Topic: Wii U gets little 3rd party love.

[ThePerm]

I've accepted the fact that third parties don't like Nintendo. The best times are when Nintendo fills the gaps themselves. I loved Nintendo 64 and Gamecube and they didnt have much third party support.

I kind of predict Sony;s future downfall, and if it happens. They'll either flock to xbox, steam, or Nintendo

[Soren]

...developers are creative people...

we couldn't think of a natural, obvious, 'OMG, I want that for what the Wii U brings to the table 'feature''

[NWR_insanolord]

we couldn't think of a natural, obvious, 'OMG, I want that for what the Wii U brings to the table 'feature''

I don't understand how they couldn't come up with putting a map, status indicators and inventory management on the GamePad. Also, it'd be perfect for off-TV play.

[the asylum]

That's Thirdparty-ese for "We dont give a **** about the Wii U and nobody will buy our game for that platform anyway so we're just not gonna bother."

Basically what we've been hearing since 2007

[Louieturkey]

we couldn't think of a natural, obvious, 'OMG, I want that for what the Wii U brings to the table 'feature''

I don't understand how they couldn't come up with putting a map, status indicators and inventory management on the GamePad. Also, it'd be perfect for off-TV play.

Off TV play is the perfect use for the gamepad for all games.  It makes the greatest sense.

[Kytim89]

With the collpase of Sony and Nintendo positioning itself to tighten its grip on the Japanese game industry, I see no reason why the third party developers of Japan would turn away from the Wii U. On the other hand, western third party developers have been burned so many times that they will tell Nintendo to shove it if their games do not sell well.
 
The bottom line is that I am more than willing to give my money to any developer that makes good games for the Wii U and 3DS. If these consoles are not good enough for certain developers then I will not buy their games. I have reached a point where I am officially a Nintendo loyalist and will never quit likeing Nintendo consoles.

[Luigi Dude]

Once the PS4 is finally revealed will probably be the moment Japanese third parties start to embrace the Wii U.  If the PS4 is a huge power increase over the Wii U, then it's going to be 3DS vs Vita all over again.  Even though third parties were having great sales on the PSP in Japan, once the Vita was revealed to be a huge increase in power and would be more expensive to develop for, Nintendo was able to get most Japanese third parties to just hold on to their PSP engines and assets and use them for to make 3DS games instead.  Don't be surprised if they do something similar with the Wii U.

And if the PS4 isn't a huge increase, well then the Wii U should be able to get ports then since nothings holding it back and the Wii U will easily be the dominate home console in Japan.

[Adrock]

Most, if not all, of the teams who worked on Wii U launch ports have probably moved on to other ports for the console. So, the "no plans" line these companies are feeding the press should be taken in many cases as "we'll announce it later." Those announcements affect a lot of things.

Wii U won't get every 3rd party game, but it should get the major ones. 3rd parties invested a lot in those games and porting them to every capable platform allows them to see even greater returns without putting forth that much more effort. Some people may scoff at 3rd parties handing these ports to smaller teams, but I'm actually not that worried. Nintendo handed the Holy Grail of ports to virtual unknown Grezzo and that turned out fantastically.

[Sarail]

You know, it's not that the entire games development industry hates Nintendo. It's the majority of western developers who have no care for Nintendo and it's platforms. And it's a crying shame, because there's money to be made on Nintendo's platforms - you just have to actually, oh...you know, try.

It's the reason I consider myself to be a Japanese gamer. And Japanese developers (those without the western development mindset - curses to you Kojima and Itagaki) make the type of games that I love and enjoy playing. Sure, I love Uncharted (I squee like a little school girl, and a small bit of pee comes out whenever a new third-person shooter catches my eye), but the very western ideas brought forth in that game are game mechanics that feel very Japanese. Metal Arms had a bit of this, Jet Force Gemini (my favourite game) did this well, and I'm immensely looking forward to Watch Dogs - oh lawd, please be a Wii U game.

Anyways, I just feel like western devs have pigeon-holed themselves into a corner where a game's mechanics and play control HAS to be designed a certain way. And because the typical bro-gamer has latched on to this, they expect no less. Madden, GTA, Halo, CoD, etc... any of these games are all incredibly similar with each series' installment. And then you've got companies like Valve, and their games like Portal and Half-Life - two VERY different games that each use a first-person perspective.

Of course, the NSMB series makes my statement mute, but oh well. That's just ONE series. And there's LOTS of different Mario games.

Also, I feel like western devs are scared of colour.

[shingi_70]

But what point is there in third parties being coy on the Wii U getting ports of these games. From my perspective all this is just giving reasons to delay a purchase of a Wii U.

[shingi_70]

Sorry for the double post.

But what Japanese Japnese developers are their anymore besides niche stuff or tecmo.

I mean let's be honest.

Konami has pretty much have everything done by Kojima or Western devs. Hudson is dead and even PES is moving development to europe.

Sqaure enix is being dragged along by the Edios side of the company. The Japanese side has nearly killed the company by overstreching the final fantasy brand and fucking up Final Fantasy 14. Dragon Quest 10 seems to be doing well and Braverly default looks cool.

Capcom is another dev that is out sourcing most of its output to Western Developers and even its internal studios barring Monster Hunter are pretty western styled.

Sega in all honesty I expect to be where THQ is this time next year if not sooner.

I think Japanese developers are killing themselves by not keeping their unquie flair. When this generation started we saw Japanese developers struggle with HD development and the longer development cycles as well as the stagnation of the RPG. Instead of trying to cope with this they decided to just try and appeal to the western market copy and paste instead of trying to have a mix of western and eastern development style.

I think the death of the console RPG is probably one of the things I disliked most about this generation because there were a lot in the early of this Gen. The problem was the first few attempts were either poor or Good games that still could have been made on say the PS2. Then the big one FF13 ended up disapointing. I think there has to be a middle ground between the open world WRPG and the narative focused TB JRPG.

Not only that japanese developers for whatever reason released only on one system (the tales games, ni no kuni) which is okay in japan but not so much in any other markets. They also decided to for the most part completely ignore xbla/PSN. Square could have easily made a new RPGs in the style of the snes or PS1 games with decnt length that would have sold well and cheap.

But I've just gotten off on a crazy tangent.  Only real japanese devs that are sizable are nintendo, namco, and tecmo koei.

[lolmonade]

How many of these games were pretty far into development before the Wii U came out? 
 
I'd expect at least some of them to be delayed ports.  I think we'll have better visibility on 3rd party support once games start being built from the ground-up with the Wii U now being out.

[ShyGuy]

So let's break this down by publisher. I'll miss some publishers and titles, so help me fill it in.

Western:
EA - Mad that Nintendo didn't go exclusivley Orbis for online.
Ubisoft - Big on the Wii U, bringing good support so far.
Activision - They do COD and....?
THQ - Almost dead. Selling themselves on the street corner in hopes of surviving.
2K Games - GTA and...?

Eastern:
Capcom - What's their problem?
Konami - They do MGS and....?
Tecmo Koei- Tekken. Dynasty Warriors. what else?
Square Enix - FF and DQ. That's it.
Sega - Barely Alive. I am getting Aliens/Marines though!
 
I think the future is more and more indie devs with downloadable titles. Wii U has a decent start there. Look at a game like Trine 2. It may be an indie downloadable title, but it is an A grade game without a doubt. Polished, pretty and lots of content. Maybe even AA.

[Ian Sane]

One problem for the Wii U is that getting some of the same third party games as the other systems, while a good thing, is not a selling point for anyone with a PS3 or Xbox 360.  So the Wii U has Arkham City and ME3.  Big deal.  I can play those on my PS3.  The market for such games is entirely those that were Wii-only last gen.  And no PS360 owner is going to buy a Wii U for those third party games because it makes no sense to buy a new system to play a game you can already play on a system you own.  Only the exclusives will influence a purchase.

And even if the PS360 owner does buy a Wii U for Mario, will he buy Arkham City or did he already buy it when it was brand new?  Usually when a new system comes out, any multiplatform games it gets will be for the new generation.  So the Cube got something like Tony Hawk's Pro Skater 3 which had come out for the PS2 a few months earlier.  That was okay because the PS2 was new enough that a lot of Gamecube owners would not already own one.  Usually the new systems are all released close enough together that a early adopter's purchase would be their first and only console of that generation.  But the Wii U is sharing third party titles with consoles that have been around for an entire generation.  Being a few months late makes a huge difference because those other consoles are so widespread.

Any third party game that is not coming out the same day as it does on the other systems or is not an exclusive is pretty much doomed to weak sales.  The Wii U realistically is supposed to be the start of a new gen but thus far it's really being treated by third parties as a competitor to the PS360.  They should be kicking off their next gen of games on it, but they're not.  They're not really offering anything that deserves to sell well, so it won't, and they'll have an excuse to just not bother in the future.

[Adrock]

@ShyGuy

You're mixing up Take Two and 2K Games. The former has GTA, Max Payne, and Red Dead while the latter has Borderlands and Bioshock.

Konami has Metal Gear, Silent Hill, Catsylvania, and Contra. They also have Dance Dance Revolution and since they own Hudson Soft, they also have Bomberman (and Bonk if you remember him)

Square Enix has Star Ocean, Mana, Kingdom Hearts, and Parasite Eve in addition to FF and DQ. They also own Eidos now so Tomb Raider, Hitman, Legacy of Kain, and Deus Ex are theirs too.

[shingi_70]

@adrock

Tale-two and 2) are the same company.

[Kairon]

I, for one, will continue to buy 3rd party games on Nintendo systems.

[Adrock]

My bad. I was trying to separate Rockstar and 2K. Take Two has all of those series then.

I, for one, will continue to buy 3rd party games on Nintendo systems.

And that's why we love you.

[Kairon]

My bad. They have all of those series then.

I, for one, will continue to buy 3rd party games on Nintendo systems.

And that's why we love you.

^_^

But seriously, I'm not doing it to fit an image. I am disappointed when I can't play games like BioShock or Deadspace. But I have one console, one handheld, and one very-out-of-date-pc that I can't afford to replace yet. So I do the sensible thing: focus on having fun with every CoD released on the Wii/Wii U, and a Funky Barn every now and again. With under-the-radar gems like Star Trek: Conquest and Dawn of Discovery, and even with third-party exclusives like Red Steel 2 or the upcoming Rayman Legends.

I may have been disappointed when I had no way to play Mass Effect when that got big, I'd watch my friends play and knew it was very compelling. But now I have a copy of Mass Effect 3 that eventually found its way into my collection.

When third party games that interest me come within my reach, I buy them. Third parties can depend on at least my amount of consumer demand. And if a third party game I'm curious about isn't within my reach, then I pout a bit and then move on. Life's too short to complain on the internet about games I haven't played.

[MysticGohan]

@ShyGuy

You're mixing up Take Two and 2K Games. The former has GTA, Max Payne, and Red Dead while the latter has Borderlands and Bioshock.

Konami has Metal Gear, Silent Hill, Catsylvania, and Contra. They also have Dance Dance Revolution and since they own Hudson Soft, they also have Bomberman (and Bonk if you remember him)

Square Enix has Star Ocean, Mana, Kingdom Hearts, and Parasite Eve in addition to FF and DQ. They also own Eidos now so Tomb Raider, Hitman, Legacy of Kain, and Deus Ex are theirs too.

Damnit Adrock! you forgot the best game of them all! Chrono Trigger! :p And Capcom need to bring back Breath of Fire! a true BoF game at that!

[ShyGuy]

I notice a lot of the Japanese developer's franchise's are dead, dormant, or relegated to B and C level status. If nothing else, I hope they can come back in the Wii U eShop.

Out of Kotaku's list, the only games that are on my "will buy for sure" list are Aliens:Colonial Marines and Bioshock Infinite, so I won't be missing out on too much.

[MrPhishfood]

Western:
EA - Mad that Nintendo didn't go exclusivley Orbis for online.

HA! Is Origin so obscure you can't even remember its name?

[Ian Sane]

I strongly prefer Japanese games so if Nintendo can get all the Japanese devs that in theory would be great.  Except that the quality of Japanese games has fallen like a rock over this last gen.  Companies like Konami, Capcom, Sega and Square used to consistently make great games.  You would occasionally get a lousy title but now it's more like you occasionally get a good one.  Nintendo is by FAR the most consistent Japanese dev these days... which I guess isn't that different since I felt they were the best dev during the glory years of Japanese games as well.

Anyway, Nintendo of today would not be the best Japanese dev of ten years ago and the gap between them and everyone else has really widened.  There really isn't another Japanese company that can be consistently associated with quality and all of them are clearly past their prime.  The market is run by the West now, which means that that is the support that is going to be the most consistent.  If Japan could turn things around, that would be fantastic.  But based on how things are now a Wii U that dominates mostly with Japanese third party support is going to get only a few really great third party gems a year.

[Luigi Dude]

I strongly prefer Japanese games so if Nintendo can get all the Japanese devs that in theory would be great.  Except that the quality of Japanese games has fallen like a rock over this last gen.  Companies like Konami, Capcom, Sega and Square used to consistently make great games.  You would occasionally get a lousy title but now it's more like you occasionally get a good one.  Nintendo is by FAR the most consistent Japanese dev these days... which I guess isn't that different since I felt they were the best dev during the glory years of Japanese games as well.

Anyway, Nintendo of today would not be the best Japanese dev of ten years ago and the gap between them and everyone else has really widened.  There really isn't another Japanese company that can be consistently associated with quality and all of them are clearly past their prime.  The market is run by the West now, which means that that is the support that is going to be the most consistent.  If Japan could turn things around, that would be fantastic.  But based on how things are now a Wii U that dominates mostly with Japanese third party support is going to get only a few really great third party gems a year.

The problem with most Japanese third parties is they keep trying to make their games like Western games because they want to appeal more to the massive COD and GTA audience.  But since they're not Western designers, they end up failing to recreate what people like about Western games and don't create what people used to like about their old Japanese games.

This is why Nintendo has faired much better then the rest of Japan because Iwata still allows Nintendo's studio's to make games the way they used.  Unlike the rest of Japan were the management tells their studio's to be like the West when these studio's don't really know how to be Western though. 

[ShyGuy]

Western:
EA - Mad that Nintendo didn't go exclusivley Orbis for online.

HA! Is Origin so obscure you can't even remember its name?

Origin! that's it! I'm trying to block it from my mind.