Topic: Revolution to launch in March?

[UncleBob]

I'm not saying that $200 is too much... I'm saying why buy a $200 system to play games that you can easily play on a $100 system that you may already own?

[Artimus]

Why buy new systems at all?

[Nile Boogie]

I believe that Twilight Princess is the key to the RevOluti0n launch. If they could somehow squeeze some kinda RevOluti0n exclusive dungeon in to the game similar to the oracle games it would give players more reason to buy a Rev plus replay value. I can't seem to flush out this idea at the moment.  Ahh Retro gameing on the RevOluti0n is worth the price of admission.

[nemo_83]

Or they could just make it so all games can be played with the new controller allowing you to do things in TP you could never do before.

[nickmitch]

UncleBob: It would make more sense to invest in the new system so that you could keep up with the current generation of games. What I was saying was that because 3rd parties haven't the dev kits yet they could still make GC games that Rev owners would buy. Buying a Rev and getting SSBO would be great and then to at least have some new games out.

[UncleBob]

Here's what I'm saying though...

If I already have a GCN, new GCN games do *not* give me a reason to "early adopt" a Revolution.  In fact, they give me more of a reason to *wait* to buy a Revolution.

Why would I want to wait to buy a Revolution?  Well, if I have a GCN, I could spend my $200+ on four (or more) brand new games.  And I could wait to get my Revolution until the price drops or Nintendo offers a good deal (Free games - see Nintendo DS/Super Mario 64 DS deal)

And what's wrong with waiting to purchase the Nintendo Revolution?  The longer I wait to buy it, the longer Microsoft or Sony have to intice me to buy their system.

Granted, I'll be getting a Revolution at Launch.  In fact, I'll likely be the first in line... I'm just saying that new GCN games are not the way to go to get someone to buy a Revolution...

[BlackNMild2k1]

What if these games(New GC games) are forward compatible, i.e. online compatible, unlocking of old gaming content(free downloads), a graphical boost, Rev controller compatibility, [add your own ideas here]

[random thoughts]What if Nintendo allowed you to catalouge all of your old GC games into the Rev, and the more games that you own the more free content they would provide you with(game downloads, NP subscription, T-shirts, etc. etc.), that would be an incentive to upgrade to the Rev, and also to continue buying GC games.[/random thoughts]

[UncleBob]

*That* could work...

Quote
[random thoughts]What if Nintendo allowed you to catalouge all of your old GC games into the Rev, and the more games that you own the more free content they would provide you with(game downloads, NP subscription, T-shirts, etc. etc.), that would be an incentive to upgrade to the Rev, and also to continue buying GC games.[/random thoughts]

The only thing I could see with this is, personally, after logging in all my GCN games, I'd run to the local rental stores to log in all the ones I don't own so that I could get the freebies...

[Ian Sane]

"Why buy new systems at all?"

For new games.  That's the point of this discussion.

My main problem with releasing Cube games to round out the Rev lineup, aside from the "I already own a Cube" factor, is that it's not a realistic plan.  Third parties don't make Cube games NOW.  Why would they make Cube games after the Rev has been released and the Cube is even more neglected than it is now?  Realistically it would be less risky for a third party to release a glorified last-gen game on the Rev than a new game on the Cube.  The Cube is a third party dead zone.  The Rev however is unproven and a third party would have a better chance catching lighting in a bottle with a new userbase looking for games to play for their new console.  And people will look for new Rev games before they look for old games they missed out on.  Plus there's such a negative stigma with the Cube.  For the general public the Cube, well, sucks.  I don't think it does but that's the image it has so it would probably be better for the Rev to distinguish itself from the Cube the best it can.  "Play Cube games to make up for release droughts" is like the worst possible association with the Cube the Rev could have.

[MrMojoRising]

I agree with Ian.  Cube games are not going to ease any early droughts on the Rev.  What's more likely is games that started out intended for Cube get shifted to Rev.  It would be nice if Pennent chase Baseball came out as a launch title with online play...although that would probably only work if the Rev were to come out around march-may. If Nintendo would just get their dev kits out already we could maybe at least get some ports of 360 games or something by launch.  Hell, if the Rev is as easy to develop for as it's made out to be then if they gave out the kits now maybe we could have some good games by launch.  My point is...get things moving already so we can have some games!

[stevey]

yeah but what about people that don't have a gamecube so insted of buying a cube for tp they wait a few month for the rev and then get it and all the other geat cube game they miss out on and after the drought they buy rev game.

[Spak-Spang]

Stevey:  Those people can pick up TP whenever they want after they buy the Revolution.

Really the only backwards compatability that truly helps the Revolution is the NES and SNES compatability and even then mostly the SNES.  

The reason for this is that both systems are over like 12 years old, and many new gamers haven't played everything available for those systems, and those that have may not have their originals.  

Super Nintendo was also the era that brought 2D gaming to its pinnacle state...so you can find the best 2D games ever created on that system...games that stand the test of time even today.  

To a lesser degree the Nintendo 64 backwards compatability may help.  This would be because there were some great party games and multiplayer games on that system that several people would love to play again.

So it isn't the Gamecube games that would allow for a small drought between a Spring/Summer launch and Christmas games to be acceptable, but the older games.

Another side note.  Having backwards compatability also allows Nintendo the freedom to work on new franchises more instead of old games.  With the revolution if I want to play Mario Golf I have 2 options the Gamecube and the Nintendo 64 version.  Same with Mario Tennis.  

For my Mario fix I have 5 2D Mario games to play and 2 3D Mario games...so I am happy to wait for a perfect Mario Revolution.

Puzzle Games:  I have a huge variety of Nintendo produced Tetris clones, many of them the best ever created.  With the Revolution and Nintendo's old library I won't need to buy another Tetris clone again.

Racing Games:  3 F-Zeros, 3 Mario Karts, FX-Racers, Uni-racers, Do you need anymore?  

The point is.  Revolution will have a large enough selection of games that will play and look good because they are from the pinnacle of 2D gaming.  People will buy those games, and they will be happy.

In fact upon release of the Revolution I am buying 2-3 256/515 SD cards (depends on price) and I am just going to download every SNES, N64 game I loved growing up.  Then I will pick up a few of the classic Nintendo games you have to own as a game enthusiast.  

If you doubt that every hardcore gamer won't be doing the same your crazy.  I also see several casual gamers doing the same, because it sounds cool to do.  Yeah I have the original Mario, but I also have All Stars SNES version, and the new one Nintendo released with even better enhanced graphics.

[Famicom]

We'd only have those games depending if Nintendo provided access to them out of the box. They've given no indication that the entire library of Nintendo published games will be available from day 1. What if they gave away SNES and N64 Mario Kart with a release of Rev Mario Kart? What if that game didn't come until two years into the life of the Rev? And to get any of the Cube games, you'd have to buy them from the store or already own them, and that isn't a solution to a drought. As it stands now, old games aren't a dependable replacement for newer ones.

[kirby_killer_dedede]

As far as what Ian said on the 1st page goes...I think everything's been taken care of, development houses are cranking, and the reason Nintendo has yet to reveal any information is to give Sony the thought they have the upper-hand while they really plan to launch before Sony.

And they could stck a controller together in like 5 minutes.  I mean it can't possibly look worse than Sony's.

[couchmonkey]

I believe having new games is a sort of advertisement for a system.  Keeping the existing fanbase happy is a nice side-effect, but the worst effect a drought can have is not just boring the existing customers, but also turning away potential new ones.  If I'm Joe Casualgamer and I walk into Wal Mart and see a Revolution shelf that is half as full as Xbox 360 and PS3, what system am I going to choose?  I can't "see" most of the backwards compatible games and, even if I could, those are all "old" games that are of less interest to me than new games anyway.

I do think the multi-gen backwards compatability is cool, and I think it could even be a very big selling point for Revolution, but I don't think Nintendo should count on it for content.

Ummm, anyhow, I do hope Nintendo is planning for an earlier-than-Christmas release, and I do hope it plans on filling in third parties soon so there can be a good launch lineup.

[Pale]

Quote
Originally posted by: kirby_killer_dedede
As far as what Ian said on the 1st page goes...I think everything's been taken care of, development houses are cranking, and the reason Nintendo has yet to reveal any information is to give Sony the thought they have the upper-hand while they really plan to launch before Sony.

And they could stck a controller together in like 5 minutes.  I mean it can't possibly look worse than Sony's.

The reason they aren't going to show the controller is because Sony has said the batarang was a concept and people hated it, so Sony is most likely reworking it.  Why should Nintendo help them along?

We will hear about the Rev controller as soon as sony shows their final controller...  who knows when that will be.

[Spak-Spang]

Kirby_Killer_Dede:  That is some very powerful faith you have in Nintendo.  I believe that Nintendo is further along then we think.  

I think the controller's features are finalized just not optimized for ultimate comfort.  I believe gamers are further along...but I don't know how many 3rd party developers are truly in the loop.

I think the companies that are now announcing they will support Revolution now what its about.  Konami knows.  Capcom knows.  I wouldn't doubt several other people know as well...but NDAs won't let talk.  

However, I don't have faith that Nintendo is having a grand scheme to just beat Sony with a surprise early launch with huge 3rd party and 1st party support.  You couldn't keep a secret like that.

CouchMonkey:  Nintendo could easily market backwards compatiable with game cards that have images of games you could download.  They could also market it heavily on television so that people know about it when they buy it.  You also seem to make it appear that Xbox 360 and PS3 will have huge number of launch games ready to go.  They won't...no launch has ever had enough games.

I also believe more games will be available from the start than not...I would predict the whole library, and I suspect that bonus games would be included as preorder bonuses.  Or how about the games with the updated graphics as the bonuses.

We don't know what will be available, I am just saying I predict more than less and that backwards compatiability makes for a huge impressive bonus launch lineup.

[stevey]

"Having backwards compatability also allows Nintendo the freedom to work on new franchises more instead of old games. With the revolution if I want to play Mario Golf I have 2 options the Gamecube and the Nintendo 64 version. Same with Mario Tennis.

For my Mario fix I have 5 2D Mario games to play and 2 3D Mario games...so I am happy to wait for a perfect Mario Revolution.

Puzzle Games: I have a huge variety of Nintendo produced Tetris clones, many of them the best ever created. With the Revolution and Nintendo's old library I won't need to buy another Tetris clone again.

Racing Games: 3 F-Zeros, 3 Mario Karts, FX-Racers, Uni-racers, Do you need anymore?

The point is. Revolution will have a large enough selection of games that will play and look good because they are from the pinnacle of 2D gaming. People will buy those games, and they will be happy."

No no no by your way of thinking there should never be more than one kind of game there is already is a game like so nintendo should never make a new f-zero, zelda, or mario one. That wrong wrong wrong!

Game don't last forever people get bored and want new games of the same franchise that are longer and look better and have new levels and stuff that the last didn't. They don't want to replay last gen game over just because it on the new system. They want to play an upgraded game that has new mode and stuff.  

[Spak-Spang]

Stevey:  That isn't my line of thinking at all.  My line of thinking is no launch can cater to everyones needs.  You can't have your racing game, RPG, Puzzle Game, Platformer, New Franchise, Fighter, Multiplayer party game, FPS, Sports games, all out day one of launch...or even all those games out in the first year of launch.  

It takes time to develop all those games, even with excelent 3rd party support it takes time.  However, Revolution will at least have a large variety of older games that many people will not have played in years available.  And these games are brilliant excelent games that are some of the best in the genre period.  Not best during their time period.  

With those games available it gives Nintendo extra time to work on other games without the immediate necessity to create the franchise games all Nintendo fans demand to play on each new Nintendo system.

Nintendo fans expect and demand to be able to play their favorite games on the new system...and therefore Nintendo must use valuable developers to create those games instead of working on new projects or original projects.  If Nintendo can use older games to help temporarily sedate the demands of the fans then they have freedom to create new and different games which are also being demanded.

Also, my analogy was in reference to the launch.  I wasn't saying new versions of those games or those types of games should be made...I am saying Nintendo will have several games available in each genre to help flesh out any launch list of games.  If its a launch with a few games the download service makes it bearable, if its a launch with tons of games then the download service makes it even better fleshing out genres that might have been neglected.

 

[Ian Sane]

Gamespot's reporting that the Rev might launch after the PS3.  Iwata suggested such at shareholders meeting though the general idea is that if it launches later it won't be much later.

I wouldn't be surprised really.  If they were on target then they probably would have shown more at E3 and there wouldn't be rumours about the controller not being done yet or third parties not having dev kits yet.  I figure they assumed the PS3 would launch later in the year way back when they first made their plans and didn't expect Sony to launch in Spring.  

[Darc Requiem]

Yeah I didn't think Sony would launch in the Spring in the US. I though they'd to a 3rd Quarter release at the earliest. I really wonder given the fact that Sony really didn't show anymore than Nintendo what kind of games they will have out. It seems like they are repeating the PS2 launch scenario. I mean all of the "games" shown at E3 were just renders. I think they are launch early to cut down the 360s headstart....360 isn't Dreamcast. MS has the cash to make Sony pay for a PS2like software lull.

[nickmitch]

Well, if Sony announces a date then that will determine the Rev's launch date as Nintendo will fully base it on that, but that's if (and only if) Sony announces their date by GDC.
MS is in the best position right now. They just need to have a strong launch line-up and then a huge wave of games for when the PS3 and Rev sit the shelves.

[Caliban]

Quote
Originally posted by: Spak-Spang
In fact upon release of the Revolution I am buying 2-3 256/515 SD cards (depends on price) and I am just going to download every SNES, N64 game I loved growing up.

If Nintendo releases a small app to use on your computer so that you can store/send on/from your hard-drive any downloaded content for Rev or DS, then you won't need to spend money on more SD cards. I am so wishing for such thing to happen.

About the launch date that Iwata "announced", I didn't like his comment at all, I want the Rev as soon as possible, I still have plenty of games for GameCube to finish, plus whatever they put available from the huge library of games from the NES, SNES, N64 will keep me occupied for a long while.  

[Spak-Spang]

Iwata's comments actually give me faith for a summer launch.  He stated to shareholders the realization that they may be last in the market, but not my much.  I think Sony surprised everyone by trying to launch around March...I think they probably even surprised their 3rd party support.

Now everyone will be raising to meet a potentially impossible deadline.  However, it sounds Nintendo isn't too worried because perhaps they were planning to launch in the summer all along.  Iwata told shareholders if they are late it will not be long.  That suggests a few months difference not a few Quaters difference.

Ian:  Also new reports say that 3rd parties know what the Revolutionary aspect of the controller is.  This means they can use Gamecube Development kits with the understanding of the enhanced specs to start programming and creating their games.  This is also very positive for a Summer launch.  It means 3rd parties will have about a year to design a Revolution game...which is about the time all 3rd party developers have for new hardware launches.

Last really cool news information is Nintendo practically confirmed a $200-$250 price point with the Revolution.  Reggie stated that the Revolution will cost much less than the competition.  I really like this...especially coupled with the GBAM that sounds like it will be dirt cheap as well.  I am predicting under $75.  

[MrMojoRising]

I hear a lot of people saying "just give us the Rev with a couple of games and the entire back library and we'll be set!!!"  I would agree that I personally would be happy with nothing more than SSB online and to be able to download classic games...but I'm worried that Nintendo might start to use the "virtual system" backwards compatibility as an excuse or crutch of some sort.
         
If the Rev launches in March or the summer with little to no third party support then we won't be complaining...but the mass market (casual gamers, if you will) will see a weak system (like what couchmonkey was saying earlier).  Then we'll be seeing the same 3rd party support, or lack thereof, for the Rev that we see now for the Cube.  And Nintendo meanwhile will simply say, "you don't need as much third party support, you can download games!"  I can see the press complaining now..."Nintendo thinks that their uber backwards compatibility allows them to slack off on new games."  
               
The reality is that a drought will not be relieved by downloadable games.  Perhaps on a personal level, some people will be satisfied with going back and playing old games...but then the same thing could be said about any system that has a drought, just the old games won't be downloaded, they will just be games you never got to.  To put it more simply so even I understand what I'm saying:  gamecube's drought right now isn't solved by the fact that there are a bunch of great games I still haven't played on GC yet.  In my opinion, the Revolution can't use it's backward compatibility to satisfy customers, it can only help lure them in.

Edit: I just fixed some grammar and such.