Author Topic: GameCube’s Mid-Term Report Card  (Read 68201 times)

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Offline odifiend

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RE:GameCube’s Mid-Term Report Card
« Reply #150 on: December 29, 2003, 03:50:02 PM »
Kyosho: not that this has anything to do with the debate, tell me please you just forgot to mention Tales of Symphonia.  Tales games kick serious @$$!
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Offline mouse_clicker

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RE:GameCube’s Mid-Term Report Card
« Reply #151 on: December 29, 2003, 04:51:17 PM »
If you're not enjoying Nintendo's latest games, then we really do have a fundamental disagreement, because I am, more so than I ever expected to when I first bought my Gamecube. Ninendo has fulfilled every wish of mine, and hence I am happy.
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Offline Kyosho

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RE:GameCube’s Mid-Term Report Card
« Reply #152 on: December 29, 2003, 05:18:31 PM »
hey odiefiend,

yeah I forgot to mention Tales of Symphonia.  I'm unfamiliar with that seriess, but it looks good.  It's a tough choice between Baten Kaitos and Tales of Symphonia.  I simply didnt mention because I forgot.. thanks for reminding me

Offline nolimit19

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RE: GameCube’s Mid-Term Report Card
« Reply #153 on: December 29, 2003, 05:50:31 PM »
*cough*killer 7!!!*cough* and i would just like to say that nintendo is meeting my expectations, but they havent blown me away with any Never Happenings if you get my drift. i think they should be exceeding expectations...and they simply arent doing that. nintendo needs a new edgy franchise or they need to revamp a current one. they could do a lot with the fire eblem series, but i think what they need is realstic zelda. sorry to say it. im sure ill be flamed, but nothing would grab the attention of gamers like killer realistic graphics and a zelda game. zelda is strait up one of the most recognizable gaming franchises. there is no other franchise that could dig nintendo out of the hole like realistic zelda.....realistic zelda would out sell gta. nintendo is sitting on a gold mine.
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Offline mouse_clicker

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RE:GameCube’s Mid-Term Report Card
« Reply #154 on: December 29, 2003, 06:01:18 PM »
Seriously, I think you guys put way too much stock into a realistic Zelda. I agree, it would be very nice, and I'm sure it would sell better than Wind Waker did, but I don't think it'd sell THAT much better. A game's style isn't what makes the difference between millions of units sold.
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Offline Hostile Creation

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RE:GameCube’s Mid-Term Report Card
« Reply #155 on: December 29, 2003, 07:46:38 PM »
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Hostile, this will be the 1st time i've said something to you. I am/was never talking to you. Exploiting text on the keyboard just to namecall is far worse than me being pathetic.


Sorry.  I'll try to be more goddamn tasteful next time if that makes you happy.
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Offline KDR_11k

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RE: GameCube’s Mid-Term Report Card
« Reply #156 on: December 30, 2003, 05:37:50 AM »
Hm, just so we can understand that card better: What ratings would you have given the N64? Comparing those two might tell us more about where N is heading.

Offline Jonnyboy117

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RE:GameCube’s Mid-Term Report Card
« Reply #157 on: December 30, 2003, 07:25:11 AM »
I thought about giving N64 ratings and might do it in a later post in this thread.  The problem is that I would be giving the N64 ratings based on its entire lifespan, which might confuse the issue of this being primarily a progress report, not a final judgement, on the GameCube.  The difference is that a progress report is meant to be constructive and point out areas that can be improved before the end of the term.  That's what I wanted to do, because I want the GameCube to improve and end up in a better situation than it is at right now.

Whoever pointed out the problem of comparing game sales to Xbox Live subscriptions, is of course correct.  I was making crude comparisons (I even did the math in my head), so I didn't mean for it to be taken too seriously.  I just wanted to show that 500,000 Xbox users is not such a small portion of the installed base.  Because there aren't really any comparable services in the console world, and since Xbox Live is packaged and sold just like a game (and even costs as much, per year), I thought it was the best I could do under short notice.  ;-)  But I do think it's fair to compare percentages of game sales across platforms.  Let's say that Game X sells 12 million copies on PS2 and 12 million copies on GameCube.  Obviously the raw sales are just as good on either platform, but Nintendo can say that nearly every single GameCube owner bought this game.  It's perhaps a small difference, but one that their investors and the media and a lot of other people will care about.  In the same way, it's more impressive for a game to sell one million on GameCube than to sell one million on PS2, because of the percentage of installed bases buying the game.

As for LAN console gaming, the feature is not much more popular on Xbox for GameCube than it was on PSX or Saturn or whatever old systems supported it.  It's just too hard to set up that many systems and TVs, not to mention the multiple copies of the game you have to own.  The only systems that have ever pulled off LAN gaming well are PC and Game Boy, both because the hardware and display are naturally together anyway.  It's easiest on PC because people can make extra copies of the game CD or create multiplayer spawns.  On Game Boy, you still have the significant problem of everyone needing a copy of the game, so more obscure titles never see much multiplayer action.  That's why we all love the games that can be played with just one cartridge.  
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Offline NWR_Lindy

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RE:GameCube’s Mid-Term Report Card
« Reply #158 on: December 30, 2003, 07:59:52 AM »
Kyosho, I totally agree.  I remember when Nintendo refused to switched over to the CD medium with the N64...they said something like, "Developers don't need all the space that's on CDs.  They'll be able to do fine with the space they have on cartridges.  We don't see it as a problem."  Gee, that line of thinking turned out GREAT for Nintendo didn't it?  It alienated developers and opened the door for Playstation to take over the market, and Nintendo's consoles practically became fanboy niche products.  The fallout from this decision eventually resulted in Nintendo taking the first loss in the company's history.  BRILLIANT.

So Mouse_Clicker, when Nintendo says "Online gaming isn't profitable" and "We don't think it will bring anything new to gaming", can you understand why I think they're clueless and I don't believe them?  Their track record at predicting market trends has been horrible ever since the SNES died out.  They do some innovative stuff in terms of new gaming experiences but it never has a major impact - it's always gimmicky gadgets like the GameBoy Camera and e-Reader.  The GameBoy Advance SP is tight but it's an evolution of an existing concept rather than a new frontier.  Console online gaming is a new frontier and I'd have expected Nintendo to be at the forefront; instead, they're taking their typically lethargic "wait and see" attitude.

As far as I'm concerned, the release of the Gamecube signalled Nintendo's refusal to compete in the US market.  It looks like a toy, is perceived as a toy and Nintendo certainly doesn't discourage this perception.  It's frustrating to see such a great company be so inflexible.

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Offline mouse_clicker

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RE:GameCube’s Mid-Term Report Card
« Reply #159 on: December 30, 2003, 08:33:24 AM »
No, Silks, I don't quite see your reasoning there. Maybe I would if the numbers were against Nintendo, but they're not. And the Gamecube, to me, represented Nintendo recognizing the mistakes they made with the N64 and fixing them, and I think they've done a great job so far.
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Offline Kyosho

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RE:GameCube’s Mid-Term Report Card
« Reply #160 on: December 30, 2003, 08:49:17 AM »
What in your opinion do you feel were the mistakes with the N64?

I feel in order of chronology
1) using cartridges as the medium
2) losing many 3rd party developers
3) lack of games

I feel what they fixed in the Gamecube were
- changing to a cheaper and larger medium format


that's all I can think of at this time.

Offline mouse_clicker

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RE:GameCube’s Mid-Term Report Card
« Reply #161 on: December 30, 2003, 09:32:20 AM »
Your number 1 reason pretty much caused the other 2. This generation Nintendo used a better medium, as you pointed out, has gotten some major 3rd parties (Sega, Capcom, Konami, EA, Ubi Soft- hell, even Namco and Square came back), and has a MUCH larger library.
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Offline Cowboy Bebop

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RE:GameCube’s Mid-Term Report Card
« Reply #162 on: December 30, 2003, 10:39:46 AM »
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No, Silks, I don't quite see your reasoning there. Maybe I would if the numbers were against Nintendo, but they're not.


What numbers are you talking about?  Their finacial numbers?  They reported their first ever loss.  Their percentage of the market?  They are a distant 2nd or 3rd.  Exactly what numbers show that Nintendo is currently a roaring success?



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And the Gamecube, to me, represented Nintendo recognizing the mistakes they made with the N64 and fixing them, and I think they've done a great job so far.



That's what they said, and that was the hope, let's take a look at it though:

Style: I don't care what the hardware looks like, you don't care what the hardware looks like, but casual fans do.  Most 12+ aged males do not want to look like a nerd.  They don't want a purple box in their room.  Sure, they also released a black one at launch, but that wasn't the one they featured in their promotions.  Either way, it's not a slick looking piece of hardware like the PS2.  You and I may find all this pathetic, but it's a fact of life, one Nintendo needs to recognize.  If the GBA SP is any indication, hopefully they have.

DVD playback:  This is probably the only generation where this will be a selling point.  Every one is/was switching over from VHS to DVD.  It's alot easier to justify the purchase to a parent or spouse if you're also getting a DVD player out of the deal.  By next generation everyone will already have a DVD player and stand alone units will be cheap.  Maybe you already had one, I did, but I know at least 3 people where this was a factor.

Disc size:  Sure it has larger capacity and is cheaper than a catridge, but it's still smaller than what everyone else is offering.  This leads to compressed cut scenes for the GameCube version.

Third party:  This is about 50/50.  They've been losing a lot of third rate third parties, but have been strengthening their ties with the biggies.  The problem is that you and I might not be interested in Atari's, Eidos's, and Acclaim's games, but casual gamers are.  Who do you think keeps buying all that licensed crap?

Kiddie image:  Nintendo has done very little to address this.  Sure there are 2nd party games like Metroid and Eternal Darkness, but most casual gamers don't know about them because Nintendo failed to aggressively market them.  The look of the console adds to this.  cel-shading Zelda didn't help.

Hype:  Would it kill Nintendo to exagerate every once in a while?  They release realistic, maybe even slightly lowered specs, while Sony and Microsoft make it sound like they're console is the second coming, and will help you score with the chicks.  Give the developers the real numbers, but give the masses something they can brag about.


I hate to sound all doom and gloom because it's not, but those are a few misteps that Nintendo has continued into this generation.  You might not care about casual gamers, but their the ones that keep a console manufacture afloat.  Without them Nintendo is sunk.  If you're truly concerned about Nintendo staying profitable so they can keep making games, then you should be concerned with those above things.
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Offline mouse_clicker

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RE:GameCube’s Mid-Term Report Card
« Reply #163 on: December 30, 2003, 10:57:22 AM »
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What numbers are you talking about? Their finacial numbers? They reported their first ever loss. Their percentage of the market? They are a distant 2nd or 3rd. Exactly what numbers show that Nintendo is currently a roaring success?


Have you read anything I've said? The numbers that show online gaming is NOT popular enough to support now! Nintendo may be a distant second, but everyone is compared to Sony, and Microsoft, the so called crusading hero of online gaming, is a VERY distant third. And that first loss ever was quickly rectified with a price drop that propelled American sales almost to the level of the PS2- Nintendo recognized the problem and fixed it. Are you trying to make a point here?

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Style: I don't care what the hardware looks like, you don't care what the hardware looks like, but casual fans do. Most 12+ aged males do not want to look like a nerd. They don't want a purple box in their room. Sure, they also released a black one at launch, but that wasn't the one they featured in their promotions. Either way, it's not a slick looking piece of hardware like the PS2. You and I may find all this pathetic, but it's a fact of life, one Nintendo needs to recognize. If the GBA SP is any indication, hopefully they have.


I don't know a single person who decided not to buy a Gamecube because the "official" color was purple- not a single one. And the people that DID make such a decision aren't the people I want taking this industry into the next generation. It's not all about making the MOST money, Cowboy- morality plays a role as well.

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DVD playback: This is probably the only generation where this will be a selling point. Every one is/was switching over from VHS to DVD. It's alot easier to justify the purchase to a parent or spouse if you're also getting a DVD player out of the deal. By next generation everyone will already have a DVD player and stand alone units will be cheap. Maybe you already had one, I did, but I know at least 3 people where this was a factor.


Stop coming up with petty reasons- if you're going to make a case for Nintendo failing, you're going to have to do better than that. The people who decided on one console over another because of DVD playback obviously aren't into the games that much. And why the hell should justification matter at all? If I'm going to buy a console people shouldn't care WHY.

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Disc size: Sure it has larger capacity and is cheaper than a catridge, but it's still smaller than what everyone else is offering. This leads to compressed cut scenes for the GameCube version.


Oh no, compressed cut scenes! Seriously, how long did you brood over all of these? I doubt any 3rd party denied the Gamecube support simply because the disc was a little too small. You know what that small disc offers? MUCH faster load times. So there's a balancing act going on.

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Third party: This is about 50/50. They've been losing a lot of third rate third parties, but have been strengthening their ties with the biggies. The problem is that you and I might not be interested in Atari's, Eidos's, and Acclaim's games, but casual gamers are. Who do you think keeps buying all that licensed crap?


I consider LOSING Acclaim, Eidos, and Atari and GAINING incredible support from Sega, Namco, and Capcom a fairly even trade- actually, I'd say Nintendo got the better end of the stick, actually.

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Kiddie image: Nintendo has done very little to address this. Sure there are 2nd party games like Metroid and Eternal Darkness, but most casual gamers don't know about them because Nintendo failed to aggressively market them. The look of the console adds to this. cel-shading Zelda didn't help.


That cel-shaded Zelda broke Vice City's record for the most preorders. I'll admit, though a lot of older gamers do see Nintendo themselves as being for a younger crowd, and Nintendo does need to step up their advertising (which they have been lately). I talk a LOT about this kind of stuff in my editorial, so I'll save myself the effort of retyping it for your convenience.

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Hype: Would it kill Nintendo to exagerate every once in a while? They release realistic, maybe even slightly lowered specs, while Sony and Microsoft make it sound like they're console is the second coming, and will help you score with the chicks. Give the developers the real numbers, but give the masses something they can brag about.


That's it, I'm convinced- you're a lunatic. How has telling a "chick" you're a gamer EVER worked? Can you explain that to me? From what I've noticed most girls seem to prefer Nintendo's games anyway, perhaps because they're not as worried about image? I NEVER want Nintendo lying or decieving to get sales, EVER. That's another major point of my editorial, which I'll again let you read on your own.

In the end, though, you've come up with some pretty sour excuses for Nintendo's troubles- I'm not saying they don't exist, not by a longshot, but come back when you find the REAL reasons, like Nintendo ignoring the smaller 3rd parties, giving PAL territories the shaft most of the time, not giving their products more prominence in retail stores, not having many games that appeal directly to the Western audience, etc, etc- you got the marketing thing, but Nintendo's already in the process of fixing that. You can do better.  
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Offline Cowboy Bebop

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RE:GameCube’s Mid-Term Report Card
« Reply #164 on: December 30, 2003, 11:32:31 AM »
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Have you read anything I've said? The numbers that show online gaming is NOT popular enough to support now! Nintendo may be a distant second, but everyone is compared to Sony, and Microsoft, the so called crusading hero of online gaming, is a VERY distant third. And that first loss ever was quickly rectified with a price drop that propelled American sales almost to the level of the PS2- Nintendo recognized the problem and fixed it. Are you trying to make a point here?


You havn't provided any proof that on-line isn't profitable.  500,000 * $50 = $25,000,000.  I highly doubt Microsoft has invested $25,000,000 into Live.  If you could show me some figures that say they have, maybe I'll start taking your claims seriously.


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I don't know a single person who decided not to buy a Gamecube because the "official" color was purple- not a single one. And the people that DID make such a decision aren't the people I want taking this industry into the next generation. It's not all about making the MOST money, Cowboy- morality plays a role as well.


They won't be taking it into the next generation, Nerds will.  Unless casual gamers start learning how to program.   They will be financing the next generation though.  Just like they did last generation, and this one.  Like it or not.  

Morality?  Where did that one come from!


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Stop coming up with petty reasons- if you're going to make a case for Nintendo failing, you're going to have to do better than that. The people who decided on one console over another because of DVD playback obviously aren't into the games that much. And why the hell should justification matter at all? If I'm going to buy a console people shouldn't care WHY.


Why does justification matter?  Obviously you've never had to explain to your wife why you want to spend $200.  It goes a whole lot easier if you can make it look like she's getting something out of the deal too.


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Oh no, compressed cut scenes! Seriously, how long did you brood over all of these? I doubt any 3rd party denied the Gamecube support simply because the disc was a little too small. You know what that small disc offers? MUCH faster load times. So there's a balancing act going on.


I never said it cost us support from third parties, but it does come up in reviews that compare all three versions.  Effecting which version a person who owns multiple consoles buys.


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I consider LOSING Acclaim, Eidos, and Atari and GAINING incredible support from Sega, Namco, and Capcom a fairly even trade- actually, I'd say Nintendo got the better end of the stick, actually.


Again, it's not about what you or I want, It's about what casual gamers want.  They don't care about Viewtiful Joe, but they do want the best version of Enter the Matrix.



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That cel-shaded Zelda broke Vice City's record for the most preorders. I'll admit, though a lot of older gamers do see Nintendo themselves as being for a younger crowd, and Nintendo does need to step up their advertising (which they have been lately). I talk a LOT about this kind of stuff in my editorial, so I'll save myself the effort of retyping it for your convenience.


You and your editorial.  I hate to break it to you, but a reply to an editorial posted on an unrelated message board is hardly an editorial.  It's just another post.  Now if you've got a point to make, I hope you don't consider yourself so important that you can't make it again.  For us people that don't want to keep flipping back to a completely different post.  After all, you don't seem to mind repeating "on-line isn't profitable" over and over again.


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That's it, I'm convinced- you're a lunatic. How has telling a "chick" you're a gamer EVER worked? Can you explain that to me? From what I've noticed most girls seem to prefer Nintendo's games anyway, perhaps because they're not as worried about image? I NEVER want Nintendo lying or decieving to get sales, EVER. That's another major point of my editorial, which I'll again let you read on your own.



I never said telling a "chick" you're a gamer EVER worked.  I said people bought into that hype.  It's not lying saying that your console can push a huge number of polygons omiting that those are unlit, unshaded polygons.  That's good marketing.  It's bad marketing to release conservitive, in-game numbers when you competitors are doing the other.



It's not about what you and I want.  We're easy.  We'll buy any Nintendo console they put out, because we're already fans.  What Nintendo needs to do is bring in new fans, and they do that by doing the things I mentioned.
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Offline KnowsNothing

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RE: GameCube’s Mid-Term Report Card
« Reply #165 on: December 30, 2003, 11:48:25 AM »
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Disc size: Sure it has larger capacity and is cheaper than a catridge, but it's still smaller than what everyone else is offering. This leads to compressed cut scenes for the GameCube version.


As MC mentioned there are the faster loading times, but there's also the piracy issue.  GC games are almost impossible to pirate, and any mainstream or even hardcore gamers isn't going to try it.  You need to have alot of money and a lot of time.  While I don't have had numbers, I can safley say that GC discs hold enough data.  Sure, the bigger discs hold more, but how much of that is actually taken up?  The GC discs hold a large amount of data, which is more than enough for the average game.  MP had beautiful graphics and sound, had a huge map, had almost perfect 60 fps, and had zero loading times.  I'd like to see playstation 2 do that.
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RE:GameCube’s Mid-Term Report Card
« Reply #166 on: December 30, 2003, 12:03:12 PM »
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As MC mentioned there are the faster loading times, but there's also the piracy issue.  GC games are almost impossible to pirate, and any mainstream or even hardcore gamers isn't going to try it.  You need to have alot of money and a lot of time.  While I don't have had numbers, I can safley say that GC discs hold enough data.  Sure, the bigger discs hold more, but how much of that is actually taken up?


Yes there are benefits to the smaller disc size, but I'm trying to look at it from the point of view of a casual gamer.  They don't care about piracy.  They just want their graphics to be as clean as possible.


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The GC discs hold a large amount of data, which is more than enough for the average game.  MP had beautiful graphics and sound, had a huge map, had almost perfect 60 fps, and had zero loading times.  I'd like to see playstation 2 do that.


Actually MP did have load times, they were just cleverly hidden by the doors and elevators.  Did you ever run across a room to a door, and have to wait for it to open.  That's why.  That's not to take away from the skills of the programmers though.
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Offline Ian Sane

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RE: GameCube’s Mid-Term Report Card
« Reply #167 on: December 30, 2003, 12:05:27 PM »
MC I think a problem with many of your arguements is that you're stating what you think about the console.  I mean you're entitled to your own opinion but your opinion isn't going to really affect overall sales and Nintendo's overall success.  YOU don't care about what colour your console is.  YOU don't care about a DVD player.  And thus everyone who thinks differently is an idiot and not a real gamer so thus who cares what they think.  Well that doesn't matter because someone who cares about how cool a console looks and likes DVD playback is still going to not buy a Gamecube even if it's for a dumb reason.  And there's more people in the market that think in that sort of superficial way than there are people who think like you.  It's like how in an election I may think that anyone that doesn't vote the way I do is a moron but that doesn't change the fact that they could still elect someone else.  It sucks but that's how it is and Nintendo can't survive forever just targeting people like you.  They can reach a broader market by changing superficial things while still keeping the hardcore fans by not changing the core fundamentals of their practices.

The key for a successful console is to not give people reasons not to buy it, even if they're dumb reasons.

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RE: GameCube’s Mid-Term Report Card
« Reply #168 on: December 30, 2003, 12:08:13 PM »
CB-   You have a little bit of flawed logic.  I was going to analyze costs, but that's silly and I would be speculating as far as actual costs.  In any case though the investment is obviously not worth the return or Nintendo would be jumping online.  There isn't a hold up "just because they are stubborn".

Diminishing return starts taking hold to some features, and online console gaming is one of them- especially when you are catering to so few users.

I suppose online gaming has the benefit of adding users at little cost- but there is a huge initial investment to overcome.  I believe that Microsoft said that they spent 10 million dollars building the Live infastructure.   Games don't cost 10 million to develop, and they can be sold at the same cost as the Live subscription.  If online racing was added to Mario Kart and Nintendo had to invest 10 million additional dollars to impliment it- why bother right now?  It might pick up a fraction of that 5% of additional users, but there would be no immediate return.  Several titles would have to also use the service to even make it feasable to develop the infastructure- and all that for 500,000 users (at best) split between them.  Even if they payed their $50 a year, that is only the return of one game (for a significantly higher investment).  It's better to develop a 1 million dollar game and get at least 20,000 users.

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RE:GameCube’s Mid-Term Report Card
« Reply #169 on: December 30, 2003, 12:09:45 PM »
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You havn't provided any proof that on-line isn't profitable. 500,000 * $50 = $25,000,000. I highly doubt Microsoft has invested $25,000,000 into Live. If you could show me some figures that say they have, maybe I'll start taking your claims seriously.


I think I'm going to take Nintendo's word over YOUR word, especially considering you have done absolutely nothing to convince me- if you want me to believe otherwise, give me some proof that MS is making a nice profit on XBox Live.


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You and your editorial. I hate to break it to you, but a reply to an editorial posted on an unrelated message board is hardly an editorial. It's just another post. Now if you've got a point to make, I hope you don't consider yourself so important that you can't make it again. For us people that don't want to keep flipping back to a completely different post. After all, you don't seem to mind repeating "on-line isn't profitable" over and over again.


Actually, my editorial was emailed to Game-Revolution as well as posted on the Gamecube Discussion board of this very forum. Did you miss my link on the first page, or do you not go into the Gamecube discussion at all? Here's another one, since you're so lazy.

As for repeating lines, no one has proved online gaming is profitable and practical. Seriously, I'm not as thick head as I may seem- if you can give me proof, I will honestly start reconsidering my entire argument. In any case, I gave you much better arguments against me than you have- it's not often your opponent would do something like that, so I'd jump on it if I were you.

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Actually MP did have load times, they were just cleverly hidden by the doors and elevators. Did you ever run across a room to a door, and have to wait for it to open. That's why. That's not to take away from the skills of the programmers though.


Actually, those were not load times. Yes, they did have the same side effect as loading would, but they weren't load times. I forget the technical details of it exactly, though- ask Shadow Fox if you want to know more about that.


IanSane: Maybe I am taking an elitist approach to it, but those opinions aren't just what *I* think, and how they affect ME. It's impossible to prove indefinitely whether DVD playback or console color really are what's "dragging" Nintendo down, so to speak (really, there's not as much "dragging" as many of you believe), but it's my opinion that they affect sales very little. That's my opinion. I don't have a negative view of casual gamers, just of casual gamers that decide what console to buy based on what color it is and whether or not it plays DVD's.

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The key for a successful console is to not give people reasons not to buy it, even if they're dumb reasons.


THAT I truly agree with, and is one of the problem's Nintendo faces- individually each problem isn't major, but together they do matter.  
"You know you're being too serious when Mouse tells you to lighten up... ^_^"<BR>-Bill

Offline odifiend

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RE:GameCube’s Mid-Term Report Card
« Reply #170 on: December 30, 2003, 12:26:50 PM »
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I consider LOSING Acclaim, Eidos, and Atari and GAINING incredible support from Sega, Namco, and Capcom a fairly even trade- actually, I'd say Nintendo got the better end of the stick, actually.

I agree with MC that Acclaim churns out crap.  Atari however has the DBZ: Budokai franchise and although I don't particularly care for it, I invite you find some sales figures on those two games and tell me that the (early) releases did not help Sony.  
As for GAINING incredible support from Sega last time I checked Super Monkey Ball was the only original thing released so far from Sega.  Yes! We have been allowed to buy Dreamcast ports! Skies of Arcadia, SA: 1&2, PSO! Thank you so much Sega for showering us with your old games yet always charging at least $40 for them.  I find it sad that of the six games Sega has released, only two have been original.  Last time I checked it was the Xbox that had Panzer Dragoon Orca and the PS2 that had Shinobi,  new expansions of Sega's classics.  Oh yes we are getting Sonic Heroes, but since the game might actually be good, the game is to be released on all platforms.
Capcom promised us exclusive RE.  They have since released RE on PS2 (not true sequels, yet, but still).  Not that was really their fault (RE 0 sales weren't what they expected).  We don't have Megaman X, no plans of getting Onimusha, no devil may cry which are games they are famous for.  But Capcom is not nearly as bad as Sega as they have blessed us with VJ.
Namco is the only company I agree with MC on.  The company is the best relation Nintendo has IMO.  SC 2, the starfox colloboration, and the Tales game are games that everyone MUST have.  I'm not crazy about Donkey Konga but somebody must be.
MC, I have to say I didn't get how purple and morality fit together, but Cowboy is right: its all about the image.  The gamecube is not so uncool but purple wasn't all that becoming.  It did look lame and I don't know a single person with a purple cube even though I know about 20 owners of the cube.  What is more if you notice in recent Nintendo ads, Nintendo is pushing the platinum gamecube so even they relized this.  Personally, I don't understand why they weren't pushing the black cube earlier.
P.S. it would probably be profitable for Nintendo to sink a couple of dollars on a cool plastic shell for their game system and sell it, than to keep it purple and have it sit on the shelf and call it moral. Argue with that!
Kiss the Cynic!

Offline KnowsNothing

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RE: GameCube’s Mid-Term Report Card
« Reply #171 on: December 30, 2003, 12:32:09 PM »
Purple is ghey.   That's what everyone around here says.

I don't want anyone thinking that I support that though. I own a purple gamecube.
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Offline Cowboy Bebop

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RE:GameCube’s Mid-Term Report Card
« Reply #172 on: December 30, 2003, 12:42:34 PM »
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Actually, those were not load times. Yes, they did have the same side effect as loading would, but they weren't load times. I forget the technical details of it exactly, though- ask Shadow Fox if you want to know more about that.



It almost worked like GTA's streaming city.   It wouldn't load the whole map at once, it would only load the room you were in. Then the game would detect where you were going and start loading the next section.  This worked great for the most part, but sometimes if you'd quickly run accross a room, it didn't have time to load the next section, so you'd have to wait a moment for it to finish loading before the door would open.  The doors also masked the fact that there was nothing behind them until the game detected that's where you were going and loaded that area.  The elevators though were definately fancy loading screens.
"Some Scientists claim that hydrogen, because it is so plentiful, is the basic building block of the universe. I dispute that. I say there is more stupidity than hydrogen, and that is the basic building block of the universe."
-Frank Zappa

Offline Ian Sane

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RE: GameCube’s Mid-Term Report Card
« Reply #173 on: December 30, 2003, 12:49:39 PM »
"As for GAINING incredible support from Sega last time I checked Super Monkey Ball was the only original thing released so far from Sega. Yes! We have been allowed to buy Dreamcast ports! Skies of Arcadia, SA: 1&2, PSO! Thank you so much Sega for showering us with your old games yet always charging at least $40 for them."

Well there's also Super Monkey Ball 2, Beach Spikers and Soccer Slam which I'm pretty sure at the time of release were all Gamecube exclusive.  PSO Episode I & II is technically a sequel as well since Episode II is basically PSO 2.  At least that's how Sega treats it as.  Personally I don't care if Skies of Arcadia is a port because it f*cking rocks!

Oh and as bad as Acclaim, Edios, and Atari are if they never supported the Cube we wouldn't have got Burnout 2, Timesplitters 2 and IKARUGA~ so although they for the most part suck I think having their support for the 1 or 2 good games they release every generation is worth it.  While ultimately we don't miss much without them we don't lose anything if the Cube has their support.  They're minor losses but losses nonetheless.

Offline Mario

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RE: GameCube’s Mid-Term Report Card
« Reply #174 on: December 30, 2003, 12:56:02 PM »
Can't forget about Billy Hatcher. Oh, and PSO III is exclusive, and a new game.