Topic: George Harrison answers questions on GameCube 2 (N5) and next Gameboy

[thecubedcanuck]

"I think that Nintendo is better at concentrating on the future and the big picture but the "now" is what is going to determine how well the N5 does which will have an effect on Nintendo's future."

That quote says it all.
The future of Nintendo is entirely dependant on the actions they take now.
If the N5 is set to come out in mid 2005 , then Nintendo has roughly 20 months to convice gamers that their product is the one to get. That means they have to win them over with the gamecube in order to get them to even consider looking at the N5. This wont be an easy task. How do you convince people who already have a console to buy another one, especially when the consoles themselves are similar in most ways. The price cut is a good start, so are games like MGS-TS (for the masses) and MKDD (for the loyalists). Only time will really tell, but I personally think a much more aggresive approach is needed. I have yet to see a commercial for MKDD or the twin snakes, and by now I should have. I have never seen a commercial for ED or RE. Again why not? They need to market themselves better, and not just to the niche market they already have. I see at least one PS2 ad a day on mainstream TV and I dont even watch much TV.
Well, enough of that.


 

[mouse_clicker]

Nobody thought cartridges were stupid until CD's became so popular, my friend. In fact, all signs pointed to cartridges being BETTER. The CD add on for the Genesis flopped, the Saturn flopped, the Playstation sold very poorly for it's frist two years- sure, you can say it was a mistake NOW, when you look back on it knowing what you know, but you would have made the same decision were you in Nintendo's shoes.

And making one color of the Gamecube purple had absolutely nothing to do with Nintendo's less than stellar sales- people who wanted a different color quite simply bought a different color.

As for your thoughts on Mario (again), it's still the same thing- Mario shooting up bad guys. Isn't it's the younger people who want to play "mature" games and it's the  older people who want to play the supposed "kiddy" games. Mario is perfect as it is, easily better than any other platforming series to date. As someone once said, if ny other company had made Super Mario Sunshine it would have been hailed as a masterpiece.  

Ads, blah, blah, blah- you're just repeating the same crap I've heard time and time again. Nintendo has actually put their advertising into high gear. I've seen innumerous Mario Kart commercials, Twin Snakes isn't do out until next March (I won't get into my thoughts on that, though), and I saw quite a few commercials for Resident Evil. To say Eternal Darkness had any advertisement at all would be an overstatement, and it's really why the game flopped. Sony ads I see almost none of, and I shouldn't- when you're as far ahead as Sony is, agressive advertising becomes a waste of money. Compare how many Pepsi ads you see versus Coca-Cola ads. And of course you seem to be forgetting about the Who are You campaign entirely, which is pure genious, if you ask me, despite your personal opinions on the individual ads.

[thecubedcanuck]

"if ny other company had made Super Mario Sunshine it would have been hailed as a masterpiece. "

This is strongly disagree with. You call also say that if it were made by a differant company then EVERONE HERE would have hated it.

The camera in the game was brutal, it made me ill to play. I am positve many others felt this way and I honestly could care less who made it.

[thecubedcanuck]

"I've seen innumerous Mario Kart commercials"

where? What are you watching?

I honestly have never seen one. As for Sonys ads, they are on quite often. Hell everyone and their uncle knows that silly voice sayong playstation at the end.

[mouse_clicker]

Odd, everyone I know who's played the game absolutely loved it- the camera was no problem at all. Afterall, it was the exact same camera system from Super Mario 64, which is considered one of the, if not the best platformer ever. The only difference was the ability to move the camera manually, which I did constantly. Not because I had to but because I wanted to- even the best camera in the world isn't always where you want it, and I was able to put the camera exactly where I wanted it at any moment in the game. It's that kind of precision and customization that should become standard in games today. I could find no faults in the camera at all.

[The Omen]

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However right now I'd say that both Sony and MS are more in touch with what gamers want right now. Nintendo on the other hand comes across as fairly out-of-touch.

I agree wholeheartedly.  And i'll tell you another thing.  Perri Kaplan from NOA is totally  clueless.  I dont know if its Nintendo feeding her(her or him?) lines or what, but i read an interview with her that just left me feeling sick to my stomach.  Fire her ass and put me in charge.  You need somebody that will fire back when it comes to competition, not somebody who says 'we're not concerned'.  Well, Perri Kaplan, your fanbase is very concerned.

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And making one color of the Gamecube purple had absolutely nothing to do with Nintendo's less than stellar sales- people who wanted a different color quite simply bought a different color.

The problem was they marketed the purple GC, not the black.  All the commercials initially were for the purple cube, and that certainly didnt help bring in new fans.

[mouse_clicker]

I don't know if I'd like Nintendo catering to people who make console decisions based on color, though, and I don't think Nintendo wants to cater to those people, either. Then again, maybe it's for that very reason sales have been slipping.  

"where? What are you watching?"

Comedy Central and Cartoon Network, mainly, although I've seen the commercial on channels like Gameshow Network and TechTV as well. Really, I've seen a lot- I wouldn't say it's a great commercial, but it's not bad either. I like the push for preordering, as well. Even if you personally didn't like the Zelda bonus disc, you have to admit it was a stroke of genious. Wind Waker preorders were through the roof and suddenly every publisher has some sort of deal for people who preorder.

[KnowsNothing]

I have a purple GC.  I like it better than the black.  I must be ghey. -___-

[Mario]

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Hype is a very delicate thing, something I don't think ANYONE has mastered, much less Nintendo.

Sony has.

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And making one color of the Gamecube purple had absolutely nothing to do with Nintendo's less than stellar sales- people who wanted a different color quite simply bought a different color.

Bzzzt. I highly disagree, no-one wants a purple lunch box. Purple is the GameCubes main colour, people see it and think its kiddie and has crappy games that only a 5 year old could enjoy.

As for advertising, i think Nintendo wasted the "who are you?" campaign on friggin Super Mario Advance 4: Super Mario Bros 3. And Mario Kart and Twin Snakes commercials? They arent even out yet! And the Mario Kart commercial thats showing now says "Coming November 18" or something, so expect a different follow up commercial after its released.

Also i dont think Nintendo should hype their next consoles so soon, its bad marketing and people want to think that the Gamecube still has lots of life left or they will be a bit on edge about whether or not to get a Nintendo console again, since a new one will come out shortly after, thus getting them screwed... or something.

And as for Gameboy vs PSP, i dont think Nintendo really have much to worry about.

[thecubedcanuck]

"I could find no faults in the camera at all. "

Blue silhouette man didnt bother you at all?

"The problem was they marketed the purple GC, not the black. All the commercials initially were for the purple cube, and that certainly didnt help bring in new fans."

This is correct even if it is very illogical.

[mouse_clicker]

I've already commented on console color.

The outline of Mario didn't bother me at all- it's very helpful knowing where Mario is when I have the camera in another position to look at something else.

Even Sony has not mastered hype- they had pretty good success with the PS2 launch, but otherwise, I don't see too much evidence to support their mastering the technique.  

[Cap]

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Originally posted by: mouse_clicker

Even Sony has not mastered hype- they had pretty good success with the PS2 launch, but otherwise, I don't see too much evidence to support their mastering the technique.

personaly, i think 50 million ps2's being sold compared to 20 million combined for gamecube and xbox is pretty good evidence.

[mouse_clicker]

Of hype? The PS2 was guaranteed to be a success simply because the Playstation was- all Sony had to do was nudge it along. The PSX wasn't hyped at all and is currently the best selling console of all time. No, even Sony has not mastered the art of hype, and it's preposterous to think they have after only 2 generations. Just because Sony has success doesn't mean they attained that success soley through the use of hype.  

[thecubedcanuck]

    Quote
   Originally posted by: mouse_clicker

   Even Sony has not mastered hype- they had pretty good success with the PS2 launch, but otherwise, I don't see too much evidence to support their mastering the technique.


The fact they are still selling consoles by the boat load says it all.
Software sales arent bad either.

jeeez

[Bill Aurion]

Sony pretty much has hype under control...I mean just look at the PSP...People are already calling it a "Game Boy Killer" even though the specs on it are impossible and that it's been pretty much confirmed that no games are currently in development for it

[thecubedcanuck]

"Comedy Central and Cartoon Network, mainly,"

Sorry I missed this earlier. But dont you think that the channels you mention have limited or should I say a certain type of viewer?

To attract more people, advertise to more people. Its real simple

[mouse_clicker]

Great sales has little to do with hype- Sony DOES have other methods of success, you know.

Yes, cable has historically had less viewers than network television, byt then again by comparison I see very few videogame commercials period on network television. Additionally, both Cartoon Network and Comedy Central get a massive amount of viewers, more than your "average" cable station. Seriously, you'd be surprised just how popular those two channels are. Obviously advertising to more people would have better results, but that's not just something Nintendo isn't doing, it's something that noone is doing.

[Mario]

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Great sales has little to do with hype- Sony DOES have other methods of success, you know.

So hype = not much sales?

And what are these other methods?

[thecubedcanuck]

"Obviously advertising to more people would have better results, but that's not just something Nintendo isn't doing, it's something that noone is doing. "

You have to be joking. Sony ads are just as common on cable as they are on network TV.
Who watches the cartoon channel? Primarily children I would think?
How does a company shed its kiddie image when they primarily advertise to children?

[Mario]

I dont think Nintendo need to shed their kiddy image, and they dont plan too either. They just need to be Nintendo, and stop TRYING to be someone else, a 'mature', 'cool' company (glass cube ads etc.). The new press release that i just read about Nintendo being the company of choice this christmas for Santa, has the whole "kiddy" feel to it, and i dont see anything wrong with that. Nintendo are kiddy, and proud of it!

[mouse_clicker]

You can't just make blanket statements, cubed- there is such a thing as nostalgia. And besides that, by far Cartoon Network's most popular shows are on Adult Swim, comprised of such shows as Family Guy, Futurama, several Cartoon Network originals, and numerous anime shows.

To date I've never seen a Sony ad, or Nintendo ad for that matter, on network television. Granted I don't watch as much network television as cable, but then agan it's quite obvious you don't watch as much cable television as I do, so I think this point is moot.

I find it odd you're falling back on the same thing people have used against Nintendo for ages, cubed. I respect you, man, I at least expected you to be original.

"So hype = not much sales?

And what are these other methods?"

Solid advertising and marketing. Good games (Sony's talents as a developer have really come to fruit in recent times). Being in touch with the public, knowing what they want and what they don't want. I've already commented on what hype can or cannot do for sales, so I won't repeat myself there, but do realize that hype isn't the only way to get sales.

[S-U-P-E-R]

Something spoke directly to me in this. Y'see, I look at my GC library, my XBox library, and my PS2 library, and the PS2 is the weirdest most unique bunch of the lot. You know what sold me on a PS2? A weird, specific game. Little niche games that don't sell half a million, but they're still GOOD games, just wacky niche things that fill out a system's library.

I mean like, realistic racing sim fans, fighting game fans, music game fans, they're each far from a majority, but when you can wrap up all those little markets in one system, that's something special, right there. And I don't mean like, one or two, I mean a real VARIETY. There's not much of a reason to be buggered to release something like Guilty Gear XX, GunGrave, Frequency, Contra, DDR, Silpheed, anything like that on more than one system. Just the one with the most units out there (unless one somehow amazingly cheaper or more practical). It seems, like, Ikaruga is the only one of these that GC actually got, and you guys all saw how hot that was.

And, hey, once these weirdos like me got a PS2, buying ten zillion copies of GTA3 was inevitable, I mean, if you've got the system already, why not get the hot high-profile game of the year, too?

In my mind here, the recipe for success is to GET THOSE DEV KITS OUT TO EVERYBODY, PRONTO. Sure, maybe clowns you never heard of like Arc System Works won't make you a DKC or a GTA3, but when all of those guys get you you an amazing volume of niche titles, that's nothing to scoff at.

(Also make a more universal controller, guys, that'd sure help. Six face buttons, if you please.)

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Also, when we launched the GameCube, we put the concentration of our development kits in the hands of only a few people -- internally, of course, with Mr. Miyamoto's EAD team, but also with Rare. And Rare didn't deliver a single game for us at the launch, when their history had been to make some really great games for us in the past. That hurt us, and it led us into this gap of titles, starting after the launch and lasting for about seven or nine months until Mario Sunshine came out. Consumers want consistency. They would never buy a DVD player that had only one or two good movies a year; they want consistency and variety, and we're trying hard to make sure that's not only resolved for the GameCube, but as we go into the next system.

YES

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But, having said that, there are probably five to eight really important publishers out there, if you look at the concentration within the industry. So we're not talking about a hundred publishers who need development kits, but five to eight

NO : (

[Bill Aurion]

I doubt the next Ninty controller will have 6 face buttons...The N64 had 6, but 4 were basically the same button, so...

And I also think what Harrison was getting at was that they would look at the possibility of sending out dev kits to the biggest dev teams, such as EA, Capcom, etc...Personally I think it makes sense, but I wouldn't wait too long before handing them out to everyone else...

[Mario]

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Solid advertising and marketing. Good games (Sony's talents as a developer have really come to fruit in recent times). Being in touch with the public, knowing what they want and what they don't want.

In other words, hype.

[mouse_clicker]

Exactly, Ty- the PS2 reaches out to all sorts of people, and when you combine them all into one, it doesn't matter if individual niche groups generally don't make games instant platinum hits. However, that's also due largely to Sony's immense 3rd party support- when you have such a vast amount of 3rd parties, obviously you're going to cover a very wide area of gamers, and I think it's that 3rd party support, or rather lack thereof, that's really damning Nintendo.