Topic: Capcom Announces First Wii Game (by Inafuna)

[Smash_Brother]

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Originally posted by: pap64 Didn't they did that already? I heard that they did a flash movie where they killed some Nintendo characters back when the XBOX was first released.

Correct.

MS has only 2 exploitable advantages over Nintendo:

1. Graphics
2. Insecurity

Since graphics haven't earned them all that much, they'd be better off trying insecurity.

But I think it might even be too late for that. You can bash something further down if people already don't like it (like the GC with many people), but trying to throw insults at something everyone DOES like can make you look worse by comparison and I think trying to bash the Wii would do that for MS at this point.

But I hope this isn't another Megaman turn-based RPG. In fact, the only Megaman game I'd tolerate is a full rebirth of the original game concept on the Wii, much like what Sonic and the Secret Rings is TRYING to do.  

[couchmonkey]

Well, people liked Nintendo a lot back in the days of Super NES, but Sega, and later Sony, still managed to pull off a bashing campaign. The difference, though, is that the majority of gamers at that time were kids, and they were becoming teenagers.  A great audience to make feel bad about their "kiddy" game system.

This is the whole advantage to Nintendo's strategy: if it's successful, the competition has no good counter-strategy other than to go back to the drawing board.  360 is not a serious alternative to Wii, if you like what Wii is offering.

Anyway, Capcom, awesome news, I hope whatever this is turns out to be good!

[ThePerm]

well Microsoft can always release a new controller

[Galford]

MS has another weapon it's called Halo 3.

I know people who are buying a 360 just to play this.
Do not underestimate this game.

What will Nintendo's answer be?

[NWR_pap64]

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Originally posted by: Galford
MS has another weapon it's called Halo 3.

I know people who are buying a 360 just to play this.
Do not underestimate this game.

What will Nintendo's answer be?

Metroid Prime 3
Super Mario Galaxy
Super Smash Bros. Brawl

And any other second or third party game they have up their sleeve (like Disaster: Day of crisis, Project H.A.M.M.E.R, The Sims Wii, Dragonquest swords and many more).

[Pittbboi]

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Originally posted by: pap64

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Originally posted by: Galford
MS has another weapon it's called Halo 3.

I know people who are buying a 360 just to play this.
Do not underestimate this game.

What will Nintendo's answer be?

Metroid Prime 3
Super Mario Galaxy
Super Smash Bros. Brawl

And any other second or third party game they have up their sleeve (like Disaster: Day of crisis, Project H.A.M.M.E.R, The Sims Wii, Dragonquest swords and many more).

Ummm, none of those games are near the star power of the Halo franchise. Good games, but they mostly only appeal to people who are already fans of Nintendo and already have Wiis or want them (heck, Smash Bros. is almost 100% fan service). Galford has a point, and it's a point that's been made before (I think someone mentioned it in a podcast, too): if there's one thing Nintendo still needs, it's the big name GAME games that get people talking, and not just your fanbase. They sorta have that in WiiSports, but they NEED another trad-game that can generate GTA/Halo/Final Fantasy type hype. Outside of graphics, that's the only thing the competition has on Nintendo (the BIG names that'll get gamers in a frenzy).

Heck, as much as I hate the notion of owning a PS3(there's absolutely nothing I want on it right now), if Final Fantasy XIII and versus XIII don't get ported to the 360 (like I'm secretly hoping), I may actually be tempted to consider putting down $600 to play those games. Nintendo doesn't yet have the kind of game that can do that (in my opinion), as most of their big name games are first party, and almost exclusively appeal to people who already love them. And Nintendo can rely on the non-gamers for so long (I know several people who bought Wiis just to play WiiSports...and nothing else).  

[Kairon]

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Originally posted by: Pittbboi

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Originally posted by: pap64

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Originally posted by: Galford
What will Nintendo's answer be?

Metroid Prime 3
Super Mario Galaxy
Super Smash Bros. Brawl

Ummm, none of those games are near the star power of the Halo franchise. Good games, but they mostly only appeal to people who are already fans of Nintendo and already have Wiis or want them (heck, Smash Bros. is almost 100% fan service). Galford has a point, and it's a point that's been made before (I think someone mentioned it in a podcast, too): if there's one thing Nintendo still needs, it's the big name GAME games that get people talking, and not just your fanbase. They sorta have that in WiiSports, but they NEED another trad-game that can generate GTA/Halo/Final Fantasy type hype. Outside of graphics, that's the only thing the competition has on Nintendo (the BIG names that'll get gamers in a frenzy).

Hmmm... game that appeals outside of its fanbase? Game that moves units worldwide as much as Halo? Games that get people talking, make the system a must-buy, and capture the cultural zeitgeist?

Let me point you in the right direction my friends: Nintendogs.

Yes, yes, I don't expect a Nintendogs Wii because it doesn't make too much sense really.... OR DOES IT?!?!?! (Imagine taking your Nintendog to a friend's through the Wiimote just like a Mii!) But I do personally anticipate Wii Music as the second coming of Wii Sports, and also believe that the next generation of Wii music game has the potential to be huge!

~Carmine "Cai" M. Red
Kairon@aol.com  

[KDR_11k]

MS has another weapon it's called Halo 3.

I know people who are buying a 360 just to play this.
Do not underestimate this game.

Halo will recapture their old market but not open up new markets for them. Most people who want a 360 for Halo 3 probably owned Halo 2 already. Pandering to your fans lets you retain them but not acquire new ones, a lesson Nintendo learned the hard way with their ever-decreasing sales numbers. MS needs more than Halo 3, they need to branch out and capture more audiences to make their marketshare grow larger than it was with the XBox. To their luck third parties are making more and more 360 games so they will expand the 360's market for MS.

Heck, as much as I hate the notion of owning a PS3(there's absolutely nothing I want on it), if Final Fantasy XIII and versus XIII don't get ported to the 360 (like I'm secretly hoping), I may actually be tempted to consider putting of $600 to play those games. Nintendo doesn't yet have the kind of game that can do that (in my opinion), as most of their big name games are first party, and almost exclusively appeal to people who already love them.

You're using two standards there. FF13 is a game that will sell PS3s primarily to people who already love Final Fantasy. Nintendo has that kind of game in Zelda. Both MGS and FF only sell systems to pleople who already love those series and had a PS2 last gen. Many people are looking to buy a PS3 because they think it'll be host to all the sequels of the series they liked on the PS2 even though more and more games are migrating away from the system. In the end Sony will only attract those parts of their fanbase whose games haven't left yet.

[Pittbboi]

Ohhh, there's that "The DS and the WII are both made by Nintendo and are so interchangeable that what worked for one MUST work for the other!!1" mentality again...

Yes, Nintendogs is THAT game, but I don't know what good having it on the DS is going to do for the Wii, and as far as I know it hasn't been announced for the Wii.

But honestly, would Nintendogs on the Wii be as big a hit as it is on the DS? Granted, I don't own Nintendogs, but I have played it briefly, and it struck me as the kind of game that would be popular in much the same way the Tamogotchi and Giga Pets were years ago. You know, pets on the go. Would Nintendogs be as fun tethered to your living room?

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You're using two standards there. FF13 is a game that will sell PS3s primarily to people who already love Final Fantasy. Nintendo has that kind of game in Zelda.

Not exactly. Granted Final Fantasy has been pretty exclusive to Sony for a while, but Final Fantasy is still a third party product. Square used to make Final Fantasy games for Nintendo, and they still make games for other consoles under the Final Fantasy name. You don't have to be a fan of Sony consoles to like Final Fantasy. How do you think Sony sucked away so many Nintendo fans during the PSX's initial years? Heck, I didn't buy a Playstation 2 until it dropped in price and FFX became a Greatest Hits title. With Nintendo games you have to be a fan of Nintendo consoles because you're not going to get their games anywhere else. And it's been so long that the games are almost removed from mainstream gaming. If you're a Sony or MS fanboy you're really not going to miss Metroid or Mario very much, because there will be plenty of alternatives on your system of choice that'll be just as good. Not so much the case for the die-hard Nintendo fanboy. Up until recently, if you wanted outstanding console RPG gameplay, you had to go to another system. Hopefully that changes (I have high hopes for Dragon Quest and Fire Emblem).    

[Jin-X]

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Originally posted by: Pittbboi

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Originally posted by: pap64

Ummm, none of those games are near the star power of the Halo franchise. Good games, but they mostly only appeal to people who are already fans of Nintendo and already have Wiis or want them (heck, Smash Bros. is almost 100% fan service).

The same thing can be said about Halo 3. It's a shooter, how does it help it expand its fanbase? Their big game last year was a shooter (Gears). The people that love shooters and Halo already know that their system to get is the 360. But aside from shooters and racers, there isn't that much else on the 360.

[Kairon]

Read my post please.

I'm personally up in the air as to whether Nintendogs would be a good fit for the Wii, but there's no question that the series itself is amazing. If you'd bother to look at its sales figures, it's sold higher than either of the Halo games!

Actually, looking at VGCharts, understandably inexact though it may be (though I'm using shipment numbers which are far more reliable since they have nothing to hide, unlike "sold" numbers), Halo is pegged at shipping 7.91 mil and 6.44 mil worldwide for the first and second game, wheres Nintendogs (in all its versions) is pegged at shipping 11.5 million worldwide.

So in effect, you're asking for the Wii's version of Nintendogs. Which is in fact Wii Sports.

Oh, but we want the NEXT version of Wii Sports right? Let's just call Wii Sports Nintendo's answer to GoW. What will they have come Halo 3? There's the question!

And well, maybe the Halo franchise IS being overrated here because of our hardcore skew. This is actually quite shocking for me because I am personally a BIG Halo defender from both a significance and QUALITY standpoint. But anyways, my personal opinion aside, looking at worldwide shipments, again from VG chart...

Super Smash bros. Melee : 6.10 million
Super Mario Sunshine: 5.56 million
Metroid Prime 2: 1.13 million

UGH! SCREW the Metroid Prime series! That series obviously doesn't belong in the same sentence as Halo saleswise. But both Smash and Mario are "almost as big" as Halo... so they should hold the fort nicely.

But where's Wii Music? Wii Fitness, Wii Sports?

Where's Nintendo's next big flag carrier, where's the breakout hit, where's the killer app, and without a WII prefix in front of it?!?!?

Hmm... the crystal ball is hazy because whereas the PS3 and X360 have tons of vague yet announced titles on the horizon for late 2007 and 2008 (Naughty Dog's next game? Mass Effect?), Nintendo's schedule has the big 3 (Mario, Smash, Metroid) and little else...

That said, let me guess at Nintendo's answer to Halo 3 come this Holiday season, part guesstimate, part wishful thinking.

Animal Crossing. (Wii Animal Crossing?)

~Carmine "Cai" M. Red
Kairon@aol.com  

[ShyGuy]

I think Super Mario and Smash Bros have the star power of Halo, problem is Microsoft will always pour millions more into marketing than Nintendo.

[Pittbboi]

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Oh, but we want the NEXT version of Wii Sports right? Let's just call Wii Sports Nintendo's answer to GoW. What will they have come Halo 3? There's the question!

And that's my whole point. WiiSports isn't going to be the answer forever.

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I think Super Mario and Smash Bros have the star power of Halo, problem is Microsoft will always pour millions more into marketing than Nintendo.

Not true. Nintendo poured twice the amount of money into marketing the Wii than MS did with the 360, and still reported profits. Nintendo is not some garage game developer. Nintendo is not as big as MS or Sony, but it IS a multi-billion dollar company and they CAN throw money at an endeavour if they want to. Problem is they usually don't want to. Microsoft may be a powerhouse but they can't throw their entire weight into the 360 because they have so many other markets they have to maintain. People act like that 45 billion is purely for the Xbox360.

[Kairon]

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Originally posted by: Pittbboi

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Oh, but we want the NEXT version of Wii Sports right? Let's just call Wii Sports Nintendo's answer to GoW. What will they have come Halo 3? There's the question!

And that's my whole point. WiiSports isn't going to be the answer forever.

You mean unlike Nintendogs? (sorry, couldn't resist, Nintendogs has AMAZING LEGS even if it is on DS...)

But anyways, my answer was Animal Crossing.

~Carmine "Cai" M. Red
Kairon@aol.com

[zakkiel]

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Ummm, none of those games are near the star power of the Halo franchise. Good games, but they mostly only appeal to people who are already fans of Nintendo and already have Wiis or want them (heck, Smash Bros. is almost 100% fan service).

I stopped reading here.  

[Pittbboi]

Good for you.

[KDR_11k]

You don't have to be a fan of Sony consoles to like Final Fantasy.

No but Sony had the Final Fantasy fans covered before. Sure, it takes an actual game to make them buy a PS3 but don't you think many Nintendo fans wouldn't have bought a Wii as soon as they did if Zelda wasn't available?

And that's my whole point. WiiSports isn't going to be the answer forever.

Yes but there's Wario Ware now (no that's not going to last forever either but we don't know what games will be released a year from now).

[Ian Sane]

Regarding Nintendo combating Halo 3 they can't with any of their current franchises.  Why?  Because those same franchises were all over the Cube and it didn't help sales.  If Super Mario Sunshine didn't sell Gamecube why the hell would Super Mario Galaxy suddenly sell Wiis?

There's nothing wrong with Nintendo's franchises and they shouldn't stop making them outright (though they could cut back on spin-offs).  Those are good games and they still sell well.  But they can't be the main attraction anymore because they're too old.  There is a whole generation of gamers that don't identify with those franchises the same way the NES/SNES crowd did.  That crowd is familiar with what they view as Playstation or Xbox franchises because that's what they grew up with.  Those franchises were part of their childhood like Mario was a part of ours.  No, Nintendo needs something new for the younger generation.  They don't have to sell out or compromise their principals to do it.  They just need something new and different for younger gamers to identify with.  They did that with Pokemon.  The age group that ate up Pokemon didn't play Mario and Zelda "back in the day".  They were too young.  Pokemon was their's.  It's like how I may like The Beatles but their music isn't as personal to me as music that was popular when I was 14.  And I'll never "get" The Beatles the same way my parents do.

Though I'm not exactly suggesting Pokemon as the literal template to work from.  It's just an example of newer Nintendo franchise taking off.  Something with a little more universal appeal (ie: teenagers will like it too) would be ideal.

[zakkiel]

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Regarding Nintendo combating Halo 3 they can't with any of their current franchises. Why? Because those same franchises were all over the Cube and it didn't help sales. If Super Mario Sunshine didn't sell Gamecube why the hell would Super Mario Galaxy suddenly sell Wiis?

I can't speak for SMS. I was underwhelmed by the game. But I know damn well that SSBM, WW, MP, and RE4 sold systems, just as TP sold Wiis and Final Fantasy games will continue to sell PlayStation iterations. The age of a franchise is not at issue. The reason Halo garnered such exclusive attention was the lack of other worthwhile games for a long time on the Xbox. If Microsoft had more AAA games, the Halo effect would be a lot less pronounced.

I'm all for new and exciting franchises (and Nintendo needs them right now to fill holes in the line-up), but if you're looking for a Wii Halo equivalent, you aren't going to get it. That's a sign of strength, not weakness.

[JonLeung]

I was at the Video Games Live concert last night.

Perhaps indicative of franchise power, the final pieces performed by the orchestra were from these games, in order of play:

-Super Mario Bros. montage with SMB music (main, underwater, underground)
-Halo & Halo 2 montage with Halo theme
-Halo 3 teaser with Halo theme and Tommy Tallarico rocking out on a guitar
-Final Fantasy VII - One Winged Angel (Sephiroth theme, no visuals because Square-Enix wouldn't allow them)

If Mario was as big as he once was, I have no doubt it would be last, as they save the best for last.

Was it really necessary for the short Halo 3 teaser, which pretty much had the same music as the piece we just saw?

And then FF VII.  It's fine music, I guess, but the game itself is overrated and likely the piece is here to appease the so-called gamers who really just hopped on the gaming bandwagon just because of this game.  Nostalgia is key, but it's not my personal nostalgia.  (I suppose final boss music that involves the whole orchestra as well as the choir works for a finale, and Bowser's theme I'm not sure would cut it.)

My point if you missed it is, FF and Halo are pretty big.  Worthy?  That's debateable.  But big?  If people are cheering them on as much as Mario, or even more, that's pretty big.  Whether Nintendo can come up with a game that most people would actually consider a Halo-killer, I don't know.

[nitsu niflheim]

mega bitch

[Kairon]

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Originally posted by: JonLeung
My point if you missed it is, FF and Halo are pretty big.  Worthy?  That's debateable.  But big?  If people are cheering them on as much as Mario, or even more, that's pretty big.  Whether Nintendo can come up with a game that most people would actually consider a Halo-killer, I don't know.

You don't "kill" Halo. That's Red Sea thinking. You set up a puppy adoption agency next door, the Blue Ocean way. &>

~Carmine "Cai" M. Red
Kairon@aol.com

[Ian Sane]

"But I know damn well that SSBM, WW, MP, and RE4 sold systems"

No they didn't.  Not in any meaningful way.  The Cube is the very definition of a flop.  Even though Nintendo remained profitable during the time the Cube was completely irrelevent in the game market three years in.  Hell after RE4 came out the release list dried up to the point where it was clear that even Nintendo was neglecting it.  It is by far the least significant Nintendo console ever aside from the Virtual Boy.  Nintendo themselves have even publicly admitted disappointment in how it performed.  They have said that the Wii will be a failure if it only sells as much as the Cube.  So the games that "sold Cubes" aren't going to sell Wiis in the amount Nintendo wants.

Nintendo loaded the Cube with their franchises and even had a whole marketing campaign based around the familiarity of their franchises and the Cube flopped.  Nintendo should just outright avoid doing things similar to how they were done on the Cube.

"I'm all for new and exciting franchises (and Nintendo needs them right now to fill holes in the line-up), but if you're looking for a Wii Halo equivalent, you aren't going to get it. That's a sign of strength, not weakness. "

I don't mean a literal Halo equivalent.  I mean something new and different that attracts the same amount of attention that Halo did.  Something that younger gamers identify as one the "their games".  A game that everyone is playing and everyone knows about.  An "it" game.  The holes should be filled with the franchises and the new stuff should be getting the big push.  When you use the new stuff to fill gaps you get a situation like Pikmin where the games are amazing but the franchise doesn't catch on as well it probably should have.  If the new franchises just fill the holes they won't get the big marketing push and thus people won't know about them.  Anyone turned off but what they view as nothing but Nintendo rehashing won't notice the new game coming out in the first place.  Without the marketing the new franchises don't take off.

[Pittbboi]

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Originally posted by: zakkiel

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Regarding Nintendo combating Halo 3 they can't with any of their current franchises. Why? Because those same franchises were all over the Cube and it didn't help sales. If Super Mario Sunshine didn't sell Gamecube why the hell would Super Mario Galaxy suddenly sell Wiis?

I can't speak for SMS. I was underwhelmed by the game. But I know damn well that SSBM, WW, MP, and RE4 sold systems, just as TP sold Wiis and Final Fantasy games will continue to sell PlayStation iterations. The age of a franchise is not at issue. The reason Halo garnered such exclusive attention was the lack of other worthwhile games for a long time on the Xbox. If Microsoft had more AAA games, the Halo effect would be a lot less pronounced.

I'm all for new and exciting franchises (and Nintendo needs them right now to fill holes in the line-up), but if you're looking for a Wii Halo equivalent, you aren't going to get it. That's a sign of strength, not weakness.

I disagree. The proof that these games didn't sell systems (or enough systems to matter) rests in the Cube's lackluster sales. They're all great games that recieved mostly good reviews, but they by and large remained a big deal mostly to Gamecube owners.

And, actually, what you said about Xbox and Halo more accurately applies to the Cube. With Metroid Prime, for example, yes it was a great game, but part of the reason it was such a big deal on the Cube was because if you wanted a stellar FPS, it was just about your only option. If you you owned a PS2 and Xbox, however, you had plenty of--while not as highly rated as MP--good FPSs. So the sting of not playing that game wasn't as bad.

Twilight Princess will sell Wiis to people who are already Nintendo fans and most likely would have gotten a Wii eventually, anyway. So far, I think it's safe to say that WiiSports is the only Wii game out currently that comes close to a true system seller. Though that's quite an achievement in itself.  

[zakkiel]

To both:

You're both using the GC's poor sales (a flop Ian, is the Dreamcast) as the linchpin of the claim that its franchises did not sell systems. There are a lot of problems with this. First, as I recall, it took Microsoft a long damn time to open up an appreciable lead on Nintendo - well after the Blessed Advent of Halo. Second, it is preposterous to suppose that the GC would have sold the same without those games; it would have become a genuine flop, not just a disappointment. Clearly they sell systems. And lastly, you're reasoning as if Halo is the only difference between the Xbox and the GC. Which is especially odd coming from Ian, since he routinely hauls out a laundry list of mistakes he believes doomed the Cube extending far beyond individual titles. If Halo had been on the GC, it would never have really taken off the way it has. The lack of online, the uphill battle against image, Nintendo's staggering inability to generate hype for any non-first-party game, and the descriminating tastes of Nintendo gamers (who tend to recognize Halo as a decent shooter rather than a divine masterpiece) would all have conspired against it.

My point: it's a myth that Nintendo needs to unveil some new masterpiece as an answer to Halo 3, anymore than the PS2 needed an answer to Halo. It definitely does need a strong fps franchise on the Wii, and maybe RS could grow into that, though it wouldn't hurt to have more.