Topic: Ultimate Nintendo Themed Party FPS brought to you By Spak-SPang

[Spak-Spang]

Take from the most recent diverse in the "The September edition of Nintendo Power" thread was talk about a new FPS idea for Nintendo.  KDR said that Nintendo really needs to focus on their own Party FPS that focuses on well balanced and enjoyable online play like Halo.  The game should be simple and immediately accessable, something most FPSers have partially achieved.  

Here is my idea.  

Nintendo Battle Arena:

Players start by chosing one of several pre-modeled characters, or create their own character.  These characters are Anime/toon styled characters that are like regular joes.  When creating your own character specific Nintendo items can placed on your character.  Like an outfit that looks like Links Outfit, or Ash's hat, or Samus's helmet.  Popular Nintendo shirts can also be worn...and if you want you can design your own T-Shirt for the characters.

The weapon of choice in the game, is a Wired Zapper that plugs into battery packs worn on the Belts of each character.  You are limited to holding 4 Battery Packs of ammo.  Different colored Battery Packs give you different attacks via your Zapper.  These attacks are representative of traditional and not so traditional classic FPS weapons, and side scrolling shooting weapons.  Example:  Red battery packs can be used to shoot a spread shot much like Contra.  The blast is a very weak energy shot that desipates quickly.  Blue Battery pack and shoot powerful lasers that bounce.  

When neccessary some battery packs will morph the Zapper into special guns like a Rocket Launcher type weapon, or the Super Scope.  

Players can also collect generades and mines to lay across the field.  Mines are simple timed, or proximity to keep the game simple and not remote controlled.  

Players are digitally transported to battle zones modeled after famous Nintendo franchises (though the main mascots will not appear).  These worlds are alive with traditional enemies from that game world that act like enemy AI attacking you and approaching you as they would the main hero of the series.  So they aren't neccessary horribly dangerous, you do need to know they are around.  

The emphasis and spirit of the game is not to allow Nintendo's franchises to fight ala FPS, but to allow the gamer to visit and battle in Nintendo themed worlds.  

Stage examples would be:

Mario Ice World:  Fight on an Icy Mountain with a slide for quick traveling down the slope, and giant rolling snowballs to avoid.  Wind Storms may pickup to blow you around and mess up your aiming, but overall a pretty safe battle from enemies.

Mario Plains:  Goombas, Paratroops, and Spinys are all over the place.  Run around and battle in this world that lives and breathes Mario.  Warp Pipes can help you sneak up on enemies.

Metroid:  This lava based level has you carefully jumping about and Metroids are flying about stealing your energy.  Feeding Metroids Grow, and if one becomes giant it may give the captured energy to human player making them super powered.

F-Zero:  Oops Somebody transported us right on the track of Mute City and a race is going on.  This level is highly dangerous because of the one hit kills of the racers zooming by.  Watch the map, and keep away from the drivers as you hunt your prey.  

I am sure you can all come up with more ideas.

Also this game will introduce powerups from the worlds you are playing in.  In Mario you can collect Fire Flowers for special generade effects, and Starman for limited invincibility.  

F-Zero you can climb into an abandoned F-Zero racer and attempt to run over your prey.

I think this game has huge opportunity to BE the online game to play.  The whimsical nature of the game makes it friendly for all ages and all types of gamers.  The concept of the game allows you to literally go wild with Nintendo themed options and battle possibilities.  

[Caliban]

So basically you mean human characters versus human characters, in the Nintendo universe? I like it! I'm also fine if weapons aren't just beam based, I want swords, knives, darts, whips, lances, bow and arrows/crossbows, rifles, pistols, revolvers, shotguns, etc...

However I too would very much like Nintendo to do a seperate online FPS not set in the Nintendo universe. Don't ask for details from me, anything else not related to nintendo but made by nintendo would be excellent.

[Kairon]

Great idea! Can I comment?

I'm envisioning your game as a sort of third-person massively multiplayer free-for-all nintendo-themed fantasy.

I mean, first off, you describe this pwnful Tony Hawk-like character creation system that puts the player's own identity in the game, and then dresses them up in Nintendo Gear (Mario's hat, Tanooki suits, Link's jerkin, Zelda's dress, Samus' arm-cannon, Falcon's helmet) and even accessorizes in-match with other gear (red shells, fire flowers, zappers, etc.).

Then they'd play in large, 16+ player free-for-all matches, like a 3rd person Smash Bros, but with superpowered normal people in Nintendo gear and gadgets. It'd be action-oriented, not shooting oriented, more like a multiplayer frenzied Mario-slash-kirby's air ride city trial!

Oh, but these kids playing would be super-powered. They'd wall-jump off of high-rises and run through parks real fast, they'd jump so high they could practically fly, all while carrying a red shell they release at exactly the right moment to nail the kid wearing a round Kirby body on his torso who is going all-out with his fire flower.

Oh, but the stages wouldn't be Nintendo themed worlds. They'd be non-descript modern day settings, non-descript city parks, city downtown areas with lots of skyscrapers, perhaps a suburb, perhaps an large empty stadium, or even a forest or some tropical islands! They'd be more like the Onett level in Earthbound, they'd be more like the world of Elebits, than they would be any crazy in-game Nintendo setting.

This dichotomy of real characters with super abilities, speed, aiming, jumps... of nintendo gear and weapons and items, but in semi-real world settings... of real life, but real life PLAY...

Yes! Just like this "Who are you?" Commercial Nintendo had in Japan: Who Are You?

This would be a game where the idea is not to win, but to play. "Soaring" around skyscrapers, leaping from island to island, climbing up trees in a forest, then using a power-up mushroom, firing a charged blast from Samus' arm cannon, letting loose a magic blast from link's sword. And when you're hit, no gore, no blood, but getting knocked around safely, exaagerated like Ash gets knocked around in the anime, not dying but merely losing a life and "blinking" out of existence!

I mean... so cool!

Oh, and my favorite idea: don't use zappers. Use wiimotes. And then have them powered up just like in elebits where you can point your Wiimtoe at another player and toss them around gravity-gun like.

~Carmine M. Red
Kairon@aol.com

[Spak-Spang]

Kairon:  Great comments.  I think moving the idea to 3rd person perspective may actually be better.  It would allow you to use different items, and like you said use more interesting powers.  A control scheme like Super Mario Galaxy, mixed with BWii would work great for this.

I like the idea of having more realistic worlds for some maps, but I also think it is important to a few whimsical and fantasy levels in the mix.  Specially since this is Nintendo and when I imagine this game, I think about what I would do in the world of Mario, or what I would do in the world of Zelda.  

However, that real world concept brings another element of complete surrealism that works brilliantly as well with the idea.

The Wiimotes or Wiipointers for the weapons is also sheer brilliance and I bow to your greater wisdom.  What works with this is that the Wiimoter can act like a gun without being a gun, but then can "morph" like my original idea into a sword or bat which you are swinging around more like project H.A.M.M.E.R.  You are brilliant.

I imagine the defeated animations being very old school.  Like a digital explosion of pixels, and then when you respawn the pixels come back together in another location.

[Spak-Spang]

PS:  Please anyone else have any thoughts to expand the idea let me know.

[Ceric]

I couldn't find an image to link but deaths should be like Megaman or better yet Like Strider in the Arcade game.

[Caliban]

Quote
Originally posted by: Spak-Spang
Kairon:  Great comments.  I think moving the idea to 3rd person perspective may actually be better.

The purpose of this new game was for it to be a FPS, but since it's moving to a 3PS I guess we're back to a Smash Brothers kind of game...they already have  a Smash Brothers type of game, so ummm where are we left then?

[Spak-Spang]

Caliban:  Not exactly.  It is still a shooter...or can be.  You can easily just switch to FPS when you are aiming a weapon.  I am one that perfers the Goldeneye concept of limited movement when aiming, or no movement.  So you can switch to FPS aiming when you pull out a gun, and then you limit yourself to the special moves you can do.

Or you can drop the ideas that Kairon brought to the table and keep it my original design.  Add some of your own thoughts to the mix.  

Its becoming a PGC brainstorming gaming now.

[Caliban]

Hmmm, the idea to switch at will/choice between first-person and third-person gaming would be optimal.

How about we have a weapon/s that create insanity effects on it's target. I only gave out ths idea for spite on SK.

[Spak-Spang]

Caliban:  Now that is an idea I like.  First, indirect weapons that adversely affect enemies but not kill or injure them are rarely used.  Slowing down an enemy, or confusing them or even speeding them up too fast can be just as much life threatening and evil as attacking them directly.

I give you kudos as well.

[KDR_11k]

Battery packs and morphing weapons sounds like it'd confuse beginners. The common powerups must be easily distinguishable and intuitive.

I really don't think this game should turn into a big Nintendo fan-fest. Remember, we're trying to attract new audiences here, not please the hardcore fans that would buy the Wii anyway. It must appear at least semi-serious to the casual observer. That doesn't mean realism, that means the stylization must be more subtle. And for the love of the FSM, no Mario powerups! Those are way too overused and aren't useful for FPSes (remember, weapons must have range and ammunition). Of course humour is good and I don't think it should be bloody. Either use robots for the players so you can have ridiculous explosions when one is taken out and maybe hilarous designs that make you wonder how they can even move or go for something like NERF Arena Blast or Laser Arena, non-lethal weapons.

[Kairon]

It's hard to see anything Nintendo themed make it into a true-to-god FPS.

Maybe we should ditch the whole Nintendo fan service celebration and just call for a completely new IP without any reference to Nintendo brands?

~Carmine M. Red
Kairon@aol.com

[King of Twitch]

Beanstalks. I've never had a shootout while hanging from a beanstalk. Think of a castle full of rooms with those spinning gates from SMW. Maybe only one character from each team would have the ability to punch so you have to stick together to advance.

Combine weapons with items: find a Zelda shovel lying around, dig a hole and plant some mines. Dig a trench and hide out. Use Luigi's vaccuum to uncover them safely and then launch them. Have some sort of jousting on mario 64's green shells. Launch yourself at opponents with a floating, movable DKC2 barrel.

Shoot and freeze an enemy with the ice arrow. Pull out the Mario sunshine water pack and spray them to push them floating onto the middle of a lake. Melt snow at the top of a hill to unleash an avalanche on opponents. Shoot yourself with an ice arrow to create a one-hit ice shield against a rocket launcher.

Fight against a massive army of fascist pikmin in a co-op mode. Liberate gardens all across an entire city for the good pikmin.


I think Camelot's style in the Mario Golf/Tennis games would work well

[Spak-Spang]

I see why you are talking about ditching the Nintendo theme, and it may be a great point.

Their are a couple of reasons I went with a Nintendo theme:

1)It is known, and comfortable.  People have played around in the Mushroom Kingdom, battled across the fields of Hyrule, and such.  These levels bring about a tradtional classic feel to them.  Something I wanted to capture...the feeling of classic/traditional games in the modern era.

2)Capturing the hardcore as well as the casual nongamer.  If you make the game more gritty, realistic you are definately going to get more of the FPS base, however you will alienate the female market, older gamer market, and nongamer market...or you could potentially.  I am trying to create a game that feels like Nintendo and can attract a huge vast audience without offending anyone.

3)Realistic can still be done and still have special levels that are Nintendo.  

FINALLY:

MJRX:  I love your idea of combining weapons to make combos or strategies...though we don't want to make it overly complicated...what weapons combine with what.  Instead ideas like digging a hole to hide a mine is perfect, and your brain already thinks in such a manner.  More stuff like that would be great.

KDR:  You are completely right about the battery packs, that was just my first idea.  But definately too abstract.

[Kairon]

Personally, I think we should drop the idea of a Nintendo theme because

1. We were thinking of an FPS to catch the *ahem* "Halo crowd. " Nintendo brands probably aren't what these people are looking for, they're probably looking for something a little less fantastical and a little less gleefully abstract. Staying true to the whimsy of Nintendo might backfire by making the game seem... well... teh kiddeh.

2. Sticking to Nintendo brands limits our creative ability to adopt new game paradigms. Perhaps if we dropped Nintendo fan service, it would be easier to come up with a game idea suitable for our needs. Maybe Nintendo brands ultimately will prove incompatible with the game experience you want to create?

3. We can STILL catch the female and casual market without Nintendo brands, it's just that we have to catch them through
-inclusive and non-complicated gameplay
-intuitive pick-up-and-play controls
-non-extrmely violent graphics and gameplay
  and
-a strong sense of female friendly backstory or plot or framing of the game's events. For example, females have recently become a big market for private-eye novels. Private eye novels with womanizing male main characters. Surprised?

Now that I've said my piece, I still want to champion my idea of an FPS where we use the Wiimote like the gravity gun in Elebits or Half-Life 2 where instead of shooting people, objects, vehicles, things, etc. we use our weapon to fire a grappling beam at them then toss or drag the around like they were weightless. Like we were all Jedi with mad force skillz.

It can be serious, it can be first person, but it's also new, unique, less hardcore, more intuitive, and not overly violent at all.

~Carmine M. Red
Kairon@aol.com  

[bustin98]

I just wanted to chime in with my support of 1st person/3rd person view switching and the inclusion of multiple wall jumps. I can picture an urban landscape of chasing people down and making a chase up to the roof tops by jumping up in an alley. It adds a sense of 'Should I follow or not?' as the first person could lay a trap (say an oil spill??) or the second person could decide to pick the other one off as he's jumping back and forth.

I would love to see this thread evolve into a game. Somebody who matters should be reading.

[KDR_11k]

Wall jumping is good, as UT2003/04 shows that creates a hidden layer of complexity the average person won't see but the pro will use to his advantage. Traps are fun in party games but you MUST have a mechanism that prevents mining spawn points.

Personally I'm against physics-based deathmatches, I hated HL2 deathmatch. Maybe as a special mode but it should not be a centerpiece of the standard mode (never mind the obvious claims of ripping HL2 off).

[Spak-Spang]

I agree with the physics based deathmatchs are a no no for this game.  This game should be something that although has complexity to it.  It must be 100% playable with basic techniques almost instantly upon picking up the game.

KDR is right.  Wall jumps and double jumps for that matter are easy to impliment and people can stumble upon them and learn their uses accidentally, but would age immense amounts of strategy to the game.

[Kairon]

Are we still talking of First Person, Third Person, or First/Third Person Switching? Because I can't imagine wall-jumping in first-person...hmmm...

The problem with typical FPS designs is they're based on twitch reflexes. That's a very hardcore element... and one I'm not sure it's worth pursuing. I'd rather capture the Halo crowd not by giving them something they've already come to expect, but giving them something new, unique, yet accessible.

Note to self: play HL2 deathmatch to find out how they screwed up gravity gun duels.

Oh, and physics are NOT complicated. They're universally understood. Things have weight. Things get thrown around. Things fall. C'mon, why do you think they're making Elebits have lots of little pikmin-esque cutesy things? It's probably a title they expect to be casual and non-gamer accessible.

~Carmine M. Red
Kairon@aol.com

 

[KDR_11k]

Are we still talking of First Person, Third Person, or First/Third Person Switching? Because I can't imagine wall-jumping in first-person...hmmm...

Play UT2004.

[Smoke39]

I don't like UT2K3/4's wall jumping.  Why can't I just press jump again?

[KDR_11k]

Because that's the key for double jump. You wouldn't like it if you tried to jump from platform to platform and were just a bit too close to the wall when you tried to double jump.

[Smoke39]

I guess.  But I don't like double-tapping the movement keys for dodging and walljumping.  It's too slow, and requires you to release a movement key, which also slows you down briefly.