Topic: New article on Nintendo´s future! Must-read!!!

[nonjagged]

Quote
Originally posted by: egman
Read my post above

I agree with most of your opinions and or feelings. Isnt it amazing there are others that will disagree and say you are wrong, Nintendo is arrrogant, Nintendo doesnt listen to you, Nintendo should do this, Nintendo should do that, Nintendo are losing it, Nintendo needs to be No 1 again, I am a raving Nintendo fanboy and if they dont listen to my posts or in some cases website rants, then I will boycott Nintendo's next platform ,,,, yadda yadda et al.

I wouldnt mind if these sad gamers just curled up in a ball or just left Nintendo's platforms already for another because if they have grown up then why are they still wearing diapers? While Nintendo is too busy organising software for 3 different platforms, Nintendo fanboys want Nintendo to tap dance while Nintendo is juggling 3 platforms and research on new gaming ideas which they will announce next year.

I could go on and I could start to insult some of them in this thread, but remember they're right and we are wrong.
Nintendo is wrong. The worst thing about these lunatics is they're too impatient.
Way too impatient and they want everything now and on a platter.
They want every Franchise $ony secures to be on Nintendo's platforms also.
They want to be spoonfed, they want to be burped.
They want Nintendo to spend billion$ on advertising and want Nintendo to get every 3rd party on the planet.
Funny thing about Acclaim is they need M$ more to survive in the console business than Nintendo need Acclaim to survive in the console business. That wasnt too hard to work out.  Just because Nintendo doesnt have time to hold Acclaim's hand and fund its games doesnt mean Nintendo is doomed.

Reality is these fanboys must keep their mentailty in check with reality and be patient.

Once Killer 7, RE4, and Geist, MP 2, Too Human and Project Zero, deliver you will see these Nintendo babies shuttup with their negativity and maybe even some will say "Momma".

Yeah and if you look at that most shortest of all lists you will find 4 of the titles to be totally original.
I once claimed Nintendo fanboys where actually blind to their biased delusions.

Everyone claims Nintendo should advertise more and attract more 3rd parties.  If only they could stop their sobbing and play whatever game pleases them because advertising games that you already know about is a waste of your time to contemplate issues about.
Let the n00bs and mainstreamers worry about the quality games that dont get advertised.
Besides Nintendo's advertising budget comes from gaming not from O/S system budgets etc.
And these babies should accept the fact that Nintendo does not want to attract all the 3rd parties in the world, it just wants to attract some 3rd parties with big Franchises. Whinning on about 3rd parties is useless. Look at just some of the titles above and then throw in MGS tweaked and some RPGs and some decent Namco games on their way and for FVCKs sake just play games instead of crying like thumbsucking babies every week .

These kiddies cant see beyond their emotions and rants and are too impatient.

 

[mouse_clicker]

Quote
"I never assumed that at all, that is why I clearly stated it was my OPINION and not a right or wrong fact."

::ahem:: Posted by thecubecanuck Tuesday July 08, 2003 6:17 AM CST

"This is all my opinion, and is not right or wrong, but it appears to be a more common opinion than the opposite one,"

Right there you CLEAR stated that more people agree with you than disagree with you. Did you forget you said that or something?

Quote
"I never said they do. What I said was, Nintendos games have been diminishing in quality, at least from my perspective,"

Let's have another quote from the same post as above quoted:

Posted by thecubecanuck Tuesday July 08, 2003 6:17 AM CST

"Zelda was way to easy, repetitive, and downright boring, Sunshine was a disaster, and I have never like games such as Mario party and pokemon. This is all my opinion, and is not right or wrong, but it appears to be a more common opinion than the opposite one, as sales clearly reflect."

So what you're saying there is that you think poor sales are reflecting Nintendo's dropping quality in videogames- so how can you claim you never said there was a correlation between sales and quality? You contradict yourself at every turn- try to be a little more consistent. It seems to me if you're so dissapointed in Nintendo you should sell your Gamecube and games and buy a PS2 or XBox. I don't mean that in a fanboyish way- there's absolutely no reason to own a console you clearly don't like.      

[Zelda]

Nintendo has all it needs It doesn't need anymore third parties. Nintendo is number 1 in my mind. It's doing fine What nintendo needs to do is nothing they' have capcom konami squarenix namco sega  and everyone else yet people still complain?! What the heck is wrong with you people? Nintend o is dooing just find and needs no help from us. WE DON'T KNOW WHAT'S BEST FOR NINTENDO.

[mouse_clicker]

What I don't get is why does everyone assume if Nintendo DOES become number 1 they'll automatically have a drop in quality? Nintendo CAN have both- they did it with the NES and SNES. Don't think that the only way for Nintendo to overtake Sony is to start making crappy games- I just think that's an excuse to rationalize Nintendo NOT being number 1.

[egman]

Actually, mouse_clicker, I would like to ask what the big deal is about Nintendo having to become number one? Business is about profit, and Nintendo has shown in TWO generations that profitablity can be accomplished without being a market leader. The spoils of being the system wars winner are few when you think about it. Sony still has to worry about making money on the PS2, just not as much as their competitors.

I agree with your observation, however. Actually, going by the article and other editorials I've seen in this vain, you would think game quality would go back up considering many argue that N's current efforts pale in comparison to the games they made as the market leader.

[lastexit]

Usal -  Everything you say Nintendo should do is a BAD IDEA.

Buy sega for their CONSOLE KNOWLEDGE??? haahaha.  Sega 32x anyone?  Sega CD?  

Nintendo SHOULD buy Sega, as soon as Sega gets its business operation in order.  Sega is a MESS financially and that's not going to change by buying it.  Sega needs to get its sh!t together and as soon as that happens someone will want to buy them.  You don't acquire companies that are billions of dollars in debt.  

TV tuner?  Waste of money, time and space.  DVD playback, too.  These chipsets are not optimised for playing video games and offer NOTHING in that regard.  The XBox and PS2 both sacrifice video gameplay to provide video playback features.  That's one of many reasons load times are better on the Gamecube.  It's not just because the disc is small, as some would have you believe.

On that note, the small dvd's are great.  Why anybody complains about this I don't know.  They must be stupid/brainwashed.  Seriously.  There is no storage problem.  I don't want to watch a 2-hour movie in the middle of a game.  I, like most people who play video games, don't want to be interrupted while I watch a five-minute video just so i can play for another five minutes.  That is the WORST and it's ALWAYS SUCKED.  Anybody who says otherwise is an idiot.  Video game make bad movies.  F@cking Metal Gear is hardly "Amelie."

Next, the controllers on GC are great.  I have always found the square ps2 controllers to be very uncomfortable and the fact is that they have too many buttons.  If you want to see a well-used controller layout, check out Metroid Prime.  The unit becomes a seamless part of the game and you never notice how much is going on with it.  Sure, other games require you to learn a different layout of buttons but THAT'S OKAY!!! I played Mortal Kombat: DA to death on my GC and didn't mind the fighting pad controls at all.  If you did, BLAME MIDWAY for being too lazy to actually program a video game properly.  

Cell-shading should not be "banned."  It's only been used in a handful of games, most notably Zelda: WW.  It enhances the game greatly.  Also, remember games like Jet Grind Radio?  That was NOTHING without cel-shading.   "Realism" is totally overrated.  The fact is taht the MAJORITY of the video game-playing audience is not undersexed loser boys like yourself, as recent studies have shown.  This is something Nintendo has known for many years, hence games like Animal Crossing.  Shooting things is REALLY BORING.  If you continue to be interested in the same types of experiences over and over it shows a LACK OF GROWTH in your personal tastes.  It's a sign that perhaps you need to re-examine your approach to life in general.  Meanwhile the rest of us will continue to enjoy and expand our video game playing experiences.  

You would have rejected Tetris when it first came out.

[nonjagged]

Quote
Originally posted by: mouse_clicker
What I don't get is why does everyone assume if Nintendo DOES become number 1 they'll automatically have a drop in quality? Nintendo CAN have both- they did it with the NES and SNES. Don't think that the only way for Nintendo to overtake Sony is to start making crappy games- I just think that's an excuse to rationalize Nintendo NOT being number 1.

Also regarding to thecubedshmuck:

You contradict yourself at every turn- try to be a little more consistent. It seems to me if you're so dissapointed in Nintendo you should sell your Gamecube and games and buy a PS2 or XBox. I don't mean that in a fanboyish way- there's absolutely no reason to own a console you clearly don't like.

He does contradict but in his opinion he wants needs Nintendo cannot give him. Others like him may enforce their opinions throughout forums boards thinking it will get Nintendo's attention or something.

Also in my opinion Nintendo will never become number 1 again because their platforms focus on gaming alone.

Many markets would chose a Blu-ray recordable player by $ony over a proprietory non-recordable machine Nintendo will develope next-gen.

Nintendo could never surpass Ps2 userbase for starters because the head start was way beyond achieving for a system that appeals to limited markets being only game players which are forced to purchased FULL RETAIL priced games.

On your side of the territory you may think piracy is not that big of a del but in some countries the gamers wont buy a console if it doesnt have a chip for it, and giving me a response about psx is past tense, the markets have evolved there are so many platforms old or new to chose from.

If Nintendo was to challenge $ony for number 1 position Nintendo would have to create a system that does not use proprietory discs and get Panasonic to make whatever standard will be universal come 2 years time.
However even if now Nintendo got a head start on $ony next-gen (as $ony did during this gen) and launched first Nintedno would need to get a FF title launch or near of, as many gamers have observed Square only supporting one platform being the one with the biggest userbase.

If this does not happen and Square (not Designer Studio but Square) is still bias for $ony then no matter what the next-gen of cry-baby Nintendo fanboys dribble in forums for the years to come, can help Nintendo.

Nintendo will never be in the Number 1 position as long as it wants to protect the software/franchises it creates with non-mainstream discs and Nintendo will never be in the Number 1 position if for some bizzare (hint biased) reason Square and Konami ignore Nintendo's next -gen platform launch.

Theres nothing more that should be discusssed about the current situation.  This thread should be put to sleep.
Nintendo cant surpass ps2, so everyone should get over it. Nintendo can only signup some decent franchises for us to enjoy the rest of the GCN's lifespan.
If Nintendo launches first next-gen which they claim they will (do exactly what fanboys want and take action) but little do the fanboys realise that Nintendo couldnt take action with GCN so quickly because the proprietory discs that Nintendo used take time to get running.
$ony & M$ reliancy on DVD plants is way easy. They depend on quick turnovers because they dont actually create much software to protect.

Its very funny how fanboys like thecubedshmuck regularily complain about lack of GTA3 titles by Nintendo but they dont bring up issues like that liscense is time-secured by $ony. Even though there is a clone of that game made for the Xbox and coming soon GCN, they still complain and even want Nintendo to create or publish a title simular in nature but fail to realise one of the most important aspects.

$ony & M$ emulate and or immitate anything that is widely popular or accepted.
Nintendo rarely copies what other developers create, because Nintendo respects the gaming community wants it to be consistant of unique gaming experiences not generic immitations that eventually flood the shelves. The other 2 corps are pimps, and would rather cash in.

We can only wait until next-gen launch to see whether or not  Square is actually truthful in that it supports the biggest userbase console.
Since that Nintendo is launching first, its safe to say that Nintendo will regain number 1 position.

But in my opinion I think that some of Square GBA games are merely being used to generate funds for the PSP titles they will be creating with $ony. In my opinion Square is using Nintendo so then it could team up with PSP because $ony would offer cash-incentive exclusivities that Nintendo doesnt like doing, just to get software on a platform.

I severely hope that I am wrong about Square and the future but, Nintendo will never be number 1 in console sales but it will always never stop refreshingly entertaining me at least and thats all that matter to me.

[thecubedcanuck]

Quote
Right there you CLEAR stated that more people agree with you than disagree with you. Did you forget you said that or something?

I said it "APPEARS" th be, I didnt say it was definate, again you are seeing only what you want to see.

Quote
So what you're saying there is that you think poor sales are reflecting Nintendo's dropping quality in videogames-

You are misinturpriting what I meant. I do think that Nintendo's game have dropped in quality, quite signifigantly in fact, however I think their poor sales are a result of image and not the quality of the games.

Quote
I don't mean that in a fanboyish way- there's absolutely no reason to own a console you clearly don't like.

I never said I dont like cube, it is Nintendo's games that I havent liked.
I love Eternal Darkness, RE and RE0.

I agree that Nintendo doesnt need to be number 1 to survive, but it also cant afford to lose users with every console as profits will become a thing of the past.

Say what you will and pat yourselves on the backs all you want, but Nintendo's appeal is dropping, and that is bad for business regardless of how much you love them.

[thecubedcanuck]

stupid double post

[ThePerm]

quite simply Microsoft was unexpected. It was not a factor in Sony or Nintendo's Strategy. Had they not been there Nintendo would have been safe to release thier console a year later. That is not possible anymore. Microsoft's online setup has hurt Sony's and has made Nintendo's seem non existant(also has hurt it...why are there only sega online games on Gamecube? No one else is making them..their makign them for Xbox, Sony gets slightly more from being the market leader but compared to the number of live enabled games its a really small number)

[mouse_clicker]

Quote
"Actually, mouse_clicker, I would like to ask what the big deal is about Nintendo having to become number one? Business is about profit, and Nintendo has shown in TWO generations that profitablity can be accomplished without being a market leader."

I never said there was a problem there, but given the chance wouldn't you want to make more money, too? Besides, more money means more and better polished games coming out of Nintendo and more financial security in casne the day of reckoning ever does come. There's no problem with Nintendo's profits now, but there's also no problem with making a lot more.

Quote
"I said it "APPEARS" th be, I didnt say it was definate"

Right, but according to you most people think Nintendo has had a serious drop in quality. It doesn't matter whether it's true or not (which it isn't, I can tell you)- what matters is that you think more people think Nintendo is making some crappy games now than people thinking Nintendo's making good games. I don't see how you can even begin to draw that conclusion.

Quote
You are misinturpriting what I meant. I do think that Nintendo's game have dropped in quality, quite signifigantly in fact, however I think their poor sales are a result of image and not the quality of the games.

You didn't say that in your post- you quite clearly juxtaposition your notion that most people think Nintendo sucks now with bad sales- you said the bad sales PROVE your idea. Now suddenly you're saying the bad sales are because of image? Why didn't you say that in your first post?

Quote
I never said I dont like cube, it is Nintendo's games that I havent liked.
I love Eternal Darkness, RE and RE0.

I knew what you meant, but honestly, how many 3rd party titles are you going to buy for the Gamecube- nearly my entire collection of Cube games (18 now, much more soon) is either 1st or 2nd party. If you are truly happy with your Gamecube despite not liking Nintendo's games now (I've never met anyone who happily owned a Gamecube but disliked Nintendo's games), then forget I ever said sold it. It's just an odd occurence.

[ThePerm]

well the damn mainstream is sold on the idea that Nintendo is kiddy and thats all it makes. Had sony been around in the 80s where the only graphics possible were cartoony..it would be just as screwed over if a newcomer came around. You can look at the game industry like the comic industry....Nintendo has Turned into DC, and Sony is marvbel. Sad but true.

[Ian Sane]

"Admittedly, Nintendo hasn't helped themselves much in this case by pouring much of resources into EAD. I think Nintendo has less of an image problem and more of a problem of forcing similarily themed content down consumers throats."

That's a GREAT point that sadly a lot of people seem to have missed in this huge thread.  Ever since the N64 (or more accurately since Gunpei Yoki left Nintendo) almost all of Nintendo's games have had the look and feel of an EAD game regardless of who developed it.  On the NES and SNES there was much more of a division as the non-EAD games were often quite different.  The result of this trend is that anyone who doesn't like the EAD-style is instantly turned off by Nintendo's library.  Developers like Hudson and Camelot should be making their own unique stuff instead of making Mario spin-off games.  Variety was a big reason why the NES and SNES were so successful and is a big reason why the PS2 is number one today.

I don't think that Nintendo is in huge trouble or anything but it is very naive and fanboyish for some of you to assume that nothing is wrong and Nintendo is doing just fine the way it is.  Nintendo is doing what I would consider acceptable right now but in the near future this might not be the case.  They may still be making a profit but their games aren't selling as well as they used to and their image among most of the gaming public has been getting worse.  If these trends continue then eventually Nintendo's going to be in trouble.  If their consoles get the reputation of being the "losing" console for each generation it is going to affect sales and profits in the longrun.  Whether or not it's a good thing many people like owning the "winning" console and if Nintendo's consoles are always in last place less people are going to buy them with each generation.  Even the hardcore fans will eventually leave if it looks as if Nintendo will never improve.

Therefore Nintendo has to "fix" their problems now while they're still relatively minor before they grow bigger.  Nintendo likely won't be number one again anytime soon but they should at least look like they're trying to reach that goal.  Settling for last place everytime will bite them in the ass eventually.

[mouse_clicker]

"That's a GREAT point that sadly a lot of people seem to have missed in this huge thread."

No, I think it's a point that a lot of people probably disagreed with and didn't think needed to be adressed. If you want to say that all Nintendo games have a Nintendo feel to them, well yes, that's true, but I don't see how you can say they're similarly themed, and you CERTAINLY can't attribute a change like that to one person. There's been quite a bit of diversity across EAD's games and I think it's crazy to say we're being force fed the same stuff over and over again. People who say Nintendo rehashes and isn't original either don't play Nintendo's games or are complete idiots.

[Usul]

lastexit,

my name is Usul and not Usal, your flaming of mine is pretty rediculous and normally I would just ignore it, but this topic is too important to be left for flamers.
You think it's just fine what Nintendo does, that it sells a console with mini-optical-discs that can't play DVD's, that it has developed a gamepad that is impractical for a lot of genres, that it ignores online-gaming. You think it's fine to have only a gaming-machine, but that is shortsighted.  

In these days develpoing games cost a lot of money, at least when it's a game with 3d-graphics, with FM-secuences and with motion-capturing, with recorded voices and orchestrated soundtrack... So, the thirdparty-developers think about what platforms could have a big enough userbase. They look at Sony, yes big enough, they look at Microsoft, still not big enough but could be big enough in a few months, they look at Nintendo, also not big enough, and the future is unclear at best.

Why is that so? Because the console is built only for gaming, but families who are deciding what to buy this christmas-season, they are looking at what they will get for their 99 $. They see the X-Box and the playstation 2 both can play music-cds and DVDs, at least potentially, and the gamecube not for the same money, the decision is pretty clear. At least the decision what not to get.

You perhaps think "I don't care for those families and other losers who don't know a bit about gaming", and for the near term that attitude might be right, but in the long run, Nintendo won't earn enough money to produce good enough future games, since more and more developers will leave the platform.

Nintendo still acts like it had a monopoly like back in the 80's, but those times are gone. Now Nintendo is the runner-up, and it has to offer the same functionality and compatibility as the competitors or even better.

It needs to be much more aggressive in pricing, in convincing thirdparty-developers, in marketing, and they should espescially stop their policy of developing so many "Mario"-games that cover all the genres, like fighting (Supersmash-Brothers), racing (Mario-Kart), tennis and golf... That scares off many thirdparty-developers, because they fear that Nintendo sells millions of their games, while their own games that offer even better gameplay won't sell.

That's why the N64 lost to the playstation 1, people waited for the next big Mario-side-game, while they ignored the other offerings. The other reason was off course the cartridge-system.

I could go on and on, but I don't have the time, perhaps tommorow.

IanSane, and ThePerm, you both made good points.

Usul

[egman]

mouse_clicker-- For my comment about Nintendo being number 1, I think you missed what I was saying. There is not guarentee that you would be profitable even if you are the market leader. Especially in this industry were it's common to take a loss on some products. The business model is slight more important, market position can be misleading about how one is actually doing. This is why are I shake my head when people talk about Microsoft beating Nintendo to the ground, when the Xbox has actually lost more than what was anticapated at this time. Bill could write it off a course, but eventually shareholders will demand return on investment. The tech bubble exploded largely because of kind of unwise speculation.


As for my comments about EAD, they are not meant to be disrespectful of the image Nintendo has built. They clearly have an idenity that you and I like, but the problem is not that many people would agree with us. If Nintendo's image was still strong, we wouldn't see threads like this.

I have heard a lot theories about Nintendo's woes, but rarely have I seen some one hit upon the software itself. While uniformily excellent, with the exception of SSB, none of the games that have come out of Nintendo for the GC have sustained considerable interest. The PS2 and Xbox sell not just because of a gritty image, but also because there have been killer apps that have struck a cord with the consumer. I'm still blown away that nearly 2 years later, Halo can still attract Xbox users. This kind of attention has been strangely absent from Nintendo, considering that the N64 lived on killer apps.

Which leads me back to what I feel is the key issue--image. Yes, there is a variety of software, but most of it is being sold on an image that I feel has become tiresome to many. Do you remember all the groaning that went on about the Four Swords GC after E3? Of course some of it was fanboyish rants, but I think some criticisms were legitimate. The Zelda image has not become as stale as Mario, and some fans would like for it stay that way. All I'm asking is for Nintendo to keep these images fresh by not runing them into the ground. Nintendo has some IP that hasn't been touched in a long time or is being horded on the GBA (Pokemon, Advance Wars), while at the same time there is a wealth of directors and producers at Nintendo's disposal who could contribute more original content if the chance came I presume.

If Nintendo is truly serious about regaining their dominance or at least retaining a strong prescene, then it's time that we see all of Nintendo and not parts of it. Regardless of what we think, Nintendo's games are the center piece of their hardware. If they want attract everyone, they themselves have to start making that happen, then the 3rd parties will be more easily convinced of Nintendo's value. As much as I detest the whole image thing, I can't get away from the fact that consumers in general are a shallow bunch. Nintendo can't change that, but they can respond to it while not neccesarily making the same types of games their competitors are.

[mouse_clicker]

Nintendo would take losses initially if they were to pursue the top spot, but that's what you have to do. They'd soon start making profits again, *exactly* like they did on the NES and SNES. I'm just saying if the Gamecube was selling better than the PS2, Nintendo's profits would skyrocket and there's absolutely nothing wrong with that.

And I didn't even realize this thread was about Nintendo's image. I thought were debating Nintendo's seemingly difficult time in attracting 3rd parties and raising sales- that has nothign to do with image. 3rd parties aren't supporting the Cube because they think they'll have poor sales, not because of an image problem. There may still be a few developers that refuse to release violent games for the Cube because they're violent, but they're definitely not the majority.

[Hostile Creation]

Quote
Pre-orders have nothing to do with the game being boring. How many of the 600,000 pre-orderer's played the game prior to ordering it?  If you look through these threads you will find a quite a few people saying that Zelda was far to easy, thus making it boring.

Actually, despite it being easy, you and Luciferschild are the only two on this board (that I can think of offhand) that said you disliked the game.  I did find it to be somewhat easy, but it's still one of the best games I've ever played.

[egman]

mouse_clicker--Yeah, this thread is about 3rd parties, but when I look at the issue it just seems to point back towards Nintendo's image woes. The argument from the 3rd parties as I understand it is that Nintendo is not attracting the userbase that buys 3rd party games. The audience is either too kiddy (which I have always believed was a misconception) or is too wrapped up in Nintendo's offerings (maybe true, though the 3rd party quality issue plays bigger role than companies are willing to concede).

Almost no 3rd parties have the balls to really support the Cube to the fullest. Capcom is the only one I can think who has really made a full on attempt without having to have some super special deal to entice them. Everyone else just keeps bringing up the makeup of the GC's userbase. Nintendo is the only one with enough power to shape their userbase to a point that 3rd parties would be comfortable. And that can only be done expanding upon their image and showing consumers they are more than a certain image. This is why I keep coming back to the issue--this whole debate points toward perception.

[thecubedcanuck]

I hear/read so many people say that Nintendo will never go third party, but I have trouble believing it.

Nintendo says its a game company, thus its console only plays games. This makes it cheaper, and for some the affordable alterative.
The problem however, is that many people are gearing towards multi use products, and IMO with good reason.

For example, Dad wants a second DVD player for the rec room, junior wants a game console, they can kill 2 birds with one stone by getting a PS2 or X-box, its a win/win.

I also dont understand why everyone is so against going third party. You would still have the games you all love, and in fact it would give nintendo a chance to make better games, because they would no longer have to worry about developing consoles.

Just a thought.

[mouse_clicker]

What more proof do you need that Nintendo won't go third party besides Iwata's word? Nintendo continues making consoles or doesn't make consoles at all. And sales are NOT bad people- if that's the only thing anyone gets from reading my post, let it be that. Yes sales are lower, but they are by no means bad. No matter how boring you may think Zelda or Mario were, they still sold great and that translates into $$$ for Nintendo. Even IF Iwata hadn't pledged Nintendo would never go 3rd-party, they're making more than enough cash right now to prevent that.

I personally wouldn't like them to go 3rd-party because I don't want to have to buy multiple consoles just to play all the games I love (which is the main reason I'm against the PSP). Sega fans have a huge problem with this- Sega has (wisely) spread their franchises over all 3 platforms, and while that may be the best action business wise Sega fans are left spread *very* thin and I don't want that to happen. I honestly think this industry needs a STANDARD console, one that ever developer works on (like with CDs or DVDs)- quite frankly I'm getting sick and tired of spending almsot half a thousand dollars on console alone each generation.

[ThePerm]

when the public ignores an awesome game like metroid prime then you know the public is stupid. I find a lot of synergy with other Nintendo fans. Im not a fanboy, i don't go that far. I play other systems and i own a nice pc.
Its just it sickens me that people complain and bitch about Nintendo being "kiddy" or some other bull shit when the stuff they release that is not "kiddy" is just ignored. Im 19 years old and iv been playing games for 15 years. I remember someone trying to tell me that if we look back even with nes that Nintendo was trying to appeal to children, obviously he doesnt understand the market and the history of the market. When nes came out you couldnt appeal to grown ups. They HATED video games. In 1984 the industry crashed and it left alot of people with sour tastes in their mouth. Aside from that the 0only graphics you could produce were sprite based graphics. Which by their 2-dimentional nature are cartoony. So we have Nointendo revitalizr the industry and become an institution and then because it is the institution it then gets bashed. Now Sony is the institution. We will see how long that lasts.  

[AgentSeven]

Game systems with multiple functions are a SCAM to cover the fact that there are no good games on the system in the first place.  For the first year my Ps2 was nothing more than a glorified, over priced, ultra crappy DVD player.  To this day the vast majority of Ps2 games are garbage.  Compared to my other systems, my ps2 gets little or no use.  If it wasn't for GTA, I wouldn't own one at all.

Give me a system that plays GREAT games first, like the GameCube has done since day one.  I could also say the same for the Dreamcast, which was killed by sony's B.S. hype machine.  

Also, Canuck, all I see you do in every thread you post is to bash Nintendo.  Why?  Don't you have anything better to do?  Dont you have any friends?  Can't you bash Nintendo over at some sony site?  It's clear no one here agrees with you, yet you just keep coming up with more flame bait.  You must be a desperately lonely person, I'm sorry to say,  Maybe you should actually buy a GameCube, instead of just complaining.

[Ian Sane]

"Game systems with multiple functions are a SCAM to cover the fact that there are no good games on the system in the first place."

Yeah and the scam works so what's wrong with Nintendo getting in on the action?  Their console wouldn't actually be a "scam" if they had some extra stuff so it would be the best of both worlds.  Nobody's going to not buy a Nintendo console because it has a DVD player in it.  I agree that games are what really matters but the general public typically doesn't think like I do.  They think more is better so if Nintendo's consoles don't do what Sony's do then to the general public their console is inferior.  A few hardcore fans that appreciate the games-only approach doesn't mean sh!t when it comes to sales and profit.  No extra features turns of casual gamers and extra features doesn't turn off hardcore fans.  It's a no brainer on which approach to take.

[mouse_clicker]

I don't see the XBox or PS2 as multimedia devices at all, and I definitely don't see DVD playback as a scam- that just makes it look like you're trying to rationalize the Gamecube not having it. Since both the PS2 and XBox use a DVD format, it's a very logical to include a feature that plays DVD's (although I wouldn't force them to buy a $30 remote like MS did). If Nintendo's next console uses a DVD format DVD playback is a must.