Author Topic: Game Journalism  (Read 94342 times)

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Offline KDR_11k

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Re: The 3rd Party Wall of Shame
« Reply #50 on: January 29, 2010, 01:26:52 PM »
Oh wow, I just saw the customer reviews on that Big League Sports game, average of one star with everyone complaining that they were looking for something to follow up on Wii Sports but all that game delivered was shitty training minigames, not even properly playing the game. Instead of playing simultaneously multiplayer is a hot seat highscore challenge. Those reviews are pure hatred and I can't imagine that it did much for Activision's brand image (one comment specifically mentions never buying from Activision again and several say they feel defrauded and think Activision needs to be sued over it).

Offline Mop it up

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Re: The 3rd Party Wall of Shame
« Reply #51 on: January 29, 2010, 03:20:05 PM »
Wow. Activision's list is pretty terrible. I don't own any of those, but there are a few that I have interest in. The 007 game, for one. I also kind of want to try a Call of Duty game just because it is a long-running, critically acclaimed series. I'm curious how the Tony Hawk games play, I enjoyed the ones on Nintendo 64 and GameCube.

Guitar Hero... I played III and it was okay, but I don't think it is something I want to own. Certainly not more than one, at least.

Is it sad that I am only interested in/own 6 total from that list?
How many of them are Guitar Hero games?

Offline BlackNMild2k1

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Re: The 3rd Party Wall of Shame
« Reply #52 on: January 29, 2010, 03:37:42 PM »
I think Activision could have avoiding playing out the music genre if they had released just Guitar Hero World Tour and then the other versions as music packs with character models that you can either buy on on disc at retail($19.99) or as DLC.

Offline Deguello

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Re: The 3rd Party Wall of Shame
« Reply #53 on: January 29, 2010, 05:35:43 PM »
Just to consolidate responses to Broodwars and Kairon.  Sure, there are a few good games on the wall of shame.  A few.  But most are the sort of shovelware the likes of which even God has never seen.

Pro's talking about brand mistrust and why your discerning Wii gamer will stick to Nintendo.  If he made a "Nintendo Wall of Glory" You'd see most of their games aren't "garbage" even when they are low budget.  Nintendo's games aren't "90% crap."  Some may not be your cup of tea, but none of them were foisted onto Wii owners like "Space Camp" or another Wii Sports ripoff as late as October 2009.

Also it shows that because the the titles released earlier in the generation from third parties got more sales than their later ones, initially the Wii gamer was trusting of third parties until they started getting real garbage dumped on them.  Then they rejected and rebuffed their games outright, even if they were good (Sega felt this) simply because of a ruined first impression.  It's cause and effect, a consequence of treating your customer like an idiot, and entirely their own fault.  Maybe if they had tried harder in 2006,2007, and 2008 they wouldn't have felt the sting of people's disinterest.  But instead, they blame me, you, Nintendo, the economy, etc.  Everybody except themselves and their shoddy development, poor marketing, and ruined brandname for the majority of gamers.

And really, who could side with the third parties here?   Who looks at this list and says "That's a great effort!  That totally matches Nintendo's 40 or so games."  Considering both the sales AND gamerankings AND amazon reviews AND professional critics would disagree, anybody who would would be in the vast minority and look like an apologist or a shill.
« Last Edit: January 29, 2010, 05:37:56 PM by Deguello »
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Offline Chozo Ghost

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Re: The 3rd Party Wall of Shame
« Reply #54 on: January 29, 2010, 06:29:13 PM »
A lot of those Ubisoft games that can be considered good are games that were only published by Ubisoft and were actually created by someone else. No More Heroes is a perfect example of this. Did Ubisoft publish this? Yeah. Were they the ones who made it? No.
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Offline broodwars

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Re: The 3rd Party Wall of Shame
« Reply #55 on: January 29, 2010, 10:05:45 PM »
A lot of those Ubisoft games that can be considered good are games that were only published by Ubisoft and were actually created by someone else. No More Heroes is a perfect example of this. Did Ubisoft publish this? Yeah. Were they the ones who made it? No.

Does it matter that Ubisoft didn't develop those titles?  No, because whether you like it or not localization is neither free nor easy.  Resources had to be allocated to the localization process, and for all the problems that Ubisoft's titles have the translation and voice acting are not usually among them.
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Offline NWR_insanolord

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Re: The 3rd Party Wall of Shame
« Reply #56 on: January 29, 2010, 10:14:25 PM »
I'm sure Imagine: Veterinarian Babyz was translated perfectly and had excellent voice acting.
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Offline Deguello

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Re: The 3rd Party Wall of Shame
« Reply #57 on: January 30, 2010, 12:20:19 AM »
A lot of those Ubisoft games that can be considered good are games that were only published by Ubisoft and were actually created by someone else. No More Heroes is a perfect example of this. Did Ubisoft publish this? Yeah. Were they the ones who made it? No.

Does it matter that Ubisoft didn't develop those titles?  No, because whether you like it or not localization is neither free nor easy.  Resources had to be allocated to the localization process, and for all the problems that Ubisoft's titles have the translation and voice acting are not usually among them.

I think it matters because if you take away the localized games, UBISoft's good games on that list get reduced by 25%.  Yes, localization costs money, but not as much money as making good games yourself, and when those two games are your highest rated games, and sold more than 80% of the crap on there, then it really shows that you can't be bothered to actually make quality games.  UBISoft was the one who pledged to make "Nintendo Quality Games" and Somehow I don't think Cook Wars or Imagine Fashion Party is what anybody had in mind.

And yeah, Pro's giving credit to UBI for them, just like he's giving credit for Victorious Boxers even though they only published that in Europe.  All this is straight up "Who's got the best lineup on Wii?"  "Who's made the most bad games?"  "Who deserves to sell the most?"  The answer isn't surprising, although third parties expected it to be them with their flooding of the market with cheap crap, and then throwing a tantrum when they don't get easy sales from customers they think are retarded.
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Offline Kairon

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Re: The 3rd Party Wall of Shame
« Reply #58 on: January 30, 2010, 01:34:45 AM »
Actually, I see everything that Pro is arguing wit the list. But it still doesn't change the fact that I own a bunch of games on that list, and WAY more than I owned for the GC from the respective publishers. In fact, these two lists almost make Ubisoft look good to me because I own and enjoy more games from them than Activision.
« Last Edit: January 30, 2010, 01:37:47 AM by Kairon »
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Offline Stratos

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Re: The 3rd Party Wall of Shame
« Reply #59 on: January 30, 2010, 02:05:02 AM »
I believe 5 of the 6 are Guitar Hero games. GH3, World Tour, Smash Hits, GH5 and Band Hero. LOL
Last one is Modern Warfare Reflex. I'm not counting World at War because once Reflex was announced I lost interest in getting that.
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Offline Ymeegod

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Re: The 3rd Party Wall of Shame
« Reply #60 on: January 30, 2010, 07:01:16 PM »
Well that's the problem with the WII--it's so freaking flooded even the good games gets burried in the pile. 

Where's EA list? 

Offline BlackNMild2k1

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Re: The 3rd Party Wall of Shame
« Reply #61 on: January 30, 2010, 07:06:10 PM »
Where's EA list? 

Patience you must have.

Offline NinGurl69 *huggles

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Re: The 3rd Party Wall of Shame
« Reply #62 on: January 30, 2010, 08:41:17 PM »
Pro Daisy is on vacation in Tahoe right now.
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Offline KDR_11k

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Re: The 3rd Party Wall of Shame
« Reply #63 on: January 30, 2010, 11:27:01 PM »
I want to see the Nintendo wall for comparison too.

Offline Stratos

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Re: The 3rd Party Wall of Shame
« Reply #64 on: January 31, 2010, 01:46:39 AM »
So I put forth a question to everyone. You know how it is common on eBay to sell large 'lots' of videogames? If the 'Ubi-66' or 'Activiasion-77' were up for bid on eBay, how high would you be willing to go to win it? This is assuming you have a few titles in there you actually want. If you could get a decent deal, would you try and win it just for those few you wanted?
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Offline Kairon

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Re: The 3rd Party Wall of Shame
« Reply #65 on: January 31, 2010, 03:03:34 AM »
I don't know... there is such a thing as negative value... I HAVE thrown away DVDs before so that they don't sully the rest of my movie collection.
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Offline Chozo Ghost

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Re: The 3rd Party Wall of Shame
« Reply #66 on: January 31, 2010, 03:09:17 AM »
So I put forth a question to everyone. You know how it is common on eBay to sell large 'lots' of videogames? If the 'Ubi-66' or 'Activiasion-77' were up for bid on eBay, how high would you be willing to go to win it? This is assuming you have a few titles in there you actually want. If you could get a decent deal, would you try and win it just for those few you wanted?

Maybe. If it was a good enough deal I would buy the lot and then resell the games I don't like.
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Offline A Straight Up Trippin' Balls Forum User

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Re: The 3rd Party Wall of Shame
« Reply #67 on: January 31, 2010, 12:44:23 PM »
Sounds like a good hot topic question for another thread. I think I would go up to about $15-20...even though I wouldn't have the shelf space.

The six-sided-video style gameplay videos would be worth it.

Offline broodwars

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Re: The 3rd Party Wall of Shame
« Reply #68 on: January 31, 2010, 02:04:18 PM »
I see people calling for an EA collage on here, but I'm struggling to think of too many bad Wii games they've released.  Granted, it's a lot of yearly iteration sports games and some throwaway casual stuff, but I don't remember any particularly bad games in that pack.
« Last Edit: January 31, 2010, 02:06:26 PM by broodwars »
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Offline ShyGuy

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Re: The 3rd Party Wall of Shame
« Reply #69 on: January 31, 2010, 02:05:24 PM »
Pro's contribution is epic here.

Amazingly, Activision is even worse than Ubisoft. Shameful sequel heaven. I own two of the games and only see about 5 total that look worth it to me.

After EA, do we get anyone else? 2k games? How about some Japanese publishers?

Offline broodwars

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Re: The 3rd Party Wall of Shame
« Reply #70 on: January 31, 2010, 02:14:50 PM »
After EA, do we get anyone else? 2k games? How about some Japanese publishers?

There's no point in doing one for 2K Games.  According to GameFAQs, they've only released 4 games on Wii so far: Fantastic Four: Rise of the Silver Surfer, Carnival Games, Don King Boxing, and Ringling Bros. and Barnum & Bailey Circus. Granted, not exactly quality releases, but it's a tiny number of releases compared to everyone else.

If you want to do Japanese companies, Capcom's always a good pick I suppose.
« Last Edit: January 31, 2010, 02:22:17 PM by broodwars »
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Offline BlackNMild2k1

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Re: The 3rd Party Wall of Shame
« Reply #71 on: January 31, 2010, 02:16:35 PM »
What would be a good follow up after we go the the shameful contributions of 3rd parties on Wii, would be to compare that with what they released on the PS360 to get the full understanding of why this wall is so shameful.


After EA, do we get anyone else? 2k games? How about some Japanese publishers?

There's no point in doing one for 2K Games.  According to GameFAQs, they've only released 5 games on Wii so far: Fantastic Four: Rise of the Silver Surfer, Carnival Games, Don King Boxing, and Ringling Bros. and Barnum & Bailey Circus. Granted, not exactly quality releases, but it's a tiny number of releases compared to everyone else.

If you want to do Japanese companies, Capcom's always a good pick I suppose.

2k Games is part of Take 2 interactive, so if you were to do anyone, it would be Take2 which includes 2k, R* and maybe a few others.

Offline Mop it up

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Re: The 3rd Party Wall of Shame
« Reply #72 on: January 31, 2010, 02:54:56 PM »
So I put forth a question to everyone. You know how it is common on eBay to sell large 'lots' of videogames? If the 'Ubi-66' or 'Activiasion-77' were up for bid on eBay, how high would you be willing to go to win it? This is assuming you have a few titles in there you actually want. If you could get a decent deal, would you try and win it just for those few you wanted?
$66 and $77, respectively. I'd try anything for a buck. I would try each one just out of curiosity, and would likely sell most of them after that.

Offline Kairon

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Re: The 3rd Party Wall of Shame
« Reply #73 on: January 31, 2010, 02:58:20 PM »
Maybe a more objective measure might be what Gamestop would be willing to pay if you traded all these games in.
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Offline NinGurl69 *huggles

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Re: The 3rd Party Wall of Shame
« Reply #74 on: January 31, 2010, 06:09:35 PM »
Actually, I see everything that Pro is arguing wit the list. But it still doesn't change the fact that I own a bunch of games on that list, and WAY more than I owned for the GC from the respective publishers. In fact, these two lists almost make Ubisoft look good to me because I own and enjoy more games from them than Activision.

I probably own a similar number of Ubi/Activision games as you, but we are only a couple of well-informed enthusiasts with questionable buying habits.  We are INSIGNIFICANT compared to the Countless Un-Informed and/or Less enthusiastic.  Publishers have to do little to capture our daring, adventurous interests.

The Wall of Shame isn't concerned with projecting our anecdotes on the climate.  We know what the 3rd Parties did, we know how the consumers responded, and we know how the 3rd Parties "responded" to that.  I believe we know enough to see what adds up, what doesn't, and when 3rd Parties are serving up Soft-Serve Ass Cream in retail and the press.  3rd Parties will not, cannot escape responsibility and accountability while the Wall of Shame stands.  they're welcome to go out of business, however

Maybe a more objective measure might be what Gamestop would be willing to pay if you traded all these games in.

Cursed Mountain is worth $3 trade-in value at GameStop =|

I want to see the Nintendo wall for comparison too.

Construction of the Wall of Shame must be completed before breaking ground on the next project's foundation.  The Nintendo Wall of Glory is currently in the design & planning phase, and is awaiting funding upon Reggie's approval.  The Revolution encompasses multiple projects.
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