Topic: The game has been leak! Prepare for spoilers!

[PurpleLink]

/sigh

No Dr. Mario  

My only starter that didn't make the cut.  DAMN YOU NINTENDO!!

[Sessha]

I knew this was going to happen.  People are confusing what they think should be in the game with what is.  I'm a lot happier about a more fleshed out single player experience then worried that there are clones again.  The development time was longer but there is a hell of a lot more in this game then melee had.  From the looks of it Ness is a clone because he seems to only be a driving point in the SSE, he protects Lucas from becoming a trophy.  That's just my own speculation.  But everyone pissing and moaning about what they wanted in the game is really annoying.  Of course the game isn't going to have everything you want in it.  That's incredibly stupid.

[NWR_insanolord]

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Originally posted by: GoldenPhoenix

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Originally posted by: Strell

You should have just stopped after reading "insatiable idiot," because it's obvious you're not going to listen to anything else other than your own diseased mind.







Every other fighting game has clones.  Every single last one.

Good for those other fighting games. Also other fighters have 50+ characters as well, so your point? It is obvious you aren't willing to debate things and instead resort to name calling, so this is my last response to you. See in game design there are priorities, and it is a shame that the priority of Brawl wasn't on the fighters first and the extras second. Especially for fighters that people, you know, CARE ABOUT like Ganondorf who is from a popular series called Zelda and is right up there with Bowser.  I kept hearing the excuse about Melee and its tight deadline and how they wanted make characters like Ganondorf unique, so what do they do after 3 years of development? Why let's make him a clone again! Wonder what the excuse will be this time?

The excuse will be that people learned how to play as the clones in Melee and the developers didn't want to completely change how the characters played. I'm not saying that it's a good excuse (it's not), but that's what it will be if they give one.

[Caterkiller]

Do we know for sure Wolf is clone or not? Because maybe, just maybe, he'll turn out to be pretty darn unique.

Also i've been trying to read up on the returning clones, but since brawl central is shut down by all the angry smash goons I can't get any more info. When I compare Mario to Luigi, I don't see a clone, their animations and attacks are way different enough for me. When I see Lucas and Ness, their smash attack animations are completely different and their specials are different enough for me as well, I don't see clone there.

Now for Ganondorf and Falco, does anyone know for sure that they are just like they were in Melee? EXACTLY like Fox, and Falcon, just with different speed and stats? If there are different enough animations in them that are as varied from Ness to Lucas I could live with that. Anyone know anything?

[GoldenPhoenix]

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Originally posted by: Sessha
I knew this was going to happen.  People are confusing what they think should be in the game with what is.  I'm a lot happier about a more fleshed out single player experience then worried that there are clones again.  The development time was longer but there is a hell of a lot more in this game then melee had.  From the looks of it Ness is a clone because he seems to only be a driving point in the SSE, he protects Lucas from becoming a trophy.  That's just my own speculation.  But everyone pissing and moaning about what they wanted in the game is really annoying.  Of course the game isn't going to have everything you want in it.  That's incredibly stupid.

Kind of like a Ganondorf with a unique moveset? I still fail to see how wanting a clone free cast is too much to ask. Seems like people are trying to rationalize once again about why it doesn't matter, except this time they can't fall back on "Oh the development cycle was too short, better than nothing". Fine I think it is fair to say you can't have everything you want but there is a point where you have to draw the line. I believe wanting unique movesets is a fair place to draw the line, heck I'm not even that disappointed in the characters themselves but I expected there to be no clones especially with the massive development team they had.  

[WalkingTheCow]

Let me first say that I understand that many of you are pretty passionate about this and I'm not completely without sympathy. But seriously, we are all looking at an incredible roster. If there is any complaint to be made at all, it would be that we were already told some of the best surprises.

Can you imagine what all of your responses would have been if the full roster had been leaked before we learned so much from the Smash Dojo?

Mario
Donkey Kong
Link
Samus/Zero suit Samus
Kirby
Fox
Pikachu
Marth
Mr. Game and Watch
Luigi
Diddy
Zelda/Shiek
Pit!
Metaknight!
Falco
Pokemon Trainer!
Ike!
Solid Snake!
Peach
Yoshi
Ganondorf
Ice Climbers
King Dedede!
Lucario!
Ness
Sonic the Hedgehog!
Bowser
Wario!
Cell Shaded Link! (which I think is bitchin')
R.O.B.!
Captain Olimar!
Captain Falcon
Lucas!
And what, we think. . . Jigglypuff and Wolf!, right? I'm no stalwart fanboy and I can be pretty critical. . . but damn! Brawl seems amazing in every respect and looks to be delivering almost everything I've wanted from the series (and some things I didn't even realize I want, like the stage builder). Have fun bitching about Ganondorf being a clone and all, but just don't forget the big picture here.  

[GoldenPhoenix]

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Originally posted by: Caterkiller
Do we know for sure Wolf is clone or not? Because maybe, just maybe, he'll turn out to be pretty darn unique.



Also i've been trying to read up on the returning clones, but since brawl central is shut down by all the angry smash goons I can't get any more info. When I compare Mario to Luigi, I don't see a clone, their animations and attacks are way different enough for me. When I see Lucas and Ness, their smash attack animations are completely different and their specials are different enough for me as well, I don't see clone there.



Now for Ganondorf and Falco, does anyone know for sure that they are just like they were in Melee? EXACTLY like Fox, and Falcon, just with different speed and stats? If there are different enough animations in them that are as varied from Ness to Lucas I could live with that. Anyone know anything?

From what I understand Falco plays like Fox except her has two guns, not sure how that changes things but that is what I understand. Ganondorf supposedly has his moveset from Melee but has Ganon as his final Smash (Hopefully it is cool). Then again this is from Gamefaqs that I gathered this, we'll hopefully know more later today. Wolf should be interesting to see though, if he is in the game, because I can't even imagine Sakurai making 3 cloned Star Fox characters.

[capamerica]

Seriously why did he waste all the time on stupid stickers, trophies and R.O.B  when that time could have been used to.. oh I don't know give Falco and Ganondorf their own FREAKEN move set.

[WalkingTheCow]

I dunno, the stickers, trophies, and R.O.B. sound pretty cool.


EDIT: Especially R.O.B.

[capamerica]

Quote
Originally posted by: WalkingTheCow
Let me first say that I understand that many of you are pretty passionate about this and I'm not completely without sympathy. But seriously, we are all looking at an incredible roster. If there is any complaint to be made at all, it would be that we were already told some of the best surprises.

Can you imagine what all of your responses would have been if the full roster had been leaked before we learned so much from the Smash Dojo?

All the good surprises where all ready announced before today. Captain Olimar was the last good one.
everything today was pretty much garbage. Except for Green Hill Zone level. I could have easly lived without everything else that was shown off today.

[GoldenPhoenix]

Quote
Originally posted by: WalkingTheCow
Let me first say that I understand that many of you are pretty passionate about this and I'm not completely without sympathy. But seriously, we are all looking at an incredible roster. If there is any complaint to be made at all, it would be that we were already told some of the best surprises.



Can you imagine what all of your responses would have been if the full roster had been leaked before we learned so much from the Smash Dojo?



Mario

Donkey Kong

Link

Samus/Zero suit Samus

Kirby

Fox

Pikachu

Marth

Mr. Game and Watch

Luigi

Diddy

Zelda/Shiek

Pit!

Metaknight!

Falco

Pokemon Trainer!

Ike!

Solid Snake!

Peach

Yoshi

Ganondorf

Ice Climbers

King Dedede!

Lucario!

Ness

Sonic the Hedgehog!

Bowser

Wario!

Cell Shaded Link! (which I think is bitchin')

R.O.B.!

Captain Olimar!

Captain Falcon

Lucas!

And what, we think. . . Jigglypuff and Wolf!, right? I'm no stalwart fanboy and I can be pretty critical. . . but damn! Brawl seems amazing in every respect and looks to be delivering almost everything I've wanted from the series (and some things I didn't even realize I want, like the stage builder). Have fun bitching about Ganondorf being a clone and all, but just don't forget the big picture here.

Actually like I said I have no big problem with the cast, I just hate seeing great characters like Ganondorf get gimped AGAIN. Will the game be amazing? Definately. But I can't help feel it is marred by the secret characters, especially those that deserved more attention even back when Melee came out.

[GoldenPhoenix]

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Originally posted by: WalkingTheCow
I dunno, the stickers, trophies, and R.O.B. sound pretty cool.





EDIT: Especially R.O.B.

Ehhe, to each their own I guess. Still I'm not sure why Sakurai put him in and not another character from his list. And if he has a unique moveset I will be quite upset!

[Sessha]

I'm not getting my hopes up, but I'll wait until there is some credible evidence that Falco and Ganondorf are exact clones.  I never used Falco so I couldn't care less.  I'm more miffed that Captian Falcons FS is not his Galactic Falcon Punch.  R.O.B. doesn't get me doing cartwheels but he could be alright, I'll just wait and see.  

[WalkingTheCow]

Heh, yeah. . . that is a sad sort of irony when Ganondorf gets a cloned moveset and R.O.B. has a unique one. Err, at least I can't imagine who he would be a clone of, but stranger things have happened. Watch, ROB will be a clone of Snake!

[NWR_insanolord]

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Originally posted by: GoldenPhoenix

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Originally posted by: WalkingTheCow

I dunno, the stickers, trophies, and R.O.B. sound pretty cool.











EDIT: Especially R.O.B.

Ehhe, to each their own I guess. Still I'm not sure why Sakurai put him in and not another character from his list. And if he has a unique moveset I will be quite upset!

I don't see how he wouldn't have a unique moveset. Unless he's another clone of Fox.

[GoldenPhoenix]

Quote
Originally posted by: WalkingTheCow
Heh, yeah. . . that is a sad sort of irony when Ganondorf gets a cloned moveset and R.O.B. has a unique one. Err, at least I can't imagine who he would be a clone of, but stranger things have happened. Watch, ROB will be a clone of Snake!

ROFL, that would be hilarious if ROB was a clone of snake.

[GoldenPhoenix]

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Originally posted by: Sessha
I'm not getting my hopes up, but I'll wait until there is some credible evidence that Falco and Ganondorf are exact clones.  I never used Falco so I couldn't care less.  I'm more miffed that Captian Falcons FS is not his Galactic Falcon Punch.  R.O.B. doesn't get me doing cartwheels but he could be alright, I'll just wait and see.

Isn't Falcon's supposed to be him riding a F-Zero car or something? (Don't remember)  

[Sessha]

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Isn't Falcon's supposed to be him riding a F-Zero car or something? (Don't remember)

Yeah it is.    

[Caterkiller]

I hate to tell you guys this, but yeah maybe Falco has 2 guns and maybe there is hope for some slightly different animations. But his Final smash... is exactly like Fox's... I know, I know.

[NWR_pap64]

Man, this is so much like Melee 6 years ago its funny...

I was on the Smash Boards reading every thread and seeing the posters' reaction to each confirmed character and I saw myself.

"Don't worry! The Online mode will still be great!"
"Brawl will be the best game ever! It doesn't matter how crappy the roster is!"
"Give the guy some time! The SSE mode is huge! There might be more secrets!"

These were the exact, same things that I said when Melee was announced. My disappointment was so big that I was in denial about it.

As for Brawl's roster, looks like I was right on a couple of things. However, I would've liked to have been wrong on a couple of things.

No matter how much of a positive spin you put on it Clone Ganondorf is still pathetic. Sakurai had two, count 'em, TWO new Zelda games to choose from and create a move list. Wind waker had a two katana wielding maniac, and Twilight Princess had a strong and deadly warlock, who used one giant sword.

What is REALLY that hard to pluck some moves off of them and create an unique Ganondorf? I know I said balancing characters isn't easy, but Sakurai now had the time and the staff to do so!

But you know what? I already trained myself to handle disappointment, so even if the hidden character roster sucks I'm alright. I expected this, so its time for me to move on.

[Mikintosh]

I dunno, I just finished Twilight Princess, and the Ganondorf boss fight was "cloned" from the Armored Knight fights, if you want to get picky about it. Why would they give him a sword if Link already has one?

As for clones (and as other people have said, we don't even know their moves), I don't find it as big of a deal as you guys seem to take it. Even in Melee they were different enough to give me a different experience when I played as them, and many people grew an attachment to them over the years; making them entirely different would have messed that up, imo.

And while you're all whining about them being lazy, keep in mind they already had to create entirely new fighting styles for Pit, Wario, Zero Suit Samus, Pokemon Trainer, Diddy Kong, Metaknight, Snake, Sonic, Dedede, Olimar, R.O.B. and possibly Luigi. In addition to all the new stages, modes, and music, I'm sure that took up the entire 2 1/2 years of production time. People who want Sakurai fired for "not respecting the fans" after all the work he and his team have obviously put into this title deserve to have their Wii stripped from their person...also, forty lashings.

The only thing they did wrong was reveal so many of the unique characters in the opening trailer, but it was sweet, and as a PR bonanza, it certainly worked. Why don't you guys just think about how you're going to like playing the game in the future rather than concentrating on pipe dreams that the director felt unworkable?

[nickmitch]

So, with ROB "confirmed" what do we expect from a ROB stage?
Anyway, I'm just glad that the flood gates are finally open now.

[NeoThunder]

has this already been discovered?
Smash bros. Intro Video

[Tanookisuit]

How do we know G-dorf is a clone?  Are there videos of him fighting?

[Bill Aurion]

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Originally posted by: TVman
So, with ROB "confirmed" what do we expect from a ROB stage?

Anyway, I'm just glad that the flood gates are finally open now.

He might not get one...Or considering the F-Zero stage is Port Town Aero Dive (remember the R.O.B. in the stage), it's possible that they might make it ROB's as well...