Topic: I just beat WW less than six minutes ago... (Spoilers, maybe?)

[Rymir]

Basically, I just beat the Windwaker, now I own and have beaten every Zelda game. I must admit Windwaker was MUCH better than what my first impressions believed it would be, unfortunately, it didn't actually meet Orcarina's standards, yet wasn't to far off, and it was over 1000% times better than Majora's Mask (probably my least favorite console Zelda ever, sense it didn't help to progress the Zelda storyline at all). The most annoying part about Windwaker was the Triforce Charts and Pieces, there was little action and fighting during this part, and finding the money to decipher charts.

   The whole fight with Gannondorf wasn't TOO terrible, but I'm sorry that it wasn't what I thought it would be with all the hype I hear about it at this site. It was WAY too easy to figure out and not as challenging as Orcarina's fight, actually the first phase in Orcarina was the most difficult part, the battle with GANNON was cheap, and escaping the castle was hard. So I'd say that the battle in WW was ALMOST comparable to OoT's final boss, but definitely not the "Best Zelda battle in History" as some people told me.

  MAJOR DISAPOINTMENTS:


          I was disapointed from the moment I found out this wasn't OoT Link and Zelda, then I was Okay with it when I found out Hyrule could still be visited, then I was somewhat dissapointed with the fact that NOTHING took place in Hyrule, except getting Master Sword and fighting Gannondorf. I wish the duguens would have actually been in Hyrule, AND according to the game a select few where chosen to be put above the land, so when Hyrule went into enternal slumber it makes sense that many Hylians were still in Hyrule, so when the Master Sword was pulled towns and people must have awakened, therefore, when the King made the STUPID wish to destroy Hyrule he was probably killing hundreds of people by drowning them to death.


      Overall, the Windwaker game was an awesome experience, but Orcarina still is awesome and the best (in my opinion, of course) Zelda game, of course I thought the FEEL, EMOTIONS, and Cel-Shading graphics were more enjoyable, if Orcarina had a makeover into that kind of style and detailed graphics, it would be the greatest game of all time.

[Hostile Creation]

I personally prefer Wind Waker, possibly because I don't seem to be as attatched to Hyrule as you do, but I understand.

Actually, the Shadow/Earth and Wind Temples are both in Hyrule, you just have to enter them from the surface because of Ganondorf's force field thingy.  And the God's Temple was sort of in Hyrule till you made it rise up

I didn't mind the triforce pieces, as I had collected three or four before I beat the Wind Temple.  It was annoying trying to get all my money back after spending it all on map translations, but no biggy.

[Rymir]

I guess I just kind of fell in love with Hyrule and everything as far back as LttP, my first Zelda game was LoZ but I didn't start playing it until I was about five, and I am about 18 now. AoL had the most massive world I must admit, but the gameplay just wasn't Zelda, though I admit the whole plotline wasn't too bad actually.

  I'm not positive but I think LttP takes place after WW and therefore there is a new Hyrule in the image of the first, but I guess I still prefer the world from Orcarina anymore.

[Hostile Creation]

I don't think LttP is after WW, because I think WW clearly says that Ganon(dorf) is dead, and you fight Ganon in LttP.  I think.  It's been forever.

What's AoL?  All I can think of is Link's Awakening, and that, to me, was an awesome game.  My first Zelda.  Maybe that's why I like the games that stray from Hyrule so much.  Awakening and Wind Waker are my two favorites.

[Bill Aurion]

AoL = Adventures of Link(The second NES game)

And WW comes before LttP...It'll all come together in the next game(hopefully )

[Hostile Creation]

Personally, I don't think that there's a defined timeline.  Nothing suggests that LttP is after WW except for a few subtle hints, and there are enough other subtle hints that completely contradict that theory.  We'll just have to wait and see what happens.  I doubt Nintendo wants to loop back around in their games like that, but we'll see.

[Rymir]

AoL: Adventures of Link

________________________

AoL (Zelda II) used was a very odd sideview Zelda action rpg, it was kind of a flop and some believed it was the death of Nintendo's Zelda series.

Second off, I do think there is a logical order to the Zelda games due to hints and a basic pattern, however, I don't think that Nintendo will ever clearly let us know what that order is, since it gives Zelda fans a reason for playing, to see how the different Zeldas connect.

Third, I don't honestly think that "Gannondorf" from WW is really who you think, well kind of. It is more likely it is a shade (or a part) of Gannon. You see, Gannondorf was most likely partly destroyed in Orcarina being subverted to GANNON. Then in WW I believe Gannondorf is completely destroyed, yet the evil part created by a darkened triforce still remains, this part is known as GANNON, which is only a part of the original Gannondorf, so basically Gannondorf the man is dead, and all that is left is a shadow of himself, Gannon.

I'm also not certain that GANNON is free from his imprisonment, it makes sense that GANNON sent a image or shade of himself in WW to prepare for freeing GANNON, especially since that is what has happened before, we are hinted to this because Agahimn (I butchered the spelling) was the shade of Gannon TWICE in Zelda games. Also if there is a true order OoT Zelda is still alive WAY after WW and LttP, etc. Tetra is not the original Zelda, of course, most likely Zelda the third. (AoL kind of explains why there are so many Hyrulian Princesses named Zelda).

Basically, Zelda lives on in eternal slumber until one of the reincarnations of Link awakes her in the last Zelda game, AoL (originally Zelda II).

Though this theory is offically proven, there is connecting elements from all Zeldas that give evidence to this, since I have already made a post before about this I won't go any further into my discussion.

[Hostile Creation]

I think these timeline threads are a bit pointless.  Before OoT, there is no timeline.  Completely ignore those games in relation to the rest of the series.  In fact, ignore the oracle ones, too, because they're just as screwed up.  And the GBA ones are probably messed up as well.  Only the 64 and Cube games have anything that vaguely resemble a constant timeline.   The only reason I bother arguing is because I firmly believe that WW is the last Zelda game so far.  Because Ganon is dead dead dead dead dead.  Spelled D-E-A-D.  He didn't die in OoT, just locked away.  The other games, like I said before, should be ignored.  So there.

I could turn out to be utterly and completely wrong, but my intuition tells me otherwise, and I've learned that my intuition is often very accurate.

[Rymir]

If not all of this applies to this topic still, well it is the same as I posted in "the makers of the master sword?"
since in that post the same conversation is basically going on, and it is also in reply to Hostile Creation:
_____________________________
If I was to dig back far enough and confuse the hell out of most of you, I could think back to Cymraeg (Wales), the Welsh supposedly fought a long war with their Celtic brethern who eventually came to take parts of Cymraeg, however, historians now have uncovered that the "war" wasn't much of one since little resistance was met and was easily crushed, now Zelda's "Imprisoning War" might be the same kind of inciddent, history exagerates itself, especially since LttP probably took place 200-500 years after Orcarina. (WW Link is not the LttP Link).

Also, I think that there is some connection to the old games, however, I do agree with you, Hostile Creation, but I think the definite timeline we can see started with LttP, OoT, MM, and WW, I don't believe the GB games are relavent, either, nor do I neccesarily think AoL and LoZ are part of the plot. However, OoT went out of its way in many points, sometimes subtle to brush back up things from LttP, if not any earlier, since LttP was the rebirth of Zelda, since AoL was kind of its death, I think the true timeline is probably OoT, MM, WW, and LttP, I do think Link to the Past fits well into the timeline, if not perfectly. I do at the same time think LttP was a remake of LoZ pretty much. It does seem to me though that OoT would be predeccessor to LttP.

Like you said, I could be wrong too, but I don't believe in multiple coincidences and since I've been a Zelda fan since well, LoZ, I think I've seen to many coincidences to believe that the games don't have any order, at least LttP, OoT, MM, and WW have an order.

By the way, history has a tendency to be inacurate, that could be why LttP said the master sword was created in OoT, since think back to what legends the Egyptians passed and what we thought, well some of this has changed with today's tech. Too far back to be relavent? Think the knights day, some things and images, tales, etc. we have of the Knight's age are entirely inacurate yet most people don't know better. For instance, until recently "honor and respect, romance and courage" were best believed to sum up the Knight's age, now we kind of know better. I've said my piece.

____________________________________________

So you know, Hostile Creation, its not that I don't agree with you about only OoT, MM, and WW being part of the storyline, I just like to consider all possible sides of the situation, and bring up points, even if I don't agree with them at all, why? I'm a writter, doesn't that explain enough? (lol)


_____________________________________________

Rymir Feldur  

[Hostile Creation]

Heh, as am I.  We're probably different types though.  I'm the kind that makes up his own storylines, and avoids at all costs anything that vaguely resembles somebody else's work.  Perhaps you're the type that does fanfics, reviews, and stuff like that.  Nothing wrong with that, but different styles.

I love playing Zelda, but I am not fond of writing about it.  Playing it is enough for me.

[corwin]

I just finished WW too.
The whole game I hoped that at some point the entire sea would dry up or something and that the "old" hyrule would be beneath it (all ruins and stuff)
but it didn't happen. I thought the fight with gannondorf was fun, especially the final "parry" attack, nice.

I didn't really understand the ending, and also seemed to short.... I hoped for some BIG plot.... I really thought that the sea would dissapear and that the ending would be a "beginning" of a new hyrule.

Ganandorf is tranformed in a stone statue....so I guess if there would be any "sequel" this statue will come to live again.

[GayStation]

Another difference I noticed is that Hostile Creation knows how to follow prescriptive grammer rules and spell.

[PIAC]

ive said it once, ill say it again, conveniant alternate realities

[Rymir]

Yes, I know I'm not the best at typing, I don't pay enough attention and write way to quickly....

[Rymir]

Yes, I know I'm not the best at typing, I don't pay enough attention and write way to quickly....

As far as writting type, I generally write fantasy fiction and I don't do fan fictions, I just pick up ideas and go from there, generally. My closest example of style of writing would be Robert Jordon's "Wheel of Time" style.

Also, as far as gramatics go, I speak english as a second language, not a primary, so that explains it for the most part.

[Hostile Creation]

Your grammar never bothered me, and I was just guessing about writing styles.  You seem very analytical (never read that Wheel story; I'll look at it), and I am anything but analytical.  As you can see by my poor guess on your genre preference

[Oldskool]

This brings up an important question: how the hell will the geography change in WW2? Different islands? Or maybe a new concept all together...

[Hostile Creation]

I'm highly anticipating the sequel, but I don't think they're going to give us more islands this time around.

[Rymir]

I'll most likely get the sequel, that's not in question, however, I'm sorry but I'm not expecting much more than another gaiden, like Majora's Mask... that tends to be the most effective style for Zelda games, anymore, and if they do decide to continue on the actual story and not just another sidestory (gaiden) I don't think it will turn out very good... not enough time on the developing board.

I don't expect another real Zelda game for a few years and it will probably be on the next generation Nintendo console. I was thinking about Sega... you suppose Nintendo will ever suffer the same fate in the future... it seems inevitable as Nintendo is falling further and further in both sales (in comparision to PS2 and XBox) and reputation since the age of the N64. I liked a FEW N64 games but it was a failure in comparision to the SNES or NES... but Gamecube has potential for regaining Nintendo's reputation. Sorry, this is a little bit off topic... (hmm... a Zelda game on the PS(x), x for whatever version, that would be very strange, or Mario on XBox...)

I've always been a Nintendo fan.. I have every Nintendo system and that's it... the only other system I have is the Sega Genesis, and that I got in 1999 for $13. So I'm a Nintendo fan... only bought the Gamecube for 2 reasons:


     1.) Zelda! I've been hooked since the begining of time... or damn near.
     2.) It's cheapest, and I'm an old and loyal Nintendo Fan...

Also, a bit more on topic... I'm not so positive that Orcarina of Time is the first occurance of Link.. I mean if you think about it Link is always in defense of Hyrule, Zelda, the Triforce, or something... so it makes sense he might have had many incarnations way before Orcarina.. who knows. Maybe Ganondorf from Orcarina isn't the first Ganon, we will never know.

[JNethery]

I have to agree with Hostile Creation that the only games that follow a "timeline" are OoT, MM and WW. I think that all the future console games will follow this storyline as well. The older games were just separate, individual games. Ever since OoT it has become an actual series with a continuing storyline.

[Berny]

*note* I thought this was the best thread in which to post this question without starting a new one */note*

End of Wind Waker: The wind billows the sails of both Tetra's and Link's boats. Tetra says the wind will guide them to their destination, wherever that may be. Excellent ending for the story; same as the beginning when Link left Outset the first time. By now your thinking, "Has Berny gone mad? He's just recounting what we already know."

I assure you I am fine. But my question lies in the end of the game. Link and Tetra sailed away...in separate boats. I don't know, maybe I missed something like Daphnes floating up after Link, having tea and soup with him, explaining that he decided he'd rather NOT go down with his ship, and then forever accompanying him as the King of Red Lions. I'm pretty sure I didn't miss anything like that so now I'm wondering if Daphnes spirit or mind was inhabiting the King of Red Lions or if Daphnes could actually transform into the boat. If he did manage to survive, that could mean that the "other" did as well....

I was kinda hoping for a new "King of Evil" for the sequel. I guess there's still hope.

[DRJ]

Quote
I was kinda hoping for a new "King of Evil" for the sequel. I guess there's still hope.

I definately think that Ganon will not return in the sequel. I mean he just died and is at the bottom of the ocean it will take years and years before someone finds him.

The next game will have some other minor baddie to fight. You wont even have the master sword, but this bad guy wont be powerful enough for you to even need it.

In some other game another link will need the master sword and he will pull it from the stone Ganon. Then Ganon can come back to life. While I believe that this Ganon is the real one and not just an incarnation of the real Ganon, if Nintendo wanted him dead, the statue would have shattered.

[Bill Aurion]

^^^  exactly how I think the next 2 games are gonna play out.  

To expand, I'm guessing that on the voyage to find a new land Link and the pirates get side-tracked/Tetra gets captured/etc..  Of course, I'm expecting the game to be land-based.  I do wonder, however, what the main tool of the game will be.  We've had a tool to move through time, through seasons, the direction of the wind....Maybe Ninty will implement sometime in a Zelda game a tool that can manipulate the weather?

<walks off drooling at potential possibilities>

[Ocarina Blue]

I think Gannon could be back, it could be like Link needs a sword to fight off a few monsters, and when he pulls the master sword from the rock, Gannon comes back...

[Berny]

I hope you're right, DRJ. I think that would be the logical direction to go in. On a separate note, does anyone know if the Japanese version of Wind Waker was longer? I was surprised that I didn't need to go to a dungeon to get the third and final pearl (Nayru's I believe). I was expecting some sort of water temple. Was there a dungeon cut out of the U.S. game?