Topic: The OFFICIAL Big N rumor thread *bring your own salt*

[Kytim89]

Does anyone think that Nintendo will launch the Wii U in multiple colors? Honestly, if the Wii U just launches in white then I will pass because I prefer a black Wii U.

[Snake-Arms]

Does anyone think that Nintendo will launch the Wii U in multiple colors? Honestly, if the Wii U just launches in white then I will pass because I prefer a black Wii U.

You would pass on a console you want merely because the color doesn't please you?

Srong wit chu?

[Shorty McNostril]

Nintendo is not stupid enough to make a console that is still underpowered compared to its current competition and will still be underpowered when it new competiton arrives in the next few years.

I hate to be the nay-sayer, but I reckon they are.  They have given us no reason to believe otherwise.

[nickmitch]

I remember a time when Nintendo fans were optimistic and full of hope. But now? I dunno, man. I just don't know.

[BlackNMild2k1]

I just saw a mock-up of a Nyko branded uMote.
It looked pretty nice. Let me go find it again and I will edit it.

I hope it's a real concept and not just a fan made thing as that would all but confirm multiple uMotes per system (although it could just be for replacement controllers too).

Hopefully, there seemed to be a lot of fans upset when they suggested it would only support one controller. I just hope the system is powerful enough that the quality isn't degraded when using more then one. I know some of the rumors seemed to suggest that one controller can potentially hog a pretty big chunk of the resources, unless it is something simple like a map or item select screen.

That was Ideaman over at GAF that said that, and something else that he said that I meant to mention over here was that the Wii U OS is currently taking up ~512MB of system ram.

lherre (dev @ NeoGAF) has previously said that the Wii U dev kits have more than 2GB of RAM in them, so that means that the Devs still have atleast 1.5GB RAM to play with if we are to take them both for their word.

and since the dev kits usually have more RAM than the retail unit, that should at minimum give the Wii U 1GB of RAM to play with. Hoping for 1.5GB

Now considering that the the Wii U is at minimum outputting PS360 level graphics only at 720p/480p (between TV & uMote) with atleast double the ram and (speculated to have) atleast and 3X the eDRAM (32MB for frame buffers and other things), also using AMD's expertise in multiple screen output (even though it's usually one image rendered across multiple screens) using a GPU that is easily(read: theoretically) 3X the power of the PS360 units, you would think that outputting to a second controller shouldn't be too taxing if we aren't looking for anything more than PS360 level output (which is not as bad as it sounds since it will be 480p on a 6.2" screen) while still maintaining atleast 720p output on the screen.

Can someone direct me to the page/topic with the rumors consolidated?

I need to update it, but check my sig at the bottom of my post.

[Shorty McNostril]

I was optimistic until I heard all these recent rumors.  I have always given Nintendo the benefit of the doubt.  But it is really wearing thin on me. 

I mean sure.  Some high profile figures in the gaming community have said that the hardware is good.  Sure.  That's awesome.  But how can one ignore the other more recent rumors from "Anonymous sources"?  Ordinarily, they would be the ones to disregard, but given Nintendo's recent history and absolutely appalling decision making therein, I'm afraid I am now completely disregarding my former optimism until I am shown otherwise.

edit: Spelling

[ShyGuy]

The thing is Shorty, we've already seen things at the last E3 that look better than the current generation. The bird demo and the Zelda HD demo. Not to mention Ghost Recon looked as good as a PS360 game.

[tendoboy1984]

The thing is Shorty, we've already seen things at the last E3 that look better than the current generation. The bird demo and the Zelda HD demo. Not to mention Ghost Recon looked as good as a PS360 game.

Another thing people don't seem to understand about game consoles:


Graphics are constantly improving the more developers get accustomed to the system's architecture. Look at the early Xbox 360 launch games (Kameo, King Kong, Perfect Dark Zero, etc.) and compare them to the games of today. There is a huge increase in graphical quality.


When the Wii U launches, games will most likely look like modern Xbox 360/PS3 games (from the last 2 years, at least). But once developers get used to the system, they will be able to push it more.


Another good example is the PS3. Most of the launch games were buggy Xbox 360 ports, but then developers finally got used to the complicated Cell processor, and they were able to code their games more sufficiently. Look at Uncharted 3, Killzone 3, MGS4, etc.

[Caterkiller]

The thing is Shorty, we've already seen things at the last E3 that look better than the current generation. The bird demo and the Zelda HD demo. Not to mention Ghost Recon looked as good as a PS360 game.

Yeah and Darksiders 2 and Aliens as well. We have anonymous sources and then we have real games! And you got my testimonial!  Who you gonna believe some random mystery man or me? The guy who only occasionally lies when it benefits him most with his own random mystery man!/joke WiiUE4 is our future!

[ShyGuy]

Look at Call of Duty 2, it was an Xbox360 launch game in 2005 and it practically looks like the Conduit! A few years later and the graphics have much improved.

[Chozo Ghost]

I'm afraid I am getting more and more disheartened by everything I hear now.  I am growing more and more fearful this will be the Wii all over again.  An underpowered machine with a gimmick strapped onto it. 

I hear ya. The only difference for me is that I'm not really disheartened, because in order to be disheartened I would have to be heartened in the first place, but ever since E3 2011 when Reggie announced the name of the new console was going to be "Wii U" my heart sank like the Titanic, and ever since then my expectations for the new console have been very low.

But that said, I did expect at the very least it was going to be more powerful than the PS360. If it can't even pull that off then even my very low expectations for it won't be met. I guess we just have to wait and see. Maybe in two months time at E3 more stuff will come to light and maybe alot of these rumors about the hardware being trash will be put to rest.

I never thought I would say this, but if this thing does turn out to be thus I will not be purchasing it until it see it in a bargain bin somewhere.  Which incidently I don't think will be that long a wait.  Can they really pull off a Wii miracle for 2 generations?  I doubt it very much.

I think they can and they will. By being the first on the market and at such a low price and with the Wii name attached they will draw the same casual crowd they did 6 years ago. Maybe its possible it won't do quite as well as the Wii did, but I can't see how it can really fail in a commercial sense.

But that doesn't matter to me. It can sell 200 million units for all I care, but if its severely underpowered and developers don't want to support it with the sort of games I want to play then what good does it do me if it is breaking sales records left and right? I don't care at all about the "Wii ---" series of games, or the raving rabbids or "let's dance" casual party stuff. Millions of people do love this stuff though, so the Wii U should do quite well sales wise, but what does that mean to me as a "core" gamer?

[Shorty McNostril]

Fellas.  Please don't misunderstand me.  I would love ever so much if I was wrong. 

But look at Nintendo's recent history.  Look at what we have seen.  And listen to what we have been hearing lately.  I just can't help but be pessimistic until I am shown otherwise. 

We have seen it all before.  We are all hyped up, ready for E3 with bated breath.  Waiting very impatiently for Nintendo to start dropping the Banzai Bills *Cue BNM gif*.  What happens?  Probably what usually happens.  Something so glaringly obvious will not be supported or some juvenile mistake will lleave us all feeling extremely underwhelmed.

It happens time and time again.  At least if my expectations are already low, I'm not going to be left disappointed. 

Like I said.  I would LOVE to be wrong.  I want to be looking forward to the launch knowing that this is the system we have been waiting for for the last 10 years.  This is the one the all the 3rd parties will flock to.  This is the one that will not get the spinoff junk that the Wii got.  This will be the one that puts Nintendo back in the spotlight as the system to own.  This is the one that won't get fobbed off as a toy. 

Please, please, please, please!!!

[UncleBob]

With all this talk about the system innards not being finalized... If Nintendo's aiming for a mid-November release (and surely they are), when do they need to start making these things?  What's the lead time on a product like this?

[tendoboy1984]

I'm afraid I am getting more and more disheartened by everything I hear now.  I am growing more and more fearful this will be the Wii all over again.  An underpowered machine with a gimmick strapped onto it. 

I hear ya. The only difference for me is that I'm not really disheartened, because in order to be disheartened I would have to be heartened in the first place, but ever since E3 2011 when Reggie announced the name of the new console was going to be "Wii U" my heart sank like the Titanic, and ever since then my expectations for the new console have been very low.

But that said, I did expect at the very least it was going to be more powerful than the PS360. If it can't even pull that off then even my very low expectations for it won't be met. I guess we just have to wait and see. Maybe in two months time at E3 more stuff will come to light and maybe alot of these rumors about the hardware being trash will be put to rest.

I never thought I would say this, but if this thing does turn out to be thus I will not be purchasing it until it see it in a bargain bin somewhere.  Which incidently I don't think will be that long a wait.  Can they really pull off a Wii miracle for 2 generations?  I doubt it very much.

I think they can and they will. By being the first on the market and at such a low price and with the Wii name attached they will draw the same casual crowd they did 6 years ago. Maybe its possible it won't do quite as well as the Wii did, but I can't see how it can really fail in a commercial sense.

But that doesn't matter to me. It can sell 200 million units for all I care, but if its severely underpowered and developers don't want to support it with the sort of games I want to play then what good does it do me if it is breaking sales records left and right? I don't care at all about the "Wii ---" series of games, or the raving rabbids or "let's dance" casual party stuff. Millions of people do love this stuff though, so the Wii U should do quite well sales wise, but what does that mean to me as a "core" gamer?

So you're lumping all traditional gamers (I hate the term "core gamer") into one demographic by saying the "Wii ____" games are mainly enjoyed by casual gamers? I find that highly stereotypical. I've been playing video games since 1990 (I'm 27 now), and I highly enjoyed Wii Sports and Wii Sports Resort.


Simplicity in video games can be fun too, you know. Look at the various arcade/puzzle games out there: Pac-Man, Tetris, Angry Birds, Dig Dug, Galaga, Asteroids, Donkey Kong Arcade, Mario Bros. Arcade, etc.


I find games with a simple concept and engaging gameplay to be more captivating than games with the latest graphics, guns, violence, cinematic presentations, etc. The whole concept of a video game is fun, and sometimes the most simple games can be the most fun. If it has that special gameplay hook that keeps me playing and enjoying the experience, then it's a good game to me.


Why do you think some of the most highly-revered games came during the 2D era (8-bit and 16-bit generations)?


Do you really think:
- Call of Duty
- Assasin's Creed
- Gears of War
- Bioshock
- Uncharted
- Forza Motorsport
- Killzone
- LittleBigPlanet
- Uncharted
- SOCOM
- Plants vs Zombies
- Angry Birds
- Cut the Rope
- Infinity Blade
- Dead Space
- Mass Effect

...etc. will be remembered 20 years from now?

Will we have the same nostalgia for those franchises that we have for:
- Mario
- Zelda
- Metroid
- Pokemon
- Sonic
- Mega Man
- Castlevania
- Street Fighter
- Mortal Kombat
- Final Fantasy
- Chrono Trigger
- Resident Evil
- Mario Kart

...etc.? I doubt it.

[Kairon]

Navigating the dangerous soul-wrecking straits of Hype is a perilous and important travail for every Nintendo fan. I wish you luck Shorty!

Personally, I've been following every rumor, but my expectations are pegged almost squarely to what I've already seen. I personally already feel so excited for what E3 2011 promised: visuals as fancy as the Bird and Zelda demos and 3rd party experiences like AC3, DS2, and Aliens. That's all stuff I feel virtually guaranteed to get since it's been more or less confirmed and shown or publicized already. And while I definitely DO want more from Nintendo and the Wii U (an RE announcement, multitabled support), this handful of what I consider "knowns" is already enough to get me excited for launch.

[Shorty McNostril]

Navigating the dangerous soul-wrecking straits of Hype is a perilous and important travail for every Nintendo fan. I wish you luck Shorty!

Personally, I've been following every rumor, but my expectations are pegged almost squarely to what I've already seen. I personally already feel so excited for what E3 2011 promised: visuals as fancy as the Bird and Zelda demos and 3rd party experiences like AC3, DS2, and Aliens. That's all stuff I feel virtually guaranteed to get since it's been more or less confirmed and shown or publicized already. And while I definitely DO want more from Nintendo and the Wii U (an RE announcement, multitabled support), this handful of what I consider "knowns" is already enough to get me excited for launch.

Eh?

I am not hyped.  That was the whole point of the post.  I was.  But not now.  I am expecting mediocrity. 

[Kairon]

Eh?

I am not hyped.  That was the whole point of the post.  I was.  But not now.  I am expecting mediocrity. 

I mean "navigating hype" in the same sense as "keeping your own expectations under control."

[Chozo Ghost]

...etc. will be remembered 20 years from now?

Yes. I don't know about every single one of those, but some of them like COD are so extremely popular that they aren't going away anytime soon.

You also have to keep in mind these modern franchises are to kids today the equivalent of what Mario and Metroid and Contra and so on were to us back in the 80s-90s. Kids today who don't own Nintendo hardware don't know what these franchises are and it doesn't mean anything to them, just as Nintendo fans who grew up in the golden age probably don't give a crap about these new  fangled games kids are playing.

So its all about the perspective of what you played when you grew up. Kids who are playing Assassin's Creed and COD today will remember them with nostalgia 20 years from now, even though by then there will be some new franchises which we can't even imagine yet. That's the way it goes.


But to get this unrelated discussion back on topic, what do you think would have happened back in the 80s-90s if Nintendo had the same casual centric attitude back then that they do today? What if the big pack in game for the NES wasn't Super Mario Bros. but instead some 8-bit equivalent of Wii Sports? What if instead of making Zelda Miyamoto made an 8-bit Wii Music? What if instead of Metroid there was 8-bit Wii Play? Those games could have been fun, but they aren't the same thing.

What you have to keep in mind is all these great Nintendo games which core gamers have nostalgia for were made way back then before Nintendo turned their focus to casuals. Had that focus been there back in those days none of those franchises would ever have been created, or they would have been far different and unrecognizable.

Would we have the same level of Nostalgia for these games if they were what we had grown up with? I don't know the answer to that. Its possible. But all I'm saying is what Nintendo is doing today in the present day is a far cry from what they did decades ago when I became a fan in the first place.

So let me ask you will Wii Sports, Wii Music, Wii Play, etc. be remembered fondly 20 years from now? Or will they be rejected as gimmicky tech demos? The kids who grew up on these games in the here and now are the only ones who will know the answer to that, but we will have to wait about 20 years to see how they and history judge these games. Personally I don't think they have the same long term appeal as Mario, Metroid, Zelda, etc. but we shall see.

[Evan_B]

Right, because Duck Hunt was a hardcore experience that was totally not a casual tech demo at all.

Oh, wait.

I'm just gonna say this- Nintendo's been selling on underpowered tech for a while, now. They've made a ****-ton of money off of it, but they've lost the hardcore gamer. When they said this was a gaming device for YOU, they meant to reconcile the hardcore audience, to reconcile those who have been ready for Nintendo's franchises to leap into HD for a long time, now.

Whether or not the console is underpowered, I saw the HD Zelda demo. That is what I want. I will buy a Wii U if I get to play a game that pretty. That's all that really matters to me.

[Kairon]

Umm... back in the 80's Super Mario Bros. and Duck Hunt WERE casual. My aunts played Super Mario Bros. and showed me tricks and warp zones. EVERYONE played Duck Hunt.

I am of the opinion that the current "casual" is just a flavor of Nintendo's eternal commitment to gamers aged 2 to 92. From Dr. Mario to Brain Age, from the Power Pad to the Balance Board, from Duck Hunt to Wii Play, from Mario Paint to Wii Music, from Super Mario Bros. to New Super Mario Bros. I don't know, the Wii has made me feel so much more closer to the full breadth of Nintendo's gaming legacy than I have in a long time.

Don't get me wrong, I'm desperately praying for a wide array of new and exciting genres, experiences, and viewpoints on the Wii U. I'm just hoping that it also continues to remind me of why I became a fan in the first place. And maybe convince a few other people to join the club.

[Chozo Ghost]

Right, because Duck Hunt was a hardcore experience that was totally not a casual tech demo at all.

I'm not saying they didn't make any casual games then, nor that they aren't making new core games now (albeit not as many). That's not my point. My point is the focus.

How many brand new hardcore franchises has Nintendo created for the Wii? Not much, if any. The Gamecube introduced some new franchises, but almost all of the core Nintendo franchises that exist today were formed during the NES-SNES era. That was when Zelda, Mario, Metroid, Kirby, Star Fox, etc. came into being. The Gamecube gave us Pikmin and a few others. But what has the Wii given us that's new? There's the Wii ---- series of games, and that's pretty much it. No new core franchises. At least not from Nintendo directly. There is Red Steel, No More Heroes, etc. from third parties.

So as I said if this same attitude had been in place back in the 80s then a lot of the core Nintendo franchises never would have been created at all, or if they were they would be drastically different. Even existing core franchises have been casualized to some degree on the Wii, whether that was by necessity in order to work with the Wiimote, or whether it was things like having the game essentially play itself to take away the challenge from players to dumb it down and make it easy for them.

[Louieturkey]

I was optimistic until I heard all these recent rumors.  I have always given Nintendo the benefit of the doubt.  But it is really wearing thin on me. 

I mean sure.  Some high profile figures in the gaming community have said that the hardware is good.  Sure.  That's awesome.  But how can one ignore the other more recent rumors from "Anonymous sources"?  Ordinarily, they would be the ones to disregard, but given Nintendo's recent history and absolutely appalling decision making therein, I'm afraid I am now completely disregarding my former optimism until I am shown otherwise.

edit: Spelling

Well, I wish I could make some of Nintendo's appalling decisions.  I'd be super rich at this point.  People keep stating that Nintendo made horrible decisions, yet they fail to realize that these "horrible decisions" led to Nintendo's most successful period in history.  The Wii is their most successful home console ever and the DS is their most successful handheld system ever.

The only real mistake was not having the foresight to see how successful the Wii would be so that they could futureproof it a little better.  From all the rumors and statements they've made about the WiiU, they will have that foresight this time around and try to futureproof it as best they can.

I feel like Nintendo is just adding one generation inbetween the PS420 and PS580 generations so eventually they will be back on equal footing with those two systems in about 12 years time.

[Kairon]

So as I said if this same attitude had been in place back in the 80s then a lot of the core Nintendo franchises never would have been created at all, or if they were they would be drastically different.

Umm... Nintendo HAD no franchises in the NES generation. They had Mario and Donkey Kong... and that was it. The creation of new IP in past generations was due to NECESSITY. The slowdown of new IP generation was due to LACK of necessity. That's all there is to it, no dramatic left turn in company policy.

And if you want to capture people's nostalgias, you can continue doing this just as well with older franchises as with newer ones: case in point, yesterday I had an EXHAUSTIVE conversation with a kid whose first Pokemon games were Heart Gold/Soul Silver!!! Our respective introductions to the Pokemon series were TWELVE years apart and his zeal was not dampened at all. It doesn't matter that Mario was born in the 80's, if his games today are still good enough to strike an emotional chord with players, he'll qualify for Nostalgia patrol in 20/30 years. And hopefully, he'll still have new games coming out for a new generation of kids to discover and start the cycle all over again.

[Shorty McNostril]

Well, I wish I could make some of Nintendo's appalling decisions.  I'd be super rich at this point.  People keep stating that Nintendo made horrible decisions, yet they fail to realize that these "horrible decisions" led to Nintendo's most successful period in history.  The Wii is their most successful home console ever and the DS is their most successful handheld system ever.

The only real mistake was not having the foresight to see how successful the Wii would be so that they could futureproof it a little better.  From all the rumors and statements they've made about the WiiU, they will have that foresight this time around and try to futureproof it as best they can.

I feel like Nintendo is just adding one generation inbetween the PS420 and PS580 generations so eventually they will be back on equal footing with those two systems in about 12 years time.

What you say is true Mr Turkey.  But we need ask just one question.  Why should we as a consumer care if they profited?  Yes it sounds selfish.  But that is the hard truth.  Why should we care if they make 100 Billion dollars or 1 million profit?  As long as they have enough money to keep pumping out the awesomeness, then who cares?

In actual fact, this huge profit is probably the reason why Nintendo would once again make a limp wristed system.  They made a toybox with a CPU for nigh on free, slapped a Wii badge on it sold it for a (knowing Nintendo probably substantial) profit and watched their bank account exponentially grow.  Why not do the same thing again?

As long as the dollars roll in, who cares about the loyal followers who were there through the hard times.  If the average joe will pay them for toybox 0.5 with a shiny new gimmick than thats fine.

That is what worries me the most.  We keep hearing that the true follower is getting looked after, but nothing ever materializes except for the expected sequels.

[FZeroBoyo]

Let's take a break from the speculation and watch this video.


http://www.gametrailers.com/video/new-consoles/728876