Topic: Mafia XXIX: "It's the Great Pumpkin (Mafia), Charlie Brown" Day 4

[stevey]

Yep, I'm gonna call the game. There's no way for the townies to win if Toruresu's voting with the mafia.

But there was a way to win. A nearly sure-fire way. And for awhile today, the townies were on the right track. I'll post this strategy later on. Unfortunately, none of the townies used their powers to their full potential... not even close. And that's turned out to be the real difference with this game.

I'll put up a story here soon...

Cheater!!!! Just have 1 more day I can still kill the bastard Khushrenada!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[BeautifulShy]

Yikes!!! What caused stevey to have this animosity towards Khushrenada?

[NWR_DrewMG]

I've been on the other side of a Khush scheme.  I know how infuriating it can be. 

[stevey]

It's a Halloween mafia, if is doesn't go on till at lease Halloween it is fail! (I can still change Toruresu mind, just give me a few hours! Nothing official yet according to the rules; Don't change the rules half way!!!! )

[Dasmos]

Yikes!!! What caused stevey to have this animosity towards Khushrenada?

You haven't played against Khush have you?

[decoyman]

Hmm... there are a few ways this could be turned around, but all of them would hinge on Toruresu re-backstabbing the mafia. I kinda doubt that'd happen, when he's about to win.

Look, Stevey, tomorrow's Halloween. I'll post the story in the morning, deal?

[Spak-Spang]

Wow, I know I am dead, but the game is over now....basically.

Look, it would have been easy to win for the townies.

Today if you had killed Khush you would have only 2 mafia members left and only lost 1 townie...you have a large advantage.
Now all you need to do is kill the final 2 mafia.  Guess what you know one of them.  Well, you had clues to both of them.  And some people flat out knew who they were.

If you killed the right mafia member first (Sally) then it would be easy to when because all you had to do was take out Lucy and you only lose half the townies...but kill the last mafia and avoid a hit.

This game was EASY TO WIN once you got rid of the mafia investigator and Great Pumpkin.

Toruresu you betrayed the townies worse than I did when I sided with thatguy, because there was a way to win, you just didn't look for it...you decided to take the easy way out.  Sad, because you had the power.  Heck you knew the mafia godfather early, you could have canceled mafia votes, and possibly actions.

**sigh** 

This game ended poorly.

[that Baby guy]

If the game's called, I'm talking.

In the first three days, the townies took out two mafia members and had another on their list.  Regardless of abilities, where Charlie Brown's and PigPen's are useless to the mafia, we had RAB sit by, which wasn't his fault, it's not that he wasn't playing, it was that he wasn't able to be online.

Still, had abilities run perfectly, we'd have a similar scenario.  At the start of day four, two mafia members would likely be dead, we normally wouldn't have had the the Great Pumpkin.  If the townies worked together, their only real bet would be to try to create the situation in which Sally would defect to the townie side.  However, that's an unlikely scenario, as the townies would need to quickly pinpoint the right roles, mafia and townie alike, and kill them.  I don't see this "potential," as it would require much, much more guesswork.

This was the mafia's game to lose, to be honest.  If you just think of the fact that in three days, two mafia members died, and yet the fourth day was hopeless from essentially the start, I would not say it was balanced, no matter how the townies used their roles.

[stevey]

The mafia relieved themselves and all their roles, Toruresu can win either way but with the townie; He won't die on day 1 for the next 15 mafia games!

[Dasmos]

If we killed Sally then Schroeder would go over to the mafia, Spak.

[BeautifulShy]

Yikes!!! What caused stevey to have this animosity towards Khushrenada?

You haven't played against Khush have you?

No I haven't but this game how he planned everything I can see how I would have trouble.

[BeautifulShy]

If we killed Sally then Schroeder would go over to the mafia, Spak.

Yep and you would have The Godfather, a bomb and someone could alter votes. In that scenario I don't think it would be possible to win.

[Khushrenada]

Dasmos said what I was going to say. You can't save Lucy last or Toru would have to become mafia.

Second, with Sally, we could block Toru every time and therefore townies would be forced to vote high for the bomber.

Third, none of the mafia's actions would be blocked.

[decoyman]

I'm going to post some of my ideas here that show how powerful the townie roles could've been.

Pig-pen - potentially invincible. could've put himself out there as the leader of the townies. Would the mafia risk having a failed hit, or try an easier target? That'd be a risk I'd be willing to take...

Schroeder - most powerful townie role in the game, and used his power... once before traitorizing. As you saw in today's thread, he had the power to swing a vote one way or another by three votes! In what could've been the play of the game, which he could've done just tonight mind you - the conditions were perfect for it, he could've changed one mafia member's vote to the bomber, and potentially taken out two mafia members in one fell swoop.

Charlie Brown - could've used his role to prove himself to townies... ("prove you're CB" - Ok, I'll put "______" in the message tomorrow. That'll confirm it, and you can trust me), or give out messages that were too risky to say in person. Actually, vudu did a little of that towards the end. Too bad it was all wrong.

Peppermint Patty - made one rather reckless hit that just happened to be really lucky. But that's partly by design. If you just play the numbers game, odds are really good that you're going to either hit a protected townie, at which point a guaranteed alliance could have been formed, or a mafia member. It's telling that the one time you used your hit, you got a (future) mafia member.

Townies could've taken this game over today. I worked out an endgame for a lot of different options... the townies had options. Quite a few of them, actually. But that went down when Toru took the easy way out. As you can see, games get broken when people don't play to their allegiances.

Edit: Hmm... I should mention, I don't mean to take anything away from the mafia here. You guys played a well-planned, devious, strategic, game. You played your roles to their full potentials, I thought, and you deserve the win. Khush, the mastermind, congratulations. I'm mostly just disappointed that we didn't get to see some of the fireworks that could've happened between the two sides. That's all.

[stevey]

The worst part is I KNEW Khush, GP, and DrewMG were mafia at the start of day 4! My gut was yelling at Gp being the bomber and Khush the godfather. I didn't have any proof so I sat on it and lost. This always happen too, it's like the 7 one I lost this way....


PS When I say Khush is evil, kill him!

[vudu]

And if Sally took thatguy's deal and betrayed the mafia, would you call him a dirty traitor too?

It's all in the rules.

You'll notice I never tried to court Sally.  Sally is a mafia member until everyone else dies.  It's not part of the role to betray her comrades.

As decoyman himself said about the Great Pumpkin role, on day 3 the townie would become a mafia member.  At that point he would have to forgo any bonds he had formed with his prior team and play for the mafia.  This is the exact same thing in reverse.

[vudu]

Charlie Brown - could've used his role to prove himself to townies... ("prove you're CB" - Ok, I'll put "______" in the message tomorrow. That'll confirm it, and you can trust me), or give out messages that were too risky to say in person. Actually, vudu did a little of that towards the end. Too bad it was all wrong.

I thought about this but ultimately decided it was pointless.  On day 1 we knew all the important townie roles.  It would have accomplished nothing.

[Khushrenada]

Oh and for anyone wondering, the plan tomorrow was to for all of the mafia to vote out DrewMG including DrewMG himself. With Toruresu's help, we control the vote so you couldn't have stopped it. Thus, Sally is voted out, I hit Nickmitch and Schroeder becomes Mafia with Lucy being the only female role left.

Day 6 begins with 3 townies and 3 mafia left. A tie going to the mafia. Game over. Torurseu wins along with the mafia and thus his betrayal was never stupid.

As regards what Spak said, not to try to make you feel bad, but Toruresu's betrayal was not as bad as yours. Toruresu's betrayal gave him a win and was part of his role to be able to join the mafia. Your betrayal did nothing for you since you did not get to share in the win and it went against your role of voting out mafia members. But let's not discuss that anymore.

[that Baby guy]

Peppermint Patty - made one rather reckless hit that just happened to be really lucky. But that's partly by design. If you just play the numbers game, odds are really good that you're going to either hit a protected townie, at which point a guaranteed alliance could have been formed, or a mafia member. It's telling that the one time you used your hit, you got a (future) mafia member.

I think that assertion is nullified by the fact that my ability was blocked day 2 and 3.

[decoyman]

Charlie Brown - could've used his role to prove himself to townies... ("prove you're CB" - Ok, I'll put "______" in the message tomorrow. That'll confirm it, and you can trust me), or give out messages that were too risky to say in person. Actually, vudu did a little of that towards the end. Too bad it was all wrong.

I thought about this but ultimately decided it was pointless.  On day 1 we knew all the important townie roles.  It would have accomplished nothing.

Yeah, your role wasn't anything amazing... I just thought it was kind of appropriate for somewhat bumbling and ineffective Charlie Brown. Your "passive" powers (potentially recruiting Sally, invincible to Peppermint Patty's hits) were more important.

[stevey]

I shall see to it that Toruresu will never get to fully play another mafia game ever, YOU WILL DIE ON DAY 1 FROM HERE ON OUT!!!!

VENDATTA!

[Toruresu]

[Khushrenada]

I'm going to post some of my ideas here that show how powerful the townie roles could've been.

Pig-pen - potentially invincible. could've put himself out there as the leader of the townies. Would the mafia risk having a failed hit, or try an easier target? That'd be a risk I'd be willing to take...

Schroeder - most powerful townie role in the game, and used his power... once before traitorizing. As you saw in today's thread, he had the power to swing a vote one way or another by three votes! In what could've been the play of the game, which he could've done just tonight mind you - the conditions were perfect for it, he could've changed one mafia member's vote to the bomber, and potentially taken out two mafia members in one fell swoop.

Charlie Brown - could've used his role to prove himself to townies... ("prove you're CB" - Ok, I'll put "______" in the message tomorrow. That'll confirm it, and you can trust me), or give out messages that were too risky to say in person. Actually, vudu did a little of that towards the end. Too bad it was all wrong.

Peppermint Patty - made one rather reckless hit that just happened to be really lucky. But that's partly by design. If you just play the numbers game, odds are really good that you're going to either hit a protected townie, at which point a guaranteed alliance could have been formed, or a mafia member. It's telling that the one time you used your hit, you got a (future) mafia member.

Townies could've taken this game over today. I worked out an endgame for a lot of different options... the townies had options. Quite a few of them, actually. But that went down when Toru took the easy way out. As you can see, games get broken when people don't play to their allegiances.

Edit: Hmm... I should mention, I don't mean to take anything away from the mafia here. You guys played a well-planned, devious, strategic, game. You played your roles to their full potentials, I thought, and you deserve the win. Khush, the mastermind, congratulations. I'm mostly just disappointed that we didn't get to see some of the fireworks that could've happened between the two sides. That's all.

Pig-Pen. Use Sally to block his ability. Mafia Hit.

Peppermint Patty. Use Sally to block ability. Mafia Hit.

Charlie Brown. Use Sally

Marcie. Use Sally

Schroeder. Use Sally. Or kill Marcie and Peppermint Patty, the two biggest mafia threats. Then kill Sally or wait for Schroeder to use his ability to do so and then join up as mafia.


The most powerful role in the game was Sally followed by the threat of a bomber.

This game was lost for the townies when Marcie was voted out. That did it. Peppermint Patty was thatguy. For any other mafia, thatguy would most likely have been either the first hit or investigation. Peppermint Patty was only going to get that first day hit.

[Dasmos]

lol, stevey.

[Khushrenada]

I shall see to it that Toruresu will never get to fully play another mafia game ever, YOU WILL DIE ON DAY 1 FROM HERE ON OUT!!!!

VENDATTA!

Yessssssss! I get to survive Day 1.