Topic: Ocarina of Time Remake for the 3DS: Malon in 3D!

[EasyCure]

**even then, why the OoT engine? The system seems a little more powerful than that so why tinker with geting the OoT engine working on the system when they could spend the time and money working on a completely new Zelda game that uses the WW engine? Or if they really wanted to cut off SOME dev time, just use the PH/ST engine?

PH/ST is a totally different type of game than what they're trying to show in 3D.

I knew that would come up but I only threw it out there because I assumed (and kind of hoped) that Nintendo would keep the console and portable Zelda titles in their different styles. I like that PH & ST feel a little more like the old 2d titles. In fact I'd really like to see what a stereoscopic 3d Zelda would look like on 3DS in that fixed camera angle, however maybe change the angle a bit so its more like Animal Crossing. I'm sure they'd make some beautiful 3D imagery in that style.

At the risk of sounding like Ian (again) I just feel that if the portable titles end up more like the console titles, they're just diluting the gene pool so to speak. I don't want to see the 3DS turn into a PSP where all its games play identically to their console iterations. With the motion sensing built into the system, and touch in place of IR pointing, they'd be pretty similar experiences ya know?

Keep in mind this is all coming from the guy thats waiting for the future where there is no console & portable system, they'd be one in the same. Know how many times I'd play a game like Rune Factory Frontier and wish I could magically transfer it to my DS because I had to run out for errands? Or how many times I wanted to zap a DS game onto the TV and play it with wii controls so I could sit a little more comfortably and have my hands cramp a little less?

Until that time comes though, I'd prefer that my portable experience be a little different than my console experience when it comes to games in the same franchise.

[UncleBob]

Until that time comes though, I'd prefer that my portable experience be a little different than my console experience when it comes to games in the same franchise.

I'm happy with 2D and 3D Mario on the same system.

I'd be just as happy with 2D and 3D Zelda on the same system.

[NWR_insanolord]

The idea that Nintendo chose to release ports instead of new games is ridiculous. It takes a lot more work to make a new game than to remake an existing one. The choice wasn't between the ports and new original games; it was between the ports and nothing. Like I said somewhere else, this isn't like the DS where the only launch game is a port. We're getting a couple ports alongside new, original games like Kid Icarus.

[EasyCure]

Until that time comes though, I'd prefer that my portable experience be a little different than my console experience when it comes to games in the same franchise.

I'm happy with 2D and 3D Mario on the same system.

I'd be just as happy with 2D and 3D Zelda on the same system.

But would you really say that if instead of NSMB Wii wasn't for wii and instead was just NSMB2 for ds without four player co-op? Wait, of course You would.

I think there's more than a few of us here who though NSMB was pretty good on the DS but had its faults, yet almost everyone here (but the usual suspects..) thought NSMBW was phenominal, and I'd say a big part of that was due to the 4 simultaneaous players that just can't be done on the DS hardware. I'd declare that to be a different beast than any 2d Mario you'd get on the DS.

In other words, I see your point and its a good'ne but it's not perfect.

All I know is the last thing I want from the 3DS is for it to release games that are like the PSP's; an almost exact experience you can get from the bigger hardware. People complain enough when Nintendo releases a slightly updated port like this, imagine a scenario where they release The Legend of Zelda: Skyward Sword on Wii followed shortely thereafter by a Zelda: Skward Sword Tales (ala Liberty City Stories, etc)

ah, it feels good to be part of a meaninful discussion again. I love you, E3

The idea that Nintendo chose to release ports instead of new games is ridiculous. It takes a lot more work to make a new game than to remake an existing one. The choice wasn't between the ports and new original games; it was between the ports and nothing. Like I said somewhere else, this isn't like the DS where the only launch game is a port. We're getting a couple ports alongside new, original games like Kid Icarus.

But why does it have to be "ports and nothing"? Nintendo are the ones creating the hardware along with the software and have plenty of teams that could have been working on new games for the launch window. They obviously have some good 3rd party support for this so that helps round out the lineup too, but even if Nintendo's games themselves get delayed, why must the 3DS release be set in stone? Just push the date back to lineup with the completion of the new games, giving 3rd parties some extra time to polish their games (lol!) if only to have the best lineup possible without padding via ports. Isn't that the most win-win situation for us, the gamers/consumers?

It's gonna be awesome seeing these ports alongside brand new titles when the 3DS launches, becuause OoT and SF64  are amazing games and deserve a second chance to shine*, but whats wrong with wishing there were more new games (from Nintendo themselves) for launch?

You know what, I'm gonna correct myself here: the most win-win situation for games is if the 3DS launches with 2 or 3 brand new games (sequels or new IPs) from Nintendo alongside all the new games from 3rd parties. Afterall, we don't know for sure these ports are all they have up their sleeve (plus I haven't followed E3 as close as you all so I'm not even positive if games like KIU, Nintendogs & AC are intended to be launch titles, so all this was for nothing if they are because they'll have those new games AND ports).


*especially Starfox. If it does well (and it should considering how awesome the game is!) you KNOW we'll see another SF game for the system now that the framework is in place.

[UncleBob]

I think there's more than a few of us here who though NSMB was pretty good on the DS but had its faults, yet almost everyone here (but the usual suspects..) thought NSMBW was phenominal, and I'd say a big part of that was due to the 4 simultaneaous players that just can't be done on the DS hardware. I'd declare that to be a different beast than any 2d Mario you'd get on the DS.

If that was the situation, then it'd be a "different beast" because of the limitations of the hardware - not strictly because of any design choices built into the game.

All I'm saying is that I don't agree with the idea that certain "types" of games should remain on one system (or type of system).  Obviously, I want a good game - and, ideally, I want that game to take advantage of the strengths of the system it's on.  But if Nintendo was to release the same-ish game around the same time on both console and hand held, I'd be just fine with it - so long as both games were good games.

I mean, I've threatened more than once to create an army of the undead to storm Nintendo HQ and demand an American release of Trace Memory 2 - and I know there's more than a few of you who'd agree with me on that.  What about a Professor Layton Wii title?  Would anyone complain that we already have those on the DS?  (Yeah, some of you would.  You can just quit gaming now.).  If the game is good, I don't care what system it's on... as long as it's a Nintendo system.

[Spak-Spang]

Its the law of limited resources that is why it is ports or nothing.

Nintendo has to develop games for the Wii, DS, and the new not even released 3DS.  Obviously, the design teams are going to be most focusing on games coming out this year on the Nintendo Wii and DS.

Also, these port projects were most likely TESTING GROUNDS for the 3D.  To make sure these games work.  As I mentioned before...using existing games and existing code and modifying them for 3D is much easier than creating new game experiences for test experiences.  We have no idea how easy or difficult it is to reprogram these games into 3D.  Perhaps Nintendo has found a simple solution to that.

As for Ports or not.  Even if the game is just a simple port with upped graphics and 3D, it still is the first time these games are playable on a portable system.  Which means you can play some of the best games ever created on the go.  Plus, there still might be added content like mentioned before.

Plus, they may not be full retail priced games...they may be downloadable games for the system...Nintendo stated downloadable games will be available at launch.  So everyone really needs to stop complaining.  We are getting a great Zelda launch game...that some have already played...big deal.  Don't buy it then. 

However, to think we could get a NEW Zelda 3DS and a NEW Star Fox 3DS and everything else Nintendo has shown us this for launch is shocking.  I would rather think Nintendo fans are very spoiled brats sometimes. 

[NWR_insanolord]

These are more or less tech demos, like Wii Sports and Wii Play were, made just to test the capabilities of the hardware, but then released commercially.

[EasyCure]

I never once said i expected a new Zelda or Starfox at launch and I never would. Well starfox maybe but not something like Zelda (we all know TP doesn't count), so i'm hoping that "brat" comment isn't meant to be directed at me, especially since i'm not trying to argue with you Spak.

I've said before I understand these are TESTING GRONDS but they could've also tested GC games but didn't, most likely because starting with N64 titles is easier, and because of how recent GC games are in comparison ports of those titles wouldn't sell as well because even with younger fans, they're fresh in peoples gaming life. I mentioned earlier how there are youngens out there that think WW is the first Zelda game, I'm sure we've all come across kids like that and you can't blame them for being born after a video game era or being too young during one. Obviously the best situation for Nintendo is to test 3D engines on relatively simpler games that if succesfully reproduced could be released as ports. There's NOTHING wrong with releasing a port and I've never once thought so, especially if its advanced in some form. I even mentioned that it's a good business move.

The point I'm trying to get across is that it would've been nice if instead of spreading their already thin resources on testing game codes and engines on this new hardware and touching up those games to release as advanced ports for launch, if those same resources already testing engine and code used them for newer experiences. I also touched base on the fact that the release date for 3ds shouldn't be set in stone. Did Nintendo even confirm that it'd be coming out next year?

Again, I'm only now catching up on all the E3 info, mainly thru posts here and not really watching videos of the conference itself. Back when the 3DS news was blurted out by Nintendo, didn't they say it'd launch in 2011? Why? The isn't the DS still making tons of money? At the time they released the news there wasn't even a confirmation of a PSP2 (and as far as I know there still isnt..?) so whats the rush to release it? All those devs they had tinkering with OoT's code and engine could've gotten it to work on 3DS with all the stereoscopic imagery in place and turned OoT into a new game (zelda or not) if Nintendo just decided to hold off on launching the system when those new games were ready.

I also mentioned that these ports should be budget priced, but a budget price as a downloadable game is even better. I forgot that the DS now has a download service, so I didn't even think that OoT 3D could be a type of VC game for cheaper than it would if it were retail. Again, that'd just be another smart business move on Nintendo since downloadable games are more prone to impulse buys than retail games.

One last thing, and again only if you're referring to me directly, Spak;

Go back and read my initial post and you'll see mentioned that i'd buy the game if the enhancements were worth it and if it was priced lower than a new game. The fact that it's in stereoscopic 3D and will have crisper graphics isn't enough. Neither is the fact that it'd be portable, as I'm not the biggest portable gamer anyway.
Adding the Iron Boots to the weapons menu as opposed to the "armour" menu and letting you use them the way we were able to in TP isn't enough either. If it adds those 2 dungeons you yourself mentioned i'd consider it. If (the game was sold at retail) and included both OoT and OoT: Master Quest I'd be more inclined to buy it. If (again sold at retail) was a compilation of OoT AND Majoras Mask (AND with added dungeons) then I really wouldn't have a choice but to buy it.

If it all it ends up being is a slightly prettier game, in stereoscopic 3D and with the Iron Boots placement being changed around, then I'll skip it. No big deal. It's not the end of the world. I won't sit on my high horse calling the people that do morons, fanboy or apologist. It's not my place, it's not my style its Ians lol sorry I'm ripping on you so much dude.

On a sidenote, I'm tired of typing out "stereoscopic 3D" to differentiate the 3D imagarey vs 3D gameplay. Thanks Nintendo

[Spak-Spang]

NO, not at you.  Just Nintendo fans in general that can't be happy.  I do not believe I would target any individual not even Ian.  But Nintendo fans in general expect too much.

[Mop it up]

Normally I would agree to that, but I don't think it is expecting too much/being unreasonable to want/expect new games with a new system launch instead of ports and remakes.

[NWR_insanolord]

That's not an unreasonable thing to expect, and if we weren't also getting new games in addition to the ports you might have a point.

[UncleBob]

Normally I would agree to that, but I don't think it is expecting too much/being unreasonable to want/expect new games with a new system launch instead of ports and remakes.

A) There are new games.  From Nintendo alone:
Port-ish: Animal Crossing™
NEW GAME - Kid Icarus™: Uprising
Somewhat new game - Mario Kart™
Somewhat new game - nintendogs™ + cats
NEW GAME - Paper Mario™
NEW GAME - PilotWings Resort™
Port - Star Fox 64™ 3D
BRAND NEW IP - Steel Diver™

B) No one knows what games will be available at launch.

So, yes, I would say that those complaining about it at this point are being unreasonable.

[Mop it up]

Are you sure that's an accurate assessment? It sounds like Animal Crossing has quite a few new features, making it at least in the new-ish category, and I don't think enough was shown of Mario Kart to declare it somewhat-new instead of putting it in the new category (unless some retro tracks were shown that I missed).

I guess we don't yet know what's coming at launch, do we? But Nintendo's track record doesn't look good, as their last three handheld launches (DS, GBA, GBC) had only ports from Nintendo. I think that's why some people may be worried.

[UncleBob]

I was being generous to the "no new games" crowd when I handed out the labels to those titles.

Anywhoo, it's my opinion Nintendo goes light at handheld launches so third party titles have a chance to sell.  Imagine if Nintendo launched the 3DS with just half that set of titles.  How many third party games do you think would sell?

[Spak-Spang]

I called

Super Mario Kart as being the "Mario" launch game for 3DS.  I am calling that a day one brand new game.

Sure it may use an updated engine we already have, but I 100% believe it will be a new game, with new tracks (as well as retro tracks) and new modes.  And, it is a PERFECT launch game.  The 3D effects will be a great asset, and the game will be great intro to whatever online scene Nintendo will have with the 3DS. 

But the list above proves greatly how Nintendo is working on the best launch lineup it has ever had for a system...and the 3D party support is enormous as well. 

[NWR_insanolord]

This isn't really a good thing, but, given the tech level of the 3DS, I can see third parties releasing the same game simultaneously on 3DS and Wii.

[Peachylala]

Anywhoo, it's my opinion Nintendo goes light at handheld launches so third party titles have a chance to sell.  Imagine if Nintendo launched the 3DS with just half that set of titles.  How many third party games do you think would sell?

I remember the GBA launch and Castlevania was the big one that everyone wanted.

[NWR_insanolord]

I don't think it's a coincidence that that was the same launch where Nintendo's only game was a port of everyone's least-favorite Mario game sorry, Mop it up.

[Ian Sane]

It doesn't have to be port or nothing but that's usually how they time it in the release schedule.  I don't think anyone craps on the VC because the VC is never used to take up the release date of where a new game would fall.  It is treated clearly as a seperate service to sell vintage games.

But when Nintendo releases an on-the-shelf port the timing of the release is always by itself.  It's in a "slot" where a new game is supposed to be.  So instead of waiting 3 months for a new title, you wait 6 because where a new game was supposed to be released Nintendo released a port instead.  It's not to compliment new titles, it's to REPLACE a new title.

When I think of re-release I think of how Final Fantasy Anthology on the Playstation was released within a month of Final Fantasy VIII.  The re-release was clearly meant to compliment the release.  They didn't use that in place of a new Final Fantasy.  Nintendo never released a GBA Mario game and they had four Mario ports.  You think that's a coincidence?

When Ocarina of Time Master Quest was released that was a complimentary release.  It came out shortly before Wind Waker.  It did not take the place of a new Zelda.  It was actually beyond the call of duty since it was a pre-order bonus.  Or you look at something really exceptional like the Resident Evil remake.  That came out the same year as Resident Evil 0.  It's actually good enough to "count" as something new and we still also got a new Resident Evil!

I don't trust Nintendo on this because in the past if you got say 4 new games a year, in a year with a port you don't get 4 and a port, you get three.  The port takes up the slot of a new release.

[NWR_insanolord]

For the last time: there are two ports at E3, alongside a whole bunch of original titles. You people seem to be ignoring all the original games and getting all bent out of shape about the ports as if that's all they had.

[Arbok]

This isn't really a good thing, but, given the tech level of the 3DS, I can see third parties releasing the same game simultaneously on 3DS and Wii.

That could be a good thing, at least if it gets some devs to finally stop ignoring the Wii (I'm looking at you Namco and Capcom...)

[Mop it up]

I don't think it's a coincidence that that was the same launch where Nintendo's only game was a port of everyone's least-favorite Mario game sorry, Mop it up.

What makes you think I care about people's opinions of games?

[EasyCure]

NO, not at you.  Just Nintendo fans in general that can't be happy.  I do not believe I would target any individual not even Ian.  But Nintendo fans in general expect too much.

Thats something we can both agree on

It woulda been nice to see some more new games and less ports, no matter how enhanced, but I'm not gonna boycott the games, they just won't be on the top of my list at launch. As I said earlier however, there's still no knowing this is all we'll get anyway, Nintendo's been known to announce surprise titles and release them soon after, so there's no telling what'll happen.

[Mop it up]

Unfortunately, a surprise announcement/release is also probably part of the reason no one bought ExciteBots. shame on all of you.

[UncleBob]

Unfortunately, a surprise announcement/release is also probably part of the reason no one bought ExciteBots. shame on all of you.

How do you explain why no one bought ExciteTrucks?