Author Topic: Baten Kaitos (Read 35639 times)

mouse_clicker · « **Reply #25 on:** July 21, 2003, 09:10:26 PM »

All I'm saying about the visual style is it's nothing we haven't seen before- not that that's a bad thing, because Grandia 2 had your stereotypical RPG anime characters and that's one of my favorite games ever. But let me tell you something about card based battles- I HATE them. I don't care if the story is the best ever in a videogame, the script is Oscar worthy, or the music is great, the core of RPG's is fighting enemies and if I can't have fun fighting the enemies, I can't have fun with the game. I never had fun with Pokemon because the battle system was so horrible (straight forward turn-based- at least throw in some strategy). I've heard the story in Soul Reaver was amazing, but the gameplay was so horrible I never got past the first 20 minutes. Quite frankly, if Baten Kaitos truly is card-based, I won't be buying it, simple as that.

Darc Requiem · « **Reply #26 on:** July 21, 2003, 11:03:26 PM »

Sigh....you've completely missed my point. I don't like card based RPG's either but that doesn't mean I'll hate Baten Kaitos. Namco made Weapon Lord and Tekken and I don't care for either. Using your logic, I would hate Soul Calibur too but I don't its my favorite 3D fighter. I never cared for Soccer games but I loved ISS 64, even my brother loved the game and he hates soccer and soccer games more than I do. I could go on. My point is don't write off a game you've never played. As Nintendo gamers, who are constantly dealing with the casual gamer turning up there noses at games like Legend of Zelda: WW without even trying them, we should be more inclined to give a game a chance. Namco put top development talent into not just one GC game but several. They put their best RPG team on an all new original GC rpg. You see a few screens with cards and automatically assume Pokemon and Lost Kingdoms am I the only one bothered by this? I mean we don't even have a description of how the battle system works and you are already refusing to play the game.

Darc Requiem

Gamefreak · « **Reply #27 on:** July 22, 2003, 12:34:16 AM »

From a reviewer's point of view.....Chrono Trigger would be the best RPG ever made. Xenogears is great, awesome storyline, etc. FF7 is great too (but nowhere near top anything in my book). But you can't foget the gameplay, gameplay engineering, etc...That's the most important part, and you can't let things like an amazing story cloud your judgment....Well, anyway, everyone is entitled to their own favorite games....

Anyway, this game looks....amazing. I'm not sure how many of you have seen this game in motion, but it's quite possibly the best looking RPG ever...

Mario · « **Reply #28 on:** July 22, 2003, 02:24:40 AM »

From a SALES perspective, Pokemon is the greatest RPG ever

Also, Namco's sales estimate for Baiten Kaitos is 500,000 in Japan. Dont write this one off so quickly

SuperLink666 · « **Reply #29 on:** July 22, 2003, 05:17:00 AM »

Another game to add to the list of I WANT REALLY BADLY

Atleast it will be summer 2004 so there might be a drough

Grey Ninja · « **Reply #30 on:** July 22, 2003, 05:19:47 AM »

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Originally posted by: Gup
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Originally posted by: Odin
Well to me it seems to be a Final Fantasy game in name only. Not much of a story, connectivety, no experience, mission based, no summons? Doesn't sound like a "Final Fantasy" game to me. FF:CC just looks like a "suped" up Gauntlet with out the exp points.

Completely agreed, the only relations are the enemies and probably the item's and weapon's name

Did that make Final Fantasy Tactics any less great?

egman · « **Reply #31 on:** July 22, 2003, 05:24:13 AM »

I really love the look of the game, but like mouse_clicker I'm worried about it being card base. I doubt I would mind the battle system--if it's turned based how different could it be from a traditional rpg? The thing that does worry me though is aquiring the cards. I really want to avoid a "gotta catch'em all" collecthon. I still haven't finished FF8, and I have had that game since it began shipping years ago. The whole card game and how it connected to the weapons system was an exercise in frustration. I usually don't mind that kind of game--I love Pokemon for instance. But the way important weapon upgrades were tied to the card game took the fun out of the game as I was overwhelmed with what I had to do make the final weapons.

If the aquisition of cards revolves around some trading/mini game system my interest will drop nearly to zero. If they can ensure that the game will boil down to a herculean effort to get every card, then I'll give it a try.

Grey Ninja · « **Reply #32 on:** July 22, 2003, 05:42:02 AM »

I seem to have missed a page here in my last post...

Mouse Clicker, I have to agree with Darc on this one. You are being a little too narrow minded with the game.

Quote
Originally posted by: Gamefreak
From a reviewer's point of view.....Chrono Trigger would be the best RPG ever made. Xenogears is great, awesome storyline, etc. FF7 is great too (but nowhere near top anything in my book). But you can't foget the gameplay, gameplay engineering, etc...That's the most important part, and you can't let things like an amazing story cloud your judgment....Well, anyway, everyone is entitled to their own favorite games....

Anyway, this game looks....amazing. I'm not sure how many of you have seen this game in motion, but it's quite possibly the best looking RPG ever...

Yes. I agree with you. From a reviewing perspective, Xenogears wouldn't be that great. Repetitive level design in later parts of the game, and the second disc has very little gameplay involved with it. The game was very rushed, as they ran out of funding, and were forced to bring it to the table with what was done. However, I don't feel that the game was compromised by that. The game was created to tell the greatest gaming story ever told, and that's what it did.

Chrono Trigger of course, was perfection in every area, and that's not to be trifled with, but to me personally, it didn't do as much for me as Xenogears. Don't get me wrong. I love both games to death... but Xenogears just struck me a hell of a lot harder, unfinished though it might have been.

Gohan_Chaos · « **Reply #33 on:** July 22, 2003, 06:43:58 AM »

Doesn't "Baten Kaitos" sound a lot like a new Skies Of Arcadia??, I mean Sega isnt making this RPG, but there's continents, but its in an imaginary world with 2 main characters, its very suspicious, and as for the greatest RPGs, it would have to be Final Fantasy 7 and "Tales Of..." franchise, and Zelda, Baten Kaitos is one weird game, but it sounds phat and all, can't wait for this one, and it doesent sound like the freaky "Xenogears/Xenosaga" series, the "Xeno" games are way too confusing and way too hard to understand, "Baten Kaitos" sounds like a very understandable story-line unlike the very complex "Xeno" games/franchise

Ian Sane · « **Reply #34 on:** July 22, 2003, 07:19:53 AM »

I don't really have a big problem with the card based battles. It's not my cup of tea but then I don't really like most RPGs anyway. If Baten Kaitos is popular with RPG fanatics then it'll be good enough for me.

However I do think that the Gamecube already has it's fair share of card based RPGs so it doesn't really make that much sense to make another one. We already have Lost Kingdoms 1 & 2 and PSO III is going to be card based. Wouldn't it make more sense to give us some more conventional RPGs (since we only have like one) before going off into the less popular RPG sub-genres? I guess Monolith's other RPG will fill in the gap but so far the Gamecube's RPG lineup has been very non-traditional. It seems rather odd that RPG developers are taking risks and experimenting on a console that has a weak RPG lineup. Maybe they're hoping to popularize these ideas on a RPG starved userbase where any RPG will get more coverage than it would on the PS2.

rpglover · « **Reply #35 on:** July 22, 2003, 07:57:00 AM »

the problem right now with baten kaitos is that we havent even seen the game in action
this game looks pretty good though from what i have seen in the pictures
but mouse_clicker has a point with the fact that in most rpgs you battle a lot and the battle system should be good
but we havent even seen the game in motion yet- i would bet that the battle system will not be like lost kingdoms
in lost kingdoms you only ever had one person in battle- yourself and you attacked by throwing cards
in this game it seems that it will be party based- so i could bet that the game would not feel like lost kingdoms
the cards could be used for all of the attacks and instead of picking attack or magic in a menu the cards themselves will serve that purpose
i would not write off this game because it is card based- give it a chance and see what it looks like in motion before you make judgements

rpglover · « **Reply #36 on:** July 22, 2003, 08:21:46 AM »

after some searching around i found some information about this game's battle system
from gamepro.com

"As co-director Hiroya Hatsushiba was quick to point out, there is more to Baten's battle system than is obvious from the screenshots. "The battle system appears to be card-based," he said at the event, "but these are not card battles here. All of the player's actions in battle are governed by these Magnus cards, but the player has to choose his moves from cards which are continually dealt out to him. It's not like a collectible-card game as much as it feels like a falling-block puzzle game of sorts. To launch a combo, all you have to do is use a card before your current attack is completed, so depending on your deck and the cards you use, your combos vary widely. Work it right and you can double the power of your attacks, but if, for example, you use a fire-element card with a water-element card, the net effect could be cut in half."

It's worth noting that everything you can do in battle—including using items and running away from enemies—can only be done if you have the right Magnus card in your current hand. There are also some "voice-only" cards that're used mostly to go with your combo moves and make your party look cool."

it seems like this game wont feel like lost kingdoms at all- hope this helps out

mouse_clicker · « **Reply #37 on:** July 22, 2003, 10:03:31 AM »

Narrow minded schmarrow minded- what comprises almost all of the gameplay in an RPG? Fighting enemies. Now, if you don't like the battle system so much you actually HATE fighting enemies, how the hell do you expect to get any enjoyment out of the game? Do you want to know why Grandia 2's one of my favorite games ever? Because it's battle system was so incredibly fun there wasn't a moment in that game I wasn't enjoying myself- I'd fight any enemy I could find because I loved the battle system so much. Now just reverse that and you get how I feel while playing card-based RPG's. I'm sure the story will be fantastic, the script will be wonderful, and everything else we've come to expect from Namco, but if I can't have fun fighting enemies in the game where else am I going to have fun? I REALLY don't want to drop 50 bucks down on a game I know I'm going to dread playing.

Darc Requiem · « **Reply #38 on:** July 22, 2003, 12:34:32 PM »

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Originally posted by: mouse_clicker
Narrow minded schmarrow minded- what comprises almost all of the gameplay in an RPG? Fighting enemies. Now, if you don't like the battle system so much you actually HATE fighting enemies, how the hell do you expect to get any enjoyment out of the game? Do you want to know why Grandia 2's one of my favorite games ever? Because it's battle system was so incredibly fun there wasn't a moment in that game I wasn't enjoying myself- I'd fight any enemy I could find because I loved the battle system so much. Now just reverse that and you get how I feel while playing card-based RPG's. I'm sure the story will be fantastic, the script will be wonderful, and everything else we've come to expect from Namco, but if I can't have fun fighting enemies in the game where else am I going to have fun? I REALLY don't want to drop 50 bucks down on a game I know I'm going to dread playing.

Your point is valid and I agree that if you hate an RPG's battle system you aren't gonna enjoy the game in most cases. That said you are still being narrow minded. You haven't played Baten Kaitos, no one here has so how can you say you hate the battle system! You haven't used the battles system and neither have I. Thats why although I too despise Card RPG's I'm actually willing to see how the battle system turns out before I write the game off. We've gotten what 10 screen shots and a quotable from the developer to go on and you've already written the game off. There has been many a time I've you seen you ream someone because they weren't giving a game a chance. It seems you are doing the same here. I mean I wasn't to keen on the battle system of Rubies of Eventide, it was a turned based MMORPG but I actually played the game and you know what I liked the battle system. Now if I would have had your attitude I would have missed out on a great game.

Darc Requiem

mouse_clicker · « **Reply #39 on:** July 22, 2003, 01:49:08 PM »

CARDS = BAD. If the battle system has cards in it, I won't like it. I KNOW I won't like it. It's like when you don't want to fly in an airplane that's rusted, is dripping gas, and is flown by a guy with 2 lazy eyes. I don't need to be IN the airplane to know something's going to go wrong.

Mario · « **Reply #40 on:** July 22, 2003, 05:28:06 PM »

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Originally posted by: mouse_clicker
CARDS = BAD. If the battle system has cards in it, I won't like it. I KNOW I won't like it. It's like when you don't want to fly in an airplane that's rusted, is dripping gas, and is flown by a guy with 2 lazy eyes. I don't need to be IN the airplane to know something's going to go wrong.

Dude, that is just wrong. It's like me saying i dont like cartoons, so Wind Waker = BAD! -_-

You havent played the game, dont be so shallow.

BlkPaladin · « **Reply #41 on:** July 22, 2003, 06:17:57 PM »

From what I have read about the game it has nothing to do with Xenogears.

And as for the cards in the battle system it looks more like it just a part of the girls magic system to help with know which form that thing she has is going to take.

And The Magic box is reporting that after they are done with this, Xenosaga II, and the "Directors cut" of Xenosaga I they will be developing for more than just Namco. (Let the speculation begin.)

Its currently on the front news page.

mouse_clicker · « **Reply #42 on:** July 22, 2003, 07:00:48 PM »

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Dude, that is just wrong. It's like me saying i dont like cartoons, so Wind Waker = BAD! -_-

You havent played the game, dont be so shallow.

Jesus- I'm getting really tired of having to justify myself to everyone and their mother

First off, read what I said in my 3 or 4 other posts. Second, no, it's NOT like saying Wind Waker is bad because you don't like cartoons. I swear, all of you call me shallow when you're just as thickheaded. Let me ask you something- if you hated turn-based battles, I mean really despised them with every fiber of your being, do you think you're going to get ANY fun out of a turn-based RPG? Of course not! And are you going to take any crap from people calling you narrow minded or shallow? Hell no! I don't enjoy card-based battles and can deduce from their that I won't enjoy Baten Kaitos seeing as it is card-based. I'm sick and tired of every hypocrite on this board calling me shallow and narrow minded when they obviously don't understand my opinion.

Mario · « **Reply #43 on:** July 22, 2003, 07:10:23 PM »

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Let me ask you something- if you hated turn-based battles, I mean really despised them with every fiber of your being, do you think you're going to get ANY fun out of a turn-based RPG?

Actually i generally dont like turn based RPGs, i dont even own ONE turned based rpg besides Final Fantasy 7 which i dont like that much. But Pokemon is one of my all time favourite games. And guess what, its a turn based RPG. Go figure? Im also going to give Baiten Kaitos a chance, not because it looks like a fantastic game in my eyes, but because ive heard really good things about it and apparently its a very well made game. You are shallow minded.

mouse_clicker · « **Reply #44 on:** July 22, 2003, 07:18:43 PM »

You've heard barely anything about it! All they've shown is some movies and art, and the only information is a cliche story and how the battles work. If anything you YOURSELF are "shallow minded" (what the hell does that mean, anyway?) because you're planning to spend $50 on a game you know next to nothing about. Next time you want to claim I'M being shallow or whatever, make sure you're innocent yourself. I'm REALLY getting pissed off with you guys.

Mario · « **Reply #45 on:** July 22, 2003, 07:25:51 PM »

Did i say i was going to buy it? Im just going to give it a chance and wait for it to be RELEASED before i make up my mind, which you have obviously already done. Since we have "barely heard anything about it!" why have you already dismissed it as crap?

rpglover · « **Reply #46 on:** July 22, 2003, 07:31:39 PM »

mouse- i can see that you hate card based games with a passion- thats one thing i think everyone has learned today
but i posted earlier a quote from one of the directors (from www.gamepro.com) about the battle system itself- and it seems nothing like a card battle system like yu-gi-oh or lost kingdoms
they said that you dont collect the cards- they are basically just the forms of attacks you can do
the cards are random on how you get them- they described it as a "falling block puzzle" type of battle system where you choose the attacks (on the corresponding cards) and combine them to make larger attacks or combos
i cant guarentee that even though it looks like a card based system, it wont feel like it that much since i havent seen it in motion
but the comments that the director made about it made me feel a little better about the battle system
i guess the only thing i can say is that you should just give it a chance and once you see the game in motion, you can make the final decision
i will most likely buy the title when it comes out just because its an rpg and made by monolith soft

mouse_clicker · « **Reply #47 on:** July 22, 2003, 07:32:54 PM »

Jesus christ, you obviously can't read- I know I won't enjoy the game because I know I won't enjoy the battles, which I know because I don't like card-based battles. However, for someone who IS interested in the game, there's many other things yet to be revealed that could swing their opinion one way or the other- for me, that thing has already been revealed. Why should I "give the battle system a chance" when it's obvious I'm going to hate it- I mean, you should know by now that I HATE CARD BASE BATTLES. Do I have to type everything in caps so everyone can read it? Don't you have someone else to be imposing your will upon?

Mario · « **Reply #48 on:** July 22, 2003, 07:38:36 PM »

If i had the same attitude as you Mouse Clicker, then i would never have played Pokemon. And also, Baiton Kaitos's battle system apparently isnt really like any other card based games anyway.

mouse_clicker · « **Reply #49 on:** July 22, 2003, 07:44:06 PM »

If you're all gung-ho for giving things a chance, why are you basing your opinion about my entire persona on one incident? Yes, OBVIOUSLY I'm narrow minded because I didn't want to play a game it was obvious I would hate- forget the rest of my life, which you know jack diddly squat about. And I know what the battle system is like, seeing as not only have several people here explained it, but so has IGN and every other gaming site- using cards at ALL in battles is a big no no for me. I'm ending this here- bottom line is this:

I don't enjoy card based battles.
Baten Kaitos's battles are card based.
I won't enjoy Baten Kaitos.

If you can't accept it, that's your problem, not mine.

News:

Author Topic: Baten Kaitos (Read 35639 times)