Topic: Lost

[GoldenPhoenix]

Jesus references? The church that everyone was gathered in had symbols from various religions and it never favored one religion over another. It would be wrong for the show to detach itself from from the faith/spirituality aspects since that was a theme from the very beginning. Really I think you are reaching to say it had "Jesus" references. Religious references? Definitely. Eko was probably the most Christian character they had and he died quite awhile back.

Really? How many shots of that big statue of Jesus were there in the finale? If it's more than 1, it's too many. It wasn't even in the background. The statue was right in front of the camera so I don't think I'm reaching at all.

Wow, just wow. So you missed all the other symbols of various other religions?

[ShyGuy]

Yeah, the stained glass in the chapel had a Christian Cross, a Jewish Star of David, an Islamic Star and Crescent, a Hindu Aum, a Buddhist Wheel, and a Taoist Yin and Yang.

[Spak-Spang]

I thought the show was actually fairly religious neutral.  Yes it had references throughout the entire show to different religions, and probably the Christian and Jewish references were more common, but that are also the most recognizable...so I understood why they were there. 

However, at the end of the series very little of what actually happened is Christian doctrine.  And the ending was quite good.  Perfect?  No.  But very well done.  And better than I thought they could have achieved. 

[Adrock]

Wow, just wow. So you missed all the other symbols of various other religions?

Are you obtuse? (2 points for those who get that reference) Yes, I saw it. I get it. The camera focused on that stained glass window for roughly 13 minutes. They didn't make the religious symbolism and references a secret. There was just a lot more Jesus in the finale. What is so hard to understand about that? I didn't see big, in your face Yin and Yang symbols sprinkled throughout the episode. I didn't like director Jack Bender force feeding me all that Jesus, front and center in all those scenes, especially when the writers already wrote it into the dialog and plot. That's no longer subliminal let alone subtle. That's "Here's Jesus. Don't you get it yet? No, here he is again." Maybe that was the point; I just didn't like it. That's not artistic, it's obnoxious. It appeals to the lowest common denominator, for people too dense to get it any other way. Disagree? Fine. Don't treat me like I'm an idiot. I'm just saying, not my thing.

[ThePerm]

i didn't see anything overtly christian, the only thing I saw was pro-afterlife. I saw one large cross, but it was centered on far less than the non-denomination stained glass. If I saw anything overt it was more based on Hinduism than anything.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sa%E1%B9%83s%C4%81ra
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Purusharthas

"We are overwhelmed by our very human need to weave a web of meaning where there may be none. Since time immemorial, ancient peoples have dressed up their lack of knowledge as gods and demons. I have discovered that sometimes, the fates of gods and mortals intertwine – and legends are born..."
James George Frazer

that describes Lost

[ShyGuy]

Sheesh, you make it sound like Jesus is out to get you.


I thought the allegory was much more subtle than the Matrix 3 or the Chronicles of Narnia.

[Adrock]

/facepalm

There's nothing inherently wrong with religion or Jesus or what have you. That's not my problem with it. The extent to which they to ram it down everyone's throats was distracting. It was already obvious without going the extra 10 miles.

And just because the allegory is less subtle than other things, doesn't mean it still wasn't overdone.

[Caterkiller]

Now now guys and gals, you're all wrong. Settled right? On to more important things, what exactly were the numbers again?

[GoldenPhoenix]

Now now guys and gals, you're all wrong. Settled right? On to more important things, what exactly were the numbers again?

Numbers, symbols created by man to make sense of the world.

There you go.

Seriously the numbers could never really have a good explanation, they are just there and are interwoven with the lives of the characters there. They are also the Valenzetti Equation which is an apocalypse equation brought up in one of the Lost mini episodes.


Also here are some neat little tidbits.

There will be a bonus feature with the complete set that will have 15 minutes of footage dealing with the Ben and Hurley years.

http://tv.ign.com/articles/109/1093234p1.html

In addition in the season 6 set there will be 20 minutes in additional footage from The End that will answer some questions that is still in production. Then Damon and Carlton will address some others in a "humorous" way.

Oh yeah about the wreckage scene at the end, ABC admitting they added it themselves to let everyone cool down emotionally before the news.

Also Jesus made the Temple and the statue.

[ThePerm]

yes, he made the Statue of Taweret(sp?) circa 300 BC

[GoldenPhoenix]

yes, he made the Statue of Taweret(sp?) circa 300 BC

Time is relative on the island.

[gbuell]

Loved the episode. The only question that I care about at all that wasn't answered was the pregnancy question, and I'm okay with believing the theory brought up above. The more important thing was the emotional closure to these characters' stories, and they nailed it. The last scene with Jack dying was pretty breathtaking.


I didn't take the couple of shots of a statue of Jesus as being ramming religion down our throats at all. If you took it that way, I'd say you're oversensitive. I didn't even realize it was a statue of Jesus until it was brought up on this thread. It really seems like going out of your way to find something to take issue with.

[gbuell]

By the way, Brandogg's assertion that they made it up as they went along is patently false imo, at least after season 3.

[Sundoulos]

How LOST should have ended

[vudu]

How LOST should have ended

Oh man, that's fantastic!

Does anyone know where to find the "alternate endings" they were hyping up for the Jimmy Kimmel show? 

[MegaByte]

Does anyone know where to find the "alternate endings" they were hyping up for the Jimmy Kimmel show? 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YyKyjeRodd4

[vudu]

Really?  I was lead to believe there were actual alternate endings; not some lame joke endings.  Suck.

[Adrock]

Also Jesus made the Temple and the statue.

I would've taken that. At least they would've answered something no matter how absurd instead of negating 95% of the previous 5 seasons of the show.

[ShyGuy]

I've noticed that if a writer can use a common trope in their story to explain something, people will fill in the blanks because they are familar with it.

If you say:
They were ghosts.
Aliens did it.
It was Time Travel.
Advanced Robots.
They are vampires

People will go "Oh, okay that makes sense"

But if you said the person doesn't age and the rules say they can't touch garlic or be exposed to sunlight people will go "WTF they are making it up as they go along!"

Also, if you can tie it back into existing history or legend people will accept it.

You make up a hairless creature that sucks goats blood people won't except it, but it you say "The ancient legend of the Chupacabra" they think it's fine.

[GoldenPhoenix]

Yeah the last 3 seasons of Lost were planned out, I think they realized after season 3 they needed to have a definitive goal and focus on it. My guess is that they always knew how it would end (I think Matthew Fox said that since he knew what his final scene would be), and had a rough draft of everything between that no doubt evolved, but really it never felt to me like they were making it up as they went, perhaps it meandered a bit in places but I never had doubt that they had a sense of where they wanted to take it.

[ThePerm]

well season 4 got hurt by the writers strike, the series seemed to lose some steam after that. The next couple of seasons were good, but not in a first season sort of way. I think though lost proves that networks need to start some real intense planning when they create a series. I really hate how things are based on ratings(which i think for the most part are completely inaccurate), and i hope that changes in the future, DVD sales, and network hits should be a greater draw on how things get made.

[GoldenPhoenix]

well season 4 got hurt by the writers strike, the series seemed to lose some steam after that. The next couple of seasons were good, but not in a first season sort of way. I think though lost proves that networks need to start some real intense planning when they create a series. I really hate how things are based on ratings(which i think for the most part are completely inaccurate), and i hope that changes in the future, DVD sales, and network hits should be a greater draw on how things get made.

This year they have adjusted how they view ratings, it isn't soley dependent on Neilson anymore, which is why we are saying more shows being renewed this year who had lower Neilson ratings since they are taking into account other ways of viewing it such as DVR and online. Also why we may be seeing more product placement in shows. Seasons 5 and 6 were my favorite of Lost.

[ThePerm]

idk, it seems like they are taking off Happy Town after just 3 episodes of being on the air, if studio execs took that approach with every show than there would be no Seinfeld. That's the same reason Conan is on TBS now. At least this is ABC and not NBC. I miss Defying Gravity :(, they canceled it before they finished airing episodes. It turns out they had finally put the remaining episodes on Hulu, but i missed them and they expired. Defying Gravity had a good cast and its too bad they didn't have a full run because things would have kicked off and now they're out of a job. I wish Syfy would start picking up cancelled shows, because some of these shows are superior to what Syfy offers, but maybe not on the right channel for the right audience. I'll check out Haven on the Syfy channel, it looks like its filmed in the same location

[ShyGuy]

I think Happy Town is coming back this summer but probably only a few episodes then it will be canceled.

[Spak-Spang]

Ok, I am late posting....but I am going to add a few cents to this conversation.

1) The religious complaints have already been answered, but I will say personally for me it wasn't over done, nor was it too much one religion or another, and just because a statue of Jesus was shown doesn't mean they were pushing Christianity...in fact as a Christian I find the story rather confusing as any form of Christian allegory.

2) About answers to the island.  I think one of the best parts of Lost is only knowing what the characters know....and only understanding what they understand.  Remember Danielle once said the smoke monster was a security system.  We took that as absolute fact, but in reality she had no idea what it was.  Where does this place learning about the island and the light?  It is obvious not even Jacob or the MIB understood what the light or island was.  Jacob was told very little from his mom about the light and island.  And he protected it the best he could.  His mother probably wasn't the first protector and probably didn't know everything.

So this means we don't know everything.  Now this may bother some people, but the writers of Lost have always said they were more focused on writing about the Characters and their drama instead of focusing on the island.  It means that characters acted on one understanding that we also believed but something else entirely happened.  (Charlie dying to send the helicopters to save Claire.) 

I think we got most of the important questions answered, and some questions left unanswered were probably dropped story arcs or are elements you can probably fill in the blanks with what we know now.  The hardest one to deal with is why was Walt special and what could he do.  But the Walt storyline was dropped because the actor was growing too fast.