Topic: Super Mario Maker

[Evan_B]

Well, I returned my copy of Mario Maker today. The selection of levels is just not improving (I'm partially to blame, I make hard levels too), and the palette of items has exhausted it's cleverness. I'm also tired of people skipping my levels and I'm tired of having to sift through self-playing and ball-busting my hard levels.

After playing a popular maker's levels, I noticed either praise for. "Being like a Mario level" or just because it was easy and I realized why this game isn't satisfying to me- everyone wants to bust people's balls bu not have to deal with it themselves, and if they scale back the difficulty it just feels boring since there is not linear structure to playing the levels. Nintendo certainly didn't do a good job of trying to filter the levels themselves.

Maybe I'll pick Mario Maker back up again in the future, when the creators have matured a bit and the level design has, as well. But until then, I have more important things to work on, and I also realized that I need a long break from all Mario because it's dissatisfying to me.

[ClexYoshi]

I actually have been exclusively been playing lots of Expert 100 Mario Challenge in that regard. I will sit through a tough level if I think they have a good idea and aren't asking me to act within a single block's pixel precision, or  are asking me to work with a mechanic that's RNG based (Bowser, Lakitu, hammer bros.)

I feel I've gotten my $60 worth and that my levels could be more popular if I had a stronger social media presence, but I don't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MwvK1v9ATNU If you can endure this guy's pitched up voice, this is actually a pretty decent video on why Auto-Mario is such a plague on Super Mario Maker...

[Phil]

Well, I returned my copy of Mario Maker today. The selection of levels is just not improving (I'm partially to blame, I make hard levels too), and the palette of items has exhausted it's cleverness. I'm also tired of people skipping my levels and I'm tired of having to sift through self-playing and ball-busting my hard levels.

After playing a popular maker's levels, I noticed either praise for. "Being like a Mario level" or just because it was easy and I realized why this game isn't satisfying to me- everyone wants to bust people's balls bu not have to deal with it themselves, and if they scale back the difficulty it just feels boring since there is not linear structure to playing the levels. Nintendo certainly didn't do a good job of trying to filter the levels themselves.

Maybe I'll pick Mario Maker back up again in the future, when the creators have matured a bit and the level design has, as well. But until then, I have more important things to work on, and I also realized that I need a long break from all Mario because it's dissatisfying to me.

I hope it wasn't me who ruined the experience for you! !    I support you for returning a game if you aren't enjoying it. That's a horrible feeling to have, being hyped for a game and it not being what you desired or it being a disappointment.

[ejamer]

...
Maybe I'll pick Mario Maker back up again in the future, when the creators have matured a bit and the level design has, as well. But until then, I have more important things to work on, and I also realized that I need a long break from all Mario because it's dissatisfying to me.

I hate to keep sounding super negative about this game, but (based on experience with other games that rely on user-generated content) don't get your hopes up for creators or level designs to mature.

The majority of people making and posting content will never spend enough time to improve significantly. Eventually the number of creators will slow down; but good content will always be drowned out by stuff that isn't really worth playing. That's just the way it is.

This isn't condemning the game. There certainly is fun to be had here, especially if you have some local friends to play with/against. Just don't expect the limitations you've already experienced to magically get fixed - for better or worse, they are part of the experience.

[lolmonade]

Yeah...i'd actually expect the quality & quantity of new levels to stagnate over time.


I think I said it somewhere else, but even if they had released tools that allowed you to create everything you could in the original games, this wouldn't replace the people at Nintendo behind making the levels.  I'm sure there's a very rigid set of rules Nintendo forces themselves through when making a 2D mario game, and the novelty of being able to flip conventions wears off eventually when you see it so many times.


I agree with ClexYoshi - I got my money's worth, but I'll be doing more tinkering with levels than playing any, and I have low expectations of my levels getting visibility.

[Luigi Dude]

I hate to keep sounding super negative about this game, but (based on experience with other games that rely on user-generated content) don't get your hopes up for creators or level designs to mature.

The majority of people making and posting content will never spend enough time to improve significantly. Eventually the number of creators will slow down; but good content will always be drowned out by stuff that isn't really worth playing. That's just the way it is.

This isn't condemning the game. There certainly is fun to be had here, especially if you have some local friends to play with/against. Just don't expect the limitations you've already experienced to magically get fixed - for better or worse, they are part of the experience.

Yep this is just the world of User Generated videogames.  For every great level that gets made, you'll get 100 bad ones as well.  The average person is not going to be making what people who actually studied and have spent years making can create.  Anyone expecting the majority of the average person being able to make Nintendo quality levels was always going to be very disappointed. 

This is why I always laughed at the idea that some people were saying Nintendo won't be able to make 2D Mario's anymore because Mario Maker will spoil the fans.  If anything, Mario Maker is going to make people crave the real thing even more since Mario Maker shows making 2D levels isn't as easy as some people think and they'll start giving some more respect to the actual professionals instead of the usual, "lol anyone can make a 2D game".

[Spak-Spang]

I am partially going to blame Nintendo and the game media.

Nintendo with the Nintendo World Championship introduced the game as a "Troll Game"  How hard can you make a level. 

All the tools are there to make really great 2D Mario levels.  Help making hard but balanced jumps.  Help making diverse enemies and even changing power up and game play mechanics to different Mario games to make the game more playable. 

Nintendo has tried to even give people tools with the incredible Game Tutorial book, but people saw that troll levels and auto playing levels got the most attention.

Now people are not trying to make good levels but trying to make either artistic levels, other game levels (Metroid ect...) or troll levels.  Nobody is thinking about a concept and applying that concept and theme to a level.  So crap levels are being made.

However, Nintendo could change that...if Nintendo could update with a difficulty level and perhaps a theme labeler that the designer and other players can do perhaps Nintendo can help filter levels better. 

[TOPHATANT123]

NCL has a tutorial comic thing on making good Mario levels, I have no idea what it says but the presentation is hilarious. http://www.nintendo.co.jp/nintendo_news/sp/151014/supermariomaker/index.html

[Fatty The Hutt]

NCL has a tutorial comic thing on making good Mario levels, I have no idea what it says but the presentation is hilarious. http://www.nintendo.co.jp/nintendo_news/sp/151014/supermariomaker/index.html

That comic is gold. So much so, that I have adopted NintenPigeon (that's what I call him) as my new avatar.
All Hail NintenPigeon!

[Stratos]

I don't understand what is going on with NintenPigeon but I want to know more.

[ShyGuy]

I'm waiting for a fan translation.

[Soren]

NintenPigeon for Smash. Also, isn't he on the in-game manual?

[Phil]

I hope Nintendo addresses these issues with finding levels and searching for same. I don't want the community to go away so soon. I really like making and playing levels.

[ClexYoshi]

Remember when we were worried that this game wasn't going to have an online server to share levels with?

it sounds like this game is going to need a UI Overhaul if Nintendo wants to keep word of mouth going about this one, because the prospect of this game providing limitless fun is very quickly evaporating if comunities like this one are losing interest this quickly.

[Soren]

Maybe this will be a wakeup call for a patch.

http://kotaku.com/why-the-latest-number-one-mario-maker-course-is-such-ga-1737305180

It says “I will play the courses of everyone who likes this,” according to a translation provided by Kotaku’s own Brian Ashcraft. This promise alone was enough to get 124,591 people to play the troll level, and at least 26,767 of those players ended up starring the course.

[ejamer]

But how do you propose they patch it?


The discovery system relies on the integrity of the players, and that's by design. If people want to recommend levels that are garbage - which many people appear content to do - then what is Nintendo supposed to do?  Unless they curate recommended levels, there isn't a good alternative. Considering the number of levels being created, I'm not sure that's even a possibility.


Nintendo could provide better filters for results, based on factors like completion percentage and average time to beat a level. Or they could try allowing user tags - but once you start relying on users again, it's probably not going to end up being as useful as we'd want. And getting your own levels played and starred will remain a metagame challenge - people who are popular outside the game or find ways to play the system will always dominate.


I don't think people are losing interest in the game generally. Creating levels is still fun. Playing levels from people you know is still fun. That's never going to change. The online discovery aspect is garbage though.

[Enner]

The easiest change from what I see is a tagging system that allows makers and players to tag any level with what the level is trying to do. Some example tags would be "Regular", "Auto", "Puzzle", "Crazy", "Kaizo", and "Precision". Makers and Player should be able to tag to keep levels honest.

[ejamer]

Makers and Player should be able to tag to keep levels honest.

You have more faith in (anonymous, online) humanity than I do.

[NWR_insanolord]

Unless they want to full-on actively police it themselves like they do Miiverse, I'm not sure there's much they could do to improve things. Maybe just streamline the process of seeing what your friends make and like, or something like a curator system where you can follow people who filter through things.

[Phil]

I like how this site does it: http://www.mariomakerhub.com/levels


I'd just like to search levels by name aside from a sixteen digit number.

[Enner]

Makers and Player should be able to tag to keep levels honest.

You have more faith in (anonymous, online) humanity than I do.

My faith comes and goes. The cyber nightmare scenario is gamifying the tagging system to promote accurate tagging and punishing inaccurate tagging.

The tagging system I had in mind does not end with a one-and-done "tag". Rather each tag has a value of trustworthiness that is determined some how. Perhaps it would be too much to ask players to tag a level. Maybe a short prompt of "Were the Maker's tags accurate? Yes/No" in the Pause menu or Level Complete screen will suffice. Of course, Player-side tagging should still be available to (hopefully) categorize levels properly.

[ShyGuy]

I just went back and played some New Super Mario Bros U. The character movement and jumping felt entirely different than Super Mario Maker. I thought it was supposed to have the same physics?

[Enner]

I haven't played New Super Mario Bros. U, but the Super Mario Maker's treatment of New Super Mario Bros. feels just as I remembered it from New Super Mario Bros. Wii.

[michaelbaysuperfan616]

I have been on the fence about getting this game but I am worried it might not be a good fit. I don't have internet at home so I cannot update or connect the servers can the game be played entirely offline? I know that reduces much of the enjoyment but is it possible to just make my own levels and play them and then when I am back online, hopefully soon, connect then?

I hate this not having internet at the house it sucks. I have discovered too many things I cannot do without it, my PS4 won't even play DVD's or Blu Rays without going online for some reason total bullshit there.

[Soren]

New update!

- Fire Koopa Clown Car: This volcanic vessel is capable of shooting fireballs as well as a powerful charged shot that can even destroy Blocks. It’s perfect for creating shoot-’em-up-style courses.
- P Warp Doors: Unlike regular Warp Doors, these are only visible while a P Switch is active – perfect for creating truly devious Ghost House courses.
- Bumper: This bouncy donut-shaped object sends Mario bounding away when touched.
- World Records: Now pages will display the World Record for each course uploaded, displaying the fastest clear time.
- Super Mario Maker Bookmark: Levels that players have bookmarked to play later using the Web portal will be accessible from the Course World tab.