Topic: BREAKING: DS to be buttonless!!??

[Stereo-Type]

http://www.cube-europe.com/news.php?nid=6426

A quote from Famitsu's president Hirokazu Hamamura has sent the gaming world into a state of deep confusion.

In a recent Yahoo! story about the PSP and DS there was an interesting quote by the president of Famitsu that has caused a stirring.

"This will not be a machine where you push the 'A' button or 'B' button and move the direction pad, but a completely different way to interact with the device."

This interesting quote has sprung many ideas and a while ago it was suggested that the DS would have a touch screen. Expect proper details on Tuedsay at E3.

[KDR_11k]

I agree with the comments on the article that say tat this does not say that the device won't have those buttons, but that it has other forms of input in addition

[jmoe316]

Yeah, I agree with KDR. Also, pointing out another comment, one person mentioned this could mean that one screen could act as the control pad, making it a touch screen. But I don't think this is how Nintendo is going to use two screens because then they'd be criticized for a "gimmicky" selling feature with the two screens.  Does anyone remember if both screens will be touch screen or just one. For some reason I keep thinking that just one of the screens is touch screen. This would then prove it as the controller screen jk

[Bill Aurion]

"But I don't think this is how Nintendo is going to use two screens because then they'd be criticized for a "gimmicky" selling feature with the two screens."

Somehow, 100+ developers don't agree...

[jmoe316]

lol, yeah you got me there Bill, but think of it this way - would the 100+ developers jump on board knowing the only control scheme is a touch screen? I don't know, maybe, but they would probably be more hesitant and wait a while until they get a more accurate public response after E3.

[Uglydot]

I really hope that Nintendo doesn't go buttonless, and I can't picture that.  One of Nintendo's mainstays is durability and lastability, a touchscreen isn't nearly as durable as face buttons.  These are family products, not adults products, kids would ruin a touch screen.

Edit:typo

[StrikerObi]

How is this about GameCube? Wrong forum buddy. Read the rules before you post please.

[Nintendoholic]

No buttons? I don't think so, maybe the buttons will be used in a different way not yet seen. Or a whole new type of button altogether.

[mrbojangos]

Striker not to be a jerk or nething, this is the Nintendo DS forum, in the Nintendo DS buttonless?, discussion, gamecube forum is next door, sorry  

[StrikerObi]

Uh I'm not a jerk. This thread WAS in GameCube discussion. I moved it.

[Myxtika1 Azn]

mrbojangos: You ever thought that it was in the Cube forum at first and that a mod moved it here?

I'm interested in knowing what the DS will be like more than before.... Just two more days.

[Ian Sane]

I'm thinking no buttons = no sales.  That concept is just a little too hardcore to have any big mainstream appeal.  The problem with that idea is that makes it so the DS can only play special new DS games.  That's too limiting.  The DS has to be able to play both special new DS games and traditional games.  People want expansion not replacement.  That sort of limitation is what turned me off of the Virtual Boy.  Even before I knew of the headaches caused my playing it I had written the VB off because it wasn't able to play the types of games I had enjoyed playing on the SNES.  I thought these new VB games looked interesting but I wasn't prepared to spend the money to buy a console that JUST played those types of games.

Two screens is a fine idea because traditional one screen games can still exist.  With no buttons it means those games can't exist at all on the DS.

E3 just keeps getting more interesting doesn't it?

[jasonditz]

Quote

the new market would be the hundreds of million of people worldwide who have played video games and don't own a Gameboy.

Take my parents, for example. Back in the early 80's video games were a major part of their entertainment budget. They bought dozens if not hundreds of Atari 2600 games. They played, their friends played... they were simple and approachable, and fun.

When the NES came out, I couldn't get them to touch it. All those buttons and directional pads were intimidating. That has gotten worse over the last few generations, not better.

The real money in the DS is not in the overlap with the GBA (although it will overlap somewhat). Its in all those people who would like to play video games but feel the games are unapproachable. If the control system is intuitive (and a touchscreen is certainly easy enough to understand, remember, this is the generation that plays all those touch screen slot machine games at casinos) and there are games that don't have a huge learning curve to get started with, they will play them.

This was posted be me in another thread a couple days ago.

I'm also available for picking out lottery numbers if you guys are looking for a prophet.

[jasonditz]

Also, lets not forget the USPTO stuff we were discussing here. Maybe its not the touch screen that's gonig to be the primary input device, but rather the motion/acceleration sensors...

[KDR_11k]

I don't think it's actually a touchscreen, more like a touchpad on a notebook, which could act as an analog-stick replacement. A touchscreen has the problem that you obscure the screen while using it for things like aiming in an FPS and at that size would be too inaccurate to hit anything, anyway. If the motion sensors were the main means for control, I just hope they don't use too excessive movements so you don't have to ram your neighbour with the device just to dodge a bullet...

Bill: I think he meant it would be gimmicky if it was like that and from the response we can assume that it's NOT gimmicky, so it's not like that.

[jasonditz]

From everything I've heard its definately touch screen as opposed to touch pad. They were talking about things like using a screen as a customizable control system where the programmer can put however many buttons, etc, on the screen as they want.

[Ian Sane]

"When the NES came out, I couldn't get them to touch it. All those buttons and directional pads were intimidating."

If one d-pad and two action buttons is intimidating for someone then videogames just aren't for them.  Someone who can't handle something as simple as that shouldn't even be able to handle most classic arcade games.  I don't want Nintendo wasting time targeting this group.  My dad is in the same category.  He can't even play Tetris.  As a result he's not interested in games nor does he want to be.  So even if Nitnendo tried to make something for him odds are he doesn't even want to try it.

Plus I would consider a complete lack of buttons to be even more complicated.  That concept intimidates me and I've played games for years.

[jasonditz]

The thing is, in my parents situation, they do play video games. They loved the Atari 2600 and still get it out from time to time. If they see a familiar arcade game (something from the early 80's usually) they'll put a few quarters in it. Like I said before they go to casinos and play video games there with touch screens.

Beyond Pacman Vs., I can't think of a single new (arcade compilations don't count) Gamecube game I could get them to try.   Its not just about the controls, but about the complexity of the game. I mean yes, the D+pad was a conceptual leap for them over the joystick, but I think with a lineup of software that didn't have such a learning curve they would've given it a try.

The home video game industry lost a significant customer base between the Atari generation and the Nintendo generation. It didn't really matter for awhile because those people had young kids to spend money on games for anyhow. Now that their kids are grown up and moved out and they are approaching retirement age, maybe its time to get them back.

Remember before you freak about "no buttons" that Pacman, Bubbles, and Robotron were all buttonless.

[vudu]

Quote
Remember before you freak about "no buttons" that Pacman, Bubbles, and Robotron were all buttonless.

don't forget super monkey ball.

[Ian Sane]

"Remember before you freak about 'no buttons' that Pacman, Bubbles, and Robotron were all buttonless."

Yeah and all of those games are great but I don't want to play nothing but.  Sorry if this sounds selfish but I don't give a f*ck what people who quit playing decades ago think.  All I care about is if games I and people like me want to play are made.  I don't mind a simple high score dependent game once in a while but I like games that have some complexity and depth to it.

If the DS could play nothing but Atari era style games who here would actually buy it?  I know I wouldn't.

[jasonditz]

Quote
Originally posted by: Ian Sane
"Remember before you freak about 'no buttons' that Pacman, Bubbles, and Robotron were all buttonless."

Yeah and all of those games are great but I don't want to play nothing but.  Sorry if this sounds selfish but I don't give a f*ck what people who quit playing decades ago think.  All I care about is if games I and people like me want to play are made.  I don't mind a simple high score dependent game once in a while but I like games that have some complexity and depth to it.

If the DS could play nothing but Atari era style games who here would actually buy it?  I know I wouldn't.

Like Shigeru said before though, every time you add complexity you shrink the market. The Atari-era player is an extreme example, but I have to admit even I was a bit put-off by the 3D platformers at first (and to this day I prefer the 2D Mario and Sonic games to their 3D counterparts).

If each new generation is about making more complex games that leaves Nintendo working harder and harder for a piece of a smaller and smaller pie. I hate to say it, but the market for players like us is pretty well saturated. I couldn't possibly spend more money on games than I already do.

It really wouldn't make sense for Nintendo to target the DS at the GBA crowd. I mean sure, some of us will buy it anyways, but if I didn't spend it on a DS I'd probably spend it on other games. I think the DS will be offering games for all markets (Dynasty Warriors probably proves that there will be buttons), but they had to break away from the Gameboy image if they wanted to attract the older player...

[vudu]

Quote
It really wouldn't make sense for Nintendo to target the DS at the GBA crowd. I mean sure, some of us will buy it anyways, but if I didn't spend it on a DS I'd probably spend it on other games.

that's like saying it doesn't make sense for sony to target the ps2 crowd when the ps3 is released.  it makes perfect sense.  granted, the ps3 is the successor to the ps2, not a "third pillar".  so i take that back--it's like saying it doesn't make sense for sony to target the ps2 crowd with the psp.

[jasonditz]

The PSP is not targetting the same market as the PS2. The PS2 is an all purpose video game system appealing primarily to low-middle and middle class teens. The PSP is a high end handheld gaming device targetting high-middle and upper class 20-somethings with huge discretionary incomes.  

[vudu]

then why bother with ps2-to-psp connectivity?

[Bill Aurion]

Good question...