Topic: PC/Mac "app stores"

[tendoboy1984]

Are these new app stores for Mac OS X and Windows 8 going to take away consumer freedoms? In the past, you could download software from anywhere on the internet. Now everything is being put in a centralized web store. Does that mean we will no longer be able to download stuff from actual websites?

[S-U-P-E-R]

What's to stop you from opening up your browser, heading to some software company site or piratebay or whatever, and getting your software there?

[tendoboy1984]

Oh I know that, but it seems Microsoft and Apple want to take the app experience from their mobile devices and implement it into the PC world.


On that note:
Why can't mobile devices freely download software from anywhere on the internet? On a mobile device, you're forced to use a specialized app store. You don't have any of those restrictions with a PC.

[S-U-P-E-R]

Well, it's fine to have another *option* on PCs, even if you don't use it. I don't think I would use it, either.

Why can't mobile devices freely download software from anywhere on the internet? Why do they need app stores? PC's have had that luxury for decades, so why can't mobile devices have that same freedom?

The companies that make them like money. It's kind of an unfortunate situation. I chose an Android phone because it's more practical for not dealing with DRM, sticking it to the man, and making it do what I want.

[BranDonk Kong]

Why can't mobile devices freely download software from anywhere on the internet? On a mobile device, you're forced to use a specialized app store. You don't have any of those restrictions with a PC.

Have you ever used an Android phone before? Settings>Security>Unknown Sources (at least on ICS) <-- check that box and you can download and install anything you want, from anywhere you want.

[NWR_insanolord]

I don't know much about what Microsoft's doing with their App Store, but the Mac App Store is entirely optional (unless the software developer doesn't offer their product any other way, which some don't). I can go to any random corner of the Internet and install whatever I like if I want to, and I do for a lot of things that don't fall under Apple's TOS for the App Store. It doesn't restrict consumer freedom, it just offers the ability to browse a centralized market, which I like a lot for most things.

[ThePerm]

Actually, it might be a good thing. It would be nice to be able to download things from a trusted place, and it also might be less hassle. I haven't really used an app store because i still have an old phone. Theo only ones I have used are the Wii Shopping Channel and Steam.

This will be especially helpful for old people.

[Morari]

Are these new app stores for Mac OS X and Windows 8 going to take away consumer freedoms?

That's certainly the plan.

[TJ Spyke]

No, it's not Morari. And I don't see you whining that you can only download Xbox 360 games from Microsoft, or PlayStation 3 games from Sony.

And the Windows 8 App Store will just be for apps developed specifically for it. You can just develop general apps and have it listed in the store (but it can't be purchased there). And the plan is for Microsoft to let people try an app for 7 days before they have to decide to buy it or not.

[BranDonk Kong]

No, it's not Morari.

Yes, it is. All the DRM bullshit that will be associated with it = plan to take away consumers' freedoms.

[NWR_insanolord]

How is having one centralized store with one login any worse than each app having its own separate serial number and activation system? The Mac App Store DRM is more lenient than most, since I can install the software on every Mac I own with one purchase and once you have it installed you have it for good without having to reactivate at all.

[BranDonk Kong]

I'm talking about Windows. I don't think having a centralized store is a bad thing, but ONLY having that one store is.

[tendoboy1984]

I don't know much about what Microsoft's doing with their App Store, but the Mac App Store is entirely optional (unless the software developer doesn't offer their product any other way, which some don't). I can go to any random corner of the Internet and install whatever I like if I want to, and I do for a lot of things that don't fall under Apple's TOS for the App Store. It doesn't restrict consumer freedom, it just offers the ability to browse a centralized market, which I like a lot for most things.

Mobile app stores like iTunes and Windows Phone Marketplace DO restrict consumer freedoms, since they are the only ways of downloading content to those devices. That's what I was talking about when I mentioned the risk of having an app store on a computer. Microsoft and Apple might decide make it the only way to download software to your computer.

[SixthAngel]

How is having one centralized store with one login any worse than each app having its own separate serial number and activation system? The Mac App Store DRM is more lenient than most, since I can install the software on every Mac I own with one purchase and once you have it installed you have it for good without having to reactivate at all.

With only one store you have one company that can control what you buy.  While seperate numbers might be a pain in the ass they don't compare to a monopoly store. Imagine if GameStop was the only store you could  buy games from.

[TJ Spyke]

I don't know much about what Microsoft's doing with their App Store, but the Mac App Store is entirely optional (unless the software developer doesn't offer their product any other way, which some don't). I can go to any random corner of the Internet and install whatever I like if I want to, and I do for a lot of things that don't fall under Apple's TOS for the App Store. It doesn't restrict consumer freedom, it just offers the ability to browse a centralized market, which I like a lot for most things.

Mobile app stores like iTunes and Windows Phone Marketplace DO restrict consumer freedoms, since they are the only ways of downloading content to those devices. That's what I was talking about when I mentioned the risk of having an app store on a computer. Microsoft and Apple might decide make it the only way to download software to your computer.

Your freedoms are not being restricted. You don't HAVE to use those phones, for example. You are not losing anything from a closed device having one provider. I don't see you bitching about consoles having only one download service.

[nickmitch]

Does anyone else notice that we keep having some of the same discussions over and over?

[NWR_insanolord]

Hey guys, am I the only one that thinks Nintendo needs to do more to bring in third party support?

[Morari]

Blah, blah, blah! I hate personal freedoms! Blah, blah, blah! I'm enthralled by my corporate overlords! Blah, blah, blah! Please pass the anal lube!

Well, at least you're being honest in a conversation for once.

[Chozo Ghost]

For those who hate App stores, the solution is obvious: switch to Linux.

[S-U-P-E-R]

"install linux problem solved"

not like Windows 8 won't be hastily cracked wide open though.

Can we move this thread to the funhouse yet? I want to use more police brutality allegories and hyperbole

[NWR_insanolord]

I can't decide which is worse, being stuck with only one way of getting software that's locked down by Microsoft, or having to use Linux. Both too horrifying to consider.

[BranDonk Kong]

I honestly don't even do that much with my computer besides go online and every now and then play something on PCSX2 or something. I'd probably be better off switching to Linux, though my wife would hate me.

[Do_What]

General consumers like app stores.  They're easy and convenient. You can have some sort of shopping experience as opposed to having to know exactly what you want and going to get it. It is easier to browse when there are a bunch of different products right in one place. You can search the internet for "photo editing programs" or "screen capture tools" and have to do a lot of hoping to find something good, or you can go to the app store and there are four or five of each kind of program you can easily compare.
It's not for everyone, but for a lot of people it's great. The most important thing is that none of this is mandatory. Steam is still going to exist (despite all of Gabe Newell's whining). You can go buy games there, or on origin, or buy physical copies, or go to specific publisher or developer websites or gog, or pretty much anywhere else you want to go. Nothing is changing about that. There's just a storefront for people to use if they choose.
You can download phone apps from the internet. You do not have to use the Play store or even Amazon's app store. There are plenty of places to go to find phone apps if you really really want to. Thing is, there's a good chance the apps you want are in one of those two stores. Also, if you buy an iphone that's your choice. You're choosing to lock yourself into that ecosystem. Even there, if you choose, you can jailbreak it and do what you want with that phone as well.
Video game consoles are really the last bastion of the super walled garden. Those even break down over time. Xbox is hacked to high heaven as is the PS3. The 3DS and the Vita are holding out, but it shouldn't be more than a year or so before both of those are busted open and homebrew communities pop up around them.

[tendoboy1984]

General consumers like app stores.  They're easy and convenient. You can have some sort of shopping experience as opposed to having to know exactly what you want and going to get it. It is easier to browse when there are a bunch of different products right in one place. You can search the internet for "photo editing programs" or "screen capture tools" and have to do a lot of hoping to find something good, or you can go to the app store and there are four or five of each kind of program you can easily compare.
It's not for everyone, but for a lot of people it's great. The most important thing is that none of this is mandatory. Steam is still going to exist (despite all of Gabe Newell's whining). You can go buy games there, or on origin, or buy physical copies, or go to specific publisher or developer websites or gog, or pretty much anywhere else you want to go. Nothing is changing about that. There's just a storefront for people to use if they choose.
You can download phone apps from the internet. You do not have to use the Play store or even Amazon's app store. There are plenty of places to go to find phone apps if you really really want to. Thing is, there's a good chance the apps you want are in one of those two stores. Also, if you buy an iphone that's your choice. You're choosing to lock yourself into that ecosystem. Even there, if you choose, you can jailbreak it and do what you want with that phone as well.
Video game consoles are really the last bastion of the super walled garden. Those even break down over time. Xbox is hacked to high heaven as is the PS3. The 3DS and the Vita are holding out, but it shouldn't be more than a year or so before both of those are busted open and homebrew communities pop up around them.

Hacking? Where in my post did I even mention that? Hacking and homebrew has nothing to do with buying stuff from an app store. I don't care about hacking or homebrew, so why did you bring it up?

[S-U-P-E-R]

It has a lot to do with your post if you're juxtaposing app stores against consumer freedom. There's certainly going to be an alternative to an app store if you can modify your device.

Hack the planet. Free Kevin!