Topic: What more do you think it’ll take?

[Pittbboi]

So, the Wii has been released to the public and it’s doing better than even most Nintendo optimists could have predicted, and it’s definitely making us pessimists think twice. PS3 sales and opinions are sagging and, after heaps of non-gamer praise, it seems like Nintendo may have just found the perfect vehicle to launch their “Blue-Ocean” strategy.

But it’s not over yet.

The Wii is a great console. Despite its flaws, the Wii is great enough that at this point, I feel that Nintendo has done enough to at least guarantee that it will maintain its market share. At the very LEAST this is guaranteed. Not only that, the Wii is the first home console from Nintendo that, in my opinion, actually has a chance to restore Nintendo to its former SNES glory (or get it pretty darn close with a chunk of the market that’s a little more sizable). But to do that, it’s going to take a bit more on Nintendo’s end, or at least I think so.
What do you think? Has Nintendo done so much right with the Wii already that all they have to do is sit back and let things naturally unfold and end with them in the lead? Or do you think there are still a few hurdles and life lessons Nintendo needs to learn in order reach the level of success it actually has a chance at this gen?

One thing I think Nintendo can do to make sure the Wii’s numbers stay high is capitalize on PS3’s post launch drought, and that entails making sure that they don’t have one. Right now the Wii’s one disadvantage (lack of power) isn’t as glaring because, frankly, PS3 doesn’t have any outstanding games that show off great graphics and great gameplay (and Xbox360 has, like, 2). And, with this HEAVY drought they’re in for, it looks like this will be the case for a long time.  Nintendo couldn’t have asked for a better shot to prove that graphics don’t matter as much as gameplay. Unlike the PS3, the Wii has a good list of great games that are going to be released in the not so distant future. Or hopefully, because they haven’t been announced yet. Games like Mario Galaxy, Smash Bros. Brawl, Mario Party, and Metroid are games that are supposed to be spread out over 2007. It may be because they genuinely need the time to fine-tune the games. But Nintendo has been known to say that just to spread their titles over the year.

I honestly think they might better help the Wii out if they don’t do that. I think they should release any game they can in the post-launch period (beginning of next year) and rely on 3rd parties a little more to fill out the latter end. 3rd party support has already been boosted this time around so Nintendo shouldn’t have to worry about carrying the weight themselves by spreading out their titles. If they legitimately need the time to fine-tune the game, go ahead. But if a game can be released, I think ASAP would be the best time. PS3 is teetering on the thin line between failure and slow-start success, and if Nintendo can flood the market with awesome games at this most crucial point before the PS3 find its legs, it won’t just curb enthusiasm for the PS3, but generate even more enthusiasm for the Wii.
Anyway, that’s what I think? What about you?  

[segagamer12]

whatever happend to the old Nintendo that mandated 1 game a  year no more no less and wouldn't let 3rd parties get away with crap. I miss those days. When Nintendo acted like the boss they got respect. But then again they chased people away too so maybe its better this way.


I think it is up to the 3rd parties to make GOOD use fot he remote to keep people coming in. We know Nintendo will make it look good, but what about Midway, Acclaim, Sega, Activision, EA, Konomi, Capcom? Will they make good use of it? EA has set up a whole studio just for Wii, and so has Disney. But I think that it will be up to the major players to show it off properly. Activision and Ubisoft are off to a good start. I hope Sega can get some of thier magic back with Wii and maybe Midway too.

I think they should get Metroid out in time to match Halo 3. And market the hell out of it. I am shocked to see so many Wii commercials when I saw only three GC commercials it entire lifespan.

I dont watch the tv chanels the usually advertise on so its nice to see thier ads poping up where they belong.

If they can keep it up with the marketing and come up with some kick ass ads to show off Metroid Prime 3 as the better FPS vs Halo 3 they might be in good shape. Halo 2 killed Echoes and Halo 3 could stunt MP3s growth a bit if Nintendo doesnt recognize its existance.  

[BigJim]

The system's just a few weeks old. Obviously execution is far from complete. Sales this holiday are all riding the hype train. Long term staying power in the next 2 years, and ability to tap the critical mass is not yet proven. Even the iPod took 2 years to take off.

They'll do better than GameCube. How much better is anybody's guess. But Nintendo's already hinted at hoping for 30+ million, which is itself basically a 50% sales increase over GCN, and on par with N64.

[Smash_Brother]

Quote
Originally posted by: segagamer12 whatever happend to the old Nintendo that mandated 1 game a  year no more no less and wouldn't let 3rd parties get away with crap. I miss those days. When Nintendo acted like the boss they got respect. But then again they chased people away too so maybe its better this way.

That was Yamauchi's Nintendo, the same Nintendo which most 3rd parties were all too happy to give the finger and leave when Sony showed up as an alternative.

It was treating 3rd parties like indentured servants that lost Nintendo the fight against the PS1. Nintendo is only now starting to regain the trust of 3rd parties and with the 3rd party sales of Wii games being quite strong, it's very good news for Nintendo as it shows that they're willing to allow 3rd parties a place at the table instead of trying to push their games first and foremost.

And Sony's "it's HD or nothing" attitude is certainly helping Nintendo to look like the good guy by comparison.

[Ian Sane]

What really matters is how well the Wii sells when anyone can just walk into a store and buy one.  We don't know that yet.  And while the PS3 has a drought so does the Wii.  While there is some stuff I don't see anything really meaty with a solid release date yet.  Metroid and Mario and all that is down the road.  We know they're 2007 games but we don't know the specifics.

I think what the Wii really needs is THAT game.  And by that I mean the game that everyone plays and is talking about.  The Cube had ZERO titles like this.  The N64 had at least three and you could probably argue it had more than that.  PS2 had GTA3.  Xbox had Halo.  It's that game that is so huge that everyone is playing it and if they're not they're at least talking about it.  You read something unrelated to videogames and the writer mentions it.

[Smash_Brother]

The DS had THAT game, Brain Age.

I swear, they just need to release "Body Age" for the Wii with physical exercises instead of brain exercises and they have the western market cornered.

[IceCold]

SSBM for the Cube, and many would argue WiiSports for Wii (haven't played it yet, but it's getting a lot of reaction from the press and great word-of-mouth)

[Smash_Brother]

Arguably, yeah, Wii Sports is indeed THAT game.

[couchmonkey]

I agree with Ian on the idea that we need the game that shows off the concept, except I don't think it will be just one game.  I think Wii Sports is already a huge step in the right direction, it may even be THAT game.  However, more are needed.  Wii Music has a lot of potential and I think Mario Galaxy could have the potential too, depends on how complicated it is.

Most likely, the product that we're looking for hasn't even been announced yet, but as long as Nintendo does a good job of searching for it and getting it out to the people once it's found, then Wii is in good shape.  Someone on here had the idea of a car mechanics game, I thought that was a great idea.

Also, Nintendo needs the third party support, but I think that's already coming along nicely.  If support continues on this level and Nintendo finds more system-proving concepts, I think the support will grow naturally.

[Pittbboi]

I agree, Ian. Gamecube definitely lacked THAT game. IceCold, I wouldn't exactly say SSBM was a THAT game in the same way GTA3 and Halo were. Granted, SSBM was one of the best games released on the Cube, but it didn't sell systems the way GTA3 and Halo did. People who didn't know jack-zip about games were talking about those two games. You know it's a THAT game if, while you're playing and no matter WHAT you're playing, some old person or parent walks up and says something like, "So, what's that you're playing? Halo?" Even if you're playing Mario Sunshine. Gamecube had nothing like that.

The Wii-Sports gets close. But I think it's too targeted at the non-gamer to be THAT game.

But Wii needs a THAT game that isn't Wii-sports. In my opinion, it's going to take a more "traditional" game to become THAT game for the Wii. For the PS2 and Xbox, heck even the N64, THAT games weren't "hippie" games that were targetted at non-gamers like Wii-Sports. They were "hardcore" games that were so hyped and such HUGE surprise hits that even non-gamers wanted it, even if all they did was run around punching people and screwing hookers, or run around the screen shooting at anything on the screen, not knowing what they were doing.

But I think it's important that they find THIS game as soon as they can. Because so far Nintendo has been riding on the wiimote and the idea that Gameplay is more essential than Graphics and Xbox360 and PS3 aren't offering much in the way of gameplay. Which so far is true. But, eventually, Xbox and PS3 are going to get a game that simply nails BOTH graphics and gameplay (something Wii just isn't capable of this gen). If Wii doesn't have THAT game by them, they might lose a LOT of their hype.

[Ian Sane]

"SSBM for the Cube"

I heard about it online a fair bit but it wasn't big enough that I would consider it.  I never heard strangers on the bus talking about SSBM.  I still hear people talk about Halo today.  SSBM wasn't a phenomenon, it was just a really popular game.  I'm talking games that transcend the console they're on.  It doesn't matter what console it's on, people will just get it.  The console just becomes the machine that plays THAT game.

[NinGurl69 *huggles]

Cooking Mama.

Now, go away, everyone.

[zakkiel]

I know SSBM sold the Cube to me, personally.

[Arbok]

Quote
Originally posted by: Ian Sane
"SSBM for the Cube"

I heard about it online a fair bit but it wasn't big enough that I would consider it.  I never heard strangers on the bus talking about SSBM.  I still hear people talk about Halo today.  SSBM wasn't a phenomenon, it was just a really popular game.  I'm talking games that transcend the console they're on.  It doesn't matter what console it's on, people will just get it.  The console just becomes the machine that plays THAT game.

It sold around 6 million copies... what more do you want from it?

In contrast, Halo sold around 7 million and Halo 2 sold around 7.5 million. But neither compare to GTA, with Vice City scoring 14 million. Still, SSBM should be included given the HUGE number of software it pushed.

[ThePerm]

i wanna know the virtual console tie-in ratio, i bet nintendo is raking in mad dough on that stuff.

[couchmonkey]

To me, the big game for Wii probably will be a non-gamer game - at least in Japan.  Why?  Because those are the games that made it big on DS.  Animal Crossing, Brain Training and Nintendogs.  We're starting to see some more traditional games like New Super Mario Bros (still designed with non-gamers in mind) and Pokemon, but the initial spike in Japan was caused by all these other products.

In North America it might be something different, who knows?  Actually, if Wii Sports is THAT game, then we'll never know for sure because it's being sold hand-in-hand with the console.

I don't know if GameCube had the big monster game we're talking about or not, but I don't think it would have saved the system anyway.  GTA didn't sell 100 million PS2s all on its own.  It was the combination of many games that sold that system.  Halo was a huge deal, but the Xbox only outsold GameCube by a couple million systems.

I think the big game(s) for Wii have a better chance of making an impact because the system itself is so unique.  It's like Tetris - the game was big elsewhere, but I think the combination of Tetris and Game Boy was something really special.

[Ian Sane]

"It sold around 6 million copies... what more do you want from it?"

The "it" factor that SSBM didn't have but Halo and GTA3 did where it extends beyond gamer culture and becomes straight up pop culture.  This isn't just related to sales.  Sales is a factor but there also needs to be this public awareness of the game.  I'm talking about when your parents know of the game and mention it at some point and yet you don't have it and have never talked to them about it.

The Gamecube never had a game like that and the proof is simply that the Cube never had a period of time where it was a hot mainstream product.

This isn't a bash on SSBM.  The type of game I'm talking about is rare, though the market leading console always has at least one of them.

[Ceric]

Quote
Originally posted by: Arbok

Quote
Originally posted by: Ian Sane
"SSBM for the Cube"

I heard about it online a fair bit but it wasn't big enough that I would consider it.  I never heard strangers on the bus talking about SSBM.  I still hear people talk about Halo today.  SSBM wasn't a phenomenon, it was just a really popular game.  I'm talking games that transcend the console they're on.  It doesn't matter what console it's on, people will just get it.  The console just becomes the machine that plays THAT game.

It sold around 6 million copies... what more do you want from it?

In contrast, Halo sold around 7 million and Halo 2 sold around 7.5 million. But neither compare to GTA, with Vice City scoring 14 million. Still, SSBM should be included given the HUGE number of software it pushed.

I want it to be a household name.  That's what Ians getting at.  Mario is a household name.  Halo has became a household name.  Same with GTA.
As I've said before you can't design a game to be "that" game it has to just happen.

Oh and Nintendo doesn't need to really be hitting Sony while there down, which they are at the moment.  No like in all good videogames, and in real life, you need to hit them right before they get there footing.  That way you don't just do base damage you also get the damage from the fall.

At the moment I think ironing out the Technical side of things will make or break Nintendo faster.  Like,

1) Fixing the transfer of saves from SD card
2) Weather Channel
3) News Channel
4) Internet Channel
5) VC Selection

These where all "on launch" features that have not shown as of yet.  It is frankly a shame that we don't have Ver. 1 of these and that they are not getting to work on Ver. 2.  Games will be in development and 3rd parties need a little time.  I see this as an excellent opportunity for Nintendo to sure up there offering where it needs it the most at the moment.  The little areas before they really have to start swinging out the big guns.  I personally am excited about BWii, Project H.a.m.m.e.r., and DQ.

[Luigi Dude]

Actually Zelda is the "it" game right now for the Wii since Ocarina of Time was one of the "it" games for the N64.  Every single person I've heard talk about the Wii has been about Zelda.  Alot of these people loved Ocarina of Time but didn't care for Majora Mask or Wind Waker.  Most of the public has been viewing Twilight Princess as Ocarina of Time 2, which I consider makes Twilight Princess an "it" game right now.

[Ceric]

Not yet.  It's the best known game.  It won't be it until the Wii is known as the console that Zelda just so happens to be on.

[The Omen]

All it will take is keeping the product coming while the PS3 languishes behind.  By the time Sony gets up to speed in about a year, the Wii could have 5-8 million consoles in the hands of gamers worldwide.  That basically ensures Nintendo a very successful generation.

[Arbok]

Quote
Originally posted by: Ian Sane
This isn't a bash on SSBM.  The type of game I'm talking about is rare, though the market leading console always has at least one of them.

What was the PS1's then?

[Ian Sane]

"What was the PS1's then?"

Final Fantasy VII.  People that had never played an RPG in their life ran out and bought a Playstation for it just because of the FMV shown in the TV ad.

[Arbok]

Quote
Originally posted by: Ian Sane
"What was the PS1's then?"

Final Fantasy VII.  People that had never played an RPG in their life ran out and bought a Playstation for it just because of the FMV shown in the TV ad.

So it would seem, I had no idea that game sold 9.8 million copies. Never would have figured it was bigger than either of the Halos.

[Galford]

I said it in another thread and I will say it again.

The Wii's real test will come when Halo 3 is released on the 360 and MGS 4 on the PS3.
Both have graphics the Wii can't reproduce and both will have not new, but at least solid gameplay.  Both will have large budgets for advertisements.

If Nintendo can weather those storms well then the Wii will do good this generation.  If not the expect 3rd party support to drop quicker then the Gamecube's did.

On a quick note about graphics, what ever game Sony is currently showing in store demos looks infinitely better then Excitetruck.  Nintendo needs to show better demos and new gamestyles ASAP.