Topic: HDTV

[MaryJane]

Hello, I kind of consider myself a geek. I love everything hi-tech and possess more knowledge on most electronics than your average joe(not you guys of course, its those "normal" people I'm refering to).

One area where I have not done as much research as I would like to is in HDTV's. Now I know a fair amount about them and how they work. The one grey area in all the research I've done, seems to be which technology offers the best viewings? LCD, DLP, CRT, or Plasma.

Now I know CRT's produce the best colors, especially black, that's a big thing in HD's I know, how good is the black. The TV i want to get, which i posted in another topic somewhere on this site is a plasma, after doing a ton of research on different models i settled on that one. Then I noticed that in all the other models I looked at none were DLP's or CRT's. The thing with CRT's is they don't go as large as the other formats, which is something I want. I want at least a 42" and I'm probably going to buy the 50" plasma I refered to earlier, if nothing dissuades me.

My question is, what are the main difference in the formats? I mean i've read what they're supposed to be, but is there anyone here who can tell me from viewing them what the differences are? Or anyone know a website that has done the research already and I can read their report?

I'm starting to lean towards DLP's but i've only just started researching DLP models, but they are rear projection, making them larger and heavier than others, but also cheaper from what I've seen so far, I'm also a little skeptical of projection T.V's because of the old days of videogames where a still screen could burn onto a projection screen. Something tells me they've since fixed this problem, but it's like how old people don't like to use microwaves and cell phones because there used to be reports that they caused cancer.

[Requiem]

Dude, how old are you?

Plasma produces the best color, LCD's are the cheapest, DLP is decent, CRT's really aren't where "it's" at.

[Ceric]

Biggest difference is viewing angle.  CRT gets you the best picture and viewing angle but it is the bulkest and least scalable, hence no big screen CRT's.  Projection tends to have a bad viewing angles.  If you not in front of it forget it.  Though all of the technologies have improved in this area.  As for the rest I know there are differences but I've seen exceptions to all the common problems with the different types of TV's.  It just goes to looking at it before you buy and see if it fits your needs. Oh about burn in.  Plasma has more of a problem with that than any of them but in newest generations they have it worked out for the most part.  If you've been spoiled by a good CRT display then you are going to have a hard time picking up a bigger one on the cheap.  I'll tell you that now.  Seeing is believing.

Edit:
You know Requiem I haven't been to impressed with the Plasma's I've seen in general though there are some really good exceptions.  Though we can all tell I'm a little CRT biased.

I'm also waiting for this for my next TV

[Requiem]

Well that depends Ceric....Where have you seen the plasma display? If it was in a store than forget about it. They have the best black, that's for damn sure (since the phosphor-whatever can actually turn off unlike LCD's).

[GoldenPhoenix]

Quote
Originally posted by: Ceric
Biggest difference is viewing angle.  CRT gets you the best picture and viewing angle but it is the bulkest and least scalable, hence no big screen CRT's.  Projection tends to have a bad viewing angles.  If you not in front of it forget it.  Though all of the technologies have improved in this area.  As for the rest I know there are differences but I've seen exceptions to all the common problems with the different types of TV's.  It just goes to looking at it before you buy and see if it fits your needs. Oh about burn in.  Plasma has more of a problem with that than any of them but in newest generations they have it worked out for the most part.  If you've been spoiled by a good CRT display then you are going to have a hard time picking up a bigger one on the cheap.  I'll tell you that now.  Seeing is believing.

Edit:
You know Requiem I haven't been to impressed with the Plasma's I've seen in general though there are some really good exceptions.  Though we can all tell I'm a little CRT biased.

I'm also waiting for this for my next TV

I think I have a CRT, it is a tube TV. It was relatively cheap as well (450$ or so), though it does not have HDMI connections, just component (my 360 can only run on 480p or 1080i). The picture is very crisp and I am quite happy with it, it seems the other HD TV's prices are mostly based upon how much technology they can cram in a smaller "body" instead of better visual quality.
 

[Ceric]

Yeah.  Mines the same way.  It's a Samsung 26-27"  I only recently started seeing any flat TV's that I thought approached it. (Theres a cool Philips I beleive one that has ambient backlighting and a really nice picture.  I was impressed for the technology of the display.)

[nitsu niflheim]

Plasma fades over time

LCD doesn't

I think Plasma can have burn in.  I've read that LCD doesn't have burn in.

[Caliban]

Quote
Originally posted by: MaryJane
My question is, what are the main difference in the formats? I mean i've read what they're supposed to be, but is there anyone here who can tell me from viewing them what the differences are? Or anyone know a website that has done the research already and I can read their report?

I'm starting to lean towards DLP's but i've only just started researching DLP models, but they are rear projection, making them larger and heavier than others, but also cheaper from what I've seen so far, I'm also a little skeptical of projection T.V's because of the old days of videogames where a still screen could burn onto a projection screen. Something tells me they've since fixed this problem, but it's like how old people don't like to use microwaves and cell phones because there used to be reports that they caused cancer.

Here are some websites/forums that I used extensively to research my recent purchase:
HDTVArcade Forum
AVS Forum
DigitalHomeCanada Forum
DigitalHomeCanada Site
Official Samsung FAQ (I only used this faq for info on DLP)
Official DLP Site

I would like to mention that I've looked and compared the weight of several 50" DLPs versus 50" Plasma. Who won? DLP! Believe it or not, 50" Plasma were between 40Kg and 50 Kg except one that was 34.2Kg (from Pioneer I think) . The DLPs were all between 30Kg and 35Kg. it surprised me too but the reality is DLPs are bigger but still lighter.

Also, DLP and LCD are immune to burn-in. Plasma will suffer from burn-in.

There's nothing much else that I can simplify for you, you are going to have to read from those sites or others you might encounter, specially the digitalhomecanada site and forum.

Don't dismiss the digitalhomecanada forum because there you will find bargains from american sites, just in case you would want to know if you do indeed live in USA.

What did I get from reading those forums and by doing a bargain hunt of my own? I got this:
Samsung DVD-HD860 HDMI Upconversion DVD Player
TRT 3-Foot HDMI Male to HDMI Male Black Digital Cable
Samsung 50" Widescreen HD Ready DLP TV HLR5066W (This wasn't the site I got it from, even Samsung doesn't have it listed lol, but it exists.)  

[Athrun Zala]

Plasmas can suffer from burn-in, although it has improved now
DLPs seem to have some lag, which is a no-no for gaming
LCDs CAN suffer from burn-in, but it's VERY rare. most of them have a sucky contrast ratio and not so hot response time
CRTs get too bulky and heavy, and don't get big enough (IIRC 40'' is the max screen size)
SED hasn't been released yet, but seems to be the most promising, I'd hold out for this one.

all in all, if you can't wait for SED, I'd get a nice Plasma

[Pale]

DLP lag is related to scaling of non HD signals.

For example:
If you plug a (new) Gamecube into your Samsung 67" DLP you will notice a lot of lag.  So what can you do?  Well if you tell the TV that you are currently playing a game, it shuts off all that HD scaling stuff and eliminates the lag.  The side effect?  You have to watch it squished throughout the entire 16x9 screen if you aren't playing a widescreen game.

Another option to solve the timing issue is to buy a high end vga converter.  These run about 100 dollars.

Any HD signal, including the 480p that Wii will support and older gamecubes support, will not lag at all.

Also, unless you like playing your games through a screen door, buy a DLP rear projection TV.  

[vudu]

What the heck is SED?  That's a new one to me.

[Ceric]

Follow my link from above.

[vudu]

Quote
a flat panel display technology that uses surface conduction electron emitters for every individual display pixel

Yikes.  Sounds expensive.

[MaryJane]

You guys are freakin awesome! Thanks for the wealth of information.

It seems I was correct in choosing a plasma, I'm getting one of those cool Philips with ambient light that Ceric mentioned.
I'm going to wait to see who wins the High Def DVD war before buying a new DVD player, but I might buy that upscaler.

I'm 22 btw, but thanks Req your summation was enlightening lol.

Oh, what does this mean?

Quote
Originally posted by: Pale

Also, unless you like playing your games through a screen door, buy a DLP rear projection TV.  

I have one more question, kind of long, and kind maybe should have its own thread, but I figure you guys may be able to answer it without needing another thread.
I'm going to buy a laptop, either the same week, or the week after I buy my T.V (which will be the weekend of the 18th, 5 days after my b-day), and I wanted to know. Is there anyway that I connect to the internet from anywhere with a laptop? The use of this laptop will be a 50/50 split with business and pleasure, and both would be aided by constant or readily available internet access. I just think it's kind of strange that a phone I paid $30 for can go online whenver and only costs $7.99 a month to do so, and yet all my searching hasn't led me to something similar for a laptop. Is it possible to connect the laptop to a cell phone and go onine that way? I haven't done nearly as much research into this as into HDTV's (and you know how much help  needed on that) but I think it should be possible, if not, I know where the hotspots are anyway, and I need to get a wireless router for when I get my 3rd DS, and eventually the Wii, since my original router broke.

[UltimatePartyBear]

SED sounds nice, but it apparently can't get much bigger than current CRT TVs, and it seems to be perpetually two years away.  I'm looking forward to DLP TVs with multicolored LEDs instead of lamps and color wheels, which supposedly takes care of just about every possible complaint about DLP, including the rainbow effect and lamp life.  They're supposed to hit the market this fall.

Edit:

Quote
Originally posted by: MaryJane
I just think it's kind of strange that a phone I paid $30 for can go online whenver and only costs $7.99 a month to do so, and yet all my searching hasn't led me to something similar for a laptop. Is it possible to connect the laptop to a cell phone and go onine that way? I haven't done nearly as much research into this as into HDTV's (and you know how much help  needed on that) but I think it should be possible, if not, I know where the hotspots are anyway, and I need to get a wireless router for when I get my 3rd DS, and eventually the Wii, since my original router broke.

Some friends of mine have what is basically a cell phone on a laptop expansion card.  They use it when they need to get online away from an accessible WiFi access point or ethernet cable.  I'm afraid I don't know the details, but what you're looking for does exist somewhere.

[Ceric]

Rock on.  I saw the Philips one at work and it does look nice plus the Ambielight should help a little with eyestrain because if you like me you be notorious for not having enough lights on.  

On the SED TV not being bigger then CRT... Well thats sort of wrong.  At the last CES they announced that the plan was to ship out the first screens no smaller then 55" and all the Demo units are 36".  Plus the technology is thinner and lighter.  Though I do have to agree it always seems 2 years away.

On the whole Internet everywhere thing welp look no more This is Verizons Solution  I'm fairly sure that Cingular has a competing product.  I know this has been out for a while and I've seen it being used by people in the boondocks.  Though I don't know how well it worked there.   Then I guess you could do an adhoc network so your DS's could use it.  I don't really know.  Or you could possible have a bluetooth phone and use the bluetooth connection to link your Laptop and phone together and sap off of it's Internet connection.  There are possibilities out there.

Hope that was helpful.

[UltimatePartyBear]

Ah, yes.  Now that I've read the source quoted by Wikipedia, it appears the article was cited strangely.  The source stated the demo units were 42" (big, but not compared to other HDTV tech), with plans for the first commercial units to be 55".   The Wikipedia article only cited the 42" size as the "maximum known."

Yes, officer, I am guilty of taking a Wikipedia article at face value without reading its sources.  Take me away.  

[Ceric]

It's ok.  Wikipedia has been proven to be about as reliable as a regular Encyclopedia.  Though it's doing well for technology thats not out in public yet.

[Caliban]

Quote
Originally posted by: Pale
DLP lag is related to scaling of non HD signals.

For example:
If you plug a (new) Gamecube into your Samsung 67" DLP you will notice a lot of lag.  So what can you do?  Well if you tell the TV that you are currently playing a game, it shuts off all that HD scaling stuff and eliminates the lag.  The side effect?  You have to watch it squished throughout the entire 16x9 screen if you aren't playing a widescreen game.

Another option to solve the timing issue is to buy a high end vga converter.  These run about 100 dollars.

Any HD signal, including the 480p that Wii will support and older gamecubes support, will not lag at all.

Also, unless you like playing your games through a screen door, buy a DLP rear projection TV.  

By new Gamecube, did you mean the ones that don't have component out?
I was informed of when playing games that all you have to do is turn off DNIe.
Oh I see, you did mean the newer GCs without component out, fortunately I've got an old GC. I would love to see an HDMI out on the Wii, seriously, just to tease you into HD gaming.

"Also, unless you like playing your games through a screen door, buy a DLP rear projection TV.  " > Huh? I didn't get it.  

[MaryJane]

Quote
Originally posted by: Ceric
Rock on.  I saw the Philips one at work and it does look nice plus the Ambielight should help a little with eyestrain because if you like me you be notorious for not having enough lights on.  

On the SED TV not being bigger then CRT... Well thats sort of wrong.  At the last CES they announced that the plan was to ship out the first screens no smaller then 55" and all the Demo units are 36".  Plus the technology is thinner and lighter.  Though I do have to agree it always seems 2 years away.

On the whole Internet everywhere thing welp look no more This is Verizons Solution  I'm fairly sure that Cingular has a competing product.  I know this has been out for a while and I've seen it being used by people in the boondocks.  Though I don't know how well it worked there.   Then I guess you could do an adhoc network so your DS's could use it.  I don't really know.  Or you could possible have a bluetooth phone and use the bluetooth connection to link your Laptop and phone together and sap off of it's Internet connection.  There are possibilities out there.

Hope that was helpful.

IMMENSELY!!

Cingular is actually better, they offer faster connections, more plan options, and more comprehensive information. Just in case anyone else was thinking of getting something similar, Verizon offers no deals if you're a current customer whereas Cingular does. Cingular also offer plans based on MB usuage, whereas Verizon only has one unlimited plan for $79.99. Just to share some info gleamed.

You're all awesome people btw. I should just copy this entire thread into the other thread asking why you love PGC. It's because of the people!
Thanks a bunch Ceric, I could kiss you, if and only if you were a hot female between the ages of 18 and 42, not too slim, not too fat, dark curly hair(on your head), a nice tan, easy-going, listens to hard rock (more like TOOL, less like Hatebreed, even though I do like Hatebreed), and umm... I think those are the only requirements... did I mention you must be hot?? LoL.

Seriously though, thanks a lot.  

[Pale]

My screen door comment is because in plasma and lcd tvs I feel like I can count the pixels by looking at them. The screen door effect is when there is enough of a black line between pixels that it is noticable.

For some reason I have this uncanny ability to see the flaws in any picture... and it freaking sucks.  I personally would never buy either a plasma or an lcd over a good DLP.

[Ceric]

What if I looked like this?

(Done by my sister: Clrkrex)  

[Requiem]

Quote
Originally posted by: MaryJaneThanks a bunch Ceric, I could kiss you, if and only if you were a hot female between the ages of 18 and 42, not too slim, not too fat, dark curly hair(on your head), a nice tan, easy-going, listens to hard rock (more like TOOL, less like Hatebreed, even though I do like Hatebreed), and umm... I think those are the only requirements... did I mention you must be hot?? LoL.

Seriously though, thanks a lot.

I've never seen a girl with curly pubic hair. Is that sh!t even possible?

P.S. I think your the first ganja-head I've ever met that listens to hatebreed.

 

[Ceric]

Quote
Originally posted by: Requiem
Well that depends Ceric....Where have you seen the plasma display? If it was in a store than forget about it. They have the best black, that's for damn sure (since the phosphor-whatever can actually turn off unlike LCD's).

I didn't see that or I answer earlier.  At work, which is a store, but most of my personal experience comes from the ones we have in my department in college and around the school.

[BigJim]

Quote
Originally posted by: Requiem

I've never seen a girl with curly pubic hair. Is that sh!t even possible?

You haven't seen enough 80's pr0n.