Topic: Episode 245: Most Dishonorable

[Yoshidious]

We were killed by DarkSim1 (a lot).

http://www.nintendoworldreport.com/rfn/26435

With RFN host Dr. Metts in the middle of a race against time to get home and record the show, the rest of the crew started this episode without their beloved leader. A relatively brisk round of New Business inevitably ensues, as Jon takes a break from his seemingly endless quest to defeat Lavos and instead discusses GoldenEye, which has quickly become his favorite FPS on Wii. Next, Greg gets shockingly topical with an in-depth look at Dead or Alive Dimensions for 3DS. Regardless of its crass exterior, Team Ninja’s fast-paced fighter proves to be a great fit for portable play, and is highly accessible for newcomers to the series. After the break, we respond to your Listener Mail, beginning with a follow-up to our E3 preview segment from last week’s episode, before Jonny arrives just in time to help us contemplate what makes most RPGs so lengthy and what matters most in the composition of a console library.

In the final segment, we kick-off our Perfect Dark RetroActive with a discussion of the game’s uproariously fun multiplayer component. Jon, James, and Jonny share hilarious anecdotes about being terrorized by Simulants while playing the XBLA version of Rare’s sci-fi shooter together online, while Greg reminisces about the good old days of 4 player split-screen sessions, stuttering framerate and all. We also read your comments from the official forum thread, which concentrate on how Perfect Dark’s local multiplayer-focused design distinguishes it from the online shooters of today.

We'll be returning to Perfect Dark for a look at its single player campaign after E3, but we still have one episode to go before the big show hits, so use this web form to send us your questions for the last pre-E3 batch of Listener Mail next week! 

[NWR_insanolord]

On the topic of big, full games as downloads, I'm really hoping for Animal Crossing 3DS to be available that way. The nature of that series, as something you play a little bit every day over a long period of time, would be ideal as a download on a handheld, so you don't have to worry about carrying the cartridge of it with you in addition to other games you're playing. I want to be able to pull out my 3DS wherever I am, regardless of what games I have with me, and be able to play Animal Crossing for 15 minutes when I've got the time.

[happyastoria]

This was your best episode yet! Damn, I love RetroActive!!!! Who thought of it? I want to give you a kiss!!!!

Also, will there be an E3 "hotel" podcast like before?

[AV]

What's up with James in this episode? Is it his time of the month?

[ShyGuy]

What's up with James in this episode? Is it his time of the month?

Pre-E3 has him on edge?

[adadad]

What's up with James in this episode? Is it his time of the month?

I used to piss my flatmates off so much whenever I used that excuse to explain my grumpiness. IT'S REAL.

[Traveller]

Playing against PD bots will do that to you.

[KDR_11k]

Good AI depends on what the AI is supposed to do. If it's supposed to just run and gun that's easy, making it work for objectives is harder. Making the bots cheat in order to pose a challenge is frowned upon as it distorts the way the game works.

BTW, grabbing items so nobody else gets them is a valid strategy in FPSes and high level play involves perfectly timing your movement to be around for when a given pickup respawns.

[ShyGuy]

I have a technical question: How come my Sansa Clip+ MP3 player classifies things like Weekend Confirmed as a podcast but RFN as a music track?

[Shaymin]

Which version are you getting (mp3 or AAC)?

I just noticed that my AAC file has a tag showing RFN as an audiobook. That explains why my iPod throws it on both as a podcast and an audiobook...

[ShyGuy]

MP3.

Also, Crimm deserves 12 bad jrpgs in a row for his John Candy dis.

[NWR_insanolord]

I love that Jon's go-to example of an '80s movie is Splash. And Crimm would have played 12 bad jrpgs in a row anyway, so I don't see how you'd consider it a punishment.

[Crimm]

What's up with James in this episode? Is it his time of the month?

Pre-E3 has him on edge?

A lot does, actually. Waiting to sign a lease on a new place (right after E3 - blah), E3, work is wrapping up a major project, and I had been drinking before the show.

I don't know that I was in any worse a mood during this episode than any other, but I haven't listened yet.

[KDR_11k]

I've played quite a few games as long as JRPGs last, the problem is that it's not the JRPGs I play that long. I got over a hundred hours in AI War and Monday Night Combat.

Another issue for the JRPG is the narrow definition for it. You stick an FPS on a CRPG and people still call it a CRPG, you stick basic brawler combat and no battle transitions on a JRPG and people call it an action RPG.

[Halbred]

What's up with James in this episode? Is it his time of the month?

Oh god, is it one of those episodes? :-D

[ShyGuy]

I love that Jon's go-to example of an '80s movie is Splash. And Crimm would have played 12 bad jrpgs in a row anyway, so I don't see how you'd consider it a punishment.

You know who was in Splash? JOHN CANDY

[Ceric]

I love that Jon's go-to example of an '80s movie is Splash. And Crimm would have played 12 bad jrpgs in a row anyway, so I don't see how you'd consider it a punishment.

You know who was in Splash? JOHN CANDY

Mannequin

John Candy is in the Ernest series isn't he?

[Ceric]

What's up with James in this episode? Is it his time of the month?

Pre-E3 has him on edge?

A lot does, actually. Waiting to sign a lease on a new place (right after E3 - blah), E3, work is wrapping up a major project, and I had been drinking before the show.

I don't know that I was in any worse a mood during this episode than any other, but I haven't listened yet.

Grats?

[Crimm]

I'm happy about it, but its stressful.


Also I need new chairs. CHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAIRS

[Ceric]

I'm happy about it, but its stressful.


Also I need new chairs. CHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAIRS

New chairs are terrible hard to find.  I ended up going through a couple to replace my desk chair... and ended up getting one of those ergonomic kneeling chairs.

[Chocobo_Rider]

Another great episode!

Musings ...

1. Not all John Candy movies are great (some suck), but for the most part, John Candy is awesome.  Planes, Trains and Automobiles? Classic.

2. Yea, James was noticeably more curmudgeon-y than usual.


Responses ...

1. The added objectives in 1P are what made GoldenEye a great game for me.  I really loved that it felt kind of like being a spy.  So many FPSs, even ones with a spy backdrop, only have one objective: "blow the sh*t out of everything... repeat."

2. Does the mediocre online experience of DOA mean that Nintendo has not made enough improvements in their new online strategy?  Or was this Team Ninja's call? Or what?

3. I would love if Zelda (or any game) could be "as long as the content supports." But, unfortunately, so many foolish reviewers (and the foolish gamers who believe them) regard completion time as perhaps the most objective metric of a games value.  Any game whose completion time is "5 hours too short" of what the reviewer/gamer thinks it should be? will flappin' crucified!!

4a. Yeaaaaaa, Mop_it_up!!

4b. I don't miss bots, but I do really miss more co-op options and the idea that you don't have to be an expert to play a given game online. =\

[Ceric]

I honestly don't see where you guys are coming from on James.  Maybe its because of been doing a reverse marathon of RFN, I'm down to 212, but my opinion would be that James sounds like James.  In fact I would even go as far as to say he is in better spirits then he has been.  He doesn't sound sick or jaded, really isn't that argumentative, and he seems to be having fun.

[broodwars]

4b. I don't miss bots, but I do really miss more co-op options and the idea that you don't have to be an expert to play a given game online. =\

Well, I certainly miss the days when it was considered standard to have an offline multiplayer mode with computer bots if you didn't want to deal with human opponents.  I think Killzone 3 is the last game I can think of in a long time that had that option (and even that's not as robust as what Perfect Dark did), as even Black Ops requires that you be online to play against bots.

As for the need for more Co-op, though, I certainly agree.  My experience playing through the Portal 2 Co-op campaign was pretty awesome, and I really enjoyed the Co-op online multiplayer levels in Uncharted 2 a few years back.  Sadly, Naughty Dog didn't feel the same way and only really supported competitive multiplayer.  And I really dislike what Perk systems have done to multiplayer.  Sure, if you have a decent matchmaking system, you should always be paired up with players of your skill level. 

However, I've seen several multiplayer games that just lump everyone together, allowing the veterans to just making multi inaccessible to anyone not willing to grind for 5 hours memorizing maps and slowly obtaining Perks.  And what if you want to play multiplayer and there are no players of your skill level around to match-up with?  You either don't get to play anything or you get lumped in with the veterans as fresh meat.  Bleh.  Players who are already good at the game shouldn't be given ways to kill everyone even easier.

As for Game Length, I agree that a game should only be as long as its content can support.  However, IMO if your main game can't support an experience that fits the price you're charging in the eyes of the fans, you need to either have supplementary game modes to fill in the gaps or something about the content that changes to encourage replay value (GoldenEye, Perfect Dark, and Timesplitters 2 were masters of this).  It really troubles me seeing so many games you can easily finish and pretty much see everything there is to see in 5 or so hours with no incentive to play any more of it.

[leahsdad]

I honestly don't see where you guys are coming from on James.  Maybe its because of been doing a reverse marathon of RFN, I'm down to 212, but my opinion would be that James sounds like James

Hah!  I just discovered RFN 6 months ago and I'm up to (or down to) #181!   Step up your game!  :-)


James, don't change!  Your grumpiness and sharp-tongued insults are an essential part of the show. 


Oh, and I don't think enough people have brought up Greg's assertion that the DS has had a profound effect on how we play RPG's.  I'm a dad of 2 girls and despite the fact that in my country (Los Angeles) we don't use public transportation much, I only play RPG's on my DS.  In fact, I think I stopped playing RPG's in general during the PS2 era (when I got married, go figure).  Missed it, but just never could find the time to sink into that kind of game.  The DS has been a godsend, for exactly the reasons that Greg brings up.  Loving it!

[Ceric]

I honestly don't see where you guys are coming from on James.  Maybe its because of been doing a reverse marathon of RFN, I'm down to 212, but my opinion would be that James sounds like James

Hah!  I just discovered RFN 6 months ago and I'm up to (or down to) #181!   Step up your game!  :-)


James, don't change!  Your grumpiness and sharp-tongued insults are an essential part of the show. 


Oh, and I don't think enough people have brought up Greg's assertion that the DS has had a profound effect on how we play RPG's.  I'm a dad of 2 girls and despite the fact that in my country (Los Angeles) we don't use public transportation much, I only play RPG's on my DS.  In fact, I think I stopped playing RPG's in general during the PS2 era (when I got married, go figure).  Missed it, but just never could find the time to sink into that kind of game.  The DS has been a godsend, for exactly the reasons that Greg brings up.  Loving it!

I came back in May and I've listen out of order Drunk Cast, Episode 78 (Gregs First appearance),  Episode 148, and a Correction its 217.  So yeah your ahead of me.  I've been listening to all the other Podcasts as well.