Topic: Metroid Other M

[Mop it up]

The wall jump is pretty finicky, it was not designed in an intuitive way. I figured out that first I must press the opposite direction of the wall, and then press the jump button, which is something I really have to think about when I execute it. If I can focus and resist the urge to press both buttons at once, then I can use it without a problem. Fortunately, the only time the move is ever needed is when the little creatures show it to you... and even that part might be skippable. I'm not sure, but I do know, every other area you can reach with it is either optional, or accessing an area before acquiring a necessary item.

I think the main reason why people like Super Metroid is because they like to figure things out for themselves, they want to explore the areas and find the secrets and the passageways and all that. And also simply because some prefer 2D games to 3D. I can understand why someone wouldn't appreciate that, especially in this age where games have a lot more direction.

I don't really remember encountering a lot of these "double upgrade" areas you speak of, but maybe I just didn't go exploring until after I had some good tools. I know of a couple, but these have a missile expansion or two after the first section, so you still get something out of it even if you can't get past the next part.

[broodwars]

Hah, I finally completed Super Metroid (5:30 completion time, 66% item collection rate), and although I think the events of the final battle are just as overblown in the fan community as the death of a certain flower girl, it is handled well.  Man, that game would have been so much better if Maridia had just been completely removed.  With that out of the way, I think I'm all set for Other M on Tuesday.

[Mop it up]

You made pretty good time for your first run. Mine was seven hours with 67%.

[Sarail]

Hah, I finally completed Super Metroid (5:30 completion time, 66% item collection rate), and although I think the events of the final battle are just as overblown in the fan community as the death of a certain flower girl, it is handled well.  Man, that game would have been so much better if Maridia had just been completely removed.  With that out of the way, I think I'm all set for Other M on Tuesday.

You really didn't like the Maridia area? Ah, man... that's probably my favorite area of the entire game.  I just love the overall feel of isolation of that area (though, yes, the entire world makes you feel isolated), and I feel like the music really adds to it.

[broodwars]

Hah, I finally completed Super Metroid (5:30 completion time, 66% item collection rate), and although I think the events of the final battle are just as overblown in the fan community as the death of a certain flower girl, it is handled well.  Man, that game would have been so much better if Maridia had just been completely removed.  With that out of the way, I think I'm all set for Other M on Tuesday.

You really didn't like the Maridia area? Ah, man... that's probably my favorite area of the entire game.  I just love the overall feel of isolation of that area (though, yes, the entire world makes you feel isolated), and I feel like the music really adds to it.

Maridia has two big things going against it: first, it's an underwater level, and those rarely go well in games (especially if you happen to get your feet stuck in the quicksand in certain areas, where it can become tedious and frustrating to free yourself from).  It's also built like a huge maze of interconnected rooms, unlike the other areas that are fairly straightforward, where often the solution comes down to combing for bomb-able floors.  The pacing of the game just slams right into a wall with Maridia, and it doesn't really pick up again until you reach Ridley's section of Norfair.

[TheBlackCat]

Fortunately, the only time the move is ever needed is when the little creatures show it to you... and even that part might be skippable. I'm not sure, but I do know, every other area you can reach with it is either optional, or accessing an area before acquiring a necessary item.

You can skip the etecoon room as well (it gets you some optional tanks), or you can wait to do it until you have the space jump (which is what I do).  The only other place it is really somewhat needed is the vertical passage to get to the spring ball, and you can either do that once you have the space jump or exploit a glitch to jump through a ceiling.

As you said, it is also necessary for a couple of sequence breaks, namely getting the wave beam before you get the grappling beam, getting the super missile before you beat spore spawn, and beating kraid before you get the high jump boots (I haven't done the last, it requires an extremely precise wall jump off a one-tile-high platform).  It is also pretty much necessary for beating Dragoon before you get the grappling beam.  Although it is probably possible to do that using the ice beam it makes things much, much harder.

[TheBlackCat]

Maridia has two big things going against it: first, it's an underwater level, and those rarely go well in games (especially if you happen to get your feet stuck in the quicksand in certain areas, where it can become tedious and frustrating to free yourself from).

That's the point, don't get your feet stuck in the sand   We have ice beams for a reason.

It's also built like a huge maze of interconnected rooms, unlike the other areas that are fairly straightforward, where often the solution comes down to combing for bomb-able floors.  The pacing of the game just slams right into a wall with Maridia, and it doesn't really pick up again until you reach Ridley's section of Norfair.

Yes, it is a maze, although I don't think any more so than upper Norfair (actually probably less so because it seals off some doors that could get you going in the wrong direction).  Also, the only areas I can think of that require you to deal with bombable floors is the room leading up to botwain (the eel boss), which you should notice just by shooting since the floors are also destroyed by beams, and the lower-right floor in the big room with the tube, which is optional.  I would say it has less of that than upper norfair, and far less than the wrecked ship.   

[Chozo Ghost]

I don't understand your criticism. I've played and beaten Super Metroid probably a dozen times and never got frustrated or quit the game. I understand what you're saying about the tricky jumps, but it never made me throw the controller down in frustration. My advice is for you to go to GameFAQS or something simialr and find out where you need to go and how to pull it all off. Once you've found everything the first time its kinda like riding a bicycle because you'll never forget. I haven't played it in a long time, but I'm sure if I did now I would be able to find all the hidden powerups without a problem. I think the first time I played I might have had the help of Nintendo Power to get me through.

[Chozo Ghost]

BTW, you say you have a problem with the water level? One thing that comes to mind immediately is I remember there's a part where you're in a glass tunnel underwater and I remember you can shoot it with a missile (or perhaps its a super missile) and that will shatter the tube and then you can get to areas there where you normally couldn't. I don't know if you already knew that or not, but I hope it helps.

[broodwars]

BTW, you say you have a problem with the water level? One thing that comes to mind immediately is I remember there's a part where you're in a glass tunnel underwater and I remember you can shoot it with a missile (or perhaps its a super missile) and that will shatter the tube and then you can get to areas there where you normally couldn't. I don't know if you already knew that or not, but I hope it helps.

Yeah, I beat the game earlier today.  Besides, that part of Super Metroid has been repeated in the Metroid games that followed it, so I knew to do it already.

[DAaaMan64]

I can't believe all you cynics are not judging this game without even playing. You guys suck.

This is an new, all different, Metroid that features the most story development of any Metroid game ever.  The gameplay has taken an all new direction, focusing on action and combat. Stop being such assholes about new directions and materials and JUST PLAY THE GAME YOURSELF.

It has great cinema, excellent graphics, awesome fun parts, AND TONS OF SURPRISES.  Its all new and its great.  It might have some frustrations, but give me brake, play it. Its worth your time.


I'd say, overall, I loved the game. I got pissed off at it, there are some unfair parts but, its just a good game. I mean, I beat it voluntarily in less than 3 days. haha

[broodwars]

I can't believe all you cynics are not judging this game without even playing. You guys suck.

This is an new, all different, Metroid that features the most story development of any Metroid game ever.  The gameplay has taken an all new direction, focusing on action and combat. Stop being such assholes about new directions and materials and JUST PLAY THE GAME YOURSELF.

It has great cinema, excellent graphics, awesome fun parts, AND TONS OF SURPRISES.  Its all new and its great.  It might have some frustrations, but give me brake, play it. Its worth your time.


I'd say, overall, I loved the game. I got pissed off at it, there are some unfair parts but, its just a good game. I mean, I beat it voluntarily in less than 3 days. haha

Uh, last time I checked, no one here (not even me, and other than issues with the lack of choice with the controls I haven't really said much on the game) was pre-judging the game, just commenting on reviews and what seems to be the general consensus of them.

[Adrock]

and although I think the events of the final battle are just as overblown in the fan community as the death of a certain flower girl, it is handled well.

Dude, it was cool as sh*t in 1994. You had to be there.

[broodwars]

and although I think the events of the final battle are just as overblown in the fan community as the death of a certain flower girl, it is handled well.

Dude, it was cool as sh*t in 1994. You had to be there.

*shrugs*

IMO, it probably would have meant more if we had seen the Baby Metroid more in the rest of the game, much like what they did with the SA-X in Metroid Fusion.  Most people probably never played Metroid 2, so it's already a little odd to care about the little thing starting off in Super Metroid.  Then you literally see nothing about the Baby metroid till the very end of the game, and then suddenly I'm expected to care about its fate (especially after it had already attacked me).  It's a cool moment in context, but people really blow it out of proportion and I think it could have been woven into the overall story much better.

Incidentally, I was a little amused when I started Super Metroid to see that (much like in Other M and Metroid Fusion) Samus had an opening monologue detailing the first 2 Metroid games.  I had forgotten that was in the game.  Despite the monologue being written more than a decade earlier than Other M's, though, I was amused to see that it is much better written (with no moaning about "THE BABY!") than what I've seen and heard of Other M's opening monologue.

[GoldenPhoenix]

and although I think the events of the final battle are just as overblown in the fan community as the death of a certain flower girl, it is handled well.

Dude, it was cool as sh*t in 1994. You had to be there.

I agree, the end sequence is still amazing. I didn't play Super Metroid until 2 or 3 years after it was released and never touched Metroid 2, and yet I found the final sequence quite emotional.

About Metroid: Other M the way I see the sexism complaints is that it can't be any worse then rewarding the player by showing Samus in minimal clothing for beating the game with all the items in the quickiest way possible. I'm just glad they are trying to flesh her out as a character, it is a promising step by Nintendo, maybe we'll see more of it in the future.

[Adrock]

I think it could have been woven into the overall story much better.

What overall story? The Space Pirates steal the baby Metroid. Samus goes to retrieve it. I thought not seeing the baby Metroid until the very end of the game was the entire point. That's why Samus is running all over Zebes.

About Metroid: Other M the way I see the sexism complaints is that it can't be any worse then rewarding the player by showing Samus in minimal clothing for beating the game with all the items in the quickiest way possible.

People are kicking up a fuss because Samus chooses to follow orders from a man as opposed to blow everything up with all of her fancy weapons. If her CO was a woman, she'd probably do the same thing so I don't buy that as sexist at all. If anything, I'm more offended by the poor plot device preventing me/Samus from blowing the sh*t out of things early in the game even though I understand why.

There also a part later in the game where Ridley comes in and Adam has to save Samus. I feel that's more poor character development than anything because it's so illogical in so many ways. It didn't need to be a man in that instance, it just happened to be. Granted, I would like to play the game to truly judge this scene but based on what I've read, I don't find it to be sexist either. Mario games are far more sexist...

[GoldenPhoenix]

What overall story? The Space Pirates steal the baby Metroid. Samus goes to retrieve it. I thought not seeing the baby Metroid until the very end of the game was the entire point. That's why Samus is running all over Zebes.

Right, it was the entire point. Not to mention it would have made little sense to have the Baby Metroid in other segments of the game. Mother Brain would want to keep the baby Metroid, the primary source to creating other Metroids close by.

[balzzzy]

People are kicking up a fuss because Samus chooses to follow orders from a man as opposed to blow everything up with all of her fancy weapons. If her CO was a woman, she'd probably do the same thing so I don't buy that as sexist at all.

IMO, it's not the fact that a man gives her the authorization to use her abilities, it's the fact that she does it because??? Because she doesn't want to upset him even though he calls her an outsider? She wants to regain respect? Seriously, what is the explanation. It just doesn't feel the same as finding the things I worked so hard to gain. In this game he technically isn't her CO. And the fact that he locks rooms that you had access to before, even though you have the authorized ability to gain those items you found earlier, and quite possibly need...tough. The other part of the story is behind that door and you haven't finished a certain other event elsewhere. This made it feel more linear like Fusion, but a little more linear than Fusion.

[FZeroBoyo]

Any word on that "Being Able to Use Nunchuk" Power-Up? =D

On a not-so-light note, it seems that this game is starting up quite a debate on Samus' character here. One can't help but wonder if Nintendo will keep it that way or return her to her "former glory". Hey RFN crew, you have an idea for a discussion later on!

[broodwars]

Any word on that "Being Able to Use Nunchuk" Power-Up? =D

On a not-so-light note, it seems that this game is starting up quite a debate on Samus' character here. One can't help but wonder if Nintendo will keep it that way or return her to her "former glory". Hey RFN crew, you have an idea for a discussion later on!

I agree.  I eagerly look forward to RFN's discussion of this game (especially Jonny's perspective), because it's pretty obvious that Nintendo (or at least Sakamoto) is trying to take Samus' character in a completely different direction...one that, if it plays out like it has been discussed so far, I don't approve of.  The Zero Suit was a bad enough blatant ploy to make Metroid attractive to Japanese perverts, but to see Samus like this now...well, I'll have to see for myself just how it plays out in-game.

[Halbred]

Initial review done, but it's too raw. I'm gonna re-write tomorrow, and it will be up before you all run out and buy the game.

The story is unbelievably bad. It throws every bad sci-fi cliche in a blender and out pops...crap. You can't even get all the power-ups during the story mode, because the game forces you down a set path (worse than Fusion). Let's put it this way: the main story mode is the developer's way of forcing you to watch their awful, cutscene-laden story. You will stop caring the second Samus says "the Deleter."

FORTUNATELY, after beating the game, Samus actually returns to the Bottle Ship, and you can explore the entire ship AT YOUR LEISURE with all your power-ups available. Now you can get all the items you couldn't before, there's actually a second ending (that's better), and at least one absolutely wonderful bit of fanservice during that particular sequence.

Get through the terrible story mode for the wonderful post-game stuff.

[Adrock]

IMO, it's not the fact that a man gives her the authorization to use her abilities, it's the fact that she does it because??? Because she doesn't want to upset him even though he calls her an outsider? She wants to regain respect? Seriously, what is the explanation.

I'm assuming the game addresses this. Without having played the game, I'd assume the explanation is that, as a Galactic Federation army (?) deserter, Samus wants to prove her worth to her former CO which, in part, entails following orders such as authorization to use heavier weaponry. Still, and more to the point, that's not inherently sexist. That's just terrible writing. It has less to do with Adam being a man than it does Adam being her former superior.

[broodwars]

Initial review done, but it's too raw. I'm gonna re-write tomorrow, and it will be up before you all run out and buy the game.

The story is unbelievably bad. It throws every bad sci-fi cliche in a blender and out pops...crap. You can't even get all the power-ups during the story mode, because the game forces you down a set path (worse than Fusion). Let's put it this way: the main story mode is the developer's way of forcing you to watch their awful, cutscene-laden story. You will stop caring the second Samus says "the Deleter."

FORTUNATELY, after beating the game, Samus actually returns to the Bottle Ship, and you can explore the entire ship AT YOUR LEISURE with all your power-ups available. Now you can get all the items you couldn't before, there's actually a second ending (that's better), and at least one absolutely wonderful bit of fanservice during that particular sequence.

Get through the terrible story mode for the wonderful post-game stuff.

Without spoiling anything, Halbred, are there any nods to the Prime series in the game?  I wouldn't expect there would be given Sakamoto's seeming indifference to them, but you do mention fanservice....

[Luigi Dude]

I'm assuming the game addresses this. Without having played the game, I'd assume the explanation is that, as a Galactic Federation army (?) deserter, Samus wants to prove her worth to her former CO which, in part, entails following orders such as authorization to use heavier weaponry. Still, and more to the point, that's not inherently sexist. That's just terrible writing. It has less to do with Adam being a man than it does Adam being her former superior.

Even though I haven't played the game from the sound of everything I've read, Samus relationship with Adam sounds like your typical Japanese student/teacher cliche where the student has the greatest respect for their teacher and will do anything to honor them, even if they haven't seen said teacher for many years.  This happens all the time in Japanese movies and anime where you can have a character who can be an ultra manly badass but as soon as they meet their former mentor the character will suddenly become a lot more humble and polite and do whatever they can to impress them.

Hell, sometimes their former teacher will turn out to be an evil bastard who's responsible for the death of thousands of people and yet the hero will still not want to fight them because they still have some respect for them.  Even if said hero has had no problem killing other evil villains who haven't even done things anywhere close to what the former teacher has.

So yeah in the end it's not sexism, but just a Japanese student/teacher cliche that many Japanese made stories have.

[Halbred]

Initial review done, but it's too raw. I'm gonna re-write tomorrow, and it will be up before you all run out and buy the game.

The story is unbelievably bad. It throws every bad sci-fi cliche in a blender and out pops...crap. You can't even get all the power-ups during the story mode, because the game forces you down a set path (worse than Fusion). Let's put it this way: the main story mode is the developer's way of forcing you to watch their awful, cutscene-laden story. You will stop caring the second Samus says "the Deleter."

FORTUNATELY, after beating the game, Samus actually returns to the Bottle Ship, and you can explore the entire ship AT YOUR LEISURE with all your power-ups available. Now you can get all the items you couldn't before, there's actually a second ending (that's better), and at least one absolutely wonderful bit of fanservice during that particular sequence.

Get through the terrible story mode for the wonderful post-game stuff.

Without spoiling anything, Halbred, are there any nods to the Prime series in the game?  I wouldn't expect there would be given Sakamoto's seeming indifference to them, but you do mention fanservice....

Not that I've seen, sadly. What fanservice there is (and there's a fail amount) references the other 2D games.