Author Topic: Radio Free Nintendo: Episode 72  (Read 17777 times)

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Offline Svevan

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RE: Radio Free Nintendo: Episode 72
« Reply #50 on: October 05, 2007, 09:08:46 PM »
Agreed IceCold.

I hope for Kirby and Pikmin especially, but Nintendo's been so slow on announcing games this past year and a half.
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Offline GoldenPhoenix

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RE:Radio Free Nintendo: Episode 72
« Reply #51 on: October 05, 2007, 09:12:37 PM »
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Originally posted by: Svevan
Agreed IceCold.

I hope for Kirby and Pikmin especially, but Nintendo's been so slow on announcing games this past year and a half.


They better do something new with Kirby, talk about a series that has grown stale. They need some new things to freshen up the gameplay, I'm not saying Canvas Curse drastic, but something to make the games fresh again. F-Zero on the other hand is has been as fresh as 2 year old ham left out in the sun since its inception.
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Offline that Baby guy

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RE:Radio Free Nintendo: Episode 72
« Reply #52 on: October 05, 2007, 09:20:09 PM »
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Originally posted by: Svevan
Nintendo didn't screw with the formula: they left it for dead. They handed it off to any developer that wanted it, gave them FREE REIGN to REMOVE EVERYTHING THAT MADE STAR FOX GOOD, and called it Star Fox anyways.

edit: George Lucas did a BETTER job with HIS OWN FREAKING PROPERTY than any of those retards did with Star FREAKING Fox

Part of the problem is that Star Fox 64 is too perfect. It's just too damn good; it goes as far with its premise as I think you can go. That's why Namco and Rare went batshlt loco with the gameplay, because they knew they couldn't improve what was already there.


No, I disagree.  There were several problems with Star Fox 64, it was just an amazing game despite this.  Since none of the developers fixed the problems, and instead created more, we forgot them all.

For instance, there needed to be lots more enemies in the all-range mode battles.  The game was limited because of the 64, but I hated having to search out targets on Sector Z before missiles.  The enemy ships needed to be more accurate, as well.  When every shot you fire can be easily deflected, you need to make every shot count, and, lets face it, they didn't.  The wingmen were retarded, despite having function.  Sure, Peppy tells you what to do in a sticky situation, but in a game as short as StarFox 64, after one or two playthroughs, you already know, and he's instantly useless.  Yes, you have to keep Falco alive for better routes, but that's it.  And Slippy tells you boss life, mostly useless, too.  All-range mode was a bore in most cases.  I mentioned the number of enemy ships above, but essentially, you just flew in a circle, dodged a few attacks, then shot the boss, except in the StarWolf dogfights.  There should have been more of those with various ships.  Maybe a slower powerhouse that could shoot bombs, too, along with a very quick, but weak opponent.  Exploit natural stereotypes.  How about the different vehicles?  Why not continue to add on-rails levels with different mechanics?  The original Landmaster levels were some of the best out there.  Couldn't another vehicle or two have been designed for linear gameplay?

As far as the battle mode, there were far few options.  The mode was improved in Assault, but there were too many problems, still.  It seemed like once someone gained the "high ground," by that I mean the best weapon/ship, it was nearly impossible to overcome them, because you die too easily as a groundling.  There should have been more air-based ships than the wolfen and arwing, because, let's face it, Factor 5 showed how having several unique ships makes gameplay awesome.

There's some things that could have been made better in a sequel to StarFox 64.  It's not that nothing can compare to the game, it's that nothing has tried to target the same gameplay as the original, while attempting to fix any issues of the first.  Instead, they all want to be a unique experience with a loosely core gameplay.  Guess what: StarFox and StarFox 64 already did that with the three tracks of levels possible.

Although, I guess I should play more of StarFox: Command before I make these judgements, I haven' delved too far into it, but I didn't like the draw-your-own path idea too much.  If I understand correctly, it did have branching paths, right?  At least they got that right.

Offline Svevan

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RE: Radio Free Nintendo: Episode 72
« Reply #53 on: October 05, 2007, 09:21:05 PM »
Personally, and I don't think everyone will or necessarily should agree with this, I think Kirby is great because of its music. Its combination of images and sounds is so perfect, the gameplay being pretty simple has never ever bothered me.  
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Offline GoldenPhoenix

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RE:Radio Free Nintendo: Episode 72
« Reply #54 on: October 05, 2007, 09:21:19 PM »
Ugh, I couldn't stand StarFox Command, it got repetitive REALLY fast.
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Offline that Baby guy

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RE: Radio Free Nintendo: Episode 72
« Reply #55 on: October 05, 2007, 09:21:36 PM »
Quote

Originally posted by: ShyGuy
Thatguy is freaking insane.


Good or bad insane?

Offline GoldenPhoenix

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RE:Radio Free Nintendo: Episode 72
« Reply #56 on: October 05, 2007, 09:22:36 PM »
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Originally posted by: Svevan
Personally, and I don't think everyone will or necessarily should agree with this, I think Kirby is great because of its music. Its combination of images and sounds is so perfect, the gameplay being pretty simple has never ever bothered me.


You don't need it to be complex, but for heaven's sake it IS the same game every time. The only one that tried something was Kirby and the Magic Door or whatever it was called. It needs spicing up, I'm not saying revamp the series, but it needs something unique to revitalize it.
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Offline Svevan

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RE: Radio Free Nintendo: Episode 72
« Reply #57 on: October 05, 2007, 09:25:48 PM »
I don't disagree, so long as the music and pretty world design are still there.
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Offline GoldenPhoenix

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RE:Radio Free Nintendo: Episode 72
« Reply #58 on: October 05, 2007, 09:28:26 PM »
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Originally posted by: Svevan
I don't disagree, so long as the music and pretty world design are still there.


Well Kirby does have good art design and music (though I was let down by March of the Minis or whatever that last game was, then again that wasn't made by Nintendo). Still want to play the SNES Kirby .
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Offline that Baby guy

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RE: Radio Free Nintendo: Episode 72
« Reply #59 on: October 05, 2007, 09:30:32 PM »
Kirby is an odd selection.  One game, to me, really stood out: Kirby's Superstar.  I really think this concept evolved into Super Smash Bros., though, so I don't complain about that being missing.  Really, beyond that, there's been two different Kriby lines.  There's been the Dream Land games and everything else.  The Dream Land games each grow in plot, abilities, and ideas.  Each one has merits, each one provides a new reason to play.  The problem is that they stopped after three.  Then, the  other games, I suppose the ones that followed behind Kirby's Adventure, never really did anything new, IMO.  I mean, one was just the remake, Kirby 64 was pretty boring and devoid of charm, The Amazing Mirror was alright at best, and Squeak Squad is just ridiculous, to me.  Canvas Curse was a breath of fresh air, but it's really a spin-off, and not part of the two Kirby sets.

And Evan, I do agree that some Kirby games develop a great atmosphere, but Kirby 64 and anything after it really haven't done much, not counting Canvas Curse.  I suppose I mean that you can find that same atmosphere and better gameplay in the Dream Land line, and there isn't reason to look outside of that, except for the spin-offs and Superstar.  Everything else has regressed in both gameplay and atmosphere, honestly.  

Offline Svevan

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RE:Radio Free Nintendo: Episode 72
« Reply #60 on: October 05, 2007, 09:31:41 PM »
Quote

Originally posted by: thatguy
Quote

Originally posted by: ShyGuy
Thatguy is freaking insane.


Good or bad insane?

You're good insane. I'm reading your posts, just not responding quite yet.
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Offline that Baby guy

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RE: Radio Free Nintendo: Episode 72
« Reply #61 on: October 05, 2007, 09:35:12 PM »
See, this is why I have nearly 2500 posts now. =P

Offline ShyGuy

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RE: Radio Free Nintendo: Episode 72
« Reply #62 on: October 05, 2007, 09:44:47 PM »
I never watched Psycho, but let me espouse about Hitchcock's films. = thatguy

Seriously, never played Wind Waker?

Offline Svevan

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RE: Radio Free Nintendo: Episode 72
« Reply #63 on: October 05, 2007, 09:48:08 PM »
Wow, ShyGuy. In the context of Hitchcock's oeuvre, Psycho is the perfect example you could have picked: it is just as much an anomaly to Hitchcock as Wind Waker is to Zelda. way. to. go.
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Offline that Baby guy

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RE: Radio Free Nintendo: Episode 72
« Reply #64 on: October 05, 2007, 09:49:34 PM »
Ikaruga.

Oh, then Wario Ware after that.

Offline ShyGuy

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RE: Radio Free Nintendo: Episode 72
« Reply #65 on: October 05, 2007, 09:59:59 PM »
I was gonna say The Birds, but I think that one is more analogous to Majora's Mask.

Offline that Baby guy

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RE: Radio Free Nintendo: Episode 72
« Reply #66 on: October 05, 2007, 10:42:30 PM »
So am I equal to Psycho, or is Wind Waker equal to Psycho?

Offline Jonnyboy117

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RE:Radio Free Nintendo: Episode 72
« Reply #67 on: October 06, 2007, 05:20:22 AM »
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Offline ShyGuy

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RE: Radio Free Nintendo: Episode 72
« Reply #68 on: October 06, 2007, 05:44:44 AM »

Offline Djunknown

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RE:Radio Free Nintendo: Episode 72
« Reply #69 on: October 06, 2007, 06:47:39 AM »
I'll sidestep the Zelda disucussion since its been going any which way...

There's no reason the Orange Box could come out on Wii. Even Gabe Newell mentioned in a Game Informer interview that he's rooting for the Wii to be successful. What gives? Jonny if you're reading this, if you don't buy a lot of PC games, I'd recommend getting an ATI graphics card, since Valve 'prefers' that brand. I don't know what series they have now, since they crank them out every 18 months or so, but a current, entry level, or mid-grade card should more than do the trick.

I believe there are videos showing Half life 2 with Wii controls via youtube. However they're using the accelerometers, and not the IR pointer. From what I saw, it was pretty competent. Imagine what Valve could do with a SDK...

Killer 7 is a love-it or hate it-game. I like it, as its style over substance in a good way, and no one in their right mind has/will imitate this title. I'd disagree about Killer 7 being broken, since all the mechanics work the way it should in the game. Can't explore the entire building? Why would you, there's Heaven Smiles eager to kill almost everywhere you turn. Switching from 3rd to 1st person is a snap. The aiming is spot on. I can't think of any moment where I'm cursing the controls, or the mechanics.

After playing some more S&P, and then playing some Halo 3, it hit me what was missing. The N64 didn't have dual analog, so you have to conciously think of moving and shooting, whereas other action titles have dual analog and  don't really think about that hunk of plastic in your hand. If S&P had been released on Gamecube, and used the C-stick and Control stick for aiming/shooting respectively (or vice versa depending on your aiming preference), the game would have been marginally easier. S&P with Wii controls are a perfect fit, hopefully we'll something from Treasure.
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Offline Entroper

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RE:Radio Free Nintendo: Episode 72
« Reply #70 on: October 07, 2007, 09:57:42 AM »
Quote

Originally posted by: thatguy
Do you know why FSA was the best Zelda?  Because it was the one that wasn't fake.  In our hearts, we all know Zelda is about dungeon crawling while traversing an amazing, diverse world.  The problem really is that while the world is diverse, there aren't really any games where your pathways and experiences can be unique each time you play it.  Sure, you might be able to play dungeon x, y, and z in whatever order you like, but you're going to play them the exact same way anyways, no matter what.  FSA got rid of the lie about it.  It had several settings, great bosses, and the linear, dungeon-puzzler gameplay all the others had, but wasn't fake about it.  It's loads and loads of the core Zelda gameplay without an annoying trek across a relatively empty land for the twelfth time.

Does anyone else see what I'm getting at?  Am I the only one who feels this way?  I certainly feel like I'm not, and there's obviously people dissatisfied with LoZ games around, but does anyone else feel this strongly about it?


I wholeheartedly agree with your take on Four Swords Adventures.  I think Ocarina was great because it focused on the dungeons more than the wandering.  Wind Waker actually offered a decent balance -- the exploration was much more open-ended and freeform, and I think it worked well.  Twilight Princess, on the other hand... argh!

I bought a Wii on launch day, and I haven't gotten to the third dungeon.  I've spent 12 hours playing the game and only been to two dungeons, and the rest of the game has made me want to go to sleep!  Hearing all these comments about how the second half of the game completely changes gears and focuses on dungeons does not make me dread the rest of the game, it actually motivates me to pick it back up so I can get to the fun stuff!

Oh, and Zelda 2 is a fantastic game, it's just hard.  I'm actually in the middle of a game of Zelda 2 right now, having just finished the third palace.  I enjoy a good side scrolling action adventure like Zelda 2, Faxanadu, and Battle of Olympus.  

Offline Jonnyboy117

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RE: Radio Free Nintendo: Episode 72
« Reply #71 on: October 07, 2007, 07:14:33 PM »
Funny, I like Battle of Olympus and Faxanadu, but I never really liked Zelda 2 much.  The controls are bonkers, for one thing.
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Offline Kairon

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RE:Radio Free Nintendo: Episode 72
« Reply #72 on: October 07, 2007, 07:36:07 PM »
Quote

Originally posted by: Entroper
Quote

Originally posted by: thatguy
Do you know why FSA was the best Zelda?  Because it was the one that wasn't fake.  In our hearts, we all know Zelda is about dungeon crawling while traversing an amazing, diverse world.  The problem really is that while the world is diverse, there aren't really any games where your pathways and experiences can be unique each time you play it.  Sure, you might be able to play dungeon x, y, and z in whatever order you like, but you're going to play them the exact same way anyways, no matter what.  FSA got rid of the lie about it.  It had several settings, great bosses, and the linear, dungeon-puzzler gameplay all the others had, but wasn't fake about it.  It's loads and loads of the core Zelda gameplay without an annoying trek across a relatively empty land for the twelfth time.

Does anyone else see what I'm getting at?  Am I the only one who feels this way?  I certainly feel like I'm not, and there's obviously people dissatisfied with LoZ games around, but does anyone else feel this strongly about it?


I wholeheartedly agree with your take on Four Swords Adventures.  I think Ocarina was great because it focused on the dungeons more than the wandering.  Wind Waker actually offered a decent balance -- the exploration was much more open-ended and freeform, and I think it worked well.  Twilight Princess, on the other hand... argh!

I bought a Wii on launch day, and I haven't gotten to the third dungeon.  I've spent 12 hours playing the game and only been to two dungeons, and the rest of the game has made me want to go to sleep!  Hearing all these comments about how the second half of the game completely changes gears and focuses on dungeons does not make me dread the rest of the game, it actually motivates me to pick it back up so I can get to the fun stuff!

Oh, and Zelda 2 is a fantastic game, it's just hard.  I'm actually in the middle of a game of Zelda 2 right now, having just finished the third palace.  I enjoy a good side scrolling action adventure like Zelda 2, Faxanadu, and Battle of Olympus.  


What a radical take on the Zelda series... I must ponder this up-ending of all that we've believed about Zelda up until now...
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Offline Entroper

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RE:Radio Free Nintendo: Episode 72
« Reply #73 on: October 08, 2007, 04:03:17 AM »
Quote

Originally posted by: Jonnyboy117
Funny, I like Battle of Olympus and Faxanadu, but I never really liked Zelda 2 much.  The controls are bonkers, for one thing.


Honestly I think all three games have "touchy" controls that take a lot of getting used to.  Zelda 2 may be the most touchy, though.

@Kairon: I don't think it's radical at all.  Zelda actually went backwards in terms of open exploration between the original LoZ (where the entire overworld was available from the outset) and LttP, where you were more restricted and directed.  I don't necessarily see that as a good or bad thing.  For me, the puzzle solving and combat in the dungeons has always been more entertaining than free roaming on the overworld, and especially more so than the silly overworld quests in TP.

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RE:Radio Free Nintendo: Episode 72
« Reply #74 on: October 08, 2007, 05:26:54 AM »
Quote

Originally posted by: Entroper
Quote

Originally posted by: Jonnyboy117
Funny, I like Battle of Olympus and Faxanadu, but I never really liked Zelda 2 much.  The controls are bonkers, for one thing.


Honestly I think all three games have "touchy" controls that take a lot of getting used to.  Zelda 2 may be the most touchy, though.

@Kairon: I don't think it's radical at all.  Zelda actually went backwards in terms of open exploration between the original LoZ (where the entire overworld was available from the outset) and LttP, where you were more restricted and directed.  I don't necessarily see that as a good or bad thing.  For me, the puzzle solving and combat in the dungeons has always been more entertaining than free roaming on the overworld, and especially more so than the silly overworld quests in TP.


Can't get much more backwards in exploration than the extremely linear Zelda II, Miyamotos admitted failure. Also isn't possible to enjoy ALL aspects that make the Zelda series good, exploration, dungeon crawling, and puzzle solving?
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