Author Topic: Grammar question: Why do people use 'are' instead of 'is'? (Read 8446 times)

VideoGamerX · « **on:** July 30, 2003, 10:55:58 AM »

I hope the title explained enough to get across what I'm talking about, but in case it didn't, I'd like to know, why do so many people use 'are' instead of 'is' when addressing a company (example: Nintendo, Sony, Konami, Capcom) and other singular groups of people? I don't mean to be nitpicky or critical. This seems like a really good question that might spark some grammar debate. This is not aimed to start an argument or a fight between groups of people who swear up and down they know sentence structure and what-not. This is really the result of one person slowly becoming annoyed at a trend that seemed to start off small about a year and a half ago that has now infected roughly 70% of all forum users.

To be honest, I don't know why people have given in and changed their own usage of 'is' and 'are' to something incorrect without even looking in to it. Just the sentence, "Oh, well Capcom are working on five exclusive games for the Nintendo Gamecube, " doesn't even come out of your mouth naturally. It reeks of wrongness to anybody that has had Freshman level English in high school. I mean, Capcom itself is ONE company. It stands as one software developer. They are acting as one under a common cause and do not pretend to be several independent individuals working together for separate interests or even common interests. Just think about it.

It's like the difference between saying:
The United States are going to war on terrorism.
and,
The United States is going to war on terrorism.

Which do you think is correct? I know which one Microsoft Word says is correct, and I know the one I would use would be viewed as correct on a formal paper. Now, all I want to know is what's up with the usage of 'are' people? Just curious to hear your reasoning and don't mind if you keep doing it.

Ian Sane · « **Reply #1 on:** July 30, 2003, 11:16:41 AM »

I'm going to go out on a limb here and assume that most people who don't have perfect grammar just do it accidentaly. I really doubt anyone who uses 'are' in the wrong sense has any specific reason for doing so.

S-U-P-E-R · « **Reply #2 on:** July 30, 2003, 11:19:11 AM »

Isn't one typical of American grammar, and the other of British/Aussie grammar?

vudu · « **Reply #3 on:** July 30, 2003, 11:20:34 AM »

i agree with ian sane. they don't do it on purpose. people is dumb.

mouse_clicker · « **Reply #4 on:** July 30, 2003, 11:37:22 AM »

That bugs me all the time!

I can't stand it when people do that. I can understand it being a mistake when people type, but if they take the time to read over their own post, using are just sounds wrong. People may also get confused since companies are made up of a bunch of people and don't realize that the company itself is only one thing and you're not referring to it's employees.

Grey Ninja · « **Reply #5 on:** July 30, 2003, 11:49:19 AM »

Kids these days simply don't bother to learn grammar because they are too busy learning 1337 5p34k to go lame it up in Counterstrike. That's my opinion on the matter.

mouse_clicker · « **Reply #6 on:** July 30, 2003, 11:56:43 AM »

OMG WTF!!11!!1 73|-| /\/1/\/j4 7|-|1/\/|{5 7|-|47 73|-| l337 15 73|-| 57UP1|] 8U7 |-|3 15 73|-| 0/\/3 7|-|47 15 73|-| 57UP1|]!!1!!!11 LOLOLOL!!!11!!!1!!1 \/\/U7 4
|]0R|{!!1!!!!111!!1

VideoGamerX · « **Reply #7 on:** July 30, 2003, 12:46:19 PM »

Those are some good points... it very well could be grammatically correct in Australlia or Great Brittain, but it always kind of struck me as something people do because they think it's correct despite sounding incorrect. It's something you just about have to make an effort to do. What really got my attention was when I saw it in a news article... and I've seen it in some gaming articles, too, but when something like this starts to spread into world news columns, I really started to wonder which was right.

If I start seeing Rick Powers doing it, I'll have to go to a higher power over the grammar of the English language (an old English teacher

) to find out the truth. lol

S-U-P-E-R · « **Reply #8 on:** July 30, 2003, 12:59:53 PM »

Quote
Corporations are collective nouns; they can be either singular or plural, and it is correct to refer to them either way. In fact, you can even switch from singular to plural and back again as you wish. The main thing is to make the sentence sound fluid and not confusing. When to use which form is often a matter of taste, which makes it hard to explain why certain uses don't sound right.

VideoGamerX · « **Reply #9 on:** July 30, 2003, 01:05:12 PM »

Thank you.

I guess Word protects against having sentences that aren't fluid. Nice to know that, but where did the quote come from?

S-U-P-E-R · « **Reply #10 on:** July 30, 2003, 01:14:42 PM »

I searched it up out of my massive stash of old emails because I knew I saw the answer somewhere. I'm pretty sure it's right, but somebody might want to additionally back it up (or conversely, disprove it, lollers).

ThePerm · « **Reply #11 on:** July 30, 2003, 03:22:27 PM »

well in order to create a corperation(in the U.S.) anyways you must go to a board of corperation. Creating a corperation is like giving birth to a person. A corperation is an entity. The people who work there are not responsible for its debt the corperation is. They dont pay the money for things..and they dont make the profit. The corperation emloys execs, workers and etc, and limits their salary. These are all specified in the corperate charter.
When refering to an Entity or a person you use "is".

The phrase Capcom are actually sounds correct. And there may be another rule to that. But Konami are sounds just wrong. But mayeb this relates to the last letter of a word. Like the AN/A word...words that start with a vowel must have "an" infront of it. Words that start with a consant have "a" in front of them. Also it depends on ther perspective of the reader. If they are thinking of acclaim as "They" then Acclaim are working(note there are two verbs) then it could be correct. Or you could say Tengen is cool(note an adjective). Ahj the rules of English. There is quite alot of them and they are flexible. But you tell me where to put the comma? Every English teacher will say differently.

Grey Ninja · « **Reply #12 on:** July 30, 2003, 03:31:48 PM »

corporation.

Please use for your reference.

ThePerm · « **Reply #13 on:** July 30, 2003, 04:02:04 PM »

meh i run perm Engrish in my mind. I have disavowed the real thing and have been workign on model languages for years. Tis not great nor ideal for thee to limit thyself in your speaking nor spelling. You shall find flexibility is the key. As i'v said earlier i have no spell check on this computer. I know how to spell, however spellign is unimportant when your tryign to convey ideas. Spend too much time on spelling you might forget what your thought were. I type more or less in the vernacular(my regional dialect accent of Southern California and Western Arizona). I was thinkign about starting a mdoel language thread opr a thread that pokes fun at grammar.

lets go into pronunctiation and spelling. I do not pronounce Corporation Corpouration i pronounce it Corperation. Thus the thought was transcribed in incorrect spelling. Though, i would say Corporation looks better to my eyes. However, hurting my tongue, catolog, catalogue, toung, prologue. muwahahahahhahaha

Also try saying Rural. I went to say that one time and i was absolutely Toungue tied;. I have heard the word countless times. I can say it in my head. When i go to speak it it sounds screwed up. My friends have trouble pronouncing it. It turns out of all the years the word was in front of me I had neverr actualyl spoken it despite it beign within my vast vocabulary. I thought about it for a few days and realised you absolutely must not reprounounce the second r forcefully..it must roll with your tongue(note i will spell it differently every time muwahahahahah). At the same time the Starting R becomes a problem as well as i will say somethign to the extent of WeyreRal. Its like that oen epsode of friends where Monica couldnt pronounce a word correctly her entire life lol. i didnt know i would ever have such similar(i pronounce it SimUlaer) problems. LOL

aoi tsuki · « **Reply #14 on:** July 30, 2003, 04:33:36 PM »

Living in the south is much much worse. i've to withstand a barrage of lengthened syllables and modified vowel sounds.

ThePerm: Don't feel bad. Our president can't say "nuclear". He should talk to Homer Simpson sometime; he runs a nukular plant.

ThePerm · « **Reply #15 on:** July 30, 2003, 04:39:35 PM »

hehehe i say Nu Clee ur. I think thats how bush pronounces it. Iv moved around alot so iv developed a rather odd dialect. I remember when i was in 7th grade soemoen thought i was English. Nope, i was Southern(i grew up in Georgia..but never picked up the accent. My mom was a military brat and my dad grew up in Idaho) anyways my absolutely gracefull dialect was corrupted by the land of Arizona.

anyways.....

http://www.hyperdictionary.com/dictionary/nuclear

http://www.bartleby.com/64/C007/0140.html

ok Bush pronnounces it nyuu kyooo lar..and that is why the world hates him. I dont. So enough with politics.

Ness_the_Mess · « **Reply #16 on:** July 30, 2003, 09:18:12 PM »

Quote
Originally posted by: VideoGamerX

It's like the difference between saying:
The United States are going to war on terrorism.
and,
The United States is going to war on terrorism.

Which do you think is correct? I know which one Microsoft Word says is correct, and I know the one I would use would be viewed as correct on a formal paper. Now, all I want to know is what's up with the usage of 'are' people? Just curious to hear your reasoning and don't mind if you keep doing it.

Well, the United States is viewed as a name. In that case, it's singular, and so 'is.'
However, if you don't view it as a name, but as the united states, then it's plural, thus 'are.'

Taking it even further, geese are flying overhead. However, a flock if geese is flying over head.
In the same way, one could view 'United' as the group term for an amount of states. This would turn it to 'is.'

However, much as french uses 'vous' to formerly reffer to a person respectfully, the old english 'thou' should be put into use when reffering to Nintendo, but only in the second person. When in the presence of Nintendo (whether as seperate buisness people, or a collective) you should therefor reffer to them as Thou and use the form of the verb 'to be' "art". So, when speeking to Shigeru Miyomoto, you would say "Thou art the most enlightened human being I have ever met." In the same way, with other verbs, you would say (for the future tense of 'to be') Thou shalt not forget to make online play accessable for thine next console. Note the use of 'thine' as the second-person possesive.

On the other hand, when speaking to the town foo... erm, I mean, George Bush, you would use what is known as Hill-billy communication. For example: "You yella bellied bu-ffoon! Killin' for peace is like makin' luuv for thems virginity-types!" And soforth.

I hope I have been of use.

PIAC · « **Reply #17 on:** July 30, 2003, 09:59:43 PM »

on the subject of pathetic spelling/grammer these days by pretty much everyone under the age of 15 on the internet (except anyone that visits this forum)
you may find this tool usefull. its a 'english to 12 year old AOL user translator' http://ssshotaru.homestead.com/files/aolertranslator.html

unfortunatly it cant translate back from AOLish into english :\

S-U-P-E-R · « **Reply #18 on:** July 30, 2003, 11:05:14 PM »

I'm glad I'm not in one of those territories where "Coke" means ANY sorta soda. Werd.

Mario · « **Reply #19 on:** July 31, 2003, 02:00:42 AM »

I use are. It makes more sense to me. Nintendo are the best. Microsoft are losing money. Sony are cool.

PIAC · « **Reply #20 on:** July 31, 2003, 02:20:59 AM »

mario are smells

and who uses the word 'coke' for any soft drink? that smells! hello KFC person, can i have a COKE! *KFC person gives customer mountain dew* thanks! weird americans

but tbh, thast like back in the day when nintendo was a adjective not just a noun, 'wanna come round and play nintendo?' ahhh the good old days

nitsu niflheim · « **Reply #21 on:** July 31, 2003, 03:14:17 AM »

It depends on the definition of "is"

Haha, bad Bill Clinton Joke.

Ness_the_Mess · « **Reply #22 on:** July 31, 2003, 06:47:37 AM »

Quote
Originally posted by: PIAC
mario are smells

and who uses the word 'coke' for any soft drink? that smells! hello KFC person, can i have a COKE! *KFC person gives customer mountain dew* thanks! weird americans

but tbh, thast like back in the day when nintendo was a adjective not just a noun, 'wanna come round and play nintendo?' ahhh the good old days

First off, methinks (however I may be wrong) that the person didn't mean any kind of Soda, rather they ment Cola ...

More importantly, the way you used Nintendo in that statement was as a direct object of the verb 'play'. If I write a letter, it doesn't make the letter an adjective.

However, we still do use nintendo as an adjective to this day. Nintendo console. Nintendo game. In these cases 'game' and 'console' are nouns, and nintendo is not. Nintendo is describing what kind of console or game.

nitsu niflheim · « **Reply #23 on:** July 31, 2003, 07:05:52 AM »

I use "Nintendo Game" but only when actually referring to a Nintendo console, then it's Playstation or Xbox game for the others, or PC game. I remember when Nintendo was synomous (sp?) with videogames and I say Coke regardless if the establishment only serves Pepsi or not, it's just how I have done it my whole life and I'm not going to change now.

ThePerm · « **Reply #24 on:** July 31, 2003, 12:03:57 PM »

the thign about english is there are alot less different tense cases then other languages. It is said that the word "whom" will dissapear in about 30 years. Its rarely used and i think is the only example of an accusitive case in english. Enlgish eeps on streamlining itself.

note this next bit is literature and is highly readable. Its an addon i wrote to a story for english 102 last year by James joice

“Addition to Evelyn by James Joyce”
   She stood silently at the station for several hours. The boat was long gone and she hadn’t left her spot at all for the entire night. She seemed to be in a trance-like state. The seaport was empty and it had been without any ships for several hours. The glowing watery mass gazed into her eyes and she stared back into it. She could hear the ocean waves crack on the harbor singing dark sea shanties of pirates and serpents dueling it out on the high seas. However, The station was much quieter then it was in the daytime. Before you could hear the clamorous chatter of tourist and sailors, but that was many hours ago. A big dark spot of water lay in front of Evelyn. It had once held the large black boat that Frank was on when he left.

Her father would be very angry with her she thought. He would be downright furious. She had packed all her clothes that day and she had all of her belongings with her. She had been out the entire night and she concluded that her father had assumed that she left the family. She felt very guilty even though she was not really gone. The two children were in the clutches of her father. It was Saturday night and he would be especially bad. The time had come she thought as she shifted out of her trance state. Her eyes were no longer fixed on the sea. The glazed look escaped her eyes and it seemed as though she had regained her conscious state. It was morning when she arrived there and now it was night. She needed to get out of the station so she started walking.

Frank was such a nice fellow she thought. Before Frank she had never had a fellow, or knew anyone who had been so kind and generous to her. Frank was a good one she thought. She continued to walk in the night away from the station along the cobblestone road thinking of Frank. She skipped her chance of happiness. No, she thought. She destroyed it. The night was dreadfully cold. The cold had been so familiar to her for the entirety of her miserable life. She had never known any other type of weather. She heard stories about how wonderful the warmth of the tropics were for those who visited. How lovely it sounded to be anything but cold. When Tom Nook the blind preacher spoke of Hell she wondered why it was so bad. A change in temperature sounded lovely. Again she thought of the tropics, which made her think of Frank. My fellow, the dark Irishman who had traversed the world and had made it big in Buenos Ayres she thought. The man she thought she loved. The Fellow she thought loved her. He was gone now.

damn forum screws up my paragraph formating

now the translated version for 12 year old aol users

“ADITION 2 AV3LYN BY JMAS JOYC3”
   SH3 S2D SIELNTLY AT DA STATION FOR S3V3RAL HOURS1!!!!!! DA BOAT WAS LONG GONE AND SHE HADN’T LEFT H3R SPOT AT AL FOR TEH ENTIER NIGHT11111! OMG SH3 SEMED 2 B IN A TRANCE-LIEK STAET11!!!!!! TEH SEAPORT WAS 3MPTY AND IT HAD BEN WITHOUT ANY SHIPS FOR SEVERAL HOURS!!1!1!!1 OMG DA GLOWNG W8RY MAS GAEZD IN2 H3R EY3S AND SHE STAERD BAK IN2 IT11!! WTF SHE CUD H3AR TEH OC3AN WAEVS CRAK ON DA HARBOR SNGNG DARK SEA SHANTEIS OF PIRAETS AND S3RP3NTS DU3LNG IT OUT ON TEH HIGH SAAS!1!!! WTF HOWEVER DA STATION WAS MUCH QUEITER TH3N IT WAS IN DA DAYTIEM!1111 OMG WTF BFOR3 U CUD HEAR TEH CLMOROUS CHATER OF 2URIST AND SALEORS BUT TAHT WAS MANY HOURS AGO!!1!!1 OMG A BIG DARK SPOT OF W8R LAY IN FRONT OF EVELYN!!111!! LOL IT HAD ONCA HELD TEH LARGE BLAK BOAT TAHT FRANK WAS ON WHEN HA LAFT
   H3R111! WTF LOL FATHER WUD B VERY ANGRY WIT HER SHE THOUGHT1!11!!!! OMG LOL HE WUD B DOWNRIGHT FURIOUS1!111 OMG LOL SHE HAD PAKAD AL H3R CLOTH3S TAHT DAY AND SHA HAD AL OF HAR BLONGNGS WIT H3R!111!1 WTF SH3 HAD BEN OUT TEH 3NTIER NIGHT AND SHA CONCLUD3D TAHT H3R FATHER HAD ASUM3D TAHT SHE L3FT TEH FMILY!1!!1!1 OMG WTF LOL SH3 FELT VERY GUILTY EVEN THOUGH SHE WAS NOT RILLY GONE11!!1!!! OMG LOL DA TWO CHILDRAN WARE IN DA CLUTCH3S OF HER FATHER!!!!! LOL IT WAS SATURDAY NIGHT AND H3 WUD B ESP3CIALY BAD!!1!11 OMG WTF DA TIEM HAD COMA SHE THOUGHT AS SHA SHIFTED OUT OF HER TRANCE STAET1!11 OMG HAR EYAS W3RE NO LONGER FIEXD ON DA SEA!!!1!!1 OMG TEH GLAEZD LOK 3SCAEPD H3R EYES AND IT SEM3D AS THOUGH SH3 HAD R3GANEAD HER CONSCIOUS STAET1!!!!1!! WTF IT WAS MORNNG WHEN SHE ARIEVD THEIR AND NOW IT WAS NIGHT1!!!11!1 OMG LOL SHE NEDED 2 GET OUT OF TEH STATION SO SHA STARTAD WOKNG


FRANK!111 OMG WTF LOL WAS SUCH A NIEC F3LOW SHA THOUGHT!1!!1 OMG WTF BFORA FRANK SHE HAD NAVER HAD A FALOW OR NU ANYON3 WHO HAD BEN SO KIND AND GAN3ROUS 2 H3R!11! WTF LOL FRANK WAS A GOD ON3 SHE THOUGHT!!!!!! OMG SHE CONTINUED 2 WOK IN DA NIGHT AWAY FROM TEH STATION ALONG DA COBLES2N3 ROAD THINKNG OF FRANK11111 OMG LOL SHE SKIP3D H3R CHANCE OF HAPIENS1!1!1!! WTF LOL NO SH3 THOUGHT!1!!111! OMG WTF LOL SH3 DESTROY3D IT!!!!!1 WTF LOL DA NIGHT WAS DREADFULY COLD11!!!!1 OMG LOL DA COLD HAD BEN SO FMILIAR 2 H3R FOR DA 3NTIERTY OF HER MIESRABL3 LIEF!!111!!! WTF SHE HAD NEVER KNOWN ANY OTHAR TYPE OF W3ATHER!!11 OMG WTF LOL SHE HEARD S2REIS ABOUT HOW WOND3RFUL DA WARMTH OF TEH TROPICS W3R3 FOR THOSE WHO VISIETD!111!! WTF HOW LOVELY IT SOUNDED 2 B ANYTHNG BUT COLD!1!1 WHEN 2M NOK TEH BLIND PR3ACH3R SPOKE OF HAL SHA WONDERED Y IT WAS SO BAD!!!1 A CHANGE IN T3MPERATURA SOUNDAD LOVELY11!!1!11 WTF LOL AGANE SH3 THOUGHT OF DA TROPICS WHICH MAED HAR THINK OF MAH!11!1! OMG LOL F3LOW TEH DARK IRISHMAN WHO HAD TRAEVRSAD DA WORLD AND HAD MAED IT BIG IN BU3NOS AYR3S SH3 THOUGHT1!11!!! WTF DA MAN SHE THOUGHT SHA LOVED!!!1!!!1 OMG WTF LOL DA FALOW SHE THOUGHT LOVAD H3R1!!1 WTF HE WAS GON3 NOW
1!1111!! OMG

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Author Topic: Grammar question: Why do people use 'are' instead of 'is'? (Read 8446 times)