Topic: Sony data says XBox beating GC by almost 4 million worldwide.

[PIAC]

*super mega ultra infernal monkeyesque sad face*

blargh, can PGC.com/forums have a speciall RANT ABOUT SALES FIGURES HERE thread :\

remember when the video game market used to be about the games?

[greenwood]

Here's the reason why the sales numbers are very important. As long as the GCN remains in 2nd place then 3rd party support will be around. But if the GCN slips to 3rd then we'll see an even bigger change then we're seeing now. Look at all the games that have been canceled for the GCN or the amount of games coming for the PS2 and Xbox but not GCN. Admittedly, most of the canceled games weren't going to be fantastic or system-sellers but added up they can become system-killers. If you really want a game and then you find out that it's coming to the PS2 or Xbox you may shrug it off but be pissed. But if several games you want aren't coming for the GCN you won't buy it.
This is very big. Yeah, far too often the moron fanboys use installed base as a way of saying, "My system is better than yours!" and all that but this is very important because 3rd parties will stop making as many games for the GCN if it drops to 3rd. And that means less sales which equals less 3rd party support which equals less sales and so on. It's a cycle that we want no part of. We can't rely on Nintendo pulling a MS and paying for games.
Yeah, 3rd party support is spectacular...compared to the N64. But compared to the PS2 and Xbox it's lagging. You may not like a game but that doesn't mean no one likes it either. For instance, I think those music/rhythm games suck but I know there's GCN owners who'd love them and DDR-whatever could be one of a handful of titles that help sell a GCN to somebody. They might say, "I can play DDR...and Zelda...and Metroid...and Resident Evil...and Rayman! Sign me up!" But if 3rd parties start pulling games then that same person may say, "Well, I'll buy a PS2 because I can play DDR, Rayman, substitute Silent Hill for Resident Evil, and Dragon Warrior, and Xenosaga, and Prince of Persia."
PoP and Rayman are on the GCN now but what if they weren't? If you really wanted those game wouldn't that make your decision easier to buy a PS2? Or an Xbox?  

[KDR_11k]

"Don't believe in statistics you haven't faked yourself" -Napoleon Bonaparte

[Mario]

OMFG PICKLES OUTSOLD TOMATOES BY FOUR MILLION FOR THE MONTH OF APRIL!!!111111 OMG TOMATOES TO GO THIRD PARTY!11ONE

TOMATOES R TEH D0000MED!

[Gamefreak]

But, in a recent survey of the popularity of the two foodstuffs, tomatoes won by a landslide of 72%. Burger King indicates the phenomenon can be explained by the fact that tomatoes are longer lasting and only need to be bought once a season.

It's teh Megat0n!!!11!!  

[Byron]

Hmmmmm I just got a picture of the powerpoint slide that Sony used in their press conference when they gave out the numbers.

http://www.stanford.edu/~moreno/images/hwwwship.jpg

It clearly says those are WORLDWIDE SHIPPED numbers not sold ones.

Well thanks alot Yahoo for yellow journalism.  Well it isn't as bad as the CNN one where Super Mario 64=Super Mario 3.

[thecubedcanuck]

If Nintendo os so far ahead of Microsoft in sales as some here say, the why

- are many gaming stores carrying less and less Nintendo stuff?

- why does blockbuster have a nearly non existant section of gamecube titles while at the same time have 3 rows of x-box games?

- are third parties dropping support of the cube?

- would Sony make this up when it doesnt affect them at all, its like looking over your shoulder because you hear footsteps 14 miles away.


I wouldnt be suprised if these numbers are true. I know when I go into my local future shop or best buy, I see a lot more x-box products moving than gamecube.

[JoeFalco]

Quote
Originally posted by: greenwood
A lot of reasons why knowing sales figures is important.

Knowing sales figures are irrevelant to buying and playing games.  Yes, 3rd party support will most likely go to the best company out there but good grief, you make it sound as if I am buying a car or making a career choice.  If anything, I have faith that Nintendo will keep on making good games.  I understand that if you want to play a certain game or type of game, you'll try to buy the system that will most likely have it.  It's a tiring debate in your mind what sacrifices you want to make if you choose to stick with one system or two but knowing whether X-Box is beating Nintendo by a hundred or a thousand hardware purchases changes little.

About the stores thing I've been reading about, I've seen a pretty good selection among the stores I've been to.  I usually don't have a problem finding what game I want for my system unless it's very popular at the moment and it's sold out.

[nonjagged]

Quote
Originally posted by: thecubedcanuck
If Nintendo os so far ahead of Microsoft in sales as some here say, the why

- are many gaming stores carrying less and less Nintendo stuff?

- why does blockbuster have a nearly non existant section of gamecube titles while at the same time have 3 rows of x-box games?

Because Sony & Blockbuster have had a deal going on for years now. Hint 5 Blockbuster hire vouchers bundled with Sony deal. Nintendo's platform is not a set-top-box multi-media entertainment system therefore they have no reason to fight Sony's exclusive deal with Blockbuster because you cant watch DVD movies (which Blockbuster stock) on the Gamecube.

- are third parties dropping support of the cube?

They never where supporting the GCN, only some excluvie 3rd party support. The amount of 3rd party trash that has come out on ps2 and xbox is a bit of a joke. Even the PC platform is laughing at some of the generic 3rd party trash that comes out, and the Gamecube is fortunate it doesnt get every bit of the trash but rather exclusive or limited deals of the cream of the crop of 3rd parties.

- would Sony make this up when it doesnt affect them at all, its like looking over your shoulder because you hear footsteps 14 miles away.

Sony arrogantly hate Nintendo so vividly they would say anything to defame Nintendo.

I wouldnt be suprised if these numbers are true. I know when I go into my local future shop or best buy, I see a lot more x-box products moving than gamecube.

If the numbers where true, too bad Sony's console is way outdated in tech-specs and eg. Nintendo's console doesnt have every single 3rd party franchise Sony manages to buy-out for time-exclusive, but at least the Gamecube has superior graphics and framerates and loadtimes which in the end those users that get to play Gamecube games get to spend more time on realtime gameplay and less time on yawning with load-times or excessive FMV gimmicks to smooth out the dodgyness.

Just my opinion, which others may agree on.

[Sea Dragon]

When you buy a game system, you become in some ways a stockholder in that company. Your "dividends" are the selection of games that the company produces. If the company is not doing as well in retail, this will eventually influence the diversity of games available, and thus, potentially lower your dividends.

Just like bands, if a company does nothing but repackage its older material and "remaster it", you know there's trouble. That's why innovation is so important, and why it's great to see new directions, like Eternal Darkness and Metroid Prime.

If I sink $150 into a system (The gamecube is the first console I've purchased in 15 years), I like to keep up with the overall flow of the company - what to expect, the direction the company is heading. This is influenced by sales. I don't really care about profit margins and assets to liability ratios and core fiscal competencies and all of that hoopa-joopa, but I do care about the overall health of a company, which is often expressed by sales figures.  

[highenergyboy]

Quote
remember when the video game market used to be about the games?

Those times leading from the end of the SNES era all the way up to the N64's golden years were the good ol days and some of the best I had. Things were more simple back then where the only exposure you had to game sales were from commercials announcing the next four N64 games that achieved million seller status. That was all there was to it.

Then around the time Project Dolphin was announced this cursed console war debate was born and has just been sucking all the fun out of gaming ever since. No wonder my interest has been waning with every passing month. I still haven't gotten a Gamecube yet and have been procrastinating since the release of Eternal Darkness last summer. Heck, I even went so far as to preorder Wind Waker despite being Cubeless just so I wouldn't miss out on the bonus disk promotion. Now with this new Gameboy player offer, again I will still find myself holding out. I've had numerous opportunities to buy a Gamecube, but I always opted for something else like music CDs, posters or new components for my computer instead. That new promotion along with games like Rebel Strike and Resident Evil 4 will probably prove to be too much to pass up in the end but what about after the Gamecube's lifespan? I keep asking myself whether that same urge that prompted me to get a Gamecube will still be there for the next generation of consoles. I never imagined I would be asking myself this.      

[greenwood]

Sigh, let's try this again.
I've said it before and I will keep saying it until it's beaten into the heads of people who don't get it. If the GCN slips into 3rd in worldwide user base more and more companies will cut support from the GCN. It's as simple as that. You may say, "Ah, it's irrelevant now, no games I care about are cut." but what happens in the future? Sega dropped their entire sports line on the GCN because of low sales. And why is that? Because the GCN is in 3rd place in NA. You may not have cared but I did. And there were others like me who also cared. NBA Jam 2004 was just cancelled, along with some other Acclaim games I can't remember right now (Alias I think). And there's other games that have been cancelled. You may not care now but I think you will when a game you want is announced for another system, maybe a system you don't own.
And let me touch upon your comments where you said it's not like you're buying a car or anything. Let's use the PS2 as an example.

$180 for the system itself. Unless you only play by yourself all the time you'll need another controller so that's $20-$25 more. Got to have a memory card so there's another $20. What else? Oh yeah, got to have a game, add another $40-$50. There's $250-$275 right there. All for what, one game (tax not included)? And who buys a system for just one game? Add in another $100 for a couple more games. So you've spent $350 and you have 3 games. Not bad I guess but you could have spent that on 6 or 7 GCN games, double the amount of games you could play.
Yeah, Nintendo is the only company capable on supporting a system on it's own (with its 1st and 2nd parties) but is that what you want? Having just a few games come out a month, with maybe just a truly great game a few times a year?
Go ahead and dismiss this if you want but this is very real.

[MysticGohan]

Quote
Originally posted by: greenwood
Sigh, let's try this again.
I've said it before and I will keep saying it until it's beaten into the heads of people who don't get it. If the GCN slips into 3rd in worldwide user base more and more companies will cut support from the GCN. It's as simple as that. You may say, "Ah, it's irrelevant now, no games I care about are cut." but what happens in the future? Sega dropped their entire sports line on the GCN because of low sales. And why is that? Because the GCN is in 3rd place in NA. You may not have cared but I did. And there were others like me who also cared. NBA Jam 2004 was just cancelled, along with some other Acclaim games I can't remember right now (Alias I think). And there's other games that have been cancelled. You may not care now but I think you will when a game you want is announced for another system, maybe a system you don't own.
And let me touch upon your comments where you said it's not like you're buying a car or anything. Let's use the PS2 as an example.

$180 for the system itself. Unless you only play by yourself all the time you'll need another controller so that's $20-$25 more. Got to have a memory card so there's another $20. What else? Oh yeah, got to have a game, add another $40-$50. There's $250-$275 right there. All for what, one game (tax not included)? And who buys a system for just one game? Add in another $100 for a couple more games. So you've spent $350 and you have 3 games. Not bad I guess but you could have spent that on 6 or 7 GCN games, double the amount of games you could play.
Yeah, Nintendo is the only company capable on supporting a system on it's own (with its 1st and 2nd parties) but is that what you want? Having just a few games come out a month, with maybe just a truly great game a few times a year?
Go ahead and dismiss this if you want but this is very real.

What did you forget the N64?

Actually it's pretty tied up here in NA with Nintendo and MS actually nintendo may even be 2nd now, don't forget that nintendo is still 2nd in worldwide sales. And that will continue to happen as Nintendo continues to make more deals with 3rd party companies.

Also don't neglect the fact that Xbox has no million sellers yet "not that i'm aware of" unless you count Halo, But what great hits are on the way? Even with Sega's support nothing's selling on that console.

I'm thinking the same fate is happenning to the Xbox as the ps2, that the case that it's being brought for it's dvd playback "Expensive and stupid at that" along with a hard drive where music can be ripped and saved. Although 3rd party software has sold ok so far, how has 2nd parties faired? MS has no talented developer on it's own, I can point out that there won't be a sequel to Abe atleast not for awhile, that game was pathetic.

So I wouldn't count Nintendo out, there's alot of behind the scenes thing's going. Even though Nintendo isn't number #1 this gen, the actions and arrangements Nintendo has been doing as of late will ensure that the next gen- will be in their favor with equal footing.

And in my eye's Xbox2 will be the underdog, I just see another Jaguar "Atari" coming, Just like that bad flood of games

[PIAC]

but to personally obsess over sales? what really is the point, unless your going to take up nintendos flag and start whacking people over the head with it and getting them to buy stuff.
a passing interest i can understand, to satisfy the curiosity on how each console is fairing is understandable, but like 3-4 threads on it? there is nothing a single person can to to change the sales on a whole, you buy 1 and perhaps 2 consoles by 1 company, there is your insignificant number in the great scheme of things.

perhaps im just sick of seeing 3-4 sales threads cluttering up the forums, me i would rather read about new exciting upcoming games, or discussions on neato/horrid aspects of current games, things revolving around games.

*sits in the corner playing gameboy and muttering incoherantly*

[Ymeegod]

" there is nothing a single person can to to change the sales on a whole, you buy 1 and perhaps 2 consoles by 1 company"

Word of mouth is quite a bit stronger than you think.  It's spreads like a virus :0.

[Mario]

Yeah i agree, look at what word of mouth has done to games like Goldeneye, Mario Kart and Wind Waker, they've sold a crapload. If a game is good, someone will start talking about it to his friend, his friend will buy it, now both people will be talking about it etc. Word of mouth probably has a bigger affect on sales than anything else, IMO.

[Cube323]

Dude, you can never rely on company posted numbers.  I work as a buyer for a major retail chain.  All I can say is this, we like to call $ony's projected 50 million installed base, the "50 million lie."  Thats a number that only reflects shipped units and NOT sold units. I have tons of unsold ps2's in all the stores I visit.  Also, one thing $ony never takes into account is the fact that it's hardware has the HIGHEST rate of failure. (Did you know that playing DVD's on your ps2 will cut it's lifespan in half?!)

You have no idea how many people come into our stores whinning "my ps2 doesn't work!"  My younger cousin is the manager of a Toys R Us in NY, and the story is the same for him.   Every couple of days someone comes in w/ this same complaint.

As for Microsoft, they have lost almost One and a Half BILLION DOLLARS on the X-Box since the consoles launch!  A billion and a half!  If you doubt my numbers just check the Wall Street Journal or read the book "Opening the Box."

Even after cutting costs and producing the current boxes w/ the cheapest Chinese made parts they could find, the system still loses almost $150 per unit.  Microsoft does not "break even" until a consumer has bought their 8th game at full price!

lol!

Nintendo has the lowest cost of goods.  The owners of Nintendo consoles buy more games than anyone and the GBA is crushing the handheld market.  As a retailer, I actually think that despite the numbers, Nintendo is actually winning the game, as they make the most money on actual Video Games!  

[ThePerm]

my third party source is a tasmanian bushman...he told me a trillion Gamecubes were sold and 3 ps2s were and 2 xboxen were sold

[Cube323]

perm, that was possibly the most stupid post I have ever read.  Get a haircut hippy

[Perfect Cell]

Well, Nintendo NOT Microsoft is Sonys main competition, so its confient for them to say that Nintendo is LAGGIng behind.. seems like pure hog wash to me

[Crazy]

Who cares?   Why did you people buy the system if all you're going to do is spend your days on forums like these discussing sales numbers?

Spend your time buying more games, and enjoying them.  That _was_ the reason we bought the game cube right?  Well then get to it.  Please!

[greenwood]

PIAC, that would be an ideal situation. I wish we all only talked about games but the reality is this does affect the games we may get to play. Anyway, I've gone on about that long enough and since I don't see any more posts arguing about this hopefully it's been cleared up why this is important.
Crazy, I have 18 GCN games and that number will only increase (True Crime, Harvest Moon, Pikmin 2, Madden 2004, and a bunch more). I spend less than 5 minutes on these boards every day or so so it's not like I'm living on message boards obsessing about this topic. I love my GCN and have never once regretted buying it.  

[PIAC]

i live on these boards as you will see if you click the link in my sig (planet piac) my GCN is right next to my pc, so well i sit i play i read i whinge

[Crazy]

18 games??    : ((   I'm so envious...   I wish i had the $$$ to get some of the games I just don't have the cash for.
I only have 14 games...  and somehow,  I will sell my soul if I have to, but I need to get so many games this year,  including a couple i missed. (Still need to get RE0)

[PaLaDiN]

Why don't you let Nintendo, Microsoft and Sony worry about sales.

All you guys can accomplish is give yourself ulcers. It's not like by worrying about sales you can pioneer a radical change in Nintendo's fundamental marketing techniques and bring them to the head of the pack. What exactly is the point of worrying?

"But Paladin, what about the third party support?"... Yeah, what's your bitching and whining going to do to change it?

I mean, honestly, this is the only page on any message board I stopped reading out of sheer disgust. Normally I read fast enough not to care about quality, but I can't read this page. Sorry. I'd rather do something less painful like go pound nails through my dic*.