never read anything he's posted outside this thread. Hell, the reason you can't edit posts in TalkBack anymore is due to a MAJOR OVERREACTION TO A component of an open rebellion against this site he largely organized.

fixed

You can give shit to me or Crimm, but you don't fuck with Aaron. He will wreck you.

broodwarsMay 18, 2014

Quote from: lolmonade

Quote from: broodwars

Quote from: deepsouth

Broodwars, I think your taking my liking the game more personal than I'm taking the 7.5 score. lol

I have particular disdain for the hive mind mentality of fanboys, and you're fortunate the terms of service here forbid me from going any further than that.

Coming from the resident Sony fanboy  :D .

If you think I'm a Sony fanboy, you clearly haven't been paying attention to the sheer number of times I complain about their actions. They just give me less reason to complain than the other two.  :P: It's kind of like that old Churchill quote about Democracy.

Broodwars isn't a fanboy of anybody; he relentlessly criticizes anyone and everyone.

I figured I was as close to a Sony fanboy as you would find around here. I personally HATE everything Xbox but I am all Windows all the way. I tend to buy Sony electronics, especially TV's, home theater, and Blu Ray players plus I have always loved Playstation for their keeping the industry moving forward. But I don't consider myself a fanboy in the truest sense I bought a PS3 just last year I stood in line to get a Wii.

Quote from: marvel_moviefan_2012

I figured I was as close to a Sony fanboy as you would find around here. I personally HATE everything Xbox but I am all Windows all the way. I tend to buy Sony electronics, especially TV's, home theater, and Blu Ray players plus I have always loved Playstation for their keeping the industry moving forward. But I don't consider myself a fanboy in the truest sense I bought a PS3 just last year, while I stood in line to get a Wii.

Sorry fixed that.

lolmonadeMay 18, 2014

Quote from: broodwars

Quote from: lolmonade

Quote from: broodwars

Quote from: deepsouth

Broodwars, I think your taking my liking the game more personal than I'm taking the 7.5 score. lol

I have particular disdain for the hive mind mentality of fanboys, and you're fortunate the terms of service here forbid me from going any further than that.

Coming from the resident Sony fanboy  :D .

If you think I'm a Sony fanboy, you clearly haven't been paying attention to the sheer number of times I complain about their actions. They just give me less reason to complain than the other two.  :P: : It's kind of like that old Churchill quote about Democracy.

Ha…I suppose maybe my perception of you is based on some recent posts you've been making lately, and not your overall historical posting..  I'm a big fan of Sony's game products, so I'm certainly not one to judge.

broodwarsMay 18, 2014

Quote from: NWR_insanolord

Broodwars isn't a fanboy of anybody; he relentlessly criticizes anyone and everyone.

In the words of Treebeard, "I'm not on anybody's side, because nobody is altogether on MY side!"  :P

OblivionMay 18, 2014

How dare you compare yourself to Treebeard!  :'(

StratosMay 18, 2014

So does that make us forum members the Free Peoples Of Middle-Earth©?

KhushrenadaMay 19, 2014

I'm clearly Aragorn.

Lucariofan99May 19, 2014

I'am Gemli!

StratosMay 20, 2014

Gemli must be Gimli's less talked about brother. Now we know why...

Lucariofan99May 20, 2014

Sorry typo, i meant gimli

AdrockMay 20, 2014

I was hoping you meant Jemli.
http://i.imgur.com/sApRcKf.jpg

ShyGuyMay 20, 2014

Alex Navarro knows what's up: 4 out 5 stars. http://www.giantbomb.com/reviews/mario-kart-8-review/1900-639/

Doctor_PancakesMay 21, 2014

I wish you folks would stop feeding the troll site. All of this discussion is likely getting them more page hits. I don't know when Metacritic was brought up their average should never influence other sites review scores. That said they seem insulted and refute the one site that leads people to this crap review in the process. What little I have played on Mario Kart 8 has got me excited for the series for the first time in about a decade. 7 was okay but it didn't make up for the duds that released after MK64 (Never played MKDS so I missed out there from what I have heard of it). They dismiss all of the pros that show in the demos and say this highly polished/advanced game is no Better than the Nintendo 64 counterpart(which hasn't aged well at all, my god the rubber banding... I did the short cut in Wario's Stadium and still got 3rd in 150 cc LOL). I don't know what state the reviewers mind was in or who he played the game with but it seems someone killed the game for the whole site seeing the staff back up in here. Maybe they were day dreaming about Watch Dogs or something. Seeing staff say the game was to kiddy on a NINTENDO game just baffles me. They'd clearly rather review gory shooters with that tone. I really want to know what they would have done differently... would you have preferred there were tanks and had the ability to steal other racers karts? Writing anti-grav and the knock into each other boosting as a gimmick? It brings a whole new line of strategy to the races. People just can't be pleased anymore Lol
/rant of the season, see yall again when you give the Ruby and Sapphire remakes a 4 for being remakes. Metacritic will have got you another click once again.

pokepal148May 21, 2014

Quote from: Doctor_Pancakes

I wish you folks would stop feeding the troll site. All of this discussion is likely getting them more page hits.

then why are commenting here.

UncleBobRichard Cook, Guest ContributorMay 22, 2014

Quote from: Doctor_Pancakes

Seeing staff say the game was to kiddy on a NINTENDO game just baffles me.

Did this happen?

BlackNMild2k1May 22, 2014

I don't know what's going on in this thread, but it would all be avoidable if Nintendo would just release Mario Kart 64 HD

add in all the new tracks and battle stages as an expansion if you want.
add in all the new vehicles and characters as DLC if you must.
add in support Wiimotes, wheels, and balance boards if necessary.

But bring back the Best Mario Kart* in glorious HD. Mario Kark 64 HD.
*honorable mention to Mario Kart 7 on the DS

AdrockMay 22, 2014

I played Mario Kart Wii online for the first (and last) time on Monday. It was the first time in a couple years I played it. Sweet baby Jebus, I was terrible. I would welcome a Mario Kart 64 HD. That was the last Mario Kart game I was consistently decent in. The only downside (besides the awful frame rate which was acceptable in 1997) was the lack of Daisy.

pokepal148May 22, 2014

I'm saying it now, Mario Kart DS was the best one.

KhushrenadaMay 22, 2014

You're only saying it now? I've been saying it for years.

1. Mario Kart DS
2. Mario Kart: Double Dash
4. Mario Kart 7
3: Mario Kart Wii
5. Mario Kart 64
6. Super Mario Kart
7. Mario Kart: Super Circuit
8. Mario Kart 8 (obviously that's what all the drama has been about)

As much as I liked and played a lot of the SNES and 64 Mario Kart, I just don't like how the SNES game controls compared to the top 2 and the 64 has courses that run way too long. I mean, Rainbow Road is only done as 1 lap in MK8 because it is so freakin' long!

Double Dash is the last Mario Kart game I got a lot of multiplayer out of and love how that game handles with the GC controller. It started to change the formula up a bit and had some great strategy play with character specific items and swapping characters. If you dig into it, it's a very rewarding game and experience. Mario Kart DS was the beginning of my solo playing of Mario Kart and it delivers in a strong experience. It even has block fort in the battle arenas if you want some classic action. Smart move there. All Mario Kart games now copy what the DS did and it has a lot of top, killer courses for racing. Just a solid package. The only issue is the DS isn't as ergonomic to hold as a GC controller. Other than that, I can't say anything bad about it.

I rank Mario Kart 7 above Wii because I think it controls better but other than that, I consider the games pretty equal. So, for me, the high point of the series came in the GC to DS years and its just been stagnating since. I still like the games but it really doesn't seem like Nintendo is trying to much with the series or that they are unable to top what they did with the DS.

MKDS with snaking taken out and battle mode playable online would be amazing.

If we're doing this....

1. Double Dash
2. Wii
3. 7
4. 8
5. 64
6. DS
7. SMK
8. Super Circuit

For me, DD and Wii are far away the best. 7 and 8 are virtually indistinguishable for me (aside from home console vs. portable). 64 is probably only as high because I still love that Battle Mode and nostalgia. I never got into DS that much. SNES is dated. Super Circuit sucks.

Aw Neal.. Super Circuit is awesome! :(


Alright, gonna list mine now.


1. MK64
2. MK:SC
3. MK:DD
4. MK:DS
5. MKWii
6. SMK
7. MK7


The bottom end of the list is tricky to place. I liked 7 but didn't end up playing it all that much, and MKWii got frustrating with the A.I. on the higher difficulties. I've played more SMK than 7 and Wii probably.

ShayminMay 22, 2014

1. 64
2. DS
3. 7
4. Super Mario Kart
5. Super Circuit
6. Wii
7. Double Dash

#comeatmebros

AdrockMay 22, 2014

1. 7
2. DS
3. 64
4. Wii
5. Double Dash
6. Super Circuit
7. Original

Not really sure where 8 will go, but from what I've read, my guess is supplanting 7 or DS.

RachtMay 22, 2014

Oooh, lists!

1. MK DS
2. MK 64
3. MK: SC
4. SMK
5. MK Wii
6. MK 7
7. MK: DD

Based on the demo I played this past weekend - played all 8 courses, and a couple of them twice (the Airport and Mario Circuit tracks) - I'm gonna say MK8 is probably going to land between the current number two and three spots. It's good. 7.5 good. ^_^

nickmitchMay 22, 2014

1. Wii
2. 7
3. DD
4. DS
5. 64
6. Arcade
7. SMK
8. SS

DD ranks high for me because it's still the most unique version of the series.

KhushrenadaMay 22, 2014

Wowzers. I did not expect to see so many different rankings. What's high for some is low for others and vice versa. No wonder this series is starting to get so many mixed reactions. But the one that completely surprises me is this one:

Quote from: Traveller

Aw Neal.. Super Circuit is awesome! :(


Alright, gonna list mine now.


1. MK64
2. MK:SC
3. MK:DD
4. MK:DS
5. MKWii
6. SMK
7. MK7


The bottom end of the list is tricky to place. I liked 7 but didn't end up playing it all that much, and MKWii got frustrating with the A.I. on the higher difficulties. I've played more SMK than 7 and Wii probably.

Ok, I got to know, what is the trick to Super Circuit? I got the game as part of the ambassador program and I put some time into it to try and beat it and get 3 star rankings before Mario Kart 7. But I could never seem to get a handle on the controls and drift or turn well at high speeds. What am I missing that you are getting to like the game this much? I finally gave up on the game.

pokepal148May 22, 2014

Quote from: Adrock

1. 7
2. DS
3. 64
4. Wii
5. Double Dash
6. Super Circuit
7. Original

Not really sure where 8 will go, but from what I've read, my guess is supplanting 7 or DS.

7 on top? no, just no.

pokepal148May 22, 2014

Quote from: NWR_Neal

If we're doing this....

1. Double Dash
2. Wii
3. 7
4. 8
5. 64
6. DS
7. SMK
8. Super Circuit

For me, DD and Wii are far away the best. 7 and 8 are virtually indistinguishable for me (aside from home console vs. portable). 64 is probably only as high because I still love that Battle Mode and nostalgia. I never got into DS that much. SNES is dated. Super Circuit sucks.

The DS game had this crazy idea called 'a good single player mode' that has since apparently been deemed 'un-mario kart' and hasn't been seen since.

Here's my list from what I've played,
#1 DS
#2 Wii
#3 what i've played of DD
#4 SS
#5 tie, Super and 7

StratosMay 22, 2014

I wish they would bring back the Double Dash mechanics. I loved teaming up in that game. I was one of the best racers in my group of friends and my buddy was an excellent gunner and we had the group power slide down to a science. Only problem was he loved throwing his weight around and would slam us off a ledge in an attempt to push opponents off the course. DS had a good battle mode. Don't know why everyone is hating on it. I liked the Shine Get mode.


Double Dash
DS
N64
Wii
SMK

{Not played so can't comment}
7, 8, Super Circuit

1. Wii
2. 64
3. DS
4. 7
5. Double Dash
6. Super Circuit
7. Super Mario Kart


Wii is above and beyond the best with the tightest controls. 64 had a very unique control system compared to modern Mario Karts and is both unique and wonderful.


Double Dash I find to be highly overrated, with the drifting being horrendous and the controls being overall pretty mediocre. Super Circuit is just bad, and the original Super Mario Kart is almost unplayable.

I forgot to include the 20 minutes I played of Mario Kart 8 at Best Buy a year ago. I'd place it just above Double Dash.

KhushrenadaMay 22, 2014

Quote from: Darkurai

Double Dash I find to be highly overrated, with the drifting being horrendous and the controls being overall pretty mediocre.

Woah! I have entered the rabbit hole with this one. I mean, I get that games and controls can connect differently with people and what is intuitive to one person can be completely foreign to another but I'm stunned by that statement. Double Dash is what has established how all Mario Kart games drift and Mario Kart DS just followed it. Maybe that's why I like those two so much. Drifting clicked a lot easier with me on those games.

Lucariofan99May 23, 2014

DS for the WIN!! we have good taste Pokepal ;)

UncleBobRichard Cook, Guest ContributorMay 23, 2014

Curious that *no* one has ranked the arcade games.  Has no one played them, or does everyone who's played them just not consider them to be part of the series?

AdrockMay 23, 2014

I know the arcade games exist, but I haven't played them so I left them off.

Quote from: UncleBob

Curious that *no* one has ranked the arcade games.  Has no one played them, or does everyone who's played them just not consider them to be part of the series?

I haven't played them myself, but I don't think I've ever heard anyone say anything good about them.

KhushrenadaMay 23, 2014

I won't rank what I haven't played unlike the Mario Kart 8 experts who only need a brief demo or other people's opinions to know how to rate something.

Quote from: Khushrenada

Wowzers. I did not expect to see so many different rankings. What's high for some is low for others and vice versa. No wonder this series is starting to get so many mixed reactions. But the one that completely surprises me is this one:

Quote from: Traveller

Aw Neal.. Super Circuit is awesome! :(


Alright, gonna list mine now.


1. MK64
2. MK:SC
3. MK:DD
4. MK:DS
5. MKWii
6. SMK
7. MK7


The bottom end of the list is tricky to place. I liked 7 but didn't end up playing it all that much, and MKWii got frustrating with the A.I. on the higher difficulties. I've played more SMK than 7 and Wii probably.

Ok, I got to know, what is the trick to Super Circuit? I got the game as part of the ambassador program and I put some time into it to try and beat it and get 3 star rankings before Mario Kart 7. But I could never seem to get a handle on the controls and drift or turn well at high speeds. What am I missing that you are getting to like the game this much? I finally gave up on the game.

Well you don't try and play it like other MK's with the power slide, although on some wide turns you can hold it to get a mini boost.

I use a combination of tapping the slide/jump and taking my finger off the accelerator. If I go into a corner with the slide, I usually let go as I begin to drift to the outside of the track, this will let me tighten my turn.

I like the game because it can feel very fast paced and its really satisfying to fly through a course tapping and turning your way through and not messing up. I am a fan of outrunning red and spiny shells too, that can feel pretty tense and its really cool to pull off.

Heres a rough example of me playing two tracks from the game. I haven't played it for quite some time and I was sitting at a strange angle, so its not ideal. I used a Micro to try and show what I do, I can't really notice when Im not using the A button though.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8MR_EwTTlxg&feature=youtu.be

And of course my old Extra Life. http://www.nintendoworldreport.com/extralife/26314/mario-kart-super-circuit

PhilPhillip Stortzum, May 23, 2014

1) Mario Kart DS
2) Mario Kart: Double Dash!!
3) Mario Kart 7
4) Mario Kart Wii
5) Mario Kart: Super Circuit
6) Mario Kart 64
7) Super Mario Kart
8. Mario Kart 8

nickmitchMay 23, 2014

I didn't like Double Dash at first (would've preferred 64 at the time), but the more I think about it, the core mechanic was really awesome.  There was just so much more to strategy than just picking your favorite characters.  Your character combo decided what kind of cars you could drive and what the special item you get was.  Plus you could get a sweet item and hold on to it for the entire race.  That level of strategy hasn't reappeared since.

KhushrenadaMay 23, 2014

Quote from: Traveller

Well you don't try and play it like other MK's with the power slide, although on some wide turns you can hold it to get a mini boost.

I use a combination of tapping the slide/jump and taking my finger off the accelerator. If I go into a corner with the slide, I usually let go as I begin to drift to the outside of the track, this will let me tighten my turn.

I like the game because it can feel very fast paced and its really satisfying to fly through a course tapping and turning your way through and not messing up. I am a fan of outrunning red and spiny shells too, that can feel pretty tense and its really cool to pull off.

Heres a rough example of me playing two tracks from the game. I haven't played it for quite some time and I was sitting at a strange angle, so its not ideal. I used a Micro to try and show what I do, I can't really notice when Im not using the A button though.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8MR_EwTTlxg&feature=youtu.be

And of course my old Extra Life. http://www.nintendoworldreport.com/extralife/26314/mario-kart-super-circuit

Hmm. Now see that seems so unnatural to me. In a Mario Kart, I usually just hold the A button down from start to finish unless there is some sort of incident where I need to let go like in MK64 where you could press the brakes to avoid a banana wipeout. The idea of letting go and tapping the accelerator is probably what's throwing me off. I think I was starting to get to that point because I was just having trouble with turns and it seemed to be the only way I could navigate but I just felt I must be doing it wrong or missing something.

The other thing that threw me off is the speed burst from power sliding or turning. From GC and on, when you started powersliding, you could then get a blue flame and a red flame so that when letting go of the power slide, you'd get a speed burst. With Super Circuit, there were a couple times I got that power slide burst but I couldn't figure out how to get it consistantly. That's what caused me to leave it in frustration. Being able to pull off a consistant power slide burst is how you get a lead and hold onto it in current MK games and get faster times to pull of 3 star ranks and beat Time Trail ghosts. It seems from what you are saying is that it is more a bonus occurance that happens once in awhile as you race.

I was watching the video to see if I could notice your thumb tapping the a button or lifting from it but it didn't seem like it however it's not like that would require a big motion. You seem to be able to get around the tracks pretty smoothly though so congrats on master the game.

------
Alright Phil! Our rankings are pretty much the same aside from your placement of Super Circuit. This man knows what he's doing.
------

Quote from: nickmitch

I didn't like Double Dash at first (would've preferred 64 at the time), but the more I think about it, the core mechanic was really awesome.  There was just so much more to strategy than just picking your favorite characters.  Your character combo decided what kind of cars you could drive and what the special item you get was.  Plus you could get a sweet item and hold on to it for the entire race.  That level of strategy hasn't reappeared since.

Yes, yes, yes! It took me awhile to figure this out. What I like about that mechanic is that it is almost a blending of Battle Mode with racing. Besides just the usual business of racing around tracks and doing some tight cornering, you then had to be aware of your item management also, swapping out characters to maybe get a character specific item or hold onto items.

Honestly, while I was disappointed with the less than stellar battle mode courses, once I started doing this more careful character selection and item management, it really helped that mode to take off and I did come to love it like previous entries. And one of the most tense and mind-warping things for me was the GameCube course. When first playing it, I hated it because this isn't battle mode. There's nowhere to hide or outwit your opponent and item boxes galore. But much like my opinion of Baby Park changed from it being a lazy oval course to a white knuckle ride from the carnage that could be unleashed on it, my opinion changed on the Gamecube course as well. You had to make every item count in that course and be aware of your surroundings. If you saw on player 2's screen that he just acquired a red shell, you are pressing the item button like mad to stop the roulette wheel and hope you've got an item to quickly counter the shell before he lines you up in his sights. With practice, my brother and I started to have some longer battles on the Gamecube map. It can really get the heart pumping.

nickmitchMay 23, 2014

I think I always liked the Baby Park course.  It looks lazy, but that thing can be a real fight.  Items matter a lot in multiplayer, and single player lets you lap opponents, which is funny.

UncleBobRichard Cook, Guest ContributorMay 23, 2014

Baby Park is an amazing example of "Less is More" design.

PhilPhillip Stortzum, May 23, 2014

^

PhilPhillip Stortzum, May 23, 2014

High five, Khush! (I was trying to type "^5" in the prior post, but I must have hit some key that made it post "^"!
Anyway, to better explain my picks (I was lazy at the time of writing the list):

Mario Kart DS - I really liked the tracks, the mission mode (especially), I loved many of the tracks (Delfino Square is my favorite from the game, along with Airship Fortress, Luigi's Mansion, and Bowser's Castle-- though I didn't care for Yoshi's track, the desert track, or the figure 8 circuit) and the online, penis emblems and all! Oh, and the implementation of regular retro tracks-- Super Circuit notwithstanding.

Mario Kart: Double Dash!! - I adore the soundtrack, I love the tracks (Mushroom Bridge, Baby Park, Bowser's Castle, Rainbow Road, Peach Beach, Daisy Cruiser, Dino Dino Jungle, etc.), I enjoyed the novelty of two racer karts, and I have a lot of nostalgia towards this game.

Mario Kart 7 - Features some really great tracks; the online was great; item balance was a little bit of a problem; I didn't like how kart pieces were unlocked randomly and with so much grinding;

Mario Kart Wii - Loved a great many of the tracks, loved how many characters there were and how varied they were, online was fun, but battle mode was nerfed, and the item balance was way too poor; oh, and I didn't like how I couldn't play the grand prix with my brother to unlock stuff like every console MK prior

Mario Kart: Super Circuit - I love the art direction of this game, watercolor/pastel-like; great amount of tracks; I'm not really big on the 2D Mario Karts, despite growing up on Super Mario Kart! Also, driving was a little slippery to me.

Mario Kart 64 - Loved, loved, LOVED this game growing up. Still contains my favorite soundtrack from the series (with Double Dash being second). Features my favorite Bowser's Castle track iteration. Battle mode was great. Some tracks were just "there," but I did enjoy the majority of them. My real problem with this game now is just how blatant the rubber-band AI is. It makes grand prix runs a chore.

Super Mario Kart - AI was cheap, driving was slippery, many tracks are just boring now to me (but that's obviously because of what's available now), but it's still a fun game. I'm looking forward to an eventual NA Virtual Console release.

StratosMay 23, 2014

I got to play the Mario Kart arcade title in Disney World a few years ago. It was fun but not nearly enough time to get a solid feel for it in comparison to the other titles.


I'll have to remember to look for it again when we go soon.

Quote from: Khushrenada

Quote from: Traveller

Well you don't try and play it like other MK's with the power slide, although on some wide turns you can hold it to get a mini boost.

I use a combination of tapping the slide/jump and taking my finger off the accelerator. If I go into a corner with the slide, I usually let go as I begin to drift to the outside of the track, this will let me tighten my turn.

I like the game because it can feel very fast paced and its really satisfying to fly through a course tapping and turning your way through and not messing up. I am a fan of outrunning red and spiny shells too, that can feel pretty tense and its really cool to pull off.

Heres a rough example of me playing two tracks from the game. I haven't played it for quite some time and I was sitting at a strange angle, so its not ideal. I used a Micro to try and show what I do, I can't really notice when Im not using the A button though.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8MR_EwTTlxg&feature=youtu.be

And of course my old Extra Life. http://www.nintendoworldreport.com/extralife/26314/mario-kart-super-circuit

Hmm. Now see that seems so unnatural to me. In a Mario Kart, I usually just hold the A button down from start to finish unless there is some sort of incident where I need to let go like in MK64 where you could press the brakes to avoid a banana wipeout. The idea of letting go and tapping the accelerator is probably what's throwing me off. I think I was starting to get to that point because I was just having trouble with turns and it seemed to be the only way I could navigate but I just felt I must be doing it wrong or missing something.

The other thing that threw me off is the speed burst from power sliding or turning. From GC and on, when you started powersliding, you could then get a blue flame and a red flame so that when letting go of the power slide, you'd get a speed burst. With Super Circuit, there were a couple times I got that power slide burst but I couldn't figure out how to get it consistantly. That's what caused me to leave it in frustration. Being able to pull off a consistant power slide burst is how you get a lead and hold onto it in current MK games and get faster times to pull of 3 star ranks and beat Time Trail ghosts. It seems from what you are saying is that it is more a bonus occurance that happens once in awhile as you race.

I was watching the video to see if I could notice your thumb tapping the a button or lifting from it but it didn't seem like it however it's not like that would require a big motion. You seem to be able to get around the tracks pretty smoothly though so congrats on master the game.

------
Alright Phil! Our rankings are pretty much the same aside from your placement of Super Circuit. This man knows what he's doing.
------

Quote from: nickmitch

I didn't like Double Dash at first (would've preferred 64 at the time), but the more I think about it, the core mechanic was really awesome.  There was just so much more to strategy than just picking your favorite characters.  Your character combo decided what kind of cars you could drive and what the special item you get was.  Plus you could get a sweet item and hold on to it for the entire race.  That level of strategy hasn't reappeared since.

Yes, yes, yes! It took me awhile to figure this out. What I like about that mechanic is that it is almost a blending of Battle Mode with racing. Besides just the usual business of racing around tracks and doing some tight cornering, you then had to be aware of your item management also, swapping out characters to maybe get a character specific item or hold onto items.

Honestly, while I was disappointed with the less than stellar battle mode courses, once I started doing this more careful character selection and item management, it really helped that mode to take off and I did come to love it like previous entries. And one of the most tense and mind-warping things for me was the GameCube course. When first playing it, I hated it because this isn't battle mode. There's nowhere to hide or outwit your opponent and item boxes galore. But much like my opinion of Baby Park changed from it being a lazy oval course to a white knuckle ride from the carnage that could be unleashed on it, my opinion changed on the Gamecube course as well. You had to make every item count in that course and be aware of your surroundings. If you saw on player 2's screen that he just acquired a red shell, you are pressing the item button like mad to stop the roulette wheel and hope you've got an item to quickly counter the shell before he lines you up in his sights. With practice, my brother and I started to have some longer battles on the Gamecube map. It can really get the heart pumping.

I actually don't need to tap A all that much, just sometimes it's helpful to correct or stay on course. Tapping and holding the jump is much more important.

Also, like I said, the power slide isn't really much like other Karts. To get it you have to hold a drift for an extended period, you will only be able to get it on the long wide turns as it needs a bit of time.

Mop it upMay 23, 2014

I guess I might as well join in on this.

1. Mario Kart Wii.
The first - and still the only - game in the series to get things just about right. Good selection of characters and vehicles, fun and dynamic new tracks, cool new items and good mixture of racing and items, great online, neat new tweaks to the formula like tricking, and a better drift system. But most importantly, the control felt responsive, smooth, and intuitive, which is more than I can say for the other games in the series, except maybe MK VII. I like Mario Kart Wii way more than all other games in the series.

2. Mario Kart VII
A real step down from Mario Kart Wii, but still a decent game. Track design varies wildy, with some good and some downright terrible ones. Control feels a little slippery but is still good enough. Gliding was neat, the propeller felt a little pointless though. Going back to 8 racers though makes it less exciting, as well as other removed features.

3. Mario Kart Double Dash!!
The double kart thing was a nice shakeup and should come back as an optional way to play. Character-specific items were a neat idea but too imbalanced. Feels a little light on content with just 16 tracks, but there are some good ones. Where it really loses me though is the awful control, just feels so loose and slippery, and flicking the stick back and forth to get drift boosts is just plain annoying.

4. Mario Kart DS
This game seems to have introduced the same style of track design still used today, so it's an important evolutionary step. It still has some good tracks as well and introduced some nice items. Mission mode and emblems should come back. The control is still pretty terrible though, made worse with the D-pad; I need analogue control for my racers.

5. Mario Kart 64
Since this is one of the few games we had growing up, I have played it a decent amount back then. I was never too into it though since the controls are downright terrible, and I can't stand to play the game today. It also has some of the most ridiculous item balance in the series, as even powerful items like lightning and stars can be received in second place.

6. Super Mario Kart
Obviously it was good for a start, but I didn't have an SNES during its time so I never played this in its day. It doesn't hold up and isn't worth playing today.

7. Mario Kart Super Circuit
I got this very shortly after getting a GBA in 2001. One of the biggest mistake buys I've ever made. Terrible controls, bad tracks, and busted mechanics make for a miserable game.

What mechanics are broken in SC?

Quote from: UncleBob

Curious that *no* one has ranked the arcade games.  Has no one played them, or does everyone who's played them just not consider them to be part of the series?

I've played them, but not nearly enough to give a final assessment on them. Tough to do that for arcade games you play maybe 8 times over the course of 3 years.

Mop it upMay 23, 2014

I forgot to mention that I have not played Mario Kart 8 or the arcade games, which is why I didn't rank them. I know there's a demo at GameStop, but at this point I can wait for the release.

Quote from: Traveller

What mechanics are broken in SC?

For me, I felt like the drifting and the boost mechanics were designed for a different game and didn't work well with the tracks, especially the SNES tracks which were designed using different control. They also removed the feather item which again screws up some of the SNES tracks. There was some other stuff too but after so long, I have forgotten it.

full disclosure I have only played SNES, GBA, N64, GC, and DS MK so here are my rankings for what its worth.


1. DS
2. N64
3. GBA
4. SNES (nostlagia mostly plus the awesome battle mode)
5. Double Dash ( would rather rank it a 10 and just make up that I played the rest because I hated it so much but whatever)

Lucariofan99May 27, 2014

DS certaintly had the best balloon battle, Block fort, blow up your own balloons,Waluigi,Boo's,Waluigi and only one bad thing... PALM FRICKEN SHORE. Did i talk about Waluigi?
http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRiIUD40vCpQGpuUAk6Y54HqoK3wkVkeWVe3uPergU1-HgkRJjXKll51e-v8A
search?q=waluigi+not+in+mario+kart+7&saf

nickmitchMay 27, 2014

Quote from: UncleBob

Curious that *no* one has ranked the arcade games.  Has no one played them, or does everyone who's played them just not consider them to be part of the series?

Quote from: nickmitch

1. Wii
2. 7
3. DD
4. DS
5. 64
6. Arcade
7. SMK
8. SS

DD ranks high for me because it's still the most unique version of the series.

Dorky Stuff SiteMay 31, 2014

To me Mario Kart 8 just looks like a fresh graphical coat of paint from Mario Kart Wii.
Barely anything new, but the Nintendo hype machine never stops.


I wrote an entire article about my thoughts here: http://www.dorkystuff.com/?p=38

KhushrenadaMay 31, 2014

Quote from: Dorky

To me Mario Kart 8 just looks like a fresh graphical coat of paint from Mario Kart Wii.
Barely anything new, but the Nintendo hype machine never stops.

Hmmmm. Words to consider. All the reviews here were very enthusiastic and maybe too positive. Interesting to consider that hype may be clouding the judgement of people.

However, when I click on the link you quoted as shown here:

Quote:

I wrote an entire article about my thoughts here: http://www.dorkystuff.com/?p=38

It doesn't take me to your site. You may want to edit the link you have in your post to ensure it goes to the proper channel.

NeifirstMay 31, 2014

Well, after spending 6+ hours with online races, both randoms and tournaments, a 7.5 score is absolutely insane.  Especially in light of a 10 for an interminable cakewalk like Kirby's Epic Yarn.

RachtMay 31, 2014

Quote from: Neifirst

Well, after spending 6+ hours with online races, both randoms and tournaments, a 7.5 score is absolutely insane.  Especially in light of a 10 for an interminable cakewalk like Kirby's Epic Yarn.

Well, after spending 6+ hours with online AND offline races, both with randoms and tournaments, a 7.5 score is absolutely justified. Especially in light of a 10 for an incredible gameplay mechanic infused and graphically endearing experience like Kirby's Epic Yarn.

Seriously. Mario Kart 8 is GRAND. It is so buttery smooth, that I can't really express in words how much of a joy this game is to play. Does it bring anything drastically new to the table, though? Nope. The zero-G/anti-gravity stuff is really brilliant, however. Racing along and then having to tilt my head a little to keep up with the action as I go sideways on a wall is a very cool experience. You don't even realise you're doing it, because it just feels natural. And the new U-turn move in battle mode is quite handy. Love that addition.

But is the game an overall polished-to-the-brim, graphically impressive, visually charming experience? Oh, absolutely. 7.5 is an above average score, people. And this is a very above average game. And would I raise Neal's score by .5 if actual Battle Mode arenas were added to the game via DLC? No doubt.

Mario Kart 8. GET IT.

broodwarsJune 01, 2014

I like what I've played of this game (2 Retro Grand Prix & 2 new Grand Prix), but wow...this game is light on content. The track designs are excellent, but there are so very...very...few of them. I just feels wrong nowadays putting an hour into a game and knowing you've already seen half the tracks the game has (obligatory mirror mode aside), with the only alternative being a slider (50cc, 100cc, 150cc) increasing the amount of bullshit the AI is going to throw at you.

AdrockJune 01, 2014

Aren't there the same amount of tracks in Mario Kart 8 as the last few entries in the series, 16 new and 16 retro? Was this a problem before? It would be nice to have some of the Arcade tracks in here just so a bunch of people like myself can experience them with searching high and low for an actual arcade unit. Also, Baby Park because... just because Baby Park.

Anyway, my friend bought this, and I put some time into the game yesterday. It's about what I expected. Also, Battle Mode is indeed mediocre. I wasn't a huge fan of it before, but my goodness, we just need Block Fort back.

On a related note, I also played Mario Kart 64 again recently. I'd totally by an HD version of it, if only so I can be decent at one Mario Kart game.

UncleBobRichard Cook, Guest ContributorJune 01, 2014

Quote from: Adrock

Aren't there the same amount of tracks in Mario Kart 8 as the last few entries in the series, 16 new and 16 retro? Was this a problem before?

I think that's part of the problem.  "More of the same" isn't always a good reason to drop $60. ;)

Seriously, though, in the age of DLC, I would have liked to have seen 24-32 brand spankin' new tracks shipped with the game and "retro" courses added through DLC.

StratosJune 01, 2014

If they do give us retro tracks as DLC I would hope they could also give us the ability to play the tracks in their original game order. Would be fun to relive the tough older cups.

broodwarsJune 01, 2014

Quote from: UncleBob

Quote from: Adrock

Aren't there the same amount of tracks in Mario Kart 8 as the last few entries in the series, 16 new and 16 retro? Was this a problem before?

I think that's part of the problem.  "More of the same" isn't always a good reason to drop $60. ;)

Seriously, though, in the age of DLC, I would have liked to have seen 24-32 brand spankin' new tracks shipped with the game and "retro" courses added through DLC.

Agreed. It's true that Mario Kart has used this format for ages, but when you compare it to other racers the amount of content this time just feels anemic (especially with Battle Mode completely neutered).  It's hard in today's market to justify that $60 on a game that you'll essentially see all the content in in 2 hours (especially when half that content is just a remix of tracks I've seen before).  It's pretty much the same issue I'd have if Nintendo made a new Star Fox game just like Star Fox 64. Sure, the content could be awesome, but if I can finish the game in the time it would take me to watch Frozen, that $60 price tag just doesn't make sense anymore.  Since I paid for Mario Kart 8 mostly using credit I'd had sitting on the eShop for months anyway, I don't feel as bad about the paltry amount of content here as I would be if I had paid $60 all at once, but it's still a serious problem with the game.

Leo13June 01, 2014

Quote from: broodwars

Quote from: UncleBob

Quote from: Adrock

Aren't there the same amount of tracks in Mario Kart 8 as the last few entries in the series, 16 new and 16 retro? Was this a problem before?

I think that's part of the problem.  "More of the same" isn't always a good reason to drop $60. ;)

Seriously, though, in the age of DLC, I would have liked to have seen 24-32 brand spankin' new tracks shipped with the game and "retro" courses added through DLC.

Agreed. It's true that Mario Kart has used this format for ages, but when you compare it to other racers the amount of content this time just feels anemic (especially with Battle Mode completely neutered).  It's hard in today's market to justify that $60 on a game that you'll essentially see all the content in in 2 hours (especially when half that content is just a remix of tracks I've seen before).  It's pretty much the same issue I'd have if Nintendo made a new Star Fox game just like Star Fox 64. Sure, the content could be awesome, but if I can finish the game in the time it would take me to watch Frozen, that $60 price tag just doesn't make sense anymore.  Since I paid for Mario Kart 8 mostly using credit I'd had sitting on the eShop for months anyway, I don't feel as bad about the paltry amount of content here as I would be if I had paid $60 all at once, but it's still a serious problem with the game.

It's really hard to complain when you're getting Pikmin 3 or Wind Waker FREE

broodwarsJune 01, 2014

Quote from: Leo13

It's really hard to complain when you're getting Pikmin 3 or Wind Waker FREE

Not when you already own them and they're the only worthwhile games available.  :P:

buttleJune 01, 2014

I think, to call this a 7.5 out of 10, the 10 is what where folks imagine the game should be after all this time.  But that really isn't doing the game or the fanbase any favors.  You can dream big all you want, just don't loose track of reality. 


Right now, I'm going through and beating the staff ghosts one by one.  And each of these tracks are excellently designed, and there is a ton of variety in the karts.  The drifting especially has never been more varied.  And from my play online and in the Grand Prixs, the weapon changes HUGELY effect the game.  I'm using far more strategy with only having 1 weapon.  The track isn't flooded with bananas like other games there aren't just stupid weapons flying everywhere.  There are definitely weapons but it's a GREAT balance.  And I love the coins.


It's easy to forget how amazing this series is or how much variety the series has.  But Mario Kart 8 really does do something different and for me, it makes for a great experience.

Leo13June 01, 2014

Quote from: broodwars

Quote from: Leo13

It's really hard to complain when you're getting Pikmin 3 or Wind Waker FREE

Not when you already own them and they're the only worthwhile games available.  :P:

I disagree. I own Mario U and Party U and I think they're both great games

StratosJune 01, 2014

I wonder what would happen if you called NOA support. Explain you already have all of the games in the promotion and maybe you could convince them to give you one of the other options from overseas like W101 or Warioware.

nickmitchJune 01, 2014

That'd be worth a shot.  Especially if you have all the games registered on Club Nintendo as proof.

nickmitchJune 01, 2014

Well, additional proof.

AdrockJune 02, 2014

Just out of curiosity, what would be an appropriate amount of content?

For comparison's sake, Sonic and Sega All-Stars Racing had 24 tracks (all new since it's the first one). It's sequel, Sonic and All-Stars Racing Transformed, had 21 tracks, 17 of which were new (one was DLC). The former has eight more original tracks but eight fewer overall. The latter had a comparative amount of new tracks but added boats and planes with tracks that changed mid-race. Mario Kart 8 seems comparable to that. Of course, Gran Turismo 6 had like 70 tracks, but they're different kinds of racing games so I'm not sure comparisons are especially useful or fair here.

It's difficult for me personally to comment on what justifies $60 worth of content since I haven't purchased a $60 game in some time. I still haven't bought Mario Kart 8 and I suppose when I do, I won't be spending $60 since I have some trade credit. As a point of reference, I played and enjoyed the ever-repetitive shit out of Mario Kart 64, and my mom spent $50 on it (which is almost $74 today). I wouldn't say no to more content because I love value. However, taking into account what we used to get, rising development costs, and comparisons to similar titles, Mario Kart 8 doesn't seem too light on content. We don't know if Nintendo plans on offering DLC in the future (besides that random free Mercedes-Benz kart" in Japan), but they have given DLC away for free and their paid DLC has been fairly substantial.

Well, I'm right onboard with Neal's score. I've had the game for three days and I've already unlocked everything and experienced every course (multiple times).

azekeJune 02, 2014

https://i.imgur.com/I5aR4yX.gif

azekeJune 02, 2014

http://giant.gfycat.com/LimitedFreshAdeliepenguin.gif

nickmitchJune 02, 2014

The .GIFs alone make this game a 9.  Clearly, the review was just premature.

To add on how much content is enough: I don't know.  It feels like we've been getting the same amount of tracks for some time now.  I'd hope for a few more this go around or at least the promise of more via DLC.  Sure, this is entirely possible/plausible nowadays, but the guarantee isn't there right now.

CericJune 02, 2014

I've beaten 50cc.  I normally beat 50cc then 100cc etc etc.  While the tracks are good I'm not enjoying running through them again.  Honestly most of the time its feels like I'm racing against 1 other kart while the Computer is Neutering my Item drops, I can't tell you how many time I've gotten the Coin and had 10 coins already.

Then there is the whole UI problem.  When your playing Single Player after each cup it dumps you to the initial load screen and I have to go through everything again to go to the next cup.  The load times between tracks feel too long.  The lack of Personal Karts for the characters takes some of the Wimsy away.

Sonic Racing Transformed you didn't run into a lot of those UI problems, except the load times.  They also did a good job of wringing variety out of there track sets with Challenges that would modify the tracks and be different then as straight up race.  I rarely felt as if the Comp was limiting my Item set because I was in the front.

Lot of races I have a good clear lead haven't seen anyone for 2 laps and then all of the suddenly the last lap everyone is there.  I had one where I was literally Blue Shell, Green Shell, Red Shell, Hit by a Banana while in the Air, and Green Shelled to a 6th place finish.

Also why can't I get the Course Map on my Screen be it I'm playing on the Gamepad or the TV.  When I'm on the TV I don't even see my controller unless I look down away from the race.  I would like to still see that information.  With the Gamepad I just don't know.  Makes it feel lonely for most of the race.

I think that the engine could easily make this one of the best Mario Kart if they release sets of 2 Grand Prix (1 New Tracks, 1 Retro Tracks) for about $2.50 per pack, cleaned up the interface, and fixed the clear player limiting.

I have to agree with the 7.5.

Mop it upJune 02, 2014

Quote from: Adrock

Just out of curiosity, what would be an appropriate amount of content?

Generally speaking, I feel that new systems should bring with them bigger, better games, but I understand how difficult that has become with the skyrocketing costs of game development over the past couple decades. In the case of Mario Kart, I would gladly trade the retro tracks in order to have a total of 24-32 new ones in one game.

There are also more features they could add in to get more mileage out of the tracks that do exist. One example would be to allow racing on them in the backwards direction, which would be a far more interesting twist than having mirror yet again (though mirror can stay). The mission mode in the DS game was a great idea and should return and be expanded upon; they could probably even mix that idea with the adventure aspect of Diddy Kong Racing and finally have a decent single player game for once.

There are also some things from past games missing in this one, such as battle arenas, and small things like no mini-map on the screen, and no record-keeping, for some examples.

I've always viewed Mario Kart as a B-level series, and this is a large part why.

StratosJune 03, 2014

I am very sad that there has been no return of Diddy Kong Racing or an incorporation of elements from it into the Mario Kart franchise. Though, if the U has a typical life-cycle we could be due for a new racer near the end of the cycle and a DKR could really fit the bill. It would also be a great way to incorporate the NFC figures since MK was too far along to include them.

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WiiU

Game Profile

Mario Kart 8 Box Art

Genre Racing
Developer Nintendo
Players1 - 4
Online1 - 12
Controllers & Accessories Wii U GamePad
Wii Remote
Wii U Pro Controller
Wii Nunchuk
Amiibo

Worldwide Releases

na: Mario Kart 8
Release May 30, 2014
PublisherNintendo
RatingEveryone
jpn: Mario Kart 8
Release May 29, 2014
PublisherNintendo
RatingAll Ages
eu: Mario Kart 8
Release May 30, 2014
PublisherNintendo
Rating3+
aus: Mario Kart 8
Release May 31, 2014
PublisherNintendo
RatingGeneral

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