Author Topic: the end of humanity (Read 33718 times)

Bill Aurion · « **Reply #75 on:** October 15, 2003, 06:37:23 PM »

Haha, I guess that's true. But opinions are like glue...They stick to you and the fumes are nauseating(*horrible analogy alert*)...That's what happens when topics like these arise; people say stuff and completely deny what everyone has to say. It's human nature

Topics like these never progress...ever...^_^

nolimit19 · « **Reply #76 on:** October 15, 2003, 07:06:22 PM »

well it is true words mean different things to different people...but so many people find words(the "f" word in this situation) hurtful, degrading, and mean that i think its not only wrong but impractical to allow such words on public tv. who cares about the people who arent offended by the "F" word??? i dont. i am not offended by the "N" word cuz im not black...and since blacks are just a minority lets just use the word all the time....if they dont want to hear it the can move to africa.....that is the type of illogical bull SHlT going on with this thing. and still no one can come up with a counter to my arguments because they arent something you can argue against. simple as that. and the fact that no one with the opposing view point has answered any of my question shows me that they have obviously gone out of the way to avoid them....meaning they are both affected by my words and therefore wrong. and at this point i would like to point to KnowsNothings sig and go finish celebrating the cubs demise. thank you and good bye for now.

Shift Key · « **Reply #77 on:** October 15, 2003, 07:17:17 PM »

LOOK AT ME! I'M THIS THREAD!
*spins around in circle, hits head and collapses*
YAY! CONCUSSION'D!

But anyway, this sounds like it should be locked. Any last words?

Bill Aurion · « **Reply #78 on:** October 15, 2003, 07:26:02 PM »

I've got a whole stack of last words!

"Are you sure the power is off?" -Unknown

"The earth is suffocating... Swear to make them cut me open, so that I won't be buried alive." -Frederic Chopin

"Waiting are they? Waiting are they? Well--let 'em wait." -Ethan Allen

"Go away. I'm all right." -H.G.Wells

nolimit19 · « **Reply #79 on:** October 15, 2003, 07:28:29 PM »

naw censorship is an important topic. to me its obvious certain things should be censored. we have things like naked news(who said morals arent declining?). and its an important topic that needs to be talked about....even if its not as constructive as it could be.....and even if one side ignores reason. even this very forum has censorship....censorship is obviously appropriate in some places, and not so much in others. and i still say that anything public traditionally is , and should be, family friendly.

Koopa Troopa · « **Reply #80 on:** October 15, 2003, 10:21:59 PM »

Quote
Whe are you going to realize it's not our morality (or lack thereof) that makes our nation great? The US is full of sleeze balls and people who are afraid of offending everybody- THEY'RE not why our country is great, my friend. THEY'RE why everybody else hates us.

Yeah our GENERATION is full of sleeze balls, but such was not the case eighty or so years our senior. And I have NO love for fantatic freedom fighters who's objective is "accept everything", it is because of them that I consider "tolerance" a dirty word.

Our morals have been on the decline, but it was good morals that founded our nation, and our general adherence to them for so long kept us great.

Its because we're constantly desensitizing ourselves that so much of populace has been growing wicked. And guess what desensitizes? A constant barrage of something... Oh! Like the need to inject foul language and sex into anything and everything!

By the way... I find it curious that you completely dodged the original question in my reply.

Termin8Anakin · « **Reply #81 on:** October 15, 2003, 11:00:36 PM »

sex sells......as much as i hate to admit it.

although.....for me......if i saw a bus stop ad of Holly Valance blowing me a kiss whilst holding a pepsi in her other hand (there is such an ad here), that doesn't make me all of a sudden say 'Oh, i wanna buy a pepsi now!'.....i'd steal the ad and put it in my room for....further use.....
Hahaha.

Anyway......back to the topic we go!

The Omen · « **Reply #82 on:** October 16, 2003, 04:25:23 AM »

Ternin8, thats true, except why is Pepsi even so well known? Because we've been barraged with constant ads over the years and now its a given -pepsi or coke? Commercials work on a subconscious level.

Anyway, i'm outta here, because beliefs are beliefs and changing anyones belief is virtually impossible...but it was fun while it lasted

Termin8Anakin · « **Reply #83 on:** October 16, 2003, 05:18:55 AM »

I don't really care about ads too much.
But there was one a while back that tried to make Pepsi cooler ad hipper than Coke, and yes, it was actually Coke they were using:

Twins are sitting on their porch. One is drinking Coke, the other, Pepsi.
Coke Twin dreams about his plans for the future, and has this glorious image of him as a champion test crickter being showered in praise. A smile is on his face.
Pepsi Twin dreams about HIS plans for the future. Out of his office he steps, and he calls out 'Next!'. He's wearing a doctor's garb, clipboard in hand. IN steps a hot chick in nothin but a bikini. The camera pulls back, and it's revealed that he is a guy who does bikini waxing........the whole office is filled with hot chicks in nothin but bikinis.
Pepsi Twin smiles. Coke Twin looks and his Coke, seriously reconsidering.

The point the ad was trying to convey? Pepsi is cooler. Did it work? Dunno. But it was funny - the first time i saw it.

I just realised that there are more of those new pepsi ads at bus stops. There's the one with Holly blowing a kiss at me (yes me

), and there's one of Chloe Maxwell *droooool* she's the wobble-board chick from the Jeans West ads.

Hahahaha.

And I think that after this post, one of the mods are gonna say:
"right, this thread has passed it's time. move on folks, nothing more to see here. it's starting to get off topic."

*LOCKED*

Don't be angry. Blame me. Me........no wait......him. HIM!

*runs*

Ms.Pikmin · « **Reply #84 on:** October 16, 2003, 08:39:48 AM »

Mouseclicker, I understand what you are saying about word just being words. The problem is that to reduce profanity, racial slurs, etc. to "just words" isn't realistic. People are affected by the words they hear someone use. It is a reflection of the users attitudes, values and also shows, in some situations, their respect for the person or people they are talking to.

I will admit that I can be fairly profane at times. I'm not trying to act like I don't use profanity. But I don't swear in front my elders, children or people who I know are going to be horrified and offended.

I'm sorry if I've missed some of your points but I've just read about 4 pages of posts and it's all jumbled in my head who said what.

Hostile Creation · « **Reply #85 on:** October 16, 2003, 12:03:09 PM »

Exactly. Profanity, in my opinion, is fine if you're using it casually, like my friends and I do on occassion. But to, say, walk up to some girl and call her a c*nt licking lesbo whore. . . it may seem empty, me saying it now, but stuff like that can hurt. So, yeah, words can be used to hurt people.

But mainly, I don't see the problem with hurting people. They can just get over it

mouse_clicker · « **Reply #86 on:** October 16, 2003, 01:22:53 PM »

It isn't realistic, Ms.Pikmin, because people don't realise it. People don't realise that if they don't choose to let a word offend them, it won't. That doesn't mean we should throw the notion out altogether, though.

And I'm not saying you should swear all the time or in front of all people, or call people whatever you want, as in Hostile's example- that's a very selfish way to think about it, Like I said, *I* don't find words offensive, and I know the words themselves aren't offensive, but I'm mindful of the fact that some people do find them offensive, and I respect their choice and hence won't swear around or to them

manunited4eva22 · « **Reply #87 on:** October 16, 2003, 02:30:09 PM »

You guys are crossing a very fine line when you are suggesting that your human truth and the human truth are the same thing. To you, your ideas and values may be one thing. It may be very similar to Western Culture, it may not, it all varies. But when you bring up something likely say naked news, you are going to hit a wall. There are many cultures where being naked is just fine, as it is very natural to be naked. Peole don't realize that their view only represents a micro, if not nanofraction of the worlds population. The fact that you were raised to find profanity dehumatizing may be true for you, but as you have already made clear, intentionally or not, it is a dying thought. Lets not forget that the f word is but one word in the english language, and that profanity, bad or not is one of the more often used nouns/adjectives/verbs used.

My point still stands about profanity. The 'profane' words are a few words that were set aside many many many years ago to represent words that the average person was supposed to be afraid to use. Since that time, the use of those words, and most words in general, have gained many different distinctions, and because of that you can't just say, this is what it means, look it up. Just think of the word kill. At one time this could pretty easily be classified as a as a verb, but since that time, it has taken many different versions, slang or not, that make its meaning more than skewed. What I am getting at is that societ HAS and will continue to change, no matter how many people say it won't and scream lalalalala as it continues. At this time, the FCC has decided that people are generally accepting of the use of the f word if it is in a proper context, and generally I have to agree with them. The analogy extends to many good movies where nudity or violence is used as a tool to reach deap human emotions. Lets look at Saving Private Ryan as an example. In Saving Private Ryan countless people are basically annihilated, and the camera does not stop at any time to make it look like anything else. ABC played the entire movie without any edits shown, because they felt that it was more important to keep the film in tact, then to play to the idea that certain things are always bad. The same thing happened on NBC, except with Shindler's List. My point is this, there is a context where the F word has a place, and the FCC has nodded their head to the major stations that they have the right to make that decision for themselves, the FCC does not need to baby sit them every moment on that word.

Hostile Creation · « **Reply #88 on:** October 16, 2003, 04:01:57 PM »

We are only referring to Western culture. I'm not talking about Asia or anything.

I agree with what you had to say, though.

Marcus Arillius · « **Reply #89 on:** October 16, 2003, 04:12:49 PM »

The End of "humanity", eh? My my, that's a very ethnocentric view if I do say so myself. I would say "who cares? It's just a word." However, for the time being it's considered taboo in our culture. Can't change culture in a day. No sir-ee bob.
I never could understand why words are taboo though. We humans are so odd. Censorship... meh.

Regardless of what you may think about censorship, we do have certain rules in this forum which you agree to abide by when you post here. One of them says that you may not use defamatory language against other people. - Jonny

Termin8Anakin · « **Reply #90 on:** October 16, 2003, 07:17:58 PM »

Fornication Under Consent of the King.

Funny how some words still have their same sort of meaning after all these centuries.
Anyway....
Words are words, Mouse, I know, as you put it, and it's true. If we just say a word we don't know, the meaning has no affect on us. So we are taught the meaning. A dog is a furry creature on four legs, drools a lot and barks, etc. This is the basics of semiotics, where there is the 'Signifier' and the 'Signified'. Signifier being the word, and the Signified being the meaning/image we associate with the word.
The signifier will always be the same (a word can't exactly change), but the signified (the meaning/image we use to associate it with) can change - much like how an earlier exampled was used (by Perm, I believe), for Shampoo in stead of f**k. By that example, we can now use shampoo in stead of f**k: "Shampoo your mum!", "Oh, SHAMPOO!". We would know that you are using another word to say f**k, but other poeple would think you really are trying to have a bath with the other guy's mum, or you forgot to buy some shampoo - like how 'frick', 'fark', 'shite' etc is what we use instead of the actual word.

Now, I'm going to go out on a limb here, since I never really paid attention in the classes at uni

.
Now Mouse, you are saying that words are JUST words. They aren't. All words have a meaning. Or else they are of no use. F**k has a meaning, s**t has a meaning, c**t has a meaning. It is the same meaning, depite the tone/instance you are using it. People WILL be offended by it one way or another. We learn (by punishment from our parents, in school, etc), we are NOT TAUGHT that profanity is bad (however much fun it would be - see the South Park Movie

).

And just let me finish by saying that however you use swear words is up to you. I can't punish you for it. I'm nowhere near you guys (except for Mario, Infernal and Joey - so watch out!

). I'm saying that while we all swear from time to time, the coolest thing to do is know when not to do it, not use it all the time cause it's cool. Sure it may make you sound like a badass (which I'm sure some of you wanna be like), but hell, just take it easy.
Ok?

I totally agree with you too, manunited. I guess I'm just saying this because too many little kids are swearing, and won't know when it is appropriate to us them.
The thing with us is that we always disagree with what younger generations do. I guess all we can do is sit back and complain our asses off

mouse_clicker · « **Reply #91 on:** October 16, 2003, 07:31:26 PM »

Words have definitions, yes, but the words we are talking about have a definition and a meaning, two very different things. Yes, words like f*** and sh** have definitions, but obviously, since we have synonyms of these words, which have the exact same definition, yet are also oddly socially acceptable, it's the meaning that makes these words "bad". But meaning is subjective- it doesn't matter how you imply it, if I don't take it that way I won't be offended. People aren't offended by the word f*** because of it's definition, they're offended because they're trained from childhood to label it as a "bad" word. My point is that if you don't let these words offend you, they won't. I'm sorry if I sound like a broken record, but I'm only responding to the arguments given to me, which so far haven't changed. So far the word f*** has been banned from network television because society has socially shunned it, but fewer and fewer people are finding it offensive, so the FCC is changing its rules to reflect the changes of society. Like I said, you either change with the future or get left in the past.

As for younger generations, 50 years ago people our age would have been severely punished for saying damn- social taboos are gradually lifted, and this is just another instance.

nolimit19 · « **Reply #92 on:** October 16, 2003, 07:44:15 PM »

well i have made several points that no one has argued against...and its not about words being bad or whether they should or shouldnt be bad...its about cussing in public...there are enough people who are offended by the f word that it is legit to not allow it on tv. PUBLIC TV THAT IS! who cares if its one cable...no one. its a private thing...no one has addressed that issue. that is the difference in this situation that everyone has missed...well not everyone, just the people hopelessly defending the ruling by the fcc.

The Omen · « **Reply #93 on:** October 16, 2003, 07:52:07 PM »

I know i said i'm out of here, but i made the fateful decision to see what has transpired in my absence.

Mouse-clicker-you're putting the cart before the horse. We are trained to believe it because it is so. People use those words in a derogatory manner. The fact that they're used in that way is why kids are trained to feel that way, not vice-versa. You're putting the reaction before the action.

mouse_clicker · « **Reply #94 on:** October 16, 2003, 07:57:12 PM »

It shouldn't matter how the word is implied if you don't let it have any effect on you. Why is sh** worse than crap when they both represent the same deragatory meaning? It doesn't make sense, does it?

nolimit: I have addressed that, and I hear swearing public constantly, not only in school, where you have to ignore it if you wish to keep your sanity, but really in any public place. Frankly, I'm quite surprised you do think it's not considered acceptable in public.

nolimit19 · « **Reply #95 on:** October 16, 2003, 07:58:22 PM »

well said omen...and i am going to try to stay away as well. we are simply at an impass and there is no way we can come to any agreement that hasnt already been made...nothing wrong with that of course.

mouse_clicker · « **Reply #96 on:** October 16, 2003, 08:08:40 PM »

No one's really answered my question- why can't you guys who don't want swearing on TV simply don't watch shows that have a lot in it? No one's forcing you to, and no one's expecting you to agree with it, either, just to accept it.

Termin8Anakin · « **Reply #97 on:** October 16, 2003, 08:37:51 PM »

I for one aren't offended by shows that have swearing.
I never said that. And neither is anyone else here.

It's just the way such freedom will be used - once that freedom is given.
When people have the freedom to say what they want on public TV, witty dialogue in shows will be replaced by huge amounts of profanity. Likewise, a scene that is meant to be sensual and erotic will be replaced by full on porn and nudity. It's just not the right thing to do. If we are to simply accept that shows are going to have heaps of this, and not watch it, there will be nothing to watch. Everything will basically be crap.
DO i sound to some of you pro-profanitist (

) like I'm some goody two-shoes Catholic who believes that you will all go to hell? Well, yes and no. I'm Catholic, yes, but i really don't give a damn about it.

mouse_clicker · « **Reply #98 on:** October 16, 2003, 08:49:12 PM »

If you guys are so adamant that most people do NOT want swearing on TV, I assure you, you won't see a lot of swearing on TV. TV shows won't swear simply because they can. Like I said, just because they're allowed to doesn't mean they will- I seriously doubt you'll see any network excersising their new right except very late and only in special case. Regardless of your opinion on cable, it HAS had the ability to leave words like sh** and f*** uncensored, but I think you'll agree that this happens VERY rarely. I agree it won't be good to have shows flooded with vulgarity (for reasons other than yours, I'm sure), but I'm at least glad that they are ABLE to. I'd prefer shows be creative and think of alternatives for swearing, since in my opinion excessive use of it makes you look unintelligent but the simple fact that it is no lnoger banned is a major step towards removing the censorship in this country.

Ms.Pikmin · « **Reply #99 on:** October 17, 2003, 02:00:27 AM »

Quote
Originally posted by: mouse_clicker
No one's really answered my question- why can't you guys who don't want swearing on TV simply don't watch shows that have a lot in it? No one's forcing you to, and no one's expecting you to agree with it, either, just to accept it.

I actually addressed this in my original post on page 1 or 2. I watch whatever I want to and don't worry about profanity. My problem is that I have kids that are 2 and 8. There is very little they can see on primetime tv. There used to be choices as far as programming went. Now, I can't think of more than one or two shows that don't have profanity or sexual content. It seems like if you find a show where there isn't swearing then the trade off is sex.

Also, on the note that we should just accept it: We are talking about tv primarily in the US. In this country we are allowed to complain and try to change things if we don't like the way it's working. We absolutely don't have to sit back and accept it. No, we don't "have" to watch shows with profanity but there should at least be choices.

News:

Author Topic: the end of humanity (Read 33718 times)