Author Topic: Ubisoft rationalizes their current support for Wii  (Read 30836 times)

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Offline GoldenPhoenix

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Ubisoft rationalizes their current support for Wii
« on: June 02, 2008, 08:33:39 PM »
I thought this would be best to have its own thread.

Here is the link to the post (Made in the ubisoft message board):

http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/9251049315/m/4081042366/p/3

Quote
The true of the matter is this, the Wii is a very different console than what most games developers are used to. The Wii has managed to make a huge success from having games on it that just would not work on a conventional console. The Wii has also managed to increase the market share to a huge group of people that are not that interested in gaming. With Wii Sports, Wii Fit and all manner of games built for family play, Nintendo know who they are marketing for and it is not die hard gamers. If you look at the most successful Wii games, they are not amazing new AAA games, they are predominantly family orientated games/alternative games.

Looking at the current UK games sales for Wii Wii Sales Link, there are not that many traditional games in the top 30. Trends are changing and not everyone wants a new action game, FPS game or epic RPG, sales of the Wii proves that the majority want something different.

Parents who are buying a console for their children do not really care about Prince of Persia, Rainbow Six or Far Cry on the box, they want games that are going to be good for their children and not get them in the local newspaper. Why else would games like Brain Training/Wii Fit/Mario Party sell in the millions if people wanted hardcore games?

Check the Nintendo DS figures in the UK as well. DS Sales Link. Notice whose name is listed there a few times but also notice which games are listed? We make games that will “hopefully” sell to a selected audience. We are a business after all, but Nintendo know which people are their market, just as Sony and Microsoft know who their markets are. Ubisoft have always been aimed at the more mature market (Look at our back catalogue) and in the last few years have started venturing into the casual gaming market. This is because that market now exists, thanks to the rise in popularity of the Wii and DS. The Wii is still a new console and it still has plenty of time to grow, Nintendo know this and Ubisoft know this.

As for Shaun Whites on the Wii, can you at least wait to get some more information and gameplay on it before binning it? Most people have seen a few screenshots and they already hate it because it does not look as good as the 360 etc but to damn a game just because of looks, and without actually playing it is just silly. All I have seen is various forums doing childish Photoshop screens, at least wait to see the game face to face before turning it into a humorous gif.

I'll flat out say this letter disgusts me and it confuses me at the same time. As we know Red Steel sold VERY well, so what happened to all those gamers that bought the (poor) Red Steel? Did they get eaten by the Sony/MS monster? What about those gamers who bought the RE games from Capcom? The market is there and frankly Ubisoft is bordering on ridiculous. Heaven forbid a 3rd Party Actually put resources in a game and advertise it a bit.
« Last Edit: June 03, 2008, 01:02:49 PM by GoldenPhoenix »
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Offline bustin98

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Re: Ubisoft rationalizes their current support for Wii
« Reply #1 on: June 02, 2008, 08:44:18 PM »
I would have thought a post about this issue would have come around sooner. The originating topic at Ubisoft has been locked. Various forums across the net has had PR Goons trying to do damage control. And every Wii and Nintendo fan who knows of the 'Crap-Casual' release schedule from Ubisoft has sworn off buying anything from Ubisoft.

Ubisoft made a giant blunder with the games they announced. I hope they suffer for it.

Offline GoldenPhoenix

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Re: Ubisoft rationalizes their current support for Wii
« Reply #2 on: June 02, 2008, 08:55:23 PM »
It is obvious the Wii has a very diverse base, just look at the sales for Smash Brothers Brawl, that alone proves there are millions of gamers out there who still want traditional games. It seems like Ubisoft is sticking their head up a Raving Rabbit behind and not realizing the market potential.
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Offline ShyGuy

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Re: Ubisoft rationalizes their current support for Wii
« Reply #3 on: June 02, 2008, 09:29:28 PM »
How come NWR doesn't get their own ubisoft pr goon?

I WILL BURN THIS MOTHER DOWN

by mother I mean Ubisoft, and by burn down I mean admonish on the internet

Offline Caliban

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Re: Ubisoft rationalizes their current support for Wii
« Reply #4 on: June 02, 2008, 10:34:01 PM »
I call upon bullshit from Ubisoft.

Offline Deguello

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Re: Ubisoft rationalizes their current support for Wii
« Reply #5 on: June 02, 2008, 11:09:26 PM »
I think their problems in this whole mess started when they painted the entire Wii userbase with a broad brush that does not include hardcore gamers.

It's the same thing a lot of third parties did with the GameCube, and they could mostly get away with it because the GameCube's userbase was small.

But this isn't the Gamecube, this is the Wii, the current and apparently future market leader in all regions (if VGchartz is a good enough metric) painting all of us Wii owners as wholly a bunch of grandmas, little girls, and casuals is ridiculous, as the giant backlash to these annoucement has shown.

Allow me to move the clock back.  There was a time in 2002 through 2004 that a popular Nintendo fanboy meme was to say that everybody who bought the PS2 only bought it for the DVD player.  This statement was usually met with scorn from an entire website or forum.  To paint the market leader with such a brush was asinine.  However " bad forum fanboyism" has apparently become "good company policy" for the Wii-deniers.  It's really sickening to watch.
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Offline mantidor

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Re: Ubisoft rationalizes their current support for Wii
« Reply #6 on: June 02, 2008, 11:35:23 PM »
Indeed. As fanboy mentality is expected but that actual companies inverting big bucks in gaming still have this mentality is almost inconceivable. How stupid can you get?
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Offline Kairon

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Re: Ubisoft rationalizes their current support for Wii
« Reply #7 on: June 03, 2008, 01:24:59 AM »
Boy, that PoP spinoff better be good or there'll be hell to pay.

....imagine the chaos if it's a PoP party game... *shudders*
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Offline GoldenPhoenix

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Re: Ubisoft rationalizes their current support for Wii
« Reply #8 on: June 03, 2008, 01:38:37 AM »
Boy, that PoP spinoff better be good or there'll be hell to pay.

....imagine the chaos if it's a PoP party game... *shudders*

Oh wow, don't say that! That sounds like something Ubisoft would do. To be honest I wouldn't mind if the spinoff was that remake they did for Xbox Live Arcade with new features, that was a really great game and I'd love to see an expanded version on the Wii. Knowing Ubisoft though we'll get PoP: Raving Arabs with camel riding mini games!
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Offline NinGurl69 *huggles

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Re: Ubisoft rationalizes their current support for Wii
« Reply #9 on: June 03, 2008, 01:41:46 AM »
LOL

LOL
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Offline BeautifulShy

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Re: Ubisoft rationalizes their current support for Wii
« Reply #10 on: June 03, 2008, 02:04:22 AM »
Is anybody else gonna boycott their stuff?
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Offline KDR_11k

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Re: Ubisoft rationalizes their current support for Wii
« Reply #11 on: June 03, 2008, 02:18:35 AM »
Quote
If you look at the most successful Wii games, they are not amazing new AAA games, they are predominantly family orientated games/alternative games.

I'm not even going to bother pointing at the tons of traditional franchise games Nintendo has successfully sold. This sentence really betrays their ignorance. Yes, Wii Fit and Sports are family oriented (though I'm not sure about "alternative") but if you think that means cheap it's no wonder you fail. Both of these are pretty much "AAA" quality (Wii Sports is somewhat small but then again it's a free bundle in most territories). Do you think Wii Fit would've sold as much if they had put a third rate team on it? They put freaking Shigeru Miyamoto on the job! Sure, it doesn't look like a hollywood movie but if you think that's the only thing defining AAA you're fucking stupid.

Casual games are serious business. Sure you can crap one out but so can thousands of others, good luck getting any sales then.

Offline NinGurl69 *huggles

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Re: Ubisoft rationalizes their current support for Wii
« Reply #12 on: June 03, 2008, 02:44:37 AM »
I got No More Heroes already, SO I'M GOOD.

Good riddance, ubi!
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Offline Plugabugz

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Re: Ubisoft rationalizes their current support for Wii
« Reply #13 on: June 03, 2008, 03:35:55 AM »
I love the way how they dumped everything on sales trends in the UK.

I forget that both Mario Kart, GTA 4 and No More Heroes impacted the charts here.

Offline Kairon

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Re: Ubisoft rationalizes their current support for Wii
« Reply #14 on: June 03, 2008, 03:56:30 AM »
Is anybody else gonna boycott their stuff?

I'm gonna buy EA instead.
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Offline Urkel

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Re: Ubisoft rationalizes their current support for Wii
« Reply #15 on: June 03, 2008, 05:40:34 AM »
What I find absolutely mind boggling is that at the start of this generation Ubi had Nintendo fans eating out of the palm of their hand, and then they pull this. And what was the point of apologizing and promising "Nintendo-like quality" if they had no intention of doing any such thing?

They're beyond the point of no return now. There's nothing they can do to regain their credibility with Nintendo fans.
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Offline GoldenPhoenix

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Re: Ubisoft rationalizes their current support for Wii
« Reply #16 on: June 03, 2008, 06:14:40 AM »
What I find absolutely mind boggling is that at the start of this generation Ubi had Nintendo fans eating out of the palm of their hand, and then they pull this. And what was the point of apologizing and promising "Nintendo-like quality" if they had no intention of doing any such thing?

They're beyond the point of no return now. There's nothing they can do to regain their credibility with Nintendo fans.

It is really too bad because I praised them for their support in the beginning but now it looks like they are taking that support those of us gave them, and are instead shoving it in our faces so they can fund PS3/Xbox 360 games.
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Offline Shift Key

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Re: Ubisoft rationalizes their current support for Wii
« Reply #17 on: June 03, 2008, 07:30:43 AM »
I'm just going to respond directly to this. There's so many things wrong with it, it deserves to be mocked. I don't even know if its authentic (it probably is, but even that's hard to fathom).

Quote
The true of the matter is this, the Wii is a very different console than what most games developers are used to.
Translation: We're used to Sony brand electronics. We are confused by this white thing and it always asking us to tighten the strap when we start playing it.

Quote
With Wii Sports, Wii Fit and all manner of games built for family play, Nintendo know who they are marketing for and it is not die hard gamers.
Translation: We're fairly certain the Nintendo class of hardcore gamer was dead and buried with their Gamecube. Any rumours of their existence will require our scientist team to investigate. We know the other hardcore fans survived the transition because GTA4 didn't bomb.

Quote
If you look at the most successful Wii games, they are not amazing new AAA games, they are predominantly family orientated games/alternative games.
Translation: Our games aren't successful. Our games aren't AAA class. Do you understand where we're coming from, or do I need to make use of this novelty hammer to convey the point?

Quote
Trends are changing and not everyone wants a new action game, FPS game or epic RPG, sales of the Wii proves that the majority want something different.
Translation: Only the hardcore gamers want a new action, FPS game or RPG. See that jump I just made? Of course not. You're too busy getting angry about BG&E not making it to Wii. Don't worry, we'll be making that for PS2 because it'll use the same graphics engine. Don't worry, Anciel doesn't know this either. He's gonna have a coronary. It'll be hilarious.

Quote
Parents who are buying a console for their children do not really care about Prince of Persia, Rainbow Six or Far Cry on the box, they want games that are going to be good for their children and not get them in the local newspaper. Why else would games like Brain Training/Wii Fit/Mario Party sell in the millions if people wanted hardcore games?
Translation: Here's the point in my argument where I paint every Wii owner as being a child or a parent buying it for a child. Watch as I continue to applaud Nintendo's Blue Ocan strategy, and then imply their strategy killed off the dinosaurs hardcore gamers. And I'll throw some of our beloved titles in there, because I know the Sony and MS fans are getting a kick out of reading this. All my sources say that Nintendo is a kiddy console, perhaps I can just say it out loud later.

Quote
We make games that will “hopefully” sell to a selected audience.
Translation: Oh man, I hope these games will sell well. Otherwise I'm gonna have someone's foot up my arse. Perhaps I should cover my arse for the next year? I'll ask a forum what I should do.

Quote
We are a business after all, but Nintendo know which people are their market, just as Sony and Microsoft know who their markets are.
Translation: We're being led around. I know this but I completely trust the people doing the leading. I mean, they're doing it for the gamers and not the money? Right?

Quote
Ubisoft have always been aimed at the more mature market (Look at our back catalogue) and in the last few years have started venturing into the casual gaming market. This is because that market now exists, thanks to the rise in popularity of the Wii and DS.
Translation: Oh ****, lets just make sure we stay away from this "casual" and "hardcore" talk; I'd hate to offend someone. My grandfather calls himself "more mature" rather than "old", lets use that instead.

But I don't like casual gamers, so don't worry about offending them. Just make sure that we appear to care about them. That'll keep them interested in us for long enough to make a profit on that terrible Dogz game. I didn't just say that out loud, did I?

Quote
The Wii is still a new console and it still has plenty of time to grow, Nintendo know this and Ubisoft know this.
Translation: Yep, we're in no rush to support this intimidating, tiny beast. The waggle itself requires our developers to attend therapy weekly. Its just so damn complicated.

Quote
As for Shaun Whites on the Wii, can you at least wait to get some more information and gameplay on it before binning it?
Translation: Where's the fucking PR company? I need good damage control. I can't control my angst for much longer.

Quote
Most people have seen a few screenshots and they already hate it because it does not look as good as the 360 etc but to damn a game just because of looks, and without actually playing it is just silly.
Translation: Why aren't you guys playing Wii Fit? I thought you were all casual gamers. After all, casual gamers don't hang around on forums and complain about games. That would make you hardcore gamers. Oh no, a conundrum.

Good thing I'm going to ignore it because you guys only like graphics, right? Go and get the 360 version. It'll make me look better.

Quote
All I have seen is various forums doing childish Photoshop screens, at least wait to see the game face to face before turning it into a humorous gif.
Translation: I wish I could photoshop. Cut that **** out, I'm envious.

Offline Strell

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Re: Ubisoft rationalizes their current support for Wii
« Reply #18 on: June 03, 2008, 08:53:42 AM »
That has to be about the most perfect deconstruction of corporate PR bullshit I've ever seen. 

"I wish I could photoshop.  Cut that **** out."

Haha, touche'.
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Offline Chozo Ghost

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Re: Ubisoft rationalizes their current support for Wii
« Reply #19 on: June 03, 2008, 10:11:11 AM »
So, no matter what Nintendo does or how successful they are it seems they just can't win. No matter what, 3rd parties always invent excuses for why they don't support it like they should. For the N64 and GC their arguments made some sense, but this time around Nintendo has dropped their bullying of 3rd parties and delivered a console that is both easy to develop for and is currently the market leader. And yet, despite Nintendo having fixed those things, the 3rd parties still come up with excuses.... even when games like Red Steel manage to sell millions.

Yes, the casual market for the Wii is strong, but the hardcore market for the Wii is also very strong as well. Red Steel, No More Heroes, and 1st party games like Zelda, Metroid, Mario, etc. all prove there is a strong demand for traditional gaming. How could anyone in their right minds not see how popular Smash Bros. or Mario Kart has been? Wii Fit is a big success as well, but come on... there's room for both types of gamers, and sometimes a gamer falls into both categories.
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Offline Kairon

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Re: Ubisoft rationalizes their current support for Wii
« Reply #20 on: June 03, 2008, 10:40:02 AM »
Ubisoft is going to get bought out by EA at this rate. It'll happen. Just watch it.
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Offline Kenology

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Re: Ubisoft rationalizes their current support for Wii
« Reply #21 on: June 03, 2008, 11:42:17 AM »
So Ubisoft's Yves Guillemot goes on record saying that he has 400 to 500 people working on Wii titles and will achieve Nintendo-like quality.  Then, we get this latest drove of brain dead shovelwares.  The rationalization behind it is that traditional games don't sell on Wii, despite plenty of games (including Ubi's own Red Steel) proving the contrary.

Raide is right though, folks on Wii don't want a Prince of Persia, Rainbow Six, or Far Cry game...  particularly when they're rushed and hacked ports like Rival Swords and Splinter Cell: Double Agent, or the atrocity that was Far Cry: Vegeance. 

The best thing Ubisoft has done for the Wii was publishing No More Heroes, which I am thankful for.  Other than that, Ubisoft fails.  They openly admitted that their casual Wii shovelware crap is used to fund games on HD consoles.  They don't care to make AAA games on the Wii.  This is unacceptable not just for Wii owners, but for the industry as a whole.

Malstrom couldn't have been more correct with his "birdman" analysis - this right here is evidence in support of it.
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Offline UncleBob

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Re: Ubisoft rationalizes their current support for Wii
« Reply #22 on: June 03, 2008, 12:35:41 PM »
Hay guys, I think we should just chill on Ubisoft and give them a chance.  It's obvious they know what they're doing, otherwise, how would they have stayed in business so long?

Wait for the games to come out, then buy them and give them a chance.  If you don't like them then, then you can complain about them.  But, the important thing is that you buy Ubisoft games.
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Offline UltimatePartyBear

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Re: Ubisoft rationalizes their current support for Wii
« Reply #23 on: June 03, 2008, 12:37:38 PM »
Ubisoft is going to get bought out by EA at this rate. It'll happen. Just watch it.

EA only buys successful companies.  Ubisoft couldn't have chosen a more perfect strategy for staving off EA.

Offline Ian Sane

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Re: Ubisoft rationalizes their current support for Wii
« Reply #24 on: June 03, 2008, 01:34:12 PM »
Quote
If you look at the most successful Wii games, they are not amazing new AAA games, they are predominantly family orientated games/alternative games.

In other words "sh!t sells on the Wii".  It's been speculated that third parties don't put any real effort into Wii games because the casual fanbase that doesn't know better just buys any old crap.  Well here we have confirmation of a third party admitting that.

I'm thinking that's going to forever be the Wii's curse.  Take away the non-gamers and the casuals.  Take away the newcomers and what do we have left?  Would this lineup sell as many consoles if the "traditional gaming market" was all there is?  I doubt it.  The Wii might as well be the Gamecube with a different controller.  The third party support is about the same.  Yeah the first party lineup is great but that's expected from a Nintendo console.  Now the third parties are probably wrong.  The Wii probably sells well enough that their AAA material would sell just as well as their shovelware.  But the Wii userbase will buy crap and the X360/PS3 probably won't as much so we're where we are now.  Ubisoft is wrong but because every third party has the same attitude it doesn't matter.  The only way to fix this is if some third party makes the Wii their target console, cleans up, and forces the other third parties to switch or get left behind.  It has to get to the point that one has to support the Wii to survive.

Boycotting Ubisoft won't do sh!t because we're not the ones in control.  The casuals are the majority on the Wii and if they buy crap then it doesn't matter if we don't.  And if the crap stopped selling then third parties would probably just pull support.  I think the Gamecube proved that not buying crap just makes third parties drop support, provided they have other consoles as an alternative.  If they can make money on the Xbox 360 then they won't care if Wii owners don't support them.  They have to NEED the Wii for any message to get through.

I remember back when the Wii wasn't out yet so many people here were PRAISING Ubisoft because they were one of like three third parties actually annoucing support.  I argued that like EA, Ubisoft support was insignificant because they support everybody.  Funny how opinions flip flop and now everyone is all "Ubisoft sucks!"