Topic: Nintendo... WAKE UP! the deku tree has bad news for you

[Pantburster]

 Why do Nintendo keep making moves like they want me to go elsewhere? I have been a Nintendo fan for about 25 years, but I'm starting to give up! All I require is one new attempt at a new IP every 18 months and 2 or 3 updates on existing franchises each year(actual new and full fat versions not HD or other 'updates') This means all Nintendo would have to do is make 3 or 4 quality games per year on each platform. This seems reasonable to me for a large and cash rich company, so why all the crap? software sells consoles and Nintendo's consoles ain't selling, so stop trying to pull the wool N we are not idiots! I would like to point out that i do like HD remakes etc but they don't constitute a proper game release and STOP ignoring the fans we DO want a new Metroid and we DO want an F Zero!

 This kind of activity mentioned above has pushed me into buying a PS3 and playing more PC games and I feel a bit abandoned by Nintendo but i am starting to enjoy my GTA V and the new Tomb raider and such like. I am even enjoying the newer rayman releases as much as some of the classic Nintendo platformers. My plea is to demand Nintendo smarten up and do the right thing before more guys like me are forced to go elsewhere!!

[Luigi Dude]

Why do Nintendo keep making moves like they want me to go elsewhere? I have been a Nintendo fan for about 25 years, but I'm starting to give up! All I require is one new attempt at a new IP every 18 months and 2 or 3 updates on existing franchises each year(actual new and full fat versions not HD or other 'updates') This means all Nintendo would have to do is make 3 or 4 quality games per year on each platform. This seems reasonable to me for a large and cash rich company, so why all the crap? software sells consoles and Nintendo's consoles ain't selling, so stop trying to pull the wool N we are not idiots! I would like to point out that i do like HD remakes etc but they don't constitute a proper game release and STOP ignoring the fans we DO want a new Metroid and we DO want an F Zero!

So all you want is 3-4 games each year with at least one being a new IP?


Wii U 2013

New IP

1.  The Wonderful 101

Updates to existing franchise

1. Pikmin 3

2. Mario 3D World


Wii U 2014

New IP

1.  Monolith Soft's new game

Updates to existing franchise

1.  Mario Kart 8

2.  Smash Bros

3.  Yoshi Yarn


Looks like Nintendo is doing exactly what you want them to do.

[lolmonade]

A new IP every 18 months?  That seems a bit ambitious for any game developer, never mind one that is as conservative as Nintendo. 


It seems like based on your post that you're more miffed that Nintendo hasn't released the updates to franchises YOU want (Metroid, F-Zero).  Like it or not, those games aren't big financial winners for them, and given the struggles with the Wii U they've had, they want to release games that'll make the Wii U more appealing to the mass market.


You probably won't see a Metroid game until 2015 at the earliest, and I don't know when we can expect another F-Zero game, given that the game didn't really set the world on fire. 

[Bizzy_Fatso]

A new IP every 18 months?  That seems a bit ambitious for any game developer, never mind one that is as conservative as Nintendo. 


It seems like based on your post that you're more miffed that Nintendo hasn't released the updates to franchises YOU want (Metroid, F-Zero).  Like it or not, those games aren't big financial winners for them, and given the struggles with the Wii U they've had, they want to release games that'll make the Wii U more appealing to the mass market.


You probably won't see a Metroid game until 2015 at the earliest, and I don't know when we can expect another F-Zero game, given that the game didn't really set the world on fire. 

The problem is they're clearly failing at that - they seem to have no clue what will appeal to the mass market these days.  Pikmin 3 was clearly a dud (and anyone could have predicted as much, given that the previous 2 didn't exactly set the world on fire and 3 was more of the same), New Super Mario U was an uninspired update to a tired series, Wind Waker HD was a painfully overpriced HD remake with no meaningful additions (aside from making some of the crappy parts of the original slightly less crappy).  I'm sure the next Donkey Kong Country will be the huge financial success they need though, right.....?

Iwata needs to go.

[UncleBob]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't recent numbers just show that Nintendo holds nearly 50% of the video game hardware market world-wide for the first part of 2013?  And well over 50% of the Japanese market (nearly 75%)?

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the number one gaming system (outside of smartphones and the like) the 3DS?  The system everyone wrote off?  Said would never sell?  Didn't the 2DS - the system folks thought Nintendo was crazy for, just set some record-breaking sales numbers?

Correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't Nintendo have 18 of the top 20 all-time selling games, 11 of which were developed and released during Iwata's tenure as president of Nintendo?  Yes, that's over HALF of the ALL-TIME best selling video games.

There's no denying that Iwata and Nintendo have made some missteps along the way - but I think the evidence speaks for itself.

[BlackNMild2k1]

source? 

[UncleBob]

For which one?

Hardware sales for the first part of 2013: http://www.nintendolife.com/news/2013/04/3ds_market_share_for_early_2013_shows_growth_in_north_america_and_europe

3DS Best Selling System for five months straight: http://thevideogamenetwork.com/2013/10/17/nintendo-3ds-best-selling-system-5-months-in-a-row/

Top 30 Selling video games of all time: http://www.refinedguy.com/2013/06/11/the-30-best-selling-video-games-of-all-time/

[Stratos]

It sounds to me like you want to leave Nintendo. Which is OK if you decide so.


I believe that Nintendo systems have plenty of games on them to keep me and most fans contented. Do they release everything I/we want? No, but what company does? If Nintendo is not fulfilling all of your gaming needs, then pick up a second system. PS3s and 360s are pretty cheap now and a lot of the quality exclusive titles on their systems are cheap as well. Also I'm willing to bet there is a backlog of titles you missed on older Nintendo systems. Browse a couple 'best of system' lists on NWR or other sites and grab the ones you missed off of Amazon for cheap.


I understand you are frustrated, but this is not an "It's complicated" relationship. It is OK to play games on other systems. Sometimes there are experiences only available or better enjoyed on specific devices.


But sounding off like a doomsday Klaxon doesn't seem to be helping the matter. All that is going to do is stir up the nest of Nintendo Apologists who will probably want to sting you.

[lolmonade]

A new IP every 18 months?  That seems a bit ambitious for any game developer, never mind one that is as conservative as Nintendo. 


It seems like based on your post that you're more miffed that Nintendo hasn't released the updates to franchises YOU want (Metroid, F-Zero).  Like it or not, those games aren't big financial winners for them, and given the struggles with the Wii U they've had, they want to release games that'll make the Wii U more appealing to the mass market.


You probably won't see a Metroid game until 2015 at the earliest, and I don't know when we can expect another F-Zero game, given that the game didn't really set the world on fire. 

The problem is they're clearly failing at that - they seem to have no clue what will appeal to the mass market these days.  Pikmin 3 was clearly a dud (and anyone could have predicted as much, given that the previous 2 didn't exactly set the world on fire and 3 was more of the same), New Super Mario U was an uninspired update to a tired series, Wind Waker HD was a painfully overpriced HD remake with no meaningful additions (aside from making some of the crappy parts of the original slightly less crappy).  I'm sure the next Donkey Kong Country will be the huge financial success they need though, right.....?

Iwata needs to go.

I don't think that anyone truly believed Pikmin 3 would set the world on fire.  Nintendo interlaces games that are more tailored towards core Nintendo gamers between their heavyweights (Mario Platformers).


I don't know whether you Played Mario U or not, but I found it to be the best NSMB game yet, even though I'd generally agree the series is getting a little stale.  But I'll also mention they've sold roughly 2 million, which it isn't bad to have a 50% attach rate to your console.


I don't know what to tell you about the  Wind Waker remake & the new Donkey Kong game.  I think they're meant to fill the gap in Nintendo's release schedule while they work on the heavy hitters (Smash Bros, namely). 


I also find it interesting you omit one of the most intriguing games Nintendo's shown in a while, Super Mario 3D World, a game it seems the developers went bananas with coming up with new gameplay ideas & mechanics.  Your rant is more that Nintendo's not doing what YOU want them to do, not that they're failing from a business standpoint.

[BlackNMild2k1]

For which one?

Hardware sales for the first part of 2013: http://www.nintendolife.com/news/2013/04/3ds_market_share_for_early_2013_shows_growth_in_north_america_and_europe

3DS Best Selling System for five months straight: http://thevideogamenetwork.com/2013/10/17/nintendo-3ds-best-selling-system-5-months-in-a-row/

Top 30 Selling video games of all time: http://www.refinedguy.com/2013/06/11/the-30-best-selling-video-games-of-all-time/

wow. but for some reason I was expecting some wiki links (or no links at all).
But I took you for your word, you didn't need to prove it to me (I've been out of the loop/news cycle for a long while, and I'm sure you noticed).


Think about this thread is on some level I agree with the OP.
Nintendo has failed to hold my interest, but it's not the Wii U specifically, it's been that way since the Wii. I really think it's videogames in general, because where Nintendo has failed to hold my interest, the PS's & Xb's have failed to interest me at all.

p.s. (My Steam acct is also chocked full of games I have never really played and probably never will).

[Bizzy_Fatso]

I don't think that anyone truly believed Pikmin 3 would set the world on fire.  Nintendo interlaces games that are more tailored towards core Nintendo gamers between their heavyweights (Mario Platformers).


I don't know whether you Played Mario U or not, but I found it to be the best NSMB game yet, even though I'd generally agree the series is getting a little stale.  But I'll also mention they've sold roughly 2 million, which it isn't bad to have a 50% attach rate to your console.


I don't know what to tell you about the  Wind Waker remake & the new Donkey Kong game.  I think they're meant to fill the gap in Nintendo's release schedule while they work on the heavy hitters (Smash Bros, namely). 


I also find it interesting you omit one of the most intriguing games Nintendo's shown in a while, Super Mario 3D World, a game it seems the developers went bananas with coming up with new gameplay ideas & mechanics.  Your rant is more that Nintendo's not doing what YOU want them to do, not that they're failing from a business standpoint.

NSMBU was fine - but it felt too similar to the others which I also played.  3D Land was great, but I'm not dying to get another one so soon after.  You know what I wouldn't mind?  Pretty much any game that won't give me deja vu from another title they already put out.

And let's be absolutely clear - Nintendo is only profitable (and barely profitable based on their most recent earnings) because of the 3DS.  The Wii U is far and away the worst console launch (outside of the Virtual Boy, of course) that Nintendo has ever had.  Iwata has presided over 2 terrible launches in a row now, and a big part of the reason the 3DS was able to recover so well is because it has no meaningful competition, which clearly isn't the case with the Wii U.  They've completely squandered a year head start...you almost have to admire that level of incompetence.

[Luigi Dude]

And let's be absolutely clear - Nintendo is only profitable (and barely profitable based on their most recent earnings) because of the 3DS.  The Wii U is far and away the worst console launch (outside of the Virtual Boy, of course) that Nintendo has ever had.  Iwata has presided over 2 terrible launches in a row now, and a big part of the reason the 3DS was able to recover so well is because it has no meaningful competition, which clearly isn't the case with the Wii U.  They've completely squandered a year head start...you almost have to admire that level of incompetence.

Smartphones are the biggest competition Nintendo has ever had in the portable market.  When the 3DS was selling terrible its early months, people were already declaring they'd lost their entire handheld audience to smartphones and it was impossible for the 3DS to recover.

So don't pull this same flawed argument with the Wii U either.  Wait until the holiday is over before declaring the system dead or else you'll look just as foolish as the people calling the 3DS dead ended up looking.

[Stratos]

I seem to recall the PS2 having a poor first year as well and look where it ended up. Plus the market is still broad and deep enough to support three major consoles.

[UncleBob]

Remember how horrible the PS3 launch was?

Iwata also presided over the absolute most successful hardware launch not only in the history of Nintendo, but in the history of video games.  In spite of all the naysayers who said Nintendo was doomed back then.

[Kytim89]

I have no doubt that the Wii U will be successful. However, the thing that is going to move hardware is software. This is why Nintendo needs to money hat weaker developers into putting games onto the Wii U. They need to become the number one place for independent developers, and whatever they can do for them then do it. Nintendo should have bought Atlus, and made the Wii U the number one place for niche games. This way people have no choice bu to buy the Wii U in order to have certain quality titles that can not be obtained on other consoles. 

[shingi_70]

Remember how horrible the PS3 launch was?

Iwata also presided over the absolute most successful hardware launch not only in the history of Nintendo, but in the history of video games.  In spite of all the naysayers who said Nintendo was doomed back then.

and neither Howard Stringer or Crazy Ken are at Sony anymore. While I disagree that Iwata needs to go (I do feel Nintendo needs a major shake up mostly getting rid of reggie), but using the Wii's success means nothing in a different market.

[broodwars]

I find the assurances that the Wii U will rebound like the 3DS did rather amusing, mainly because the Wii U has ALREADY failed to compete against the only hardware it ever had a serious shot at competing with technologically (PS3/360) with the only meaningful 3rd party support it will likely ever have. Now the next generation consoles are releasing, and Nintendo's upcoming software lineup is eerily as sparse as some of the worst years of previous Nintendo consoles, including delays to fill in wide software gaps. People love to bring up how certain franchises sold on Wii as an indicator of sales potential on the Wii U, but the Wii was a successful console with a massive install base. The Wii U has been a colossal failure with a tiny one. There's a BIT of a discrepancy there. And NOW the favorite talking point is that families will SOMEHOW save the Wii U now. Suuuuuuuuuure. Of Course they will. I'm SUUUUUUUURE that one 3D Mario game is going to do it when...

- 2 2D Mario games
- 2 minigame collections
- a GameCube Zelda rehash
- a colorful, cartoony RTS game
AND 1 colorful, cartoony brawler ALL FAILED. Miserably.

I'm sure the Wii U will one day be a decent console. All Nintendo home consoles have EVENTUALLY gotten compelling software lineups, but let's not kid ourselves here: the Wii U's not going to ever be a major, consistent sales threat. And in the end, Iwata will have presided over both Nintendo's most profitable accomplishment AND their greatest embarrassment since the Virtual Boy. That these were back-to-back occurrences doesn't speak well for him.

[the asylum]

Why do you want to get rid of Reggie? He really doesnt do much other than act as Iwata's English-version avatar.

Also yes, the Wii was successful- from a sales standpoint. mostly because the smartphone craze hadn't really taken off yet. The only things that sold on the Wii were the handful of first-party titles and the heaps of shovelware. Real serious efforts from third partiesmostly fell flat in sales (Conduit, Mad World, etc). From a gaming standpoint, inarguably, the Wii was a colossal failure. (negative rep ahoy!)

[UncleBob]

And in the end, Iwata will have presided over both Nintendo's most profitable accomplishment AND their greatest embarrassment since the Virtual Boy. That these were back-to-back occurrences doesn't speak well for him.

While I would be very impresses (and quite surprised) if Wii U ever did crazy sales like Wii, I'd be really, really surprised if it sold worse than the GCN/N64.

[Stratos]

Why do you want to get rid of Reggie? He really doesnt do much other than act as Iwata's English-version avatar.Also yes, the Wii was successful- from a sales standpoint. mostly because the smartphone craze hadn't really taken off yet. The only things that sold on the Wii were the handful of first-party titles and the heaps of shovelware. Real serious efforts from third partiesmostly fell flat in sales (Conduit, Mad World, etc). From a gaming standpoint, inarguably, the Wii was a colossal failure. (negative rep ahoy!)

I think the definition of 'serious efforts' is stretched here. Most 3rd party games like Conduit were mediocre at best. Only thing they did right was bring the type of gameplay we wanted to the Wii's motion controls. I'm not saying the games were bad - many were quite fun and worth experiencing - but I would not classify them as serious efforts. The few I would consider serious like Godfather and Boom Blox either sold so poorly they couldn't financially justify sequels or their sequels did not perform as expected, killing future possibilities on the system.


The Wii U will probably fall into the same pit the Wii fell into only with bigger launch support. This time we are getting a bit more launch support from 3rd parties but it will most likely dry up next year. There will still be plenty of fun, unique and engaging titles for the U throughout the life of the system.


I am quite happy being a Wii owner and already there are enough titles on the Wii U that I know I will be a happy Wii U owner. I would LOVE to see the Wii U become a major platform for 3rd party creativity but the reality is Nintendo has not been in that position for nearly two decades. Most people have multiple consoles. For the price of two Nintendo games you can own a system to get your fix of non-Nintendo games. I will almost always choose the Nintendo console version of a multiplatform game as a vote of support for seeing Nintendo return to dominance but I'm not going to ignore the plethora of unique and fun Nintendo games because of their lack of success in the 'console wars'. I am a consumer who knows what he likes and I buy it.

[azeke]

Bile spawn here is pretty hilarious.

[shingi_70]

At least the Wii U was primed to get indies until the PS4/Vita arrived.

Why do you want to get rid of Reggie? He really doesnt do much other than act as Iwata's English-version avatar.

Also yes, the Wii was successful- from a sales standpoint. mostly because the smartphone craze hadn't really taken off yet. The only things that sold on the Wii were the handful of first-party titles and the heaps of shovelware. Real serious efforts from third partiesmostly fell flat in sales (Conduit, Mad World, etc). From a gaming standpoint, inarguably, the Wii was a colossal failure. (negative rep ahoy!)

I feel that reggie is a yes man to Iwata and for Nintendo to become more competitive than NOA and NOE need to have more Independence from NCL. Looks at how Sony's Worldwide studios have helped the company for the better. But if were being honest the only way to get rid of reggie would be getting rid of Iwata.

[Spak-Spang]

The problem with asking to get rid of Reggie is obvious.  If NCL only wants a Yes Man, then they will just hire another Yes Man.  So getting rid of Reggie doesn't solve the problem.

Now, I am saying Nintendo's Wii U is a success or going to be a success.  But, I do think it is premature to write it off before its competition has even been released.  Let's see how those launches pan out.  We could be seeing the state of the industry right now.  Perhaps gamers don't really want to upgrade right now.  Perhaps they were fine with the current state of gaming. 

Lets see where Nintendo is after this holiday season, and into 2014...where hopefully Nintendo will have a steady stream of solid 1st party games, and will be gaining support from indie 3rd parties and other developers.  Let's see if the industry decides that pushing bigger and more expensive games is really the direction they want to go...or developers will change direction and perhaps chose Nintendo as their platform to do just that. 

I am not wishful thinking, and I do agree Nintendo seems to be in trouble this generation, but I am not going to write them off before their competition even sells one system.  Nor should you. 

[MagicCow64]

I think we can draw a pretty strong conclusion here that we should wait til the holidays are over until we start entering the stages of grief. I'm not super optimistic, but no need to lose hair over this prematurely. And I'm a guy who will not be adapting to XStation world.

The only concrete thing here I find worrying is the ghost town release schedule next year. But given how weirdly card-chesty Nintendo has become, I think it's safe to assume we'll get several waves of announcements before E3. I wouldn't be surprised if there's a major Direct in the next six weeks to draw off attention from Sony and Microsoft.

[Spak-Spang]

Honestly, Nintendo just needs a game released in Feb.  April, June/July and August.
If they can have some sold exclusives that are released in the first half of the year, Nintendo can ride the holiday season.  I think Smash Bros will be the big holiday season hit.  But if Nintendo could finish it for the summer hit, and give us Mario Kart for the next Christmas, or vice versa we would be set.  It would be too much to ask for the new Zelda to be ready for Next Christmas, but I am sure Nintendo will surprise us with a few interesting smaller games. 

And now that Nintendo has righted the 3DS boat, they can now focus on filling the Wii U game list with several top tier games.