Topic: IMPRESSIONS: Wii de Asobu Metroid Prime

[Rize]

So the fact that the new controls feel better and more intuitive don't win you over?

I didn't realize that the "feel" of the new control system could be considered a fact.  It seems more like opinion to me.  As for my opinion of it, I would argue that it feels worse.  It requires a lot more physical effort to use the Wii control system considering that the precise location of your wrist determines your aim and movement as opposed to the location of your thumb).  It's not like Metroid Prime wasn't eminently playable with its original control scheme.  In fact, the distinct flavor of MP's controls is part of the appeal for me.  I would be more interested in buying a copy of Corruption that allowed the use of the GameCube controller than this.

As for intuitiveness, the new system might be more intuitive (that could be measured at least), but even if it is that doesn't mean much to me considering I've played the original game through at least 5 times (not to mention it's sequel 3 or 4 times) and have already mastered the old control system.  However, I never said Nintendo shouldn't be doing this, but that they should include the original control schemes in deference to people who prefer them but would like the advantage of the new wide-screen mode.  Really, is that too much to ask?

The point of these re-releases is to play classic games with enhanced Wii controls. If you want to play them with the GC controller, play the original releases.

Don't worry, I will.

[Plugabugz]

This was in the original Euro (and maybe Japanese version), but all narration was silenced for the American version.  Thankfully.

Yeah my copy does it. the beginning few seconds you almost expect Patrick Stewart to launch in with SPACE. THE FINAL FRONTIER.

[Ian Sane]

So the fact that the new controls feel better and more intuitive don't win you over? The point of these re-releases is to play classic games with enhanced Wii controls. If you want to play them with the GC controller, play the original releases.

I thought the point of these re-releases was so that Nintendo could sell a product without the expense of making a new game? 

There's no point in not having the option for the old controls since the game was designed for it in the first place.  I suspect Nintendo doesn't do it to emphasize the remote.  They want the Wii controls to be seen as superior but if the original controls are an option people might try both and find they like the original controls better.  Uh oh!  "I should have just got the Cube version if the controls aren't improved!"  Removing the option ensures that the remote will be seen as superior because most people won't be able to make a direct comparison.  And the new controls have to be considered superior if these re-releases are to be seen as worthwhile and not a rip-off.  They did the same thing with Twilight Princess where the Wii was a new system and the remote concept had to be "proven" to justify buying a new console for Zelda when one could just have bought it for the Cube for less money.

[GoldenPhoenix]

Funny I thought most bought Wii for Wii Sports not Zelda. Silly me.

[Ian Sane]

Funny I thought most bought Wii for Wii Sports not Zelda. Silly me.

You know that NOW but Nintendo didn't know exactly what was going to happen then.  They clearly moved Zelda to the Wii launch in hope that it would help sell systems, probably because they were taking a risk with Wii Sports and wanted a safety net.  In the end Wii Sports was a huge hit and Zelda didn't necessarily have to be there but Nintendo clearly felt that Zelda had to help sell the Wii concept.  Off topic though.

[TheYoungerPlumber]

TYP, is there any other content added to this game like the space pirate side-story that was revealed some time ago?

I have seen nothing to suggest this such an addition. If you're talking about additional things to scan for backstory, I'm afraid I'm not capable of determining that with my limited Japanese. (Besides, I didn't feel like reading through stuff I scanned anyway.)

[NWR_pap64]

So the fact that the new controls feel better and more intuitive don't win you over?

I didn't realize that the "feel" of the new control system could be considered a fact.  It seems more like opinion to me.  As for my opinion of it, I would argue that it feels worse.  It requires a lot more physical effort to use the Wii control system considering that the precise location of your wrist determines your aim and movement as opposed to the location of your thumb).  It's not like Metroid Prime wasn't eminently playable with its original control scheme.  In fact, the distinct flavor of MP's controls is part of the appeal for me.  I would be more interested in buying a copy of Corruption that allowed the use of the GameCube controller than this.

As for intuitiveness, the new system might be more intuitive (that could be measured at least), but even if it is that doesn't mean much to me considering I've played the original game through at least 5 times (not to mention it's sequel 3 or 4 times) and have already mastered the old control system.  However, I never said Nintendo shouldn't be doing this, but that they should include the original control schemes in deference to people who prefer them but would like the advantage of the new wide-screen mode.  Really, is that too much to ask?

The point of these re-releases is to play classic games with enhanced Wii controls. If you want to play them with the GC controller, play the original releases.

Don't worry, I will.

Umm...physical effort?

I would understand this if it was Wii Sports, Wii Fit or even something like "Mario and Sonic at the Olympic Games" which requires intense waggle. But Metroid Prime?

I won't argue this since this is basically a matter of personal preference. But saying it requires a lot of physical effort when its pretty basic compared to other titles out there is exaggerating, in my honest opinion.

[NinGurl69 *huggles]

I hope the whole "Wii de Ass-o-poo" series bombs.  But curse Nintendo for actually marketting this ****.  I didn't see any extensive video/ad campaigns (tv, internet or whatever) for early non-first party Wii stuff like BWii.  ****ing double standards within its own publishing structure.

Yeah, you do realize that Battalion Wars 2 is a first party game? Nintendo owned and published.

If you don't like the series, fine. Plenty of other people (including me) are interested in playing these games again in an improved form. Some of them of are also cheaper than buying used GameCube versions (Mario Power Tennis is like $35 used).

BWii was made by a 3rd party developer in a franchise Nintendo didn't conceive, like Geist.  Not first party, more like a second party, definitely not supported like Nintendo's other forgettable first party projects.

[Rize]

Umm...physical effort?

I would understand this if it was Wii Sports, Wii Fit or even something like "Mario and Sonic at the Olympic Games" which requires intense waggle. But Metroid Prime?

I won't argue this since this is basically a matter of personal preference. But saying it requires a lot of physical effort when its pretty basic compared to other titles out there is exaggerating, in my honest opinion.

I don't know about you, but I'm just about twenty nine, and my job has me working on computers all day long.  Because of that and because of two years worth of Diablo II several years back, I have mild carpal tunnel syndrome.  To be honest, yes the physical effort of using my wrist to play Corruption for several hours at a time irritates my mild carpal tunnel problems (first and foremost) and even barring the carpal tunnel issue, definitely requires noticeably more effort than using an analog stick.  Maybe I'm just getting old.

[NinGurl69 *huggles]

Maybe just old already and need some Wii Fitting.  Take breaks every 15 minutes, stretch your joints regularly and all that good stuff.

~~~~~

Going 28, on computers 16 hours a day (work+home), try to squeeze in some Kung Fuing and Wii Kart and other carpal tunnel Wii gaming during the week, and doing fine save for these NWR visits.

[Plugabugz]

BWii was made by a 3rd party developer in a franchise Nintendo didn't conceive, like Geist.  Not first party, more like a second party, definitely not supported like Nintendo's other forgettable first party projects.

Wii Chess defeats your BWii with vinegar.

[TheYoungerPlumber]

Disappointment over no GameCube support is reasonable, but I must say I'm surprised at the intense negativity regarding Corruption's control scheme! I'll let you know if I somehow magically stumble on an unlockable GC controller mode, but no menu options jump out at me, and it isn't on the back of the box.

[Ian Sane]

I have similar carpal tunnel syndrome issues that Rize has.  And I play guitar as well just to add to the wrist destruction.  It is more physically demanding than conventional controls.

But with Corruption I just personally don't like as much how I have to aim and stuff.  I didn't have to do that before and now suddenly I have to?  Well that's lame.  And again who does it cater to?  The close-minded rubes who want it to play like DOOM.  Meanwhile I'm more used to adventure games and suddenly a sequel to an adventure series that I enjoyed now requires me to have FPS skills which I don't really have.  I, the fan, am effectively punished while the non-fan, who is only a non-fan because he's a biased moron, is rewarded.

I do think an FPS that uses similar controls would work really well though.  And I would be more willing to take the effort to master them since in that case I would be the outsider trying something out of his comfort zone instead of the established fan wondering why the game is no longer designed for him.

Though the inaccuracy of the remote has always been my beef with it.  If the classic or Gamecube controller is an option I always use it because it's much more accurate and responsive.

[Mop it up]

What I wonder is if this game is going to be easier with the new control scheme. It wasn't designed with free-look in mind, the original control style didn't have that. Enemies were placed in places within your field of vision so you could quickly lock-on to them, since you couldn't really look up or down (easily).

The difficulty selection being available at the start makes me wonder... Might the "hard" mode actually be the "normal" mode of the first game, and the "normal" mode is now an "easy" mode? If there's some sort of "super hard" difficulty unlocked through completion, that might answer this question.

[NinGurl69 *huggles]

Maybe TYP could compare the amount of damage it takes to kill certain enemies or bosses, and compare to the classic version.

[TheYoungerPlumber]

Sadly my GC copy is at home in the US. I might be able to do a followup on your side by side difficulty q in two months when my parents visit.

No garuntees the NA and Japanese versions have ever had the same difficulty, though.

[Mop it up]

Forget that, just buy the JPN version of the GameCube original.

J/k. I'm sure somebody will look into this once the game is released in North America. I don't know when that's going to be though.

[TJ Spyke]

BWii was made by a 3rd party developer in a franchise Nintendo didn't conceive, like Geist.  Not first party, more like a second party, definitely not supported like Nintendo's other forgettable first party projects.

Sigh, please do some research before making such claims. Battalion Wars is part of the long running "Wars" series from Nintendo (in fact, Battalion Wars was originally gonna be called "Advance Wars: Under Fire"). Being developed by a third party studio doesn't mean squat. That would be like saying the Mario Party games are third party, or most of the Mario sports games. The game is first party, plain and simple. Part of a long running IP owned by Nintendo and published by Nintendo.

[NinGurl69 *huggles]

Sadly my GC copy is at home in the US. I might be able to do a followup on your side by side difficulty q in two months when my parents visit.

No garuntees the NA and Japanese versions have ever had the same difficulty, though.

Funny you mention that, cuz in my mind Japan has gone soft, while the USA has gone casual.  How the difficulty modes compare is a curiosity.

How about this, tell me how many basic Power Beam shots it takes to kill the first bug on Tallon IV in the different modes on Wii?

[Ian Sane]

Sigh, please do some research before making such claims. Battalion Wars is part of the long running "Wars" series from Nintendo (in fact, Battalion Wars was originally gonna be called "Advance Wars: Under Fire").

Does anyone actually consider them part of the same series?  I remember when the game was revealed as "Advance Wars" but there was some flack that it was quite clearly NOT an Advance Wars games since it had completely different gameplay and was made by a different dev.  I always assumed Nintendo changed the name to avoid complaints like that.

In North America it seems quite clearly that "Advance Wars" is the name for the series overall anyway.

[NinGurl69 *huggles]

BWii was made by a 3rd party developer in a franchise Nintendo didn't conceive, like Geist.  Not first party, more like a second party, definitely not supported like Nintendo's other forgettable first party projects.

Sigh, please do some research before making such claims. Battalion Wars is part of the long running "Wars" series from Nintendo (in fact, Battalion Wars was originally gonna be called "Advance Wars: Under Fire"). Being developed by a third party studio doesn't mean squat. That would be like saying the Mario Party games are third party, or most of the Mario sports games. The game is first party, plain and simple. Part of a long running IP owned by Nintendo and published by Nintendo.

I know the old name (hell, i have the E3 press DVDs that contain the old trailers), big deal, shoehorning it into Advance Wars universe didn't work out, and this particular actiony war concept wasn't something Nintendo wrapped their own heads around.  All those other games you mention are fine and dandy cuz they're largely projects Nintendo started first (I assume) then sought a developer to hire, not a developer coming from left field to pitch an idea to Nintendo hoping to get pub support.

Let BWii be that first party title it is.  Doesn't change how it's not a collaboration with Nintendo's usual Japanese suspects/partners and got poorly treated by its casual-game-making parent publisher leading up to and after release.

But now I'm less surprised at Nintendo as I remind myself of the arse pudding lasagna that was Metroid Prime 3's hype non-campaign.

[Caliban]

TYP, is there any other content added to this game like the space pirate side-story that was revealed some time ago?

I have seen nothing to suggest this such an addition. If you're talking about additional things to scan for backstory, I'm afraid I'm not capable of determining that with my limited Japanese. (Besides, I didn't feel like reading through stuff I scanned anyway.)

It's cool. I'm certain more information will be released, or posted in the coming months until its release in North America.

[Rize]

I have similar carpal tunnel syndrome issues that Rize has.  And I play guitar as well just to add to the wrist destruction.  It is more physically demanding than conventional controls.

Even more similar than you realize since I also play guitar (and drums).  Although I've honestly never felt that bother my carpal tunnel (well, I take it back, standing and playing guitar bothers my carpal tunnel but I never play guitar on stage/standing anymore).  Playing guitar instead is going to give me early onset arthritis in the fingers (but not my thumbs).

[Shecky]

The final boss was the worst part of MP, it was more fighting the control (and the insane visor/weapon switching) instead of the actual enemy.  It'd be interesting to see how that battle handles with this control scheme...

[TJ Spyke]

Does anyone actually consider them part of the same series?  I remember when the game was revealed as "Advance Wars" but there was some flack that it was quite clearly NOT an Advance Wars games since it had completely different gameplay and was made by a different dev.  I always assumed Nintendo changed the name to avoid complaints like that.

In North America it seems quite clearly that "Advance Wars" is the name for the series overall anyway.

I think most people assume that is why Nintendo changed the name, to avoid having it compared to the handheld games. I was just trying to point out that they are still technically part of the same series as the Advance Wars games.