Topic: La Mulana is F***ed up!

[Pixelated Pixies]

I have three flares remaining since I tried using the things in various places in the hope that they would solve puzzles that have hints related to showing lights (they never did). Guess I could buy more but they're 40 gold per box and I'm not sure they add enough damage to be worth the expense.

The other ankh I have active is the Sun Temple, I could try that one too for a change. Because I haven't been able to get the first red light I've been using the lights in areas they weren't meant for.

True, the Flares aren't all that powerful. During his jumping phase, however, there is a period of time in which you can't do anything but remain slightly to the side of him (which is time pretty much wasted since you can't hit him). I just used that time to hit him with as many Flares as I could. In a battle like that my thinking was that every bit of damage counts.

I also used the ankh jewels out of sequence. I'm not sure if there is an ideal sequence for the bosses, but the route I took was Mausoleum of Giants, Spring in the Sky and then Temple of the Sun. The Temple of the Sun boss really took it out of me and I haven't been back to the game since. @ClexYoshi, however, has convinved me to push on. I'll hopefully return to it at some point next week.
 
What areas have you tackled so far @KDR?
 

[KDR_11k]

Thoroughly combed the Mausoleum, Spring and Sun Temple, decently explored the Inferno Cavern, found pathes through the Moon Temple to other areas, got some progress out of the Twins' Labyrinth (currently only have one loose thread in that area in the form of a miniboss that can freeze time for me, seems rather impossible to beat, I already beat the one that spawns the silhouette children but didn't reach anything except a regular money chest from it), have the save point but little else from the Endless Corridor and beat the bosses of the Gate and the Mausoleum.


EDIT: Tried the Sun Temple boss and beat him in like 4 attempts (one of which was getting instakilled when he jumped into the foreground at the start). He gives you a lot of opportunities to make him taste the chain whip and shurikens. The hitbox on his head was significantly smaller than the sprite though, again evidence of bad design. Beating him gave me a new passage (to a dead end with instructions by Xelpud on what I need to do before I can proceed there) so at least killing bosses does something productive. I guess beating the water guy would open the floodgates at the bottom of the Spring but I don't have another red light yet (would need the one from the Gate but I have absolutely no clue on how to do that).

[ClexYoshi]

You kids... I had no clue anybody was posting in this thread still!

Is La Mulana a sadistic game? Yes.

Is La Mulana an obtuse game? Yes

Is La Mulana a Memorization fest like I wanna be the Guy? Unless you are speedrunning, NO

KDR, I will send you a note shortly offering the same service that I did for Pixelated Pixies.

I also cannot stress enough; YOU SHOULD BE SAVING BOSS FIGHTS UNTIL YOU ARE WELL ENOUGH EQUIPPED FOR THEM! yes, there are quite a few mini-bosses that the answer is Shuriken or the Axe you get from the temple of the moon after you get some other items. I've actually tested it; in this remake, if you stumble your way about into a few things and know some things about the game mechanics, it is possible to get all but 2 of the Sacred Orbs and some of the best weapons in the game with only Sakit defeated. for a significantly more normal run, that's obviously not the case.

I'd also like to throw out a couple of suggestions at stuff you could do to help you out, KDR. I'll hide it all behind spoilers if you don't wanna hear it; You really want the bronze mirror now that you've beaten Ellmac. this treasure is in the Temple of the sun, but you will need to go down by where you got the spring in the sky's ank jewel, and whip some stuff that is corking up the spring. there's a stone platform intercrossed with a chain holding the blug you need to break, and then you need to whip the pulley mechanism on the screen above. then you're going to need the birth seal from the surface to solve a puzzle in the temple of the sun and go into the CHamber of extinction, where after you light things up by shooting some flares into the lanterns, you'll see a mural of a little shield-like thing. whip that some and that will open up the chest in the room in the temple of the sun adjacent to the Chamber of Extinction Entrance. that will net you the Bronze Mirror, unto which you'll learn the reason why some of the grail points don't have a warp point; you see, La Mulana is effectivley double the size you thought it was. each area has a paralell and opposite area called the Backside, and you need a piece of software to grail warp to the backside (This made more sense in the roiginal because you'd pause the game and hit 0 through 9 on the keypad to warp, and so they needed a way to switch you from warping to the first 10 areas and then other 9 that are on the backside) At any rate, your backside Warp program is called Future Development company. it's found in the Graveyard of the Giants, which is the backside equivalent of the Masoleum of the Giants, and is located just outside of the entrace to the tower of the ruinf rom Graveyard of the Giants.

hoo! That's some infodump! ^____^ Feels good to talk some more La Mulana!

[Pixelated Pixies]

there are quite a few mini-bosses that the answer is Shuriken or the Axe you get from the temple of the moon after you get some other items.

I love  the axe. It's awesome.
 

You really want the bronze mirror now that you've beaten Ellmac. this treasure is in the Temple of the sun, but you will need to go down by where you got the spring in the sky's ank jewel, and whip some stuff that is corking up the spring. there's a stone platform intercrossed with a chain holding the blug you need to break, and then you need to whip the pulley mechanism on the screen above. then you're going to need the birth seal from the surface to solve a puzzle in the temple of the sun and go into the Chamber of extinction, where after you light things up by shooting some flares into the lanterns, you'll see a mural of a little shield-like thing. whip that some and that will open up the chest in the room in the temple of the sun adjacent to the Chamber of Extinction Entrance. that will net you the Bronze Mirror, unto which you'll learn the reason why some of the grail points don't have a warp point

See, my question is, how else but through trial and error would you work that stuff out? I've actually done some of the things you've described above, in particular the steps for Spring in the Sky and I think I might also have done what you describe in Chamber of extinction. For me though, these things seemed like unrelated and disparate puzzles and tasks. It's not very apparent that in solving some of these puzzles that it's unlocked something in a completely different part of the world. It's all very confusing to me.
 
As we discussed, though, I'm going to push on because I think the game is super interesting and can be rewarding. I've recently moved house and haven't had much time for gaming, but I'll have more free time in the coming weeks to play through some games and then get back to La Mulana.

[KDR_11k]

I'm way past all that. Currently dealing with "Eden". Got all but one life extension and I already heard I have to get that before defeating all 8 bosses.

What does killing Sakit do except remove his statue?

The Inferno boss is one massive asshole. Required sheer luck to win that fight (namely that he pops up near a platform so you can hit him as jumping to hit him will just make you collide with him). Gauntlet axe says **** you. Anyway, he's dead, moving on.

I've been getting my hints from NeoGAF, that did enough. Well, I also used the wiki to find out that the tablets puzzle in the Gate of Guidance requires breaking the tablets, not just tagging them and to check whether some of the items that are mentioned all the time by the tablets are relevant to me yet (answer was no).

Pixies: These are mostly very clearly described tasks. There's even a description of what to do in the darkness if you can't light it up.

[Pixelated Pixies]

See, I'm kind of the opposite of Dr Metts. If I have to look up a walkthrough or video guide then I feel like the game isn't doing it's job. To be fair, Sometimes losing track of what you're supposed to be doing in a game can be put down to player error, but I feel in the case of La Mulana much of my confusion is caused by the fact that even when I do solve a puzzle I'm not entirely sure how I've done it or in some cases what I've achieved by resolving it. Has it unlocked a door, has it opened up a treasure chest, has it revealed something which was previously hidden? On top of that, if a puzzle has unlocked something I'm sometimes unclear where in the world the change has happened. Have I unlocked something in the area I'm currently in, or in one of the several other areas I've already been through? There's being cryptic and there's being obtuse, and too often do I feel like La Mulana can be the latter.

[ClexYoshi]

Beating one of the 8 main bosses opens up doors that are accessable via the bronze mirror. the one that connects the Masoleium of the giants and the Graveyard of the Giants is to the left of the grail point in the Masoleium.

I originally approached La Mulana in 2007 when the original hit the PC as freeware, and the understanding that I came to is that the game does in some way, shape, or form provide the very vague hints of what you need to do and you do have to sniff around sometimes to figure out what in the heck a puzzle did... What I'm getting at is that the 3 Japanese guys who made the original are folks who kinda celebrated being able to go on the internet and share the secrets of the MSX Home computer classics they used to play back in the day like the MSX Version of Castlevania [VERY different from the NES version] or Knightmare 2: The Maze of Galleous. being that La Mulana is a game you can only get through the internet, they wanted to make a game that would simultaneously make the individual feel very accomplished and then in turn also make whatever community cropped up around their game feel that same sense of accomplishment by banding together to crack the secrets of ruins that really feel like they could be something that no human being has yet to successfully explore and come back to tell the tale.

I digress, though. Caltrops or Rolling Shuriken are an excelent way to deal with Viy. spears are also a decent option. also, now that you beat Viy, you should go back down by the base of the waterfall on the surface and investigate, KDR.

[KDR_11k]

Rolling shuriken is workable but caltrops require getting pretty close and the spear requires being exactly above him which, if you're doing it because he didn't pop up, just means you're about to eat laser. It seems pretty easy to play defensively against him, his attacks are easy to avoid if you aren't trying to hit him so you could theoretically wait a LONG time if you have to. Then gauntlet axe.

[ClexYoshi]

the idea behind Caltrops is that you get on a platform way above him as the little gargoyle guys are opening his eyes. if he's getting ready to fire the laser, you get out of the way. if he pops his eye out, then you're in prime position to deliver some Axe-y justice!

Another tip I'll give you is if you have the [spiler] RandC.exe + Mekuri.EXE program combo, it'll increase the damage on all your weapons becides the whips, while if you have LaMulana.EXE + Move.EXE loaded, it will double your power and make it so that the Mace whip's attack is almost as much as a PISTOL BULLET'S.  The Axe's stand-alone damage is actually a little under half of a single pistol bullet shot.

[negative_zero]

I have to agree this game is pretty confusing.  I feel like I'm kind of randomly wandering around a lot, not even really sure what my goals are supposed to be.  And then I sort of stumbled upon a boss and defeated it and... saw the end credits, despite the fact that there is still clearly a ton that I have not done yet.  Even trying to use a guide is a bit confusing since it seems very non-linear so unless you use a guide from the start, it is easy to get confused.


Still, I enjoy it.  I just don't know if I will ever finish it. 

[azeke]

I am three hours in and just beat first boss on first dungeon. That was surprisingly easy provided you have ninja stars.

Enjoying the game so far.

[azeke]

Beat my second boss, robot Giant. Save file says i played this game for five hours.

Come on, people. It's not that hard. Took me seven or so tries to figure out the pattern to hit his face and after it fell off, i just finished him by spamming ninja stars (when face shield is on they don't work).

The game isn't really that obtuse as you make it to be. I find Zelda games MUCH more esoteric. I got completely stumped in all three Zeldas since OOT not knowing what to do and what should i get to get inside dungeons or to complete some quest. After literally days and days of pointless wandering i finally give up and watch walkthrough. Like right now, in MM: what am i supposed to do get inside Ikana village, i need some mask you get near the ranch? Been there and looked everywhere, can't find nothing for three days now.

[Pixelated Pixies]

Beat my second boss, robot Giant. Save file says i played this game for five hours.

Come on, people. It's not that hard. Took me seven or so tries to figure out the pattern to hit his face and after it fell off, i just finished him by spamming ninja stars (when face shield is on they don't work).

The game isn't really that obtuse as you make it to be.

I'm glad that has been your experience. It has certainly not been mine.


People's minds work differently I guess. I truely can appreciate La Mulana for what it is, but it's sensibilities just don't seem to gel with how my mind works and I, therefore, get frustrated. That being said, I still intend to go back to it at some point.

At the minute though I'm neck deep in the awesomeness that is Fallblox.

[KDR_11k]

Beat my second boss, robot Giant. Save file says i played this game for five hours.

Come on, people. It's not that hard. Took me seven or so tries to figure out the pattern to hit his face and after it fell off, i just finished him by spamming ninja stars (when face shield is on they don't work).

The game isn't really that obtuse as you make it to be. I find Zelda games MUCH more esoteric. I got completely stumped in all three Zeldas since OOT not knowing what to do and what should i get to get inside dungeons or to complete some quest. After literally days and days of pointless wandering i finally give up and watch walkthrough. Like right now, in MM: what am i supposed to do get inside Ikana village, i need some mask you get near the ranch? Been there and looked everywhere, can't find nothing for three days now.

You've only seen the Gate and the Mausoleum and you make a judgment on the difficulty? Come back to me after dealing with the boss of Inferno or the puzzles of Illusion and Birth.

[ejamer]

Having (finally!) put several hours into the game, just wanted to say that it's hard to sympathize with some of the complaints here.


Invisible walkways? How is that fair?! Well, there is a skeleton in the room that says he found a hidden path way between two faces along with a switch you can't reach (conveniently located beside a face). Not obvious... but once you do the obvious stuff and start looking for details about how to flip the remaining switches these type of clues are really helpful.


That's not saying the game challenges are easy or fair or well designed. Some of them aren't. But some of the examples posted here about stuff in the early going that doesn't make sense are because people either (a) aren't paying attention to details, or (b) aren't used to these type of challenges.


I've enjoyed La Mulana immensely so far. There is still a lot that I don't "get" and need to figure out. There are many challenges that are either kicking my ass or leaving me completely befuddled. I will never beat this game without help from forums and/or walkthroughs. But it's still been a fun ride to uncover as much as I have without help.